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gdg9
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Why is Monday Day 1 in IATA?

Wed Aug 16, 2017 12:26 pm

Just curious, how did it come to pass that Day 1 is a Monday rather than Sunday in airline schedules? I understand there are a few cultures where Friday/Saturday or what not are the weekends, just curious how Monday is Day 1 and not Sunday? Just something decided way back when, Chicago Convention, or some other reason?
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jplatts
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Re: Why is Monday Day 1 in IATA?

Wed Aug 16, 2017 12:30 pm

Monday is the 1st day of the work week, and some of the calendars in languages other than English (including Spanish and other foreign languages) start with Monday in the 1st column instead of Sunday in the 1st column.
 
bx737
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Re: Why is Monday Day 1 in IATA?

Wed Aug 16, 2017 12:31 pm

I would suspect the weekend is generally Saturday and Sunday so a new week begins on a Monday, thus day 1
 
DfwRevolution
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Re: Why is Monday Day 1 in IATA?

Wed Aug 16, 2017 12:37 pm

I'm pretty sure God started with Monday as Day 1, too. :old:
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OlafW
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Re: Why is Monday Day 1 in IATA?

Wed Aug 16, 2017 12:47 pm

Monday is day 1 by two definitions. One is that apparently the United Nations decided that way in 1978 - although I cannot find any document for this. The other is ISO 8601 "Data elements and interchange formats – Information interchange – Representation of dates and times". I guess one of these was agreed on in IATA or ICAO sometime
 
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Marcello47
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Re: Why is Monday Day 1 in IATA?

Wed Aug 16, 2017 12:51 pm

Have you ever read the Holy Bible? God had a rest the SEVENTH day which is Sunday....
 
bgm
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Re: Why is Monday Day 1 in IATA?

Wed Aug 16, 2017 12:51 pm

gdg9 wrote:
Just curious, how did it come to pass that Day 1 is a Monday rather than Sunday in airline schedules? I understand there are a few cultures where Friday/Saturday or what not are the weekends, just curious how Monday is Day 1 and not Sunday? Just something decided way back when, Chicago Convention, or some other reason?


The map below shows which countries begin the week on Sunday/Monday/Saturday:

https://www.reddit.com/r/MapPorn/commen ... countries/
OK boomer.
 
raylee67
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Re: Why is Monday Day 1 in IATA?

Wed Aug 16, 2017 12:57 pm

bgm wrote:
gdg9 wrote:
Just curious, how did it come to pass that Day 1 is a Monday rather than Sunday in airline schedules? I understand there are a few cultures where Friday/Saturday or what not are the weekends, just curious how Monday is Day 1 and not Sunday? Just something decided way back when, Chicago Convention, or some other reason?


The map below shows which countries begin the week on Sunday/Monday/Saturday:

https://www.reddit.com/r/MapPorn/commen ... countries/


While in China, Hong Kong and Taiwan, the calendars all show Sunday on the 1st column, Monday is literally called "Week Day One" (using the Chinese word for the number one) in the Chinese language.

Similarly, Tuesday is "Week Day Two" and up to Saturday as "Week Day Six". Then Sunday is called "Week Day Sun" (literally using the Chinese character for the sun)

So for most people using Chinese as their first language, they naturally see Monday as the first day of the week, despite how the calendars on the walls are oriented.
319/20/21 332/33 342/43/45 359/51 388 707 717 732/36/3G/38/39 74R/42/43/44/4E/48 757 762/63 772/7L/73/7W 788/89 D10 M80 135/40/45 175/90 DH1/4 CRJ/R7 L10
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Aesma
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Re: Why is Monday Day 1 in IATA?

Wed Aug 16, 2017 1:09 pm

I understand Saturday as the first day of the week for Muslims, however Sunday as the first day of the week makes no sense at all.
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airbazar
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Re: Why is Monday Day 1 in IATA?

Wed Aug 16, 2017 1:11 pm

raylee67 wrote:
bgm wrote:
gdg9 wrote:
Just curious, how did it come to pass that Day 1 is a Monday rather than Sunday in airline schedules? I understand there are a few cultures where Friday/Saturday or what not are the weekends, just curious how Monday is Day 1 and not Sunday? Just something decided way back when, Chicago Convention, or some other reason?


The map below shows which countries begin the week on Sunday/Monday/Saturday:

https://www.reddit.com/r/MapPorn/commen ... countries/


While in China, Hong Kong and Taiwan, the calendars all show Sunday on the 1st column, Monday is literally called "Week Day One" (using the Chinese word for the number one) in the Chinese language.

Similarly, Tuesday is "Week Day Two" and up to Saturday as "Week Day Six". Then Sunday is called "Week Day Sun" (literally using the Chinese character for the sun)

So for most people using Chinese as their first language, they naturally see Monday as the first day of the week, despite how the calendars on the walls are oriented.


And I live in the U.S. and never heard anyone call Sunday, the first day of the week. That map is bonkers. We even get paid weekly here and our weekly salaries, for most people are Monday thru Sunday.
 
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redzeppelin
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Re: Why is Monday Day 1 in IATA?

Wed Aug 16, 2017 1:11 pm

DfwRevolution wrote:
I'm pretty sure God started with Monday as Day 1, too. :old:


Umm... If you want to get Biblical, Sunday would would be considered the first day of the week, and Saturday the 7th. The Genesis creation story says that God rested on the 7th day, which is memorialized by the Jewish Sabbath on Saturday. In the New Testament, the resurrection of Christ occurs in the morning of the of the first day of the week (Matt 28:1) leading to the Christian Sabbath on Sunday.

I'm always fascinated by how days are named in different languages and cultures, and how various numberic and/or religious word roots are incorporated. In Russian for example, the weekday names all have roots related to the numbers 1 through 5, while the weekend days have religious names: Saturday = Subota, which translates directly as "Sabbath"; Sunday = Voskresenye, which translates directly as "resurrection."

Russian is also one of the cultures where Monday is usually shown as the first day of the week on calendars.
 
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SomebodyInTLS
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Re: Why is Monday Day 1 in IATA?

Thu Aug 17, 2017 3:47 pm

airbazar wrote:
raylee67 wrote:
bgm wrote:

The map below shows which countries begin the week on Sunday/Monday/Saturday:

https://www.reddit.com/r/MapPorn/commen ... countries/


While in China, Hong Kong and Taiwan, the calendars all show Sunday on the 1st column, Monday is literally called "Week Day One" (using the Chinese word for the number one) in the Chinese language.

Similarly, Tuesday is "Week Day Two" and up to Saturday as "Week Day Six". Then Sunday is called "Week Day Sun" (literally using the Chinese character for the sun)

So for most people using Chinese as their first language, they naturally see Monday as the first day of the week, despite how the calendars on the walls are oriented.


And I live in the U.S. and never heard anyone call Sunday, the first day of the week. That map is bonkers. We even get paid weekly here and our weekly salaries, for most people are Monday thru Sunday.


But I think Microsoft, Google et al tend to put Sunday at the front unless you specify otherwise (e.g. by defining a region/language other than US in your device profile)...

In fact it wouldn't surprise me if China etc. just followed the US convention kind of by default, while Europe had decided otherwise.

To be honest, I also think Sunday first makes no sense either grammatically (week*END*) or in terms of the Christian tradition (I am an atheist, by the way).
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cschleic
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Re: Why is Monday Day 1 in IATA?

Thu Aug 17, 2017 9:02 pm

SomebodyInTLS wrote:
airbazar wrote:
raylee67 wrote:

While in China, Hong Kong and Taiwan, the calendars all show Sunday on the 1st column, Monday is literally called "Week Day One" (using the Chinese word for the number one) in the Chinese language.

Similarly, Tuesday is "Week Day Two" and up to Saturday as "Week Day Six". Then Sunday is called "Week Day Sun" (literally using the Chinese character for the sun)

So for most people using Chinese as their first language, they naturally see Monday as the first day of the week, despite how the calendars on the walls are oriented.


And I live in the U.S. and never heard anyone call Sunday, the first day of the week. That map is bonkers. We even get paid weekly here and our weekly salaries, for most people are Monday thru Sunday.


But I think Microsoft, Google et al tend to put Sunday at the front unless you specify otherwise (e.g. by defining a region/language other than US in your device profile)...

In fact it wouldn't surprise me if China etc. just followed the US convention kind of by default, while Europe had decided otherwise.

To be honest, I also think Sunday first makes no sense either grammatically (week*END*) or in terms of the Christian tradition (I am an atheist, by the way).


Interesting point about online calendars. I always change mine to show Monday as the starting day and others at work say "that's clever!" But from a practical standpoint, having the two weekend days split on a calendar just doesn't make sense, it's much easier when they're together. Plus, being a avgeek, the industry calls Monday day #1 so.....
 
EL-AL
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Re: Why is Monday Day 1 in IATA?

Sun Aug 20, 2017 12:38 pm

In Israel Sunday is the first day of the work week, with the weekend been Friday and Saturday
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ME720
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Re: Why is Monday Day 1 in IATA?

Sun Aug 20, 2017 2:01 pm

Monday is the first day of the week for the majority. No brainer that Monday is day 1..
 
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Re: Why is Monday Day 1 in IATA?

Sun Aug 20, 2017 5:31 pm

Almost nobody thinks Sunday is Day 1 of each week for the past few centuries. :D
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timz
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Re: Why is Monday Day 1 in IATA?

Sun Aug 20, 2017 9:01 pm

I'm guessing Monday has been 1 in airline timetables since before IATA existed. Anyone got a 1930s ABC Guide?
 
ME720
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Re: Why is Monday Day 1 in IATA?

Sun Aug 20, 2017 9:45 pm

Sunday rest day for all the western world.. aviation started in the western world .. makes sense that Monday is day 1. Had Middle east countries invented airplanes and pioneered flight turn of the 20th century, Saturday or Sunday would have been day 1 ..
 
timz
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Re: Why is Monday Day 1 in IATA?

Mon Aug 21, 2017 8:58 pm

Looks like the ABC Guide started using 1 for Monday in 1946-47. Did any air or rail or other timetable use numerals for weekdays before that?
 
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Re: Why is Monday Day 1 in IATA?

Fri Sep 01, 2017 6:13 pm

Marcello47 wrote:
Have you ever read the Holy Bible? God had a rest the SEVENTH day which is Sunday....

I'm sure you will agree that the Tanakh, or Holy Scriptures, can serve as our guide.

Shabbat is the 7th day, or day of rest (sunset Friday through sunset Saturday).

If this is not your 7th day you are unbiblical.

From Wikipedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hebrew_calendar

Yom Rishon – יום ראשון‎ (abbreviated יום א׳‎), meaning "first day" [corresponds to Sunday] (starting at preceding sunset of Saturday)
Yom Sheni – יום שני‎ (abbr. יום ב׳‎) meaning "second day" [corresponds to Monday]
Yom Shlishi – יום שלישי‎ (abbr. יום ג׳‎) meaning "third day" [corresponds to Tuesday]
Yom Reviʻi – יום רביעי‎ (abbr. יום ד׳‎) meaning "fourth day" [corresponds to Wednesday]
Yom Chamishi – יום חמישי‎ (abbr. יום ה׳‎) = "fifth day" [corresponds to Thursday]
Yom Shishi – יום ששי‎ (abbr. יום ו׳‎) meaning "sixth day" [corresponds to Friday]
Yom Shabbat – יום שבת‎ (abbr. יום ש׳‎), or more usually Shabbat – שבת‎ meaning "rest day" [corresponds to Saturday]

Shabbat Shalom
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ro1960
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Re: Why is Monday Day 1 in IATA?

Fri Sep 01, 2017 7:55 pm

The real question is why is Sunday shown as the first column of a calendar week if day 1 is Monday.
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Re: Why is Monday Day 1 in IATA?

Fri Sep 01, 2017 8:08 pm

ro1960 wrote:
The real question is why is Sunday shown as the first column of a calendar week if day 1 is Monday.


It isn't necessarily. Try a calendar on a UK hotel booking site, for instance, and you'll likely see Monday as the first column.

ISO weeks start on Monday and most systems that pretend to be international will follow. Various SQL implementations are all over the map, e.g. I believe mysql has monday as 0 and sunday as 6. For Oracle it depends on one of the NLS settings. And so on.
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Re: Why is Monday Day 1 in IATA?

Fri Sep 01, 2017 8:22 pm

airbazar wrote:
raylee67 wrote:
bgm wrote:

The map below shows which countries begin the week on Sunday/Monday/Saturday:

https://www.reddit.com/r/MapPorn/commen ... countries/


While in China, Hong Kong and Taiwan, the calendars all show Sunday on the 1st column, Monday is literally called "Week Day One" (using the Chinese word for the number one) in the Chinese language.

Similarly, Tuesday is "Week Day Two" and up to Saturday as "Week Day Six". Then Sunday is called "Week Day Sun" (literally using the Chinese character for the sun)

So for most people using Chinese as their first language, they naturally see Monday as the first day of the week, despite how the calendars on the walls are oriented.


And I live in the U.S. and never heard anyone call Sunday, the first day of the week. That map is bonkers. We even get paid weekly here and our weekly salaries, for most people are Monday thru Sunday.



I would assume as the person that did the map noted that sunday is the first calendar day in china but monday is marked as the first day of the week. US calendars have most always followed that format as have most cell phones. But it's always been common that Monday is the first day of the week in the US as well.

I would also agree this goes back to early days of christian religion as noted by others that the the day was Gods rest day, this the end of the week.
 
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Re: Why is Monday Day 1 in IATA?

Fri Sep 01, 2017 8:34 pm

BobPatterson wrote:
Marcello47 wrote:
Have you ever read the Holy Bible? God had a rest the SEVENTH day which is Sunday....

I'm sure you will agree that the Tanakh, or Holy Scriptures, can serve as our guide.

Shabbat is the 7th day, or day of rest (sunset Friday through sunset Saturday).

If this is not your 7th day you are unbiblical.

From Wikipedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hebrew_calendar

Yom Rishon – יום ראשון‎ (abbreviated יום א׳‎), meaning "first day" [corresponds to Sunday] (starting at preceding sunset of Saturday)
Yom Sheni – יום שני‎ (abbr. יום ב׳‎) meaning "second day" [corresponds to Monday]
Yom Shlishi – יום שלישי‎ (abbr. יום ג׳‎) meaning "third day" [corresponds to Tuesday]
Yom Reviʻi – יום רביעי‎ (abbr. יום ד׳‎) meaning "fourth day" [corresponds to Wednesday]
Yom Chamishi – יום חמישי‎ (abbr. יום ה׳‎) = "fifth day" [corresponds to Thursday]
Yom Shishi – יום ששי‎ (abbr. יום ו׳‎) meaning "sixth day" [corresponds to Friday]
Yom Shabbat – יום שבת‎ (abbr. יום ש׳‎), or more usually Shabbat – שבת‎ meaning "rest day" [corresponds to Saturday]

Shabbat Shalom


Different religions use different days. To say "if this is not your 7th day you are not biblical" is insulting other religions, as each has their own bibles. It is also quite rude and arrogant. This from someone with a Jewish mother and a Catholic father and with friends of over 30 religions from around the world. one of us will know who's religion is correct until we pass to the next plane. So be polite.

I hope the moderators cut off this post as it really has gone to far off track and no longer has anything to do with Airlines!
 
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ro1960
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Re: Why is Monday Day 1 in IATA?

Fri Sep 01, 2017 10:04 pm

PITingres wrote:
ro1960 wrote:
The real question is why is Sunday shown as the first column of a calendar week if day 1 is Monday.


It isn't necessarily. Try a calendar on a UK hotel booking site, for instance, and you'll likely see Monday as the first column.

ISO weeks start on Monday and most systems that pretend to be international will follow. Various SQL implementations are all over the map, e.g. I believe mysql has monday as 0 and sunday as 6. For Oracle it depends on one of the NLS settings. And so on.


I was referring to the OP who seems to be living in the US where calendars start on a Sunday. We all agree here that day 1 is Monday.

From his point of view day 1 should be Sunday because it's the first column on a calendar.
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BobPatterson
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Re: Why is Monday Day 1 in IATA?

Sat Sep 02, 2017 6:32 pm

rbavfan wrote:
BobPatterson wrote:
Marcello47 wrote:
Have you ever read the Holy Bible? God had a rest the SEVENTH day which is Sunday....

I'm sure you will agree that the Tanakh, or Holy Scriptures, can serve as our guide.

Shabbat is the 7th day, or day of rest (sunset Friday through sunset Saturday).

If this is not your 7th day you are unbiblical.

From Wikipedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hebrew_calendar

Yom Rishon – יום ראשון‎ (abbreviated יום א׳‎), meaning "first day" [corresponds to Sunday] (starting at preceding sunset of Saturday)
Yom Sheni – יום שני‎ (abbr. יום ב׳‎) meaning "second day" [corresponds to Monday]
Yom Shlishi – יום שלישי‎ (abbr. יום ג׳‎) meaning "third day" [corresponds to Tuesday]
Yom Reviʻi – יום רביעי‎ (abbr. יום ד׳‎) meaning "fourth day" [corresponds to Wednesday]
Yom Chamishi – יום חמישי‎ (abbr. יום ה׳‎) = "fifth day" [corresponds to Thursday]
Yom Shishi – יום ששי‎ (abbr. יום ו׳‎) meaning "sixth day" [corresponds to Friday]
Yom Shabbat – יום שבת‎ (abbr. יום ש׳‎), or more usually Shabbat – שבת‎ meaning "rest day" [corresponds to Saturday]

Shabbat Shalom


Different religions use different days. To say "if this is not your 7th day you are not biblical" is insulting other religions, as each has their own bibles. It is also quite rude and arrogant. This from someone with a Jewish mother and a Catholic father and with friends of over 30 religions from around the world. one of us will know who's religion is correct until we pass to the next plane. So be polite.

My mother was Jewish and my father was Greek Orthodox. My wife is a National Baptist. I happen to be an Agnostic.

My response was to someone who wished to use "the Holy Bible" as evidence for a point of view.

It was neither impolite nor insulting.

Shalom
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Re: Why is Monday Day 1 in IATA?

Sat Sep 02, 2017 6:38 pm

I thought Monday associate with Mono- and Tuesday associate with Two but after looking up search engine results it seems like I was wrong

Edit: Per wikipedia's article on Monday, it seems like the Sunday start of the week is some sort of Roman tradition.
And on the other hand, per wikkipedia article for Tuesday, it seems like Slavic name for Tuesday mean second in the week
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Re: Why is Monday Day 1 in IATA?

Sat Sep 02, 2017 7:15 pm

Please .... finish this ! It's crazy ! Day 1 = Monday first working day of the week.
 
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huaiwei
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Re: Why is Monday Day 1 in IATA?

Sat Sep 02, 2017 7:30 pm

SomebodyInTLS wrote:
airbazar wrote:
raylee67 wrote:

While in China, Hong Kong and Taiwan, the calendars all show Sunday on the 1st column, Monday is literally called "Week Day One" (using the Chinese word for the number one) in the Chinese language.

Similarly, Tuesday is "Week Day Two" and up to Saturday as "Week Day Six". Then Sunday is called "Week Day Sun" (literally using the Chinese character for the sun)

So for most people using Chinese as their first language, they naturally see Monday as the first day of the week, despite how the calendars on the walls are oriented.


And I live in the U.S. and never heard anyone call Sunday, the first day of the week. That map is bonkers. We even get paid weekly here and our weekly salaries, for most people are Monday thru Sunday.


But I think Microsoft, Google et al tend to put Sunday at the front unless you specify otherwise (e.g. by defining a region/language other than US in your device profile)...

In fact it wouldn't surprise me if China etc. just followed the US convention kind of by default, while Europe had decided otherwise.

To be honest, I also think Sunday first makes no sense either grammatically (week*END*) or in terms of the Christian tradition (I am an atheist, by the way).

That is how I concluded too. Microsoft actually influenced many things culturally, including popularising American spellings, date formats, and now even calendar days!

In countries like China where the Gregorian calendar is considered foreign, they are more likely to simply adopt what is perceived to be common. Microsoft gave them the impression that it is representative of Western conventions, when in actual fact, it is not representative of Europe!

By the way, do not use the airline booking pages as representative of such conventions. I just noticed the Singapore Airlines website also places Sunday first, but we are not exactly consistent over such things! :D
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Aesma
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Re: Why is Monday Day 1 in IATA?

Sat Sep 02, 2017 10:26 pm

BobPatterson wrote:
Marcello47 wrote:
Have you ever read the Holy Bible? God had a rest the SEVENTH day which is Sunday....

I'm sure you will agree that the Tanakh, or Holy Scriptures, can serve as our guide.

Shabbat is the 7th day, or day of rest (sunset Friday through sunset Saturday).

If this is not your 7th day you are unbiblical.

From Wikipedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hebrew_calendar

Yom Rishon – יום ראשון‎ (abbreviated יום א׳‎), meaning "first day" [corresponds to Sunday] (starting at preceding sunset of Saturday)
Yom Sheni – יום שני‎ (abbr. יום ב׳‎) meaning "second day" [corresponds to Monday]
Yom Shlishi – יום שלישי‎ (abbr. יום ג׳‎) meaning "third day" [corresponds to Tuesday]
Yom Reviʻi – יום רביעי‎ (abbr. יום ד׳‎) meaning "fourth day" [corresponds to Wednesday]
Yom Chamishi – יום חמישי‎ (abbr. יום ה׳‎) = "fifth day" [corresponds to Thursday]
Yom Shishi – יום ששי‎ (abbr. יום ו׳‎) meaning "sixth day" [corresponds to Friday]
Yom Shabbat – יום שבת‎ (abbr. יום ש׳‎), or more usually Shabbat – שבת‎ meaning "rest day" [corresponds to Saturday]

Shabbat Shalom


Since Hebrew words just mean first day, second day etc., then the first day could very well correspond to a Monday of our calendar, or any other day. It's just by convention that Sunday is used.

Shabbat being used as the rest day, just like Sunday is for Christians, then it would make much more sense to have Shabbat on Sundays.
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ro1960
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Re: Why is Monday Day 1 in IATA?

Sat Sep 02, 2017 10:57 pm

In airline timetables, even in the US, Monday has been day 1 for a long time. "Daily except Sunday" was marked as "x7".

http://timetableimages.com/ttimages/us/al74/us74-04.jpg
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rbavfan
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Re: Why is Monday Day 1 in IATA?

Sat Sep 02, 2017 11:14 pm

BobPatterson wrote:
rbavfan wrote:
BobPatterson wrote:
I'm sure you will agree that the Tanakh, or Holy Scriptures, can serve as our guide.

Shabbat is the 7th day, or day of rest (sunset Friday through sunset Saturday).

If this is not your 7th day you are unbiblical.

From Wikipedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hebrew_calendar

Yom Rishon – יום ראשון‎ (abbreviated יום א׳‎), meaning "first day" [corresponds to Sunday] (starting at preceding sunset of Saturday)
Yom Sheni – יום שני‎ (abbr. יום ב׳‎) meaning "second day" [corresponds to Monday]
Yom Shlishi – יום שלישי‎ (abbr. יום ג׳‎) meaning "third day" [corresponds to Tuesday]
Yom Reviʻi – יום רביעי‎ (abbr. יום ד׳‎) meaning "fourth day" [corresponds to Wednesday]
Yom Chamishi – יום חמישי‎ (abbr. יום ה׳‎) = "fifth day" [corresponds to Thursday]
Yom Shishi – יום ששי‎ (abbr. יום ו׳‎) meaning "sixth day" [corresponds to Friday]
Yom Shabbat – יום שבת‎ (abbr. יום ש׳‎), or more usually Shabbat – שבת‎ meaning "rest day" [corresponds to Saturday]

Shabbat Shalom


Different religions use different days. To say "if this is not your 7th day you are not biblical" is insulting other religions, as each has their own bibles. It is also quite rude and arrogant. This from someone with a Jewish mother and a Catholic father and with friends of over 30 religions from around the world. one of us will know who's religion is correct until we pass to the next plane. So be polite.

My mother was Jewish and my father was Greek Orthodox. My wife is a National Baptist. I happen to be an Agnostic.

My response was to someone who wished to use "the Holy Bible" as evidence for a point of view.

It was neither impolite nor insulting.

Shalom



My point was you said if you don't use saturday as the 7th day your not biblical based on your bible. Different Bibles from varied religions use sunday as the 7th day. You tried to make your bible right and theirs wrong. Neither may be correct. We will only know when we pass. So point was you said that and I noted please don't make your religion more correct than theirs. You cNd deny you wrote that phrase it's in your post. Just note thare are many that would take offense due to how it was phrased.
 
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ClipperYankee
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Re: Why is Monday Day 1 in IATA?

Sat Sep 02, 2017 11:37 pm

I dunno about Microsoft being any influence as Sunday being the start of the week was taught to me in grade school in NY in the 70s. And most every U.S. calendar is/has been that way.
In a way it's not surprising as there are so many differences between regions that I'm amazed the entire world works on a 24 hour clock, though I'm sure someone will point out some area that doesn't use it.
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Jayafe
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Re: Why is Monday Day 1 in IATA?

Sun Sep 03, 2017 12:31 pm

ClipperYankee wrote:
I dunno about Microsoft being any influence as Sunday being the start of the week was taught to me in grade school in NY in the 70s. And most every U.S. calendar is/has been that way.
In a way it's not surprising as there are so many differences between regions that I'm amazed the entire world works on a 24 hour clock, though I'm sure someone will point out some area that doesn't use it.


Just UK-US related, as usual going opposite the rest of the world

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/24-hour_clock

A limited number of countries, particularly English-speaking nations, use the 12-hour clock as a standard, or a mixture of the 24- and 12-hour time systems.
 
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ro1960
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Re: Why is Monday Day 1 in IATA?

Sun Sep 03, 2017 1:55 pm

Jayafe wrote:
ClipperYankee wrote:
I dunno about Microsoft being any influence as Sunday being the start of the week was taught to me in grade school in NY in the 70s. And most every U.S. calendar is/has been that way.
In a way it's not surprising as there are so many differences between regions that I'm amazed the entire world works on a 24 hour clock, though I'm sure someone will point out some area that doesn't use it.


Just UK-US related, as usual going opposite the rest of the world

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/24-hour_clock

A limited number of countries, particularly English-speaking nations, use the 12-hour clock as a standard, or a mixture of the 24- and 12-hour time systems.


Not to mention saying hundreds in hours as if time used the decimal system (twelve hundred hours for example). There can only be 24 in a day !
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c933103
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Re: Why is Monday Day 1 in IATA?

Sun Sep 03, 2017 4:18 pm

huaiwei wrote:
SomebodyInTLS wrote:
airbazar wrote:

And I live in the U.S. and never heard anyone call Sunday, the first day of the week. That map is bonkers. We even get paid weekly here and our weekly salaries, for most people are Monday thru Sunday.


But I think Microsoft, Google et al tend to put Sunday at the front unless you specify otherwise (e.g. by defining a region/language other than US in your device profile)...

In fact it wouldn't surprise me if China etc. just followed the US convention kind of by default, while Europe had decided otherwise.

To be honest, I also think Sunday first makes no sense either grammatically (week*END*) or in terms of the Christian tradition (I am an atheist, by the way).

That is how I concluded too. Microsoft actually influenced many things culturally, including popularising American spellings, date formats, and now even calendar days!

In countries like China where the Gregorian calendar is considered foreign, they are more likely to simply adopt what is perceived to be common. Microsoft gave them the impression that it is representative of Western conventions, when in actual fact, it is not representative of Europe!

By the way, do not use the airline booking pages as representative of such conventions. I just noticed the Singapore Airlines website also places Sunday first, but we are not exactly consistent over such things! :D

Even thought Greogorian calendar is considered foreign in China, they are already used during 19th century, and the weekday system have been in use before that.
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vahancrazy
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Re: Why is Monday Day 1 in IATA?

Sun Sep 03, 2017 4:39 pm

it has been already said but I will repeat.
Monday is day 1 because saturday and sunday are the week-end, thus, they stay at the last spot! the first day after the week-end is monday: the week start on monday.
 
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BobPatterson
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Re: Why is Monday Day 1 in IATA?

Sun Sep 03, 2017 6:34 pm

rbavfan wrote:
[
My point was you said if you don't use saturday as the 7th day your not biblical based on your bible. Different Bibles from varied religions use sunday as the 7th day. You tried to make your bible right and theirs wrong. Neither may be correct. We will only know when we pass. So point was you said that and I noted please don't make your religion more correct than theirs. You cNd deny you wrote that phrase it's in your post. Just note thare are many that would take offense due to how it was phrased.

I expect that the mods will correctly remove this side argument over what is and is not biblical from a topic about the customs of the airline industry.

Until then.......

No Bible is MY Bible. I am an Agnostic who happens to know a little bit about scriptural history. You make it sound like all religions have bibles. They do not. Those with written scriptures may have a book or books, but they are not all called bibles.

You bring in another subject when you state "We will only know when we pass". I'd suggest you will know even less than you know now when the lights go out for you.

Again, my response was directed to someone using "the Bible" to support his claim. His claim is not supported by the Tanakh, also known as the Hebrew scripture and erroneously called by some "the old testament". It is the ultimate source for discussion of sabbaths within judeo-christian cultures.

The assignment of names to calendar days, and the arrangement of those days on ancient or modern calendars, is an artifact of cultures. Which days are shown as first or last in a week are merely matters of custom and convention.
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Viscount724
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Re: Why is Monday Day 1 in IATA?

Sun Sep 03, 2017 10:25 pm

ro1960 wrote:
The real question is why is Sunday shown as the first column of a calendar week if day 1 is Monday.


In Europe, calendars almost always show the first column as Monday. I was always used to the first day being Sunday, as is the norm on calendars in the U.S. and Canada. When I moved to GVA in 1996 to work for IATA it was hard to get used to calendars starting on Monday.
 
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Jayafe
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Re: Why is Monday Day 1 in IATA?

Sun Sep 03, 2017 11:25 pm

Becuase it is the standard. Period.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/ISO_week_date

The ISO week date system is effectively a leap week calendar system that is part of the ISO 8601 date and time standard issued by the International Organization for Standardization (ISO)
......
Weeks start with Monday
......
 
gatechae
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Re: Why is Monday Day 1 in IATA?

Sun Sep 03, 2017 11:33 pm

At my work (aerostructures manufacturing) Day 1 is Friday, day 7 is thursday
 
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flyingclrs727
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Re: Why is Monday Day 1 in IATA?

Mon Sep 04, 2017 2:07 am

It's very important when selecting flights online to pay attention to whether Sunday or Monday is in column 1.
 
rove312
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Re: Why is Monday Day 1 in IATA?

Mon Sep 04, 2017 2:49 am

I picture continental Europe as considering Monday as the first day of the week, but note that in Portuguese the weekdays are named segunda-feira through sexta-feira, meaning, as I understand, second through sixth weekdays.
 
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ro1960
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Re: Why is Monday Day 1 in IATA?

Mon Sep 04, 2017 2:40 pm

Viscount724 wrote:
ro1960 wrote:
The real question is why is Sunday shown as the first column of a calendar week if day 1 is Monday.


In Europe, calendars almost always show the first column as Monday. I was always used to the first day being Sunday, as is the norm on calendars in the U.S. and Canada. When I moved to GVA in 1996 to work for IATA it was hard to get used to calendars starting on Monday.


The problem is the incoherence in the US. Calendars start on Sunday but day 1 of the week is Monday. Likewise Americans start counting with the forefinger where Europeans start with the thumb :thumbsup: (Cut to famous scene in "Inglourious Basterds" :))
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ro1960
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Re: Why is Monday Day 1 in IATA?

Mon Sep 04, 2017 2:47 pm

rove312 wrote:
I picture continental Europe as considering Monday as the first day of the week, but note that in Portuguese the weekdays are named segunda-feira through sexta-feira, meaning, as I understand, second through sixth weekdays.


Not exactly. It's another religious origin (I'll let you Google it). Yet if you translate "Lundi/Lunes/Montag/Monday" into Portuguese you'll get "Segunda-feira" which despite having "second" in its name is the first day of the week.
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afterburner
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Re: Why is Monday Day 1 in IATA?

Mon Sep 04, 2017 3:36 pm

Aesma wrote:
I understand Saturday as the first day of the week for Muslims, however Sunday as the first day of the week makes no sense at all.

In Arabic, the word 'Sunday' is related to the word 'one'. The word 'Monday' is related to the word 'two'. And so on, except 'Friday', which is the holy day for Muslims.
 
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BobPatterson
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Re: Why is Monday Day 1 in IATA?

Mon Sep 04, 2017 6:10 pm

ro1960 wrote:
Viscount724 wrote:
ro1960 wrote:
The real question is why is Sunday shown as the first column of a calendar week if day 1 is Monday.


In Europe, calendars almost always show the first column as Monday. I was always used to the first day being Sunday, as is the norm on calendars in the U.S. and Canada. When I moved to GVA in 1996 to work for IATA it was hard to get used to calendars starting on Monday.


The problem is the incoherence in the US. Calendars start on Sunday but day 1 of the week is Monday. Likewise Americans start counting with the forefinger where Europeans start with the thumb :thumbsup: (Cut to famous scene in "Inglourious Basterds" :))

:-) LOL I'm one American who doesn't fit your mold :-)

I'm right-handed. When I count using my fingers I do so with the left hand palm upward and I peel back the fingers starting with the pinkie. The thumb is number five.

This will be a good topic at our next family reunion. I don't know if it is a "family trait".
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ro1960
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Re: Why is Monday Day 1 in IATA?

Mon Sep 04, 2017 7:18 pm

BobPatterson wrote:
:-) LOL I'm one American who doesn't fit your mold :-)

I'm right-handed. When I count using my fingers I do so with the left hand palm upward and I peel back the fingers starting with the pinkie. The thumb is number five.

This will be a good topic at our next family reunion. I don't know if it is a "family trait".


You prove me right about incoherence :-)
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