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flymco753
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Re: Hurricane Irma's Impact on Aviation

Thu Sep 07, 2017 2:45 am

jumbojet wrote:
guyanam wrote:
Surprisingly SXM will reopen on Friday morning. SKB as well. I guess LI has to figure out its crew and plane deployment and which routes to cancel.


I'm telling you, the residents of SXM don't screw around. I bet the whole Island is already in mobilization mode, helping clear the airfield and terminal of debris as well as cleaning up the rest of the Island. Without tourism, I hate to say it, but Saint Maarten wouldn't exist. I wouldn't be the one bit surprised if by Friday, planes were flying passengers into and out of the Island. I tip my hat to all the wonderful people on SXM that are going through this very difficult time but they will definitely persevere.
I'd like to know if they're going to let American's help with disaster relief, the island gave to me and now I wan't to give back in the largest way possible.
...the carriage of liquids, gels, and aerosols are prohibited through the screening checkpoint except for travel size toiletries of 3 ounces or less...
 
jumbojet
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Re: Hurricane Irma's Impact on Aviation

Thu Sep 07, 2017 2:54 am

flymco753 wrote:
[]I'd like to know if they're going to let American's help with disaster relief, the island gave to me and now I wan't to give back in the largest way possible.


best way you can help is once the Island is functioning at some semblance of what is was before Irma, is to book a flight and a hotel room on St. Maarten.
 
RickNRoll
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Re: Hurricane Irma's Impact on Aviation

Thu Sep 07, 2017 3:42 am

jumbojet wrote:
guyanam wrote:
Surprisingly SXM will reopen on Friday morning. SKB as well. I guess LI has to figure out its crew and plane deployment and which routes to cancel.


I'm telling you, the residents of SXM don't screw around. I bet the whole Island is already in mobilization mode, helping clear the airfield and terminal of debris as well as cleaning up the rest of the Island. Without tourism, I hate to say it, but Saint Maarten wouldn't exist. I wouldn't be the one bit surprised if by Friday, planes were flying passengers into and out of the Island. I tip my hat to all the wonderful people on SXM that are going through this very difficult time but they will definitely persevere.


Where can any tourists stay? Tents?
 
jumbojet
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Re: Hurricane Irma's Impact on Aviation

Thu Sep 07, 2017 3:51 am

RickNRoll wrote:
jumbojet wrote:
guyanam wrote:
Surprisingly SXM will reopen on Friday morning. SKB as well. I guess LI has to figure out its crew and plane deployment and which routes to cancel.


I'm telling you, the residents of SXM don't screw around. I bet the whole Island is already in mobilization mode, helping clear the airfield and terminal of debris as well as cleaning up the rest of the Island. Without tourism, I hate to say it, but Saint Maarten wouldn't exist. I wouldn't be the one bit surprised if by Friday, planes were flying passengers into and out of the Island. I tip my hat to all the wonderful people on SXM that are going through this very difficult time but they will definitely persevere.


Where can any tourists stay? Tents?


If its a camping style vacation you seek, then yes. Seriously, just because your flying into SXM doesn't mean your a tourist. Lots of folks own property on SXM so they could be going back to check on loved ones etc. Flights won't be full but there are other reason for needing to go to SXM. You'll have engineers I am sure, contractors and the like....
 
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c933103
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Re: Hurricane Irma's Impact on the Lesser Antilles

Thu Sep 07, 2017 4:22 am

ikramerica wrote:
Cat 5s aren't real Cat 5s anymore. They measure winds aloft at the edge of the eye wall, not sustained winds on the ground to classify. They also interpret satellite data. This is very different than before when they were classified by ships that survived and ground measurements.

It's already made a direct hit on some islands as a "Cat 5" with only sustained Cat 3 winds on the ground for a brief amount of time and mainly sustained Cat 2 winds with Cat 3 gusts.

I say "only" in the relative sense, because it's still very destructive. Having been hit by a Cat 2 that stalled out (Georges) I wouldn't want to do that again. But don't believe the Cat 5 hype until there are actual sustained winds over 155 recorded anywhere. And despite the "strongest storm ever" hype, this storm simply isn't even close. Those pre 1960s storms listed as Cat 4 and 5 were much stronger, which explains the higher devastation and death toll relative to population than more recent storms (due to winds). Flooding is another matter. Category doesn't really matter much there. It's size, speed, exact location of landfall and available warm water sources that dictate rainfall.



- While wind aloft are measured, they are not directly used to describe the strength of the cyclone itself. They are used to infer the wind on the ground. They also drop measurement equipment from the plane down to the sea and record the wind reading along the path it drop
- Satellite data is also used to try to figure out the cyclone's strength and as a result convert to wind speed on the ground
- Sometimes, we get reading from wind meters on top of hills, they also need to be converted to sea surface reading.
- Reading from some islands are relatively low as equipment have been blown off before recording maximum wind, and they could be in the left semicircle of the cyclone.
- Those pre 1960 cat 4 and cat 5 were much stronger and much more devastating because of the lack of infrasturcture and forecasting technology, and the lack of cyclone-proof in most buildings.
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United787
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Re: Hurricane Irma's Impact on Aviation

Thu Sep 07, 2017 4:25 am

Found some photos of the damage in St. Bart's:

https://twitter.com/bienglace/status/905610697656107009

Although flooded, the roofs of the buildings in Gustavia look relatively intact. The cars at the airport rental lot look like they were tossed around like toys. The pictures look better than I thought, I feared the worst.
 
Indy
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Re: Hurricane Irma's Impact on the Lesser Antilles

Thu Sep 07, 2017 4:36 am

sudenmorsian wrote:
Air Force and NOAA hurricane hunter aircraft measured aloft winds, which when converted down using a regular formula indicated sustained surface wind speeds of 160 knots (185 mph) — while many storms away from land must have their intensities estimated using the Dvorak technique (which analyzes satellite imagery), Irma did actually have those winds directly measured in the eye wall. In addition, friction at the surface means that these highest wind speeds will not always be measured by surface-based weather stations. However, a weather station on Barbuda did record 155 mph winds prior to it being destroyed during the passage of Irma last night.


I can shed more light on this. The NHC wind speed reports are 90% of flight level winds. That is a huge error on their part. This change was made after reviewing hurricane Andrew. Prior to this the norm was to go with 70-90% (or was it 60-90% I forget the exact range) depending on the storm itself. This is what gives the appearance of storms being stronger today. It is in large part due to how the NHC calculates wind speed and little to do with the change in the storms themselves. You will find that the NHC numbers never validate. If you want to know the true strength of a storm, just subtract about 15% from the NHC wind speed. Maybe 20%. You typically will not find a wind gust as high as what the NHC says the sustained winds are. The information about the reporting change was posted in a PDF document issued by the NHC many years ago. If you hunt for it you can probably still find it online.

When a storm gets as strong as Irma it really doesn't matter if the wind speeds are 155 or 185. It is like debating -50 or -70F wind chills. By that point the cold will give you frost bite quickly. But the point is that storm strength is greatly overstated by the NHC.
Indy = Indianapolis and not Independence Air
 
spacecadet
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Re: Hurricane Irma's Impact on Aviation

Thu Sep 07, 2017 5:21 am

jumbojet wrote:
Without tourism, I hate to say it, but Saint Maarten wouldn't exist.


Well, it existed a long time before tourists started coming, and it'll exist a long time into the future with or without them. I think what you're saying is that it wouldn't exist *for tourists* without those tourists - and that's of course true. But people will always live there and the island will remain, whether or not the hotels get rebuilt in the next six months or a year.

It's going to take a long time from the looks of it. The French interior minister said the "four most solid buildings" on the island have been destroyed, so he expects most others have been as well. I wonder which buildings he's talking about, but seeing the Sonesta completely gutted and seeing YouTube videos from other hotels in that area in a similar state, I think it's going to be a while before the island is ready for tourists again.

I'm sure there are some hotels that came out better than others, but good luck getting a room at one of them for a while - a smaller number of hotels is now going to have to deal with all the people coming in to help rebuild, plus all of the tourists when they start coming back.
I'm tired of being a wanna-be league bowler. I wanna be a league bowler!
 
guyanam
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Re: Hurricane Irma's Impact on Aviation

Thu Sep 07, 2017 5:51 am

spacecadet wrote:
[.
Well, it existed a long time before tourists started coming, ..


There is a reason why even though SXM airport is in a shambles they want to reopen by Friday. ..SXM didn't exist before tourism. In 1960 the population was 10,000 and now its around 80,000 over 75% of which come from outside of the island.

Electricity was only added to the French side in the LATE 1960s. On the Dutch side maybe in the late 50s. And it was tourism which triggered the development of infrastructure. The middle aged taxi drivers on the French side are very good at giving the real social history of the island as they have seen how tourism tremendously improved their lives.

Before tourism they gathered salt, fished, had goat herds, and migrated to neighboring islands to cut cane, or to AUA/CUR to work in the refineries. Without tourism the population plummets by 75% or more, sharply reducing local consumption and government revenues even more than that lost by the absence of tourism. There is no more salt, farming isn't an option and fishing is a hard an unreliable way to earn a living. The locals now enjoy a standard of living way above what semi subsistence activities can support. SXM is the second richest island in the northeast Caribbean with only EIS being better off.

Before tourism SXM was a dry island with an impoverished population chasing goats. So SXM will open on Friday and they hope that airline service will resume shortly after that. I don't know if Winair planes will be back given the Jose possibility on Sat.
 
BonaireFly
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Re: Hurricane Irma's Impact on Aviation

Thu Sep 07, 2017 5:58 am

Update to the situation in St.Maarten.
The airport on the French side has been badly damaged. The control tower has been completely destroyed. Though I have yet to see pictures confirming this.

On the Dutch side, the airport terminal has suffered great damage but structurally it remains standing. Though at least three jet bridges have received major damage. A number of hangars have been completely destroyed. Some GA props and jets that remained on the island have also suffered great Damage.

Regarding the OP's original question. Winnair has sent their fleet to the Caribbean islands. Seaborne and another cargo airline in PR has sent their fleet to the ABC Islands. Seaborne has sent their Twin Otter sea planes to Bonaire as well as at least two or three of their Saab 340 fleet. As for the other airline, there are currently 7 Shorts cargo airplanes parked at Flamingo Airport. One of which, a Short 330 suffered an in-flight engine shutdown on its way here and declared an emergency landing. It landed safely Tuesday afternoon.
 
zoek34
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Re: Hurricane Irma's Impact on Aviation

Thu Sep 07, 2017 6:36 am

Picture of the situation at (what used to be) Maho Beach:

https://twitter.com/kon_marine/status/9 ... 0829815808



Video by the Dutch Navy of the island of St. Maarten (mainly the Dutch part):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lkSNWkgkH4Q
 
DaufuskieGuy
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Re: Hurricane Irma's Impact on Aviation

Thu Sep 07, 2017 6:51 am

Watch this Delta 737 land, and then take off, as Hurricane Irma bashes Puerto Rico https://twitchy.com/gregp-3534/2017/09/ ... tchywidget
 
rbavfan
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Re: Hurricane Irma's Impact on the Lesser Antilles

Thu Sep 07, 2017 8:57 am

jumbojet wrote:
smokeybandit wrote:
I'd be concerned at MIA or FLL.


Nah. Anything at FLL/MIA can easily fly out of harms way.


I think he meant airport damage not planes.
 
Bavd
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Re: Hurricane Irma's Impact on Aviation

Thu Sep 07, 2017 9:10 am

guyanam wrote:
Surprisingly SXM will reopen on Friday morning. SKB as well. I guess LI has to figure out its crew and plane deployment and which routes to cancel.


If this is true, it will only be for millitary relief flights. it could be months for any "normal" flights will resume....
Image
 
rbavfan
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Re: Hurricane Irma's Impact on the Lesser Antilles

Thu Sep 07, 2017 9:40 am

inflightVideo wrote:
The Maho Beachcam is now destroyed, here are the final moments before it went down:

https://twitter.com/PTZtv/status/905403131361730560

Looks absolutely insane.


The MD-80 was still sitting on the runway.
 
FlySSC
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Re: Hurricane Irma's Impact on Aviation

Thu Sep 07, 2017 10:07 am

AF498 CDG-SXM is still scheduled on Saturday Sept. 9th but I really doubt it will operate.
The airport is now partially operational for emergencies and rescue flights only.
French rescue teams and French army aircrafts have arrived last night at PTP and should start flights to SXM within the next hours to bring there the rescue teams and all the material required.
 
LH526
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Re: Hurricane Irma's Impact on Aviation

Thu Sep 07, 2017 11:07 am

Another press photo of SXM:
Image
Trittst im Morgenrot daher, seh ich dich im Strahlenmeer ...
 
vfw614
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Re: Hurricane Irma's Impact on Aviation

Thu Sep 07, 2017 11:43 am

The Dutch Navy's social media presence is quite insightful:

As per the link to the Dutch Navy, a KDC10 and a Herc will position to Curacao to be available as soon as SXM re-opens. The Dutch Navy has positioned its Caribbean patrol vessel in the vicinity of St. Maarten and the ship's NH90 helicopter has undertaken some surveillance. Before, it checked out Saba and St. Eustatius and reported back the damage is relatively modest whereas at St. Maarten it is massive.


Btw, if I understood a Dutch article correctly, some looting has taken place in St. Maarten.
 
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readytotaxi
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Re: Hurricane Irma's Impact on Aviation

Thu Sep 07, 2017 12:05 pm

richierich wrote:
I wonder how Sir Richard Branson is doing riding out the storm on Necker Island?

From the night before the storm.

https://www.virgin.com/richard-branson/ ... ma-arrives
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jumbojet
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Re: Hurricane Irma's Impact on Aviation

Thu Sep 07, 2017 12:12 pm

FlySSC wrote:
AF498 CDG-SXM is still scheduled on Saturday Sept. 9th but I really doubt it will operate.
The airport is now partially operational for emergencies and rescue flights only.
French rescue teams and French army aircrafts have arrived last night at PTP and should start flights to SXM within the next hours to bring there the rescue teams and all the material required.


You'll probably see some heavy transport planes landing at SXM. There gonna need lots of heavy equipment that's not on the island or is but damaged and unusable.
 
jumbojet
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Re: Hurricane Irma's Impact on Aviation

Thu Sep 07, 2017 12:16 pm

FlySSC wrote:
AF498 CDG-SXM is still scheduled on Saturday Sept. 9th but I really doubt it will operate.
The airport is now partially operational for emergencies and rescue flights only.
French rescue teams and French army aircrafts have arrived last night at PTP and should start flights to SXM within the next hours to bring there the rescue teams and all the material required.


DL 461 is still scheduled for tomorrow though I cant see it actually taking off. It will probably cancel later on today.
 
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flymco753
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Re: Hurricane Irma's Impact on Aviation

Thu Sep 07, 2017 12:28 pm

So the Grand Case airport is completely destroyed, all foundations are beyond compromised or completely gone.
...the carriage of liquids, gels, and aerosols are prohibited through the screening checkpoint except for travel size toiletries of 3 ounces or less...
 
FlySSC
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Re: Hurricane Irma's Impact on Aviation

Thu Sep 07, 2017 12:51 pm

flymco753 wrote:
So the Grand Case airport is completely destroyed, all foundations are beyond compromised or completely gone.


No. Apparently, unlike what was said previously, SFG is operational and the runway can, and will, be used by the rescue teams.

<http://www.lepoint.fr/societe/ouragan-irma-l-aeroport-francais-de-saint-martin-pourra-accueillir-les-secours-07-09-2017-2155190_23.php>

Only in French. Sorry. Just an hour ago.
 
gunnerman
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Re: Hurricane Irma's Impact on Aviation

Thu Sep 07, 2017 12:54 pm

ANU is open today, but don't know from when. Both the BA and VS flights from LGW to ANU are in the air now, ETA 1433 and 1426 respectively. However, the BA flight will terminate at ANU instead of continuing onto PLS. BA flies to PLS twice-weekly, the next flight will be on Sunday. BA's normal service will resume tomorrow (Friday) when its LGW to ANU flight will continue onto TAB, and its Saturday flight to ANU will continue onto SKB.

There is no travel update from LIAT, which should have been available on its website at 5pm on Wednesday.
Last edited by gunnerman on Thu Sep 07, 2017 1:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
bmacleod
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Re: Hurricane Irma's Impact on Aviation

Thu Sep 07, 2017 12:59 pm

Won't be surprised if SXM is shut down for at least 6 months - for tourists anyway.

Most of the surrounding area including the famous beach behind the runway looks like it has been completely destroyed....

AF/KLM should have a travel flash/bulletin issued shortly.
Last edited by bmacleod on Thu Sep 07, 2017 1:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Sand0rf
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Re: Hurricane Irma's Impact on Aviation

Thu Sep 07, 2017 1:07 pm

vfw614 wrote:
The Dutch Navy's social media presence is quite insightful:

As per the link to the Dutch Navy, a KDC10 and a Herc will position to Curacao to be available as soon as SXM re-opens.


They're actually departing for Curacao this afternoon to get there faster when SXM opens. They bring water and food for 40000 people for 5 days. That's enough for the Dutch people on the island. The French are having a similar operation for the French side of the island. The C130 is especially send because of its ability to land on rugged airstrips.
 
zoek34
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Re: Hurricane Irma's Impact on Aviation

Thu Sep 07, 2017 1:11 pm

gunnerman wrote:
The BA flight will terminate at ANU instead of continuing onto PLS


The reason why BA doesn't continu on to PLS today is probably because Irma is nearby PLS.
 
Indy
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Re: Hurricane Irma's Impact on Aviation

Thu Sep 07, 2017 1:25 pm

It really is amazing how well SXM stood up to the storm. Given the severity of the storm I would have expected to see more structural damage. Maybe once the building is inspected it will be found that the damage is more than cosmetic. It was obviously built to withstand major storms.
Indy = Indianapolis and not Independence Air
 
jumbojet
Topic Author
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Re: Hurricane Irma's Impact on Aviation

Thu Sep 07, 2017 1:28 pm

Sand0rf wrote:
vfw614 wrote:
The Dutch Navy's social media presence is quite insightful:

As per the link to the Dutch Navy, a KDC10 and a Herc will position to Curacao to be available as soon as SXM re-opens.


They're actually departing for Curacao this afternoon to get there faster when SXM opens. They bring water and food for 40000 people for 5 days. That's enough for the Dutch people on the island. The French are having a similar operation for the French side of the island. The C130 is especially send because of its ability to land on rugged airstrips.


Obviously the French will have to land at SXM and somehow drive to the French side. I know its not far but still, roads can be impassable. I wonder if they will also transport military style road vehicles to help get the supplies from SXM to the French side?
 
jumbojet
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Re: Hurricane Irma's Impact on Aviation

Thu Sep 07, 2017 1:35 pm

guyanam wrote:
spacecadet wrote:
[.
Well, it existed a long time before tourists started coming, ..


There is a reason why even though SXM airport is in a shambles they want to reopen by Friday. ..SXM didn't exist before tourism. In 1960 the population was 10,000 and now its around 80,000 over 75% of which come from outside of the island.

Electricity was only added to the French side in the LATE 1960s. On the Dutch side maybe in the late 50s. And it was tourism which triggered the development of infrastructure. The middle aged taxi drivers on the French side are very good at giving the real social history of the island as they have seen how tourism tremendously improved their lives.

Before tourism they gathered salt, fished, had goat herds, and migrated to neighboring islands to cut cane, or to AUA/CUR to work in the refineries. Without tourism the population plummets by 75% or more, sharply reducing local consumption and government revenues even more than that lost by the absence of tourism. There is no more salt, farming isn't an option and fishing is a hard an unreliable way to earn a living. The locals now enjoy a standard of living way above what semi subsistence activities can support. SXM is the second richest island in the northeast Caribbean with only EIS being better off.

Before tourism SXM was a dry island with an impoverished population chasing goats. So SXM will open on Friday and they hope that airline service will resume shortly after that. I don't know if Winair planes will be back given the Jose possibility on Sat.


Thanks for the well thought out explanation as to why SXM is where it is today. Of course the island would exist just in a more primitive state. They know that which is why I think they will recover much sooner than people think.
 
LH526
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Re: Hurricane Irma's Impact on Aviation

Thu Sep 07, 2017 1:46 pm

And another one:

Looks like the entire beach has been washed past the perimeter fence and now rests on the threshold.

Image
Trittst im Morgenrot daher, seh ich dich im Strahlenmeer ...
 
FrancisBegbie
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Re: Hurricane Irma's Impact on Aviation

Thu Sep 07, 2017 1:53 pm

jumbojet wrote:
Sand0rf wrote:
vfw614 wrote:
The Dutch Navy's social media presence is quite insightful:

As per the link to the Dutch Navy, a KDC10 and a Herc will position to Curacao to be available as soon as SXM re-opens.


They're actually departing for Curacao this afternoon to get there faster when SXM opens. They bring water and food for 40000 people for 5 days. That's enough for the Dutch people on the island. The French are having a similar operation for the French side of the island. The C130 is especially send because of its ability to land on rugged airstrips.


Obviously the French will have to land at SXM and somehow drive to the French side. I know its not far but still, roads can be impassable. I wonder if they will also transport military style road vehicles to help get the supplies from SXM to the French side?


One of the Dutch navy vessels was reported to have a bulldozer on board for exactly those types of jobs. Also other vehicles like an ambulance and a water tanker if I remember correctly. Also both ships have fresh water-generating capabilities which can come in handy right now.
 
ikramerica
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Re: Hurricane Irma's Impact on the Lesser Antilles

Thu Sep 07, 2017 2:04 pm

c933103 wrote:
ikramerica wrote:
Cat 5s aren't real Cat 5s anymore. They measure winds aloft at the edge of the eye wall, not sustained winds on the ground to classify. They also interpret satellite data. This is very different than before when they were classified by ships that survived and ground measurements.

It's already made a direct hit on some islands as a "Cat 5" with only sustained Cat 3 winds on the ground for a brief amount of time and mainly sustained Cat 2 winds with Cat 3 gusts.

I say "only" in the relative sense, because it's still very destructive. Having been hit by a Cat 2 that stalled out (Georges) I wouldn't want to do that again. But don't believe the Cat 5 hype until there are actual sustained winds over 155 recorded anywhere. And despite the "strongest storm ever" hype, this storm simply isn't even close. Those pre 1960s storms listed as Cat 4 and 5 were much stronger, which explains the higher devastation and death toll relative to population than more recent storms (due to winds). Flooding is another matter. Category doesn't really matter much there. It's size, speed, exact location of landfall and available warm water sources that dictate rainfall.



- While wind aloft are measured, they are not directly used to describe the strength of the cyclone itself. They are used to infer the wind on the ground. They also drop measurement equipment from the plane down to the sea and record the wind reading along the path it drop
- Satellite data is also used to try to figure out the cyclone's strength and as a result convert to wind speed on the ground
- Sometimes, we get reading from wind meters on top of hills, they also need to be converted to sea surface reading.
- Reading from some islands are relatively low as equipment have been blown off before recording maximum wind, and they could be in the left semicircle of the cyclone.
- Those pre 1960 cat 4 and cat 5 were much stronger and much more devastating because of the lack of infrasturcture and forecasting technology, and the lack of cyclone-proof in most buildings.



The winds aloft are absolutely, combined with satellite and a "model" using buoys used. And it this method has provided a false measure for quite some time.

This is just a matter of technicality, but there are no ATLANTIC recent storms where the SUSTAINED winds on the ground matched the category when it was declared a 4 or 5. Gusts, yes. Sustained, no. And category is supposed to be based on sustained wind. But hype/hysteria/budgeting is based on the biggest number you can claim.

This storm devastated Barbuda and caused great damage to SXM so far but there were absolutely no sustained Cat 5 readings let alone the "strongest ever". Cat 3 can devastate poorly constructed structures. Further, despite being close to the eye, Antigua wasn't impacted much. The suE and claimed strength of the storm should have devastated islands that were "brushed" by the edge of the eye wall, but this did not happen.

My heart goes out to those whose lives are wrecked or who lost loved ones. This doesn't attempt to diminish that. But there is an easy to document inflation of storm strength that can't be ignored.
Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
 
8598033649
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Re: Hurricane Irma's Impact on Aviation

Thu Sep 07, 2017 2:16 pm

What is the current full status of Florida ops . Are carriers doing 9000 flights to get planes out ?
 
capitalflyer
Posts: 630
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Re: Hurricane Irma's Impact on Aviation

Thu Sep 07, 2017 2:18 pm

MIA is currently in a ground stop due to traffic. I assume this is unusual for MIA? Indication of the amount of in and out in preparation for Irma, both getting folks out of MIA as well as serving as a hub to reach out to Caribbean.
 
capitalflyer
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Re: Hurricane Irma's Impact on Aviation

Thu Sep 07, 2017 2:27 pm

Airlines offering fare relief for evacuees

http://money.cnn.com/2017/09/06/news/co ... index.html
 
RL757PVD
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Re: Hurricane Irma's Impact on Aviation

Thu Sep 07, 2017 2:57 pm

capitalflyer wrote:
Airlines offering fare relief for evacuees

http://money.cnn.com/2017/09/06/news/co ... index.html


Only after being called out like Joel Osteen for $1,000- $2,000 + fares
Experience is what you get when what you thought would work out didn't!
 
ckfred
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Re: Hurricane Irma's Impact on Aviation

Thu Sep 07, 2017 3:00 pm

I heard on WGN-AM in Chicago that AA will wind down its normal schedule at MIA on Friday, and there will be no AA flights in or out of MIA on Saturday and Sunday.
 
rebr
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Re: Hurricane Irma's Impact on Aviation

Thu Sep 07, 2017 3:18 pm

Dutch Navy is reporting the runway at SXM will already open sometime today: https://nos.nl/artikel/2191832-luchthav ... -hulp.html
 
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readytotaxi
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Re: Hurricane Irma's Impact on Aviation

Thu Sep 07, 2017 3:23 pm

ckfred wrote:
I heard on WGN-AM in Chicago that AA will wind down its normal schedule at MIA on Friday, and there will be no AA flights in or out of MIA on Saturday and Sunday.

Like wise BA have cancelled Sat-Sun. Those passengers can pop up the road to Orlando where they still have two flights departing both days.
Last edited by readytotaxi on Thu Sep 07, 2017 3:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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bennett123
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Re: Hurricane Irma's Impact on Aviation

Thu Sep 07, 2017 3:25 pm

So was the MD80 destroyed.
 
vfw614
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Re: Hurricane Irma's Impact on Aviation

Thu Sep 07, 2017 3:28 pm

Aerial view of SXM:

Image

From that, I think military style relief flights shuld be able to get in sooner than later.
 
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aeromoe
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Re: Hurricane Irma's Impact on the Lesser Antilles

Thu Sep 07, 2017 3:32 pm

fly4ever78 wrote:
Narfish641 wrote:
I have a really terrible feeling that it will come up inland to Flordia and up into Georgia and the Carolinas. The worst part is that there is an area at Hartfield Jackson where they store planes is in a low area near the runway by the Tech Ops hangers. And there is about a dozen or more aircraft that are parked in a line, if that hurricane comes inland and hit our state, were talking millions if not billions of dollars worth of damage. Those planes will be underwater or floating like a bunch of rubber duckies.


Can't they just move the planes to another part of the airport??!!


Thank you! With sufficient notice, I can't imagine an airline would just let planes sit in a location that might be subject to the rhetoric posed above. If so, an insurance company might be able to counter with "neglect" or some other official term and refuse to pay out.
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qf789
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Re: Hurricane Irma's Impact on Aviation

Thu Sep 07, 2017 3:36 pm

QR has cancelled flights to MIA for Saturday and Sunday

http://www.gulf-times.com/story/562970/ ... n-Sep-9-10
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guyanam
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Re: Hurricane Irma's Impact on Aviation

Thu Sep 07, 2017 3:57 pm

Bavd wrote:
guyanam wrote:
Surprisingly SXM will reopen on Friday morning. SKB as well. I guess LI has to figure out its crew and plane deployment and which routes to cancel.


If this is true, it will only be for millitary relief flights. it could be months for any "normal" flights will resume....
Image


Well we will know by tomorrow. AA, LI and B6 aren't bringing in any assistance. If its just WM, KL and AF then this might be true. People do need to travel. As I said 70-80% of the population aren't locals and some might just need to leave. I don't see any evidence that there will be work any time soon unless one is involved in construction and repair.
 
guyanam
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Re: Hurricane Irma's Impact on Aviation

Thu Sep 07, 2017 4:00 pm

jumbojet wrote:
[.
Thanks for the well thought out explanation as to why SXM is where it is today. Of course the island would exist just in a more primitive state. They know that which is why I think they will recover much sooner than people think.


The island will exist but its local population will all be with their relatives some where in the USA, and the rest will return to other parts of the Caribbean, France, and elsewhere.

I just don't see people who work in hotels and government offices getting out in fishing boats hoping to catch fish.
 
guyanam
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Re: Hurricane Irma's Impact on the Lesser Antilles

Thu Sep 07, 2017 4:12 pm

ikramerica wrote:

.". Cat 3 can devastate poorly constructed structures. Further, despite being close to the eye, Antigua wasn't impacted much. The suE and claimed strength of the storm should have devastated islands that were "brushed" by the edge of the eye wall, but this did not happen.

..



Barbuda is more than 50 miles away from ANU so that means that ANU would have been either at the edge of the hurricane force winds or in the tropical storm zone. This means that they got some fierce breeze. The hurricane zone extended about 50 miles out from the eye.

That devastation in SXM isn't Cat 3. Those types of storms aren't unusual and this damage was severe. The only country which would have had do many poorly built structures for that to be the reason for this damage will be Haiti. I doubt that those large hotels were all poorly built. The French comment about their gov't offices being well built and yet are damaged. I don't see why they would be mistaken.

As some one said that one can quibble as to whether the winds around the eye were 155 or 185, but 155 is a bad hurricane. Anything about 140 is pretty bad.
 
Brickell305
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Re: Hurricane Irma's Impact on Aviation

Thu Sep 07, 2017 5:15 pm

gunnerman wrote:
ANU is open today, but don't know from when. Both the BA and VS flights from LGW to ANU are in the air now, ETA 1433 and 1426 respectively. However, the BA flight will terminate at ANU instead of continuing onto PLS. BA flies to PLS twice-weekly, the next flight will be on Sunday. BA's normal service will resume tomorrow (Friday) when its LGW to ANU flight will continue onto TAB, and its Saturday flight to ANU will continue onto SKB.

There is no travel update from LIAT, which should have been available on its website at 5pm on Wednesday.


How much longer will ANU remain open? Island is currently under hurricane watch from Jose. It is currently forecast to pass just north of Barbuda but if it keeps to that path, there will definitely be adverse weather effects from outer bands.
 
gunnerman
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Re: Hurricane Irma's Impact on Aviation

Thu Sep 07, 2017 5:40 pm

LIAT has today (Thursday) cancelled 16 flights.

https://www.liat.com/navSource.html?page_id=975
 
masgniw
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Re: Hurricane Irma's Impact on Aviation

Thu Sep 07, 2017 5:51 pm

LH526 wrote:
And another one:

Looks like the entire beach has been washed past the perimeter fence and now rests on the threshold.

Image


Wow that's a crazy. What's the source for these?
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