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KarelXWB
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EK to study all-economy A380 to combat low cost carriers

Thu Sep 07, 2017 8:49 am

Tim Clark is speaking at the #AviationFest in London and mentioned Emirates may explore all-economy A380s to compete against the rising long-haul low-cost carriers.

@emirates may explore creating all-economy A380s to compete against long-haul low-cost airlines #AviationFest


Offering up to 4 different economy class products on the main deck of the A380 is one of the ideas floating around.

#aviationfest Tim Clark suggests that emirates may need 4 flavors of economy class on A380s to compete with long haul LCC


How to handle the long-haul LCC challenge? Clarke teases "multiple classes of economy" on A380 main deck. #AviationFest #PaxEx


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r2rho
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Re: EK to study all-economy A380

Thu Sep 07, 2017 9:00 am

Offering up to 4 different economy class products

So, Premium Y, Y+, Y- ... I can't imagine what would be the fourth one. Up to now, only AA has segmented Y into three classes on some aircraft (a good move IMO)
 
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Re: EK to study all-economy A380

Thu Sep 07, 2017 9:02 am

This will really give a weird passenger experience with 4 kinds of Y... doens't a 5 star airline as EK want a uniform product?

I could see AMS getting it's second flight going to full Y and one flight F/C/Y for the premium market. BKK and India will be up there...
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Re: EK to study all-economy A380 to combat low cost carriers

Thu Sep 07, 2017 9:07 am

Will we see Basic Economy on EK?
 
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Re: EK to study all-economy A380 to combat low cost carriers

Thu Sep 07, 2017 9:10 am

Guess which is the only LCC which directly threatens ME3 on their staple passengers-- IndiGo.
 
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Re: EK to study all-economy A380

Thu Sep 07, 2017 9:40 am

r2rho wrote:
Offering up to 4 different economy class products

So, Premium Y, Y+, Y- ... I can't imagine what would be the fourth one. Up to now, only AA has segmented Y into three classes on some aircraft (a good move IMO)


NZ does 5

https://www.airnewzealand.com.au/seat
 
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KarelXWB
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Re: EK to study all-economy A380 to combat low cost carriers

Thu Sep 07, 2017 9:43 am

anshabhi wrote:
Guess which is the only LCC which directly threatens ME3 on their staple passengers-- IndiGo.


Tim Clark mentioned long-haul low-cost carriers are the biggest threat.
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Re: EK to study all-economy A380 to combat low cost carriers

Thu Sep 07, 2017 9:52 am

KarelXWB wrote:
anshabhi wrote:
Guess which is the only LCC which directly threatens ME3 on their staple passengers-- IndiGo.


Tim Clark mentioned long-haul low-cost carriers as the biggest threat.

Yeah and IndiGo is going long haul, for certain.
 
kurtverbose
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Re: EK to study all-economy A380 to combat low cost carriers

Thu Sep 07, 2017 10:57 am

They should call the lowest class 'Scum class' to encourage people to upgrade.
 
r2rho
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Re: EK to study all-economy A380 to combat low cost carriers

Thu Sep 07, 2017 11:00 am



Wow, I was not aware. Now -that- is confusing.
 
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Re: EK to study all-economy A380 to combat low cost carriers

Thu Sep 07, 2017 11:05 am

kurtverbose wrote:
They should call the lowest class 'Scum class' to encourage people to upgrade.


They should do what they did in the early days of train travel. Stick the cheapest ticket seats out in the open without a roof. That way you know they are not buying the more expensive tickets purely because they can't possibly afford them.
 
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Re: EK to study all-economy A380 to combat low cost carriers

Thu Sep 07, 2017 11:07 am

Yes please an all Y A380 into STN would be brilliant , real game changer

Y on an EK A380 is like Y+ On other airlines
 
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Re: EK to study all-economy A380 to combat low cost carriers

Thu Sep 07, 2017 11:09 am

NZ's approach tho has been very successful in terms of catering to diverse needs. They still augment all economy flights with wide body flights which offer premium econ and business flat beds so passengers have a choice to big cities but not to all trans-taxman cities. No reason Emirates couldn't adopt a similar approach.
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Re: EK to study all-economy A380 to combat low cost carriers

Thu Sep 07, 2017 11:18 am

the all economy LH a/c is indeed the new black...
 
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Re: EK to study all-economy A380 to combat low cost carriers

Thu Sep 07, 2017 11:24 am

r2rho wrote:


Wow, I was not aware. Now -that- is confusing.

I don't. It's pretty simple to understand IMHO - you just pay for what you need. And you can still pay for many things later if you decided that you need them, like food, baggage or entertainment. In addition, this arrangement only exists on their Trans-Tasman, domestic & selected leisure destinations - i.e. the likes of DPS, HNL etc. Not on their longer flights to Asia, North America and Europe.

I would say it's actually an effective method to counter LCCs without investing too much on new airlines, new products, etc., so long as you can keep your costs down to a reasonable level to make your flights profitable with minimal ancillary revenue.

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Last edited by eamondzhang on Thu Sep 07, 2017 11:27 am, edited 1 time in total.
 
horizon360
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Re: EK to study all-economy A380

Thu Sep 07, 2017 11:27 am

r2rho wrote:
So, Premium Y, Y+, Y- ... I can't imagine what would be the fourth one.


What are the odds that their new Y- section will be 11-abreast?
 
Dardania
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Re: EK to study all-economy A380 to combat low cost carriers

Thu Sep 07, 2017 12:01 pm

Maybe they should consider...point to point flights, to counter LCC LH ? Not sure they'd get the rights, but for some routes (say Birmingham to Indian destinations)?
 
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Re: EK to study all-economy A380

Thu Sep 07, 2017 12:16 pm

downdata wrote:
r2rho wrote:
Offering up to 4 different economy class products

So, Premium Y, Y+, Y- ... I can't imagine what would be the fourth one. Up to now, only AA has segmented Y into three classes on some aircraft (a good move IMO)


NZ does 5

https://www.airnewzealand.com.au/seat


Aren't they just packaging up the same seat with extras, though?

The only 4th Economy product I can thing of would be the family couch that CI and NZ have.
Down with that sort of thing!
 
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Re: EK to study all-economy A380

Thu Sep 07, 2017 12:21 pm

horizon360 wrote:
r2rho wrote:
So, Premium Y, Y+, Y- ... I can't imagine what would be the fourth one.


What are the odds that their new Y- section will be 11-abreast?


Some form of budget economy I guess.

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r2rho
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Re: EK to study all-economy A380 to combat low cost carriers

Thu Sep 07, 2017 12:29 pm

Aren't they just packaging up the same seat with extras, though?

The only 4th Economy product I can thing of would be the family couch that CI and NZ have.

Yeah, it looks like NZ has effectively 3 hard products - Y, Y+ and PY - but sells them as 5 different fares depending on the extras you choose.
 
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Re: EK to study all-economy A380 to combat low cost carriers

Thu Sep 07, 2017 12:37 pm

Timothy may be still spinning the idea of old class structure, but Mueller's idea is to eliminate "the segregation of transportation classes", his own words.

Mueller thinks, airlines should offer the whole basket of goods and services, passenger picks and pays for what they want.

If I want a flatbed, but not filet mignon/dom/caviar, I should be able to purchase exactly that.
If some one on a 6hr flight wants an economy seat but premium meal (filet mignon/dom/caviar) and a greeting by name with a smile, they should be able to buy that.

This will be achieved through digital innovation and big data.
Last edited by dtw2hyd on Thu Sep 07, 2017 12:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
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Re: EK to study all-economy A380 to combat low cost carriers

Thu Sep 07, 2017 12:39 pm

Virgin Australia sells Business, Premium Economy, Y+ (extra legroom seats with a few perks) and standard Y which seems like a model that some airlines could adopt. I thought DL was going to do the same but they're scrapping Delta Comfort on flights with Premium Economy.
 
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Re: EK to study all-economy A380 to combat low cost carriers

Thu Sep 07, 2017 12:39 pm

So they eliminated First Class on some of the newer A380s, and now Business Class too. Looks like they are having a hard time filling their premium cabins so now this under the cover of threat from LCCs to go all Economy.
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Re: EK to study all-economy A380 to combat low cost carriers

Thu Sep 07, 2017 1:02 pm

It is a trend in the industry. First and even biz are under threat from the biz jets. When you need to fly 4 executives to a meeting and all would get a biz ticket a private jet is not much more expensive but much more flexible and allows to reduce the time wasted at airports.
 
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Re: EK to study all-economy A380 to combat low cost carriers

Thu Sep 07, 2017 1:31 pm

EK should experiment such a change with FlyDubai now that they are getting closer in cooperation. A few older 77Ws should be handed over to FZ to try out lowcost medium/long haul routes. This way the EK brand can be protected from dilution.
 
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Re: EK to study all-economy A380 to combat low cost carriers

Thu Sep 07, 2017 1:39 pm

It seems a little over complicated but I can see it.
11 across with the so called 18" seat
10 across with standard 18.5" seat
10 across with a little more legroom and recline but keeping the 18.5" seat.
9 across (if lower deck) with Qantas style premium y.
And some lie flat biz class to round it all off.
 
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Re: EK to study all-economy A380 to combat low cost carriers

Thu Sep 07, 2017 1:47 pm

klakzky123 wrote:
Virgin Australia sells Business, Premium Economy, Y+ (extra legroom seats with a few perks) and standard Y which seems like a model that some airlines could adopt. I thought DL was going to do the same but they're scrapping Delta Comfort on flights with Premium Economy.

As does AA on 787 and eventually 777. Not sure about 332 plans. I believe the 77W will have 5 "classes" of service. F J W Y+ Y.

I wonder if EK would mind a FlyDubai section on their 388/77W where the seats are tighter, less service, etc.
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Re: EK to study all-economy A380 to combat low cost carriers

Thu Sep 07, 2017 1:50 pm

dtw2hyd wrote:
Timothy may be still spinning the idea of old class structure, but Mueller's idea is to eliminate "the segregation of transportation classes", his own words.

Mueller thinks, airlines should offer the whole basket of goods and services, passenger picks and pays for what they want.

If I want a flatbed, but not filet mignon/dom/caviar, I should be able to purchase exactly that.
If some one on a 6hr flight wants an economy seat but premium meal (filet mignon/dom/caviar) and a greeting by name with a smile, they should be able to buy that.

This will be achieved through digital innovation and big data.

Love it :)
How is this kind of innovation dependent on big data?
 
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Re: EK to study all-economy A380 to combat low cost carriers

Thu Sep 07, 2017 2:03 pm

IMO this looks to be the fate of those earlier delivered A380 in EK fleet to be reconfigured into all economy.

Interesting that a new segment is opening up for the A380 in a high densed sector market: First Malaysian in Al-Haj A380 concept, then Hi Fly & now EK.
 
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Re: EK to study all-economy A380

Thu Sep 07, 2017 2:07 pm

horizon360 wrote:
r2rho wrote:
So, Premium Y, Y+, Y- ... I can't imagine what would be the fourth one.


What are the odds that their new Y- section will be 11-abreast?


Emirates is not interested in 11 abreast on the A380.
 
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Re: EK to study all-economy A380

Thu Sep 07, 2017 2:14 pm

mjoelnir wrote:
horizon360 wrote:
r2rho wrote:
So, Premium Y, Y+, Y- ... I can't imagine what would be the fourth one.


What are the odds that their new Y- section will be 11-abreast?


Emirates is not interested in 11 abreast on the A380.

For their standard A380 configurations sure. For an all-economy A380 with "multiple classes of economy" designed to compete against mid/long haul LCCs EK may have a different opinion in regards to 11 abreast in A380s for the basic Y sections.
 
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Re: EK to study all-economy A380 to combat low cost carriers

Thu Sep 07, 2017 2:53 pm

Flightsimboy wrote:
So they eliminated First Class on some of the newer A380s, and now Business Class too. Looks like they are having a hard time filling their premium cabins so now this under the cover of threat from LCCs to go all Economy.


"...Emirates may explore..." != fact
 
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Re: EK to study all-economy A380 to combat low cost carriers

Thu Sep 07, 2017 3:17 pm

May be reason for Airbus to revisit the "moderate stretch" idea they floated around at Paris 2015.
 
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Re: EK to study all-economy A380 to combat low cost carriers

Thu Sep 07, 2017 3:24 pm

pompos wrote:
Love it :)
How is this kind of innovation dependent on big data?


I suppose big data plays a major role in optimized forecasting of various goods and services in an al-a-carte model. Traditional forecasting leads to either lack of options or waste of goods.

Based on Mueller's comments, a lot of major airlines already have this kind of data. He wants to bring this technology to EK by 2025.
 
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Re: EK to study all-economy A380 to combat low cost carriers

Thu Sep 07, 2017 3:35 pm

parapente wrote:
It seems a little over complicated but I can see it.
11 across with the so called 18" seat
10 across with standard 18.5" seat
10 across with a little more legroom and recline but keeping the 18.5" seat.
9 across (if lower deck) with Qantas style premium y.
And some lie flat biz class to round it all off.


Something like this has long struck me as sane. It kind of corresponds to the star ratings of motels. I would probably choose one of the 10 across. It sounds like it would be comparable to a three star motel. Water and cheap snacks should be free (meets The Good Samaritan standard). Buy the food and beverages you want.
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Re: EK to study all-economy A380 to combat low cost carriers

Thu Sep 07, 2017 3:45 pm

KarelXWB wrote:
anshabhi wrote:
Guess which is the only LCC which directly threatens ME3 on their staple passengers-- IndiGo.


Tim Clark mentioned long-haul low-cost carriers are the biggest threat.


EK in the defensive, for a change.

I think this is a profound remark. The times they are changing.

It will be interesting to see whom might be able to cramp 800 passengers in one A380.
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Re: EK to study all-economy A380 to combat low cost carriers

Thu Sep 07, 2017 3:54 pm

True ala carte, without prejudice, would allow the customer to buy the services wanted. The Airline would establish its target profit margin and apply it to each of its services. Someone might want to travel economy plus, use what is now called the business lounge at an airport, and eat and drink as they want. For all of this to work smoothly big data, well designed web sites, effective automated communications with suppliers and customers is required. Custom packages to ensure all services are used at capacity (but not over that) could be offered to specific customers with the intention of encouraging them to upgrade. This all requires a lot of computer power.

Think Amazon - They have upwards of 50K high paid people in Seattle doing this sort of thing, and they just announced a second headquarters of the same size will be built in another city.
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Re: EK to study all-economy A380

Thu Sep 07, 2017 4:43 pm

Polot wrote:
mjoelnir wrote:
horizon360 wrote:

What are the odds that their new Y- section will be 11-abreast?


Emirates is not interested in 11 abreast on the A380.

For their standard A380 configurations sure. For an all-economy A380 with "multiple classes of economy" designed to compete against mid/long haul LCCs EK may have a different opinion in regards to 11 abreast in A380s for the basic Y sections.



An already paid-for A380 with an all-economy configuration and 11 abreast seating in some sections must have an unbeatable CASM.

(If you can fill up those 700+ seats)
 
aviationjunky
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Re: EK to study all-economy A380 to combat low cost carriers

Thu Sep 07, 2017 4:47 pm

It they wanted to break it into 4 Economy classes, it would easily be:

- Economy Basic with no seat selections (randomly selected at time of check in), everything is BOB including seatback entertainment and baggage.
- Economy Plus with no seat selections (randomly selected at time of check in), but free snacks/drinks, with BOB seatback entertainment and baggage.
- Economy Select with free seat selections at check in, free snacks/drinks, with BOB seatback entertainment, and one free checked bag.
- Economy Premium with free advanced seat selections, 50% extra leg room, free snacks/drinks, free seatback entertainment, and one free checked bag.

Also, the issue with an all economy A380 is the amount and wight of bags for the 700+ passengers. I'm sure there is going to be an EXTREME weight restrictions on the passengers and bags.
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Re: EK to study all-economy A380 to combat low cost carriers

Thu Sep 07, 2017 4:48 pm

dtw2hyd wrote:
Timothy may be still spinning the idea of old class structure, but Mueller's idea is to eliminate "the segregation of transportation classes", his own words.

Mueller thinks, airlines should offer the whole basket of goods and services, passenger picks and pays for what they want.

If I want a flatbed, but not filet mignon/dom/caviar, I should be able to purchase exactly that.
If some one on a 6hr flight wants an economy seat but premium meal (filet mignon/dom/caviar) and a greeting by name with a smile, they should be able to buy that.

This will be achieved through digital innovation and big data.

I like your wording better than the "needs and expectations" marketing bullshit in the slides posted earlier, but still, it's not about "wants" since we all would want a first class seat if not a suite.

A more true rendering is "passenger picks what they decide they can afford".

frmrCapCadet wrote:
True ala carte, without prejudice, would allow the customer to buy the services wanted. The Airline would establish its target profit margin and apply it to each of its services. Someone might want to travel economy plus, use what is now called the business lounge at an airport, and eat and drink as they want. For all of this to work smoothly big data, well designed web sites, effective automated communications with suppliers and customers is required. Custom packages to ensure all services are used at capacity (but not over that) could be offered to specific customers with the intention of encouraging them to upgrade. This all requires a lot of computer power.

Think Amazon - They have upwards of 50K high paid people in Seattle doing this sort of thing, and they just announced a second headquarters of the same size will be built in another city.

Seems idealistic to me.

Customer will be faced with a myriad of "bundles" of features to choose from, carefully chosen by marketing to get the pax to pay for things they don't want.

If every single detail is selectable, it's going to make delivery of the exact product specified pretty difficult for the front line staff.

The usual dynamic will still be in play: the customer will want to maximize what they get versus what they spend, the airline will try to minimize what they deliver and maximize what they can charge.
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Re: EK to study all-economy A380

Thu Sep 07, 2017 4:54 pm

jmmadrid wrote:
Polot wrote:
mjoelnir wrote:

Emirates is not interested in 11 abreast on the A380.

For their standard A380 configurations sure. For an all-economy A380 with "multiple classes of economy" designed to compete against mid/long haul LCCs EK may have a different opinion in regards to 11 abreast in A380s for the basic Y sections.



An already paid-for A380 with an all-economy configuration and 11 abreast seating in some sections must have an unbeatable CASM.

(If you can fill up those 700+ seats)


An unbeatable CASM yes, but a lot of empty seats. In addition, nobody knows the economics of maintining the A380 beyond the 12 year C8 checks.
IMO EK's not a viable business but what makes it less catastrophic is their cheap premium offering (even though perhaps it's part of the problem why EK will never be viable without subsidies). Take that away and they are toast.
 
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Re: EK to study all-economy A380 to combat low cost carriers

Thu Sep 07, 2017 5:21 pm

Revelation wrote:
dtw2hyd wrote:
Timothy may be still spinning the idea of old class structure, but Mueller's idea is to eliminate "the segregation of transportation classes", his own words.

Mueller thinks, airlines should offer the whole basket of goods and services, passenger picks and pays for what they want.

If I want a flatbed, but not filet mignon/dom/caviar, I should be able to purchase exactly that.
If some one on a 6hr flight wants an economy seat but premium meal (filet mignon/dom/caviar) and a greeting by name with a smile, they should be able to buy that.

This will be achieved through digital innovation and big data.

I like your wording better than the "needs and expectations" marketing bullshit in the slides posted earlier, but still, it's not about "wants" since we all would want a first class seat if not a suite.

A more true rendering is "passenger picks what they decide they can afford".

frmrCapCadet wrote:
True ala carte, without prejudice, would allow the customer to buy the services wanted. The Airline would establish its target profit margin and apply it to each of its services. Someone might want to travel economy plus, use what is now called the business lounge at an airport, and eat and drink as they want. For all of this to work smoothly big data, well designed web sites, effective automated communications with suppliers and customers is required. Custom packages to ensure all services are used at capacity (but not over that) could be offered to specific customers with the intention of encouraging them to upgrade. This all requires a lot of computer power.

Think Amazon - They have upwards of 50K high paid people in Seattle doing this sort of thing, and they just announced a second headquarters of the same size will be built in another city.

Seems idealistic to me.

Customer will be faced with a myriad of "bundles" of features to choose from, carefully chosen by marketing to get the pax to pay for things they don't want.

If every single detail is selectable, it's going to make delivery of the exact product specified pretty difficult for the front line staff.

The usual dynamic will still be in play: the customer will want to maximize what they get versus what they spend, the airline will try to minimize what they deliver and maximize what they can charge.


As an example: if I have a 5 hour layover (something I try to avoid) I would like a bit of personal space. Like a lounge, but I don't need included shower, food or drink et alia. And I am quite willing to pay for it, but not if it has a 90% profit pricing. $10 an hour for a recliner not too far from food and restrooms, a place to safely leave my carryon and do a bit of walking. Parents should have a place for kids to play (think MacDonald's play areas), again they would be willing to pay. Maybe this is available, I haven't seen many airports.

The time should long be past when airlines can treat Y passengers like sh*t. Unless you pay multiples of advertised fares this is often what can be expected. Airlines are using public facilities, paid for by taxes and customers (not airlines when you come down to it). It may require paying customers, through their elected representatives to write the basic contracts for what the public can expect when they fly via public spaces. There are, and I do not include you, those who think it is perfectly OK to mistreat Y passengers. I applaud EK for their taking the lead in reversing this dynamic.
Last edited by frmrCapCadet on Thu Sep 07, 2017 5:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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speedbird52
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Re: EK to study all-economy A380 to combat low cost carriers

Thu Sep 07, 2017 5:31 pm

Low cast airlines really are ruining this industry
 
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Channex757
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Re: EK to study all-economy A380 to combat low cost carriers

Thu Sep 07, 2017 5:47 pm

It's obvious to me who Emirates are looking at as the main danger to their volume business.

Air Asia X, Cebu Pacific, Scoot and the rest.

EK wants to deploy the A380 against them, offering super low fares on high density A380s with their top-of-the-line CASM figures. The A380 gets extremely cheap to operate when you start packing it out, and Asia is where those cheap fares will certainly take off.Add a little Emirates glitter to the product and they are in with a fighting chance.

I can't see these aircraft finding their way into Europe. That's a more mature market with premium demand. These are the Asian people movers into Indonesia and Malaysia, places like this.
 
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Re: EK to study all-economy A380

Thu Sep 07, 2017 5:56 pm

Waterbomber wrote:
IMO EK's not a viable business but what makes it less catastrophic is their cheap premium offering (even though perhaps it's part of the problem why EK will never be viable without subsidies). Take that away and they are toast.


Come back when you have any proof of such subsidies. This topic has been long discussed in a.net, with not a single evidence of so. That shaming/begging/blaming rethoric is really exhausting. And always coming from same side of the ocean.
Last edited by Jayafe on Thu Sep 07, 2017 6:00 pm, edited 2 times in total.
 
johns624
Posts: 2380
Joined: Mon Jul 07, 2008 11:09 pm

Re: EK to study all-economy A380 to combat low cost carriers

Thu Sep 07, 2017 6:00 pm

It's called "Steerage"...
 
dtw2hyd
Posts: 7532
Joined: Wed Jan 09, 2013 12:11 pm

Re: EK to study all-economy A380 to combat low cost carriers

Thu Sep 07, 2017 6:10 pm

Channex757 wrote:
It's obvious to me who Emirates are looking at as the main danger to their volume business.

Air Asia X, Cebu Pacific, Scoot and the rest.

EK wants to deploy the A380 against them, offering super low fares on high density A380s with their top-of-the-line CASM figures. The A380 gets extremely cheap to operate when you start packing it out, and Asia is where those cheap fares will certainly take off.Add a little Emirates glitter to the product and they are in with a fighting chance.

I can't see these aircraft finding their way into Europe. That's a more mature market with premium demand. These are the Asian people movers into Indonesia and Malaysia, places like this.


Probably you could add Norwegian and WOW to the list.

The main problem for Emirates is its bloated cost structure. It cannot compete with airlines with frugal cost structure.

It is their own making. If one Emirati wants to have a top management position hire 50 Brits as senior/middle-level managers, 150 Indians as supervisors and 4,799 worker bees from all over. Later decide what they will do.
 
User avatar
enilria
Posts: 9797
Joined: Fri Feb 22, 2008 7:15 pm

Re: EK to study all-economy A380 to combat low cost carriers

Thu Sep 07, 2017 6:32 pm

KarelXWB wrote:
Tim Clark is speaking at the #AviationFest in London and mentioned Emirates may explore all-economy A380s to compete against the rising long-haul low-cost carriers.

If AA/DL/UA were right that EK doesn't care about profitability, why would they even do things like make the A380 more dense (as they keep doing)? More evidence AA/DL/UA are playing politics.
 
MIflyer12
Posts: 6456
Joined: Mon Feb 18, 2013 11:58 pm

Re: EK to study all-economy A380 to combat low cost carriers

Thu Sep 07, 2017 6:38 pm

Services a la carte can be (un)bundled and delivered pretty easily. When you start messing with seat width and seat pitch you're going to get inventory problems: not enough (the extra pitch window seat I wanted) or too much (and had to give a 'nice' seat to somebody who didn't pay for it).
 
VSMUT
Posts: 3479
Joined: Mon Aug 08, 2016 11:40 am

Re: EK to study all-economy A380 to combat low cost carriers

Thu Sep 07, 2017 6:41 pm

dtw2hyd wrote:
Channex757 wrote:
It's obvious to me who Emirates are looking at as the main danger to their volume business.

Air Asia X, Cebu Pacific, Scoot and the rest.

EK wants to deploy the A380 against them, offering super low fares on high density A380s with their top-of-the-line CASM figures. The A380 gets extremely cheap to operate when you start packing it out, and Asia is where those cheap fares will certainly take off.Add a little Emirates glitter to the product and they are in with a fighting chance.

I can't see these aircraft finding their way into Europe. That's a more mature market with premium demand. These are the Asian people movers into Indonesia and Malaysia, places like this.


Probably you could add Norwegian and WOW to the list.


Probably not WOW, they don't offer any flights remotely between markets connected by Emirates. But Norwegian and Eurowings in particular must be hurting Emirates on holidaymakers traveling from Europe to Asia and Africa. I read somewhere that Bangkok was one of the primary destinations of Emirates passengers travelling from Scandinavia, and since then Norwegian has barged into the market, probably stealing a ton of passengers. It's only a matter of time before Norwegian starts expanding their long haul services to Asia from other European markets, and that is what Emirates is fearing. Probably even worse with the Eurowings, who seem to be targeting markets dominated by the ME3 to a much greater extent than Norwegian (and probably deliberately done so by LH).

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