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LatinPlane
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San Diego's Palomar Airport Reopens - Cal Jet to LAS

Sun Oct 22, 2017 12:00 am

I'm surprised I didn't read it here first. Carlsbad's McClellan-Palomar has regained schedule airline service thanks to Cal Jet a new airline in partnership with Elite Airways.

Flights started twice a day to LAS. They are planning to expand service to the Bay Area and as well as Cabo.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LCFA8zIL-zM

Wishing them all the best of luck in their business!
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globalflyer
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Re: San Diego's Palomar Airport Reopens - Cal Jet to LAS

Sun Oct 22, 2017 2:05 am

A fantastic trip report already in that forum for that service. Great article and pictures.
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loisencroach
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Re: San Diego's Palomar Airport Reopens - Cal Jet to LAS

Sun Oct 22, 2017 6:56 pm

Wouldn't be surprised if STS is their next Bay Area city to replace G4's pullout
 
mtnwest1979
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Re: San Diego's Palomar Airport Reopens - Cal Jet to LAS

Sun Oct 22, 2017 7:11 pm

loisencroach wrote:
Wouldn't be surprised if STS is their next Bay Area city to replace G4's pullout



Probably not since they are catering to the CLD originating traffic and mostly on business traveler with any new locales, with some exception. See Cal Pacific former plans for basically same exact plan for these folks.
With two failed carriers on STS-LAS ( QX G4), that would seem to me mean demand is not sufficient enough to maintain any regular service to LAS.

I was in LAS 10/10 and saw their earlier arrival from CLD and noted 32 pax deplane. Evidently none were booked to go back as plane then pushed and off it went.
Thought 32 was decent enough for as young of service it is.
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SANFan
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Re: San Diego's Palomar Airport Reopens - Cal Jet to LAS

Sun Oct 22, 2017 9:20 pm

When this new service at CLD was first previewed, I think a lot of folks didn't even bother to discuss it, as in, "let's wait to see the first flight depart." Since the inaugural flight was at the end of September, then I guess, assuming they're still flying, Congrat's are in order to both Cal Jet and Palomar! If they can keep the fares where they say they will, fly the 'right' routes, and still make some money, then more power to them.

I didn't see/hear anything about service to LAX which IMO is what they really need to add to accommodate the business travelers in the North County area.

loisencroach wrote:
Wouldn't be surprised if STS is their next Bay Area city to replace G4's pullout

Excuse me? Are you talking about Stockton -- which G4 serves from SAN but I don't believe they've eliminated that route permanently -- because G4 doesn't fly SAN-STS now or ever. Or are you talking about LAS-STS? Please clarify what you are referring to.

bb
 
SANMAN66
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Re: San Diego's Palomar Airport Reopens - Cal Jet to LAS

Mon Oct 23, 2017 5:48 pm

All CLD needs now is for Alaska/Horizon to start there with the Q100,maybe a few flights to LAX?
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WN732
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Re: San Diego's Palomar Airport Reopens - Cal Jet to LAS

Mon Oct 23, 2017 7:07 pm

SANFan wrote:
When this new service at CLD was first previewed, I think a lot of folks didn't even bother to discuss it, as in, "let's wait to see the first flight depart." Since the inaugural flight was at the end of September, then I guess, assuming they're still flying, Congrat's are in order to both Cal Jet and Palomar! If they can keep the fares where they say they will, fly the 'right' routes, and still make some money, then more power to them.

I didn't see/hear anything about service to LAX which IMO is what they really need to add to accommodate the business travelers in the North County area.

loisencroach wrote:
Wouldn't be surprised if STS is their next Bay Area city to replace G4's pullout

Excuse me? Are you talking about Stockton -- which G4 serves from SAN but I don't believe they've eliminated that route permanently -- because G4 doesn't fly SAN-STS now or ever. Or are you talking about LAS-STS? Please clarify what you are referring to.

bb


I think he meant that Cal Jet would replace G4 entirely at STS as they have pulled out of STS. Perhaps they could serve CLD directly to STS instead of someone doing STS-SAN.
 
AirFiero
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Re: San Diego's Palomar Airport Reopens - Cal Jet to LAS

Mon Oct 23, 2017 7:09 pm

Is this airline in any way related to the one that earlier proposed CLD service? What was it, California Pacific?
 
AWACSooner
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Re: San Diego's Palomar Airport Reopens - Cal Jet to LAS

Mon Oct 23, 2017 7:16 pm

SANMAN66 wrote:
All CLD needs now is for Alaska/Horizon to start there with the Q100,maybe a few flights to LAX?

Except Horizon dumped their -100s years ago...and I doubt they could fill a Q400 for any route out of there at this stage.
 
SANMAN66
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Re: San Diego's Palomar Airport Reopens - Cal Jet to LAS

Tue Oct 24, 2017 7:14 pm

AWACSooner wrote:
SANMAN66 wrote:
All CLD needs now is for Alaska/Horizon to start there with the Q100,maybe a few flights to LAX?

Except Horizon dumped their -100s years ago...and I doubt they could fill a Q400 for any route out of there at this stage.


Oops! I meant Q400. They cant fill a Q400 from CLD?
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SurfandSnow
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Re: San Diego's Palomar Airport Reopens - Cal Jet to LAS

Tue Oct 24, 2017 7:59 pm

I actually have been wondering if CLD could be an opportunity for airlines like AA, AS and/or UA. These airlines haven't been afraid to try smaller Californian markets like MMH, SBP and STS lately, and it can be very difficult to reach the likes of SAN or SNA from northern San Diego County these days...
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SANFan
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Re: San Diego's Palomar Airport Reopens - Cal Jet to LAS

Tue Oct 24, 2017 9:09 pm

SurfandSnow wrote:
I actually have been wondering if CLD could be an opportunity for airlines like AA, AS and/or UA. These airlines haven't been afraid to try smaller Californian markets like MMH, SBP and STS lately, and it can be very difficult to reach the likes of SAN or SNA from northern San Diego County these days...

AAEagle and UAExpress have both tried CLD (to LAX) in the past; UAx left when their Embraers were retired. That is not to say they couldn't try it again, with whatever a/c they feel might work.

I would love to see QX try flying a couple of Qs r/t to LA every day and they could even run a daily r/t to SFO. I doubt it will happen though. (I also wonder if we could some day see SAN-LAX service from QX? Or will they continue to turn all that business over to AA?)

bb
 
MO11
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Re: San Diego's Palomar Airport Reopens - Cal Jet to LAS

Tue Oct 24, 2017 9:12 pm

AirFiero wrote:
Is this airline in any way related to the one that earlier proposed CLD service? What was it, California Pacific?


No. The current operation is actually two companies. Cal Jet is actually a tour operator, not an airline. It has been around for several years. Elite Airways is the actual certificated carrier that is providing the service.
 
deebee278
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Re: San Diego's Palomar Airport Reopens - Cal Jet to LAS

Tue Oct 24, 2017 9:12 pm

loisencroach wrote:
Wouldn't be surprised if STS is their next Bay Area city to replace G4's pullout


Due to the massive wildfires, I don't feel that KSTS (Santa Rosa) will be on any airline's bucket list anytime soon.
 
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usxguy
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Re: San Diego's Palomar Airport Reopens - Cal Jet to LAS

Wed Oct 25, 2017 4:53 am

DOT Part 380 / public charters can't interline. In fact, Expedia expelled all of them from GDS bookings.
xx
 
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hawaiian717
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Re: San Diego's Palomar Airport Reopens - Cal Jet to LAS

Wed Oct 25, 2017 4:54 am

CLD-LAX only makes sense as a hub feeding route since its so close; going to a further hub like SFO, LAS, or PHX would allow a mix of local and connecting traffic. Either way you would need connecting feed, which both CalJet and the short-lived BizAirShuttle lack.

The other problem is the need for good short field performance at CLD, which makes the CRJ-700 a more viable option than the CRJ-200 for CLD. But the bigger plane is harder to fill, so the economics of making CLD work are tough, especially with the lack of small turboprops on the west coast now with the retirements of the SkyWest EMB-120s, Mesa Dash 8s, and Eagle Saab 340s. And customers have to weigh the convenience of CLD with a connecting flight versus the longer drive but more nonstop options at SAN and SNA.
 
doug_or
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Re: San Diego's Palomar Airport Reopens - Cal Jet to LAS

Wed Oct 25, 2017 4:56 am

There isn't a local market to LAX, it would rely on connections. That makes AS/QX a pretty poor choice. They could potentially codeshare with AA, but the revenue sharing would have to be pretty rich.
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Jamake1
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Re: San Diego's Palomar Airport Reopens - Cal Jet to LAS

Wed Oct 25, 2017 6:51 am

Cal Jet/Elite should fly CLD-SFO. Suburban airport to major airport. There would be plenty of local traffic. It's a shame that Skywest/United Express doesn't fly CLD-SFO. The connection opportunities would be bountiful.
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GCT64
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Re: San Diego's Palomar Airport Reopens - Cal Jet to LAS

Wed Oct 25, 2017 1:05 pm

Jamake1 wrote:
Cal Jet/Elite should fly CLD-SFO. Suburban airport to major airport. There would be plenty of local traffic. It's a shame that Skywest/United Express doesn't fly CLD-SFO. The connection opportunities would be bountiful.


I agree. We have some small operations in Carlsbad and Silicon Valley and important customers in both locations. I am pretty sure that CLD-SFO (on UA or Cal Jet/Elite) or CLD-SJC (on Cal Jet/Elite or Horizon/AS) would be successful. There are surprising number of tech companies in Carlsbad, many are (very) close to the airport.
Flown in: A20N,A21N,A30B,A306,A310,A319,A320,A321,A332,A333,A343,A346,A359,A388,BA11,BU31,(..56 more types..),VC10,WESX
 
loisencroach
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Re: San Diego's Palomar Airport Reopens - Cal Jet to LAS

Wed Oct 25, 2017 2:17 pm

deebee278 wrote:
loisencroach wrote:
Wouldn't be surprised if STS is their next Bay Area city to replace G4's pullout


Due to the massive wildfires, I don't feel that KSTS (Santa Rosa) will be on any airline's bucket list anytime soon.


The fires did more residential damage than anything and most of the harvest has already occurred
Last edited by loisencroach on Wed Oct 25, 2017 2:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
wedgetail737
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Re: San Diego's Palomar Airport Reopens - Cal Jet to LAS

Wed Oct 25, 2017 2:34 pm

I would be surprised to see QX/AS at CLD considering their operations at SAN.
 
evank516
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Re: San Diego's Palomar Airport Reopens - Cal Jet to LAS

Wed Oct 25, 2017 4:09 pm

hawaiian717 wrote:
CLD-LAX only makes sense as a hub feeding route since its so close; going to a further hub like SFO, LAS, or PHX would allow a mix of local and connecting traffic. Either way you would need connecting feed, which both CalJet and the short-lived BizAirShuttle lack.

The other problem is the need for good short field performance at CLD, which makes the CRJ-700 a more viable option than the CRJ-200 for CLD. But the bigger plane is harder to fill, so the economics of making CLD work are tough, especially with the lack of small turboprops on the west coast now with the retirements of the SkyWest EMB-120s, Mesa Dash 8s, and Eagle Saab 340s. And customers have to weigh the convenience of CLD with a connecting flight versus the longer drive but more nonstop options at SAN and SNA.


The E170/175 might be a viable option as well. These aircraft have pretty stellar short field performance. On the east coast Eagle flies the 175 on CLT/DCA-EYW (MIA-EYW too). Does AA have any E-Jets in PHX? I know DL has an E-Jet base in SLC. That might be an option in time. The 170 doesn't have much more (if any) capacity than the CRJ-700.
 
ridgid727
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Re: San Diego's Palomar Airport Reopens - Cal Jet to LAS

Thu Nov 16, 2017 4:09 am

Anyone know how these flights have been doing?
 
n7371f
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Re: San Diego's Palomar Airport Reopens - Cal Jet to LAS

Thu Nov 16, 2017 5:00 am

Wozniak an interesting cat. He had a varied run in the Twin Cities. Read up on it.
 
N415XJ
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Re: San Diego's Palomar Airport Reopens - Cal Jet to LAS

Thu Nov 16, 2017 5:49 am

I guess this explains the all-white CRJ I saw on my trip to LAS a few weeks ago. What an interesting little carrier... I might have to try them out next time I have some extra cash from a big win on the strip (assuming they survive long enough).
 
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KLMatSJC
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Re: San Diego's Palomar Airport Reopens - Cal Jet to LAS

Thu Nov 16, 2017 5:56 am

Speaking of CLD, there is a big announcement tomorrow about California Pacific Air. Apparently they are buying a 58-year old airline for their operating certificate, and will be operating 4 ERJ-145s and 2 -175s. out of CLD, starting on April 1 (Yes, 2018). I think the airline is Aerodynamics Inc. (ADI), but we will find out for sure tomorrow morning
A318/19/20/21/21N A332/3 A343/5 A388 B712 B722 B732/3/4/7/8/9/9ER B744/4M B752/3 B762ER/3/3ER/4ER B772/E/L/W B788 CRJ2/7/9 Q400 EMB-120 ERJ-135/140/145/145XR/175 DC-10-10 MD-82/83/88/90

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ridgid727
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Re: San Diego's Palomar Airport Reopens - Cal Jet to LAS

Thu Nov 16, 2017 1:02 pm

KLMatSJC wrote:
Speaking of CLD, there is a big announcement tomorrow about California Pacific Air. Apparently they are buying a 58-year old airline for their operating certificate, and will be operating 4 ERJ-145s and 2 -175s. out of CLD, starting on April 1 (Yes, 2018). I think the airline is Aerodynamics Inc. (ADI), but we will find out for sure tomorrow morning

Let me get this correct, the attempt to start California Pacific Air is on the books again? Is it still under the direction of Ted Vallas?
 
MO11
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Re: San Diego's Palomar Airport Reopens - Cal Jet to LAS

Thu Nov 16, 2017 2:43 pm

KLMatSJC wrote:
Speaking of CLD, there is a big announcement tomorrow about California Pacific Air. Apparently they are buying a 58-year old airline for their operating certificate, and will be operating 4 ERJ-145s and 2 -175s. out of CLD, starting on April 1 (Yes, 2018). I think the airline is Aerodynamics Inc. (ADI), but we will find out for sure tomorrow morning



Aerodynamics is correct.....
 
routeplanner
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Re: San Diego's Palomar Airport Reopens - Cal Jet to LAS

Thu Nov 16, 2017 2:44 pm

https://www.ch-aviation.com/portal/news ... q18-launch

They probably could have picked up the WP certificate for a song with no planes, then they would have to get the aircraft they want to use on their ops certificate. But maybe this ADI thing will work out best.
 
SANMAN66
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Re: San Diego's Palomar Airport Reopens - Cal Jet to LAS

Thu Nov 16, 2017 4:03 pm

routeplanner wrote:
https://www.ch-aviation.com/portal/news/61136-california-pacific-eyes-part-121-carrier-2q18-launch

They probably could have picked up the WP certificate for a song with no planes, then they would have to get the aircraft they want to use on their ops certificate. But maybe this ADI thing will work out best.


I wish them luck! I thought California Pacific was dead, but I read the article, that's too many destinations for an upstart airline,
they need to start with one or two destinations at first. That destination to LAS? Caljet is not going to like that idea! Or Los Cabos?
They need to leave all the international flying to SAN. (Does CLD have FIS facilities?)
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mtnwest1979
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Re: San Diego's Palomar Airport Reopens - Cal Jet to LAS

Thu Nov 16, 2017 4:18 pm

SANMAN66 wrote:
routeplanner wrote:
https://www.ch-aviation.com/portal/news/61136-california-pacific-eyes-part-121-carrier-2q18-launch

They probably could have picked up the WP certificate for a song with no planes, then they would have to get the aircraft they want to use on their ops certificate. But maybe this ADI thing will work out best.


I wish them luck! I thought California Pacific was dead, but I read the article, that's too many destinations for an upstart airline,
they need to start with one or two destinations at first. That destination to LAS? Caljet is not going to like that idea! Or Los Cabos?
They need to leave all the international flying to SAN. (Does CLD have FIS facilities?)


Well it didn't say they were going to start all of them at once. Probably just like previous plan, here and there until all are on line.
Now I want to start an airlines out of CLD and name it California Coastal Jet lol. Half hourly E120s to ONT haha.
Riddle: Which lasts longer, a start-up airline or a start-up football league?
 
SANMAN66
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Re: San Diego's Palomar Airport Reopens - Cal Jet to LAS

Thu Nov 16, 2017 5:25 pm

mtnwest1979 wrote:

Now I want to start an airlines out of CLD and name it California Coastal Jet lol. Half hourly E120s to ONT haha.


:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
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RJNUT
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Re: San Diego's Palomar Airport Reopens - Cal Jet to LAS

Thu Nov 16, 2017 5:45 pm

ADI runs the DEN-PIR-ATY EAS route codeshare with ZK. I wonder how this affects that route.
 
ridgid727
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Re: San Diego's Palomar Airport Reopens - Cal Jet to LAS

Thu Nov 16, 2017 6:48 pm

Their website announces April 1st as well.
http://flycpair.com/
 
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jnev3289
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Re: San Diego's Palomar Airport Reopens - Cal Jet to LAS

Thu Nov 16, 2017 7:00 pm

ridgid727 wrote:
Their website announces April 1st as well.
http://flycpair.com/

THAT is their website? Woof. I've seen better websites from "Into to Computers" Freshman College Student projects
 
SANMAN66
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Re: San Diego's Palomar Airport Reopens - Cal Jet to LAS

Thu Nov 16, 2017 7:05 pm

They sound confident this time. I'm still wondering about that flight to Los Cabos, I
had asked earlier if CLD has FIS facilities? It looks as if Los Cabos is one of Caljet's
future destinations also.
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GCT64
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Re: San Diego's Palomar Airport Reopens - Cal Jet to LAS

Thu Nov 16, 2017 7:18 pm

Who would have thought that CLD would have two scheduled passenger airlines based there!
I've always thought CLD could be a much bigger market/airline operation than it is/has been but finding enough business to keep 2 airlines running is a tough task.
Flown in: A20N,A21N,A30B,A306,A310,A319,A320,A321,A332,A333,A343,A346,A359,A388,BA11,BU31,(..56 more types..),VC10,WESX
 
ridgid727
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Re: San Diego's Palomar Airport Reopens - Cal Jet to LAS

Thu Nov 16, 2017 7:28 pm

GCT64 wrote:
Who would have thought that CLD would have two scheduled passenger airlines based there!
I've always thought CLD could be a much bigger market/airline operation than it is/has been but finding enough business to keep 2 airlines running is a tough task.


It is interesting. Not sure I understand why they both need to serve LAS and both plan on serving the same markets. CP Air going to OAK and SJC is a little baffling, and I would have thought SEA would have been on their radar early on.
 
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jnev3289
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Re: San Diego's Palomar Airport Reopens - Cal Jet to LAS

Thu Nov 16, 2017 7:30 pm

Also a bit ironic or ominous they're planning to start flights on April Fools Day...
 
ridgid727
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Re: San Diego's Palomar Airport Reopens - Cal Jet to LAS

Thu Nov 16, 2017 7:31 pm

ridgid727 wrote:
GCT64 wrote:
Who would have thought that CLD would have two scheduled passenger airlines based there!
I've always thought CLD could be a much bigger market/airline operation than it is/has been but finding enough business to keep 2 airlines running is a tough task.


It is interesting. Not sure I understand why they both need to serve LAS and both plan on serving the same markets. CP Air going to both OAK and SJC is a little baffling, and I would have thought SEA would have been on their radar early on.
 
evank516
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Re: San Diego's Palomar Airport Reopens - Cal Jet to LAS

Thu Nov 16, 2017 7:55 pm

jnev3289 wrote:
Also a bit ironic or ominous they're planning to start flights on April Fools Day...


Glad I'm not the only one who saw this.
 
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usxguy
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Re: San Diego's Palomar Airport Reopens - Cal Jet to LAS

Thu Nov 16, 2017 8:03 pm

or that they are buying SkyValue Airlines...
xx
 
SANMAN66
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Re: San Diego's Palomar Airport Reopens - Cal Jet to LAS

Thu Nov 16, 2017 8:16 pm

jnev3289 wrote:
Also a bit ironic or ominous they're planning to start flights on April Fools Day...


Uh,oh!!! Could this be a joke?
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TWA902fly
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Re: San Diego's Palomar Airport Reopens - Cal Jet to LAS

Thu Nov 16, 2017 8:36 pm

jnev3289 wrote:
ridgid727 wrote:
Their website announces April 1st as well.
http://flycpair.com/

THAT is their website? Woof. I've seen better websites from "Into to Computers" Freshman College Student projects


And the guy who wrote the start date is named Tom Morrow... 'Tomorrow' haha.

'902
life wasn't worth the balance, or the crumpled paper it was written on
 
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KLMatSJC
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Re: San Diego's Palomar Airport Reopens - Cal Jet to LAS

Fri Nov 17, 2017 7:19 pm

usxguy wrote:
or that they are buying SkyValue Airlines...


That's ADI, the airline I mentioned earlier.
A318/19/20/21/21N A332/3 A343/5 A388 B712 B722 B732/3/4/7/8/9/9ER B744/4M B752/3 B762ER/3/3ER/4ER B772/E/L/W B788 CRJ2/7/9 Q400 EMB-120 ERJ-135/140/145/145XR/175 DC-10-10 MD-82/83/88/90

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KLMatSJC
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Re: San Diego's Palomar Airport Reopens - Cal Jet to LAS

Sun Nov 19, 2017 7:27 pm

It is confirmed that it is Aerodynamics Inc. (ADI) or SkyValue Airlines. The CEO will stay on as the CEO of CP. I have been following this airline since their first announcement in 2010, and I truly think this time will work.

https://www.sandiegoreader.com/news/201 ... dy-again/#
A318/19/20/21/21N A332/3 A343/5 A388 B712 B722 B732/3/4/7/8/9/9ER B744/4M B752/3 B762ER/3/3ER/4ER B772/E/L/W B788 CRJ2/7/9 Q400 EMB-120 ERJ-135/140/145/145XR/175 DC-10-10 MD-82/83/88/90

Long Live the Tulip, Cactus, and Redwood
 
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OA940
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Re: San Diego's Palomar Airport Reopens - Cal Jet to LAS

Sun Nov 19, 2017 9:01 pm

Well I hope both succeed, but idk. For some reason I think that Cal Jet would do better.
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kgaiflyer
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Re: San Diego's Palomar Airport Reopens - Cal Jet to LAS

Sun Nov 19, 2017 10:17 pm

"AAEagle and UAExpress have both tried CLD (to LAX) in the past; UAx left when their Embraers were retired."
.
It's been a while since I flew UAX CLD-LAX. As I recall, we docked at LAX gate 71A. We arrived behind schedule. Pretty nearly everyone on board ran across the concourse to either 70A (Washington-Dulles) or 70B (San Francisco). Otherwise, the E-120 had every seat filled. A 30 passenger plane seemed just about right for such a service.
 
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usxguy
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Re: San Diego's Palomar Airport Reopens - Cal Jet to LAS

Sun Nov 19, 2017 10:19 pm

Problem with CalJet is being a DOT Part 380, you can't book those on many of the online travel engines, and you also can't interline. At least with ADI having scheduled authority, there's more distribution opportunities.
xx
 
amadorE175
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Re: San Diego's Palomar Airport Reopens - Cal Jet to LAS

Sun Nov 19, 2017 11:11 pm

TWA902fly wrote:
jnev3289 wrote:
ridgid727 wrote:
Their website announces April 1st as well.
http://flycpair.com/

THAT is their website? Woof. I've seen better websites from "Into to Computers" Freshman College Student projects


And the guy who wrote the start date is named Tom Morrow... 'Tomorrow' haha.

'902


I don't know if it's the same person but there is an actual person named Tom Morrow who used to write for the local newspaper.

http://www.osidenews.com/tom-morrow-writer/

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