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scouseflyer
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Re: Istanbul new airport - latest pictures and discussion thread

Thu Oct 25, 2018 8:45 pm

UPlog wrote:
I really find it fascinating how so many foreign nations are able to deliver great infrastructure projects in a short time, while it can take us a decade to simply renovate a few terminals.

While I doubt I will ever get to pilot a plane into IST, I would look forward to using it as a passenger. Kudos to the Turks


A good chunk of that is due to stronger environmental and H&S laws in the Western nations - think of the size of the forest that has been obliterated by this development and whether that would happen in the UK or Germany or the US (less so now). Turkey also is somewhat more "autocratic" so people are told to do stuff and less questions get asked!
 
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Clipper101
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Re: Istanbul new airport - latest pictures and discussion thread

Fri Oct 26, 2018 3:55 am

scouseflyer wrote:
UPlog wrote:
I really find it fascinating how so many foreign nations are able to deliver great infrastructure projects in a short time, while it can take us a decade to simply renovate a few terminals.

While I doubt I will ever get to pilot a plane into IST, I would look forward to using it as a passenger. Kudos to the Turks


A good chunk of that is due to stronger environmental and H&S laws in the Western nations - think of the size of the forest that has been obliterated by this development and whether that would happen in the UK or Germany or the US (less so now). Turkey also is somewhat more "autocratic" so people are told to do stuff and less questions get asked!


- Germany: it did happen with the construction of the 4th runway in FRA.

- US: Take a visit to Florida & see the number of trees that are routinely cut not necessarily to build airports, but to build resorts, malls, housing complexes & other constructions of this sort.
 
leftyboarder
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Re: Istanbul new airport - latest pictures and discussion thread

Fri Oct 26, 2018 5:48 am

While I agree that environmental protection laws are slightly less enforced in Turkey (in writing they are in fact pretty harsh and there was a time many projects were stalled because of them), it is an illusion that infrastructure development takes place slower in the West due to environmental laws. It is NIMBYs that slow projects down in the West, not environmental protection agencies.
 
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LAXintl
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Re: Istanbul new airport - latest pictures and discussion thread

Fri Oct 26, 2018 3:54 pm

Media walkthrough of new terminal. Lots of photos.

First Look Inside Istanbul New Airport, Soon to Be the World’s Largest
https://thepointsguy.com/news/first-loo ... w-airport/

=
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A388
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Re: Istanbul new airport - latest pictures and discussion thread

Fri Oct 26, 2018 7:04 pm

Very nice!!!! Good luck to them with this beautiful airport :D

A388
 
Galwayman
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Re: Istanbul new airport - latest pictures and discussion thread

Fri Oct 26, 2018 7:11 pm

Looks fantastic , well done Istanbul
 
Cathay777300ER
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Re: Istanbul new airport - latest pictures and discussion thread

Mon Oct 29, 2018 4:19 pm

I've been trying to find more information about flights moving as the grand opening is today. What I've roughly found is a few flights would move but besides wikipedia I can't find which. On Wikipedia it says some flights (Ankara, Antalya, Baku, Ercan, İzmir) will move tomorrow but not all. Can someone help me clarify if the Turkish and other airline move?
 
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mercure1
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Re: Istanbul new airport - latest pictures and discussion thread

Mon Oct 29, 2018 4:27 pm

Yes TK will operate services to 5 destinations from the new airport to start with. For specific flight schedules simply look at www.turkishairlines.com The airports temporary code is ISL.
mercure f-wtcc
 
Cathay777300ER
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Re: Istanbul new airport - latest pictures and discussion thread

Mon Oct 29, 2018 4:45 pm

So It looks like
Istanbul New-Ankara starts October 31 daily First day 77W then 738
Istanbul New-Ercan starts October 31 daily 738 (Theres an issue on the website with timezones as it shows the flight from Istanbul as 35 mins compared to 2:50 back)
Istanbul New-Izmir starts November 1 daily 738
Istanbul New-Antalya starts November 1 daily 738
Istanbul New-Baku starts November 8 daily 738
 
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DominikR83
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Re: Istanbul new airport - latest pictures and discussion thread

Mon Oct 29, 2018 7:13 pm

UPlog wrote:
I really find it fascinating how so many foreign nations are able to deliver great infrastructure projects in a short time, while it can take us a decade to simply renovate a few terminals.



Well,Turkey is an autocratic country(almost a dictatorship).If Mr. Erdogan wants to build a new airport this airport will be build.There are no independent courts or any other really poweful organizations who are able to stop such projects.And even if any courts clearly defines such projects as illegal it doesn`t bother the government.It just continues.
And so without any noteworthy resistance the construction and planning period is noticeably shorter than in any democratic country with wirking court system.

Clipper101 wrote:
- Germany: it did happen with the construction of the 4th runway in FRA.

Well,from the official start of planning until the opening of the runway it took also almost 10 years. ;)
So not really faster.
 
PlymSpotter
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Re: Istanbul new airport - latest pictures and discussion thread

Mon Oct 29, 2018 11:11 pm

Cathay777300ER wrote:
So It looks like
Istanbul New-Ankara starts October 31 daily First day 77W then 738
Istanbul New-Ercan starts October 31 daily 738 (Theres an issue on the website with timezones as it shows the flight from Istanbul as 35 mins compared to 2:50 back)
Istanbul New-Izmir starts November 1 daily 738
Istanbul New-Antalya starts November 1 daily 738
Istanbul New-Baku starts November 8 daily 738


Baku is weekly perhaps? 8 daily seems somewhat impressive!
...love is just a camouflage for what resembles rage again...
 
xjetflyer2001
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Re: Istanbul new airport - latest pictures and discussion thread

Mon Oct 29, 2018 11:42 pm

What is the timeline for all airlines to move over to the new airport? I looked at wikipedia, I know I know, and I only see that all TK flights will be moving on Dec 31st 2018, what about the other airlines? will they move at the same date, have some already moved, or will they move at a later date?

I'm curious because if the old airport stays open into next year sometime I may be able to plan a trip and would love to get into that observation area in the mall that is across the street from rwys 35L and 35R approach ends with all of the TK traffic weeded out.
 
Cathay777300ER
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Re: Istanbul new airport - latest pictures and discussion thread

Mon Oct 29, 2018 11:53 pm

PlymSpotter wrote:
Cathay777300ER wrote:
So It looks like
Istanbul New-Ankara starts October 31 daily First day 77W then 738
Istanbul New-Ercan starts October 31 daily 738 (Theres an issue on the website with timezones as it shows the flight from Istanbul as 35 mins compared to 2:50 back)
Istanbul New-Izmir starts November 1 daily 738
Istanbul New-Antalya starts November 1 daily 738
Istanbul New-Baku starts November 8 daily 738


Baku is weekly perhaps? 8 daily seems somewhat impressive!


Sorry the dates seem to be confusing. All services seem to just be daily for the next few weeks.
 
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TK787
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Re: Istanbul new airport - latest pictures and discussion thread

Tue Oct 30, 2018 12:51 am

xjetflyer2001 wrote:
What is the timeline for all airlines to move over to the new airport? I looked at wikipedia, I know I know, and I only see that all TK flights will be moving on Dec 31st 2018, what about the other airlines? will they move at the same date, have some already moved, or will they move at a later date?

I'm curious because if the old airport stays open into next year sometime I may be able to plan a trip and would love to get into that observation area in the mall that is across the street from rwys 35L and 35R approach ends with all of the TK traffic weeded out.

Last flight from ISTANBUL ATATURK for international airlines: Midnight Dec 29
Last flight from ISTANBUL ATATURK for TK............................: Midnight Dec 30
NO flights to EITHER ISTANBUL airport...................................: Midnight Dec 30-11am Dec 31
First Flight to ISTANBUL NEW AIRPORT by only TK.................: 11am-4pm Dec 31
Flights to ISTANBUL NEW AIRPORT by TK, Onur and Atlas.....: 4pm-9pm Dec 31
Flights to ISTANBUL NEW AIRPORT by all airlines...................: 9pm onward Dec31
 
xjetflyer2001
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Re: Istanbul new airport - latest pictures and discussion thread

Tue Oct 30, 2018 3:26 am

TK787 wrote:
xjetflyer2001 wrote:
What is the timeline for all airlines to move over to the new airport? I looked at wikipedia, I know I know, and I only see that all TK flights will be moving on Dec 31st 2018, what about the other airlines? will they move at the same date, have some already moved, or will they move at a later date?

I'm curious because if the old airport stays open into next year sometime I may be able to plan a trip and would love to get into that observation area in the mall that is across the street from rwys 35L and 35R approach ends with all of the TK traffic weeded out.

Last flight from ISTANBUL ATATURK for international airlines: Midnight Dec 29
Last flight from ISTANBUL ATATURK for TK............................: Midnight Dec 30
NO flights to EITHER ISTANBUL airport...................................: Midnight Dec 30-11am Dec 31
First Flight to ISTANBUL NEW AIRPORT by only TK.................: 11am-4pm Dec 31
Flights to ISTANBUL NEW AIRPORT by TK, Onur and Atlas.....: 4pm-9pm Dec 31
Flights to ISTANBUL NEW AIRPORT by all airlines...................: 9pm onward Dec31


Thank You for the break down, to bad, sounds like the old airport will be completely flightless by the time I would be able to make it out that way
 
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ro1960
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New Istanbul Airport: "Disturbing secrets" revealed

Tue Oct 30, 2018 7:27 am

I didn't see this topic discussed in the Istanbul new airport thread or anywhere else on a.net. On the day after IGA was "opened" by Turkey's President Erdogan, "disturbing secrets" are revealed by various news sites like this one:
https://www.news.com.au/travel/travel-updates/disturbing-secrets-behind-what-will-be-the-worlds-biggest-airport/news-story/7ce4c19f00fbf0d1fca7cd5772d4357e

    "As many as 400 deaths on site, working conditions likened those in a “concentration camp”
    "37 worker deaths at the site and said more than 100 dead workers remained unidentified"
    "he pressure to finish the project as “relentless” and said long working hours had lead to “carelessness, accidents and deaths”.
    "fatalities were being covered up, with dead workers’ families being paid hush money"
    "As well as poor safety conditions, workers have been struggling with bedbugs in accommodation, overcrowded sleeping quarters, substandard food and inadequate transport to the site, and long delays in wages"
    "In September, a bus carrying workers crashed, injuring 17. It prompted mass strikes over poor working conditions. About 400 striking workers were rounded up with 24 formally jailed pending trial"
    "some 2.5 million trees will have been destroyed by the end of the megaproject"
    "Animal experts also warned the airport sat on a vital bird migration route"
    "financial observers said foreign lending has financed much of Turkey’s construction boom, leaving the private sector with a massive $280 billion debt"

I don't how much of this is true but it is indeed disturbing if even half of it is confirmed.

Anyone has insights on these claims?
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ugurberkin
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Re: Istanbul new airport - latest pictures and discussion thread

Tue Oct 30, 2018 7:39 am

Istanbul Ataturk Airport will remain open for Cargo operations and business jets for a while.

On the other hand name of the new airport is also announced by the President.

Istanbul International Airport. No specific name is assigned.

Small portion of Ataturk Airport will be kept for business jets so the name can't be transferred.
 
THY748i
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Re: Istanbul new airport - latest pictures and discussion thread

Tue Oct 30, 2018 8:18 am

xjetflyer2001 wrote:
What is the timeline for all airlines to move over to the new airport? I looked at wikipedia, I know I know, and I only see that all TK flights will be moving on Dec 31st 2018, what about the other airlines? will they move at the same date, have some already moved, or will they move at a later date?

I'm curious because if the old airport stays open into next year sometime I may be able to plan a trip and would love to get into that observation area in the mall that is across the street from rwys 35L and 35R approach ends with all of the TK traffic weeded out.


Cargo flights won‘t move until the end of 2019 though, so it won‘t be completely flightless. You won‘t see the chaos that is IST now but on a positive note you won‘t be disturbed by the ordinarity of all the A32x and 737s :D.
 
mxaxai
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Re: New Istanbul Airport: "Disturbing secrets" revealed

Tue Oct 30, 2018 8:47 am

The majority of these claims are true, some even confirmed by official sources. Only the number of fatalities is probably lower than 400. 27 were confirmed and that seems more realistic. I also can't comment on debt but Turkey has had some financial troubles lately.
 
PanHAM
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Re: New Istanbul Airport: "Disturbing secrets" revealed

Tue Oct 30, 2018 9:48 am

I know there is another thread but this is more specific about how not to build an Airport.. The number of 400 fatalities may be exaggerated but most of the other items are correct.

When BER is an example of how not to build an Airport. But looking at it from the opposit side., the new Istanbul Airport certainly is a much worse example of how not to do it.

Berlin is the laughing stock of the world and the rest of Germany Shares that. However in Istanbul, the laughter gets stuck in once's throat. I'm not supersticious but that place has a bad Karma.
Was Erlauben Erdogan!!!
 
Kikko19
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Re: New Istanbul Airport: "Disturbing secrets" revealed

Tue Oct 30, 2018 9:54 am

PanHAM wrote:
I know there is another thread but this is more specific about how not to build an Airport.. The number of 400 fatalities may be exaggerated but most of the other items are correct.

When BER is an example of how not to build an Airport. But looking at it from the opposit side., the new Istanbul Airport certainly is a much worse example of how not to do it.

Berlin is the laughing stock of the world and the rest of Germany Shares that. However in Istanbul, the laughter gets stuck in once's throat. I'm not supersticious but that place has a bad Karma.

Sure there are slavery issues everywhere down there. Like Qatar, UAE and others in that area have different habits than the west I would also see figures of China construction industry... But hey! The capitalism has his victims.
 
lightmac
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Re: New Istanbul Airport: "Disturbing secrets" revealed

Tue Oct 30, 2018 10:05 am

Actually, I have no intention to soften this critique, but for ANY big project in the world, usually workers die in the process. The insurance companies actually have an average number of fataitis/10.000 m3 of building built. Sad but true.
 
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ro1960
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Re: New Istanbul Airport: "Disturbing secrets" revealed

Tue Oct 30, 2018 10:14 am

So does this means that corners have been cut to meet the deadline and that safe operations are compromised at the airport? Unlike at BER, if - for example - the smoke extraction system were faulty, would it be covered up?
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PanHAM
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Re: New Istanbul Airport: "Disturbing secrets" revealed

Tue Oct 30, 2018 10:14 am

The fact that others are worse is no excuse. Turkey wants to be a member state of the EU. If they are serious about that they have to accept European Standards and not those of Qatae. Sure, accidents can happen everywhere, that's why great care is taken to avoid accidents. Visiting a construction site like the T3 at FRA requires hard hat and steel plated shoes as well as a warning vest. Without you have to staqy in the bus.
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conaly
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Re: Istanbul new airport - latest pictures and discussion thread

Tue Oct 30, 2018 10:50 am

How many runways does the airport currently have? I've read several times, that either three or four are in operation, but it seems, that two of them are just taxiways, which have been temporarily reworked to function as runways. Can somebody give a clear information, maybe with some plans or pictures, what the runway situation currently looks like. I am a little bit confused.
Airports 2019: ADB, ALG, AMD, ATL, BOG, BOS, CDG, CTS, DEL, DTW, DUS, EWR, FRA, FUK, HAM, HFT, HIJ, HND, HVG, IST, ITM, JFK, MUC, NGO, NUE, OKA, PHL, SIN, STN, TOS, YYZ, ZRH
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peterinlisbon
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Re: New Istanbul Airport: "Disturbing secrets" revealed

Tue Oct 30, 2018 11:09 am

I have heard that a lot of people were killed and nobody really knows how many. Officially the number is 27 but others say it's a lot more. In Turkey it's hard to get the truth. There was some big protest against the conditions just before it opened that was put down harshly with over a hundred workers arrested. Also, the airport opened officially but it is not really ready. It is still being finished. They are forcing Turkish Airlines to move it's whole operation across before the end of the year, on 31st December. I'm sure that date was chosen for political reasons because they don't want to admit that the project was delayed. Fortunately TK will now have the chance until then to operate a limited number of flights to get its staff trained and used to the new airport, but I still think there is the potential for huge disruption when they do make the move in one day. I can't imagine how you can suddenly have hundreds of aircraft landing in one day at an airport that has hardly been used before and everything will go smoothly.
 
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TK787
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Re: Istanbul new airport - latest pictures and discussion thread

Tue Oct 30, 2018 11:20 am

conaly wrote:
How many runways does the airport currently have? I've read several times, that either three or four are in operation, but it seems, that two of them are just taxiways, which have been temporarily reworked to function as runways. Can somebody give a clear information, maybe with some plans or pictures, what the runway situation currently looks like. I am a little bit confused.

You are correct, two runways in operation right now. Two taxiways right next to them as backups. 3rd runway is more like a year away.
 
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TK787
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Re: Istanbul new airport - latest pictures and discussion thread

Tue Oct 30, 2018 11:22 am

xjetflyer2001 wrote:
What is the timeline for all airlines to move over to the new airport? I looked at wikipedia, I know I know, and I only see that all TK flights will be moving on Dec 31st 2018, what about the other airlines? will they move at the same date, have some already moved, or will they move at a later date?

I'm curious because if the old airport stays open into next year sometime I may be able to plan a trip and would love to get into that observation area in the mall that is across the street from rwys 35L and 35R approach ends with all of the TK traffic weeded out.


Here is the old chart, just move the calendar two months forward:
http://www.wwacg.org/up/files/LT_Circ_2018_A_06_en.pdf
 
PanHAM
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Re: New Istanbul Airport: "Disturbing secrets" revealed

Tue Oct 30, 2018 11:40 am

By the order of....the move will/must function smoothly. What a question. The rest of the world celebrates the New Year, any hick-ups won't be noted that much.
Was Erlauben Erdogan!!!
 
716131
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Re: New Istanbul Airport: "Disturbing secrets" revealed

Tue Oct 30, 2018 11:58 am

I think if you want to add this information, continue this thread here!
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1379061
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TK105
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Re: New Istanbul Airport: "Disturbing secrets" revealed

Tue Oct 30, 2018 12:08 pm

Overall number of workers killed due to accidents at New Istanbul Airport is 35 (confirmed by both employer and Construction Workers Union):
http://www.sozcu.com.tr/2018/gundem/3-h ... e-2628604/ (in Turkish, published by opposition newspaper)

As a comparison, at BER there are total of 4 fatalities (as of 2012):
https://www.morgenpost.de/flughafen-BER ... orben.html (in German)

Considering that maximum 6000 workers employed at BER and 35000 workers employed at New Istanbul Airport at peak times, there are 0.67 fatalities at BER and 1 fatalities at New Istanbul Airport per 1000 workers.

As a second factor, you should also consider construction times. For BER it is 14 years (if they manage to open it in 2020) and for New Istanbul Airport it is 3.5 years.
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TK787
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Re: Istanbul new airport - latest pictures and discussion thread

Tue Oct 30, 2018 12:14 pm

TK787 wrote:
xjetflyer2001 wrote:
What is the timeline for all airlines to move over to the new airport? I looked at wikipedia, I know I know, and I only see that all TK flights will be moving on Dec 31st 2018, what about the other airlines? will they move at the same date, have some already moved, or will they move at a later date?

I'm curious because if the old airport stays open into next year sometime I may be able to plan a trip and would love to get into that observation area in the mall that is across the street from rwys 35L and 35R approach ends with all of the TK traffic weeded out.


Here is the old chart, just move the calendar two months forward:
http://www.wwacg.org/up/files/LT_Circ_2018_A_06_en.pdf

Sorry about the duplicate post, I just found the latest chart here:
https://ops.group/wp-content/uploads/2018/10/LTFM.pdf
 
MWAAdude
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Re: Istanbul new airport - latest pictures and discussion thread

Tue Oct 30, 2018 12:30 pm

leftyboarder wrote:
While I agree that environmental protection laws are slightly less enforced in Turkey (in writing they are in fact pretty harsh and there was a time many projects were stalled because of them), it is an illusion that infrastructure development takes place slower in the West due to environmental laws. It is NIMBYs that slow projects down in the West, not environmental protection agencies.


You are taking too narrow an interpretation of "Environmental Protection Laws." In the US, these laws not only provide NIMBYs with many avenues with which to challenge or appeal decisions the government has made, but they also explicitly protect certain populations of people, particularly Title VI populations. All of this is referred to as "Environmental Impact" regardless of if it has to do with the cutting of trees or impacts to some obscure species of micro-shrimp. Take a look at an EIS or EIR or EA for a large infrastructure project and you'll see that the engineering consultants who wrote the report are required to evaluate the number of jobs the project creates, the impact on the local economy, the impact on the local micro-shrimp populations, GHGs, etc. Environmental Impact, and the entire process that is required, even with no NIMBY pushback, can add years to the preliminary engineering process, especially on projects with interagency review, where every stakeholder agency has something to opine about.
 
Lufthansa
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Re: Istanbul new airport - latest pictures and discussion thread

Tue Oct 30, 2018 12:38 pm

I'm really curious to see what the new TK international lounge is going to look like? The current one is an absolute masterpiece and one of the best... if not THE BEST in the world. And there's some good ones out there, in all kinds of styles but the Turkish Elite got this one right. (Not to take away from other top ones like AY in HEL, BA in LHR, VS in LHR, QF in LAX and SYD, EK's almost city of a lounge in DXB, Cathay's got several in HKG etc) But this one was easily the best. I haven't tried AA's new offerings, I hear they're good at JFK. So fingers crossed... they do something similar or come up with something even better. This is suppose to be a symbol of National Pride and attract the world to use this airport so I wouldn't be surprised if its got a WOW factor.
 
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Revelation
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Re: Istanbul new airport - latest pictures and discussion thread

Tue Oct 30, 2018 12:52 pm

MWAAdude wrote:
leftyboarder wrote:
While I agree that environmental protection laws are slightly less enforced in Turkey (in writing they are in fact pretty harsh and there was a time many projects were stalled because of them), it is an illusion that infrastructure development takes place slower in the West due to environmental laws. It is NIMBYs that slow projects down in the West, not environmental protection agencies.

You are taking too narrow an interpretation of "Environmental Protection Laws." In the US, these laws not only provide NIMBYs with many avenues with which to challenge or appeal decisions the government has made, but they also explicitly protect certain populations of people, particularly Title VI populations. All of this is referred to as "Environmental Impact" regardless of if it has to do with the cutting of trees or impacts to some obscure species of micro-shrimp. Take a look at an EIS or EIR or EA for a large infrastructure project and you'll see that the engineering consultants who wrote the report are required to evaluate the number of jobs the project creates, the impact on the local economy, the impact on the local micro-shrimp populations, GHGs, etc. Environmental Impact, and the entire process that is required, even with no NIMBY pushback, can add years to the preliminary engineering process, especially on projects with interagency review, where every stakeholder agency has something to opine about.

As a child of the 60s I grew up a block away from what is now a Superfund site that was cleaned up by the EPA that so many people bitch about.

The corporation that made the mess just washed their hands of it.

I'd suggest that EPA and environmental laws have saved a lot more lives than most people can comprehend.

Guess who gets called in to figure out what kind of nasty stuff was in the pools of liquids at the basement of the Twin Towers after 9/11?

I'm glad we do Environmental Impact studies of major projects rather than mindlessly pave over the last micro-shrimp habitat on our way to creating more Superfund sites.

I realize there is a lot of bureaucratic overhead, but that's the thing to focus on, rather than the existence of the Environmental Impact Study and the EPA itself.

The problem is you can't really show you're not paving over the home of the micro-shrimp without doing the required studies.
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ro1960
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Re: Istanbul new airport - latest pictures and discussion thread

Tue Oct 30, 2018 1:00 pm

I started another thread about the "disturbing secrets" revealed in the press yesterday (work conditions, strike, fatalities, etc.):

New Istanbul Airport: "Disturbing secrets" revealed
You may like my airport photos:
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ro1960
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Re: New Istanbul Airport: "Disturbing secrets" revealed

Tue Oct 30, 2018 1:01 pm

SQ789 wrote:
I think if you want to add this information, continue this thread here!
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1379061


Thanks, I put a link there to this thread.
You may like my airport photos:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/aeroports
 
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enilria
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Re: New Istanbul Airport: "Disturbing secrets" revealed

Tue Oct 30, 2018 1:03 pm

ro1960 wrote:
As many as 400 deaths on site, working conditions likened those in a “concentration camp”
"37 worker deaths at the site and said more than 100 dead workers remained unidentified

Don't these conflict?
 
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truckofpigeons
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Re: Istanbul new airport - latest pictures and discussion thread

Tue Oct 30, 2018 1:07 pm

Lufthansa wrote:
I'm really curious to see what the new TK international lounge is going to look like? The current one is an absolute masterpiece and one of the best... if not THE BEST in the world. And there's some good ones out there, in all kinds of styles but the Turkish Elite got this one right. (Not to take away from other top ones like AY in HEL, BA in LHR, VS in LHR, QF in LAX and SYD, EK's almost city of a lounge in DXB, Cathay's got several in HKG etc) But this one was easily the best. I haven't tried AA's new offerings, I hear they're good at JFK. So fingers crossed... they do something similar or come up with something even better. This is suppose to be a symbol of National Pride and attract the world to use this airport so I wouldn't be surprised if its got a WOW factor.


I've only been able to fly business once (when United airmiles counted for something) and that's the one lounge I went to. I heard its reputation soon after and realised it had probably spoilt me for most others!

I'm really looking forward to the new airport opening. I've been avoiding IST-Ataturk for a while because of the crowding (on the ramp as well as for passengers! https://www.airliners.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1407215) but MUC-ESB just switched from LH to XQ and you can no longer book LHR-MUC-ESB through flights with LH. So I'm glad an alternative is rapidly approaching.

(edit to add link)
Last edited by truckofpigeons on Tue Oct 30, 2018 1:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
xjetflyer2001
Posts: 287
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Re: Istanbul new airport - latest pictures and discussion thread

Tue Oct 30, 2018 1:10 pm

THY748i wrote:
xjetflyer2001 wrote:
What is the timeline for all airlines to move over to the new airport? I looked at wikipedia, I know I know, and I only see that all TK flights will be moving on Dec 31st 2018, what about the other airlines? will they move at the same date, have some already moved, or will they move at a later date?

I'm curious because if the old airport stays open into next year sometime I may be able to plan a trip and would love to get into that observation area in the mall that is across the street from rwys 35L and 35R approach ends with all of the TK traffic weeded out.


Cargo flights won‘t move until the end of 2019 though, so it won‘t be completely flightless. You won‘t see the chaos that is IST now but on a positive note you won‘t be disturbed by the ordinarity of all the A32x and 737s :D.


That is very true, a trip still may be worth it just for cargo flights
 
xjetflyer2001
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Re: Istanbul new airport - latest pictures and discussion thread

Tue Oct 30, 2018 1:11 pm

TK787 wrote:
TK787 wrote:
xjetflyer2001 wrote:
What is the timeline for all airlines to move over to the new airport? I looked at wikipedia, I know I know, and I only see that all TK flights will be moving on Dec 31st 2018, what about the other airlines? will they move at the same date, have some already moved, or will they move at a later date?

I'm curious because if the old airport stays open into next year sometime I may be able to plan a trip and would love to get into that observation area in the mall that is across the street from rwys 35L and 35R approach ends with all of the TK traffic weeded out.


Here is the old chart, just move the calendar two months forward:
http://www.wwacg.org/up/files/LT_Circ_2018_A_06_en.pdf

Sorry about the duplicate post, I just found the latest chart here:
https://ops.group/wp-content/uploads/2018/10/LTFM.pdf


Great, thanks for the chart, that helps tons
 
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william
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Re: New Istanbul Airport: "Disturbing secrets" revealed

Tue Oct 30, 2018 1:20 pm

TK105 wrote:
Overall number of workers killed due to accidents at New Istanbul Airport is 35 (confirmed by both employer and Construction Workers Union):
http://www.sozcu.com.tr/2018/gundem/3-h ... e-2628604/ (in Turkish, published by opposition newspaper)

As a comparison, at BER there are total of 4 fatalities (as of 2012):
https://www.morgenpost.de/flughafen-BER ... orben.html (in German)

Considering that maximum 6000 workers employed at BER and 35000 workers employed at New Istanbul Airport at peak times, there are 0.67 fatalities at BER and 1 fatalities at New Istanbul Airport per 1000 workers.

As a second factor, you should also consider construction times. For BER it is 14 years (if they manage to open it in 2020) and for New Istanbul Airport it is 3.5 years.


Interesting.
 
PlymSpotter
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Re: New Istanbul Airport: "Disturbing secrets" revealed

Tue Oct 30, 2018 1:23 pm

When it comes to the trees, initially the 2.5 million figure was split into 650,000 felled and 1.85 million moved. I really don't believe they moved that many trees, it's also better to assess this based on area not individual trees.

However I'm less worried about the trees than I am the soil. You can regrow a forest in 20-100 years, depending on the species, but it takes hundreds to thousands of years to recreate the soil needed for these forests to grow and for the biodiversity to establish itself.
...love is just a camouflage for what resembles rage again...
 
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ro1960
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Re: New Istanbul Airport: "Disturbing secrets" revealed

Tue Oct 30, 2018 1:40 pm

enilria wrote:
ro1960 wrote:
As many as 400 deaths on site, working conditions likened those in a “concentration camp”
"37 worker deaths at the site and said more than 100 dead workers remained unidentified

Don't these conflict?


There are quotes from the article. It makes sense when you read it.
You may like my airport photos:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/aeroports
 
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PerfectGriffin
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Re: New Istanbul Airport: "Disturbing secrets" revealed

Tue Oct 30, 2018 1:41 pm

The New Istanbul airport is huge and was built so fast which I personally think is an incredible accomplishment. Megaprojects of this scale always have their critics and almost always result in fatalities.
 
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PerfectGriffin
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Re: Istanbul new airport - latest pictures and discussion thread

Tue Oct 30, 2018 1:46 pm

Must be complicated for an airline with a sizable amount of connecting traffic to move flights slowly to the new airport.
 
aldrigsomandre
Posts: 346
Joined: Mon Nov 23, 2015 2:30 am

Re: Istanbul new airport - latest pictures and discussion thread

Tue Oct 30, 2018 1:54 pm

PerfectGriffin wrote:
Must be complicated for an airline with a sizable amount of connecting traffic to move flights slowly to the new airport.


Currently, the routes that are flown from the new airport are in addition to the flights from IST.

So there's no connecting traffic right now.
 
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DominikR83
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Re: New Istanbul Airport: "Disturbing secrets" revealed

Tue Oct 30, 2018 2:28 pm

The short construction period was only possible because the government just ignored all concerns regarding environmental damages,eplyee safety and anything else.
In modern,democratic countries all these concerns would have been checked and discussed and either the airport would never have been built or it would have taken twice or three times the time.
 
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mafaky
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Re: Istanbul new airport - latest pictures and discussion thread

Tue Oct 30, 2018 3:32 pm

Istanbul New-Ercan starts October 31 daily 738 (Theres an issue on the website with timezones as it shows the flight from Istanbul as 35 mins compared to 2:50 back)


Turkey didn't switchback from the "summertime, this year again. So entire Turkey will be using GMT+3 during this winter period while entire Cyprus (including Northern Cyprus Turkish Republic, hence the airport Ercan) has switched back to GMT+2.
A veteran Electronics & Communications Engineer from Istanbul-Turkey, highly interested in civil and military aviation.
 
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PatrickZ80
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Re: New Istanbul Airport: "Disturbing secrets" revealed

Tue Oct 30, 2018 5:35 pm

PerfectGriffin wrote:
The New Istanbul airport is huge and was built so fast which I personally think is an incredible accomplishment. Megaprojects of this scale always have their critics and almost always result in fatalities.


If you think of that as an incredible accomplishment, think again. As others have said, this was only possible due to un-human working conditions. They knew that up-front and deliberately choose for it. That's not something to be proud of, that's something to be ashamed of.

You can say megaprojects almost always result in fatalities. Sure, accidents do happen but you can do everything possible to prevent them. You can minimize any risk to reduce the chance of accidents. If that costs time or money, then so be it. Better safe than sorry. However in case of this airport, nothing was done to prevent accidents. They just let them happen and accept them. That's the cultural difference between Turkey and the western world, where humanity is more important than money. Descent working conditions, descent wages, a good safety culture, that's what's important and that's what Turkey lacks of.
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