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dazeflight
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Re: BER News and Discussion Thread

Mon Oct 26, 2020 2:48 pm

Antarius wrote:
Stairs with luggage isn't convenient.


Smart people use the elevators. In all seriousness: could you maybe try to at least follow the basic discussion or are you just trying to troll?
 
Noshow
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Re: BER News and Discussion Thread

Mon Oct 26, 2020 2:51 pm

Bit unfriendly, aren't we?
 
Antarius
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Re: BER News and Discussion Thread

Mon Oct 26, 2020 2:56 pm

dazeflight wrote:
Antarius wrote:
Stairs with luggage isn't convenient.


Smart people use the elevators. In all seriousness: could you maybe try to at least follow the basic discussion or are you just trying to troll?


You asked an obvious question, I gave an obvious answer.

Exactly how is this a wise design decision? Maybe try to follow the point and don't be salty.
2020: SFO DFW IAH HOU CLT MEX BIS MIA GUA ORD DTW LGA BOS LHR DUB BFS BHD STN OAK PHL ISP JFK SJC DEN SJU LAS TXL GDL
 
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Phosphorus
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Re: BER News and Discussion Thread

Mon Oct 26, 2020 2:59 pm

dazeflight wrote:
Quick logic question: how is this an issue:

cirrusdragoon wrote:
Travelers at BER must carry their suitcases down the stairs to the platform themselves.


if this is possible:

cirrusdragoon wrote:
or wait for one of the three elevators per platform


- especially considering heavy suitcases and the like are anyway not allowed on escalators? In other words: how is this relevant at all outside of the circles of TXL-objectophiles who seek any straw they can find to make BER worse than it is? On the positive side though: if this is what's left of BER-criticism (and it seems to be case in respect to german social media of the past days), BER doesn't seem to be bad at all.


A "not-a-fan-of-TXL" (never had a pleasant experience with them. But then, when I first flew to that airport -- around 2010 or so -- it was already slated for closure. So no surprise there) here.
In this day and age, having an underground railway station at a busy place -- like this airport is expected to be, and not designing some escalators both ways, is an oversight, plain and simple.
Look at the demand for escalators, both upwards and downwards, at a place like FRA airport Regionalbahnhof or Fernbahnhof. Then perform a mental exercise of confining all folks, going downwards, to stairs or queue to the elevator. These are often tired people with luggage, after a flight, maybe long flight, and they have a train to catch.
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dazeflight
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Re: BER News and Discussion Thread

Mon Oct 26, 2020 3:14 pm

^ These tired people with lots of heavy luggage who need a train to catch are not allowed to use the excalators anyway as you can see here. Regarding your example: people are lazy, it's that simple. The question is if the lazyness equals a need. BER is not the US where you use an escalator to enter the fitness club.
Last edited by dazeflight on Mon Oct 26, 2020 3:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
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atcsundevil
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Re: BER News and Discussion Thread - 2020

Mon Oct 26, 2020 3:18 pm

Just a notice to users: I added "2020" to the title of this thread so that it's a reminder to us to refresh the thread at the end of this year. This thread has been running for quite a long time now, and given the fundamental changes occurring at BER, I'd say it's time for a fresh start. This thread will remain open until 31 Dec, and will then be replaced with a new thread.

✈️ atcsundevil
 
Antarius
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Re: BER News and Discussion Thread

Mon Oct 26, 2020 4:10 pm

dazeflight wrote:
^ These tired people with lots of heavy luggage who need a train to catch are not allowed to use the excalators anyway as you can see here. Regarding your example: people are lazy, it's that simple. The question is if the lazyness equals a need. BER is not the US where you use an escalator to enter the fitness club.


I didn't realize AMS and FRA were in the US.

Seems someone worked on the BER project and is mighty touchy about feedback from regular travelers.
2020: SFO DFW IAH HOU CLT MEX BIS MIA GUA ORD DTW LGA BOS LHR DUB BFS BHD STN OAK PHL ISP JFK SJC DEN SJU LAS TXL GDL
 
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ClassicLover
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Re: BER News and Discussion Thread - 2020

Mon Oct 26, 2020 5:36 pm

Any ideas what happened to the space where airBerlin's lounge had been built?

This article shows some "pictures" (though they look CG to me) - https://morepremium.com/the-new-airport-lounge-that-no-one-will-ever-visit/

Has the space been used for one of the other lounges that is opening there, Lounge Tegel and Lounge Tempelhof? Or is it just an empty room, still furnished for airBerlin or what at the moment?

Quite curious about this, so if anyone has any info, that would be great to hear.
I do enjoy a spot of flying, especially when it's not in economy!
 
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SQ22
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Re: BER News and Discussion Thread - 2020

Mon Oct 26, 2020 6:15 pm

May I kindly ask you to discuss the topic and not to attack each other? Thanks.
 
AMP44
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Re: BER News and Discussion Thread - 2020

Mon Oct 26, 2020 6:17 pm

ClassicLover wrote:
Any ideas what happened to the space where airBerlin's lounge had been built?

This article shows some "pictures" (though they look CG to me) - https://morepremium.com/the-new-airport-lounge-that-no-one-will-ever-visit/

Has the space been used for one of the other lounges that is opening there, Lounge Tegel and Lounge Tempelhof? Or is it just an empty room, still furnished for airBerlin or what at the moment?

Quite curious about this, so if anyone has any info, that would be great to hear.


AB's lounge was constructed in the South Pier. Looking at the BER map, Lounge Tempelhof is in the South Pier, so I am sure they took over the AB Lounge space. The LH Lounge is right next to the Lounge Tegel in the North Pier.

https://ber.berlin-airport.de/content/dam/restartweb/no-language/dokumente/20200825_BER%20T1%20T2%20Terminalplan%20A4-EN.pdf
 
Antarius
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Re: BER News and Discussion Thread

Mon Oct 26, 2020 7:32 pm

YYZLGA wrote:
LTU932 wrote:
YYZLGA wrote:
BER is intended to have a regional express service that will make limited stops from Hauptbahnhof (only Gesundbrunnen and Ostkreuz) and will take 29 minutes. There'll also be some other RB services making limited stops from the major Stadtbahn stations like Alexanderplatz, Friedrichstrasse, and Zoo. In a few years, hopefully, the new route via Sudkreuz will open following some track work, and that will take only 20 minutes from Hauptbahnhof.
How long more or less will it take to connect via S-Bahn to the Stadtbahn or Ringbahn? 30 minutes? 40 minutes? Just curious. The S1 from HAM takes about 20 minutes to connect to Hamburg-Hauptbahnhof, and arrivals are made in such a way that you can directly connect to the Verbindungsbahn (aka Dammtor-Linie) via line S31. If you wanna bypass Hamburg-Altona, you'd have to wait a few minutes until the S21 arrives, which itself directly connects to the S3.


To the Ringbahn, I'd imagine the S-Bahn would take around 25 minutes like it does from SXF today. To the Stadtbahn it would probably take more like 45, but I would assume everyone would just take the RB stopping at Ostkreuz and Ostbahnhof. Probably more like 15 minutes to Ostkreuz.

Berliners were spoiled with the proximity of TXL (at least by car), but BER will be very well connected by rail by the standards of most airports.


TXL was definitely very convenient by car. Even otherwise, while not the most seamless, taking the bus to Zoologischer Garten wasn't that bad.

I'm excited by BER's upcoming rail connectivity. Although for my family, getting to it from Zehlendorf isn't going to be fun.

The most exciting part for me is collecting a new airport code :)
2020: SFO DFW IAH HOU CLT MEX BIS MIA GUA ORD DTW LGA BOS LHR DUB BFS BHD STN OAK PHL ISP JFK SJC DEN SJU LAS TXL GDL
 
wr911
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Re: BER News and Discussion Thread - 2020

Mon Oct 26, 2020 9:42 pm

I liked TXL, close to the city and the way each security gate was right there, zero walking. I guess it belongs to a different time.
 
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Phosphorus
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Re: BER News and Discussion Thread - 2020

Mon Oct 26, 2020 9:49 pm

wr911 wrote:
I liked TXL, close to the city and the way each security gate was right there, zero walking. I guess it belongs to a different time.

Yup. It was not designed for a line of people snaking all over the place to get to security check, or check-in, or whatever. With AirBerlin and easyJet both running massive operations there, and all others there as well, the crowds seemed a bit surreal for such a compact place.
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Kent350787
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Re: BER News and Discussion Thread - 2020

Mon Oct 26, 2020 10:26 pm

So is it actually opening?

I've watched a couple of virtual tours, and some of the spaces in the new terminal seem surprisingly compact. But I'm looking forward to visiting - the big red box was in Potsdamer Platz last time I was in Berlin :)

My son's host family lives in Lichtenrade - quite good for BER, less good for Zentrum
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Airdolomiti
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Re: BER News and Discussion Thread - 2020

Mon Oct 26, 2020 10:28 pm

AMP44 wrote:
ClassicLover wrote:
Any ideas what happened to the space where airBerlin's lounge had been built?

This article shows some "pictures" (though they look CG to me) - https://morepremium.com/the-new-airport-lounge-that-no-one-will-ever-visit/

Has the space been used for one of the other lounges that is opening there, Lounge Tegel and Lounge Tempelhof? Or is it just an empty room, still furnished for airBerlin or what at the moment?

Quite curious about this, so if anyone has any info, that would be great to hear.


AB's lounge was constructed in the South Pier. Looking at the BER map, Lounge Tempelhof is in the South Pier, so I am sure they took over the AB Lounge space. The LH Lounge is right next to the Lounge Tegel in the North Pier.

https://ber.berlin-airport.de/content/dam/restartweb/no-language/dokumente/20200825_BER%20T1%20T2%20Terminalplan%20A4-EN.pdf


That is correct, the Lounge Tempelhof would have been the AB lounge.
 
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ua900
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Re: BER News and Discussion Thread

Mon Oct 26, 2020 11:51 pm

cirrusdragoon wrote:
It appears another design flaw. No downward escalators to the train platforms. Travelers at BER must carry their suitcases down the stairs to the platform themselves.

At the three underground platforms, three entrances lead to Terminal 1 each. But next to the steps, there is always only one upward escalator. Travelers can't get down to the track this way. If you come out of the terminal with heavy luggage in the future, you have to lift suitcases and bags down to the train with your own strength, or wait for one of the three elevators per platform. News link in german


Woohoo, that's major. Looking forward to my first flight out of there. What's next, stairway up to the lounge?

dazeflight wrote:
Quick logic question: how is this an issue:

cirrusdragoon wrote:
Travelers at BER must carry their suitcases down the stairs to the platform themselves.


if this is possible:

cirrusdragoon wrote:
or wait for one of the three elevators per platform


- especially considering heavy suitcases and the like are anyway not allowed on escalators? In other words: how is this relevant at all outside of the circles of TXL-objectophiles who seek any straw they can find to make BER worse than it is? On the positive side though: if this is what's left of BER-criticism (and it seems to be case in respect to german social media of the past days), BER doesn't seem to be bad at all.


Wait until the elevators break as they did at TXL ;-) Even TXL had escalators going down to the bus/taxi/rental car area. Then again they also had a ramp for luggage carts from the rental car drop off area to the terminal that featured cobblestones right after the ramp :roll:

Check out how many people with a carry on will use escalators vs. stairs. The elevators will be busy, not just with heavy luggage. Old people, people with strollers, people with carry-ons, lots of users. And the elevators aren't just to access the trains or go down, traffic can add up quickly.

https://ber.berlin-airport.de/content/d ... n%20A4.pdf

PANAMsterdam wrote:
dazeflight wrote:

- especially considering heavy suitcases and the like are anyway not allowed on escalators? In other words: how is this relevant at all outside of the circles of TXL-objectophiles who seek any straw they can find to make BER worse than it is? On the positive side though: if this is what's left of BER-criticism (and it seems to be the case with respect to german social media of the past days), BER doesn't seem to be bad at all.



I've always dragged my suitcase up or down the escalators to/from the train platform at AMS. They even made 'flat' escalators, to prevent suitcases from falling off the steps of regular escalators. So yes, it IS an error from BER. 40% of passengers traveling to/from AMS arrive/depart by Train. Imagine if they all had to wait on three elevators.


Fun fact: The flat escalators in AMS can even be taken by the lawn tractor lookalikes that pull the larger luggage carts all the way to the rental car parking structure and back. Had someone pull our 12 suitcases there to/from the rental cars from the arrivals area/to the check-in counters in May and August with that thing. Very capable service, I doubt BER will ever have that since neither SXF nor TXL had it. Sometimes it's better to look further away from your hometown airport when building something new. BER management clearly didn't, perhaps they only looked at FRA and MUC for comparison.

dazeflight wrote:
^ These tired people with lots of heavy luggage who need a train to catch are not allowed to use the escalators anyway as you can see here. Regarding your example: people are lazy, it's that simple. The question is if the lazyness equals a need. BER is not the US where you use an escalator to enter the fitness club.


Having a "need" in order to become "eligible" to use something is a very German concept. No shoeshine at the airport, no need, just shine them at home. No porter service, no need, schlepping luggage 1/2 mile or more with differences in elevation is true grit. No valet parking, no need, we're not in Hollywood. Welcome to Germany, have a beer and sausage at the EsS-Bahn ;-)

The only thing missing here is being asked to ride a rental bike to the city center. On the road since the S-Bahn can't accommodate too many bikes. And of course, the S-Bahn can't accommodate too much luggage either. No need since it's not like the train is going to an international airport or something, it's just going to the next incarnation of a sleepy regional airport with a few international flights. Same concept as the TXL bus before that, no need for luggage racks when you have bus drivers who can elevate their voice if needed with their signature "Berliner Schnauze".

Every Hertz bus in the US has luggage racks, pure laziness. Same as running half-empty buses from the terminal to the tarmac and back. Why do that when you can pack passengers like sardines and yell at them if they don't move further to the back to make room for five or ten more people? Welcome to Germany, where service, comfort, and international standards are a foreign language / Fremdwoerter. Enjoy your stay and your warm welcome ;-)

Which is why as much as I enjoy staying there, I enjoy the departure more than anything, at the point where I'm sitting on my UA flight back to EWR enjoying the pre-departure beverage :lol: :champagne:

Phosphorus wrote:
A "not-a-fan-of-TXL" (never had a pleasant experience with them. But then, when I first flew to that airport -- around 2010 or so -- it was already slated for closure. So no surprise there) here.
In this day and age, having an underground railway station at a busy place -- like this airport is expected to be, and not designing some escalators both ways, is an oversight, plain and simple.
Look at the demand for escalators, both upwards and downwards, at a place like FRA airport Regionalbahnhof or Fernbahnhof. Then perform a mental exercise of confining all folks, going downwards, to stairs or queue to the elevator. These are often tired people with luggage, after a flight, maybe a long flight, and they have a train to catch.


:checkmark: :checkmark: :checkmark:

Aside from lines of people at the elevator bank waiting to go down, people with luggage, strollers, wheelchairs, etc. will also want to go up using the elevators. Getting in and out of elevators takes time. It's not uncommon that people do the Harlem shuffle because people who are already inside are trying to make room for an old person with a luggage cart, prevent a family from getting separated, etc. There's a lot to be said about throughput capacity and chokepoints, whether that's a security checkpoint, a check-in area, or some other transit area. The idea is to increase capacity as much as possible while minimizing all areas where traffic jams could occur. Well, in most airports around the world, anyway :roll:

It's one thing to see these chokepoints grow over time due to changing needs (e.g. security checkpoints after 9/11 that had to be done on the fly using existing architecture, TXL traffic growing well beyond its intended purpose and capacity) but it's quite another to build in chokepoints on a clean sheet design. I doubt it was deliberate or malice, so perhaps it just needs to be called out as incompetence/lack of experience.
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Airdolomiti
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BER News and Discussion Thread - 2020

Tue Oct 27, 2020 7:45 am

It’ll be interesting to see what, if anything, can be done about the escalators. The S-Bahn platform has two, the other platforms each have four. I have no idea whether there is any way to permanently change the direction of, say, half the number of available escalators that doesn’t require replacing the whole thing.

Also, the train station and escalators have been ready for *years* and there were plenty of opportunities for keen media to pick up on this. It’s surprising that they would only notice now, so close to the opening.
 
Noshow
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Re: BER News and Discussion Thread - 2020

Tue Oct 27, 2020 8:26 am

If you look at pictures they only seem to have had very limited access to very selected places. At least there are thousands of pictures of the "red art carpet" in the main hall.
 
max999
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Re: BER News and Discussion Thread - 2020

Tue Oct 27, 2020 9:22 am

Since we have about 20 posts criticizing the lack of down escalators to the train platforms, I will continue this trend by criticizing all the stairs at SXF (now called BER T5). To go from one part of BER T5 to another, there are too many narrow and steep staircases to navigate. There are no escalators and the elevators are small and hidden.

Every time I've used SXF, I've had to pull my luggage up and down these stairs. I really think BER management needs to overhaul BER T5 to make it more passenger friendly since they decided to keep it open. If management doesn't want to update BER T5, I think they should just close it because there's too much capacity anyways (post pandemic).

Here's a sample picture of one of the many stairs. This is the kind of staircase you find at a small office building, not at a major international airport.

Image
Last edited by max999 on Tue Oct 27, 2020 9:44 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Noshow
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Re: BER News and Discussion Thread - 2020

Tue Oct 27, 2020 9:40 am

To be fair these are the stairs leading up to the visitors terrace and offices level not the route all passengers have to take.
 
max999
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Re: BER News and Discussion Thread - 2020

Tue Oct 27, 2020 9:43 am

Noshow wrote:
To be fair these are the stairs leading up to the visitors terrace and offices level not the route all passengers have to take.


That's just a sample picture. There are other stairs that connect one part of the terminal to another, which passengers must use. The other stairs are similar to the sample.
All the things I really like to do are either immoral, illegal, or fattening.
 
Noshow
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Re: BER News and Discussion Thread - 2020

Tue Oct 27, 2020 10:06 am

Well Schönefeld/T5 now is their low cost and low comfort terminal for airlines like Ryanair and such that don't want to pay full service fees at BER. It might be the best use for this terminal that was essentially inherited from east Germany and is way too small and outdated in many ways.
 
dazeflight
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Re: BER News and Discussion Thread - 2020

Tue Oct 27, 2020 11:45 am

^ The old terminal that was inherited from the GDR (now area L) is the one that has escalators and elevators. The weird staircases have mostly been built to connect it to the newer temporary areas surrounding it.

Noshow wrote:
If you look at pictures they only seem to have had very limited access to very selected places. At least there are thousands of pictures of the "red art carpet" in the main hall.


There were emergency trials before the planned opening in 2012, press and others had access to the train station since 2011 and have visited regularly because of the infamous ventilation trains, e.g. here.

max999 wrote:
Every time I've used SXF, I've had to pull my luggage up and down these stairs. I really think BER management needs to overhaul BER T5 to make it more passenger friendly since they decided to keep it open. If management doesn't want to update BER T5, I think they should just close it because there's too much capacity anyways (post pandemic).


Yes, T5 is not very passenger friendly or has many amenities, yet, millions of people managed to use SXF each year. The T5 terminals have been renovated and slightly improved (e.g. the downstairs waiting areas in K are larger now and a bar and a cafe have been added), but that's about it. The reason why T5 is kept open and T2 instead delayed is probably a combination of renewed business contracts after the renovation just before Corona together with additional airline relocations in case traffic picks up before T3 has been built in the south. The only airline that was supposed to use T2 and moved to T5 is Wizzair, the rest in T5 would have to move three times (SXF -> T2 -> T5 -> T3) in that case.
 
max999
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Re: BER News and Discussion Thread - 2020

Tue Oct 27, 2020 12:06 pm

Noshow wrote:
Well Schönefeld/T5 now is their low cost and low comfort terminal for airlines like Ryanair and such that don't want to pay full service fees at BER. It might be the best use for this terminal that was essentially inherited from east Germany and is way too small and outdated in many ways.


I remember seeing an article last year that said Ryanair criticized the planned fees charged for using BER T5 will be the same as fees for T1 / T2. Ryanair wanted lower fees from BER management because the vast difference in quality between T5 and T1 / T2. I agree with Ryanair's criticism. I'm not sure if the issue was ever resolved.
All the things I really like to do are either immoral, illegal, or fattening.
 
dazeflight
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Re: BER News and Discussion Thread - 2020

Tue Oct 27, 2020 12:31 pm

^ Not sure about the exact wording of Ryanair's criticizm but the terminal-specific fees (waiting room and baggage handling fees) at T1/T2 and T5 are not the same, while fees per planecategory, tarmac occupation and passenger don't differ.
 
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Phosphorus
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Re: BER News and Discussion Thread - 2020

Tue Oct 27, 2020 2:06 pm

Airdolomiti wrote:
It’ll be interesting to see what, if anything, can be done about the escalators. The S-Bahn platform has two, the other platforms each have four. I have no idea whether there is any way to permanently change the direction of, say, half the number of available escalators that doesn’t require replacing the whole thing.

Also, the train station and escalators have been ready for *years* and there were plenty of opportunities for keen media to pick up on this. It’s surprising that they would only notice now, so close to the opening.


You mean, the same media, who were either blind to the whole BER problem, or were so swamped with reporting the endless list of problems -- that made inconvenience a very distant afterthought, compared to actual safety issues -- as to actually contemplate, if BER can be open, in principle, without a rebuild (and/or a demolition, and then rebuild)?

Let's face it -- even on this board, there are folks, who'll defend BER, "as is", to the end. There are folks, who gave up, and are actually surprised BER will open. Folks who believe BER is hell-spawn, regardless. Folks who believe BER is heaven-sent, regardless.
For most of these audiences, an additional inconvenience of BER is non-news.
Like in USSR in 1989 -- for some, Lenin was still dead, for 65 years. For some, he was "the most alive of all living". It was pointless to try to feed them information that Lenin was dead. :)
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Noshow
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Re: BER News and Discussion Thread - 2020

Tue Oct 27, 2020 2:13 pm

I will just use BER as a passenger and hope it will work alright finally. But it looks like it.
 
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dangerhere
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Re: BER News and Discussion Thread - 2020

Tue Oct 27, 2020 2:17 pm

Kent350787 wrote:
So is it actually opening?


My son's host family lives in Lichtenrade - quite good for BER, less good for Zentrum


I guess you mean Mitte ;)
 
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ClassicLover
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Re: BER News and Discussion Thread - 2020

Tue Oct 27, 2020 6:08 pm

Airdolomiti wrote:
AMP44 wrote:
ClassicLover wrote:
Any ideas what happened to the space where airBerlin's lounge had been built?

This article shows some "pictures" (though they look CG to me) - https://morepremium.com/the-new-airport-lounge-that-no-one-will-ever-visit/

Has the space been used for one of the other lounges that is opening there, Lounge Tegel and Lounge Tempelhof? Or is it just an empty room, still furnished for airBerlin or what at the moment?

Quite curious about this, so if anyone has any info, that would be great to hear.


AB's lounge was constructed in the South Pier. Looking at the BER map, Lounge Tempelhof is in the South Pier, so I am sure they took over the AB Lounge space. The LH Lounge is right next to the Lounge Tegel in the North Pier.

https://ber.berlin-airport.de/content/dam/restartweb/no-language/dokumente/20200825_BER%20T1%20T2%20Terminalplan%20A4-EN.pdf


That is correct, the Lounge Tempelhof would have been the AB lounge.


Thank you both for that :) Much appreciated.
I do enjoy a spot of flying, especially when it's not in economy!
 
miegapele
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Re: BER News and Discussion Thread - 2020

Tue Oct 27, 2020 6:43 pm

Before demanding such luxury as downwards elevators, it would be interesting to know did they fix that elevator which was few steps too short, going up? Does anybody know?
 
RainerBoeing777
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Re: BER News and Discussion Thread - 2020

Tue Oct 27, 2020 6:52 pm

when does BER open?
CX - JL - LH - KE - KL - SQ - QR - QF - TG - UA
 
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Phosphorus
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Re: BER News and Discussion Thread - 2020

Tue Oct 27, 2020 7:12 pm

RainerBoeing777 wrote:
when does BER open?

Airport code BER active since day before, so legally BER is already open.
First flights land this Saturday
Step-by-step opening procedure:
https://ber.berlin-airport.de/en/news/2 ... -flug.html
AN4 A40 L4T TU3 TU5 IL6 ILW I93 F50 F70 100 146 ARJ AT7 DH4 L10 CRJ ERJ E90 E95 DC-9 MD-8X YK4 YK2 SF3 S20 319 320 321 332 333 343 346 722 732 733 734 735 73G 738 739 744 74M 757 767 777
Ceterum autem censeo, Moscovia esse delendam
 
RainerBoeing777
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Re: BER News and Discussion Thread - 2020

Tue Oct 27, 2020 7:36 pm

Phosphorus wrote:
RainerBoeing777 wrote:
when does BER open?

Airport code BER active since day before, so legally BER is already open.
First flights land this Saturday
Step-by-step opening procedure:
https://ber.berlin-airport.de/en/news/2 ... -flug.html


I don't even understand something about the new airport. Are there 5 Terminals? And because they only focus on T1 and T5, what about the others? I also saw a news that T2 opened in 2021
CX - JL - LH - KE - KL - SQ - QR - QF - TG - UA
 
mxaxai
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Re: BER News and Discussion Thread - 2020

Tue Oct 27, 2020 7:42 pm

RainerBoeing777 wrote:
I don't even understand something about the new airport. Are there 5 Terminals? And because they only focus on T1 and T5, what about the others? I also saw a news that T2 opened in 2021

T1 = original BER
T2 = T1 extension for more check-in, security and baggage area (no gates)
T5 = original SXF

T1 is the part that opens this week. This is the part of the new airport that's responsible for all the delays.

T2 was added relatively recently when it became clear that T1 is too small for all the existing traffic from TXL. It's ready for operation even today but due to the low passenger numbers they've postponed using it until summer 2021.

T3/4 are in the master plan for BER so the old SXF terminal was assigned the number 5 when they decided to keep it open. These haven't been built yet, nor are they in any serious planning stage. They only reserved some space (and terminal numbers) for future expansion options.

T5 is open, has always been open and will remain in use for an indefinite period as LCC terminal. They just renamed it. It was originally supposed to be closed when T1 starts operating but T1 is too small for (last year's) passenger numbers so they decided to give it a small overhaul and keep it open.
Last edited by mxaxai on Tue Oct 27, 2020 7:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
dodoma
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Re: BER News and Discussion Thread - 2020

Tue Oct 27, 2020 8:17 pm

miegapele wrote:
Before demanding such luxury as downwards elevators, it would be interesting to know did they fix that elevator which was few steps too short, going up? Does anybody know?


As one of the almost 10.000 people who tested the airport during the previous couple of months, I'm happy to report that these escalators have been replaced and no extra steps are required to reach the ground level. I was actually quite surprised when I realized this few weeks ago.

Also I took the train to the new station tonight and I have to say that apart from the "missing" downwards escalator, the station seems very well equipped and ready for service.
 
dodoma
Posts: 56
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Re: BER News and Discussion Thread - 2020

Tue Oct 27, 2020 8:21 pm

mxaxai wrote:
RainerBoeing777 wrote:
I don't even understand something about the new airport. Are there 5 Terminals? And because they only focus on T1 and T5, what about the others? I also saw a news that T2 opened in 2021

T1 = original BER
T2 = T1 extension for more check-in, security and baggage area (no gates)
T5 = original SXF

T1 is the part that opens this week. This is the part of the new airport that's responsible for all the delays.

T2 was added relatively recently when it became clear that T1 is too small for all the existing traffic from TXL. It's ready for operation even today but due to the low passenger numbers they've postponed using it until summer 2021.

T3/4 are in the master plan for BER so the old SXF terminal was assigned the number 5 when they decided to keep it open. These haven't been built yet, nor are they in any serious planning stage. They only reserved some space (and terminal numbers) for future expansion options.

T5 is open, has always been open and will remain in use for an indefinite period as LCC terminal. They just renamed it. It was originally supposed to be closed when T1 starts operating but T1 is too small for (last year's) passenger numbers so they decided to give it a small overhaul and keep it open.


One quick note I have to make: The company that runs the airport has stated that once terminal 3 opens, it will close the old SXF (now BER terminal 5) for good. Source: https://www.berlin-airport.de/de/presse/informationen-ber/ausblick/3_ausbauphasen/#finger_tab2
 
Kent350787
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Re: BER News and Discussion Thread - 2020

Tue Oct 27, 2020 9:21 pm

dangerhere wrote:
Kent350787 wrote:
So is it actually opening?


My son's host family lives in Lichtenrade - quite good for BER, less good for Zentrum


I guess you mean Mitte ;)


It's been a long time - of course :)
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Antarius
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Re: BER News and Discussion Thread - 2020

Tue Oct 27, 2020 10:13 pm

dodoma wrote:
miegapele wrote:
Before demanding such luxury as downwards elevators, it would be interesting to know did they fix that elevator which was few steps too short, going up? Does anybody know?


As one of the almost 10.000 people who tested the airport during the previous couple of months, I'm happy to report that these escalators have been replaced and no extra steps are required to reach the ground level. I was actually quite surprised when I realized this few weeks ago.

Also I took the train to the new station tonight and I have to say that apart from the "missing" downwards escalator, the station seems very well equipped and ready for service.


Awesome. Glad to hear.
2020: SFO DFW IAH HOU CLT MEX BIS MIA GUA ORD DTW LGA BOS LHR DUB BFS BHD STN OAK PHL ISP JFK SJC DEN SJU LAS TXL GDL
 
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lightsaber
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Re: BER News and Discussion Thread - 2020

Wed Oct 28, 2020 12:26 am

Just because there have been so many false starts, Saturday October 31st (Halloween) is the BER opening day.

https://www.cnn.com/travel/article/berl ... index.html


Pinch me. I honestly cannot believe it. Sorry, this isn't anything personal, I've just followed the excitement and fiascos of BER for so long, part of me wants to watch the webcams (are there any?) before believing it.

Lightsaber
Winter is coming.
 
PANAMsterdam
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Re: BER News and Discussion Thread - 2020

Wed Oct 28, 2020 9:01 am

lightsaber wrote:
part of me wants to watch the webcams (are there any?) before believing it.

Lightsaber


There are probably webcams but they are probably not working :duck:
Every country has an airline. The world has Pan Am.
 
Noshow
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Re: BER News and Discussion Thread - 2020

Wed Oct 28, 2020 9:13 am

This would be a nice new topic: What could still go wrong? :biggrin:
 
SCQ83
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Re: BER News and Discussion Thread - 2020

Wed Oct 28, 2020 9:47 am

Noshow wrote:
Well Schönefeld/T5 now is their low cost and low comfort terminal for airlines like Ryanair and such that don't want to pay full service fees at BER. It might be the best use for this terminal that was essentially inherited from east Germany and is way too small and outdated in many ways.


The issue with T5 (aka SXF) is that it was disgusting. Stairs everywhere (does it even comply with regulations for disabled passengers?). Extremely crowded. Smelly (you smell like the Burger King; it felt like it didn't have any kind of ventilation or way to take away the smell of the food outlets; not great in the post-COVID world anyway).

One thing is a luxury/confortable terminal and another one is an unhealthy terminal.

I don't think anyone expects lounges or luxury perks in a low-cost terminal, but a "healthy" terminal should be a given. Specially in the capital of Germany; we are not talking about a second-world Eastern European or African country. There are plenty of examples of low-cost terminals / Ryanair airports that are OK (CPH Go, BCN T2, BGY, CRL, etc.)
 
Noshow
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Re: BER News and Discussion Thread - 2020

Wed Oct 28, 2020 10:03 am

I agree with your assessment. However they had expected to close it for BER until recently and ran it down intentionally. Only now they refurbished some parts and opened up waiting room walls to create slightly more gate space. Hopefully they will now make it more comfortable to stay there. Realistically the airport is close to be bankrupt and has no money to spend.
 
T4thH
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Re: BER News and Discussion Thread - 2020

Wed Oct 28, 2020 12:09 pm

Noshow wrote:
This would be a nice new topic: What could still go wrong? :biggrin:

Nothing.
OK, Trump is loosing the election and starts a nuke war immediately on 03-Nov-2020, to stay the greatestest president ever.

And 50 years later: "And here my son, as you can see with your three eyes, on this glassed plain field, was once the BER."

But as said, else: nothing :white:
 
Noshow
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Re: BER News and Discussion Thread - 2020

Wed Oct 28, 2020 12:16 pm

Germany is close to another Corona lock down. At least the BER opening might be even more fun now. Airport open,still nobody inside. :scratchchin:

On a serious note I hope traffic and travel recover and everybody can return to healthy business soon.
 
filipinoavgeek
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Re: BER News and Discussion Thread - 2020

Wed Oct 28, 2020 1:11 pm

BER's start of operations has been delayed for so long that between BER starting construction and finally opening, 9V-SKA was assembled in Toulouse, became the first A380 owned by an airline, operated the first commercial flight by an A380, served SQ for less than 10 years, was sent to Tarbes for storage, ultimately scrapped, and turned into limited-edition luggage tags before BER saw a single paying passenger.
RIP 9V-SKA
2007 - 2019
 
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Aisak
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Re: BER News and Discussion Thread - 2020

Wed Oct 28, 2020 1:39 pm

Any info regarding lounges?
I know BA used to run a Lounge at TXL, will they run their own lounge at BER or will use a thrid party? Since most oneworld carriers at BER (ex-TXL) run non-Schengen flgihts it might make sense to place the lounge after passport control at the non-Schengen area.
Regarding LH and AF, most of their flights and alliance flights are Schengen so I guess they will be located just after security.

The alliance partners not finding a suitable "alliance lounge" will have to search for an agreement with a 3rd party lounge. Any info on who will be setting up a lounge at BER T1/T2?
 
Noshow
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Re: BER News and Discussion Thread - 2020

Wed Oct 28, 2020 1:45 pm

Lufthansa has one at the north end of T1 and there is another one -pay I guess- at the south end. There might be more.
BTW: Haven't noticed any "golden gull" lounge, the one I typically wait at.
 
goosebayguy
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Re: BER News and Discussion Thread - 2020

Wed Oct 28, 2020 3:13 pm

Does anyone know if there is a viewing terrace at BER?
 
mxaxai
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Re: BER News and Discussion Thread - 2020

Wed Oct 28, 2020 3:20 pm

goosebayguy wrote:
Does anyone know if there is a viewing terrace at BER?

Yes, there is:
https://ber.berlin-airport.de/en/flugha ... rasse.html

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