nascar1
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Level to launch 5 new destinations and also a new ORY base next S18.

Tue Nov 28, 2017 9:51 am

Accoding to several newspaper today Level will announce;

- 2nd base in ORY, with 4 new destinations: Montreal, Newark, Fort de France and Pointe à Pitre from July 2018.

- New destination from BCN: Boston.

- The fleet will grow up to 5 A330-200

More information is expected this morning.

https://cincodias.elpais.com/cincodias/2017/11/27/companias/1511811514_616066.html
http://www.europapress.es/turismo/transportes/aerolineas/noticia-level-abrira-paris-orly-segunda-base-europea-julio-2018-20171128103612.html
Last edited by nascar1 on Tue Nov 28, 2017 10:08 am, edited 2 times in total.
 
hkcanadaexpat
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Re: Level to launch 5 new destinatinos next S18 and new ORY base.

Tue Nov 28, 2017 9:53 am

Actually its Montreal, not Quebec City.
 
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KarelXWB
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Re: Level to launch 5 new destinations and also a new ORY base next S18.

Tue Nov 28, 2017 10:15 am

Press release:

http://newsroom.aviator.aero/level-laun ... from-eu99/

International Airlines Group will launch flights to Montreal*, New York, Guadeloupe and Martinique from Paris Orly from July 2018 via LEVEL its low cost longhaul airline brand.

Fares start from €99** one way and tickets go on sale today at flylevel.com.
LEVEL will base two Airbus A330-200 aircraft at Orly, each with 293 economy and 21 premium economy seats.
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commavia
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Re: Level to launch 5 new destinations and also a new ORY base next S18.

Tue Nov 28, 2017 10:19 am

Replacing Open Skies, which will cease to exist. Interesting.
 
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lesfalls
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Re: Level to launch 5 new destinations and also a new ORY base next S18.

Tue Nov 28, 2017 10:23 am

I just looked at ORY-EWR roundtrip in September 2018 and it seems that the flights are operated by Openskies with an IB flight number. I wonder if there is more to this.

https://booking.flylevel.com/?triptype= ... hd=0&inf=0
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andymartin
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Re: Level to launch 5 new destinations and also a new ORY base next S18.

Tue Nov 28, 2017 10:39 am

Still showing as Open Skies on a Kayak search, with astronomical fares! Where are these 99 euro fares?
 
SpaceshipDC10
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Re: Level to launch 5 new destinations and also a new ORY base next S18.

Tue Nov 28, 2017 10:57 am

Alright, so in addition to Air Canada, Air Transat, Air France from CDG, Corsair, as long as they keep flying to YUL, will now have competition at ORY. Don't know the frequency though. With 293 seats in Y, are the LEVEL's A332s configured with 8 seats per abreast? That's 40 seats less than TS, however they do have 9 more than them at the front.
 
pabloeing
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Re: Level to launch 5 new destinations and also a new ORY base next S18.

Tue Nov 28, 2017 11:00 am

¿NRT from BCN soon?
 
fjmm92
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Re: Level to launch 5 new destinations and also a new ORY base next S18.

Tue Nov 28, 2017 11:03 am

From BCN:

PUJ ends 24 March 2018
BOS begins 28 March 2018
LAX resumes 28 March 2018

OAK, BOS and EZE increases from 6 August 2018

Image
 
nascar1
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Re: Level to launch 5 new destinations and also a new ORY base next S18.

Tue Nov 28, 2017 11:05 am

Schedule S18:

PARIS ORLY (new base 2 A330) Opening July 2

July 2 Montreal (3x weekly)
July 3 Guadalupe (4x weekly)
3 sept Martinique (3x weekly)
4 sept New York (4 lyweek)

BARCELONA (3 A330)

Boston (from March 28 2x up to 3 weekly August 6)
Los Angeles (resumption of seasonal2 weekly flight from March 28)
San Francisco (up to 3 weekly from August 7)
Punta Cana (canceled March 24)
Buenos Aires (4x up to 6 weekly from August 6)
Last edited by nascar1 on Tue Nov 28, 2017 11:12 am, edited 2 times in total.
 
nascar1
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Re: Level to launch 5 new destinations and also a new ORY base next S18.

Tue Nov 28, 2017 11:06 am

pabloeing wrote:
¿NRT from BCN soon?


According to my sources, ANA will announce BCN in a few weeks.
 
oldannyboy
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Re: Level to launch 5 new destinations and also a new ORY base next S18.

Tue Nov 28, 2017 11:26 am

SpaceshipDC10 wrote:
. With 293 seats in Y, are the LEVEL's A332s configured with 8 seats per abreast? That's 40 seats less than TS, however they do have 9 more than them at the front.


8 across, and quite comfortable, with good pitch. the LEVEL jets are really rather nice inside. The Premium section up-front is really cozy and spacious.
 
SpaceshipDC10
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Re: Level to launch 5 new destinations and also a new ORY base next S18.

Tue Nov 28, 2017 11:55 am

oldannyboy wrote:
8 across, and quite comfortable, with good pitch. the LEVEL jets are really rather nice inside. The Premium section up-front is really cozy and spacious.


So they might end up with the best Y cabin of all the airlines serving YUL-Paris route.
 
fjmm92
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Re: Level to launch 5 new destinations and also a new ORY base next S18.

Tue Nov 28, 2017 12:26 pm

According to an interview in the spanish media "El Economista" with Willie Walsh, IAG's CEO, two new Level routes from Barcelona will be announced in a few days apart of Boston.

http://www.eleconomista.es/economia/not ... elona.html
 
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zkojq
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Re: Level to launch 5 new destinations and also a new ORY base next S18.

Tue Nov 28, 2017 1:13 pm

This is silly. LHLC is unproven. If you set up a base for your LHLC subsidiary at your rival's hub, they are going to do the same to you (Boost at Madrid). Collectively everyone trashes everyone else's yields. They say that Level is profitable by year end, but they don't say anything about the affected Iberia routes.

Great for the travelling public though.

I guess Openskies is operating the flights since Level still doesn't have its AOC? Guess that maybe makes it simpler for crewing.
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Richard28
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Re: Level to launch 5 new destinations and also a new ORY base next S18.

Tue Nov 28, 2017 1:29 pm

At the recent IAG results confrerence I'm pretty sure they said Level has not dented demand or yields at IB.
 
oldannyboy
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Re: Level to launch 5 new destinations and also a new ORY base next S18.

Tue Nov 28, 2017 1:34 pm

SpaceshipDC10 wrote:
oldannyboy wrote:
8 across, and quite comfortable, with good pitch. the LEVEL jets are really rather nice inside. The Premium section up-front is really cozy and spacious.


So they might end up with the best Y cabin of all the airlines serving YUL-Paris route.


Well, easily. At least in terms of personal space, and comfort of the seat. Not to mention how clean and well kept their cabins are.
 
tphuang
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Re: Level to launch 5 new destinations and also a new ORY base next S18.

Tue Nov 28, 2017 2:04 pm

Bummer open skies is going away. I really enjoyed the prem plus seats. Maybe I will try out level's premium seats next time to Paris.
 
LHRFlyer
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Re: Level to launch 5 new destinations and also a new ORY base next S18.

Tue Nov 28, 2017 2:35 pm

I note the IAG press release refers to the closure of the OpenSkies brand, which does suggest that the AOC May be used for LEVEL:

http://www.iairgroup.com/phoenix.zhtml? ... ID=2318756
 
jbs2886
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Re: Level to launch 5 new destinations and also a new ORY base next S18.

Tue Nov 28, 2017 2:40 pm

LHRFlyer wrote:
I note the IAG press release refers to the closure of the OpenSkies brand, which does suggest that the AOC May be used for LEVEL:

http://www.iairgroup.com/phoenix.zhtml? ... ID=2318756


Good catch, that’s definitely an easy way to get the LEVEL AOC. I suspect Openskies yields were being hit hard and there really isn’t a good, cheap airport to replace the 757s and 767.
 
FSDan
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Re: Level to launch 5 new destinations and also a new ORY base next S18.

Tue Nov 28, 2017 2:56 pm

Is BCN-PUJ a permanent cancellation, or was this just planned to be operated during the winter?

Also, LEVEL is not part of the TATL JV with BA, IB, and AA, is it?
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CaliguyNYC
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Re: Level to launch 5 new destinations and also a new ORY base next S18.

Tue Nov 28, 2017 3:10 pm

So Open Skies, which had business class, is gone and Level, which does not have a business class, replaces it. I wonder what affects AF more a cheap business class airline or one targeting tourists?
 
tobsw
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Re: Level to launch 5 new destinations and also a new ORY base next S18.

Tue Nov 28, 2017 3:31 pm

FSDan wrote:
Also, LEVEL is not part of the TATL JV with BA, IB, and AA, is it?


Level is just a brand. Both Iberia and OpenSkies/BA belong to the TATL JV. Hence, "Level flights" are part of the venture.
 
nascar1
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Re: Level to launch 5 new destinations and also a new ORY base next S18.

Tue Nov 28, 2017 8:24 pm

Schedule has been released.

Barcelona – Boston eff 28MAR18 2 weekly (3 weekly from 06AUG18)
IB2625 BCN1600 – 1815BOS 332 36
IB2626 BOS2015 – 0930+1BCN 332 36

Service operates Day 146 from 06AUG18.

Paris Orly – Fort-de-France eff 03SEP18 3 weekly
IB2672 ORY1100 – 1405FDF 332 146
IB2673 FDF1700 – 0720+1ORY 332 146

Paris Orly – Montreal eff 02JUL18 3 weekly (Subject to Government Approval)
IB2678 ORY1945 – 2130YUL 332 146
IB2679 YUL2315 – 1205+1ORY 332 146

Paris Orly – Newark eff 04SEP18 4 weekly
IB2674 ORY1450 – 1715EWR 332 x146
IB2675 EWR1900 – 0820+1ORY 332 x146

Current OpenSkies service will be operated by Boeing 757 only on daily basis from the same date, instead of 757/767.

Paris Orly – Pointe-a-Pitre eff 03JUL18 4 weekly
IB2670 ORY1610 – 1910PTP 332 x146
IB2671 PTP2110 – 1120+1ORY 332 x146

On existing routes from Barcelona, planned frequency adjustments as follow. Reservation for these routes also opened on Tuesday 28NOV17:

Barcelona – Buenos Aires Ezeiza eff 25MAR18 4 weekly (Day x135; 6 weekly Day x1 from 11AUG18)
Barcelona – Los Angeles eff 28MAR18 2 weekly (Day 37)
Barcelona – Oakland eff 27MAR18 2 weekly (Day 25; 3 weekly Day 257 from 07AUG18)


Source: Airlineroute
 
wenders825
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Re: Level to launch 5 new destinations and also a new ORY base next S18.

Tue Nov 28, 2017 8:32 pm

fjmm92 wrote:
According to an interview in the spanish media "El Economista" with Willie Walsh, IAG's CEO, two new Level routes from Barcelona will be announced in a few days apart of Boston.

http://www.eleconomista.es/economia/not ... elona.html

would be shocked if NRT is not one of these, that was heavily rumored with the original announcement of LEVEL

everyone on this board wanted LEVEL to fail and it appears to be a success with increased frequencies and more destinations in 2018. look at that
 
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Aisak
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Re: Level to launch 5 new destinations and also a new ORY base next S18.

Tue Nov 28, 2017 8:35 pm

jbs2886 wrote:
LHRFlyer wrote:
I note the IAG press release refers to the closure of the OpenSkies brand, which does suggest that the AOC May be used for LEVEL:

http://www.iairgroup.com/phoenix.zhtml? ... ID=2318756


Good catch, that’s definitely an easy way to get the LEVEL AOC.


Well, not actually. Level needs a Spanish AOC to fly from BCN to PUJ or EZE. No French AOC will allow Level to fly those routes.
On the other hand a Spanish registered airline (IB for the time being) can fly between two points in France or from France to any country signing open skies with the EU.
 
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PatrickZ80
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Re: Level to launch 5 new destinations and also a new ORY base next S18.

Tue Nov 28, 2017 8:41 pm

FSDan wrote:
Is BCN-PUJ a permanent cancellation, or was this just planned to be operated during the winter?

Also, LEVEL is not part of the TATL JV with BA, IB, and AA, is it?


Sad to see Punta Cana discontinued, but a logical move. Level was founded to compete with Norwegian, and Norwegian didn't fly to the Caribbean anymore. They pulled out of St. Croix and San Juan and Guadeloupe and Martinique are only served from the USA and not from Europe. With their flights to those islands Level is trying to be ahead of Norwegian.

And as a matter of fact, Level is part of the joint venture. If you're trying to book a flight on the Level website, it shows the Level flights plus the alternatives flown by Iberia, British Airways and American Airlines.
 
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Jayafe
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Re: Level to launch 5 new destinations and also a new ORY base next S18.

Tue Nov 28, 2017 9:36 pm

wenders825 wrote:
everyone on this board wanted LEVEL to fail and it appears to be a success with increased frequencies and more destinations in 2018. look at that


Increasing frequencies is not a sign a success, barely a way to show they are still in the game to hit DY. IAG has more than enough money and planes to go break even or even burn some money. By the way, LEVEL does not even exists ("yet"), it is basically IB in ULC version painted in green and blue.
 
AirInterCRV
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Re: Level to launch 5 new destinations and also a new ORY base next S18.

Tue Nov 28, 2017 9:46 pm

CaliguyNYC wrote:
So Open Skies, which had business class, is gone and Level, which does not have a business class, replaces it. I wonder what affects AF more a cheap business class airline or one targeting tourists?


good question.
The fact that so many airlines are trying their luck again and again on PAR-NYC is beyond me:
- XL Airways is just absorbing some cheap Y seasonal surplus and isn't making money
- La Compagnie is a non-factor
- Norwegian: no idea how they're doing. But I would guess that with the frequencies they have, they're mostly fighting in the Icelandair / WOW league

Now, OpenSkies is an interesting proposition, as they fly from ORY and offer an overall decent flying experience to OW loyal travelers unimpressed by AA, in particular in premium Y (and also cheap J fares). They might have the potential to play it like VS at LHR (albeit on a different scale). But... they're not making money, and now they're being replaced by an airline with less-than-daily frequencies and no J

Meanwhile, UA and AA don't deploy much capacity and seem content with loyal O&D + people transiting through EWR and JFK, and DL/AF own the route...

As for PTP and FDF, you could fill 10x daily 388s from PAR if you wanted to, demand is endless. Whether you would make money out of this is another story.
 
airzona11
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Re: Level to launch 5 new destinations and also a new ORY base next S18.

Tue Nov 28, 2017 10:44 pm

Interesting they go from lots of premium to nothing premium.
 
FSDan
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Re: Level to launch 5 new destinations and also a new ORY base next S18.

Tue Nov 28, 2017 11:07 pm

tobsw wrote:
FSDan wrote:
Also, LEVEL is not part of the TATL JV with BA, IB, and AA, is it?


Level is just a brand. Both Iberia and OpenSkies/BA belong to the TATL JV. Hence, "Level flights" are part of the venture.


Ah, thanks for the correction!
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ro1960
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Re: Level to launch 5 new destinations and also a new ORY base next S18.

Tue Nov 28, 2017 11:16 pm

Good to see that OpenSkies staff are not let down:

"Level’s Paris flights will be operated by staff who currently work for IAG’s French airline OpenSkies which is based at the airport. The OpenSkies brand will cease to operate at the end of next summer and all its staff will operate Level flights."

https://worldairlinenews.com/2017/11/28/level-to-launch-four-long-haul-routes-from-paris-orly-the-openskies-brand-to-be-retired/

But what fate for the 3 757s and the 767?
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NichCage
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Re: Level to launch 5 new destinations and also a new ORY base next S18.

Tue Nov 28, 2017 11:22 pm

Nice to see LEVEL in ORY. There also expanding BCN which is also good, despite the fact that PUJ is being cut with BOS being added.
.
 
dcajet
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Re: Level to launch 5 new destinations and also a new ORY base next S18.

Wed Nov 29, 2017 12:30 am

Although unrelated to LEVEL additional flights to EZE, AR announced today that it is dropping BCN from its network. LEVEL will have the route for itself from Feb 1st and until Norwegian starts flying between the two cities.
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deltadudejg
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Re: Level to launch 5 new destinations and also a new ORY base next S18.

Wed Nov 29, 2017 1:57 am

Shame about the Openskies brand. Anyone else feel it was a bit of a waste to bring aboard the one 767 and fly it for a little over a year to now by next summer dump the whole brand. I'm curious what they will do with the aircraft.
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Andy33
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Re: Level to launch 5 new destinations and also a new ORY base next S18.

Wed Nov 29, 2017 6:17 am

deltadudejg wrote:
Shame about the Openskies brand. Anyone else feel it was a bit of a waste to bring aboard the one 767 and fly it for a little over a year to now by next summer dump the whole brand. I'm curious what they will do with the aircraft.

The 767 will be up for sale, along with the 7 remaining 767s in the BA mainline fleet all of which are meant to leave by the end of 2018. The 767 is the last of the long-haul configured BA 767s still with BA and sister airlines. All current and former BA 767s are Rolls Royce engined and so are of little interest to the P2F market.
 
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Aisak
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Re: Level to launch 5 new destinations and also a new ORY base next S18.

Wed Nov 29, 2017 10:04 am

AirInterCRV wrote:
Now, OpenSkies is an interesting proposition, as they fly from ORY and offer an overall decent flying experience to OW loyal travelers unimpressed by AA, in particular in premium Y (and also cheap J fares). They might have the potential to play it like VS at LHR (albeit on a different scale). But... they're not making money, and now they're being replaced by an airline with less-than-daily frequencies and no J


And no OW benefits.... Well, maybe they are, but IB itself is restricting Iberia Plus benefits on IB26XX flights, those operated on behalf of Level. So I will not excpect much when flashing a shiny emerald gem.

Also interesting to see what happens to the 212 openskies lounge at Orly West. It is at the Non-Schengen area so it can only be used by BA-openskies passengers, and not by IB flyers to MAD (or Vueling ones). It is hard the lounge can make it to next winter if it's only intended for BA passengers.
 
SCQ83
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Re: Level to launch 5 new destinations and also a new ORY base next S18.

Wed Nov 29, 2017 10:44 am

I don't see the surprise about OpenSkies. They were quite an unknown, "weird" carrier.

Since OpenSkies used to operate to IAD, maybe LEVEL could attempt BWI? BA already operates there so IAG has some infrastructure and knowledge of the market. It would be interesting, at least ORY-BWI seasonal to start with.

Paris-Washington has only UA and AF on IAD-CDG, so that would be a first low-cost connection between those two cities and a different airport combination.
 
Egerton
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Re: Level to launch 5 new destinations and also a new ORY base next S18.

Wed Nov 29, 2017 11:54 am

The IAG press release is here

http://www.iairgroup.com/phoenix.zhtml?c=240949&p=media

I wonder if some contributors might care to read, mark and learn from it?
 
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zkojq
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Re: Level to launch 5 new destinations and also a new ORY base next S18.

Wed Nov 29, 2017 12:25 pm

So Level flights operate with Iberia crews (same labour costs), Iberia purchased aircraft (same finance costs) but with Level sold/marketed tickets (much lower yield). Yet somehow they're profitable? I seriously doubt that ancillary revenue is making up the difference. :roll:
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Egerton
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Re: Level to launch 5 new destinations and also a new ORY base next S18.

Wed Nov 29, 2017 12:46 pm

zkojq wrote:
So Level flights operate with Iberia crews (same labour costs), Iberia purchased aircraft (same finance costs) but with Level sold/marketed tickets (much lower yield). Yet somehow they're profitable? I seriously doubt that ancillary revenue is making up the difference. :roll:


I wonder what source you have for any of your assertions?
Presumably you are aware that for a director of a public company is is a very serious error to knowingly make false statements?
I wonder if perhaps you might be embedded in your own beliefs?

I look forward with interest to see what IAG tell us in due course about the bookings LEVEL have achieved for their new French routes?
 
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Jayafe
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Re: Level to launch 5 new destinations and also a new ORY base next S18.

Wed Nov 29, 2017 1:12 pm

zkojq wrote:
So Level flights operate with Iberia crews (same labour costs), Iberia purchased aircraft (same finance costs) but with Level sold/marketed tickets (much lower yield). Yet somehow they're profitable?


They are not (and wont be for at least 1-2 years according to WW).
 
Apprentice
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Re: Level to launch 5 new destinations and also a new ORY base next S18.

Wed Nov 29, 2017 1:35 pm

nascar1 wrote:
Schedule has been released.

Barcelona – Boston eff 28MAR18 2 weekly (3 weekly from 06AUG18)
IB2625 BCN1600 – 1815BOS 332 36
IB2626 BOS2015 – 0930+1BCN 332 36

Service operates Day 146 from 06AUG18.

Paris Orly – Fort-de-France eff 03SEP18 3 weekly
IB2672 ORY1100 – 1405FDF 332 146
IB2673 FDF1700 – 0720+1ORY 332 146

Paris Orly – Montreal eff 02JUL18 3 weekly (Subject to Government Approval)
IB2678 ORY1945 – 2130YUL 332 146
IB2679 YUL2315 – 1205+1ORY 332 146

Paris Orly – Newark eff 04SEP18 4 weekly
IB2674 ORY1450 – 1715EWR 332 x146
IB2675 EWR1900 – 0820+1ORY 332 x146

Current OpenSkies service will be operated by Boeing 757 only on daily basis from the same date, instead of 757/767.

Paris Orly – Pointe-a-Pitre eff 03JUL18 4 weekly
IB2670 ORY1610 – 1910PTP 332 x146
IB2671 PTP2110 – 1120+1ORY 332 x146

On existing routes from Barcelona, planned frequency adjustments as follow. Reservation for these routes also opened on Tuesday 28NOV17:

Barcelona – Buenos Aires Ezeiza eff 25MAR18 4 weekly (Day x135; 6 weekly Day x1 from 11AUG18)
Barcelona – Los Angeles eff 28MAR18 2 weekly (Day 37)
Barcelona – Oakland eff 27MAR18 2 weekly (Day 25; 3 weekly Day 257 from 07AUG18)


Source: Airlineroute


Hi:. I had the impression that Level will fly BCN-FFL. Was I wrong?
Thanks
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zkojq
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Re: Level to launch 5 new destinations and also a new ORY base next S18.

Wed Nov 29, 2017 2:52 pm

Jayafe wrote:
zkojq wrote:
So Level flights operate with Iberia crews (same labour costs), Iberia purchased aircraft (same finance costs) but with Level sold/marketed tickets (much lower yield). Yet somehow they're profitable?


They are not (and wont be for at least 1-2 years according to WW).


In the link that KarelXWB posted in reply three, Willie Walsh says:

“LEVEL’s Barcelona operation has been an incredible success. Customers love it and LEVEL will be profitable this year. Barcelona was always a first step and today we’re delighted to launch flights from our second European city with four exciting new routes from Paris.


So apparently despite their costs being broadly the same as Iberia (same flight crew, same cabin crew, same aircraft financing, same cost of fuel) and yields being softer (its a LCC) it is profitable. Hence me being somewhat mystified.

http://newsroom.aviator.aero/level-laun ... from-eu99/
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ro1960
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Re: Level to launch 5 new destinations and also a new ORY base next S18.

Wed Nov 29, 2017 2:57 pm

Aisak wrote:
Also interesting to see what happens to the 212 openskies lounge at Orly West. It is at the Non-Schengen area so it can only be used by BA-openskies passengers, and not by IB flyers to MAD (or Vueling ones). It is hard the lounge can make it to next winter if it's only intended for BA passengers.


Is it possible that lounges will be relocated in the building connecting West and South terminals?
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Aisak
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Re: Level to launch 5 new destinations and also a new ORY base next S18.

Wed Nov 29, 2017 4:29 pm

    zkojq wrote:
    So Level flights operate with Iberia crews (same labour costs), Iberia purchased aircraft (same finance costs) but with Level sold/marketed tickets (much lower yield).

    How can you be so sure about that statement? Level flights do operate with Iberia crews but i'm curious to know where have you seen those costs in their financial reports.
    A crew member based in BCN does not have to **cost** the same than a crew member based in MAD.
    SEPLA, the pilot's union has been offering some sort of plan for quite some time to convince IB management to re-open the BCN base.

    Also, i kind of remember reading in the press that the crew based in BCN for Level agreed different labour conditions.
     
    flyguy1
    Posts: 1675
    Joined: Wed Jun 23, 1999 9:45 am

    Re: Level to launch 5 new destinations and also a new ORY base next S18.

    Wed Nov 29, 2017 4:50 pm

    Any word on what will happen to JFK-ORY?
    727, L1011, MD80, A300, 777-200, 737-300, 737-700, 747-400, 757-200, 737-800, A320. E190, E135, 767-200, CRJ9
     
    Newbiepilot
    Posts: 3639
    Joined: Tue Aug 30, 2016 10:18 pm

    Re: Level to launch 5 new destinations and also a new ORY base next S18.

    Wed Nov 29, 2017 5:26 pm

    AirInterCRV wrote:
    CaliguyNYC wrote:
    So Open Skies, which had business class, is gone and Level, which does not have a business class, replaces it. I wonder what affects AF more a cheap business class airline or one targeting tourists?


    good question.
    The fact that so many airlines are trying their luck again and again on PAR-NYC is beyond me:
    - XL Airways is just absorbing some cheap Y seasonal surplus and isn't making money
    - La Compagnie is a non-factor
    - Norwegian: no idea how they're doing. But I would guess that with the frequencies they have, they're mostly fighting in the Icelandair / WOW league

    Now, OpenSkies is an interesting proposition, as they fly from ORY and offer an overall decent flying experience to OW loyal travelers unimpressed by AA, in particular in premium Y (and also cheap J fares). They might have the potential to play it like VS at LHR (albeit on a different scale). But... they're not making money, and now they're being replaced by an airline with less-than-daily frequencies and no J

    Meanwhile, UA and AA don't deploy much capacity and seem content with loyal O&D + people transiting through EWR and JFK, and DL/AF own the route...

    As for PTP and FDF, you could fill 10x daily 388s from PAR if you wanted to, demand is endless. Whether you would make money out of this is another story.


    I think Norwegian is a big factor between Paris and New York. Advanced purchase fares are under $400 on many of their transatlantic routes including Paris to New York. I don’t see how anyone can earn money at those prices, but that is what Norwegian can charge.
     
    tphuang
    Posts: 3375
    Joined: Tue Mar 14, 2017 2:04 pm

    Re: Level to launch 5 new destinations and also a new ORY base next S18.

    Wed Nov 29, 2017 5:52 pm

    Should that be considered really low though? I routinely see sub $500 flights direct from west coast to china. And the transcon flights drop to below $300 round trip these days.
     
    Dominion301
    Posts: 2319
    Joined: Wed Jul 20, 2016 1:48 pm

    Re: Level to launch 5 new destinations and also a new ORY base next S18.

    Wed Nov 29, 2017 6:28 pm

    NichCage wrote:
    Nice to see LEVEL in ORY. There also expanding BCN which is also good, despite the fact that PUJ is being cut with BOS being added.
    .


    The thing is reading the press release, it does not give you the impression that PUJ is cancelled.
    LEVEL flies currently from Barcelona to Buenos Aires, San Francisco (Oakland) and Punta Cana with a summer service to Los Angeles.


    Logically this seems-like a winter-seasonal type of route. They say "currently" flying to PUJ, which makes sense given it's IATA winter season. I get the impression PUJ alternates with LAX summer service.

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