^that may be true. but certainly at least Teterboro. With proper times and frequencies (4x daily), it would be a successful route. (Their last "NYC" attempt was pure Jersey at MMU and forced pax from both origins to over night it 1-3 days in the other cities--it failed pretty quickly).

greenair727 wrote:

^that may be true. but certainly at least Teterboro. With proper times and frequencies (4x daily), it would be a successful route. (Their last "NYC" attempt was pure Jersey at MMU and forced pax from both origins to over night it 1-3 days in the other cities--it failed pretty quickly).

They have tried to get into TEB but have had difficulty with it. They will definitely not be providing 4x/day service, though. They are trying to skim off the top paying passengers doing single day trips, thus the early morning departure/late evening arrival. If they ever get the ability to, I am sure LUK-MMU will be moved to TEB and BKL-TEB will be started.

flight152 wrote:

greenair727 wrote:

Speaking of BKL, trouble at OneJet. Are they out of funds? I hope Ultimate Air is still a separate entity and not part of OneJet yet so that it could be separate from this and continue to prosper at BKL...and hopefully add LGA and MDW.

http://www.post-gazette.com/local/regio ... 1808100180

There’s pretty much zero chance of that airline having the ability to acquire slots at LGA.

Irrespective of slots, there is provision for ad hoc approval of public charter flights at LGA (and DCA, as well); but I doubt it would be granted on an 'every Mon-Fri' basis.

Diff subj: Nice to see CLE-RDU back in the DL schedule after it was zeroed last week in Enilria's weekly OAG thread.

^that is good re RDU. Anyone know if SJU on UA is officially coming back? According to this webpage, dated July 10th, its listed, though it could just be sloppy work by Port Control by not deleting it from an earlier version.

http://www.clevelandairport.com/sites/d ... 072518.pdf

Re Ultimate, why was getting into TEB difficult?

from enilria's list:
DL CLE-SLC JAN 1.0>0.1[0] FEB 1.0>0.5[0]

Is this a loading error? This is a new (and long-awaited) route.

Looks like the SLC is still loaded as daily late Feb and beyond. There's speculation on Eniliria's thread that Delta trims its schedule a bit for other priorities during peak Sundance period, which is late January/early Feb. Who the heck knows? Of note, PIT and IND still appear to be daily in this time period.

Anyone know why UA4883 EWR-CLE diverted to PIT yesterday?

Overflew the runway at 4,000ft then landed and was escorted by three fire trucks to the terminal.

Forced some of our arriving traffic to switch runway ops for about 20 minutes.

F9 presser at CLE today...adding some, dropping SAN and perhaps others....No idea where.

LifetimeGS wrote:

F9 presser at CLE today...adding some, dropping SAN and perhaps others....No idea where.

These are 3 that I saw
CLE-PBI on A321
CLE-PUJ on A320
CLE-SRQ on A321

LifetimeGS wrote:

F9 presser at CLE today...adding some, dropping SAN and perhaps others....No idea where.

Dropping SAN? They’re just launching it this week.

^It being F9, I think he was kidding. What time is the presser?

Embers announced as the new dining option in the former Kay Jewelers space. Opening in November:

https://twitter.com/goingplacesCLE/stat ... 0003535874

Finally PBI is back, SRQ seems to take away from RSW. UA couldn't make PBI work with an ERJ.

Sr. Sales Manager Will Evans from F9 presented. Today 15 cities nonstop out of CLE. 3 new cities announced:

Starting:

Nov 15 3x/wk PBI--A321 (230 pax)
Dec 10 2x/wk SRQ
Jan 06 3x/wk PUJ

$49 intro fares on all three.

Also a new staffer dedicated to Cleveland events.
Stated they have the youngest fleet in the US.

^ woah, A321 for PBI seems like a lot. Nice new routes though.

Re PUJ--do we now have three carriers? Who does Swift fly for Vacation Express or Apple Vacations? And who is the other carrier that isn't Swift?

CLE-SRQ might work better since there's no low fare or good nonstop options for those residing in the Toledo and SE Michigan areas.

greenair727 wrote:

Re PUJ--do we now have three carriers? Who does Swift fly for Vacation Express or Apple Vacations? And who is the other carrier that isn't Swift?

F9 is taking over the Apple Vacation routes from whoever was flying them. They are just selling tickets on the side also.

Great to see PBI return.

greenair727 wrote:

Re PUJ--do we now have three carriers? Who does Swift fly for Vacation Express or Apple Vacations? And who is the other carrier that isn't Swift?

Swift most recently flew to PUJ and MBJ for Vacation Express. There goes those cool 767's!

https://www.travelbybob.com/flight-sche ... -schedule/

Looks like Frontier will continue services to CUN and PUJ for Apple Vacations.

http://www.applevacations.com/flight-sc ... cleveland/

Duplicate post!

How the airline world has changed. I viewed these 2 or 3 or 4 times a week flights as a bit of a joke when F9 and Allegiant first came around. Now I'm as excited for PBI to return as the next guy, even if only 3x per week, albeit with a lot of seats. Anything to avoid FLL, which has really become a tough airport, terminal car traffic is absolute grid lock at certain times.

Are F9 still operating CLE-PDX?

[*]

gravytrain wrote:

Are F9 still operating CLE-PDX?

Seasonally, typically between June and August.

Thanks, just looked at the frontier map posted on the Hopkins twitter account. SEA and PDX are omitted.

LifetimeGS wrote:

SRQ seems to take away from RSW.

That's your only take away???

gravytrain wrote:

Thanks, just looked at the frontier map posted on the Hopkins twitter account. SEA and PDX are omitted.

I’m guessing because neither of them are active right now. SEA will resume after Easter and I’m assuming PDX will return next summer.

What impact does DL's cancellation of DTW>CAK have on CLE? It's only 150 seats/day. Not sure if they would add DTW flights/seats at CLE or let the existing DL network at CAK/CLE get better load factors.

Seems like Frontier are throwing darts at the board to an extent in seeing what hits and what doesn't. Lots of chopping and changing in terms of routes and frequencies. Wouldn't be surprised to see them try routes like MCI, IND or even Cincy at some point.

^I would imagine a lot of the CAK-DTW demand would shift to CLE--don't know if there is existing capacity on CLE-DTW or if it will need to be added. For those traveling to Detroit, clearly its easier to drive to CLE than connect at MSP/ATL. But for many other trips, ATL is too far south and MSP to far north, so DTW is the preferred connecting point. Hence, I think a of demand will go to CLE. For those going to Florida or Portland/Seattle, ATL and MSP still work, but otherwise I see a shift to CLE.

gravytrain wrote:

Seems like Frontier are throwing darts at the board to an extent in seeing what hits and what doesn't. Lots of chopping and changing in terms of routes and frequencies. Wouldn't be surprised to see them try routes like MCI, IND or even Cincy at some point.

DEN-ABQ is currently the shortest nonstop route that is operated by F9, and both CLE-CVG and CLE-IND are shorter than the nonstop routes that are currently operated by F9. In addition, CVG is only 221 mi from CLE and IND is only 261 miles from CLE, whereas ABQ is 349 miles from DEN.

While F9 does operate a few other nonstop routes shorter than 400 miles such as ATL-CVG, DEN-SLC, LAS-SLC and RDU-TTN, most of F9's nonstop routes are more than 400 miles long (and much longer than CLE-CVG or CLE-IND).

G4 does operate AZA-LAS nonstop service, which is only 276 miles long and shorter than any of F9's current nonstop routes.

Unlike F9 and G4, NK does operate a few nonstop routes that are shorter than 260 miles such as FLL-MCO, FLL-TPA, LAS-LAX, LAS-PHX, and LAS-SAN.

B6 has some routes shorter than 300 miles long within the Northeastern U.S., and WN has many nonstop domestic routes that are shorter than 300 miles long.

F9 is unlikely to serve CVG or IND nonstop from CLE since F9 doesn't currently operate any nonstop routes that are that short. On the other hand, MCI is far enough from CLE for F9 to possibly add CLE-MCI nonstop service.

^MCI is an important business city for CLE. I'd rather see WN, UA, or DL from CLE or Ultimate from BKL on it than F9 three days a week.

Akron Fulton International Airport is being rebranded as "Akron Executive Airport" with plans for more hangar/office space (by eliminating a 2300-foot runway).
https://www.cleveland.com/akron/index.s ... ort_r.html

Lorain, Medina, Lost Nation, BKL, and CGF are relievers for Hopkins, but not Akron Fulton. Is it because its too small? or because its the reliever for CAK?

Breakdown of May, '18 CLE domestic-only boardings:

Airline 5/18 ... 5/19 ...LF% ... LF%

G4 . 11,982 ... 13,036 ... 84.4 .. 74.4 ... down 8.5%
AA . 34,953 ... 25,772 ... 89.5 .. 81.6 ... up 35.6%
DL . 32,917 ... 30,041 ... 89.3 .. 81.6 ... up 9.6%
F9 . 46,774 ... 56,522 ... 88.6 .. 82.5 ... down 17.2%
B6 . 12,274 ... 11,674 ... 91.8 .. 86.5 ... up 5.1%
WN . 73,552 ... 59,541 .. 86.2 .. 85.6 ... up 23.5%
NK . 34,229 ... 32,653 ... 88.8 .. 84.9 ... up 4.8%
UA . 55,421 ... 54,116 ... 86.6 .. 84.1 ... up 2.4%

Total 407,936 ... 385,071 ... 87.1 .. 82.8 ... up 5.9%

Note: AA, DL, and UA data are for mainline flights only.

Thoughts: B6 is essentially running full; unless they add a route (SJU? JFK?) their CLE growth is over until they get their new A220s in 2020. AA in a quiet way has nearly doubled their post-merger traffic. WN seems to doing well whereever they fly. UA ... well, what can you say? At least it's an up year for them.

Thanks for the info, Massey. Those are some very healthy load factors. AA’s growth in CLE is very encouraging.

masseybrown wrote:

Breakdown of May, '18 CLE domestic-only boardings:

Airline 5/18 ... 5/19 ...LF% ... LF%

Thanks for sharing the data. I assume the comparison is 5/18 vs. 5/17? Also, any way to also get data for the regional partners. I would assume UA +UAX would still be the largest carrier in CLE. Can't wait to see international traffic for June.

CLEguy wrote:

masseybrown wrote:

Breakdown of May, '18 CLE domestic-only boardings:

Airline 5/18 ... 5/19 ...LF% ... LF%

Thanks for sharing the data. I assume the comparison is 5/18 vs. 5/17? Also, any way to also get data for the regional partners. I would assume UA +UAX would still be the largest carrier in CLE. Can't wait to see international traffic for June.

Ouch! Yes, 5/17 and it's too late to correct it.

It's possible to get some regional data, but it's aggregated by operator, ExpressJet, for instance - not by which major they are flying for. Since some of the RJ operators fly for more than one airline, it's not useful data for brand comparisons.

What is the situation in Cleveland this week. Hopkins has has run 25L closed all week. This is along with runway 28 closed all summer. The runway at Burke has been closed all weekend. One runway open total at both airports. Anyone know what is going on?

Trk1 wrote:

What is the situation in Cleveland this week. Hopkins has has run 25L closed all week. This is along with runway 28 closed all summer. The runway at Burke has been closed all weekend. One runway open total at both airports. Anyone know what is going on?

Actually CLE Runway 6R/24L has been closed since 7/31 and is scheduled to remain closed until 9/15 due to construction (replacement of drainage tiles alongside of the runway) Runway 10/28 is scheduled to be closed until 11/16

Looking at flightaware, it shows arrivals and departures at BKL.

Thanks for runway update. Was at the Stadium on Friday night and saw from my seat that the Burke runway was closed. Must have reopened.

Out of curiousity, do commercial airliners ever need to use runway 10/28? Or is it mostly general aviation?

SgtBarone wrote:

Out of curiousity, do commercial airliners ever need to use runway 10/28? Or is it mostly general aviation?

Back when it was busy, it was not uncommon to run a 6/10 operation where both 6R/6L and 10 were used for arrivals during arrival pushes. Runway 10 was rarely used for departures but a 24/28 operation was also common. Most larger 737s would require the longer runways but commercial carriers can definitely accept 10/28. Nowadays, I would say that 10/28 is only really used when there are strong winds favoring the runway or when the random bizjet requests it.

Trk1 wrote:

Thanks for runway update. Was at the Stadium on Friday night and saw from my seat that the Burke runway was closed. Must have reopened.

Remember there are also parallel runways at BKL (6's/24's), so perhaps one runway was closed for maintenance.

http://aeronav.faa.gov/d-tpp/1809/05370 ... ddest=(BKL)

Thanks,

Not aware that Burke had two. Never flown from the airport or looked at an airport map

I was at Burke Sunday parking for a race. Lots of setup for the air show. Didn’t see any planes. Lots of copters taking off an landing.

Still the cleanest and nicest bathrooms in the Cleveland airport system

The tents were gone!

CLEguy wrote:

Trk1 wrote:

Thanks for runway update. Was at the Stadium on Friday night and saw from my seat that the Burke runway was closed. Must have reopened.

Remember there are also parallel runways at BKL (6's/24's), so perhaps one runway was closed for maintenance.

http://aeronav.faa.gov/d-tpp/1809/05370 ... ddest=(BKL)

Is 6R still certified and used as a runway? Someone had once told me it was no longer officially a runway. I see on the chart you sited, dated 16AUG2018, it is still a runway. Just looking to confirm.

SgtBarone wrote:

Out of curiousity, do commercial airliners ever need to use runway 10/28? Or is it mostly general aviation?

This is a LONG time ago...but I have flown into KCLE many, many times over the years. I lived in Cleveland, then flew home from Florida and North Carolina to NE Ohio for many years, too. I believe it was back in 1983 or 1984 we took off to the west on 10/28. It was a PeoplExpress 732 to KEWR. It was the only time I ever took off or landed on that runway in 50-60 ops into or out of KCLE. Just my two cents. I still remember it, though.

greenair727 wrote:

CLEguy wrote:

Trk1 wrote:

Thanks for runway update. Was at the Stadium on Friday night and saw from my seat that the Burke runway was closed. Must have reopened.

Remember there are also parallel runways at BKL (6's/24's), so perhaps one runway was closed for maintenance.

http://aeronav.faa.gov/d-tpp/1809/05370 ... ddest=(BKL)

Is 6R still certified and used as a runway? Someone had once told me it was no longer officially a runway. I see on the chart you sited, dated 16AUG2018, it is still a runway. Just looking to confirm.

Yes, definitely. It is the older of the 2 main runways but it is used a lot. When both parallels are operational. 6R is used for departures and 6L for arrivals. There is a displaced threshold when landing 6R but there is still about 8,000 feet remaining for that.

According to Allegiant's latest schedule extension, it looks like service to FLL and MYR will not be returning, and SFB is now seasonal. Seems like Spirit won the battle for MYR (and FLL for that matter, not counting UA's seasonal service).