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NickolayAv
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Wed Aug 22, 2018 3:23 pm

airbazar wrote:
NickolayAv wrote:
georgiabill wrote:
That being said does anyone think RAM would consider adding CMN-BOS-CMN to connect to their network?

Honestly, I think it's only a matter of time until that route gets announced.

Really? Never thought this would even be a market worth discussing. The majority of tourism is to Marrakesh not CMN but I can't imagine that is a big number from BOS to begin with. And from what I hear connecting at CMN is nothing short of a gamble. TP already serves CMN/RAK/FEZ from LIS but unfortunately only the JFK flight offers good connections in both direction. If TP were to add a morning departure from BOS which I hope they'll do with the A321LR, LIS would immediately become the most attractive hub for Morocco and even lots of Africa.

I understand the BOS to Morocco O/D is very small, but this is a case where BOS could be used as a hub, with some B6 feed (codeshare partners)(also really easy connection from C to E) along with some connecting traffic into Africa and S. Europe, I think that the airline could make this flight work. :bouncy:
"If you want to be a millionaire, start with a billion dollars and launch a new airline"-Richard Branson
 
LH423
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Thu Aug 23, 2018 10:24 pm

georgiabill wrote:
Butts in seat does not always equal profits. But I remember flying on SN'S DC-10"S back in the 80'S. Good loads 80 to 90% loads factors(estimating). That being said after the demise of SN another airline tried the route with MD-11'S. (sorry forget the name of said carrier) service did not last very long. That being said I wish them well and will most likely book them to fly to BRU from BOS as BRU is a very interesting city for me.
That being said does anyone think RAM would consider adding CMN-BOS-CMN to connect to their network?


The airline that took up the route after the demise of Sabena was Delsey (née VG) Airlines. They initiated routes to BOS and JFK. However, whereas SN had a network of connections, especially to west Africa, reportedly gave them a shred of profitability out of Boston (hence VG choosing it as their second route), VG only had connections to Yerevan, which may have worked well out of LAX but less so out of Boston. They routinely flew with a couple dozen pax. The whole sad experiment, not just the BOS route, lasted less than 18 months.

That makes me question the viability for Primera. The local market between Boston and Brussels is pretty small. Even on an LCC with an A321 and no direct competition, I feel they'll have a bit of an uphill battle with this one without onward connections.

LH423
« On ne voit bien qu'avec le cœur. L'essentiel est invisible pour les yeux » Antoine de Saint-Exupéry
 
airbazar
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Fri Aug 24, 2018 1:37 am

LH423 wrote:
That makes me question the viability for Primera. The local market between Boston and Brussels is pretty small. Even on an LCC with an A321 and no direct competition, I feel they'll have a bit of an uphill battle with this one without onward connections.

I agree that this will be a tricky market but these are very different times from the 80's and 90's.
People now are more comfortable self-connecting and also know that they can take a train and be in Paris in less than 1.5 hours for example and book a triangle itinerary. The information and tools to do this is literally at our fingertips and people have the knowledge to use it. Worst case BRU could work as a backdoor to get to either France or the Netherlands so it should put some pressure on DL/KL/AF fares.
 
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adamh8297
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Fri Aug 24, 2018 12:36 pm

airbazar wrote:
LH423 wrote:
That makes me question the viability for Primera. The local market between Boston and Brussels is pretty small. Even on an LCC with an A321 and no direct competition, I feel they'll have a bit of an uphill battle with this one without onward connections.

I agree that this will be a tricky market but these are very different times from the 80's and 90's.
People now are more comfortable self-connecting and also know that they can take a train and be in Paris in less than 1.5 hours for example and book a triangle itinerary. The information and tools to do this is literally at our fingertips and people have the knowledge to use it. Worst case BRU could work as a backdoor to get to either France or the Netherlands so it should put some pressure on DL/KL/AF fares.


I was going to say something similar and we a have a more technological savvy generation now earning the money to travel but will look for the best deal possible.

Its probably not the best for a family of four wanting to get to France or Netherlands comfortably but for millennials and older Gen Z's who want to get the Mainland Europe quickly and bounce around its ideal.

I don't think Delsey/VG filed any T-100's for their BOS/JFK-BRU experiment in 2002.

We will have an idea of how this may do when we see T-100's come out for BOS-CDG/STN starting at the end of the year. If we see 60's and 70's for loads in these large markets then I wouldn't be too optimistic on BRU.
Airlines flown: A3, AA, AC, AF, AM, BA, B6, CA, CO, CX, DL, EA, EL, IB, LH, MI, MQ, NH, NW, NZ, OU, PE, QF, S4, SQ, TP, UA, US, VS, WE, WN

2019: CX BOS-HKG, WE HKG-HKT, CA HKT-PEK-EWR, B6 EWR-BOS
 
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VS4ever
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Fri Aug 24, 2018 3:41 pm

adamh8297 wrote:
airbazar wrote:
LH423 wrote:
That makes me question the viability for Primera. The local market between Boston and Brussels is pretty small. Even on an LCC with an A321 and no direct competition, I feel they'll have a bit of an uphill battle with this one without onward connections.

I agree that this will be a tricky market but these are very different times from the 80's and 90's.
People now are more comfortable self-connecting and also know that they can take a train and be in Paris in less than 1.5 hours for example and book a triangle itinerary. The information and tools to do this is literally at our fingertips and people have the knowledge to use it. Worst case BRU could work as a backdoor to get to either France or the Netherlands so it should put some pressure on DL/KL/AF fares.


I was going to say something similar and we a have a more technological savvy generation now earning the money to travel but will look for the best deal possible.

Its probably not the best for a family of four wanting to get to France or Netherlands comfortably but for millennials and older Gen Z's who want to get the Mainland Europe quickly and bounce around its ideal.

I don't think Delsey/VG filed any T-100's for their BOS/JFK-BRU experiment in 2002.

We will have an idea of how this may do when we see T-100's come out for BOS-CDG/STN starting at the end of the year. If we see 60's and 70's for loads in these large markets then I wouldn't be too optimistic on BRU.


You are correct VG did not file any T-100's in 2002 ( I just downloaded as a check). The Dec T-100's are always the indicator because they are June. May can go either way and tends not to be as clear. But June should be very telling. That said if PF are doing badly, it wouldn't make sense while Oil Prices are rising to double down on BRU...
That feeling when you sit at the end of a runway, brakes are released and the raw power takes over. Now that is a thing of beauty and it never gets old.
 
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787fan8
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Fri Aug 24, 2018 5:57 pm

With KLM and Korean on the way, I have to say that I'm very intrigued by BOS's international expansion in the last few years. With that said, here are 5 international carriers that I think could add BOS in less than 5 years. These are not listed in any particular order BTW.

1. Austrian Airlines
2. LOT Polish Airlines
3. Air India
4. EVA Air
5. Air Italy
Atlanta is an incredibly cool city - Andrew Lincoln

Future Auburn graduate
 
aaflyer777
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Fri Aug 24, 2018 6:03 pm

Anyone think CI would give BOS-TPE a shot? I know they were considering it a while back. If not them I think EVA will definitely jump on BOS-TPE at some point.
 
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chrisnh
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Fri Aug 24, 2018 6:12 pm

787fan8 wrote:
With KLM and Korean on the way, I have to say that I'm very intrigued by BOS's international expansion in the last few years. With that said, here are 5 international carriers that I think could add BOS in less than 5 years. These are not listed in any particular order BTW.

1. Austrian Airlines
2. LOT Polish Airlines
3. Air India
4. EVA Air
5. Air Italy


It would be nice seeing them all once the new E expansion is done. I hope I'm alive to see it. :rotfl:
 
iyerhari
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Fri Aug 24, 2018 6:25 pm

787fan8 wrote:
With KLM and Korean on the way, I have to say that I'm very intrigued by BOS's international expansion in the last few years. With that said, here are 5 international carriers that I think could add BOS in less than 5 years. These are not listed in any particular order BTW.

1. Austrian Airlines
2. LOT Polish Airlines
3. Air India
4. EVA Air
5. Air Italy

AI chances look bleak - with their current financial situation (yes. the taxpayer will foot the bill), plus most of their adds has been on *A hubs. There could be a better chance for 9W but their financial situation is not all that good either. Too many options from most cities to India.
 
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VS4ever
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Fri Aug 24, 2018 6:35 pm

Massport CEO stepping down in November. CFO will be interim head until search for successor completed

http://www.winthroptranscript.com/2018/ ... step-down/
That feeling when you sit at the end of a runway, brakes are released and the raw power takes over. Now that is a thing of beauty and it never gets old.
 
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adamh8297
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Fri Aug 24, 2018 7:05 pm

VS4ever wrote:
adamh8297 wrote:
airbazar wrote:
I agree that this will be a tricky market but these are very different times from the 80's and 90's.
People now are more comfortable self-connecting and also know that they can take a train and be in Paris in less than 1.5 hours for example and book a triangle itinerary. The information and tools to do this is literally at our fingertips and people have the knowledge to use it. Worst case BRU could work as a backdoor to get to either France or the Netherlands so it should put some pressure on DL/KL/AF fares.


I was going to say something similar and we a have a more technological savvy generation now earning the money to travel but will look for the best deal possible.

Its probably not the best for a family of four wanting to get to France or Netherlands comfortably but for millennials and older Gen Z's who want to get the Mainland Europe quickly and bounce around its ideal.

I don't think Delsey/VG filed any T-100's for their BOS/JFK-BRU experiment in 2002.

We will have an idea of how this may do when we see T-100's come out for BOS-CDG/STN starting at the end of the year. If we see 60's and 70's for loads in these large markets then I wouldn't be too optimistic on BRU.


You are correct VG did not file any T-100's in 2002 ( I just downloaded as a check). The Dec T-100's are always the indicator because they are June. May can go either way and tends not to be as clear. But June should be very telling. That said if PF are doing badly, it wouldn't make sense while Oil Prices are rising to double down on BRU...


I checked CAA and they listed 5291 pax for BOS-STN in June - I think they are in the low 80's for Loads - Assumed 17 roundtrips and 198 seats in plane. May have been a cancellation or two though! Will CDG do better since its the primary airport yet smaller market?
Airlines flown: A3, AA, AC, AF, AM, BA, B6, CA, CO, CX, DL, EA, EL, IB, LH, MI, MQ, NH, NW, NZ, OU, PE, QF, S4, SQ, TP, UA, US, VS, WE, WN

2019: CX BOS-HKG, WE HKG-HKT, CA HKT-PEK-EWR, B6 EWR-BOS
 
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VS4ever
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Sun Aug 26, 2018 5:01 pm

On the list for excellent spotting, we have Manning field in Lynn, watching football at ground level, and up in the air all manner of arrivals going over the field. The latest being the Westjet Encore q400,
That feeling when you sit at the end of a runway, brakes are released and the raw power takes over. Now that is a thing of beauty and it never gets old.
 
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adamh8297
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Mon Aug 27, 2018 11:50 am

B6 will run over 10 round trips on BOS-SMF during Xmas/New Year's.
Airlines flown: A3, AA, AC, AF, AM, BA, B6, CA, CO, CX, DL, EA, EL, IB, LH, MI, MQ, NH, NW, NZ, OU, PE, QF, S4, SQ, TP, UA, US, VS, WE, WN

2019: CX BOS-HKG, WE HKG-HKT, CA HKT-PEK-EWR, B6 EWR-BOS
 
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NickolayAv
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Mon Aug 27, 2018 2:55 pm

adamh8297 wrote:
B6 will run over 10 round trips on BOS-SMF during Xmas/New Year's.

Is there any specific reason as to why?
"If you want to be a millionaire, start with a billion dollars and launch a new airline"-Richard Branson
 
airbazar
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Mon Aug 27, 2018 3:25 pm

NickolayAv wrote:
adamh8297 wrote:
B6 will run over 10 round trips on BOS-SMF during Xmas/New Year's.

Is there any specific reason as to why?

My guess would be ski traffic to Squaw Valley which is on the Ikon pass, just like the new route which serves Steamboat Springs. Still waiting for BOS-BZN :)
But if that is the reason, why not fly directly into Reno?
 
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VS4ever
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Mon Aug 27, 2018 3:45 pm

airbazar wrote:
NickolayAv wrote:
adamh8297 wrote:
B6 will run over 10 round trips on BOS-SMF during Xmas/New Year's.

Is there any specific reason as to why?

My guess would be ski traffic to Squaw Valley which is on the Ikon pass, just like the new route which serves Steamboat Springs. Still waiting for BOS-BZN :)
But if that is the reason, why not fly directly into Reno?


SMF is close, but not that close, plus you have to go up Donner pass to get there, when RNO is already pretty much at that height. This does seem a little odd, especially if the weather is bad. B6 will get you to SMF, but you better know how to handle chains to get up to Squaw Valley etc. cause CHP will not let you up there without them,
That feeling when you sit at the end of a runway, brakes are released and the raw power takes over. Now that is a thing of beauty and it never gets old.
 
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adamh8297
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Mon Aug 27, 2018 5:01 pm

airbazar wrote:
NickolayAv wrote:
adamh8297 wrote:
B6 will run over 10 round trips on BOS-SMF during Xmas/New Year's.

Is there any specific reason as to why?

My guess would be ski traffic to Squaw Valley which is on the Ikon pass, just like the new route which serves Steamboat Springs. Still waiting for BOS-BZN :)
But if that is the reason, why not fly directly into Reno?


I think its more VFR and to/from college traffic.
Airlines flown: A3, AA, AC, AF, AM, BA, B6, CA, CO, CX, DL, EA, EL, IB, LH, MI, MQ, NH, NW, NZ, OU, PE, QF, S4, SQ, TP, UA, US, VS, WE, WN

2019: CX BOS-HKG, WE HKG-HKT, CA HKT-PEK-EWR, B6 EWR-BOS
 
iyerhari
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Tue Aug 28, 2018 7:26 pm

BOS July-2018 numbers are out. BOS is inching close to 4M pax and just 67 pax (YES!) shy of touching 4M.

Jul-18 Jul-18 Difference
Domestic Charter Passenger 422 728 -42.03%
Domestic Commuter Passenger 215,387 190,652 12.97%
Domestic Jet Passenger 2,975,522 2,717,994 9.47%
Total Domestic Passengers 3,191,331 2,909,374 9.69% Wow!

International
Bermuda/Bahamas/Caribbean 96,843 91,545 5.79%
Canada 107,351 105,080 2.16%
Central America 25,654 22,160 15.77%
Europe 449,310 436,536 2.93%
Middle East 58,653 57,977 1.17%
South America 10,628 4,354 144.10%
Trans-Pacific 50,461 46,673 8.12%
Total International passengers 798,900 764,325 4.52%

General Aviation 9,702 9,874 -1.74%
Total Airport pax 3,999,933 3,683,573 8.59%

Comparisons to MSP on a YTD basis:

BOS MSP-BOS MSP
2,576,261 108,549 2,684,810
2,605,207 105,812 2,711,019
3,197,326 213,541 3,410,867
3,508,607 (515,345) 2,993,262
3,705,129 (477,639) 3,227,490
3,843,131 (327,466) 3,515,665
3,999,933 (334,925) 3,665,008

23,435,594 (1,227,473) 22,208,121

2018 is going to be another BIG YEAR for Logan. Enjoy!
 
clrd4t8koff
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Tue Aug 28, 2018 9:06 pm

787fan8 wrote:
With KLM and Korean on the way, I have to say that I'm very intrigued by BOS's international expansion in the last few years. With that said, here are 5 international carriers that I think could add BOS in less than 5 years. These are not listed in any particular order BTW.

1. Austrian Airlines
2. LOT Polish Airlines
3. Air India
4. EVA Air
5. Air Italy


While I'd love to see all of them at BOS, I really want to make sure the current and newly announced flights have time to mature and survive, and even go daily (KL & KE).
 
aaflyer777
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Thu Aug 30, 2018 12:18 pm

Well it appears BOS has gained another transatlantic destination for next summer, Primera will be launching 4x weekly flights to Berlin starting June 9 using 737 MAXs

https://www.flightglobal.com/news/artic ... in-451525/
 
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tlecam
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Thu Aug 30, 2018 1:23 pm

I just saw the same thing. I did not see that coming.

It’s been discussed numerous times; Berlin is an interesting city. It is huge, but the demographics, plus history, leave it with fewer flights. I’m not sure I’d use the word under-served, because the economy hasn’t been there over the past 3 decades to support lots of flights. Forward looking, however, I do think it will see more growth. I just read a report indicating strong growth in life sciences, biotech, and IT in the coming decades.

The Primera flight is probably the right model to begin flights to Boston. I don’t think anyone could make the economics of a wide body with business class work. I doubt LH will respond, but I suspect that they’ll be watching.
BOS-LGA-JFK | A:319/20/21, 332/3, 346 || B:717, 735, 737, 738, 739, 752, 753, 762, 763, 764, 787, 772, 744 || MD80, MD90
 
B752OS
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Thu Aug 30, 2018 1:30 pm

clrd4t8koff wrote:
787fan8 wrote:
With KLM and Korean on the way, I have to say that I'm very intrigued by BOS's international expansion in the last few years. With that said, here are 5 international carriers that I think could add BOS in less than 5 years. These are not listed in any particular order BTW.

1. Austrian Airlines
2. LOT Polish Airlines
3. Air India
4. EVA Air
5. Air Italy


While I'd love to see all of them at BOS, I really want to make sure the current and newly announced flights have time to mature and survive, and even go daily (KL & KE).


I agree. Hopefully 5 years from now all of the current carriers will be able to maintain their services. Always nice to add service, but Logan is getting to the point where there's not a whole lot left in Europe and Asia to serve. You'd have to think Asia is going to be tapped out once KE starts up. Now that KL is coming plus the seasonal adds to BRU and TXL, not much is left in Europe to be served.
 
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VS4ever
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Thu Aug 30, 2018 1:43 pm

tlecam wrote:
I just saw the same thing. I did not see that coming.

It’s been discussed numerous times; Berlin is an interesting city. It is huge, but the demographics, plus history, leave it with fewer flights. I’m not sure I’d use the word under-served, because the economy hasn’t been there over the past 3 decades to support lots of flights. Forward looking, however, I do think it will see more growth. I just read a report indicating strong growth in life sciences, biotech, and IT in the coming decades.

The Primera flight is probably the right model to begin flights to Boston. I don’t think anyone could make the economics of a wide body with business class work. I doubt LH will respond, but I suspect that they’ll be watching.


Flights are loaded on Primera's site

TXL 18.15 - 21.05 BOS 7M9 (2,3,5,7)
BOS 22.35 - 12.05 TXL 7M9 (2,3,5,7)

So as far as I can tell there are 0 gates available for a 21.05 arrival..so that's going to be interesting. along with the fact that even with a minor delay, 3 times a week there will be 3 Primera aircraft on the ground at BOS.

In other news, got excited yesterday when WW announced they were flying to DEL from BOS, only to find that it's a tag on from KEF on the regular flight :(
That feeling when you sit at the end of a runway, brakes are released and the raw power takes over. Now that is a thing of beauty and it never gets old.
 
hinckley
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Thu Aug 30, 2018 1:44 pm

B752OS wrote:
I agree. Hopefully 5 years from now all of the current carriers will be able to maintain their services. Always nice to add service, but Logan is getting to the point where there's not a whole lot left in Europe and Asia to serve. You'd have to think Asia is going to be tapped out once KE starts up. Now that KL is coming plus the seasonal adds to BRU and TXL, not much is left in Europe to be served.


Since the entry of JL six years ago, I can't believe that there's another major airport in the world that has seen the growth of international carriers that Boston has seen. Maybe we'll see some additional new services to TPE and one or two more to South America, but after five or six years of extraordinary growth, BOS is due for a period for all the new services to get established and mature.
 
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NickolayAv
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Thu Aug 30, 2018 3:25 pm

VS4ever wrote:
tlecam wrote:
I just saw the same thing. I did not see that coming.

It’s been discussed numerous times; Berlin is an interesting city. It is huge, but the demographics, plus history, leave it with fewer flights. I’m not sure I’d use the word under-served, because the economy hasn’t been there over the past 3 decades to support lots of flights. Forward looking, however, I do think it will see more growth. I just read a report indicating strong growth in life sciences, biotech, and IT in the coming decades.

The Primera flight is probably the right model to begin flights to Boston. I don’t think anyone could make the economics of a wide body with business class work. I doubt LH will respond, but I suspect that they’ll be watching.


Flights are loaded on Primera's site

TXL 18.15 - 21.05 BOS 7M9 (2,3,5,7)
BOS 22.35 - 12.05 TXL 7M9 (2,3,5,7)

So as far as I can tell there are 0 gates available for a 21.05 arrival..so that's going to be interesting. along with the fact that even with a minor delay, 3 times a week there will be 3 Primera aircraft on the ground at BOS.

In other news, got excited yesterday when WW announced they were flying to DEL from BOS, only to find that it's a tag on from KEF on the regular flight :(

Congratulations Primera. In one summer you have added the same amount of TATL flights than DL has from it's focus city. This leaves very few, very small markets for DL to expand without competition, when they announce Boston to be a hub. BRU and TXL were some of the destinations I was expecting from DL. Pretty much any market from here on out will have competition from another airline.
"If you want to be a millionaire, start with a billion dollars and launch a new airline"-Richard Branson
 
iyerhari
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Thu Aug 30, 2018 4:02 pm

NickolayAv wrote:
Congratulations Primera. In one summer you have added the same amount of TATL flights than DL has from it's focus city. This leaves very few, very small markets for DL to expand without competition, when they announce Boston to be a hub. BRU and TXL were some of the destinations I was expecting from DL. Pretty much any market from here on out will have competition from another airline.

It wouldn't be fair to compare DL to Primera. Both serve a very different customer base IMO. If you were a business customer and the business ties were that good, DL would make an entry. DL only flies seasonal from JFK which is a significantly bigger city vs. BOS. AA is scheduled to fly seasonal from PHL. The only airport in Northeast that has yearlong flights is UA from EWR. A business customer would still end up taking the alliance where his FF miles are. But then who knows strange things happen and maybe we will see even B6 enters some interesting TATL destination from BOS.
 
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chrisnh
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Thu Aug 30, 2018 4:29 pm

Not mentioned in the release is the sandwich stop in Iceland :lol:
 
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pitbosflyer
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Thu Aug 30, 2018 4:54 pm

VS4ever wrote:
So as far as I can tell there are 0 gates available for a 21.05 arrival..so that's going to be interesting. along with the fact that even with a minor delay, 3 times a week there will be 3 Primera aircraft on the ground at BOS.


Would it be a remote stand and busing situation?
A:320/21, 333, 343, 346 || B:717, 735, 737, 738, 739, 752, 753, 763, 772 || MD80, MD90 || E:145, 170, 175, 190, 195 || CR200, 700, 900
 
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VS4ever
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Thu Aug 30, 2018 6:07 pm

pitbosflyer wrote:
VS4ever wrote:
So as far as I can tell there are 0 gates available for a 21.05 arrival..so that's going to be interesting. along with the fact that even with a minor delay, 3 times a week there will be 3 Primera aircraft on the ground at BOS.


Would it be a remote stand and busing situation?


I think that's going to be an almost certainty, because there are now 14 aircraft wanting 12 gates and especially if things don't go to plan, which lets face it never actually does. 2022 cannot come soon enough...
That feeling when you sit at the end of a runway, brakes are released and the raw power takes over. Now that is a thing of beauty and it never gets old.
 
clrd4t8koff
Posts: 1659
Joined: Sun Mar 06, 2005 3:57 am

Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Thu Aug 30, 2018 6:33 pm

B752OS wrote:
clrd4t8koff wrote:
787fan8 wrote:
With KLM and Korean on the way, I have to say that I'm very intrigued by BOS's international expansion in the last few years. With that said, here are 5 international carriers that I think could add BOS in less than 5 years. These are not listed in any particular order BTW.

1. Austrian Airlines
2. LOT Polish Airlines
3. Air India
4. EVA Air
5. Air Italy


While I'd love to see all of them at BOS, I really want to make sure the current and newly announced flights have time to mature and survive, and even go daily (KL & KE).


I agree. Hopefully 5 years from now all of the current carriers will be able to maintain their services. Always nice to add service, but Logan is getting to the point where there's not a whole lot left in Europe and Asia to serve. You'd have to think Asia is going to be tapped out once KE starts up. Now that KL is coming plus the seasonal adds to BRU and TXL, not much is left in Europe to be served.


Also totally forgot about the December launch of 3U's CTU-BOS service. Crazy to think we'll have a non-stop to a secondary Chinese market (even though CTU is a huge population base).
 
AviationAddict
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Thu Aug 30, 2018 7:52 pm

I think it's time to beat the dead horse yet again and say that Massport and the Feds need to add customs to one or more of the other terminals. If they could open facilities in A and/or C that could potentially remove all the DL and most of the B6 tails from E (except for the handful of domestic flights that use E1). It certainly wouldn't solve most of the issues and probably wouldn't even solve the Primera problem but, it would be a nice start. If nothing more I feel like it's an image thing...I'd hate to be a business flyer in KE and after sitting on a plane for 15 hours be told to hang on for another 45 minutes because the DL/B6 flight from BDA was running late and is still at the gate.
 
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VS4ever
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Thu Aug 30, 2018 7:59 pm

AviationAddict wrote:
I think it's time to beat the dead horse yet again and say that Massport and the Feds need to add customs to one or more of the other terminals. If they could open facilities in A and/or C that could potentially remove all the DL and most of the B6 tails from E (except for the handful of domestic flights that use E1). It certainly wouldn't solve most of the issues and probably wouldn't even solve the Primera problem but, it would be a nice start. If nothing more I feel like it's an image thing...I'd hate to be a business flyer in KE and after sitting on a plane for 15 hours be told to hang on for another 45 minutes because the DL/B6 flight from BDA was running late and is still at the gate.


Noble thoughts I grant you and I am of a similar opinion, however Massport have already agreed to give B6 long term preferential treatment to E1, as part of the B6 30 gate strategy, so C isn't happening any time soon. A is an interesting one. DL I am sure would love not having to tow their big stuff around from E all the time, but the only place to put a sterile area needed is in the satellite, which would take up a huge chunk of real estate. in the A13-A17 section. With the expansion(s) of E coming, that's going to be the focus, and I have not seen anything on the capital project list to even note that this is even being discussed. Shame because in many ways it makes sense.
That feeling when you sit at the end of a runway, brakes are released and the raw power takes over. Now that is a thing of beauty and it never gets old.
 
AviationAddict
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Thu Aug 30, 2018 8:12 pm

I doubt it will ever happen, or at least not in the next decade but, we can always hope and dream!
 
FGITD
Posts: 981
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Thu Aug 30, 2018 8:38 pm

VS4ever wrote:
AviationAddict wrote:
I think it's time to beat the dead horse yet again and say that Massport and the Feds need to add customs to one or more of the other terminals. If they could open facilities in A and/or C that could potentially remove all the DL and most of the B6 tails from E (except for the handful of domestic flights that use E1). It certainly wouldn't solve most of the issues and probably wouldn't even solve the Primera problem but, it would be a nice start. If nothing more I feel like it's an image thing...I'd hate to be a business flyer in KE and after sitting on a plane for 15 hours be told to hang on for another 45 minutes because the DL/B6 flight from BDA was running late and is still at the gate.


Noble thoughts I grant you and I am of a similar opinion, however Massport have already agreed to give B6 long term preferential treatment to E1, as part of the B6 30 gate strategy, so C isn't happening any time soon. A is an interesting one. DL I am sure would love not having to tow their big stuff around from E all the time, but the only place to put a sterile area needed is in the satellite, which would take up a huge chunk of real estate. in the A13-A17 section. With the expansion(s) of E coming, that's going to be the focus, and I have not seen anything on the capital project list to even note that this is even being discussed. Shame because in many ways it makes sense.



Also a matter of staffing. Massport could build 5 new terminals, all with CBP facilities. Doesn't mean the federal government is going to staff them.
 
airbazar
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Fri Aug 31, 2018 12:28 pm

VS4ever wrote:
Noble thoughts I grant you and I am of a similar opinion, however Massport have already agreed to give B6 long term preferential treatment to E1, as part of the B6 30 gate strategy, so C isn't happening any time soon. A is an interesting one. DL I am sure would love not having to tow their big stuff around from E all the time, but the only place to put a sterile area needed is in the satellite, which would take up a huge chunk of real estate. in the A13-A17 section. With the expansion(s) of E coming, that's going to be the focus, and I have not seen anything on the capital project list to even note that this is even being discussed. Shame because in many ways it makes sense.

C doesn't really need it. If the need to have international arrivals in C ever arises it would be a lot less expensive to just build a sterile corridor from a few gates closest to E straight into the CBP facility in E.
Once E expands it will be very difficult to justify building another CBP facility, hence why Massport is focusing on linking all terminals airside instead.
As for the dream of having a CBP facility in A, as I've mentioned before it could be located underground, parallel to the existing passenger tunnel between the main terminal and the satellite terminal. My hope is that in the future technology will render current-day CBP facilities, irrelevant. That might not be for our generation but at the speed that technology moves, who knows.
 
cloudboy
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Fri Aug 31, 2018 12:38 pm

I don't know the internal layout of the terminals, but there already is a lower level hallway between C and E. Right now I believe it is outside security (I havn't been down there in a while), but I imagine it wouldn't be that difficult to convert to being behind security. It wouldn't be terribly convenient, but it might do the trick temporarily until the E terminal is expanded.
"Six becoming three doesn't create more Americans that want to fly." -Adam Pilarski
 
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chrisnh
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Fri Aug 31, 2018 12:44 pm

clrd4t8koff wrote:

Also totally forgot about the December launch of 3U's CTU-BOS service. Crazy to think we'll have a non-stop to a secondary Chinese market (even though CTU is a huge population base).


I think BOS is the envy of so many other airports for the roll it's been on since 2012 with JAL. As for this CTU-BOS service, I've seen nothing official aside from them saying they have plans to launch the service with A350s (the first of which is very, very colorful and filled with----you guessed it----pandas). :lol:
 
B752OS
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Fri Aug 31, 2018 2:12 pm

The eventual plane for Terminal E is to add 5 wide-body gates (with dual jet bridges) and 2 narrow body gates - phase 1 which is supposed to be completed by 2021 is adding 4 new wide body gates. Ideally, Massport would have found a way to move the Delta and JetBlue hangars, the economy parking lot and the State Police barracks. That would have opened things up a bit more and they could add an additional 8 wide body gates (this would allow enough space to park 4-5 wide body planes). That way Terminal E would have 16 wide body gates and 3 narrow body gates (this factors in the 1 gate in E that B6 is getting).

But as others have stated, unless the staffing is there, it doesn't matter how much you expand.
 
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VS4ever
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Sat Sep 01, 2018 1:52 pm

chrisnh wrote:
clrd4t8koff wrote:

Also totally forgot about the December launch of 3U's CTU-BOS service. Crazy to think we'll have a non-stop to a secondary Chinese market (even though CTU is a huge population base).


I think BOS is the envy of so many other airports for the roll it's been on since 2012 with JAL. As for this CTU-BOS service, I've seen nothing official aside from them saying they have plans to launch the service with A350s (the first of which is very, very colorful and filled with----you guessed it----pandas). :lol:


Yeah, i've tried looking at booking this flight and it's not bookable as far as I can tell, so I agree, I have my doubts on this one. If it comes off at all, I will be pleasantly surprised, so the focus goes to PF flying to TXL and BRU :)
That feeling when you sit at the end of a runway, brakes are released and the raw power takes over. Now that is a thing of beauty and it never gets old.
 
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adamh8297
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Sat Sep 01, 2018 3:14 pm

VS4ever wrote:
chrisnh wrote:
clrd4t8koff wrote:

Also totally forgot about the December launch of 3U's CTU-BOS service. Crazy to think we'll have a non-stop to a secondary Chinese market (even though CTU is a huge population base).


I think BOS is the envy of so many other airports for the roll it's been on since 2012 with JAL. As for this CTU-BOS service, I've seen nothing official aside from them saying they have plans to launch the service with A350s (the first of which is very, very colorful and filled with----you guessed it----pandas). :lol:


Yeah, i've tried looking at booking this flight and it's not bookable as far as I can tell, so I agree, I have my doubts on this one. If it comes off at all, I will be pleasantly surprised, so the focus goes to PF flying to TXL and BRU :)


3U may not have approval from US DOT yet. Our orange-tanned friend in DC may not be making things easy with the tariffs etc.

Pumped about TXL but leery about its operational performance. If its summer only it should be OK. I can see US point of sale growing on this one due to what Berlin offers. Berlin is an easier sell to Millennials than Brussels in my opinion.

There's been a lot of debate about BRU/TXL but assuming they run these routes about 6 months a year equals 39.3K seats for each destination. BOS-BRU was 31.8K in 2011 and BOS-BER was 26.4K in the same year. My guess those numbers are higher in recent years with the increased service (especially LCC service) that has come in.


adamh8297 wrote:
May as well predict some route announcements for 2018

B6 BOS-HAV
B6 BOS-CVG
B6 BOS-ROC
B6 BOS-ANU
AV BOS-SAL
KE BOS-ICN (2019 start)
WN BOS-SAT
Q6 BOS-SJO
DY BOS-FCO (2019 start)
DY BOS-AMS (2019 start)


Batting .300 so far this year and was right on additional AMS service. Still a chance DY adds more Europe and the possible B6 domestic additions. I don't know what I was thinking with Volaris Costa Rica!
Airlines flown: A3, AA, AC, AF, AM, BA, B6, CA, CO, CX, DL, EA, EL, IB, LH, MI, MQ, NH, NW, NZ, OU, PE, QF, S4, SQ, TP, UA, US, VS, WE, WN

2019: CX BOS-HKG, WE HKG-HKT, CA HKT-PEK-EWR, B6 EWR-BOS
 
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VS4ever
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Sun Sep 02, 2018 2:09 am

adamh8297 wrote:
May as well predict some route announcements for 2018

B6 BOS-HAV
B6 BOS-CVG
B6 BOS-ROC
B6 BOS-ANU
AV BOS-SAL
KE BOS-ICN (2019 start)
WN BOS-SAT
Q6 BOS-SJO
DY BOS-FCO (2019 start)
DY BOS-AMS (2019 start)


Batting .300 so far this year and was right on additional AMS service. Still a chance DY adds more Europe and the possible B6 domestic additions. I don't know what I was thinking with Volaris Costa Rica![/quote]

Keep that kind of average up, and the Marlins are going to come calling, easy flight to FLL on B6... just saying.. although i agree Volaris would have been a little out of left field (to keep up the baseball analogy) , but with Massport right now, never say never. I can't wait to see what the summer loads looked like for this year and I am excited about what's to come in 19, even the Mid East is rebounding. The growth will continue, because well. Massport think they are ultimately able to shove through around 70m out of the airport, if you use their math. Realistically though, when B6 get access to all 30 gates and their 200 departures a day, DL get all of theirs (20 1/2) with the share from WS and up to 150, the extra gates in E, I can see close to 50m being possible. It's really quite insane, unless the bubble bursts of course, which it could do in a number of ways. Time will tell. But next year will see over 4m pax in at least one month, if not two, it proves despite it's limitiations, BOS is a place folks want to fly to/through.
That feeling when you sit at the end of a runway, brakes are released and the raw power takes over. Now that is a thing of beauty and it never gets old.
 
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VS4ever
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Sun Sep 02, 2018 3:24 pm

Can’t copy the info on my phone but it looks like from the OAG thread that Level are starting earlier next year and maybe increasing a little. Am I reading that right?
That feeling when you sit at the end of a runway, brakes are released and the raw power takes over. Now that is a thing of beauty and it never gets old.
 
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NickolayAv
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Sun Sep 02, 2018 3:35 pm

VS4ever wrote:
Can’t copy the info on my phone but it looks like from the OAG thread that Level are starting earlier next year and maybe increasing a little. Am I reading that right?

Level is currently year round, they will be flying here this winter but reduce from 4 to 3 weekly frequencies, but it does seem like they are adding frequencies next year. Can't find the additions online yet as flights are only bookable through March.
"If you want to be a millionaire, start with a billion dollars and launch a new airline"-Richard Branson
 
Dieuwer
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Sun Sep 02, 2018 7:09 pm

Not sure why adamh8297 thinks there is a DY BOS-AMS or BOS-FCO flight. There ain't.
 
bagoldex
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Sun Sep 02, 2018 7:23 pm

Dieuwer wrote:
Not sure why adamh8297 thinks there is a DY BOS-AMS or BOS-FCO flight. There ain't.


Reading is fundamental ... "May as well predict some route announcements for 2018"

He was correct about the additional service to AMS but predicted the wrong airline.
 
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adamh8297
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Sun Sep 02, 2018 7:51 pm

NickolayAv wrote:
VS4ever wrote:
Can’t copy the info on my phone but it looks like from the OAG thread that Level are starting earlier next year and maybe increasing a little. Am I reading that right?

Level is currently year round, they will be flying here this winter but reduce from 4 to 3 weekly frequencies, but it does seem like they are adding frequencies next year. Can't find the additions online yet as flights are only bookable through March.


Level started at 2 weekly then went to three mid-summer and stays that way through the winter (though the days switch in late October).

It looks like its going to 4 weekly based on the OAG thread. 0.6 usually equals 4 weekly depends on the amount of days in the month and what days they fall on.
Airlines flown: A3, AA, AC, AF, AM, BA, B6, CA, CO, CX, DL, EA, EL, IB, LH, MI, MQ, NH, NW, NZ, OU, PE, QF, S4, SQ, TP, UA, US, VS, WE, WN

2019: CX BOS-HKG, WE HKG-HKT, CA HKT-PEK-EWR, B6 EWR-BOS
 
georgiabill
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Sun Sep 02, 2018 10:22 pm

Does anyone else think a LP LIM-BOS-LIM 3 or 4 weekly might be considered by LP? Perhaps making it a SCL-LIM-BOS-LIM-SCL routing perhaps starting in 2020.
 
Dieuwer
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Sun Sep 02, 2018 10:28 pm

bagoldex wrote:
Dieuwer wrote:
Not sure why adamh8297 thinks there is a DY BOS-AMS or BOS-FCO flight. There ain't.


Reading is fundamental ... "May as well predict some route announcements for 2018"

He was correct about the additional service to AMS but predicted the wrong airline.


Damn. I hoped he had a super secret crystal ball...
 
airbazar
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Mon Sep 03, 2018 12:49 pm

Is MUC-BOS now the most desirable route for LCC's?
The fares are crazy high but MUC has no slots for a new airline so if a Norwegian or Primera want to enter the market they will probably have to wait until the 3rd runway opens at MUC. Coincidentally, that should be at about the same time that terminal E would be getting additional gates.
 
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adamh8297
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Re: Boston aviation - 2018

Mon Sep 03, 2018 8:52 pm

airbazar wrote:
Is MUC-BOS now the most desirable route for LCC's?
The fares are crazy high but MUC has no slots for a new airline so if a Norwegian or Primera want to enter the market they will probably have to wait until the 3rd runway opens at MUC. Coincidentally, that should be at about the same time that terminal E would be getting additional gates.


Due to it's larger market size and basket case incumbent carrier, BOS-FCO would be more desirable for the LCCs though at slightly under 4100 miles it would probably be DY or LEVEL.

I'd rather compete against AZ than LH.
Airlines flown: A3, AA, AC, AF, AM, BA, B6, CA, CO, CX, DL, EA, EL, IB, LH, MI, MQ, NH, NW, NZ, OU, PE, QF, S4, SQ, TP, UA, US, VS, WE, WN

2019: CX BOS-HKG, WE HKG-HKT, CA HKT-PEK-EWR, B6 EWR-BOS

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