Moderators: richierich, ua900, PanAm_DC10, hOMSaR
Portlander wrote:Best thing to do is click on the triangle above the post and ask directly.Wonder if SQ22 or any other moderator could add BGR and PSM to the thread title seeing both airports are larger than Worcester and New Haven? Maybe ORH has now passed PSM (CY17) thanks to JetBlue.
Fex180 wrote:paysonmt77 wrote:I just pulled a quick United schedule to ORD and very shocked on the lift from various airports. July 14th to July 21st sat to sat flights.
MHT just 2 flights on CRJ 200- 100 seats available for purchase. No AA to ORD, SWA to MDW
BTV 5 flights A320, CRJ200(3), 737-700, 426 seats available for purchase. AA to ORD
BGR 3 flights CRJ 700, A319, E175, 264 seats available for purchase. AA to ORD
PWM 4 flights A320, E175, A319, E145 398 seats available for purchase. AA to ORD, SWA to MDW
Funny that there are more seats between ORD and BTV than MHT or PWM. Is there some kind of business connection between Burlington and Chicago that bumps demand for seats?
pwm2txlhopper wrote:Looks like United has reintrouduced mainline from ORD-PWM this summer season. The late evening flight 1610 has been A319 the last few days.
While they've upgauged EWR and IAD to A320 and -319' during summer season for the last two years, this is is the first UA mainline on ORD-PWM since 2001-2002ish. Last summer they upgraded to E170. That had been the largest UA equipment to ORD for quite a few years. The last time UA flew PWM-ORD, they were flying 727-200's and 737-500.
Also, UA1986, the late evening IAD-PWM, and early morning PWM-IAD is back to A320 for the season.
mjgbtv wrote:Fex180 wrote:paysonmt77 wrote:I just pulled a quick United schedule to ORD and very shocked on the lift from various airports. July 14th to July 21st sat to sat flights.
MHT just 2 flights on CRJ 200- 100 seats available for purchase. No AA to ORD, SWA to MDW
BTV 5 flights A320, CRJ200(3), 737-700, 426 seats available for purchase. AA to ORD
BGR 3 flights CRJ 700, A319, E175, 264 seats available for purchase. AA to ORD
PWM 4 flights A320, E175, A319, E145 398 seats available for purchase. AA to ORD, SWA to MDW
Funny that there are more seats between ORD and BTV than MHT or PWM. Is there some kind of business connection between Burlington and Chicago that bumps demand for seats?
Nothing that I can think of. I expect it's mostly westbound connections, and if you add in the MDW seats the numbers are probably more in proportion. The AA to ORD flight at BTV is new and I believe is just one E145 daily.
cloudboy wrote:Burlington also pulls travelers from Quebec, as it is cheaper an easier to fly between two domestic points. not as bad as it once was, but it still is cheaper and easier.
tphuang wrote:the crazy thing about that is that WN is not successful out of BOS to places outside of their fortress hubs. And they are not getting more gates. Seems like a bad strategy to me.
tphuang wrote:the crazy thing about that is that WN is not successful out of BOS to places outside of their fortress hubs. And they are not getting more gates. Seems like a bad strategy to me.
Fex180 wrote:cloudboy wrote:Burlington also pulls travelers from Quebec, as it is cheaper an easier to fly between two domestic points. not as bad as it once was, but it still is cheaper and easier.
Isn't that one of the big reasons Porter operates out of BTV? or are do they fly that route to serve winter ski tourism?
iyerhari wrote:tphuang wrote:the crazy thing about that is that WN is not successful out of BOS to places outside of their fortress hubs. And they are not getting more gates. Seems like a bad strategy to me.
IMO, WN may not leave BOS - it is an important station for them at-least to link the dots. They may not be happy with what they have but being #4 in BOS in rankings is not helpful either.
LotsaRunway wrote:iyerhari wrote:tphuang wrote:the crazy thing about that is that WN is not successful out of BOS to places outside of their fortress hubs. And they are not getting more gates. Seems like a bad strategy to me.
IMO, WN may not leave BOS - it is an important station for them at-least to link the dots. They may not be happy with what they have but being #4 in BOS in rankings is not helpful either.
I agree that it is an important station for the rest of the WN network, even if the BOS crowd doesn't take to them. WN still seems to still want to grow at BOS, but I can't imagine they are currently making much money there. They need to run competitive fares with B6 and NK, and operating cost have got to be higher at Logan than at places like PVD and MHT. There is also the delay factor and extra fuel costs for lining up for take off and being put into an in-flight holding patterns during congestion. All reasons why the old WN avoided big airports, but the new WN learned they couldn't be without them to complete their domestic network.
I will add that it would be far easier for competitors to encroach on WN turf in MHT and PVD than it will be for WN to lucratively grow at BOS, at least in the near term. WN has themselves in a funny situation, trimming MHT to try to keep planes full at BOS that need the extra revenue to make those flights viable.
LotsaRunway wrote:Speaking of MHT, with the recent word that PrimeAir (Amazon) is pulling out of PVD for BDL, it seems to open the door for MHT or PSM to make a play for some PrimeAir Boston area business. BDL will fit Amazon needs for the that particular region, but I would suspect they would like to regain access closer to Boston in the near future. I'm sure the MHT aggressive management is all over this.
iyerhari wrote:LotsaRunway wrote:iyerhari wrote:IMO, WN may not leave BOS - it is an important station for them at-least to link the dots. They may not be happy with what they have but being #4 in BOS in rankings is not helpful either.
I agree that it is an important station for the rest of the WN network, even if the BOS crowd doesn't take to them. WN still seems to still want to grow at BOS, but I can't imagine they are currently making much money there. They need to run competitive fares with B6 and NK, and operating cost have got to be higher at Logan than at places like PVD and MHT. There is also the delay factor and extra fuel costs for lining up for take off and being put into an in-flight holding patterns during congestion. All reasons why the old WN avoided big airports, but the new WN learned they couldn't be without them to complete their domestic network.
I will add that it would be far easier for competitors to encroach on WN turf in MHT and PVD than it will be for WN to lucratively grow at BOS, at least in the near term. WN has themselves in a funny situation, trimming MHT to try to keep planes full at BOS that need the extra revenue to make those flights viable.
The other large competitors benefit from BOS thanks to a large intl. codeshare partners in addition to intl. flights by themselves. The only route I believe WN has a complete monopoly with them is STL and I am surprised neither DL or B6 have picked up that route. I am not counting MDW, DAL, as there are multiple carriers on the primary airport side. But nevertheless, WN retrenching ops from BOS to MHT, PVD does not seem likely. BOS is an important city and growing and for the next foreseeable future, Logan will continue to grow.
Fex180 wrote:Was using the wayback machine looking at the MHT website (flymanchester.com) from March of 2008. Made me realize how drastically WN has cut service at MHT in the past 10 years
from the "nonstop destinations" page March 2008
"Southwest Airlines
11 jets a day to Baltimore-Washington
6 jets a day to Philadelphia
5 jets a day to Chicago-Midway
5 jet a day to Orlando
3 jets a day to Tampa
1 jet a day to Las Vegas
1 jet a day to Phoenix
1 Saturday-only jet to Ft. Lauderdale beginning March 8th; Daily Ft. Lauderdale flights begin May 10th "
source : https://web.archive.org/web/20080330005 ... ations.php
I think MHT now is down to 6x daily to BWI, 3x daily to MDW, 1x daily to MCO and less than daily service to TPA.
PortlandMEguy wrote:Looks line Southwest's Saturday Seasonal PWM-MCO is cut for the time being based on their newest schedule extension.
chrisnh wrote:I wonder whether going to BOS was a smart move for them. It seems like their whole strategy of entering big-city airports represented way more misses than hits.
Revelation wrote:chrisnh wrote:I wonder whether going to BOS was a smart move for them. It seems like their whole strategy of entering big-city airports represented way more misses than hits.
Instead of what, defending the realm from the MHTs, PVDs, and ISPs of the world while B6 becomes totally dominant at BOS and JFK? Might make for an interesting MBA project.
Fex180 wrote:Revelation wrote:chrisnh wrote:I wonder whether going to BOS was a smart move for them. It seems like their whole strategy of entering big-city airports represented way more misses than hits.
Instead of what, defending the realm from the MHTs, PVDs, and ISPs of the world while B6 becomes totally dominant at BOS and JFK? Might make for an interesting MBA project.
There's no reason WN can't have a token presence at BOS, it certainly does them no harm. But as of right now they seem very uninterested in basically all of their New England markets, especially MHT and PWM.
Fex180 wrote:Revelation wrote:chrisnh wrote:I wonder whether going to BOS was a smart move for them. It seems like their whole strategy of entering big-city airports represented way more misses than hits.
Instead of what, defending the realm from the MHTs, PVDs, and ISPs of the world while B6 becomes totally dominant at BOS and JFK? Might make for an interesting MBA project.
There's no reason WN can't have a token presence at BOS, it certainly does them no harm. But as of right now they seem very uninterested in basically all of their New England markets, especially MHT and PWM.
paysonmt77 wrote:Southwest usually only flies during March and April Saturday only MCO-PWM, we will have to wait till March schedule comes out. They don't fly to MCO in February, which I could not understand. B6 flew to MCO on a daily basis and yielded 90+, but flying E-190 does not make any money. Frontier plans to expand to TPA and RSW at some point.
RKDFlier wrote:PortlandMEguy wrote:Looks line Southwest's Saturday Seasonal PWM-MCO is cut for the time being based on their newest schedule extension.
Could this open the door for Frontier to go year round?
Fex180 wrote:Revelation wrote:chrisnh wrote:I wonder whether going to BOS was a smart move for them. It seems like their whole strategy of entering big-city airports represented way more misses than hits.
Instead of what, defending the realm from the MHTs, PVDs, and ISPs of the world while B6 becomes totally dominant at BOS and JFK? Might make for an interesting MBA project.
There's no reason WN can't have a token presence at BOS, it certainly does them no harm. But as of right now they seem very uninterested in all of their New England markets, especially MHT and PWM.
slcdeltarumd11 wrote:I wouldn't be surprised if we see a record summer at BTV. The airport seems busier , there have been a few more flight delta to JFK, AA to ORD.
Fex180 wrote:paysonmt77 wrote:Southwest usually only flies during March and April Saturday only MCO-PWM, we will have to wait till March schedule comes out. They don't fly to MCO in February, which I could not understand. B6 flew to MCO on a daily basis and yielded 90+, but flying E-190 does not make any money. Frontier plans to expand to TPA and RSW at some point.
TPA and RSW from PWM?? Seems like a bit of stretch...but then again Frontier does love the dart board
piedmontf284000 wrote:Manchester-Boston deputy airport director Thomas Malafronte said United’s decision to suspend service between Manchester and Chicago was due to fleet constraints...
http://www.wmur.com/article/united-airl ... e/22011531
No way this is gone for good. It will be back by late winter/early spring.
tomaheath wrote:I looked at tomorrow’s ORD flights from Manchester 16,12 and 32 empty seats on a CRJ200 at $418 one way.
chrisnh wrote:It was inevitable but the service was poor. Unless ORD was your destination, connecting onward was a horrible ordeal. AA might come in to serve ORD, they might not. But whether they do or don’t won’t be MHT management at work. They draw big paychecks to serves as little more than janitors of the place. They will say that economics pulled UA out of this market. But if AA steps in, they’ll beat their chests and scream, “LOOK WHAT WE DID!”