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1989worstyear
Posts: 196
Joined: Sun Dec 04, 2016 6:53 pm

Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2018

Tue Mar 27, 2018 12:35 am

osupoke07 wrote:
Here's the original Reuters report referenced in the BBJ article

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-amer ... SKBN1GZ35U

Looks to be an order of 25-30 frames, no variant specified yet. Nothing mentioned about the A350 order, but one would have to assume that it's on thin ice at the moment.

Hopefully, this means we'll see the 787-10 in American colors soon!


The -10 seems a bit big for a 763 replacement :confused:
Stuck at age 15 thanks to the certification date of the A320-200 and my parents' decision to postpone having a kid by 3 years. At least there's Dignitas...
 
User avatar
American 767
Posts: 4187
Joined: Wed May 19, 1999 7:27 am

Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2018

Tue Mar 27, 2018 12:52 am

1989worstyear wrote:
osupoke07 wrote:
Here's the original Reuters report referenced in the BBJ article

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-amer ... SKBN1GZ35U

Looks to be an order of 25-30 frames, no variant specified yet. Nothing mentioned about the A350 order, but one would have to assume that it's on thin ice at the moment.

Hopefully, this means we'll see the 787-10 in American colors soon!


The -10 seems a bit big for a 763 replacement :confused:


The -10 would be the right 77E replacement, if American decides to go all Boeing for its future wide body fleet. The 763 replacement is the 788 and the 789 depending on the routes where more capacity is needed. For example, the 788 has already replaced the 763 on the ORD-CDG route, although only seasonal, it is a 77E during the summer.
Ben Soriano
 
hkcanadaexpat
Posts: 2878
Joined: Mon Dec 10, 2012 3:33 am

Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2018

Tue Mar 27, 2018 1:29 am

Swadian wrote:
I imagine AA will put A332s on current A333 routes, or will they move 77Es or 763s to PHL and CLT?

PHL-AMS and PHL-ZRH are 763 operated as of two days ago.
 
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Runway28L
Posts: 881
Joined: Wed Sep 20, 2017 7:35 pm

Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2018

Tue Mar 27, 2018 2:55 am

osupoke07 wrote:
Here's the original Reuters report referenced in the BBJ article

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-amer ... SKBN1GZ35U

Looks to be an order of 25-30 frames, no variant specified yet. Nothing mentioned about the A350 order, but one would have to assume that it's on thin ice at the moment.

Hopefully, this means we'll see the 787-10 in American colors soon!



I agree. Seems to me like a 787-10 order. Exercising some of their current 787 options would be a nice bonus as well.
Greetings from KPIT! Check out my photos here: https://www.airliners.net/search?user=45 ... teAccepted
 
jbs2886
Posts: 1729
Joined: Wed Apr 01, 2015 9:07 pm

Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2018

Tue Mar 27, 2018 3:07 am

Runway28L wrote:
osupoke07 wrote:
Here's the original Reuters report referenced in the BBJ article

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-amer ... SKBN1GZ35U

Looks to be an order of 25-30 frames, no variant specified yet. Nothing mentioned about the A350 order, but one would have to assume that it's on thin ice at the moment.

Hopefully, this means we'll see the 787-10 in American colors soon!



I agree. Seems to me like a 787-10 order. Exercising some of their current 787 options would be a nice bonus as well.


I'm sure the order would be an exercising of options, not (1) completely new order, and (2) order from exercise of options.
 
tom02
Posts: 22
Joined: Wed Dec 26, 2012 8:02 pm

Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2018

Tue Mar 27, 2018 2:11 pm

American 767 wrote:
1989worstyear wrote:
osupoke07 wrote:
Here's the original Reuters report referenced in the BBJ article

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-amer ... SKBN1GZ35U

Looks to be an order of 25-30 frames, no variant specified yet. Nothing mentioned about the A350 order, but one would have to assume that it's on thin ice at the moment.

Hopefully, this means we'll see the 787-10 in American colors soon!


The -10 seems a bit big for a 763 replacement :confused:


The -10 would be the right 77E replacement, if American decides to go all Boeing for its future wide body fleet. The 763 replacement is the 788 and the 789 depending on the routes where more capacity is needed. For example, the 788 has already replaced the 763 on the ORD-CDG route, although only seasonal, it is a 77E during the summer.


I feel if they order the 787-10 it will be more of an A333 replacement and exercising the 789 options to replace the 77E.
 
FSDan
Posts: 1783
Joined: Mon Jan 03, 2011 5:27 pm

Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2018

Tue Mar 27, 2018 3:06 pm

hkcanadaexpat wrote:
Swadian wrote:
I imagine AA will put A332s on current A333 routes, or will they move 77Es or 763s to PHL and CLT?

PHL-AMS and PHL-ZRH are 763 operated as of two days ago.


And by this summer, there will be 9x daily 763 departures from PHL: 3x MIA, 1x SJU, 1x LIS, 1x AMS, 1x ZRH, 1x PRG, and 1x BUD. That will make PHL the 2nd largest 763 base for AA, after MIA.
This is my signature until I think of a better one.
 
FSDan
Posts: 1783
Joined: Mon Jan 03, 2011 5:27 pm

Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2018

Tue Mar 27, 2018 3:07 pm

American 767 wrote:
For example, the 788 has already replaced the 763 on the ORD-CDG route, although only seasonal, it is a 77E during the summer.


All ORD long haul will be on the 788 as of this summer. The only non-788 widebody flight from ORD on AA will be 1x daily MIA-ORD-MIA on the 763.
This is my signature until I think of a better one.
 
User avatar
American 767
Posts: 4187
Joined: Wed May 19, 1999 7:27 am

Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2018

Tue Mar 27, 2018 4:02 pm

FSDan wrote:
American 767 wrote:
For example, the 788 has already replaced the 763 on the ORD-CDG route, although only seasonal, it is a 77E during the summer.


All ORD long haul will be on the 788 as of this summer. The only non-788 widebody flight from ORD on AA will be 1x daily MIA-ORD-MIA on the 763.


So no more 777 in ORD. Now an interesting question is will ORD ever see the 789. I don't see why not, especially if additional options are converted to firm orders. 788/789 is the same type rating, same crew base. I see the 789 on the ORD-LHR and ORD-NRT routes.
Ben Soriano
 
jgcotter
Posts: 295
Joined: Mon Mar 27, 2017 6:29 pm

Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2018

Tue Mar 27, 2018 9:36 pm

E145 N651AE is en route from MQT to RIC for transfer from Envoy to Piedmont. 42 E145s on property now at Piedmont.
https://flightaware.com/live/flight/N651AE
 
FSDan
Posts: 1783
Joined: Mon Jan 03, 2011 5:27 pm

Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2018

Tue Mar 27, 2018 10:00 pm

American 767 wrote:
FSDan wrote:
American 767 wrote:
For example, the 788 has already replaced the 763 on the ORD-CDG route, although only seasonal, it is a 77E during the summer.


All ORD long haul will be on the 788 as of this summer. The only non-788 widebody flight from ORD on AA will be 1x daily MIA-ORD-MIA on the 763.


So no more 777 in ORD. Now an interesting question is will ORD ever see the 789. I don't see why not, especially if additional options are converted to firm orders. 788/789 is the same type rating, same crew base. I see the 789 on the ORD-LHR and ORD-NRT routes.


If I recall correctly, last summer (specifically July/August) ORD-CDG was a 789 route, with the routing being DFW-CDG-ORD-CDG-DFW. For now the 789s have been consolidated down to just LAX and DFW.

I honestly wouldn't be surprised to see ORD stay all-788 for now, given that AA is concentrating on simplifying the long haul fleet based at each hub. Once DFW-PEK moves to the 789 this August, the only 788 route that doesn't touch ORD will be 2x daily DFW-SFO (just noticed this loaded - cool to see widebodies back on DFW-SFO!). Next summer, I wouldn't be surprised if there are one or two more Transatlantic routes for ORD - I keep thinking ORD-ATH would do well as a summer-seasonal route for AA.
This is my signature until I think of a better one.
 
GoHokies
Posts: 29
Joined: Sat Aug 13, 2016 2:53 pm

Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2018

Tue Mar 27, 2018 11:04 pm

SQ789 wrote:
alasizon wrote:
tom02 wrote:
Does anyone know when the first A333 will be retired in 2018?

Should began several months from now and all planned by end of year.


Per AA’s most recent fleet plan, the A333s will not be retired until 2020.

Does anyone think AA might pickup a few used A332s to complement their existing fleet and then replace the all the A332s with the MoM?

If AA decides to replace the 767s with 788s, then it seems like AA would have little interest in the MoM aircraft.
 
777PHX
Posts: 719
Joined: Tue Oct 13, 2015 4:36 am

Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2018

Tue Mar 27, 2018 11:44 pm

GoHokies wrote:
SQ789 wrote:
alasizon wrote:

Should began several months from now and all planned by end of year.


Per AA’s most recent fleet plan, the A333s will not be retired until 2020.

Does anyone think AA might pickup a few used A332s to complement their existing fleet and then replace the all the A332s with the MoM?

If AA decides to replace the 767s with 788s, then it seems like AA would have little interest in the MoM aircraft.


I doubt it. This current regime at AA doesn't seem interested in used aircraft and they still have 52 unexercised options for 787s. More than enough to replace the A333s, the balance of the 767s and 757s, and a headstart on the A332s(or 77Es), whichever leave first.
 
AA321T
Posts: 99
Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2017 9:22 pm

Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2018

Wed Mar 28, 2018 12:44 am

Just saw confirmed on our official company flight attendant Facebook page that we are indeed picking up eight A319's from Frontier by the end of the year. They will be retrofitted to the LUS interior standard and will operate under LUS until neutral metal happens later this year.

More satellite WiFi mods:
737-800
3AW - Should exit on 3/28
3AP - Should exit on 3/30
757-200
5ES - Should exit on 4/3
A319
708 - Should exit on 3/28
A320
665 - Should exit on 3/29
 
demkid
Posts: 19
Joined: Fri May 26, 2017 6:48 am

Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2018

Tue Apr 03, 2018 8:13 pm

Does anyone know if there's a detailed plan for MD-80 retirements for this year? I think the plan was to go from 45 down to about 29(?) this year but I'm unaware of any leaving service up until this point.
 
UpNAWAy
Posts: 249
Joined: Thu Aug 11, 2016 12:42 pm

Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2018

Tue Apr 03, 2018 8:18 pm

All the ones this year leave on the same day, the first week of September, after the summer flying season.
 
OB1504
Posts: 3332
Joined: Tue Jul 27, 2004 5:10 am

Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2018

Tue Apr 03, 2018 9:04 pm

If the first 45 or so 737-800s are leaving in a year’s time, why are they still installing the satellite wi-fi on these aircraft? 3AP caught my attention when I saw it sporting a new antenna yesterday.
 
alasizon
Topic Author
Posts: 1387
Joined: Sat Apr 28, 2007 8:57 pm

Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2018

Wed Apr 04, 2018 5:32 pm

UpNAWAy wrote:
All the ones this year leave on the same day, the first week of September, after the summer flying season.


Are you sure about that? There was some internal shifting of flying around because there were a few S80s leaving in August.
Manager on Duty & Tower Planner
 
jgcotter
Posts: 295
Joined: Mon Mar 27, 2017 6:29 pm

Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2018

Thu Apr 05, 2018 11:06 am

American MD-83 N9405T ferried DFW to ROW yesterday for retirement. 44 x MD-80 remaining at American.
https://flightaware.com/live/flight/N9405T
 
ckfred
Posts: 5085
Joined: Wed Apr 25, 2001 12:50 pm

Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2018

Thu Apr 05, 2018 2:05 pm

I watched a YouTube video for someone who follows the airline industry. He said his information was that AA interest in the A330neo has waned, and that AA is close to a deal for more 789s. This seems to be the media consensus.

But, AA still has a number of 763s and 752s that are due for retirement. It seems to me that the 789 is too much airplane to replace these aircraft, particularly for flying to Europe or South America.
 
nc3rd
Posts: 66
Joined: Tue Oct 07, 2014 5:52 pm

Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2018

Thu Apr 05, 2018 2:11 pm

AA321T wrote:
Just saw confirmed on our official company flight attendant Facebook page that we are indeed picking up eight A319's from Frontier by the end of the year. They will be retrofitted to the LUS interior standard and will operate under LUS until neutral metal happens later this year.

More satellite WiFi mods:
737-800
3AW - Should exit on 3/28
3AP - Should exit on 3/30
757-200
5ES - Should exit on 4/3
A319
708 - Should exit on 3/28
A320
665 - Should exit on 3/29

"Official" facebook page? And how was this confirmed?
The views written above are mine and mine alone and do not represent any official information from any airline or compan
 
ckfred
Posts: 5085
Joined: Wed Apr 25, 2001 12:50 pm

Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2018

Thu Apr 05, 2018 2:14 pm

American 767 wrote:
FSDan wrote:
American 767 wrote:
For example, the 788 has already replaced the 763 on the ORD-CDG route, although only seasonal, it is a 77E during the summer.


All ORD long haul will be on the 788 as of this summer. The only non-788 widebody flight from ORD on AA will be 1x daily MIA-ORD-MIA on the 763.


So no more 777 in ORD. Now an interesting question is will ORD ever see the 789. I don't see why not, especially if additional options are converted to firm orders. 788/789 is the same type rating, same crew base. I see the 789 on the ORD-LHR and ORD-NRT routes.


There was a WSJ article earlier this year about how airlines are trying to improve on-time performance. AA is trying to minimize the number aircraft types flying out of each hub for long-haul international. So, the decision was made to make ORD all 788. The main concept is that if any given aircraft goes tech, it can easily be swapped out for another plane without having to deal with changes in seating or finding a different crew. Swapping between a 789 and a 788 or vice versa would mean having to find more F/As when swapping to the larger version or bumping people who swapping to the smaller version.
 
AA321T
Posts: 99
Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2017 9:22 pm

Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2018

Thu Apr 05, 2018 5:25 pm

nc3rd wrote:
AA321T wrote:
Just saw confirmed on our official company flight attendant Facebook page that we are indeed picking up eight A319's from Frontier by the end of the year. They will be retrofitted to the LUS interior standard and will operate under LUS until neutral metal happens later this year.

More satellite WiFi mods:
737-800
3AW - Should exit on 3/28
3AP - Should exit on 3/30
757-200
5ES - Should exit on 4/3
A319
708 - Should exit on 3/28
A320
665 - Should exit on 3/29

"Official" facebook page? And how was this confirmed?

It’s an official company run Facebook page for crew members to ask questions and get answers from the company. Somebody asked for them to comment on the rumors that we are taking used aircraft and the admin commented saying that the only confirmed frames we are taking for now are eight A319s from Frontier.
 
Chaostheory
Posts: 1070
Joined: Wed Mar 06, 2013 2:09 am

Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2018

Thu Apr 05, 2018 6:20 pm

I haven't read the other 4 pages so this could already have been posted. Speaking to a friend in AA Ops today, provisional MSN allocated to the first A321neo due next year is 8741.
 
brooklynchris13
Posts: 234
Joined: Fri Mar 19, 2010 12:11 am

Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2018

Sat Apr 07, 2018 3:09 pm

Happy Weekend all. With the 787 announcement yesterday, the A350 cancellation, and the 737 MAX deferrals, I believe that the short, medium, and long term fleet plans for AA just came into very clear focus. If you consider the "right" size for mainline around 950 frames, then the goal would appear to be:
- 135ish Small NB mainline (A319 class)
- 350ish Medium NB Mainline (A320/B738/738MAX class)
- 325ish Large NB Mainline (A321/B757 class)
- 150ish Widebody aircraft. (788;789;78J9?; 77W)

Given that aircraft are not-replaced on a one of this type for one of that type direct basis and the Wall Street concern about capacity, I am guessing that we can draw a few possible items to come in the next update of the AA fleet plan:

- E190s are still gone
- they will procure even more used A319s than the rumored (8) from F9
- A320s are not long for the door
- 757 replacement will be some of the A321 NEOs converted to the LR version for some missions and an upgrade to a 788 for others
- A333 will go first (replaced by the 789s on the previous order)
- B763s will go next (replaced by the 788s on the new order)
- A332s will follow (replaced by the 789s on the new order... I know they said early 772s will go, but I just have a feeling it will be the Airbus first)
- the remaining options will be utilized for the 772 replacement (maybe a mix of 789 & 78J)
- the 797/MOM may not be seen at AA for a long time, if ever

This will allow several goals to be accomplished:
-fleet simplicity
-consistent passenger experience
-maximize growth to economic realities
-improved fuel efficency

The last part is what strikes me as being smart about having control over capacity growth through management of plans to reconfigure aircraft. If there is a slowdown (global trade war?) you can just slow down adding seats to the planes you already own. Is there is growth, you can accelerate the reconfigure effort with no capital costs at all. That is why I also think the low end mainline can be filled by used frames picked up on the cheap. in regards to the 797/MOM, I have to believe that this fleet plan makes it very unlikely that aircraft will arrive at AA anytime in the next 10 years plus. There are just not going to be the markets where it is needed and, even if it fills a niche between the A321 (LR) and the 788, that would only be 10-30 frames, and their actions are showing no desire for that small a sub-fleet.

Regarding other AA strategy, this also points to some of the much laughed about long term profit predictions made last year. By maximizing the network connections, refining capacity, and simplifying the fleet, the only way that the airline would experience serious financial hardship is though a recession/trade war or rapidly escalating fuel prices, but that is going to impact everyone and more fuel efficient aircraft will help that. A bigger concern may be longer term debt with interest rate fluctuations, but that should be able to be managed effectively. The only outstanding fleet issue that would remain is what would replace the 738s in 15-20 years and that aircraft probably is not on the drawing board yet.

That is my .02. Would love to hear other takes on the situation. All-in-all, a very exciting time for AA though.
"Be the change you want to see in the world" (mg)
 
ahj2000
Posts: 1121
Joined: Wed Nov 26, 2014 5:34 pm

Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2018

Sat Apr 07, 2018 3:23 pm

brooklynchris13 wrote:
Happy Weekend all. With the 787 announcement yesterday, the A350 cancellation, and the 737 MAX deferrals, I believe that the short, medium, and long term fleet plans for AA just came into very clear focus. If you consider the "right" size for mainline around 950 frames, then the goal would appear to be:
- 135ish Small NB mainline (A319 class)
- 350ish Medium NB Mainline (A320/B738/738MAX class)
- 325ish Large NB Mainline (A321/B757 class)
- 150ish Widebody aircraft. (788;789;78J9?; 77W)

Given that aircraft are not-replaced on a one of this type for one of that type direct basis and the Wall Street concern about capacity, I am guessing that we can draw a few possible items to come in the next update of the AA fleet plan:

- E190s are still gone
- they will procure even more used A319s than the rumored (8) from F9
- A320s are not long for the door
- 757 replacement will be some of the A321 NEOs converted to the LR version for some missions and an upgrade to a 788 for others
- A333 will go first (replaced by the 789s on the previous order)
- B763s will go next (replaced by the 788s on the new order)
- A332s will follow (replaced by the 789s on the new order... I know they said early 772s will go, but I just have a feeling it will be the Airbus first)
- the remaining options will be utilized for the 772 replacement (maybe a mix of 789 & 78J)
- the 797/MOM may not be seen at AA for a long time, if ever

This will allow several goals to be accomplished:
-fleet simplicity
-consistent passenger experience
-maximize growth to economic realities
-improved fuel efficency

The last part is what strikes me as being smart about having control over capacity growth through management of plans to reconfigure aircraft. If there is a slowdown (global trade war?) you can just slow down adding seats to the planes you already own. Is there is growth, you can accelerate the reconfigure effort with no capital costs at all. That is why I also think the low end mainline can be filled by used frames picked up on the cheap. in regards to the 797/MOM, I have to believe that this fleet plan makes it very unlikely that aircraft will arrive at AA anytime in the next 10 years plus. There are just not going to be the markets where it is needed and, even if it fills a niche between the A321 (LR) and the 788, that would only be 10-30 frames, and their actions are showing no desire for that small a sub-fleet.

Regarding other AA strategy, this also points to some of the much laughed about long term profit predictions made last year. By maximizing the network connections, refining capacity, and simplifying the fleet, the only way that the airline would experience serious financial hardship is though a recession/trade war or rapidly escalating fuel prices, but that is going to impact everyone and more fuel efficient aircraft will help that. A bigger concern may be longer term debt with interest rate fluctuations, but that should be able to be managed effectively. The only outstanding fleet issue that would remain is what would replace the 738s in 15-20 years and that aircraft probably is not on the drawing board yet.

That is my .02. Would love to hear other takes on the situation. All-in-all, a very exciting time for AA though.


I agree in all but one aspect. I think a 200-seater has a spot in AA's roster. Places like Budapest, Prague, Montevideo, and the recently announced Córdoba most likely can't survive on a 788, and would have technical problems on a 321LR. Whether that means 797/MOM, fresh 767s (United had talked about them as well, right?), or a new fix, I'm just not sure that the 321LR and the 788 covers enough for American.
-Andrés Juánez
 
1989worstyear
Posts: 196
Joined: Sun Dec 04, 2016 6:53 pm

Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2018

Sat Apr 07, 2018 4:45 pm

brooklynchris13 wrote:
Happy Weekend all. With the 787 announcement yesterday, the A350 cancellation, and the 737 MAX deferrals, I believe that the short, medium, and long term fleet plans for AA just came into very clear focus. If you consider the "right" size for mainline around 950 frames, then the goal would appear to be:
- 135ish Small NB mainline (A319 class)
- 350ish Medium NB Mainline (A320/B738/738MAX class)
- 325ish Large NB Mainline (A321/B757 class)
- 150ish Widebody aircraft. (788;789;78J9?; 77W)

Given that aircraft are not-replaced on a one of this type for one of that type direct basis and the Wall Street concern about capacity, I am guessing that we can draw a few possible items to come in the next update of the AA fleet plan:

- E190s are still gone
- they will procure even more used A319s than the rumored (8) from F9
- A320s are not long for the door
- 757 replacement will be some of the A321 NEOs converted to the LR version for some missions and an upgrade to a 788 for others
- A333 will go first (replaced by the 789s on the previous order)
- B763s will go next (replaced by the 788s on the new order)
- A332s will follow (replaced by the 789s on the new order... I know they said early 772s will go, but I just have a feeling it will be the Airbus first)
- the remaining options will be utilized for the 772 replacement (maybe a mix of 789 & 78J)
- the 797/MOM may not be seen at AA for a long time, if ever

This will allow several goals to be accomplished:
-fleet simplicity
-consistent passenger experience
-maximize growth to economic realities
-improved fuel efficency

The last part is what strikes me as being smart about having control over capacity growth through management of plans to reconfigure aircraft. If there is a slowdown (global trade war?) you can just slow down adding seats to the planes you already own. Is there is growth, you can accelerate the reconfigure effort with no capital costs at all. That is why I also think the low end mainline can be filled by used frames picked up on the cheap. in regards to the 797/MOM, I have to believe that this fleet plan makes it very unlikely that aircraft will arrive at AA anytime in the next 10 years plus. There are just not going to be the markets where it is needed and, even if it fills a niche between the A321 (LR) and the 788, that would only be 10-30 frames, and their actions are showing no desire for that small a sub-fleet.

Regarding other AA strategy, this also points to some of the much laughed about long term profit predictions made last year. By maximizing the network connections, refining capacity, and simplifying the fleet, the only way that the airline would experience serious financial hardship is though a recession/trade war or rapidly escalating fuel prices, but that is going to impact everyone and more fuel efficient aircraft will help that. A bigger concern may be longer term debt with interest rate fluctuations, but that should be able to be managed effectively. The only outstanding fleet issue that would remain is what would replace the 738s in 15-20 years and that aircraft probably is not on the drawing board yet.

That is my .02. Would love to hear other takes on the situation. All-in-all, a very exciting time for AA though.


Looks like the 763's are going before the A333's now, according to the press releases from yesterday.
Stuck at age 15 thanks to the certification date of the A320-200 and my parents' decision to postpone having a kid by 3 years. At least there's Dignitas...
 
Swadian
Posts: 363
Joined: Sun Sep 11, 2016 4:56 am

Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2018

Sun Apr 08, 2018 1:28 am

American 767 wrote:
1989worstyear wrote:
osupoke07 wrote:
Here's the original Reuters report referenced in the BBJ article

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-amer ... SKBN1GZ35U

Looks to be an order of 25-30 frames, no variant specified yet. Nothing mentioned about the A350 order, but one would have to assume that it's on thin ice at the moment.

Hopefully, this means we'll see the 787-10 in American colors soon!


The -10 seems a bit big for a 763 replacement :confused:


The -10 would be the right 77E replacement, if American decides to go all Boeing for its future wide body fleet. The 763 replacement is the 788 and the 789 depending on the routes where more capacity is needed. For example, the 788 has already replaced the 763 on the ORD-CDG route, although only seasonal, it is a 77E during the summer.


I don't believe AA will choose the 78J for 77E replacement as the 789 currently has more seats than the 77E and more than enough range.

Today's Bloomberg article confirms that the order is for 22x 788 and 25x 789 - no 78J.

Source: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles ... reamliners.

GoHokies wrote:
SQ789 wrote:
alasizon wrote:

Should began several months from now and all planned by end of year.


Per AA’s most recent fleet plan, the A333s will not be retired until 2020.

Does anyone think AA might pickup a few used A332s to complement their existing fleet and then replace the all the A332s with the MoM?

If AA decides to replace the 767s with 788s, then it seems like AA would have little interest in the MoM aircraft.


AA has little reason to buy used A332s when they can replace all of them and then some with the 788 and 789 using their existing 58 options. It's more likely they'll try to dump existing A332s on the used market when they still have resale value, unless the A333s which are early models. For this reason the 77E may end up outlasting the A332 due to fleet commonality with the 77W.

ckfred wrote:
I watched a YouTube video for someone who follows the airline industry. He said his information was that AA interest in the A330neo has waned, and that AA is close to a deal for more 789s. This seems to be the media consensus.

But, AA still has a number of 763s and 752s that are due for retirement. It seems to me that the 789 is too much airplane to replace these aircraft, particularly for flying to Europe or South America.


The 763s can be replaced with 788s and there is currently no plan to retire the 24x 757 International (75L) aircraft. The 10x 75H can be replaced with A321neo.

ahj2000 wrote:
brooklynchris13 wrote:
.....


I agree in all but one aspect. I think a 200-seater has a spot in AA's roster. Places like Budapest, Prague, Montevideo, and the recently announced Córdoba most likely can't survive on a 788, and would have technical problems on a 321LR. Whether that means 797/MOM, fresh 767s (United had talked about them as well, right?), or a new fix, I'm just not sure that the 321LR and the 788 covers enough for American.


With the death of MIA-MVD, it is possible that AA will decide to "go big or go home" and allocate a 788 to MIA-COR anyway - same for BUD and PRG. The 788 and 763 have the same number of J seats, only 788 has 17 more Y seats which is negligible considering greater fuel efficiency. If AA can't fly COR, BUD, and PRG profitably with a 788, then they'll just discontinue the route as with MVD. COR could be handed over to LATAM if it doesn't work out.

Concur that AA will probably buy more cheap used A319s but perhaps A320s will stay longer than expected due to commonality with A319 and A321. Not sure where AA would send A321LR - it seems the standard A321neo may have sufficient range to cover all remaining 757 routes except possibly ORD-MAN (which may go to 788 anyway) or DFW-KEF (which may be moved to ORD, PHL, or even JFK if A321neo range is insufficient).

The Bloomberg article quoted above states 40x 737-MAX8 deliveries have been deferred - these aircraft were intended to replace the A320 and older 738 but now it seems they will only replace the older 738 for now. Possibly AA will even cancel those 40 orders down the line to make way for more A32x orders and change it to a 779 order or more 789s.

AA is on track to becoming the world's largest 787 operator.
Inland Streamliner
 
Pu752
Posts: 441
Joined: Thu Mar 10, 2005 2:29 am

Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2018

Sun Apr 08, 2018 1:50 am

Swadian wrote:
American 767 wrote:
1989worstyear wrote:

The -10 seems a bit big for a 763 replacement :confused:


The -10 would be the right 77E replacement, if American decides to go all Boeing for its future wide body fleet. The 763 replacement is the 788 and the 789 depending on the routes where more capacity is needed. For example, the 788 has already replaced the 763 on the ORD-CDG route, although only seasonal, it is a 77E during the summer.


I don't believe AA will choose the 78J for 77E replacement as the 789 currently has more seats than the 77E and more than enough range.

Today's Bloomberg article confirms that the order is for 22x 788 and 25x 789 - no 78J.

Source: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles ... reamliners.

GoHokies wrote:
SQ789 wrote:
Should began several months from now and all planned by end of year.


Per AA’s most recent fleet plan, the A333s will not be retired until 2020.

Does anyone think AA might pickup a few used A332s to complement their existing fleet and then replace the all the A332s with the MoM?

If AA decides to replace the 767s with 788s, then it seems like AA would have little interest in the MoM aircraft.


AA has little reason to buy used A332s when they can replace all of them and then some with the 788 and 789 using their existing 58 options. It's more likely they'll try to dump existing A332s on the used market when they still have resale value, unless the A333s which are early models. For this reason the 77E may end up outlasting the A332 due to fleet commonality with the 77W.

ckfred wrote:
I watched a YouTube video for someone who follows the airline industry. He said his information was that AA interest in the A330neo has waned, and that AA is close to a deal for more 789s. This seems to be the media consensus.

But, AA still has a number of 763s and 752s that are due for retirement. It seems to me that the 789 is too much airplane to replace these aircraft, particularly for flying to Europe or South America.


The 763s can be replaced with 788s and there is currently no plan to retire the 24x 757 International (75L) aircraft. The 10x 75H can be replaced with A321neo.

ahj2000 wrote:
brooklynchris13 wrote:
.....


I agree in all but one aspect. I think a 200-seater has a spot in AA's roster. Places like Budapest, Prague, Montevideo, and the recently announced Córdoba most likely can't survive on a 788, and would have technical problems on a 321LR. Whether that means 797/MOM, fresh 767s (United had talked about them as well, right?), or a new fix, I'm just not sure that the 321LR and the 788 covers enough for American.


With the death of MIA-MVD, it is possible that AA will decide to "go big or go home" and allocate a 788 to MIA-COR anyway - same for BUD and PRG. The 788 and 763 have the same number of J seats, only 788 has 17 more Y seats which is negligible considering greater fuel efficiency. If AA can't fly COR, BUD, and PRG profitably with a 788, then they'll just discontinue the route as with MVD. COR could be handed over to LATAM if it doesn't work out.

Concur that AA will probably buy more cheap used A319s but perhaps A320s will stay longer than expected due to commonality with A319 and A321. Not sure where AA would send A321LR - it seems the standard A321neo may have sufficient range to cover all remaining 757 routes except possibly ORD-MAN (which may go to 788 anyway) or DFW-KEF (which may be moved to ORD, PHL, or even JFK if A321neo range is insufficient).

The Bloomberg article quoted above states 40x 737-MAX8 deliveries have been deferred - these aircraft were intended to replace the A320 and older 738 but now it seems they will only replace the older 738 for now. Possibly AA will even cancel those 40 orders down the line to make way for more A32x orders and change it to a 779 order or more 789s.

AA is on track to becoming the world's largest 787 operator.



MVD performs well enough for AA. Check your facts, it won't or been cancelled.
 
777PHX
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2018

Sun Apr 08, 2018 2:00 am

I'm skeptical AA has any interest in a potential 797. The 797 as outlined is 220-270 seats. AA's 788 has ~225ish seats and 789 covers the upper end of that spectrum. The 797 just seems redundant, especially if their goal is fleet simplification.
 
Swadian
Posts: 363
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2018

Sun Apr 08, 2018 5:15 pm

Pu752 wrote:
...
MVD performs well enough for AA. Check your facts, it won't or been cancelled.


My bad, I confused MVD with CNF. In any case, if MVD performs well on the 763, you can expect it to perform just as well on the 788 as did DFW-Hawaii with the 77E.
Inland Streamliner
 
alasizon
Topic Author
Posts: 1387
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2018

Sun Apr 15, 2018 3:50 am

Updated Fleet Plan:
https://americanairlines.gcs-web.com/st ... a5694fdabb

Highlights:
333s here through at least the end of 2020
738 retirements pushed back a year (now starting 2020)
50 MAXes deferred from 2020-2022 to 2025 & 2026
Expedited winddown of the 763 fleet in 2020 (down to 5 by end of 2020)
12 788 deliveries in 2020
49 ERDs showing as sticking around through 2020 but I doubt that.
Manager on Duty & Tower Planner
 
User avatar
American 767
Posts: 4187
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2018

Sun Apr 15, 2018 4:15 am

alasizon wrote:
Updated Fleet Plan:
https://americanairlines.gcs-web.com/st ... a5694fdabb

Highlights:
333s here through at least the end of 2020
738 retirements pushed back a year (now starting 2020)
50 MAXes deferred from 2020-2022 to 2025 & 2026
Expedited winddown of the 763 fleet in 2020 (down to 5 by end of 2020)
12 788 deliveries in 2020
49 ERDs showing as sticking around through 2020 but I doubt that.


Also, by the end of 2020 as the plan is right now 24 757s will remain. So my understanding is those 24 units will be the 24 LAA International 757s still remaining in the fleet, and the 10 ex-US 757s will be leaving the fleet during the year 2020. So this being said, no more 757 retirement at least till the end of next year. I recently flew on N199AN from MIA to JFK.
Thanks for the updated fleet plan.
Ben Soriano
 
USAirKid
Posts: 321
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2018

Sun Apr 15, 2018 7:32 am

alasizon wrote:
Updated Fleet Plan:
https://americanairlines.gcs-web.com/st ... a5694fdabb

Highlights:
333s here through at least the end of 2020
738 retirements pushed back a year (now starting 2020)
50 MAXes deferred from 2020-2022 to 2025 & 2026
Expedited winddown of the 763 fleet in 2020 (down to 5 by end of 2020)
12 788 deliveries in 2020
49 ERDs showing as sticking around through 2020 but I doubt that.



I found the American Eagle fleet plan to be fascinating. There are some pretty clear trends, the CRJ200s are being drastically reduced (surprise!) the Dash-8 variants go away, and there are a few more E175s.

But the parts I found interesting were the CRJ700 trend:
2017: 110
2018: 119
2019: 111
2020: 111

That 2018 bump seems weird, are they switching operators who bring their own CRJ700s? or are they taking a few new ones in for 2018 and retiring the oldest ones come 2019?

Also the ERDs seem to show AA picking up a few more planes from outside. As of 2017 they have 21 in service, and "At the end of the first quarter, the company had 23 ERJ140 regional aircraft in temporary storage, which are not included in the active regional ending fleet count." which means they own 44 total, but they'll be up to 49 of them by 202, so where do the last five come from?
 
justplanenutz
Posts: 588
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2018

Sun Apr 15, 2018 5:45 pm

USAirKid wrote:
alasizon wrote:
Updated Fleet Plan:
https://americanairlines.gcs-web.com/st ... a5694fdabb

Also the ERDs seem to show AA picking up a few more planes from outside. As of 2017 they have 21 in service, and "At the end of the first quarter, the company had 23 ERJ140 regional aircraft in temporary storage, which are not included in the active regional ending fleet count." which means they own 44 total, but they'll be up to 49 of them by 202, so where do the last five come from?


Those figures are at different dates: 21 were in service 12/31/2017 and 23 in storage 3/31/2018. The other 5 were put back into service during the 1st quarter.
 
Swadian
Posts: 363
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2018

Sun Apr 15, 2018 9:32 pm

alasizon wrote:
Updated Fleet Plan:
https://americanairlines.gcs-web.com/st ... a5694fdabb

Highlights:
333s here through at least the end of 2020
738 retirements pushed back a year (now starting 2020)
50 MAXes deferred from 2020-2022 to 2025 & 2026
Expedited winddown of the 763 fleet in 2020 (down to 5 by end of 2020)
12 788 deliveries in 2020
49 ERDs showing as sticking around through 2020 but I doubt that.


AA sure is going to have a lot of 788s!

American 767 wrote:
alasizon wrote:
Updated Fleet Plan:
https://americanairlines.gcs-web.com/st ... a5694fdabb

Highlights:
333s here through at least the end of 2020
738 retirements pushed back a year (now starting 2020)
50 MAXes deferred from 2020-2022 to 2025 & 2026
Expedited winddown of the 763 fleet in 2020 (down to 5 by end of 2020)
12 788 deliveries in 2020
49 ERDs showing as sticking around through 2020 but I doubt that.


Also, by the end of 2020 as the plan is right now 24 757s will remain. So my understanding is those 24 units will be the 24 LAA International 757s still remaining in the fleet, and the 10 ex-US 757s will be leaving the fleet during the year 2020. So this being said, no more 757 retirement at least till the end of next year. I recently flew on N199AN from MIA to JFK.
Thanks for the updated fleet plan.


Looks like the A321neo are replacing 75H while all 75L may stay indefinitely due to lack of A321LR order. However, they may end up being replaced by A321neo in the early 2020s anyway.

757 looks like will definitely outlast 763.
Inland Streamliner
 
jgcotter
Posts: 295
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2018

Mon Apr 16, 2018 10:26 pm

E145 N621AE ferried from ABI to RIC this morning for transfer from TSA to Piedmont. 43 x E145 on property now at Piedmont.
https://flightaware.com/live/flight/N621AE
 
Swadian
Posts: 363
Joined: Sun Sep 11, 2016 4:56 am

Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2018

Tue Apr 17, 2018 1:47 am

What are the longest E145, 738, A319, A320, and A321 routes respectively?
Inland Streamliner
 
Boof02671
Posts: 448
Joined: Sun Jul 10, 2016 12:15 am

Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2018

Tue Apr 17, 2018 1:51 am

AA doesn’t own TSA, did they lease the plane to them?
 
User avatar
Runway28L
Posts: 881
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2018

Tue Apr 17, 2018 3:15 am

Swadian wrote:
What are the longest E145, 738, A319, A320, and A321 routes respectively?

Possibly not accurate, but I'll give it a shot...

E145: MIA-CLE (938 nm)
B738: MIA-SEA (2,367 nm)
A319: DFW-UIO (2,239 nm)
A320: PHL-SFO (2,191 nm)
A321: LAX-LIH (2,272 nm)
Image
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jgcotter
Posts: 295
Joined: Mon Mar 27, 2017 6:29 pm

Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2018

Tue Apr 17, 2018 3:54 am

Boof02671 wrote:
AA doesn’t own TSA, did they lease the plane to them?

Yes, sort of, TSA has operated 15 AA-owned planes and two TSA-owned planes for American Eagle out of DCA for quite a while, under a fee for departure contract. (Similar to the Compass-operated E-175s.) One more AA-owned plane, N614AE, will transfer from TSA to Piedmont later this month.
 
Boof02671
Posts: 448
Joined: Sun Jul 10, 2016 12:15 am

Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2018

Tue Apr 17, 2018 3:56 am

jgcotter wrote:
Boof02671 wrote:
AA doesn’t own TSA, did they lease the plane to them?

Yes, sort of, TSA has operated 15 AA-owned planes and two TSA-owned planes for American Eagle out of DCA for quite a while, under a fee for departure contract. (Similar to the Compass-operated E-175s.) One more AA-owned plane, N614AE, will transfer from TSA to Piedmont later this month.

Thank you.
 
User avatar
JackMeahoff
Posts: 72
Joined: Fri Apr 06, 2018 2:12 am

Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2018

Tue Apr 17, 2018 4:22 am

American 767 wrote:

The -10 would be the right 77E replacement, if American decides to go all Boeing for its future wide body fleet. The 763 replacement is the 788 and the 789 depending on the routes where more capacity is needed. For example, the 788 has already replaced the 763 on the ORD-CDG route, although only seasonal, it is a 77E during the summer.


That would be awesome if American had an all-Boeing fleet with 787-8s, 787-9s and 787-10s. You would think American would have planned such a lineup from the start.
 
ahj2000
Posts: 1121
Joined: Wed Nov 26, 2014 5:34 pm

Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2018

Tue Apr 17, 2018 2:38 pm

Boof02671 wrote:
jgcotter wrote:
Boof02671 wrote:
AA doesn’t own TSA, did they lease the plane to them?

Yes, sort of, TSA has operated 15 AA-owned planes and two TSA-owned planes for American Eagle out of DCA for quite a while, under a fee for departure contract. (Similar to the Compass-operated E-175s.) One more AA-owned plane, N614AE, will transfer from TSA to Piedmont later this month.

Thank you.

You all are talking about PSA right?
-Andrés Juánez
 
Boof02671
Posts: 448
Joined: Sun Jul 10, 2016 12:15 am

Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2018

Tue Apr 17, 2018 3:18 pm

ahj2000 wrote:
Boof02671 wrote:
jgcotter wrote:
Yes, sort of, TSA has operated 15 AA-owned planes and two TSA-owned planes for American Eagle out of DCA for quite a while, under a fee for departure contract. (Similar to the Compass-operated E-175s.) One more AA-owned plane, N614AE, will transfer from TSA to Piedmont later this month.

Thank you.

You all are talking about PSA right?

No TSA is Trans States Airlines, PSA flies the CRJs. Piedmont flies the Small ERJs
 
ahj2000
Posts: 1121
Joined: Wed Nov 26, 2014 5:34 pm

Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2018

Tue Apr 17, 2018 6:40 pm

Boof02671 wrote:
ahj2000 wrote:
Boof02671 wrote:
Thank you.

You all are talking about PSA right?

No TSA is Trans States Airlines, PSA flies the CRJs. Piedmont flies the Small ERJs

Aahh ok. I hadn’t seen the acronym used on here. Thanks for it clarifying.
-Andrés Juánez
 
Swadian
Posts: 363
Joined: Sun Sep 11, 2016 4:56 am

Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2018

Tue Apr 17, 2018 9:51 pm

Runway28L wrote:
Swadian wrote:
What are the longest E145, 738, A319, A320, and A321 routes respectively?

Possibly not accurate, but I'll give it a shot...

E145: MIA-CLE (938 nm)
B738: MIA-SEA (2,367 nm)
A319: DFW-UIO (2,239 nm)
A320: PHL-SFO (2,191 nm)
A321: LAX-LIH (2,272 nm)
Image


AA was using A319 on MIA-SEA which is longer than DFW-UIO. I guess that means MIA-SEA is the longest flight for both A319 and 738? I don't know if AA will use A319 on MIA-SEA again soon.

How many PHL-SFO are on A320? I'd have thought AA would put all-A321 on all PHL-SFO now in addition to the single A332. Looks like AA really does need more A321. It seems that they can't get enough of that aircraft and that many 738 routes can be switched to A321.

Would BOS-LAX be the longest A321 route if its winter use was counted?
Inland Streamliner
 
User avatar
Runway28L
Posts: 881
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2018

Tue Apr 17, 2018 10:06 pm

Swadian wrote:
Runway28L wrote:
Swadian wrote:
What are the longest E145, 738, A319, A320, and A321 routes respectively?

Possibly not accurate, but I'll give it a shot...

E145: MIA-CLE (938 nm)
B738: MIA-SEA (2,367 nm)
A319: DFW-UIO (2,239 nm)
A320: PHL-SFO (2,191 nm)
A321: LAX-LIH (2,272 nm)
Image


AA was using A319 on MIA-SEA which is longer than DFW-UIO. I guess that means MIA-SEA is the longest flight for both A319 and 738? I don't know if AA will use A319 on MIA-SEA again soon.

How many PHL-SFO are on A320? I'd have thought AA would put all-A321 on all PHL-SFO now in addition to the single A332. Looks like AA really does need more A321. It seems that they can't get enough of that aircraft and that many 738 routes can be switched to A321.

MIA-SEA was most recently a 738 when I last checked FlightAware. I have seen MIA-SAN as a L-US A319 so that also has to be up there.

I probably should've said SFO-PHL instead of PHL-SFO because the eastbound has an A320 (AA855) but westbound is all-A321 and A332.
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Swadian
Posts: 363
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2018

Wed Apr 18, 2018 3:25 am

Just confirming: 5DK (N692AA) will be the oldest AA aircraft following imminent MD-80 and 763 retirement?

Runway28L wrote:
Swadian wrote:
Runway28L wrote:
Possibly not accurate, but I'll give it a shot...

E145: MIA-CLE (938 nm)
B738: MIA-SEA (2,367 nm)
A319: DFW-UIO (2,239 nm)
A320: PHL-SFO (2,191 nm)
A321: LAX-LIH (2,272 nm)
Image


AA was using A319 on MIA-SEA which is longer than DFW-UIO. I guess that means MIA-SEA is the longest flight for both A319 and 738? I don't know if AA will use A319 on MIA-SEA again soon.

How many PHL-SFO are on A320? I'd have thought AA would put all-A321 on all PHL-SFO now in addition to the single A332. Looks like AA really does need more A321. It seems that they can't get enough of that aircraft and that many 738 routes can be switched to A321.

MIA-SEA was most recently a 738 when I last checked FlightAware. I have seen MIA-SAN as a L-US A319 so that also has to be up there.

I probably should've said SFO-PHL instead of PHL-SFO because the eastbound has an A320 (AA855) but westbound is all-A321 and A332.


Why does the eastbound have an A320 while westbound does not?
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Runway28L
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2018

Wed Apr 18, 2018 2:11 pm

Swadian wrote:
Just confirming: 5DK (N692AA) will be the oldest AA aircraft following imminent MD-80 and 763 retirement?

Runway28L wrote:
Swadian wrote:

AA was using A319 on MIA-SEA which is longer than DFW-UIO. I guess that means MIA-SEA is the longest flight for both A319 and 738? I don't know if AA will use A319 on MIA-SEA again soon.

How many PHL-SFO are on A320? I'd have thought AA would put all-A321 on all PHL-SFO now in addition to the single A332. Looks like AA really does need more A321. It seems that they can't get enough of that aircraft and that many 738 routes can be switched to A321.

MIA-SEA was most recently a 738 when I last checked FlightAware. I have seen MIA-SAN as a L-US A319 so that also has to be up there.

I probably should've said SFO-PHL instead of PHL-SFO because the eastbound has an A320 (AA855) but westbound is all-A321 and A332.


Why does the eastbound have an A320 while westbound does not?

Likely for aircaft repositioning.
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