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adamh8297
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Re: OAG Changes 1/7/2018:HA Adds LGB; UA adds DEN-ATW/ORF,IAH-CAK/DAY,LAX-ACV,ORD-BIS/SLN,SFO-MSN; AM Drops DEN-MEX

Sun Jan 07, 2018 8:00 pm

NYCVIE wrote:
First, thanks enilria! We appreciate your hard work every week!

enilria wrote:

Hmm...slots?
*DY EWR-CDG MAR 0.9>0 APR 0.9>0 MAY 0.8>0 JUN 0.9>0 JUL 0.8>0 AUG 0.9>0 SEP 0.9>0
*DY EWR-ORY MAR 0>0.9 APR 0>1.0 MAY 0>1.0 JUN 0>1.0 JUL 0>1.0 AUG 0>1.0 SEP 0>1.0


This is really interesting. DY operation in Paris is getting messy. CPH, HEL, ARN, BGO, OSL, and now EWR from ORY while at CDG they'll have BOS, DEN, FLL, LAX, JFK, OAK, MCO, and soon OSL which will transfer over from ORY. I wonder if they're goal is to have their whole operation end up in CDG but they just don't have the slots? It can't be particularly cost effective to have split ops to that degree (same could be said for JFK/EWR ops).


Wasn't their original plan to completely use ORY?
Airlines flown: A3, AA, AC, AF, AM, BA, B6, CA, CO, CX, DL, EA, EL, IB, LH, MI, MQ, NH, NW, NZ, OU, PE, QF, S4, SQ, TP, UA, US, VS, WE, WN

2019: CX BOS-HKG, WE HKG-HKT, CA HKT-PEK-EWR, B6 EWR-BOS
 
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flymco753
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Re: OAG Changes 1/7/2018:HA Adds LGB; UA adds DEN-ATW/ORF,IAH-CAK/DAY,LAX-ACV,ORD-BIS/SLN,SFO-MSN; AM Drops DEN-MEX

Sun Jan 07, 2018 8:12 pm

klm617 wrote:
lavalampluva wrote:
Looks like RJ DTW-YUL Is just suspended for the month of June.



Perhaps an earlier start for the DTW-AMN Nonstop
AMM nonstop is starting earlier.
...the carriage of liquids, gels, and aerosols are prohibited through the screening checkpoint except for travel size toiletries of 3 ounces or less...
 
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Midwestindy
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Re: OAG Changes 1/7/2018:HA Adds LGB; UA adds DEN-ATW/ORF,IAH-CAK/DAY,LAX-ACV,ORD-BIS/SLN,SFO-MSN; AM Drops DEN-MEX

Sun Jan 07, 2018 8:48 pm

SFOtoORD wrote:
Midwestindy wrote:
enilria wrote:
That's a shocker
*UA SFO-MSN JUN 0>0.8 JUL 0>1.0 AUG 0>1.0 SEP 0>1.0


Likely some financial incentives behind it, PDEW was only around 75-80 for Q1/Q2 of 2017


Not sure why that would be necessary. MSN is a University town and home to Epic. I’m sure there are plenty of Bay Area links. SFO can also carry connecting traffic.


Pretty straight forward, CMH and IND had incentives to start flights to the Bay Area, both of which had at least double the PDEW to the Bay Area, more connections, larger tech industries, and are in general more proven markets.....
ORD & IND

AA & DL
 
Rdh3e
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Re: OAG Changes 1/7/2018:HA Adds LGB; UA adds DEN-ATW/ORF,IAH-CAK/DAY,LAX-ACV,ORD-BIS/SLN,SFO-MSN; AM Drops DEN-MEX

Sun Jan 07, 2018 8:52 pm

Midwestindy wrote:
Pretty straight forward, CMH and IND had incentives to start flights to the Bay Area, both of which had at least double the PDEW to the Bay Area, more connections, larger tech industries, and are in general more proven markets.....

Both of which require mainline aircraft though. Much higher risk.
 
Cubsrule
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Re: OAG Changes 1/7/2018:HA Adds LGB; UA adds DEN-ATW/ORF,IAH-CAK/DAY,LAX-ACV,ORD-BIS/SLN,SFO-MSN; AM Drops DEN-MEX

Sun Jan 07, 2018 8:54 pm

Midwestindy wrote:
SFOtoORD wrote:
Midwestindy wrote:

Likely some financial incentives behind it, PDEW was only around 75-80 for Q1/Q2 of 2017


Not sure why that would be necessary. MSN is a University town and home to Epic. I’m sure there are plenty of Bay Area links. SFO can also carry connecting traffic.


Pretty straight forward, CMH and IND had incentives to start flights to the Bay Area, both of which had at least double the PDEW to the Bay Area, more connections, larger tech industries, and are in general more proven markets.....


. . . But out of E75 range, no?
I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more
 
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Midwestindy
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Re: OAG Changes 1/7/2018:HA Adds LGB; UA adds DEN-ATW/ORF,IAH-CAK/DAY,LAX-ACV,ORD-BIS/SLN,SFO-MSN; AM Drops DEN-MEX

Sun Jan 07, 2018 8:56 pm

Rdh3e wrote:
Midwestindy wrote:
Pretty straight forward, CMH and IND had incentives to start flights to the Bay Area, both of which had at least double the PDEW to the Bay Area, more connections, larger tech industries, and are in general more proven markets.....

Both of which require mainline aircraft though. Much higher risk.


I am aware of the risk involved, but there is also risk in starting MSN-SFO whether it is on an e175 or not....
ORD & IND

AA & DL
 
SFOtoORD
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Re: OAG Changes 1/7/2018:HA Adds LGB; UA adds DEN-ATW/ORF,IAH-CAK/DAY,LAX-ACV,ORD-BIS/SLN,SFO-MSN; AM Drops DEN-MEX

Sun Jan 07, 2018 9:30 pm

Midwestindy wrote:
SFOtoORD wrote:
Midwestindy wrote:

Likely some financial incentives behind it, PDEW was only around 75-80 for Q1/Q2 of 2017


Not sure why that would be necessary. MSN is a University town and home to Epic. I’m sure there are plenty of Bay Area links. SFO can also carry connecting traffic.


Pretty straight forward, CMH and IND had incentives to start flights to the Bay Area, both of which had at least double the PDEW to the Bay Area, more connections, larger tech industries, and are in general more proven markets.....


I don’t see it. Any time I go to Madison, a ton of the SFO-DEN/ORD passengers end up on my DEN/ORD-MSN flights. I’m also not aware of particularly large Tech in either of those markets other than SFDC’s in IND. Epic has their marquee customer Kaiser in the Bay Area Plus Sutter, Stanford and a couple other health systems. With 75 seats this shouldn’t be tough to fill. Probably some smaller CA markets that gain one-stop service as well.
 
Biged
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Re: OAG Changes 1/7/2018:HA Adds LGB; UA adds DEN-ATW/ORF,IAH-CAK/DAY,LAX-ACV,ORD-BIS/SLN,SFO-MSN; AM Drops DEN-MEX

Sun Jan 07, 2018 9:38 pm

Awesome thread
50 years ago 75 person jets where mainline.
 
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Midwestindy
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Re: OAG Changes 1/7/2018:HA Adds LGB; UA adds DEN-ATW/ORF,IAH-CAK/DAY,LAX-ACV,ORD-BIS/SLN,SFO-MSN; AM Drops DEN-MEX

Sun Jan 07, 2018 10:03 pm

SFOtoORD wrote:
Midwestindy wrote:
SFOtoORD wrote:

Not sure why that would be necessary. MSN is a University town and home to Epic. I’m sure there are plenty of Bay Area links. SFO can also carry connecting traffic.


Pretty straight forward, CMH and IND had incentives to start flights to the Bay Area, both of which had at least double the PDEW to the Bay Area, more connections, larger tech industries, and are in general more proven markets.....


I don’t see it. Any time I go to Madison, a ton of the SFO-DEN/ORD passengers end up on my DEN/ORD-MSN flights. I’m also not aware of particularly large Tech in either of those markets other than SFDC’s in IND. Epic has their marquee customer Kaiser in the Bay Area Plus Sutter, Stanford and a couple other health systems. With 75 seats this shouldn’t be tough to fill. Probably some smaller CA markets that gain one-stop service as well.


I don't know enough to speak entirely for CMH but I know in terms of jobs, CMH and IND have around 2x the amount tech jobs that MSN does. For IND, Roche (which spent $149.2 million on US travel in 2016) has its US HQ and 2nd largest US office in IND and the Bay Area. As you mentioned, Salesforce Marketing Cloud is HQ'd in IND with a couple thousand employees, while Salesforce is HQ'd in SFO. Genesys has its largest office in the Bay Area, and 2nd or 3rd largest in IND. e.t.c, e.t.c IND this summer will have 4 daily flights to the Bay Area, so there is definitely a tech market

Cool that MSN gets a west coast link though, I just would have thought LAX would have been first.
ORD & IND

AA & DL
 
76794p
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Re: OAG Changes 1/7/2018:HA Adds LGB; UA adds DEN-ATW/ORF,IAH-CAK/DAY,LAX-ACV,ORD-BIS/SLN,SFO-MSN; AM Drops DEN-MEX

Sun Jan 07, 2018 10:13 pm

jetmatt777 wrote:
FATFlyer wrote:
knope2001 wrote:
Here are the longest scheduled E175 routes in the US in statute miles:

1773 MSN-SFO
1735 STL-SFO
1731 FAT-ORD (begins 6/7/18)
1718 MKE-PDX
1715 AUS-PDX
1709 STL-SEA
1708 STL-PDX
1694 MKE-SEA
1616 DFW-PDX

Edited to include FAT-ORD


Image

Really, it is pretty impressive range for a 76 seater. They are very comfortable too. I'd rather that long of a flight on an E175 compared to a mainline jet.


AUS-PDX has gone mainline Alaska in recent months. Depending on the day, it's either a 73G, 738, or 739.
There's always money IN the banana stand.
 
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mke717spotter
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Re: OAG Changes 1/7/2018:HA Adds LGB; UA adds DEN-ATW/ORF,IAH-CAK/DAY,LAX-ACV,ORD-BIS/SLN,SFO-MSN; AM Drops DEN-MEX

Sun Jan 07, 2018 10:18 pm

enilria wrote:
That's a shocker
*UA SFO-MSN JUN 0>0.8 JUL 0>1.0 AUG 0>1.0 SEP 0>1.0

First MSN beat out MKE in terms of getting a DL SLC flight and now they've gotten UA to SFO as well! In the meantime WN has cut back MKE-SFO and made it seasonal.

knope2001 wrote:

Here are the longest scheduled E175 routes in the US in statute miles:

1773 MSN-SFO
1735 STL-SFO
1718 MKE-PDX
1715 AUS-PDX
1709 STL-SEA
1708 STL-PDX
1694 MKE-SEA
1616 DFW-PDX

I see that AS is upgrading MKE-SEA to mainline in March. That would still leave DL using E175s on the route, but according to Wikipedia its ending in June?
Will you watch the Cleveland Browns and the Detroit Lions on Sunday? Only if coach Eric Mangini resigned after a loss.
 
clrd4t8koff
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Re: OAG Changes 1/7/2018:HA Adds LGB; UA adds DEN-ATW/ORF,IAH-CAK/DAY,LAX-ACV,ORD-BIS/SLN,SFO-MSN; AM Drops DEN-MEX

Sun Jan 07, 2018 10:48 pm

NickolayAv wrote:
hvusslax wrote:
I can't see this increased frequency on FI to JFK and IAD on their website. BOS seems to be 3x daily on most days.

Does that mean they'll return to B757 because currently they fly a daily B767?


I just looked at various dates in May, June, July and August and all show 2x 757, 1x 767. Interesting that they have 2 flights that depart within 45-mins of each other, a 767 and a 757 (8:45pm & 9:30pm).
 
Bobloblaw
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Re: OAG Changes 1/7/2018:HA Adds LGB; UA adds DEN-ATW/ORF,IAH-CAK/DAY,LAX-ACV,ORD-BIS/SLN,SFO-MSN; AM Drops DEN-MEX

Sun Jan 07, 2018 10:51 pm

[/quote]helps B6 with slot squatting. A321NEO really makes a lot of these routes possible[/quote]

You dont slot squat by flying a 2,500 mile flight. There is actual demand in Orange County and the rest of the southland
 
SUNCTRY738
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Re: OAG Changes 1/7/2018:HA Adds LGB; UA adds DEN-ATW/ORF,IAH-CAK/DAY,LAX-ACV,ORD-BIS/SLN,SFO-MSN; AM Drops DEN-MEX

Sun Jan 07, 2018 10:52 pm

UA BIS-ORD? Wow, this one surprises me a bit. And twice daily. I wonder what the equipment is?
 
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Midwestindy
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Re: OAG Changes 1/7/2018:HA Adds LGB; UA adds DEN-ATW/ORF,IAH-CAK/DAY,LAX-ACV,ORD-BIS/SLN,SFO-MSN; AM Drops DEN-MEX

Sun Jan 07, 2018 10:55 pm

SUNCTRY738 wrote:
UA BIS-ORD? Wow, this one surprises me a bit. And twice daily. I wonder what the equipment is?


ERJ145
ORD & IND

AA & DL
 
Rdh3e
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Re: OAG Changes 1/7/2018:HA Adds LGB; UA adds DEN-ATW/ORF,IAH-CAK/DAY,LAX-ACV,ORD-BIS/SLN,SFO-MSN; AM Drops DEN-MEX

Sun Jan 07, 2018 10:58 pm

mke717spotter wrote:
enilria wrote:
That's a shocker
*UA SFO-MSN JUN 0>0.8 JUL 0>1.0 AUG 0>1.0 SEP 0>1.0

First MSN beat out MKE in terms of getting a DL SLC flight and now they've gotten UA to SFO as well! In the meantime WN has cut back MKE-SFO and made it seasonal.

Fares to MSN from the Bay are about 40% higher than MKE according to the DOT. I'm sure that helps.
 
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KLASM83
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Re: OAG Changes 1/7/2018:HA Adds LGB; UA adds DEN-ATW/ORF,IAH-CAK/DAY,LAX-ACV,ORD-BIS/SLN,SFO-MSN; AM Drops DEN-MEX

Sun Jan 07, 2018 11:03 pm

enilria wrote:
UA IAD-ROA APR 3>2.0 MAY 3>2


Can't help but wonder if that's because of Amtrak's new service eating away at the O&D* on that route? Seems like more of a connecting frequency than O&D now.

*Yes, I know IAD is ~30miles from DC, and I'd be that kind of person to take a flight like that if it was cheap enough lol

Also glad to see BIS-ORD is back, I know UA tried it back in the early 2010s when oil was on the upswing.

Thanks for the update as usual!
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enilria
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Re: OAG Changes 1/7/2018:HA Adds LGB; UA adds DEN-ATW/ORF,IAH-CAK/DAY,LAX-ACV,ORD-BIS/SLN,SFO-MSN; AM Drops DEN-MEX

Sun Jan 07, 2018 11:12 pm

KLASM83 wrote:
enilria wrote:
UA IAD-ROA APR 3>2.0 MAY 3>2


Can't help but wonder if that's because of Amtrak's new service eating away at the O&D* on that route? Seems like more of a connecting frequency than O&D now.

*Yes, I know IAD is ~30miles from DC, and I'd be that kind of person to take a flight like that if it was cheap enough lol

Also glad to see BIS-ORD is back, I know UA tried it back in the early 2010s when oil was on the upswing.

Thanks for the update as usual!

:)

I guess somebody had to lose something to add all those new routes.
 
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klm617
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Re: OAG Changes 1/7/2018:HA Adds LGB; UA adds DEN-ATW/ORF,IAH-CAK/DAY,LAX-ACV,ORD-BIS/SLN,SFO-MSN; AM Drops DEN-MEX

Sun Jan 07, 2018 11:16 pm

Midwestindy wrote:
SFOtoORD wrote:
Midwestindy wrote:

Pretty straight forward, CMH and IND had incentives to start flights to the Bay Area, both of which had at least double the PDEW to the Bay Area, more connections, larger tech industries, and are in general more proven markets.....


I don’t see it. Any time I go to Madison, a ton of the SFO-DEN/ORD passengers end up on my DEN/ORD-MSN flights. I’m also not aware of particularly large Tech in either of those markets other than SFDC’s in IND. Epic has their marquee customer Kaiser in the Bay Area Plus Sutter, Stanford and a couple other health systems. With 75 seats this shouldn’t be tough to fill. Probably some smaller CA markets that gain one-stop service as well.


I don't know enough to speak entirely for CMH but I know in terms of jobs, CMH and IND have around 2x the amount tech jobs that MSN does. For IND, Roche (which spent $149.2 million on US travel in 2016) has its US HQ and 2nd largest US office in IND and the Bay Area. As you mentioned, Salesforce Marketing Cloud is HQ'd in IND with a couple thousand employees, while Salesforce is HQ'd in SFO. Genesys has its largest office in the Bay Area, and 2nd or 3rd largest in IND. e.t.c, e.t.c IND this summer will have 4 daily flights to the Bay Area, so there is definitely a tech market



Cool that MSN gets a west coast link though, I just would have thought LAX would have been first.


Why does everyone think tech jobs fuel the airline business. Everyone flies not just tech people. It's like everyone has to glorify the tech industry.
the truth does matter, guys. too bad it's often quite subjective. the truth is beyond the mere facts and figures. it's beyond good and bad, right and wrong...
 
SFOtoORD
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Re: OAG Changes 1/7/2018:HA Adds LGB; UA adds DEN-ATW/ORF,IAH-CAK/DAY,LAX-ACV,ORD-BIS/SLN,SFO-MSN; AM Drops DEN-MEX

Sun Jan 07, 2018 11:28 pm

klm617 wrote:
Midwestindy wrote:
SFOtoORD wrote:

I don’t see it. Any time I go to Madison, a ton of the SFO-DEN/ORD passengers end up on my DEN/ORD-MSN flights. I’m also not aware of particularly large Tech in either of those markets other than SFDC’s in IND. Epic has their marquee customer Kaiser in the Bay Area Plus Sutter, Stanford and a couple other health systems. With 75 seats this shouldn’t be tough to fill. Probably some smaller CA markets that gain one-stop service as well.


I don't know enough to speak entirely for CMH but I know in terms of jobs, CMH and IND have around 2x the amount tech jobs that MSN does. For IND, Roche (which spent $149.2 million on US travel in 2016) has its US HQ and 2nd largest US office in IND and the Bay Area. As you mentioned, Salesforce Marketing Cloud is HQ'd in IND with a couple thousand employees, while Salesforce is HQ'd in SFO. Genesys has its largest office in the Bay Area, and 2nd or 3rd largest in IND. e.t.c, e.t.c IND this summer will have 4 daily flights to the Bay Area, so there is definitely a tech market



Cool that MSN gets a west coast link though, I just would have thought LAX would have been first.


Why does everyone think tech jobs fuel the airline business. Everyone flies not just tech people. It's like everyone has to glorify the tech industry.


You seem to be making quite a leap. Which post says only tech companies fill planes? The Bay Area’s biggest industry is tech, but also several others including pharma and healthcare that were mentioned in posts above.
 
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piedmontf284000
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Re: OAG Changes 1/7/2018:HA Adds LGB; UA adds DEN-ATW/ORF,IAH-CAK/DAY,LAX-ACV,ORD-BIS/SLN,SFO-MSN; AM Drops DEN-MEX

Sun Jan 07, 2018 11:29 pm

SUNCTRY738 wrote:
UA BIS-ORD? Wow, this one surprises me a bit. And twice daily. I wonder what the equipment is?


Not to mention the AA flight and you have 3x daily to BIS from ORD

flymco753 wrote:
klm617 wrote:
lavalampluva wrote:
Looks like RJ DTW-YUL Is just suspended for the month of June.



Perhaps an earlier start for the DTW-AMN Nonstop
AMM nonstop is starting earlier.


Starts up on the 8th of June

wedgetail737 wrote:
FI BOS-KEF MAY 2.0>3
FI IAD-KEF MAY 1.9>3 JUN 2>3 JUL 2>3 AUG 2>3 SEP 2>3
FI JFK-KEF MAY 1.9>3 JUN 2>3 JUL 2>3 AUG 2>3 SEP 2>3
FI ORD-KEF MAY 1.0>1.2 JUN 1.0>1.4 JUL 1.0>1.4 AUG 1.0>1.4 SEP 1.0>1.2

I wonder if FI is still taking delivery of some old AA 757's.


They are definitely going to need a few more aircraft. KEF is going to be insane this summer. I wonder if the demand is really there or FI is trying to push WW out of these markets.
 
NWADTWE16
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Re: OAG Changes 1/7/2018:HA Adds LGB; UA adds DEN-ATW/ORF,IAH-CAK/DAY,LAX-ACV,ORD-BIS/SLN,SFO-MSN; AM Drops DEN-MEX

Sun Jan 07, 2018 11:31 pm

So what is the actual frequency year round for RJ DTW-AMM? and does anyone have the loads or at least the link to where they are stored. I know they have been shared before I believe
I haven't been everywhere, but it's on my list!
 
jubguy3
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Re: OAG Changes 1/7/2018:HA Adds LGB; UA adds DEN-ATW/ORF,IAH-CAK/DAY,LAX-ACV,ORD-BIS/SLN,SFO-MSN; AM Drops DEN-MEX

Sun Jan 07, 2018 11:42 pm

What does the increase in KL SLC-AMS represent in terms of weekly flights?
 
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NickolayAv
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Re: OAG Changes 1/7/2018:HA Adds LGB; UA adds DEN-ATW/ORF,IAH-CAK/DAY,LAX-ACV,ORD-BIS/SLN,SFO-MSN; AM Drops DEN-MEX

Sun Jan 07, 2018 11:46 pm

clrd4t8koff wrote:
NickolayAv wrote:
hvusslax wrote:
I can't see this increased frequency on FI to JFK and IAD on their website. BOS seems to be 3x daily on most days.

Does that mean they'll return to B757 because currently they fly a daily B767?


I just looked at various dates in May, June, July and August and all show 2x 757, 1x 767. Interesting that they have 2 flights that depart within 45-mins of each other, a 767 and a 757 (8:45pm & 9:30pm).

That makes sense considering last summer they had three 757 daily, and with increased passenger numbers they can probably fill all the seats most days.
"If you want to be a millionaire, start with a billion dollars and launch a new airline"-Richard Branson
 
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OzarkD9S
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Re: OAG Changes 1/7/2018:HA Adds LGB; UA adds DEN-ATW/ORF,IAH-CAK/DAY,LAX-ACV,ORD-BIS/SLN,SFO-MSN; AM Drops DEN-MEX

Sun Jan 07, 2018 11:52 pm

Re: DEN-HYS-SLN-ORD.

I made an observation a while back that 2-stop routes between hubs would be a good way to increase loads and provide more service to smaller markets and was roundly poo-poohed. Costs, extra segments make them non-viable etc...

Now I see something like this and have to gloat just a tad...even though this type of routing has yet to prove itself, with the US3 now having more robust hubs geographically I wonder if we wont see more of these types of routes going forward.

Just looking at UA: EWR-PIA-SUX-DEN, EWR-SBN-ALO-DEN and the like. Any two smaller cities without the heft to have their own nonstops to the hubs combined to offer two hubs with a stop in one direction or another. I hope this is a trend....
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WA707atMSP
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Re: OAG Changes 1/7/2018:HA Adds LGB; UA adds DEN-ATW/ORF,IAH-CAK/DAY,LAX-ACV,ORD-BIS/SLN,SFO-MSN; AM Drops DEN-MEX

Sun Jan 07, 2018 11:55 pm

piedmontf284000 wrote:
They are definitely going to need a few more aircraft. KEF is going to be insane this summer. I wonder if the demand is really there or FI is trying to push WW out of these markets.


Although many passengers change planes in KEF, another problem that's developing is that Iceland is receiving more tourists than their infrastructure can handle. Some articles have speculated that there may be a backlash against tourism from the Icelandic people, who see their country get more congested every year.
 
usairways85
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Re: OAG Changes 1/7/2018:HA Adds LGB; UA adds DEN-ATW/ORF,IAH-CAK/DAY,LAX-ACV,ORD-BIS/SLN,SFO-MSN; AM Drops DEN-MEX

Mon Jan 08, 2018 12:13 am

enilria wrote:
FAQ
AS PHL-SFO APR 0.4>0.2 MAY 1.6>1.0

This looks like some AS/VX flight number and aircraft nuances. Operated by Virgin America through 4/24 and then Alaska from 4/25
But does appear that they pulled back the 2nd frequency.
 
Rdh3e
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Re: OAG Changes 1/7/2018:HA Adds LGB; UA adds DEN-ATW/ORF,IAH-CAK/DAY,LAX-ACV,ORD-BIS/SLN,SFO-MSN; AM Drops DEN-MEX

Mon Jan 08, 2018 12:16 am

OzarkD9S wrote:
. I hope this is a trend....

Unless there is a trend of the US government offering (increased numbers of) $10M subsidies for these types of services then no, it won't be a trend.
 
AAvgeek744
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Re: OAG Changes 1/7/2018:HA Adds LGB; UA adds DEN-ATW/ORF,IAH-CAK/DAY,LAX-ACV,ORD-BIS/SLN,SFO-MSN; AM Drops DEN-MEX

Mon Jan 08, 2018 12:24 am

SFOtoORD wrote:
klm617 wrote:
Midwestindy wrote:

I don't know enough to speak entirely for CMH but I know in terms of jobs, CMH and IND have around 2x the amount tech jobs that MSN does. For IND, Roche (which spent $149.2 million on US travel in 2016) has its US HQ and 2nd largest US office in IND and the Bay Area. As you mentioned, Salesforce Marketing Cloud is HQ'd in IND with a couple thousand employees, while Salesforce is HQ'd in SFO. Genesys has its largest office in the Bay Area, and 2nd or 3rd largest in IND. e.t.c, e.t.c IND this summer will have 4 daily flights to the Bay Area, so there is definitely a tech market



Cool that MSN gets a west coast link though, I just would have thought LAX would have been first.


Why does everyone think tech jobs fuel the airline business. Everyone flies not just tech people. It's like everyone has to glorify the tech industry.


You seem to be making quite a leap. Which post says only tech companies fill planes? The Bay Area’s biggest industry is tech, but also several others including pharma and healthcare that were mentioned in posts above.


In this, and countless other threads I've read, when there is new service to the Bay area, you can count on comments about the flight being fueled by the tech industry.
 
SFOtoORD
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Re: OAG Changes 1/7/2018:HA Adds LGB; UA adds DEN-ATW/ORF,IAH-CAK/DAY,LAX-ACV,ORD-BIS/SLN,SFO-MSN; AM Drops DEN-MEX

Mon Jan 08, 2018 12:48 am

AAvgeek744 wrote:
SFOtoORD wrote:
klm617 wrote:

Why does everyone think tech jobs fuel the airline business. Everyone flies not just tech people. It's like everyone has to glorify the tech industry.


You seem to be making quite a leap. Which post says only tech companies fill planes? The Bay Area’s biggest industry is tech, but also several others including pharma and healthcare that were mentioned in posts above.


In this, and countless other threads I've read, when there is new service to the Bay area, you can count on comments about the flight being fueled by the tech industry.


And when there are flights to Detroit people talk about automotive, when there are flights to NYC there is talk about financial services, DC leads to talk about capital-to-capital, flights from Germany to the South lead to talk about all the German companies with manufacturing in the South. So how is saying that a tech connection in the Bay Area is glorifying tech? Every region has a major industry. Shouldn’t be a big deal to talk about that as something that might contribute to new air service.
 
md94
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Re: OAG Changes 1/7/2018:HA Adds LGB; UA adds DEN-ATW/ORF,IAH-CAK/DAY,LAX-ACV,ORD-BIS/SLN,SFO-MSN; AM Drops DEN-MEX

Mon Jan 08, 2018 12:49 am

AVLAirlineFreq wrote:
knope2001 wrote:

I'm sure this isn't the most captivating topic for many as Hays is pretty small. But I am very encouraged to see better service patterns for small communities, especially on branded regional jets. The subsidies which support these flights are not cheap and have been tenuous for years. If airlines can figure ways to give useful, reasonably-well patronized service to these communities the subsidies can get smaller and the danger of losing it can lessen. Nothing sadder for a small-community air service advocate like myself to see us spending $2-3m per year to pay for unreliable EAS flights which are little utilized. So this kind of thing is encouraging.



This is also the kind of destination you want to see work. It's a 4.5 hour drive to Denver, 2.5 hour drive to Wichita, and over 2 hours to Manhattan from Hays. No, there aren't many people who live in the huge expanse of western Kansas and eastern Colorado, but this is the kind of service that could significantly enhance the ability to do business in that region.


Agree 100%. I grew up out there and it is a long haul to drive out from Chicago. I wish they would get a direct flight from ORD-GCK because the flight from DFW-GCK is a crap shoot if it will be delayed or cancelled.
72?, 732/3/7/8/9, 763/4, 772/3, 744, 788/@, MD88/90, F100, 319/20/21, 330/32/33, 359, E145/135/175/195, CRJ200/700, B206, 152/72/8
 
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knope2001
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Re: OAG Changes 1/7/2018:HA Adds LGB; UA adds DEN-ATW/ORF,IAH-CAK/DAY,LAX-ACV,ORD-BIS/SLN,SFO-MSN; AM Drops DEN-MEX

Mon Jan 08, 2018 1:45 am

mke717spotter wrote:
enilria wrote:
That's a shocker
*UA SFO-MSN JUN 0>0.8 JUL 0>1.0 AUG 0>1.0 SEP 0>1.0

First MSN beat out MKE in terms of getting a DL SLC flight and now they've gotten UA to SFO as well! In the meantime WN has cut back MKE-SFO and made it seasonal.


It remains to be seen if Southwest will again cut MKE-SFO seasonally or not. In 2017-2018 they had a significant aircraft shortage and non-competitive long-haul flights which don't contribute significantly to the network connectivity were a comparably easy place to free up capacity. MKE-SFO was one of those. Now one could rightly ask why they did not immediately restore MKE-SFO as soon as possible in 2018. But on the flipside given the choice it does make sense for Southwest to add sunbird flying during that peak rather than get MKE-SFO back flying and adding flights to places like PHX and FL later in the year.

As for Madison having much higher yields to San Francisco than Milwaukee the gap isn't typically that large. Plus it's not uncommon for bargain-seeking leisure traffic to bleed to bigger airports with better fares. Here are the average fares to the bay area (SFO+OAK+SJC) for the year ended 6/30/2017 (most recent available info)

$280.15 MSN
$242.76 MKE
$242.07 ORD
$219.97 MDW

The most recent quarter for Madison (Q2 2017) showed a notable fare spike which makes the full-year average quite a bit higher. Not clear if that's a reporting anomaly (these numbers are 10% samples) or a meaningful, durable jump:

Madison-Bay Area Average Fare
$267.81 Q2 2016
$255.40 Q3 2016
$271.60 Q4 2016
$255.19 Q1 2017
$338.40 Q2 2017

For the year ended 3/31/2016 the average fare was $262.50. Still a notch higher than MKE or ORD but not massively so. With a nonstop flight on MSN-SFO it's likely the local O+D count will increase but the average fare will slip.

mke717spotter wrote:
I see that AS is upgrading MKE-SEA to mainline in March. That would still leave DL using E175s on the route, but according to Wikipedia its ending in June?

Yes -- actually by May there won't be an E75 flying MKE-SEA. Alaska switches to Mainline in March and Delta switches to mainline in May. (And then Southwest resumes in June.)
 
RJNUT
Posts: 1862
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Re: OAG Changes 1/7/2018:HA Adds LGB; UA adds DEN-ATW/ORF,IAH-CAK/DAY,LAX-ACV,ORD-BIS/SLN,SFO-MSN; AM Drops DEN-MEX

Mon Jan 08, 2018 1:45 am

md94 wrote:
AVLAirlineFreq wrote:
knope2001 wrote:

I'm sure this isn't the most captivating topic for many as Hays is pretty small. But I am very encouraged to see better service patterns for small communities, especially on branded regional jets. The subsidies which support these flights are not cheap and have been tenuous for years. If airlines can figure ways to give useful, reasonably-well patronized service to these communities the subsidies can get smaller and the danger of losing it can lessen. Nothing sadder for a small-community air service advocate like myself to see us spending $2-3m per year to pay for unreliable EAS flights which are little utilized. So this kind of thing is encouraging.



This is also the kind of destination you want to see work. It's a 4.5 hour drive to Denver, 2.5 hour drive to Wichita, and over 2 hours to Manhattan from Hays. No, there aren't many people who live in the huge expanse of western Kansas and eastern Colorado, but this is the kind of service that could significantly enhance the ability to do business in that region.


Agree 100%. I grew up out there and it is a long haul to drive out from Chicago. I wish they would get a direct flight from ORD-GCK because the flight from DFW-GCK is a crap shoot if it will be delayed or cancelled.

Oh, you can rest assured of a crap shoot on any of the EAS services regardless of carrier or hub served
 
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klm617
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Re: OAG Changes 1/7/2018:HA Adds LGB; UA adds DEN-ATW/ORF,IAH-CAK/DAY,LAX-ACV,ORD-BIS/SLN,SFO-MSN; AM Drops DEN-MEX

Mon Jan 08, 2018 1:46 am

NWADTWE16 wrote:
So what is the actual frequency year round for RJ DTW-AMM? and does anyone have the loads or at least the link to where they are stored. I know they have been shared before I believe



Ir's 2 times per week year round in the low season via YUL and in the summer nonstop.
the truth does matter, guys. too bad it's often quite subjective. the truth is beyond the mere facts and figures. it's beyond good and bad, right and wrong...
 
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klm617
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Re: OAG Changes 1/7/2018:HA Adds LGB; UA adds DEN-ATW/ORF,IAH-CAK/DAY,LAX-ACV,ORD-BIS/SLN,SFO-MSN; AM Drops DEN-MEX

Mon Jan 08, 2018 1:53 am

SFOtoORD wrote:
AAvgeek744 wrote:
SFOtoORD wrote:

You seem to be making quite a leap. Which post says only tech companies fill planes? The Bay Area’s biggest industry is tech, but also several others including pharma and healthcare that were mentioned in posts above.


In this, and countless other threads I've read, when there is new service to the Bay area, you can count on comments about the flight being fueled by the tech industry.


And when there are flights to Detroit people talk about automotive, when there are flights to NYC there is talk about financial services, DC leads to talk about capital-to-capital, flights from Germany to the South lead to talk about all the German companies with manufacturing in the South. So how is saying that a tech connection in the Bay Area is glorifying tech? Every region has a major industry. Shouldn’t be a big deal to talk about that as something that might contribute to new air service.



I agree but for the most part it seems to be that the only industry that is going to fuel growth in the commercial aviation industry is the tech industry. Germany is more connected to Detroit as far as manufacturing goes than the south is.
the truth does matter, guys. too bad it's often quite subjective. the truth is beyond the mere facts and figures. it's beyond good and bad, right and wrong...
 
SFOtoORD
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Re: OAG Changes 1/7/2018:HA Adds LGB; UA adds DEN-ATW/ORF,IAH-CAK/DAY,LAX-ACV,ORD-BIS/SLN,SFO-MSN; AM Drops DEN-MEX

Mon Jan 08, 2018 2:34 am

klm617 wrote:
SFOtoORD wrote:
AAvgeek744 wrote:

In this, and countless other threads I've read, when there is new service to the Bay area, you can count on comments about the flight being fueled by the tech industry.


And when there are flights to Detroit people talk about automotive, when there are flights to NYC there is talk about financial services, DC leads to talk about capital-to-capital, flights from Germany to the South lead to talk about all the German companies with manufacturing in the South. So how is saying that a tech connection in the Bay Area is glorifying tech? Every region has a major industry. Shouldn’t be a big deal to talk about that as something that might contribute to new air service.



I agree but for the most part it seems to be that the only industry that is going to fuel growth in the commercial aviation industry is the tech industry. Germany is more connected to Detroit as far as manufacturing goes than the south is.


You’re being silly/overreacting on tech. There are a myriad of historical threads w the exact same discussion about other cities/industries.

The South comment came from the number of times there have been threads about how LH maintains service to CLT. BMW, Daimler, Siemens, Henkel and Bosch all have meaningful footprints in the Carolinas.
 
MDGLongBeach
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Re: OAG Changes 1/7/2018:HA Adds LGB; UA adds DEN-ATW/ORF,IAH-CAK/DAY,LAX-ACV,ORD-BIS/SLN,SFO-MSN; AM Drops DEN-MEX

Mon Jan 08, 2018 2:42 am

Ok so I'm from LGB, tried understanding what 1.0<0 meant? Does that mean it goes round trip once a day? Excited that HA is coming!
 
slcdeltarumd11
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Re: OAG Changes 1/7/2018:HA Adds LGB; UA adds DEN-ATW/ORF,IAH-CAK/DAY,LAX-ACV,ORD-BIS/SLN,SFO-MSN; AM Drops DEN-MEX

Mon Jan 08, 2018 2:50 am

enilria wrote:
*AM DEN-MEX APR 0.4>0.2 MAY 0.3>0 JUN 0.3>0 JUL 0.3>0 AUG 0.3>0 SEP 0.3>0


I wish i could say this was surprising. AM is just sad with their USA flights. I hate to see them leave Denver.

It is really cool to see HA in LGB. I think that will work out well for them.
Last edited by slcdeltarumd11 on Mon Jan 08, 2018 2:58 am, edited 1 time in total.
 
Cubsrule
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Re: OAG Changes 1/7/2018:HA Adds LGB; UA adds DEN-ATW/ORF,IAH-CAK/DAY,LAX-ACV,ORD-BIS/SLN,SFO-MSN; AM Drops DEN-MEX

Mon Jan 08, 2018 2:51 am

Midwestindy wrote:
SFOtoORD wrote:
Midwestindy wrote:

Pretty straight forward, CMH and IND had incentives to start flights to the Bay Area, both of which had at least double the PDEW to the Bay Area, more connections, larger tech industries, and are in general more proven markets.....


I don’t see it. Any time I go to Madison, a ton of the SFO-DEN/ORD passengers end up on my DEN/ORD-MSN flights. I’m also not aware of particularly large Tech in either of those markets other than SFDC’s in IND. Epic has their marquee customer Kaiser in the Bay Area Plus Sutter, Stanford and a couple other health systems. With 75 seats this shouldn’t be tough to fill. Probably some smaller CA markets that gain one-stop service as well.


I don't know enough to speak entirely for CMH but I know in terms of jobs, CMH and IND have around 2x the amount tech jobs that MSN does. For IND, Roche (which spent $149.2 million on US travel in 2016) has its US HQ and 2nd largest US office in IND and the Bay Area. As you mentioned, Salesforce Marketing Cloud is HQ'd in IND with a couple thousand employees, while Salesforce is HQ'd in SFO. Genesys has its largest office in the Bay Area, and 2nd or 3rd largest in IND. e.t.c, e.t.c IND this summer will have 4 daily flights to the Bay Area, so there is definitely a tech market

Cool that MSN gets a west coast link though, I just would have thought LAX would have been first.


I'm a little confused. I realize that tech jobs are a highly imperfect analog for SFO demand, but if IND has twice the tech jobs but something like 6 times the number of seats, why wouldn't MSN-SFO make sense?

Seeing SFO before LAX speaks to the tech industry in Madison and the strength of the hub, and maybe also to the fact that DL - the obvious choice to start LAX-MSN - is short on gate space at LAX.

knope2001 wrote:
jetmatt777 wrote:
knope2001 wrote:
EAS flying. HYS-DEN has been running twice daily with 50-seat RJ's but (unlike stronger plains RJ markets like Manhattan, Grand Island, Garden City) Hays' traffic is thin and per-passenger subsidy is comparably high. Now that Salina has been awarded to Skywest the twice-daily DEN-HYS flights will operate DEN-HYS-SLN. Plus one of the DEN-HYS-SLN flights will continue on to ORD. Both markets will have access to two hubs and planes will run fuller -- hopefully for less total subsidy than independent twice-daily RJ nonstops to Hays and to Salina would have cost.



I was in Hays last month and ran into the mayor. He told me that getting UA to start ORD was a major priority for his city. Looks like he got his wish, albeit thru SLN. I'm sure they are happy!


Glad to hear they are excited about it. Not only will they have a 1-stop flight to Chicago which will offer more connections east, but the afternoon HYS-DEN flight will run a few hours earlier as part of the change. Right now the afternoon HYS-DEN flight gets into Denver too late to connect most places east of the Mississippi, so effectively Hays has only has that morning flight if you need to go to Atlanta, or Florida, or Boston, etc. This changes opens that up quite a bit. And Chicago itself is likely fairly high on the destination list for Hays.

I'm sure this isn't the most captivating topic for many as Hays is pretty small. But I am very encouraged to see better service patterns for small communities, especially on branded regional jets. The subsidies which support these flights are not cheap and have been tenuous for years. If airlines can figure ways to give useful, reasonably-well patronized service to these communities the subsidies can get smaller and the danger of losing it can lessen. Nothing sadder for a small-community air service advocate like myself to see us spending $2-3m per year to pay for unreliable EAS flights which are little utilized. So this kind of thing is encouraging.


Reliable branded flying seems to be the only ticket out of EAS or to lower subsidies. Regional jet service got COU and MHK out of EAS, and the only sub-$1MM subsidies in the lower 48 right now are for jet service by either Eagle or OO. In a similar vein, reliable service on Piedmont to the likes of FLO, HTS, and IPT has likely kept those places out of the program.
I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more
 
axiom
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Re: OAG Changes 1/7/2018:HA Adds LGB; UA adds DEN-ATW/ORF,IAH-CAK/DAY,LAX-ACV,ORD-BIS/SLN,SFO-MSN; AM Drops DEN-MEX

Mon Jan 08, 2018 3:03 am

slcdeltarumd11 wrote:
enilria wrote:
*AM DEN-MEX APR 0.4>0.2 MAY 0.3>0 JUN 0.3>0 JUL 0.3>0 AUG 0.3>0 SEP 0.3>0


I wish i could say this was surprising. AM is just sad with their USA flights. I hate to see them leave Denver.


Indeed, sad to see AM drop DEN. Does anyone have any perspective on why AM has been reducing so much US capacity lately? Is it a function of the DL JV?
 
axiom
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Re: OAG Changes 1/7/2018:HA Adds LGB; UA adds DEN-ATW/ORF,IAH-CAK/DAY,LAX-ACV,ORD-BIS/SLN,SFO-MSN; AM Drops DEN-MEX

Mon Jan 08, 2018 3:09 am

AAvgeek744 wrote:
SFOtoORD wrote:
klm617 wrote:

Why does everyone think tech jobs fuel the airline business. Everyone flies not just tech people. It's like everyone has to glorify the tech industry.


You seem to be making quite a leap. Which post says only tech companies fill planes? The Bay Area’s biggest industry is tech, but also several others including pharma and healthcare that were mentioned in posts above.


In this, and countless other threads I've read, when there is new service to the Bay area, you can count on comments about the flight being fueled by the tech industry.


Which is fair, and a good reason to begin to identify why two places might indeed share demand, but by no means an end point. The San Franciscio regional economy may be the capital of tech, but it also has a huge and diversified economy. I hope that goes without saying.

The problem is that some folks here tend to operate with a simplistic view of regional economics. Sam Francisco is tech. Boston is universities. Florida is trash holiday and VFR.

There are elements of trust in these narratives, but only just. Simplifications can become dogma. Simplifications beget more simplification. It becomes the basis for the equivalent of dick measuring.

Enilria, thanks for this thread. I've been enjoying them for what must be more than a decade, and I so appreciate it.
 
Dominion301
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Re: OAG Changes 1/7/2018:HA Adds LGB; UA adds DEN-ATW/ORF,IAH-CAK/DAY,LAX-ACV,ORD-BIS/SLN,SFO-MSN; AM Drops DEN-MEX

Mon Jan 08, 2018 3:20 am

klm617 wrote:
lavalampluva wrote:
Looks like RJ DTW-YUL Is just suspended for the month of June.



Perhaps an earlier start for the DTW-AMN Nonstop


I believe RJ have 5th freedom traffic rights on YUL-DTW. Can anyone confirm this?
 
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knope2001
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Re: OAG Changes 1/7/2018:HA Adds LGB; UA adds DEN-ATW/ORF,IAH-CAK/DAY,LAX-ACV,ORD-BIS/SLN,SFO-MSN; AM Drops DEN-MEX

Mon Jan 08, 2018 3:33 am

Cubsrule wrote:
Reliable branded flying seems to be the only ticket out of EAS or to lower subsidies. Regional jet service got COU and MHK out of EAS, and the only sub-$1MM subsidies in the lower 48 right now are for jet service by either Eagle or OO. In a similar vein, reliable service on Piedmont to the likes of FLO, HTS, and IPT has likely kept those places out of the program.


That is a really good (and generally overlooked) point. Were some of these smallest unsubsidized markets to have slipped onto the EAS roller coaster their local markets could have been killed off by the poor service some cities have endured. Joplin is a good example -- when Great Lakes had the EAS market and flew Beech 1900's unreliably to Kansas City (when KC no longer had a connecting hub) they were down to about 120 enplanements per week ten years ago. With branded service on AA* to Dallas they enplane more like 525 per week and the per-passenger subsidy is $9, lowest in the EAS system. Manhattan and Columbia are off EAS completely. Those are among the best cases of course, and a market like Hays or Salina is probably never going to get quite that far. But the more branded RJ service helps markets move in that direction, including when 1-stop flights are part of the picture, the better chance subsidies are tolerable and possibly even something state and local governments and local businesses could share in a post-EAS world or reimagined EAS world.
 
lavalampluva
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Re: OAG Changes 1/7/2018:HA Adds LGB; UA adds DEN-ATW/ORF,IAH-CAK/DAY,LAX-ACV,ORD-BIS/SLN,SFO-MSN; AM Drops DEN-MEX

Mon Jan 08, 2018 3:43 am

Dominion301 wrote:
klm617 wrote:
lavalampluva wrote:
Looks like RJ DTW-YUL Is just suspended for the month of June.



Perhaps an earlier start for the DTW-AMN Nonstop


I believe RJ have 5th freedom traffic rights on YUL-DTW. Can anyone confirm this?

No. They do not.
Remind me to send a thank you note to Mr. Boeing.
 
Jshank83
Posts: 3684
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Re: OAG Changes 1/7/2018:HA Adds LGB; UA adds DEN-ATW/ORF,IAH-CAK/DAY,LAX-ACV,ORD-BIS/SLN,SFO-MSN; AM Drops DEN-MEX

Mon Jan 08, 2018 4:09 am

jetmatt777 wrote:

Really, it is pretty impressive range for a 76 seater. They are very comfortable too. I'd rather that long of a flight on an E175 compared to a mainline jet.


I agree with this. My one time on a E175 was much more comfortable than a mainline.
 
ericm2031
Posts: 1428
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Re: OAG Changes 1/7/2018:HA Adds LGB; UA adds DEN-ATW/ORF,IAH-CAK/DAY,LAX-ACV,ORD-BIS/SLN,SFO-MSN; AM Drops DEN-MEX

Mon Jan 08, 2018 5:11 am

knope2001 wrote:
FATFlyer wrote:
knope2001 wrote:
Here are the longest scheduled E175 routes in the US in statute miles:

1773 MSN-SFO
1735 STL-SFO
1731 FAT-ORD (begins 6/7/18)
1718 MKE-PDX
1715 AUS-PDX
1709 STL-SEA
1708 STL-PDX
1694 MKE-SEA
1616 DFW-PDX

Edited to include FAT-ORD


Thanks -- forgot that was coming...


PSP-ORD clocks in at 1652
 
77H
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Re: OAG Changes 1/7/2018:HA Adds LGB; UA adds DEN-ATW/ORF,IAH-CAK/DAY,LAX-ACV,ORD-BIS/SLN,SFO-MSN; AM Drops DEN-MEX

Mon Jan 08, 2018 5:55 am

plane1205 wrote:
Midwestindy wrote:
enilria wrote:
That's a shocker
*UA SFO-MSN JUN 0>0.8 JUL 0>1.0 AUG 0>1.0 SEP 0>1.0


Likely some financial incentives behind it, PDEW was only around 75-80 for Q1/Q2 of 2017


With Epic Software continuing to expand, I’m sure they saw an opportuntity to add a flight and capture some West coast connecting traffic.


Called this months ago on a Midwest Routes thread for those same reasons. Great to see it come to fruition. Interesting to see it ahead of MKE which is twice as large although WN already has that pair served.

77H
 
slcdeltarumd11
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Re: OAG Changes 1/7/2018:HA Adds LGB; UA adds DEN-ATW/ORF,IAH-CAK/DAY,LAX-ACV,ORD-BIS/SLN,SFO-MSN; AM Drops DEN-MEX

Mon Jan 08, 2018 6:30 am

Hays Kansas is exactly the kind of place that deserves EAS service. I totally agree with opinions stated here. It's isolated and far from any airport. The area needs a link for emergencies and business. It's a lifeline.

Some EAS applications should not even be allowed to apply but this is a good example of a city and area that deserves it. It's a long drive to anywhere.
 
Bobloblaw
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Re: OAG Changes 1/7/2018:HA Adds LGB; UA adds DEN-ATW/ORF,IAH-CAK/DAY,LAX-ACV,ORD-BIS/SLN,SFO-MSN; AM Drops DEN-MEX

Mon Jan 08, 2018 6:40 am

I didnt realize cities could be added to EAS. I knew cities could be taken off.
 
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knope2001
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Re: OAG Changes 1/7/2018:HA Adds LGB; UA adds DEN-ATW/ORF,IAH-CAK/DAY,LAX-ACV,ORD-BIS/SLN,SFO-MSN; AM Drops DEN-MEX

Mon Jan 08, 2018 1:03 pm

Bobloblaw wrote:
I didnt realize cities could be added to EAS. I knew cities could be taken off.


You're right that no new communities can be added, but Hays has been on EAS for the length of the program. What's changed is the service pattern which links Hays to Salina and opens up new access to Chicago in addition to Denver.

Currently:
Skywest runs HYS-DEN 2x/day with 50-seat RJ
Great Lakes runs SLN-DEN with 30-seat EM2

Hays doesn't have the traffic to support 100 daily seats by itself.
Salina can generate more than Hays but 100 daily seats (if they were to get similar twice-daily RJ's) is still probably more than needed, and the current Great Lakes flights don't maximize Salina's potential.

New:
Skywest will run twice-daily SLN-HYS-DEN 50-seat RJ's, but one of those flights will originate in ORD operating ORD-SLN-HYS-DEN. These cities will now have flights both east and west, three useful departures each weekday (meaning better connecting options and better recovery during irregular ops), and only 75 seats each.

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