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unrave
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Re: India Aviation Thread - 2018

Mon Mar 26, 2018 4:26 am

Irehdna wrote:
Air India has an improving product, but the vast majority of the population don't realise that and still flock to ME3/LH.

There are multiple reasons why people prefer the ME3 over AI, but a major gripe for south Indians is that AI comes across as a north centred airline. If you're flying to HYD, on EK you'll get loads of Telugu entertainment, menu printed in Telugu etc. compared to AI which doesn't stock even a single non Bollywood Indian movie. Another major factor is that clearing customs/ immigration at HYD/BLR/MAA/COK is far quicker than at DEL. Nevertheless AI has taken massive strides in the last 3-4 years in developing a decent hub at DEL which is definitely a positive for Indian flyers. I wish they also improve their domestic connectivity with DEL: AI, for example, does not fly from DEL to CJB, the 19th busiest airport in India.
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binayak
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Re: India Aviation Thread - 2018

Mon Mar 26, 2018 6:33 am

https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/in ... 459105.cms
9W wants to fly to CIS??? Is that a good market to be considered given AI's failure at Moscow
Can BOM JNB or BOM PVG be done with the max? If so I think those are the ones 9W should consider .
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globetrotter94
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Re: India Aviation Thread - 2018

Mon Mar 26, 2018 6:37 am

binayak wrote:
https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/industry/transportation/airlines-/-aviation/jet-airways-plans-new-trips-abroad-with-boeing-737-max-planes/articleshow/63459105.cms
9W wants to fly to CIS??? Is that a good market to be considered given AI's failure at Moscow
Can BOM JNB or BOM PVG be done with the max? If so I think those are the ones 9W should consider .


1 think 9W can do in CIS that AI couldn't do: get in bed with Aeroflot (SU)--they seem to prefer partnerships with Skyteam players these days.
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globetrotter94
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Re: India Aviation Thread - 2018

Mon Mar 26, 2018 6:40 am

binayak wrote:
AI's success might provoke 9W to start US flights . The american carriers don't seem to be interested in india at all. For them india will always be low yielding . Any ways UA has lost a good opportunity and I don't think there will be any more frequency additions in this route for a couple of years.


Only at the risk of gaining the ire of their partners at AF/KL/DL. As for the US carriers, the thing is, I feel they are still largely driven by their pre-liberalization model of being mostly domestic carriers with much smaller international outreach (certainly no competition to the likes of the EUB3 or the MEB3). Still, UA manages to find enough yield to justify EWR-BOM/DEL year-round, and shows no signs of running.
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globetrotter94
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Re: India Aviation Thread - 2018

Mon Mar 26, 2018 6:48 am

Irehdna wrote:
Air India has an improving product, but the vast majority of the population don't realise that and still flock to ME3/LH.


AI should run better ad campaigns to match the efforts of EU carriers or the MEB3. Search 'Air India ad' on YouTube and you are quite likely to be disappointed. On the rare occasion that they do release an ad, it comes off as boring or stereotypical. Something more than a bunch of random people sitting on a plane, eating or watching TV and making complimentary reviews would be appreciated. I also feel that other elements of the AI brand have also failed to keep up, including the puzzled evolution of the Maharajah and the lack of a boarding theme.
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unrave
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Re: India Aviation Thread - 2018

Mon Mar 26, 2018 7:04 am

binayak wrote:
https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/industry/transportation/airlines-/-aviation/jet-airways-plans-new-trips-abroad-with-boeing-737-max-planes/articleshow/63459105.cms
9W wants to fly to CIS??? Is that a good market to be considered given AI's failure at Moscow
Can BOM JNB or BOM PVG be done with the max? If so I think those are the ones 9W should consider .


BOM PVG could be done with the MAX but BOM JNB is definitely not possible.
9W has to find new markets if it wishes to grow. It simply cannot match the LCCs in domestic milk runs and the Gulf/Singapore.
17April2019: RIP Jet Airways
 
binayak
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Re: India Aviation Thread - 2018

Mon Mar 26, 2018 7:09 am

globetrotter94 wrote:
binayak wrote:
AI's success might provoke 9W to start US flights . The american carriers don't seem to be interested in india at all. For them india will always be low yielding . Any ways UA has lost a good opportunity and I don't think there will be any more frequency additions in this route for a couple of years.


Only at the risk of gaining the ire of their partners at AF/KL/DL. As for the US carriers, the thing is, I feel they are still largely driven by their pre-liberalization model of being mostly domestic carriers with much smaller international outreach (certainly no competition to the likes of the EUB3 or the MEB3). Still, UA manages to find enough yield to justify EWR-BOM/DEL year-round, and shows no signs of running.

Why so?? The entire joint venture fails to provide a choice of timing to pax where ME3 wins. Once Navi Mumbai comes up, an afternoon bank of 9W flights to US will be helpful for those who don't want to leave at night hours.
AI's afternoon flights from Delhi to EU are succesful because that is what we Indians are most comfortable with.. That non flights to US can be successful now.....AI has proved it. 9W has even better brand reputation than them. There is no reason why they can't be successful. With cooperation with Delta pax can go to even smaller cities in US where long haul flights are not viable.
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binayak
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Re: India Aviation Thread - 2018

Mon Mar 26, 2018 7:14 am

unrave wrote:
binayak wrote:
https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/industry/transportation/airlines-/-aviation/jet-airways-plans-new-trips-abroad-with-boeing-737-max-planes/articleshow/63459105.cms
9W wants to fly to CIS??? Is that a good market to be considered given AI's failure at Moscow
Can BOM JNB or BOM PVG be done with the max? If so I think those are the ones 9W should consider .


BOM PVG could be done with the MAX but BOM JNB is definitely not possible.
9W has to find new markets if it wishes to grow. It simply cannot match the LCCs in domestic milk runs and the Gulf/Singapore.

Best will be to deploy as many as possible in domestic and improve market share there. With around 150 narrow bodies by 2024, they might have ~20% market share which is still decent for an FSC in india.
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globetrotter94
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Re: India Aviation Thread - 2018

Mon Mar 26, 2018 7:17 am

binayak wrote:
globetrotter94 wrote:
binayak wrote:
AI's success might provoke 9W to start US flights . The american carriers don't seem to be interested in india at all. For them india will always be low yielding . Any ways UA has lost a good opportunity and I don't think there will be any more frequency additions in this route for a couple of years.


Only at the risk of gaining the ire of their partners at AF/KL/DL. As for the US carriers, the thing is, I feel they are still largely driven by their pre-liberalization model of being mostly domestic carriers with much smaller international outreach (certainly no competition to the likes of the EUB3 or the MEB3). Still, UA manages to find enough yield to justify EWR-BOM/DEL year-round, and shows no signs of running.

Why so?? The entire joint venture fails to provide a choice of timing to pax where ME3 wins. Once Navi Mumbai comes up, an afternoon bank of 9W flights to US will be helpful for those who don't want to leave at night hours.
AI's afternoon flights from Delhi to EU are succesful because that is what we Indians are most comfortable with.. That non flights to US can be successful now.....AI has proved it. 9W has even better brand reputation than them. There is no reason why they can't be successful. With cooperation with Delta pax can go to even smaller cities in US where long haul flights are not viable.


Yes, but currently, AF/KL are hoping to use 9W to claw back marketshare on US-India. So, I am not certain they would react positively to being cut out as the middle-men. On the other hand, I guess there is scope if they opt for direct cooperation with DL, but my impression was that as of now, it is actually AF/KL that 9W has stronger ties with, rather than DL?
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dtw2hyd
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Re: India Aviation Thread - 2018

Mon Mar 26, 2018 7:35 am

binayak wrote:
globetrotter94 wrote:
binayak wrote:
AI's success might provoke 9W to start US flights . The american carriers don't seem to be interested in india at all. For them india will always be low yielding . Any ways UA has lost a good opportunity and I don't think there will be any more frequency additions in this route for a couple of years.


Only at the risk of gaining the ire of their partners at AF/KL/DL. As for the US carriers, the thing is, I feel they are still largely driven by their pre-liberalization model of being mostly domestic carriers with much smaller international outreach (certainly no competition to the likes of the EUB3 or the MEB3). Still, UA manages to find enough yield to justify EWR-BOM/DEL year-round, and shows no signs of running.

Why so?? The entire joint venture fails to provide a choice of timing to pax where ME3 wins. Once Navi Mumbai comes up, an afternoon bank of 9W flights to US will be helpful for those who don't want to leave at night hours.
AI's afternoon flights from Delhi to EU are succesful because that is what we Indians are most comfortable with.. That non flights to US can be successful now.....AI has proved it. 9W has even better brand reputation than them. There is no reason why they can't be successful. With cooperation with Delta pax can go to even smaller cities in US where long haul flights are not viable.


Because 9 hr India-Europe flights are more profitable than 14 hr India-US flights. With every new station-AMS/CDG gives one-stop access to 35+ North American cities. ME3 can never match this.
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unrave
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Re: India Aviation Thread - 2018

Mon Mar 26, 2018 8:00 am

AI disinvestment update for the day: EoI will likely have a clause stipulating no job losses for one year post acquisition
http://www.business-standard.com/articl ... 585_1.html
While this will have a negative impact on the valuation, this is one way of keeping the unions quiet.
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binayak
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Re: India Aviation Thread - 2018

Mon Mar 26, 2018 8:53 am

globetrotter94 wrote:
binayak wrote:
globetrotter94 wrote:

Only at the risk of gaining the ire of their partners at AF/KL/DL. As for the US carriers, the thing is, I feel they are still largely driven by their pre-liberalization model of being mostly domestic carriers with much smaller international outreach (certainly no competition to the likes of the EUB3 or the MEB3). Still, UA manages to find enough yield to justify EWR-BOM/DEL year-round, and shows no signs of running.

Why so?? The entire joint venture fails to provide a choice of timing to pax where ME3 wins. Once Navi Mumbai comes up, an afternoon bank of 9W flights to US will be helpful for those who don't want to leave at night hours.
AI's afternoon flights from Delhi to EU are succesful because that is what we Indians are most comfortable with.. That non flights to US can be successful now.....AI has proved it. 9W has even better brand reputation than them. There is no reason why they can't be successful. With cooperation with Delta pax can go to even smaller cities in US where long haul flights are not viable.


Yes, but currently, AF/KL are hoping to use 9W to claw back marketshare on US-India. So, I am not certain they would react positively to being cut out as the middle-men. On the other hand, I guess there is scope if they opt for direct cooperation with DL, but my impression was that as of now, it is actually AF/KL that 9W has stronger ties with, rather than DL?

I was predicting 9W to fly to USA by 2021 not tomorrow. As of now they can work with AF KLM. However India USA market is rising in demand and 9W being an Indian longer haul airline can't leave this market untapped for a long time. After all 9W is the major benefitter of the JV not AF KLM. So I don't think it will make much of a difference for the latter.
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CaliguyNYC
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Re: India Aviation Thread - 2018

Mon Mar 26, 2018 1:59 pm

unrave wrote:
Irehdna wrote:
Air India has an improving product, but the vast majority of the population don't realise that and still flock to ME3/LH.

There are multiple reasons why people prefer the ME3 over AI, but a major gripe for south Indians is that AI comes across as a north centred airline. If you're flying to HYD, on EK you'll get loads of Telugu entertainment, menu printed in Telugu etc. compared to AI which doesn't stock even a single non Bollywood Indian movie. Another major factor is that clearing customs/ immigration at HYD/BLR/MAA/COK is far quicker than at DEL. Nevertheless AI has taken massive strides in the last 3-4 years in developing a decent hub at DEL which is definitely a positive for Indian flyers. I wish they also improve their domestic connectivity with DEL: AI, for example, does not fly from DEL to CJB, the 19th busiest airport in India.


So not true, AI does offer South Indian films. That said, people, including S Indians, do not fly AI for great customized service. They fly AI because it's an Indian airline where people know how they will be treated (good or bad). AI has done well on their flights to the US to cities where they offer one stop, IMHO, because: (1) some people feel more comfortable flying an Indian airline or sending their parents via an Indian airline, (2) some people are more comfortable connecting in India vs the ME or CDG, (3) the flight timings allow for better arrival and departure times to many Indian cities (not to mention the ability to connect to smaller cities without long wait (4) some prefer clearing customs/immigration during their 2 hour connections (use the time well) while others in the final destination - AI offers both options for key destinations and (5) if you miss your DEL connection, chances are you can get rebooked on another flight/airline. If you want high end J you don't fly AI. I think you need to ask yourself why a flight like ORD-DEL-HYD has been so popular with HYD people? So while I am not doubting that some people feel AI is biased (hell this forum has like three or so super vocal people, the vast majority of Indians in both the US and India view AI like the above. AI won't work for everyone, but it doesn't need to. It's niche is VFR Indians and discounted J.

On the 9W nonstops to the US - I think 9W will begin JFK-BOM nonstop because it would be a hub to hub flight that has decent J demand. I think it will be an afternoon departure from JFK and an early night departure form BOM (like 10pm getting into JFK at 5am). This way pax have some options and you would open up connections to many smaller Indian cities. The poster that said AF/KL/DL want the traffic flowing through Europe are right to a point. But I am sure DL recognizes that for more premium pax to switch from ME3, 9W and DL/AF/KL/VS need to offer choice.
 
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Re: India Aviation Thread - 2018

Mon Mar 26, 2018 9:34 pm

globetrotter94 wrote:
binayak wrote:
globetrotter94 wrote:

Only at the risk of gaining the ire of their partners at AF/KL/DL. As for the US carriers, the thing is, I feel they are still largely driven by their pre-liberalization model of being mostly domestic carriers with much smaller international outreach (certainly no competition to the likes of the EUB3 or the MEB3). Still, UA manages to find enough yield to justify EWR-BOM/DEL year-round, and shows no signs of running.

Why so?? The entire joint venture fails to provide a choice of timing to pax where ME3 wins. Once Navi Mumbai comes up, an afternoon bank of 9W flights to US will be helpful for those who don't want to leave at night hours.
AI's afternoon flights from Delhi to EU are succesful because that is what we Indians are most comfortable with.. That non flights to US can be successful now.....AI has proved it. 9W has even better brand reputation than them. There is no reason why they can't be successful. With cooperation with Delta pax can go to even smaller cities in US where long haul flights are not viable.


Yes, but currently, AF/KL are hoping to use 9W to claw back marketshare on US-India. So, I am not certain they would react positively to being cut out as the middle-men. On the other hand, I guess there is scope if they opt for direct cooperation with DL, but my impression was that as of now, it is actually AF/KL that 9W has stronger ties with, rather than DL?


And outside of JFK and possibly ATL, there is no good DL hub for an Indian carrier. And JFK is fairly limited for domestic flights. (Destinations that could warrant non-stop India-US would be JFK, EWR, ORD, IAD, SFO, LAX and possibly IAH/DFW/ATL.)

Better to focus on LHR, CDG, AMS from more Indian cities.
 
nmraja
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Re: India Aviation Thread - 2018

Mon Mar 26, 2018 9:39 pm

SEA could be another option for the Northwest US, considering the fact that DL has significant presence there.

I hope MAA gets the AMS connection from 9W, not sure how the recently introduced MAA-CDG is doing.
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Re: India Aviation Thread - 2018

Mon Mar 26, 2018 11:41 pm

nmraja wrote:
SEA could be another option for the Northwest US, considering the fact that DL has significant presence there.

I hope MAA gets the AMS connection from 9W, not sure how the recently introduced MAA-CDG is doing.


But in order to sustain a ULH flight like BOM-SEA, you would need some level of premium O&D traffic between these city pairs. Not convinced that that exists.
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slickvik
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Re: India Aviation Thread - 2018

Tue Mar 27, 2018 3:09 am

Any hope for IXC once the runway upgradation is finally complete? I don't know which countries it is a point of call for but it has a great location for potential flights.
 
sand26391
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Re: India Aviation Thread - 2018

Tue Mar 27, 2018 5:10 am

nmraja wrote:
SEA could be another option for the Northwest US, considering the fact that DL has significant presence there.

I hope MAA gets the AMS connection from 9W, not sure how the recently introduced MAA-CDG is doing.


Very unlikely... the carrier is slowly establishing BLR as a hub in the south. Ofcourse BOM/DEL is its 1st choice for expansion, the carrier is already changing a few domestic flights to suite its SIN/AMS connectivity + adding new DOM flights from the city for SS'18. Once they get the MAX, expect them to add a few more int'l flights from BLR & increase DOM freq. Also 9W has codeshared on the AF flight BLR-CDG( for the 1st time) & what this has done is, for the SS'18 AF has gone Daily on the BLR-CDG sector. AF used to go 6x weekly in the summer schedule every year, plus they are likely to start BLR-HKG which helps the DL connection to SEA.
 
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Re: India Aviation Thread - 2018

Tue Mar 27, 2018 5:15 am

slickvik wrote:
Any hope for IXC once the runway upgradation is finally complete? I don't know which countries it is a point of call for but it has a great location for potential flights.


Too close to DEL - No real geographic advantage and limited demand as destination outside VFRs. Easily accessible with a connection via DEL.
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globetrotter94
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Re: India Aviation Thread - 2018

Tue Mar 27, 2018 8:33 am

HNL wrote:
slickvik wrote:
Any hope for IXC once the runway upgradation is finally complete? I don't know which countries it is a point of call for but it has a great location for potential flights.


Too close to DEL - No real geographic advantage and limited demand as destination outside VFRs. Easily accessible with a connection via DEL.


This, and I guess ATQ also carves away demand for IXC to some extent. I have always been fascinated by the presence of "rare" Central Asian carriers like Turkmenistan Airlines and Uzbekistan Airlines at ATQ.
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slickvik
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Re: India Aviation Thread - 2018

Tue Mar 27, 2018 2:31 pm

globetrotter94 wrote:
HNL wrote:
slickvik wrote:
Any hope for IXC once the runway upgradation is finally complete? I don't know which countries it is a point of call for but it has a great location for potential flights.


Too close to DEL - No real geographic advantage and limited demand as destination outside VFRs. Easily accessible with a connection via DEL.


This, and I guess ATQ also carves away demand for IXC to some extent. I have always been fascinated by the presence of "rare" Central Asian carriers like Turkmenistan Airlines and Uzbekistan Airlines at ATQ.


Those airlines have good service and fixed fares.
 
slickvik
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Re: India Aviation Thread - 2018

Tue Mar 27, 2018 4:24 pm

HNL wrote:
slickvik wrote:
Any hope for IXC once the runway upgradation is finally complete? I don't know which countries it is a point of call for but it has a great location for potential flights.


Too close to DEL - No real geographic advantage and limited demand as destination outside VFRs. Easily accessible with a connection via DEL.


The demand is there, unofficially 35-40% of DEL passengers go to Punjab/Himachel/Haryana. From what I’ve heard Delhi airport lobby has done its level best to block flights. That being said there are other complicating factors like bilateral agreements, points of call, and inter fighting between IXC and ATQ over flights.
 
sand26391
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Re: India Aviation Thread - 2018

Tue Mar 27, 2018 5:56 pm

^^ Is there actual proof for ur statement saying 40% of DEL traffic is from PB/HM/HA??? If not then you are just reading too much garbage on newspapers/SSC/Blogs.
I remember the Surat/Vadodara "aviation geeks" like WWWAS quoting something similar about Mumbai pax traffic.
 
slickvik
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Re: India Aviation Thread - 2018

Tue Mar 27, 2018 6:04 pm

sand26391 wrote:
^^ Is there actual proof for ur statement saying 40% of DEL traffic is from PB/HM/HA??? If not then you are just reading too much garbage on newspapers/SSC/Blogs.
I remember the Surat/Vadodara "aviation geeks" like WWWAS quoting something similar about Mumbai pax traffic.


I forgot to add Uttarkhand to that. Not sure of proof but there are various workers for airlines that leak the info out frequently. To be fair, IXC has the additional problem of being an air force airport, and air force is blocking watch hours and CAT III installation for years. I mean I guess my point is that for many people flights to IXC/ATQ would be beneficial because going from Delhi adds a lot of time, as most people take taxi, while only some take train or air due to luggage/timing restrictions. There is a significant diaspora that flies to these places.
 
slickvik
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Re: India Aviation Thread - 2018

Tue Mar 27, 2018 6:05 pm

binayak wrote:
sand26391 wrote:
^^^^
Understood, but what do u have to say with the following logic that many say(On twitter atleast) "There is a large population of Sikhs/Punjabis in BHX and nearby cities, the airline can easily sustain the flight!" Is it just VFR/OD traffic or is there actually Business traffic btw the 2 cities

It's just VFR that too low yielding ones mostly. Yes as unrave pointed out there is a sizable Indian diaspora at BHX so best will be to route them through the airline's hub. No business traffic. More than 90% international business traffic from India are from metro cities only. Well the ATQ BHX flight originates from DEL so there will be some business traffic but not much. This reminds me of AI's " punjab mail " !!!


It's just filling up the 2 days that BHX-DEL isn't running, so no risk. The punjabis actually want it to be ATQ-BHX-YYZ but I personally don't find that to be realistic.
 
slickvik
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Re: India Aviation Thread - 2018

Tue Mar 27, 2018 6:06 pm

CaliguyNYC wrote:
binayak wrote:
CaliguyNYC wrote:

Ugh once again this same viewpoint. There is NO conspiracy against South Indian airports or any airports. BLR and HYD had brand new airports BEFORE BOM. HYD was trumpeted as the ideal Indian hub - never happened. It didn't happen because of O&D demand to HYD. Flights need a mix of O&D and connecting traffic. Most Indian cities lack premium O&D. I would think every Indian city worth anything would want to be connected to DEL, BOM and now even BLR. That is based on economics and govt. Not biases. Also having international connecting pax can help add frequencies to domestic frequencies )so by pushing a ton of international connections to the Gulf you actually lose flight frequencies domestically - which normal citizens of a country would always press for). There are plenty of people who have no issue connecting in Del or BOM - just look at AI's HYD-DEL-ORD. While others want to connect in the Gulf. So be it. The South is very well connected to the Gulf & SEAsia. So really confused why people feel the GOI screwed the South (also the EU bilaterals usually have BLR, HYD, MAA as points of call - airlines just don't always use them). If anything, the South lacks EU connectivity because those pax fly via the Gulf. And if DEL ends up being a global hub w govt help, then so be it. BOM had the chance and the local govt screwed that up (note the govt allowed TRV, BLR, MAA, HYD all to develop which really hurt BOM as well - no one from BOM complains). Now DEL is better suited as an Indian hub because of space, lack of other close by big airports and high O&D due to govt traffic). At least let India have one hub. As someone who's family flies US-BOM, we love that we have the option of AI nonstop to DEL (it gives flight timing options plus one long leg and then a small one - choice/preference). And the national govt didn't kill CCU - the local govt (and by extension the local people who elected said govt) screwed it by literally driving away businesses.

I am not one of those who want to say that AI should operate ultra long hauls to USA from south india, neither do I fancy such routes. I just wanted to say that six years ago, there was hardly any intercontinental flight from south but the cities were growing rapidly. So why couldn't AI take a chance. For example, once they had declared FRA as a scissor hub for flights onward to USA. , they just connected BOM and DEL to FRA and had onward routes to ORD,EWR,LAX. Neither BLR nor MAA was taken into consideration.
Till last year even I agreed that AI is not ignoring south and are building strong hub in DEL but recent events like continuing the loss making AMD LHR EWR and launching of ATQ BHX have totally changed my views.


Fair enough. Here's what I would say - AI should stick to building the DEL hub and also fly high O&D premium routes form other cities (like CCU-BKK or MAA-SIN or BOM-DXB). The AMD-LHR-EWR and ATQ-BHX flights have been slammed by many and were wrong decisions. So AI shouldn't start MAA-JFK because they started AMD-LHR. They should instead cancel those flights and focus on DEL. Going by your argument, I would say there is a case for AMD and ATQ (which I do not agree with). Both of those cities suffer much more by the limited bilaterals than any city in the south. So MAA, BLR have a host of options by Indian and non Indian carriers to fly to the west. ATQ and AMD do not. Also they have the most established diaspora in the West (I know some groups have immigrated more recently). These groups funnel a lot of money back to Indian and want some convenience (in the same way Kerela wanted all those nonstop to the Gulf). So AMD being connected to LHR and EWR (which are HUGE upper middle class Gujrati immigrant cities) does make some political sense. That said, AI should cut these routes.


Agreed, south has many more international flights than north, particularly Kerala. Many cities in the north don't even have point of call agreements to fly internationally even if airlines wanted to start such flights.
 
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Re: India Aviation Thread - 2018

Wed Mar 28, 2018 5:11 am

Are we going to have another brawl here over whether North India is underserved by international airlines or South India? :stirthepot: Pass me the popcorn.
 
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unrave
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Re: India Aviation Thread - 2018

Wed Mar 28, 2018 5:17 am

IndiGo and Go Air start getting replacement engines for their grounded fleet
https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/in ... 491031.cms

The entire fleet is expected to be up and running by the end of April. This is good news as they will be able to run a full schedule in May, the busiest month for travel in India
17April2019: RIP Jet Airways
 
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unrave
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Re: India Aviation Thread - 2018

Wed Mar 28, 2018 6:26 am

Per CIAL's fb page, COK will handle its 10 millionth passenger for FY17-18 this afternoon, becoming the 7th Indian airport to handle 10m pax in a year. For reference there are 32 Mainland Chinese airports that handle more than 10m annual pax!
17April2019: RIP Jet Airways
 
binayak
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Re: India Aviation Thread - 2018

Wed Mar 28, 2018 6:29 am

https://m.economictimes.com/industry/tr ... 467288.cms
Well new gateway for North East. Bad for CCU as they were only famous for good connections to the north east. Jet airways has even started non-stops from North East to DEL. I think they will work well. I would have been happier if AI had started those routes cause DEL is their hub and those routes even lead to good market share of int'l traffic out of NE.
The best preparation for tomorrow is doing your best today
 
binayak
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Re: India Aviation Thread - 2018

Wed Mar 28, 2018 6:35 am

unrave wrote:
Per CIAL's fb page, COK will handle its 10 millionth passenger for FY17-18 this afternoon, becoming the 7th Indian airport to handle 10m pax in a year. For reference there are 32 Mainland Chinese airports that handle more than 10m annual pax!

It's better not to compare Indian traffic with Chinese. You have various airlines with multiple hubs operating there. It will take us a decade to be at par with them
The best preparation for tomorrow is doing your best today
 
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globetrotter94
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Re: India Aviation Thread - 2018

Wed Mar 28, 2018 7:07 am

binayak wrote:
https://m.economictimes.com/industry/transportation/airlines-/-aviation/jet-airways-announces-plans-to-make-guwahati-its-regional-gateway/articleshow/63467288.cms
Well new gateway for North East. Bad for CCU as they were only famous for good connections to the north east. Jet airways has even started non-stops from North East to DEL. I think they will work well. I would have been happier if AI had started those routes cause DEL is their hub and those routes even lead to good market share of int'l traffic out of NE.


CCU is the fastest growing airport for its size in India (and also one of the fastest in the world), and as one of the largest cities in India, Kolkata can hold its own with O&D traffic, as well as a hub for all the other Indian domestic airlines (AI, 6E, et al.) to the Northeast, with, or without 9W.
6E, 9W, AF, AI, B6, BA, BI, BR, CA, DN, GA, IC, JL, KB, KL, KU, NH, QR, SQ, TG, TK, UA, VS
 
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unrave
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Re: India Aviation Thread - 2018

Wed Mar 28, 2018 7:07 am

Daily disinvestment update
https://www.thehindubusinessline.com/ec ... 366791.ece

Nothing that we didn't know before:
Govt will retain 24% stake in AI and 50% stake in AISATS
EoI will be issued in the next few days
17April2019: RIP Jet Airways
 
HNL
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Re: India Aviation Thread - 2018

Wed Mar 28, 2018 8:03 am

globetrotter94 wrote:
binayak wrote:
https://m.economictimes.com/industry/transportation/airlines-/-aviation/jet-airways-announces-plans-to-make-guwahati-its-regional-gateway/articleshow/63467288.cms
Well new gateway for North East. Bad for CCU as they were only famous for good connections to the north east. Jet airways has even started non-stops from North East to DEL. I think they will work well. I would have been happier if AI had started those routes cause DEL is their hub and those routes even lead to good market share of int'l traffic out of NE.


CCU is the fastest growing airport for its size in India (and also one of the fastest in the world), and as one of the largest cities in India, Kolkata can hold its own with O&D traffic, as well as a hub for all the other Indian domestic airlines (AI, 6E, et al.) to the Northeast, with, or without 9W.


Yet CCU can't get the Europe Big 3 to return. CCU does have the ME3, but lacks the all important flights to FRA MUC CDG AMS LHR MAD.
HNL - There's no place like it!
 
binayak
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Re: India Aviation Thread - 2018

Wed Mar 28, 2018 8:41 am

HNL wrote:
globetrotter94 wrote:
binayak wrote:
https://m.economictimes.com/industry/transportation/airlines-/-aviation/jet-airways-announces-plans-to-make-guwahati-its-regional-gateway/articleshow/63467288.cms
Well new gateway for North East. Bad for CCU as they were only famous for good connections to the north east. Jet airways has even started non-stops from North East to DEL. I think they will work well. I would have been happier if AI had started those routes cause DEL is their hub and those routes even lead to good market share of int'l traffic out of NE.


CCU is the fastest growing airport for its size in India (and also one of the fastest in the world), and as one of the largest cities in India, Kolkata can hold its own with O&D traffic, as well as a hub for all the other Indian domestic airlines (AI, 6E, et al.) to the Northeast, with, or without 9W.


Yet CCU can't get the Europe Big 3 to return. CCU does have the ME3, but lacks the all important flights to FRA MUC CDG AMS LHR MAD.

He was referring to the fast growth of domestic traffic at CCU. Only BOM and DEL serve the complete list of European cities you mentioned. BLR, MAA etc serve some of them. Lack of premium traffic is what prevents EU airlines from CCU.
The best preparation for tomorrow is doing your best today
 
HNL
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Re: India Aviation Thread - 2018

Wed Mar 28, 2018 8:42 am

binayak wrote:
HNL wrote:
globetrotter94 wrote:

CCU is the fastest growing airport for its size in India (and also one of the fastest in the world), and as one of the largest cities in India, Kolkata can hold its own with O&D traffic, as well as a hub for all the other Indian domestic airlines (AI, 6E, et al.) to the Northeast, with, or without 9W.


Yet CCU can't get the Europe Big 3 to return. CCU does have the ME3, but lacks the all important flights to FRA MUC CDG AMS LHR MAD.

He was referring to the fast growth of domestic traffic at CCU. Only BOM and DEL serve the complete list of European cities you mentioned. BLR, MAA etc serve some of them. Lack of premium traffic is what prevents EU airlines from CCU.


Think BA was the last to leave CCU. There is a robust tech sector ( yes not as much as BLR etc ) that should be some sort of lure to CCU. When I go there I fly via HKG to avoid the annoying transfers to a domestic flight after a long journey. Much rather take the connection at the start of a trip. Going via Europe requires 2 connections - bleach.
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devmapper
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Re: India Aviation Thread - 2018

Wed Mar 28, 2018 8:44 am

HNL wrote:
globetrotter94 wrote:
binayak wrote:
https://m.economictimes.com/industry/transportation/airlines-/-aviation/jet-airways-announces-plans-to-make-guwahati-its-regional-gateway/articleshow/63467288.cms
Well new gateway for North East. Bad for CCU as they were only famous for good connections to the north east. Jet airways has even started non-stops from North East to DEL. I think they will work well. I would have been happier if AI had started those routes cause DEL is their hub and those routes even lead to good market share of int'l traffic out of NE.


CCU is the fastest growing airport for its size in India (and also one of the fastest in the world), and as one of the largest cities in India, Kolkata can hold its own with O&D traffic, as well as a hub for all the other Indian domestic airlines (AI, 6E, et al.) to the Northeast, with, or without 9W.


Yet CCU can't get the Europe Big 3 to return. CCU does have the ME3, but lacks the all important flights to FRA MUC CDG AMS LHR MAD.

How much international connecting traffic does CCU get from being the gateway to the North East? It is my home airport, and I have never noticed any significant numbers of people of North Eastern origin connect onto the EK, EY, QR, KA or AI flights out of CCU. I cannot say if they are connecting to SIN or BKK, since I've never connected through those two airports. Domestic connections are a different matter, as I am sure quite a significant portion of the North-East origin people working in the southern states connect via CCU. Most of the traffic between CCU and the North-East are O&D.

Re: international connectivity, CCU isn't really an industrial or services powerhouse, as compared to the western or southern states. There are very few links to Europe because most of the industrial and services companies in Kolkata are domestic in nature. That comes from the scattergun political climate of the state. Admittedly I was surprised to see full J class on the KA flights both inbound and outbound as recently as the beginning of March.

I think CCU traffic will continue to grow as the region exports its human capital out to DEL, BLR, BOM and HYD. Most of the kids do visit their families often. There was a time in 2011 when I was flying every alternate weekend to CCU from MAA.
 
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globetrotter94
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Re: India Aviation Thread - 2018

Wed Mar 28, 2018 8:47 am

binayak wrote:
HNL wrote:
globetrotter94 wrote:

CCU is the fastest growing airport for its size in India (and also one of the fastest in the world), and as one of the largest cities in India, Kolkata can hold its own with O&D traffic, as well as a hub for all the other Indian domestic airlines (AI, 6E, et al.) to the Northeast, with, or without 9W.


Yet CCU can't get the Europe Big 3 to return. CCU does have the ME3, but lacks the all important flights to FRA MUC CDG AMS LHR MAD.

He was referring to the fast growth of domestic traffic at CCU. Only BOM and DEL serve the complete list of European cities you mentioned. BLR, MAA etc serve some of them. Lack of premium traffic is what prevents EU airlines from CCU.


And even in that list, BOM does not have any direct flight to MAD. CCU is a different sort of market. It does not need AF/BA/KL/LH. It is more suitable for the likes of Eurowings, Joon, or IndiGo long-haul if and when that is launched.
6E, 9W, AF, AI, B6, BA, BI, BR, CA, DN, GA, IC, JL, KB, KL, KU, NH, QR, SQ, TG, TK, UA, VS
 
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globetrotter94
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Re: India Aviation Thread - 2018

Wed Mar 28, 2018 8:49 am

devmapper wrote:
How much international connecting traffic does CCU get from being the gateway to the North East? It is my home airport, and I have never noticed any significant numbers of people of North Eastern origin connect onto the EK, EY, QR, KA or AI flights out of CCU. I cannot say if they are connecting to SIN or BKK, since I've never connected through those two airports. Domestic connections are a different matter, as I am sure quite a significant portion of the North-East origin people working in the southern states connect via CCU. Most of the traffic between CCU and the North-East are O&D.


Me neither--never seen any significant present of Northeast Indians at the CCU international section, even for BKK/SIN.
6E, 9W, AF, AI, B6, BA, BI, BR, CA, DN, GA, IC, JL, KB, KL, KU, NH, QR, SQ, TG, TK, UA, VS
 
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unrave
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Re: India Aviation Thread - 2018

Wed Mar 28, 2018 10:48 am

Mr Anil Krishnan is the 10 millionth passenger at COK this year
Image
Photo source: IndiGo Twitter
17April2019: RIP Jet Airways
 
sand26391
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Re: India Aviation Thread - 2018

Wed Mar 28, 2018 12:58 pm

So 6E serves over 10 million pax out of 26.6 million from BLR.
Image
 
sibibom
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Re: India Aviation Thread - 2018

Wed Mar 28, 2018 1:01 pm

Government proposes to sell 76% stake in Air India

The government hopes to decide on Air India’s new owner by June-end and complete the “legal closing” of the transaction by December when the Maharaja’s assets are transferred to the winning bidder.


Source : https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/bus ... 517948.cms
 
binayak
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Re: India Aviation Thread - 2018

Wed Mar 28, 2018 1:40 pm

sand26391 wrote:
So 6E serves over 10 million pax out of 26.6 million from BLR.

What!!!! Is 9W smoking something?? Either they increase their presence in BLR or forget about a BLR hub.
Any ways.....Is the market share of various indian airlines for this year disclosed?
The best preparation for tomorrow is doing your best today
 
sand26391
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Re: India Aviation Thread - 2018

Wed Mar 28, 2018 2:23 pm

As of now Indigo holds 42% share of pax traffic at BLR whereas 9W is 16%. If im not wrong the airline also parks the 2nd highest number of A320s at BLR overnight & has more than 116 departures daily(2nd highest
in the country) .6E has been ramping up ops since Airasia India setup its base in BLR, way back in 2014. That time 9W didn't think much about setting up BLR as a base....
To be fair on 9W, they just started building BLR as hub with the new AMS service in late Oct and new domestic additions from this Summer schedule with PAT,IDR, GAU & potentially a new route ot HKG in WS18. It wil take sometime for them to build the BLR base. The AMS flight has been doing very well for pax connecting to SFO/JFK with around 60-90 mins of Transit time at AMS.
Regarding other IND airlines serving BLR wrt to pax share, I do not have the data.. AI was 8% last time I saw.
 
vadodara
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Re: India Aviation Thread - 2018

Wed Mar 28, 2018 4:26 pm

More action in Ahmedabad:

With Iraqi Airways all set to commence its operations from Sardar Vallabhbhai Patel International Airport (SVPI) this summer, it becomes third international airlines to start operations from the city airport.

Jazeera airlines had commenced its operations from Ahmedabad to Kuwait thrice a week.

SpiceJet had commenced its flight to Bangkok

Ethopian airlines that used to operate freight flights from the city is also planning to add three passenger flights along with Air Asia.

http://www.dnaindia.com/business/report-starting-this-summer-fly-directly-from-ahmedabad-to-iraq-2598139
 
subramak1
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Re: India Aviation Thread - 2018

Wed Mar 28, 2018 4:47 pm

binayak wrote:
unrave wrote:
Per CIAL's fb page, COK will handle its 10 millionth passenger for FY17-18 this afternoon, becoming the 7th Indian airport to handle 10m pax in a year. For reference there are 32 Mainland Chinese airports that handle more than 10m annual pax!

It's better not to compare Indian traffic with Chinese. You have various airlines with multiple hubs operating there. It will take us a decade to be at par with them


Yes and the economy is 5 times bigger, they liberalized the economy in 1977 . The year India kicked out coca cola and IBM.

The India China comparison is stupid , something as an NRI i fail to understand big time. It may be just me

Subu
 
CaliguyNYC
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Re: India Aviation Thread - 2018

Wed Mar 28, 2018 5:39 pm

Just out of curiosity, why would Iraqi airlines fly to AMD? Not saying they shouldn't just wondering why? Pilgrimage flights for Gujarati moslems, traders?
 
vadodara
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Re: India Aviation Thread - 2018

Wed Mar 28, 2018 7:43 pm

CaliguyNYC wrote:
Just out of curiosity, why would Iraqi airlines fly to AMD? Not saying they shouldn't just wondering why? Pilgrimage flights for Gujarati moslems, traders?


Business. Tourism. Friends and Family (can be clubbed under tourism). Possibly labor as well, but no where close to likes of Kerala.

The whole belt, Rajkot-Ahmedabad-Vadodara is going gang-busters. Excluding Surat because Bombay is more convenient for them.
 
subramak1
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Re: India Aviation Thread - 2018

Wed Mar 28, 2018 11:06 pm

vadodara wrote:
CaliguyNYC wrote:
Just out of curiosity, why would Iraqi airlines fly to AMD? Not saying they shouldn't just wondering why? Pilgrimage flights for Gujarati moslems, traders?


Business. Tourism. Friends and Family (can be clubbed under tourism). Possibly labor as well, but no where close to likes of Kerala.

The whole belt, Rajkot-Ahmedabad-Vadodara is going gang-busters. Excluding Surat because Bombay is more convenient for them.


And connectivity to UK.

Subu
 
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Slash787
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Re: India Aviation Thread - 2018

Wed Mar 28, 2018 11:50 pm

CaliguyNYC wrote:
Just out of curiosity, why would Iraqi airlines fly to AMD? Not saying they shouldn't just wondering why? Pilgrimage flights for Gujarati moslems, traders?


Even I had the same question, I find it pretty surprising. I assume they will use a narrow body on this route.

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