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grjplanes
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Leasing out LHR slots

Fri Jan 19, 2018 3:06 pm

Since LHR slots are quite valuable and in demand, I was wondering if airlines are allowed to lease out their slots for a period to other airlines, if they see the need to temporary suspend certain flights.

Thinking in the case of SAA: If they decide to take some hard decisions (on various aspects) and decide to operate only 1 daily JNB-LHR rotation while restructuring takes place over a certain few years, but don't want to get rid of the other slots believing they could re-instate that flights again in 2 or 3 years time perhaps. I think SAA have quite good slots, so to get that back will be difficult to impossible?
Will they be allowed to lease those out to another airline, covering that costs (not sure if they could actually make profit of it?) for say 2 or 3 years, or on year to year basis?

On the other hand then as well...will airlines lease such slots (if allowed), knowingly that it might only be temporary and that SAA will want it back at some point (with sufficient notice of course)?
 
ZaphodHarkonnen
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Re: Leasing out LHR slots

Fri Jan 19, 2018 3:13 pm

Well I know Air NZ essentially leased one of its two slots out when it stopped the AKL-HKG-LHR route.

My understanding is that an airline is limited in how long it can lease a slot as a slot is only for a specific amount of time. And at the end of that time period if the airline hasn't been using that slot then it goes back into the pool to get assigned.

If you do a search for Heathrow slot leasing you'll get a load of results as it appears to be a pretty big business in and of itself.

Beyond that someone with more knowledge will have to speak up as my knowledge of it is pretty basic.
 
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LAXintl
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Re: Leasing out LHR slots

Fri Jan 19, 2018 3:15 pm

Yes, the UK is one of the few places that allow secondary marketplace for slots such as their lease or sale.
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FabDiva
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Re: Leasing out LHR slots

Fri Jan 19, 2018 3:15 pm

You can lease them out. Virgin got some flack for demanding remedy slots from the BA/BMI takeover when they were leasing several of their existing slots to other airlines.
 
Cunard
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Re: Leasing out LHR slots

Fri Jan 19, 2018 6:46 pm

Several airlines at LHR have recently sold their slots on to other airlines with some of them releasing them back again from the purchaser of from another airline for a determined period of time when they revert back to the airline that they were leased or purchased them

A couple of airlines have recently sold their slots and are using spare slots from other airlines within their respective alliance such as the agreement with Kenya Airways and KLM.

Other airlines that use leased slots having sold their own at LHR are Alitalia and Croatian Airlines and I'm sure there are numerous others that I can't think of right now.
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zkncj
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Re: Leasing out LHR slots

Fri Jan 19, 2018 10:24 pm

ZaphodHarkonnen wrote:
Well I know Air NZ essentially leased one of its two slots out when it stopped the AKL-HKG-LHR route.

My understanding is that an airline is limited in how long it can lease a slot as a slot is only for a specific amount of time. And at the end of that time period if the airline hasn't been using that slot then it goes back into the pool to get assigned.
.


Believe that NZ that as apart of there joint venture with CX, they ended up selling the slot to CX.
 
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qf2220
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Re: Leasing out LHR slots

Fri Jan 19, 2018 10:31 pm

Qantas has a pair on lease to BA given it no longer uses them. IIRC they have 4 pairs and are only using 2 pair?
 
eamondzhang
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Re: Leasing out LHR slots

Fri Jan 19, 2018 11:32 pm

qf2220 wrote:
Qantas has a pair on lease to BA given it no longer uses them. IIRC they have 4 pairs and are only using 2 pair?

That's right. They leased out 2 pairs to BA when they ended BKK-LHR and HKG-LHR. Not sure if they'll take back one when QF9 goes via PER (since QF9 will have a different arrival time than what it currently operates)

Michael
 
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FlyCaledonian
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Re: Leasing out LHR slots

Sat Jan 20, 2018 10:59 pm

eamondzhang wrote:
qf2220 wrote:
Qantas has a pair on lease to BA given it no longer uses them. IIRC they have 4 pairs and are only using 2 pair?

That's right. They leased out 2 pairs to BA when they ended BKK-LHR and HKG-LHR. Not sure if they'll take back one when QF9 goes via PER (since QF9 will have a different arrival time than what it currently operates)

Not sure how it works with BA/QF - could possibly have been a fixed period lease (e.g. three years) or possibly an ongoing lease with QF able to review which slots it wants to use each year. My hunch is the former as it could have been tied in to the length of the original QF/EK deal then allowing QF to review options. With QF9/QF10 operating MEL-PER-LHR and QF1/QF2 operating SYD-SIN-LHR I wonder if QF will consider adding a third daily flight back to LHR? BNE-HKG-LHR with the 789 would be an interesting choice and would effectively allow QF to operate to LHR on its own metal from the four largest Australian cities.
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eamondzhang
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Re: Leasing out LHR slots

Sat Jan 20, 2018 11:02 pm

FlyCaledonian wrote:
eamondzhang wrote:
qf2220 wrote:
Qantas has a pair on lease to BA given it no longer uses them. IIRC they have 4 pairs and are only using 2 pair?

That's right. They leased out 2 pairs to BA when they ended BKK-LHR and HKG-LHR. Not sure if they'll take back one when QF9 goes via PER (since QF9 will have a different arrival time than what it currently operates)

Not sure how it works with BA/QF - could possibly have been a fixed period lease (e.g. three years) or possibly an ongoing lease with QF able to review which slots it wants to use each year. My hunch is the former as it could have been tied in to the length of the original QF/EK deal then allowing QF to review options. With QF9/QF10 operating MEL-PER-LHR and QF1/QF2 operating SYD-SIN-LHR I wonder if QF will consider adding a third daily flight back to LHR? BNE-HKG-LHR with the 789 would be an interesting choice and would effectively allow QF to operate to LHR on its own metal from the four largest Australian cities.

I think the previous lease term was till 2019 but I could be wrong. Also I highly doubt QF has any plan to add any additional services to LHR currently. It may happen when they started flying SYD/MEL-LHR non-stop but for now I couldn't see that.

Michael
 
jfk777
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Re: Leasing out LHR slots

Sat Jan 20, 2018 11:11 pm

FlyCaledonian wrote:
eamondzhang wrote:
qf2220 wrote:
Qantas has a pair on lease to BA given it no longer uses them. IIRC they have 4 pairs and are only using 2 pair?

That's right. They leased out 2 pairs to BA when they ended BKK-LHR and HKG-LHR. Not sure if they'll take back one when QF9 goes via PER (since QF9 will have a different arrival time than what it currently operates)

Not sure how it works with BA/QF - could possibly have been a fixed period lease (e.g. three years) or possibly an ongoing lease with QF able to review which slots it wants to use each year. My hunch is the former as it could have been tied in to the length of the original QF/EK deal then allowing QF to review options. With QF9/QF10 operating MEL-PER-LHR and QF1/QF2 operating SYD-SIN-LHR I wonder if QF will consider adding a third daily flight back to LHR? BNE-HKG-LHR with the 789 would be an interesting choice and would effectively allow QF to operate to LHR on its own metal from the four largest Australian cities.


When Qantas flew 744 to London they had 4 flights daily, after they dissolved their BA/QF venture and reduced their flights to 2 A380's the other 2 slots were leased to BA.
 
jfk777
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Re: Leasing out LHR slots

Sat Jan 20, 2018 11:32 pm

For SAA to sell one of its two remaining LHR slots would be devastating. London produces lots of revenue for SAA. Selling a "crown jewel" is a short term thing bringing long term problems. What SAA proposes is akin to the Catholic Church selling the Vatican.
 
Cunard
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Re: Leasing out LHR slots

Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:05 am

SAA could easily sell their own LHR slots or 'crown jewel' as you quaintly call them to get some cash sale and lease them back from the purchaser as many airlines do at LHR with Croatian Airlines and Delta and Kenya Airways and KLM being two examples.
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Cunard
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Re: Leasing out LHR slots

Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:07 am

eamondzhang wrote:
FlyCaledonian wrote:
eamondzhang wrote:
That's right. They leased out 2 pairs to BA when they ended BKK-LHR and HKG-LHR. Not sure if they'll take back one when QF9 goes via PER (since QF9 will have a different arrival time than what it currently operates)

Not sure how it works with BA/QF - could possibly have been a fixed period lease (e.g. three years) or possibly an ongoing lease with QF able to review which slots it wants to use each year. My hunch is the former as it could have been tied in to the length of the original QF/EK deal then allowing QF to review options. With QF9/QF10 operating MEL-PER-LHR and QF1/QF2 operating SYD-SIN-LHR I wonder if QF will consider adding a third daily flight back to LHR? BNE-HKG-LHR with the 789 would be an interesting choice and would effectively allow QF to operate to LHR on its own metal from the four largest Australian cities.

I think the previous lease term was till 2019 but I could be wrong. Also I highly doubt QF has any plan to add any additional services to LHR currently. It may happen when they started flying SYD/MEL-LHR non-stop but for now I couldn't see that.

Michael


I think the suggestion of BNE-HKG-LHR was looking long term not for now!
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grjplanes
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Re: Leasing out LHR slots

Sun Jan 21, 2018 8:28 am

jfk777 wrote:
For SAA to sell one of its two remaining LHR slots would be devastating. London produces lots of revenue for SAA. Selling a "crown jewel" is a short term thing bringing long term problems. What SAA proposes is akin to the Catholic Church selling the Vatican.


The reason for my original post is exactly this...the options of just leasing it out temporary, instead of selling it, because it is so valuable. At the moment there's no real proof that LHR route actually operates at a profit for SAA (as most longhaul routes are running at a loss), and therefor if they have to make severe cuts like reduce JNB-LHR to 1 daily, but then keep the other slot and lease it out...just to cover the cost or actually make some profit of it as well...

Added to this...what if SAA is closed down in it's current form (as even murmured lately from top management) and the SA government decide to set up a new company...will it be possible to transfer these slots over to the new company or what's such a process?
 
LJ
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Re: Leasing out LHR slots

Sun Jan 21, 2018 9:51 am

Cunard wrote:
SAA could easily sell their own LHR slots or 'crown jewel' as you quaintly call them to get some cash sale and lease them back from the purchaser as many airlines do at LHR with Croatian Airlines and Delta and Kenya Airways and KLM being two examples.


A sale - lease back is still a short term solution as a leasing would costs more unless you plan to get rid of the asset in due course or expect the value of the asset to decline considerably.

grjplanes wrote:
Added to this...what if SAA is closed down in it's current form (as even murmured lately from top management) and the SA government decide to set up a new company...will it be possible to transfer these slots over to the new company or what's such a process?


It depends on whether the new company would take over the old company and/or if the old entity ceases operations before or after a takeover. Moroever, the slots can also be sold prior to a shutdown to the new airline. It all depends on the legal way of structuring and the law in SA.
 
jfk777
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Re: Leasing out LHR slots

Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:42 pm

grjplanes wrote:
jfk777 wrote:
For SAA to sell one of its two remaining LHR slots would be devastating. London produces lots of revenue for SAA. Selling a "crown jewel" is a short term thing bringing long term problems. What SAA proposes is akin to the Catholic Church selling the Vatican.


The reason for my original post is exactly this...the options of just leasing it out temporary, instead of selling it, because it is so valuable. At the moment there's no real proof that LHR route actually operates at a profit for SAA (as most longhaul routes are running at a loss), and therefor if they have to make severe cuts like reduce JNB-LHR to 1 daily, but then keep the other slot and lease it out...just to cover the cost or actually make some profit of it as well...

Added to this...what if SAA is closed down in it's current form (as even murmured lately from top management) and the SA government decide to set up a new company...will it be possible to transfer these slots over to the new company or what's such a process?



SAA is owned the the Government of South Africa so a new South African airline should be able to them as the Government owns them.
 
jfk777
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Re: Leasing out LHR slots

Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:45 pm

grjplanes wrote:
jfk777 wrote:
For SAA to sell one of its two remaining LHR slots would be devastating. London produces lots of revenue for SAA. Selling a "crown jewel" is a short term thing bringing long term problems. What SAA proposes is akin to the Catholic Church selling the Vatican.


The reason for my original post is exactly this...the options of just leasing it out temporary, instead of selling it, because it is so valuable. At the moment there's no real proof that LHR route actually operates at a profit for SAA (as most longhaul routes are running at a loss), and therefor if they have to make severe cuts like reduce JNB-LHR to 1 daily, but then keep the other slot and lease it out...just to cover the cost or actually make some profit of it as well...

Added to this...what if SAA is closed down in it's current form (as even murmured lately from top management) and the SA government decide to set up a new company...will it be possible to transfer these slots over to the new company or what's such a process?


SAA currently flies two A330-200 most days to LHR, if they can't make money with those airplanes they have far bigger problems which they might have. Baseb on the price Oman Air paid Kenya Airways for their early morning slot at LHR the two SAA slots could be worth $150,000,000 USD.
 
cedarjet
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Re: Leasing out LHR slots

Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:57 pm

Air Transat had a few A310s per week in summer out of the old T2, handling was by Air France and I think that was where they leased the slots from. Don’t remember the year, prob. c. 2007, 2008.
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lhrsfosyd
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Re: Leasing out LHR slots

Sun Jan 21, 2018 2:01 pm

This is what SAA's operations should look like.

JNB 1840-2225 ACC 2355-0625 LHR
JNB 2155-0720 LHR

LHR 1430-2100 ACC 2230-0625 JNB
LHR 1805-0715 JNB
 
Cunard
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Re: Leasing out LHR slots

Sun Jan 21, 2018 2:45 pm

I don't think SAA operating a LHR flight via ACC would be a very good move and not very competitive against the direct flights from LHR to JNB with BA and VS as well as the single direct flight from SAA you propose.

Perhaps we should have a new thread regarding SAA and their LHR operations!
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lhrsfosyd
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Re: Leasing out LHR slots

Sun Jan 21, 2018 2:50 pm

Completely agree one stop option wouldn't be competitive Cunard!

SAA has already lost a battle on JNBLONJNB market though. Accra would have much higher yield and it would allow to feed Star Alliance network to US/Canada at LHR. It also saves SAA one aircraft from operating JNB ACC JNB.
 
Cunard
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Re: Leasing out LHR slots

Sun Jan 21, 2018 5:25 pm

So what your actually suggestion competitive or not is a JNB-ACC-LHR flight allowing for Star Alliance connections at LHR from ACC and at the same time releasing an aircraft on JNB-ACC.

Why bother it's either JNB to LHR nonstop with SAA or nothing and I can't honestly see them giving up LHR as a destination the South African government would prefer to see it losing money rather than admit to failure and axing such a prestige route not only for SAA but for the whole country.

But to be honest this is a bit of a severe thread drift isn't it as we're discussing leased slots at LHR not what SAA should be doing with their JNB-LHR flights.

But that's for another thread unless you want to start one yourself so others can discuss it!
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FlyCaledonian
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Re: Leasing out LHR slots

Sun Jan 21, 2018 6:21 pm

Cunard wrote:
eamondzhang wrote:
FlyCaledonian wrote:
Not sure how it works with BA/QF - could possibly have been a fixed period lease (e.g. three years) or possibly an ongoing lease with QF able to review which slots it wants to use each year. My hunch is the former as it could have been tied in to the length of the original QF/EK deal then allowing QF to review options. With QF9/QF10 operating MEL-PER-LHR and QF1/QF2 operating SYD-SIN-LHR I wonder if QF will consider adding a third daily flight back to LHR? BNE-HKG-LHR with the 789 would be an interesting choice and would effectively allow QF to operate to LHR on its own metal from the four largest Australian cities.

I think the previous lease term was till 2019 but I could be wrong. Also I highly doubt QF has any plan to add any additional services to LHR currently. It may happen when they started flying SYD/MEL-LHR non-stop but for now I couldn't see that.

Michael


I think the suggestion of BNE-HKG-LHR was looking long term not for now!

It very much was.

I find it interesting that having dissolved the joint venture with BA to tie-up with EK and operate from SYD/MEL via DXB that QF are now confident/strong enough to stop serving LHR via DXB with the non-stop from PER (originating in MEL) and the resumption of the SYD flight via SIN. The impact of that latter flight on BA will be interesting because it re-introduces competition on the SIN-LHR route (currently a BA/SQ duopoly) and I wonder how BA will respond - the use of the 77W on the LHR-SIN-SYD flight was said to have put the flight on a sound footing. Will they stick with the 77W or move to using the 789 for SYD?
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TheLion
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Re: Leasing out LHR slots

Sun Jan 21, 2018 8:44 pm

FlyCaledonian wrote:
Cunard wrote:
eamondzhang wrote:
I think the previous lease term was till 2019 but I could be wrong. Also I highly doubt QF has any plan to add any additional services to LHR currently. It may happen when they started flying SYD/MEL-LHR non-stop but for now I couldn't see that.

Michael


I think the suggestion of BNE-HKG-LHR was looking long term not for now!

It very much was.

I find it interesting that having dissolved the joint venture with BA to tie-up with EK and operate from SYD/MEL via DXB that QF are now confident/strong enough to stop serving LHR via DXB with the non-stop from PER (originating in MEL) and the resumption of the SYD flight via SIN. The impact of that latter flight on BA will be interesting because it re-introduces competition on the SIN-LHR route (currently a BA/SQ duopoly) and I wonder how BA will respond - the use of the 77W on the LHR-SIN-SYD flight was said to have put the flight on a sound footing. Will they stick with the 77W or move to using the 789 for SYD?


Knowing BA under the obsessively profit-only driven Cruz & Walsh, they’ll either drop capacity or drop the route altogether. They don’t know how to fight for market share.

To anyone who doesn’t agree: Level was a weak, lame effort-on-the-back-of-a-fag-paper late in the day and the LGW B772 vs Norwegian is responsive and effectively a rather bullying reply to an innovator.
 
jfk777
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Re: Leasing out LHR slots

Sun Jan 21, 2018 8:52 pm

Cunard wrote:
So what your actually suggestion competitive or not is a JNB-ACC-LHR flight allowing for Star Alliance connections at LHR from ACC and at the same time releasing an aircraft on JNB-ACC.

Why bother it's either JNB to LHR nonstop with SAA or nothing and I can't honestly see them giving up LHR as a destination the South African government would prefer to see it losing money rather than admit to failure and axing such a prestige route not only for SAA but for the whole country.

But to be honest this is a bit of a severe thread drift isn't it as we're discussing leased slots at LHR not what SAA should be doing with their JNB-LHR flights.

But that's for another thread unless you want to start one yourself so others can discuss it!


The topic of SAA selling or leasing their LHR slots and operating the route are linked. SAA could always sell them and Gatwick their London flights too.
 
eamondzhang
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Re: Leasing out LHR slots

Sun Jan 21, 2018 11:42 pm

FlyCaledonian wrote:
I find it interesting that having dissolved the joint venture with BA to tie-up with EK and operate from SYD/MEL via DXB that QF are now confident/strong enough to stop serving LHR via DXB with the non-stop from PER (originating in MEL) and the resumption of the SYD flight via SIN. The impact of that latter flight on BA will be interesting because it re-introduces competition on the SIN-LHR route (currently a BA/SQ duopoly) and I wonder how BA will respond - the use of the 77W on the LHR-SIN-SYD flight was said to have put the flight on a sound footing. Will they stick with the 77W or move to using the 789 for SYD?

I think they'll stick with 77W as my observation shows they have a very healthy load in F/J on the route.

Ps. Don't forget Norwegian's SIN-LGW :duck: although I know it's a different subject.

Michael
 
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flymco753
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Re: Leasing out LHR slots

Sun Jan 21, 2018 11:45 pm

How do the London airports handle slots? I know that in the U.S. the FAA allocates and re allocates the slots. Is it essentially the same for the UK?
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NYCVIE
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Re: Leasing out LHR slots

Sun Jan 21, 2018 11:54 pm

lhrsfosyd wrote:
This is what SAA's operations should look like.

JNB 1840-2225 ACC 2355-0625 LHR
JNB 2155-0720 LHR

LHR 1430-2100 ACC 2230-0625 JNB
LHR 1805-0715 JNB


I think long-established BA would easily drive SAA off of LHR-ACC.
 
Cunard
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Re: Leasing out LHR slots

Mon Jan 22, 2018 1:23 am

eamondzhang wrote:
FlyCaledonian wrote:
I find it interesting that having dissolved the joint venture with BA to tie-up with EK and operate from SYD/MEL via DXB that QF are now confident/strong enough to stop serving LHR via DXB with the non-stop from PER (originating in MEL) and the resumption of the SYD flight via SIN. The impact of that latter flight on BA will be interesting because it re-introduces competition on the SIN-LHR route (currently a BA/SQ duopoly) and I wonder how BA will respond - the use of the 77W on the LHR-SIN-SYD flight was said to have put the flight on a sound footing. Will they stick with the 77W or move to using the 789 for SYD?

I think they'll stick with 77W as my observation shows they have a very healthy load in F/J on the route.

Ps. Don't forget Norwegian's SIN-LGW :duck: although I know it's a different subject.

Michael


You mean the same Norwegian that is reducing their successful (the airline said it not me) route from LGW to SIN from 4 weekly flights down to a single weekly flight from June 2018.
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evanb
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Re: Leasing out LHR slots

Mon Jan 22, 2018 2:07 am

lhrsfosyd wrote:
SAA has already lost a battle on JNBLONJNB market though. Accra would have much higher yield and it would allow to feed Star Alliance network to US/Canada at LHR. It also saves SAA one aircraft from operating JNB ACC JNB.


They already operate JNB-ACC-IAD with full traffic rights on the ACC-IAD-ACC sector with connections with UA at IAD to US and Canada. Not sure how LHR would be preferable than IAD in terms of destinations and costs.
 
9252fly
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Re: Leasing out LHR slots

Mon Jan 22, 2018 2:13 am

What did SAA do with their CPT - LHR slot a few years ago when they terminated the route? I believe SQ picked up the slot, just never knew if they sold or leased it.
 
Cunard
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Re: Leasing out LHR slots

Mon Jan 22, 2018 2:34 am

If I remember correctly and I'm quite certain about it SAA did sell their CPT-LHR slots to Singapore, I remember thinking at the time that it seemed strange for SAA to abandon this long standing route leaving British Airways to have a monopoly after Virgin Atlantic also pulling off the route.

I wondered at the time of the slots sale to Singapore Airlines that if SAA ever considered returning to the CPT-LHR it would be very difficult for them to obtain suitable slots again considering their financial status.
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eamondzhang
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Re: Leasing out LHR slots

Mon Jan 22, 2018 11:04 am

Cunard wrote:
You mean the same Norwegian that is reducing their successful (the airline said it not me) route from LGW to SIN from 4 weekly flights down to a single weekly flight from June 2018.

Guess I missed that part! Thx. Was never aware that Norwegian is reducing LGW-SIN, not to mention such a large one.

Michael
 
fcogafa
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Re: Leasing out LHR slots

Mon Jan 22, 2018 12:24 pm

Wasn't it established that the Norwegian SIN reduction is very short term?
 
Andy33
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Re: Leasing out LHR slots

Mon Jan 22, 2018 1:22 pm

flymco753 wrote:
How do the London airports handle slots? I know that in the U.S. the FAA allocates and re allocates the slots. Is it essentially the same for the UK?


There's an independent slot control regulator - ACL - Airport Coordination Ltd, which is responsible for slot allocation at all controlled UK and Irish Republic airports (27 in all), not just the London ones. Under contract they also handle slots at airports in New Zealand, Dubai, Luxembourg, and some Polish and Canadian airports.

https://www.acl-uk.org/

The logic of doing it this way is that it prevents slots being used as bargaining chips in negotiations involving governments.
 
benbeny
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Re: Leasing out LHR slots

Mon Jan 22, 2018 3:41 pm

I'm curious on how LHR slots pricing work.
Is it put on auction when airlines return it and airlines with highest bidding may acquire it? Or is it having fixed price?
 
Andy33
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Re: Leasing out LHR slots

Mon Jan 22, 2018 4:14 pm

Unusually in world terms, the UK allows slots to be traded between airlines. One airline can sell all or part of its slot holding to another. Pricing is what the market will bear - in general price varies according to time of day, LHR early morning arrivals are particularly sought after.
But slots have to be actually used on at least 80% of possible dates, or they are forfeited without any compensation. If this happens they are allocated to airlines on a waiting list, with priority being given to airlines who currently hold no slots at all. There's no charge for this, but of course it could take years for a forfeited slot pair to become available at a suitable time of day for a new airline.
 
Mangs
Posts: 38
Joined: Mon Aug 17, 2015 7:09 pm

Re: Leasing out LHR slots

Mon Jan 22, 2018 4:31 pm

eamondzhang wrote:
Cunard wrote:
You mean the same Norwegian that is reducing their successful (the airline said it not me) route from LGW to SIN from 4 weekly flights down to a single weekly flight from June 2018.

Guess I missed that part! Thx. Was never aware that Norwegian is reducing LGW-SIN, not to mention such a large one.

Michael


A quick look at their website shows 4x weekly from now on until October.
There was a reduction before at 1x weekly but now its back to 4x weekly throughout the summer all the way to October.

Seems like they changed from Monday, Wednesday, Thursday and Sunday to Monday, Wednesday, Friday and Sunday from April and onward.
 
berari
Posts: 930
Joined: Wed Jul 06, 2016 3:47 pm

Re: Leasing out LHR slots

Mon Jan 22, 2018 5:22 pm

Kenya Airways made the now irreversible mistake in my opinion of selling their slots, a valuable asset that further solidifies their dependence on KL for overnight flights into LHR.
 
Planesmart
Posts: 2891
Joined: Sun Dec 05, 2004 3:18 am

Re: Leasing out LHR slots

Mon Jan 22, 2018 7:26 pm

jfk777 wrote:
SAA is owned the the Government of South Africa so a new South African airline should be able to them as the Government owns them.

Slots are owned by airlines, not governments.

Standards for slot ownership, transfer, forfeit, utilisation, etc are covered by IATA, who establish world's best practice, with regular updates. IATA's involvement, removed political and other influences. The IATA group responsible are involved in developing Corsia best practice.

ACL meets or exceeds the IATA standards.
 
redroo
Posts: 594
Joined: Tue Jun 07, 2016 10:28 pm

Re: Leasing out LHR slots

Mon Jan 22, 2018 9:01 pm

I have often wondered why we don’t move to a market mechanisms for slots at LHR. Every two years there is an auction for the right to a slot. The winner gets the slot. You do away with landing charges at the same time, so the market will determine the best aircraft for the time of day and potential profit.

Of course the biggest slot holders would hate this and it would be open to abuse by airlines with big pockets.
 
evanb
Posts: 945
Joined: Thu Jan 07, 2016 3:26 pm

Re: Leasing out LHR slots

Mon Jan 22, 2018 9:51 pm

redroo wrote:
I have often wondered why we don’t move to a market mechanisms for slots at LHR. Every two years there is an auction for the right to a slot. The winner gets the slot. You do away with landing charges at the same time, so the market will determine the best aircraft for the time of day and potential profit.

Of course the biggest slot holders would hate this and it would be open to abuse by airlines with big pockets.


On face value this seems reasonable but it would create a huge amount of future cost uncertainty and airlines would be far more hesitant to invest in Heathrow capacity if they only have short term certainty regarding the slots. We already have a market mechanism to trade Heathrow slots. If the price to acquire slots is too high an airline doesn't enter. The corollary is that if the price of slots is high airlines are more willing to sell them.

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