User avatar
sunking737
Posts: 1337
Joined: Tue Feb 22, 2005 10:33 pm

Re: Frontier Airlines Network Thread 2018

Sun Jul 08, 2018 3:42 am

Frontier 14[/quote]
Does this explain why a bunch of Frontier's flights from the west coast to DEN are red-eye flights? Here are some examples that I'm referring to:
SEA-DEN: 12:55 AM - 4:35 AM
PDX-DEN: 12:55 AM - 4:32 AM
SFO-DEN: 12:59 AM - 4:25 AM
LAX-DEN: 12:59 AM - 4:29 AM

I'm sorry, but I don't know who would ever want to travel on these types of flights. I'm sure that there are perfectly valid reasons for scheduling them at these times. But from an ordinary customer/passenger point of view, this makes absolutely no sense at all.[/quote]

I used to fly from LAX to MSP on the red eye. I got a full day in at school, slept on the plane and spent the whole next day with friends back home in MSP. I worked for RC back in the day, we had guys fly to LAX the first flight out of MSP, then take the red eye home. Spent the day at the beach etc.
I'm a SUNDUCK......Worked for RC & SY @ MSP
 
F9LASDEN
Posts: 100
Joined: Tue May 01, 2018 3:56 pm

Re: Frontier Airlines Network Thread 2018

Sun Jul 08, 2018 3:47 am

AirFiero wrote:
Wasn’t there an airline (Eastern?), many years ago, that had a red eye hub in Kansas City (I think) with very low fares and connections at like 4am? Would something like that work today, with an LCC?


F9 has something like this going on in DEN right now. Arrivals from a lot of eastern destinations in the evening, departures to LAS, LAX, SFO, SEA, and PDX, (as well as SLC, and ONT (on M/W/F/Sa) and ABQ (on Tu/Th/Su)) between 10-10:30pm, those flights turn and fly the aforementioned redeyes back to DEN, and eastern departures between 6-8am
 
n7371f
Posts: 1409
Joined: Fri Jul 04, 2008 3:54 pm

Re: Frontier Airlines Network Thread 2018

Sun Jul 08, 2018 4:12 am

It's all about aircraft utilization and driving lower costs. A plane isn't making $ unless it's flying. And Daniel Schurz & his team clearly believe there is an untapped market of people who will choose to fly these kind of flights. A counter question might be: would having 2 of these flights RON and get maintenance prevent what's going on right now?

It's also a culprit in their operational meltdown.

sunking737 wrote:
Frontier 14

Does this explain why a bunch of Frontier's flights from the west coast to DEN are red-eye flights? Here are some examples that I'm referring to:
SEA-DEN: 12:55 AM - 4:35 AM
PDX-DEN: 12:55 AM - 4:32 AM
SFO-DEN: 12:59 AM - 4:25 AM
LAX-DEN: 12:59 AM - 4:29 AM

I'm sorry, but I don't know who would ever want to travel on these types of flights. I'm sure that there are perfectly valid reasons for scheduling them at these times. But from an ordinary customer/passenger point of view, this makes absolutely no sense at all.[/quote]

I used to fly from LAX to MSP on the red eye. I got a full day in at school, slept on the plane and spent the whole next day with friends back home in MSP. I worked for RC back in the day, we had guys fly to LAX the first flight out of MSP, then take the red eye home. Spent the day at the beach etc.[/quote]
 
AirFiero
Posts: 865
Joined: Wed Aug 28, 2013 11:43 pm

Re: Frontier Airlines Network Thread 2018

Sun Jul 08, 2018 4:57 am

F9LASDEN wrote:
AirFiero wrote:
Wasn’t there an airline (Eastern?), many years ago, that had a red eye hub in Kansas City (I think) with very low fares and connections at like 4am? Would something like that work today, with an LCC?


F9 has something like this going on in DEN right now. Arrivals from a lot of eastern destinations in the evening, departures to LAS, LAX, SFO, SEA, and PDX, (as well as SLC, and ONT (on M/W/F/Sa) and ABQ (on Tu/Th/Su)) between 10-10:30pm, those flights turn and fly the aforementioned redeyes back to DEN, and eastern departures between 6-8am


I assume it is a limited bank, then? I was under the impression that F9 wasn’t doing much hub stuff?
 
User avatar
SumChristianus
Topic Author
Posts: 540
Joined: Tue Jan 09, 2018 3:00 am

Re: Frontier Airlines Network Thread 2018

Sun Jul 08, 2018 5:13 am

AirFiero wrote:
F9LASDEN wrote:
AirFiero wrote:
Wasn’t there an airline (Eastern?), many years ago, that had a red eye hub in Kansas City (I think) with very low fares and connections at like 4am? Would something like that work today, with an LCC?


F9 has something like this going on in DEN right now. Arrivals from a lot of eastern destinations in the evening, departures to LAS, LAX, SFO, SEA, and PDX, (as well as SLC, and ONT (on M/W/F/Sa) and ABQ (on Tu/Th/Su)) between 10-10:30pm, those flights turn and fly the aforementioned redeyes back to DEN, and eastern departures between 6-8am


I assume it is a limited bank, then? I was under the impression that F9 wasn’t doing much hub stuff?


They have redeyes to DEN and from DEN nightly. To me F9 at DEN (while it still has a lot of day-time flights) is looking more and more like HP's LAS operation.
UA DL LH NW AA --- Next DEN-IND (UA TBD)
"Born in Wonder, Brought to Wisdom"
"I wish OO would bid for RIW-DEN"
 
F9LASDEN
Posts: 100
Joined: Tue May 01, 2018 3:56 pm

Re: Frontier Airlines Network Thread 2018

Sun Jul 08, 2018 6:03 am

AirFiero wrote:
F9LASDEN wrote:
AirFiero wrote:
Wasn’t there an airline (Eastern?), many years ago, that had a red eye hub in Kansas City (I think) with very low fares and connections at like 4am? Would something like that work today, with an LCC?


F9 has something like this going on in DEN right now. Arrivals from a lot of eastern destinations in the evening, departures to LAS, LAX, SFO, SEA, and PDX, (as well as SLC, and ONT (on M/W/F/Sa) and ABQ (on Tu/Th/Su)) between 10-10:30pm, those flights turn and fly the aforementioned redeyes back to DEN, and eastern departures between 6-8am


I assume it is a limited bank, then? I was under the impression that F9 wasn’t doing much hub stuff?


Yeah, it’s small. They’re a more O&D focused airline. It would be interesting to see someone try this on a larger scale, or for F9 to expand it into a bigger operation.
 
User avatar
deltacto
Posts: 408
Joined: Thu Mar 05, 2009 5:49 pm

Re: Frontier Airlines Network Thread 2018

Sun Jul 08, 2018 10:25 am

duplicate
Last edited by deltacto on Sun Jul 08, 2018 10:28 am, edited 1 time in total.
 
User avatar
deltacto
Posts: 408
Joined: Thu Mar 05, 2009 5:49 pm

Re: Frontier Airlines Network Thread 2018

Sun Jul 08, 2018 10:27 am

AirFiero wrote:
Wasn’t there an airline (Eastern?), many years ago, that had a red eye hub in Kansas City (I think) with very low fares and connections at like 4am? Would something like that work today, with an LCC?


Eastern ... IAH starting in 1985 ... later moved to ORD

http://www.departedflights.com/EAmoonlightspecial.html

Image

More info in this thread:
"Eastern Air Lines Moonlight Special"
viewtopic.php?t=381301
 
AirFiero
Posts: 865
Joined: Wed Aug 28, 2013 11:43 pm

Re: Frontier Airlines Network Thread 2018

Sun Jul 08, 2018 3:05 pm

F9LASDEN wrote:
AirFiero wrote:
F9LASDEN wrote:

F9 has something like this going on in DEN right now. Arrivals from a lot of eastern destinations in the evening, departures to LAS, LAX, SFO, SEA, and PDX, (as well as SLC, and ONT (on M/W/F/Sa) and ABQ (on Tu/Th/Su)) between 10-10:30pm, those flights turn and fly the aforementioned redeyes back to DEN, and eastern departures between 6-8am


I assume it is a limited bank, then? I was under the impression that F9 wasn’t doing much hub stuff?


Yeah, it’s small. They’re a more O&D focused airline. It would be interesting to see someone try this on a larger scale, or for F9 to expand it into a bigger operation.


You’d think that an airline could make a killing at using their aircraft overnight like this.
 
rph99
Posts: 64
Joined: Wed May 13, 2015 3:27 am

Re: Frontier Airlines Network Thread 2018

Sun Jul 08, 2018 11:35 pm

AirFiero wrote:
F9LASDEN wrote:
AirFiero wrote:

I assume it is a limited bank, then? I was under the impression that F9 wasn’t doing much hub stuff?


Yeah, it’s small. They’re a more O&D focused airline. It would be interesting to see someone try this on a larger scale, or for F9 to expand it into a bigger operation.


You’d think that an airline could make a killing at using their aircraft overnight like this.



With Frontier’s never ending saga of cancellations and delays I dont anticipate much success. Sounds like a potential nightmare for passengers and a financial burden for the airline.

I love Frontier, always have, even as an ULCC. But if the comments above are true about lack of resources to deal with mechanical issues...it’s a shame. For years Frontier won awards for their maitence/mechanical teams. If they are making money now and one of the most profitable airlines in the U.S. you’d think they’d give a little back to the cuts they made to at the least try to run an efficient operation.
 
User avatar
OzarkD9S
Posts: 5174
Joined: Tue Oct 23, 2001 2:31 am

Re: Frontier Airlines Network Thread 2018

Sun Jul 08, 2018 11:42 pm

F9LASDEN wrote:
AirFiero wrote:

Wasn’t there an airline (Eastern?), many years ago, that had a red eye hub in Kansas City (I think) with very low fares and connections at like 4am? Would something like that work today, with an LCC?


It was Eastern, but the red-eye hub was IAH. EA had a proper hub at MCI for a few years.
Next up: STL-DAL-ABQ-DAL-STL. A little December day trip. Because that's what av-geeks do. :airplane:
 
freakyrat
Posts: 1502
Joined: Fri Aug 22, 2008 1:04 pm

Re: Frontier Airlines Network Thread 2018

Mon Jul 09, 2018 1:26 am

OzarkD9S wrote:
F9LASDEN wrote:
AirFiero wrote:

Wasn’t there an airline (Eastern?), many years ago, that had a red eye hub in Kansas City (I think) with very low fares and connections at like 4am? Would something like that work today, with an LCC?


It was Eastern, but the red-eye hub was IAH. EA had a proper hub at MCI for a few years.


Eastern had a mail hauling contract and since the planes were going full or not they decided to offer some real bargain basement fares on these flights.
 
RL757PVD
Posts: 2919
Joined: Fri Dec 03, 1999 2:47 am

Re: Frontier Airlines Network Thread 2018

Mon Jul 09, 2018 3:05 am

I assume we will see a schedule extension this week as its about to drop below 4 months out....
Experience is what you get when what you thought would work out didn't!
 
User avatar
Midwestindy
Posts: 3280
Joined: Sun Mar 12, 2017 3:56 am

Re: Frontier Airlines Network Thread 2018

Mon Jul 09, 2018 3:13 am

RL757PVD wrote:
I assume we will see a schedule extension this week as its about to drop below 4 months out....


Likely either this week or next, last years big extension was July 18 I believe.
DL DM, AA Gold in 2018, Visited 2018:AMS, ATL, AUS, BOS, BWI, CDG, CLT, CMN, DCA, DFW, DTW, DXB, EWR, FLL, FRA, HAV, HPN, JFK, JNB, IAD, IAH, IND, LAX, LGA, LHR, LOS, MAD, MCO, MIA, MSP, ORD, PBI, PHL, PVD, SAN, SEA, SJD, SLC, SFO, STL, TPA, TXL, YYZ, ZRH
 
User avatar
spinkid
Posts: 1722
Joined: Fri Jul 20, 2001 5:59 am

Re: Frontier Airlines Network Thread 2018

Mon Jul 09, 2018 5:31 am

freakyrat wrote:
OzarkD9S wrote:
F9LASDEN wrote:


It was Eastern, but the red-eye hub was IAH. EA had a proper hub at MCI for a few years.


Eastern had a mail hauling contract and since the planes were going full or not they decided to offer some real bargain basement fares on these flights.


I feel like PSA offered these as well.
The only airlines I could see doing this today would be ULCCs but I have a feeling they don't have mail contracts with less than daily service in many markets. I think the build up of Fedex, UPS, etc over the years has taken over a bulk of that business, so indeed it may be a bygone era.
 
WNflyer1523
Posts: 251
Joined: Fri Jan 06, 2017 2:28 am

Re: Frontier Airlines Network Thread 2018

Mon Jul 09, 2018 4:56 pm

n7371f wrote:
Frontier's operation right now is a mess.

Once again, today, a laundry list of cancellations: 32 for Friday & Saturday morning as of 11:00pm EDT. That's 8% of scheduled departures. And of those that operated, 32% were 15+ late.

The numbers for the past 7 days are similarly awful. 22 cancels Thursday, 44% 15+ late. Wednesday was much better only 9 scrubs. But if you go back even further the numbers get ugly again.

What's up? I'm hearing the usual combo: back-up MEL's catching up; not enough hands on fixing planes; crew shortages; and, of course, the Indigo/Biffle management style stretching the system way too thin. Regardless of what, the ops numbers are awful. Have to believe its actually costing F9 more $ than running a good ops.

Meanwhile Spirit, long mocked for its operation, just 3 cancels Friday.


Frontier is not doing so good right now...

https://www.facebook.com/FrontierPilots ... =3&theater
https://www.bizjournals.com/denver/news ... e=facebook
 
User avatar
pwm2txlhopper
Posts: 1316
Joined: Tue Jan 27, 2004 10:40 am

Re: Frontier Airlines Network Thread 2018

Mon Jul 09, 2018 5:19 pm

Frontier will be commencing service to PWM-Portland, Maine, tomorrow, on July 10 with flights from RDU and DEN. MCO starts in August. First time PWM as had a flight West of the Mississippi River, and it will also be the longest non-stop flight in PWM's history.

Excited to see them enter the market with JetBlue and Southwest already here. The LCC competition will only lower the fares on all carriers out of PWM. In the ten years since Jet Blue and Air Tran arrived in town, average fares have plummeted.
 
WeatherPilot
Posts: 183
Joined: Sun Jun 25, 2017 1:51 am

Re: Frontier Airlines Network Thread 2018

Tue Jul 10, 2018 12:20 am

How does F9 find the gate space for all these DEN flights even if only 2x/week for a lot of them with only 8 gates?
 
F9LASDEN
Posts: 100
Joined: Tue May 01, 2018 3:56 pm

Re: Frontier Airlines Network Thread 2018

Tue Jul 10, 2018 12:31 am

WeatherPilot wrote:
How does F9 find the gate space for all these DEN flights even if only 2x/week for a lot of them with only 8 gates?


They use a lot of the common use gates as well, especially for the late evening and early morning departures, when other airlines (primarily B6 and the international carriers) aren't using them. A52, while officially listed as a common-use gate, has basically become an F9 gate after NK switched to the C gates. F9 uses it several times a day, and I've never seen another airline using it. I've also seen them using A33 and A35 (B6's primary gates), A37 (BA's primary gate), A39 (VX's old gate), and A41 and A43 (LH's primary gates, also used commonly by AC, WS, AM, Y4, and FI) during the late evening and early morning hours.
 
WeatherPilot
Posts: 183
Joined: Sun Jun 25, 2017 1:51 am

Re: Frontier Airlines Network Thread 2018

Tue Jul 10, 2018 12:53 am

F9LASDEN wrote:
WeatherPilot wrote:
How does F9 find the gate space for all these DEN flights even if only 2x/week for a lot of them with only 8 gates?


They use a lot of the common use gates as well, especially for the late evening and early morning departures, when other airlines (primarily B6 and the international carriers) aren't using them. A52, while officially listed as a common-use gate, has basically become an F9 gate after NK switched to the C gates. F9 uses it several times a day, and I've never seen another airline using it. I've also seen them using A33 and A35 (B6's primary gates), A37 (BA's primary gate), A39 (VX's old gate), and A41 and A43 (LH's primary gates, also used commonly by AC, WS, AM, Y4, and FI) during the late evening and early morning hours.


Oh that's right. I forgot about the common use gates. Interesting how they seem to be conveniently just across the terminal from their primary gates ;)
 
F9LASDEN
Posts: 100
Joined: Tue May 01, 2018 3:56 pm

Re: Frontier Airlines Network Thread 2018

Tue Jul 10, 2018 1:22 am

WeatherPilot wrote:
F9LASDEN wrote:
WeatherPilot wrote:
How does F9 find the gate space for all these DEN flights even if only 2x/week for a lot of them with only 8 gates?


They use a lot of the common use gates as well, especially for the late evening and early morning departures, when other airlines (primarily B6 and the international carriers) aren't using them. A52, while officially listed as a common-use gate, has basically become an F9 gate after NK switched to the C gates. F9 uses it several times a day, and I've never seen another airline using it. I've also seen them using A33 and A35 (B6's primary gates), A37 (BA's primary gate), A39 (VX's old gate), and A41 and A43 (LH's primary gates, also used commonly by AC, WS, AM, Y4, and FI) during the late evening and early morning hours.


Oh that's right. I forgot about the common use gates. Interesting how they seem to be conveniently just across the terminal from their primary gates ;)


Common gate usage for today (7/9):
-Flight 392 (to BNA) went out of A52
-Flight 652 (to SYR) went out of A37
-Flight 555 (to SAN) went out of A35
-Flight 544 (to DCA) went out of A35
-Flight 267 (to SNA) went out of A37
-Flight 573 (to SLC) went out of A39
-Flight 1528 (to OMA) went out of A52
-Flight 663 (to SFO) went out of A52
-Flight 557 (to SAN) went out of A52
-Flight 409 (to LAX) is going out of A52

Usage of their own gates today:
-A32: 9 flights
-A34: 6 fllights
-A36: 6 flights
-A38: 7 flights
-A40: 7 flights
-A42: 8 flights
-A44: 7 flights
-A46: 9 flights

Interesting how they use A52, officially a common-use gate, almost as much as their own gates. 5 flights out of there today alone.
 
WNflyer1523
Posts: 251
Joined: Fri Jan 06, 2017 2:28 am

Re: Frontier Airlines Network Thread 2018

Tue Jul 10, 2018 2:56 pm

Lafayette, LA and Huntsville, AL are loaded on Frontier's website. Flights to DEN and MCO start in October.
I thought they should at least extend the schedule first, then add their flights. The amount of bookable flights is only like 3-4 weeks!
 
TYSflyer
Posts: 186
Joined: Wed Jan 11, 2017 5:44 pm

Re: Frontier Airlines Network Thread 2018

Tue Jul 10, 2018 3:19 pm

WNflyer1523 wrote:
Lafayette, LA and Huntsville, AL are loaded on Frontier's website. Flights to DEN and MCO start in October.
I thought they should at least extend the schedule first, then add their flights. The amount of bookable flights is only like 3-4 weeks!

Yes, I agree this a little bit of a fail on their part. Usually when a new city is announced it gets a good deal of press coverage especially in these smaller cities. That leads to people going to their website quickly to book trips potentially holiday trips. If they get on their website today there are very few flights to choose from. Maybe they’ll extend the booking window in the next day or two.
 
User avatar
flymco753
Posts: 2889
Joined: Fri Jun 10, 2016 2:09 am

Re: Frontier Airlines Network Thread 2018

Tue Jul 10, 2018 4:01 pm

They best be extending their schedule to March or beginning of April if they’re waiting this long...
...the carriage of liquids, gels, and aerosols are prohibited through the screening checkpoint except for travel size toiletries of 3 ounces or less...
 
F9LASDEN
Posts: 100
Joined: Tue May 01, 2018 3:56 pm

Re: Frontier Airlines Network Thread 2018

Tue Jul 10, 2018 4:43 pm

flymco753 wrote:
They best be extending their schedule to March or beginning of April if they’re waiting this long...


I believe that is what they did last summer. Didn't extend past mid-November until July 18 (the same day they announced the 85 route mega-expansion), but when they did extend it, they extended it all the way through April 8.
 
bergenm
Posts: 3
Joined: Fri Jul 13, 2018 4:33 pm

Re: Frontier Airlines Network Thread 2018

Fri Jul 13, 2018 5:38 pm

Anyone know anything about this? Is Frontier going to get a new aircraft type?
https://rapidcityjournal.com/news/local ... 237d3.html
 
WaywardMemphian
Posts: 1059
Joined: Sat Dec 13, 2014 9:05 pm

Re: Frontier Airlines Network Thread 2018

Fri Jul 13, 2018 6:32 pm

bergenm wrote:
Anyone know anything about this? Is Frontier going to get a new aircraft type?
https://rapidcityjournal.com/news/local ... 237d3.html



Is that supposed to be a joke?

Looks to be from 1958
 
User avatar
Frontier14
Posts: 541
Joined: Sat Dec 25, 2010 4:14 am

Re: Frontier Airlines Network Thread 2018

Fri Jul 13, 2018 9:36 pm

WaywardMemphian wrote:
bergenm wrote:
Anyone know anything about this? Is Frontier going to get a new aircraft type?
https://rapidcityjournal.com/news/local ... 237d3.html



Is that supposed to be a joke?

Looks to be from 1958


Aaaaah the one of the DC-3 routes from the 1950s. Nostalgia anyone ?

Frontier 14
 
bergenm
Posts: 3
Joined: Fri Jul 13, 2018 4:33 pm

Re: Frontier Airlines Network Thread 2018

Fri Jul 13, 2018 11:43 pm

Frontier14 wrote:
WaywardMemphian wrote:
bergenm wrote:
Anyone know anything about this? Is Frontier going to get a new aircraft type?
https://rapidcityjournal.com/news/local ... 237d3.html



Is that supposed to be a joke?

Looks to be from 1958


Aaaaah the one of the DC-3 routes from the 1950s. Nostalgia anyone ?

Frontier 14


I thought that on the pilot forums someone had said they will be taking another aircraft in Q4 2018

https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/1459400-post24.html

A220??
 
SWApilotfarmer
Posts: 23
Joined: Tue Aug 15, 2017 12:48 am

Re: Frontier Airlines Network Thread 2018

Sat Jul 14, 2018 3:18 am

bergenm wrote:
Frontier14 wrote:
WaywardMemphian wrote:


Is that supposed to be a joke?

Looks to be from 1958


Aaaaah the one of the DC-3 routes from the 1950s. Nostalgia anyone ?

Frontier 14


I thought that on the pilot forums someone had said they will be taking another aircraft in Q4 2018

https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/1459400-post24.html

A220??


So the original article you posted is from 1958 and the forum quote you posted is from 2013. Do you have a serious question or just messing around?
 
Fex180
Posts: 129
Joined: Fri Apr 06, 2018 12:33 pm

Re: Frontier Airlines Network Thread 2018

Sat Jul 14, 2018 9:14 pm

Frontier really needs to release their holiday / winter schedule ASAP. Go on their social media pages and all you'll see are customers begging for a schedule extension. They'll really be shooting themselves in the foot if they don't extend their schedule very soon.
 
User avatar
Midwestindy
Posts: 3280
Joined: Sun Mar 12, 2017 3:56 am

Re: Frontier Airlines Network Thread 2018

Sat Jul 14, 2018 9:29 pm

Fex180 wrote:
Frontier really needs to release their holiday / winter schedule ASAP. Go on their social media pages and all you'll see are customers begging for a schedule extension. They'll really be shooting themselves in the foot if they don't extend their schedule very soon.


It was way worse last year
DL DM, AA Gold in 2018, Visited 2018:AMS, ATL, AUS, BOS, BWI, CDG, CLT, CMN, DCA, DFW, DTW, DXB, EWR, FLL, FRA, HAV, HPN, JFK, JNB, IAD, IAH, IND, LAX, LGA, LHR, LOS, MAD, MCO, MIA, MSP, ORD, PBI, PHL, PVD, SAN, SEA, SJD, SLC, SFO, STL, TPA, TXL, YYZ, ZRH
 
WNflyer1523
Posts: 251
Joined: Fri Jan 06, 2017 2:28 am

Re: Frontier Airlines Network Thread 2018

Mon Jul 16, 2018 3:43 pm

Frontier will now be flying out of Jackson, MS 2x a week to MCO starting in late October. The amount of bookable flights is literally only 7.
So they can announce all these new destinations/routes but can't open up a booking schedule more than 4 months in advance.
 
717atOGG
Posts: 709
Joined: Fri Feb 27, 2015 2:10 am

Re: Frontier Airlines Network Thread 2018

Mon Jul 16, 2018 6:28 pm

WNflyer1523 wrote:
Frontier will now be flying out of Jackson, MS 2x a week to MCO starting in late October. The amount of bookable flights is literally only 7.
So they can announce all these new destinations/routes but can't open up a booking schedule more than 4 months in advance.

I wish they'd just announce these a little bit later with the winter schedule rather than announcing these earlier with a pathetic booking window.
But anyways, about JAN, they're also doing a DEN flight that starts on October 13. IMO starting these with an A320 is a bit too ambitious, and that these JAN and LFT flights would be an excellent use of their A319 fleet. With F9's recent trend of expanding into the smaller southern US airports, I think that we might see XNA and some combination of MAF, AMA, and LBB get DEN/MCO service as well.
 
TYSflyer
Posts: 186
Joined: Wed Jan 11, 2017 5:44 pm

Re: Frontier Airlines Network Thread 2018

Tue Jul 17, 2018 9:07 am

Looks like they have finally extended their booking window through mid February.
 
cvgComair
Posts: 1950
Joined: Thu Jul 07, 2016 3:48 pm

Re: Frontier Airlines Network Thread 2018

Tue Jul 17, 2018 10:25 am

CVG-PHX resumes 11/6 after previously being cut and CVG-SAN appears to be extended to year round.
A319/320/321/330, B717/727/737/757/767/777/787, CRJ-100/200/700/900, DC-9, ERJ-140/145/170/175, MD-80/90, S340
 
RL757PVD
Posts: 2919
Joined: Fri Dec 03, 1999 2:47 am

Re: Frontier Airlines Network Thread 2018

Tue Jul 17, 2018 11:51 am

Is this a full extension? There’s a lot of stuff not there, including virtually no MIA service from anywhere in the northeast (PVD ISP or TTN is what I checked)
Experience is what you get when what you thought would work out didn't!
 
RL757PVD
Posts: 2919
Joined: Fri Dec 03, 1999 2:47 am

Re: Frontier Airlines Network Thread 2018

Tue Jul 17, 2018 12:00 pm

Midwestindy wrote:
RL757PVD wrote:
Is this a full extension? There’s a lot of stuff not there, including virtually no MIA service from anywhere in the northeast (PVD ISP or TTN is what I checked)


Well those flights performed sup-par last year so it wouldn't shock me if they dropped them for this year


I thought it was just the rough early start (oct which was too early) and they got to 90% + from December onward
Experience is what you get when what you thought would work out didn't!
 
User avatar
Midwestindy
Posts: 3280
Joined: Sun Mar 12, 2017 3:56 am

Re: Frontier Airlines Network Thread 2018

Tue Jul 17, 2018 12:01 pm

RL757PVD wrote:
Is this a full extension? There’s a lot of stuff not there, including virtually no MIA service from anywhere in the northeast (PVD ISP or TTN is what I checked)


Well those flights performed sup-par last year so it wouldn't shock me if they dropped them for this year
DL DM, AA Gold in 2018, Visited 2018:AMS, ATL, AUS, BOS, BWI, CDG, CLT, CMN, DCA, DFW, DTW, DXB, EWR, FLL, FRA, HAV, HPN, JFK, JNB, IAD, IAH, IND, LAX, LGA, LHR, LOS, MAD, MCO, MIA, MSP, ORD, PBI, PHL, PVD, SAN, SEA, SJD, SLC, SFO, STL, TPA, TXL, YYZ, ZRH
 
WNflyer1523
Posts: 251
Joined: Fri Jan 06, 2017 2:28 am

Re: Frontier Airlines Network Thread 2018

Tue Jul 17, 2018 1:57 pm

I don't really see anything significantly new with this extension. No ISP-MIA/other airport in South Florida which they said they intend to do
 
User avatar
flymco753
Posts: 2889
Joined: Fri Jun 10, 2016 2:09 am

Re: Frontier Airlines Network Thread 2018

Tue Jul 17, 2018 2:06 pm

Strange, not all destinations are bookable past 11/14...
...the carriage of liquids, gels, and aerosols are prohibited through the screening checkpoint except for travel size toiletries of 3 ounces or less...
 
joeljack
Posts: 593
Joined: Fri Feb 25, 2005 12:38 pm

Re: Frontier Airlines Network Thread 2018

Tue Jul 17, 2018 3:22 pm

DSM-MCO not shown to come back.
OMA-DEN is 7 days a week this fall (the 1st time it has been 7 days a week in about 3 years), goes down to 3x a week this winter, the lowest it has been in 2 years and on a A319 vs an A320. Wow.
OMA-AUS/SAT/PHL all end with the extension.
OMA-RSW flew last winter with a VERY short forward booking window for much of it. Allegiant responded and added OMA-Punta Gordo last winter, also with short booking window. Neither of these did that great, not empty, just not great. Allegiant didn't come back this winter and I was hoping F9 would bring their flight back with a more normal forward booking window and with Allegiant leaving, I think this flight would do much better this winter. Nope, OMA-RSW shown not coming back. Ugh.

I wonder where all this lift is going? I see many other flights on other cities not coming back too, like the MIA that somebody mentioned above. Get ready for another round on the Frontier dart board I would guess.
 
freakyrat
Posts: 1502
Joined: Fri Aug 22, 2008 1:04 pm

Re: Frontier Airlines Network Thread 2018

Tue Jul 17, 2018 4:02 pm

joeljack wrote:
DSM-MCO not shown to come back.
OMA-DEN is 7 days a week this fall (the 1st time it has been 7 days a week in about 3 years), goes down to 3x a week this winter, the lowest it has been in 2 years and on a A319 vs an A320. Wow.
OMA-AUS/SAT/PHL all end with the extension.
OMA-RSW flew last winter with a VERY short forward booking window for much of it. Allegiant responded and added OMA-Punta Gordo last winter, also with short booking window. Neither of these did that great, not empty, just not great. Allegiant didn't come back this winter and I was hoping F9 would bring their flight back with a more normal forward booking window and with Allegiant leaving, I think this flight would do much better this winter. Nope, OMA-RSW shown not coming back. Ugh.

I wonder where all this lift is going? I see many other flights on other cities not coming back too, like the MIA that somebody mentioned above. Get ready for another round on the Frontier dart board I would guess.


F9 brought back DEN-BMI. The only route left to bring back is DEN-SBN which actually can come back seasonally from March-October (three times weekly) and do well. Average load factor at SBN when you exclude the Months of DEC, JAN, and FEB was 88.72 % on an A319. The winter months drug the load factor down otherwise F9 had a load factor of 94% during the spring and summer. They enplaned and deplaned approx 22,000 passengers on 189 flights for total of approx. 44,000 .
 
WeatherPilot
Posts: 183
Joined: Sun Jun 25, 2017 1:51 am

Re: Frontier Airlines Network Thread 2018

Tue Jul 17, 2018 4:12 pm

SYR-DEN/RDU/ORD all gone after November in the schedule update. They just started SYR-DEN/RDU and they haven't even started SYR-ORD and they've already been discontinued.
 
jasoncrh
Posts: 638
Joined: Wed Jun 08, 2005 10:29 pm

Re: Frontier Airlines Network Thread 2018

Tue Jul 17, 2018 4:19 pm

Louisville appears to lose its nonstop to Austin, which Frontier is only starting in August. who knows if it will come back next year? Next summer?
Otherwise, Louisville to Denver goes from 4 to 2 times a week after november, which is okay, I guess, during the low season.
 
F9LASDEN
Posts: 100
Joined: Tue May 01, 2018 3:56 pm

Re: Frontier Airlines Network Thread 2018

Tue Jul 17, 2018 4:19 pm

WeatherPilot wrote:
SYR-DEN/RDU/ORD all gone after November in the schedule update. They just started SYR-DEN/RDU and they haven't even started SYR-ORD and they've already been discontinued.


All three of those flights are seasonal routes. It’s possible that they won’t come back next summer, but just because they are not running during the winter doesn’t mean that they are gone for good.
 
RL757PVD
Posts: 2919
Joined: Fri Dec 03, 1999 2:47 am

Re: Frontier Airlines Network Thread 2018

Tue Jul 17, 2018 4:20 pm

WeatherPilot wrote:
SYR-DEN/RDU/ORD all gone after November in the schedule update. They just started SYR-DEN/RDU and they haven't even started SYR-ORD and they've already been discontinued.


I never expected to see those past November however some or all of those will be back next summer I imagine. I was expecting to see them add more in Florida though like 2x Tampa Miami and fort Myers etc.

I’m wondering if this was an extension of the “no brainer” stuff while they continue to flush out the rest
Experience is what you get when what you thought would work out didn't!
 
F9LASDEN
Posts: 100
Joined: Tue May 01, 2018 3:56 pm

Re: Frontier Airlines Network Thread 2018

Tue Jul 17, 2018 4:30 pm

jasoncrh wrote:
Louisville appears to lose its nonstop to Austin, which Frontier is only starting in August. who knows if it will come back next year? Next summer?
Otherwise, Louisville to Denver goes from 4 to 2 times a week after november, which is okay, I guess, during the low season.


Both these moves make sense for the winter season. SDF-AUS is listed as a seasonal route, and considering that winter is the slow tourism season for a lot of destinations outside of warm weather destinations like Florida, it makes sense that this route stops during the winter in exchange for added routes to those warm weather destinations. Hopefully the route will resume next summer, but we’ll have to wait and see. Like you mention, winter being the slow season for SDF-DEN justifies the frequency reduction during the winter. Other frequency adjustments were made in DEN that make sense for the winter, such as DEN-MCO going from 1x to 2x daily, and both DEN-TPA and DEN-RSW going daily from 4x weekly and 3x weekly, respectively.
 
FlyPNS1
Posts: 5417
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 1999 7:12 am

Re: Frontier Airlines Network Thread 2018

Tue Jul 17, 2018 4:32 pm

Amazingly, PNS-DEN and PNS-ORD both survived in the extension, though PNS-DEN is trimmed from 3x weekly to 2x weekly. However, the PNS-ORD continues to DEN as same plane service.

I wasn't sure these would survive the low season in PNS.
 
F9LASDEN
Posts: 100
Joined: Tue May 01, 2018 3:56 pm

Re: Frontier Airlines Network Thread 2018

Tue Jul 17, 2018 4:35 pm

joeljack wrote:
DSM-MCO not shown to come back.
OMA-DEN is 7 days a week this fall (the 1st time it has been 7 days a week in about 3 years), goes down to 3x a week this winter, the lowest it has been in 2 years and on a A319 vs an A320. Wow.
OMA-AUS/SAT/PHL all end with the extension.
OMA-RSW flew last winter with a VERY short forward booking window for much of it. Allegiant responded and added OMA-Punta Gordo last winter, also with short booking window. Neither of these did that great, not empty, just not great. Allegiant didn't come back this winter and I was hoping F9 would bring their flight back with a more normal forward booking window and with Allegiant leaving, I think this flight would do much better this winter. Nope, OMA-RSW shown not coming back. Ugh.

I wonder where all this lift is going? I see many other flights on other cities not coming back too, like the MIA that somebody mentioned above. Get ready for another round on the Frontier dart board I would guess.


OMA-AUS/SAT/PHL are all listed as seasonal routes, so the suspensions of them past November were to be expected. The loss of DSM-MCO and OMA-RSW are much more news-worthy developments for this particular schedule extension.

Popular Searches On Airliners.net

Top Photos of Last:   24 Hours  •  48 Hours  •  7 Days  •  30 Days  •  180 Days  •  365 Days  •  All Time

Military Aircraft Every type from fighters to helicopters from air forces around the globe

Classic Airliners Props and jets from the good old days

Flight Decks Views from inside the cockpit

Aircraft Cabins Passenger cabin shots showing seat arrangements as well as cargo aircraft interior

Cargo Aircraft Pictures of great freighter aircraft

Government Aircraft Aircraft flying government officials

Helicopters Our large helicopter section. Both military and civil versions

Blimps / Airships Everything from the Goodyear blimp to the Zeppelin

Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos