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guyanam
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Re: Why don't any US carriers fly to Guyana?

Wed Feb 07, 2018 5:19 pm

VC10er wrote:
What is Guyana’s (and Surinam’s) tourist infrastructure like? Are there resorts etc? I have never been, but I would figure that there is an opportunity given beautiful beaches I’ve seen as well as eco-tourism.
Perhaps too much corruption as stated here, but it seems like a potential great NEW sun chasing destination - no?



What ever the tourism attractions of Guyana and Suriname are beaches aren't it. The sea is muddy and brown in color because of the heavy sediment brought down by the rivers. In fact its not until about 100 miles out to sea that it turns blue again.

Guyana has virtually no tourist infrastructure and doesn't know how to go about building a tourism industry. Suriname has a small eco tourism product. Given that the Amazon basin doesn't lend itself to the type of animal watching safaris that one can get in Africa, and there are no nearby beaches as one can get in Belize and Costa Rica eco tourism will be a very niche product for those countries.

The DR is as corrupt as ever and is also high crime but is the largest Caribbean destination for tourism. Yes there are horror stories in the DR of tourists being attacked by locals who then call the police and then play victim. The police then fine the tourist and distribute the bribe IN FRONT OF THEM! I suggest that those who disbelieve go to www.dr1.com.
 
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PPVLC
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Re: Why don't any US carriers fly to Guyana?

Wed Feb 07, 2018 5:41 pm

Varig used to fly to Georgetown, Paramaribo and Cayenne but they were mostly short hauls from BEL.
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DL757NYC
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Re: Why don't any US carriers fly to Guyana?

Sat Feb 17, 2018 8:47 am

guyanam wrote:
bridge29 wrote:
DL757NYC wrote:
DL pulled out because of issues with either the government or airport. It wasn’t a profit issue. The flight made money. I can’t recall the exact issue but it was publicized


Actually, it was a precisely a passenger load and revenue issue:

https://www.kaieteurnewsonline.com/2013 ... -pull-out/


A fly by night carrier called EZjet entered the market, dropped fares to unsustainable levels and forced both BW and DL to match. BW then reconfigured its JFK GEO service to be nonstop rather than operating via POS. The combination of both made DLs route less profitable than it was. They asked for a waiver of fuel taxes which are reportedly high and were denied, so they exited.



Well let’s just say I know people who saw that flight go out packed every night. The issue was the local government but hey what do I know.
 
CobaltScar
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Re: Why don't any US carriers fly to Guyana?

Sat Feb 17, 2018 2:39 pm

guyanam wrote:
B737900ER wrote:
guyanam wrote:

You really think that GEO is more dangerous or corrupt than Venezuela or Colombia? Or Nigeria? While there are problems these aren't any worse than in some other countries.

Yes.

It may be small but it’s incredibly corrupt. I was held for hours at the airport on “suspicion on drug trafficking”. When they realized I wasn’t going to pay my way out they went as far as dumping all of the contents of my checked bag on the ramp, and then watched as I .



Sorry as soon as you use your experiences to damn a country you lose credibility. When people wish to make a point they cite 3rd party sources DL goes to LOS and US carriers fly to CCS, to Honduras and El Salvador. 3rd party sources deem them all to be more dangerous than GEO.

BTW there are loads of horror stories out of MEX.


There are many people from Guyana in central Florida. Lots of Hindu temples frequented by them and I've come into contact with them. I always ask them about visiting because I would like to see some of the flora/fauna there. None of them advise it. Even they when they go to visit feel in danger. One I knew went to visit relatives and had a gold chain on, he was shot in the stomach on his relatives front porch and robbed. Died soon after. You listed some other dangerous locations, difference is there is money to be made on those flights. For now.

As far as United to Lagos, the crews there had heavily armed escort to and from and in their layover there. No thanks.
 
FARmd90
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Re: Why don't any US carriers fly to Guyana?

Sat Feb 17, 2018 6:42 pm

Just for a hypothetical question. How well would a GEO-SJU on B6 do with say the 190? It could be done as a turn for the crew so no layover issues there and with the stop in SJU that people could connect onto other multiple points in the B6 network and further on once in the states. Or would a nonstop be better due to local demand to either FLL or JFK?

And again I know that this question has a .000000000003% chance of ever happening but it’s always fun to ask “what if”
 
Varsity1
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Re: Why don't any US carriers fly to Guyana?

Sat Feb 17, 2018 7:23 pm

B737900ER wrote:
Galwayman wrote:
US carriers are really lazy and prefer codeshares and oligopolic situations , they’re really chasing the high fares low effort revenue .

Duh. How do you justify chasing low fare high effort revenue? It’s a business not a non profit charity or an entity designed to make you feel better about yourself. Tell your employees and shareholders that we’re going to make less money so we can work harder. That will go over well.

:lol:

This place is a mess.
 
guyanam
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Re: Why don't any US carriers fly to Guyana?

Mon Feb 19, 2018 4:12 pm

DL757NYC wrote:
guyanam wrote:
bridge29 wrote:

Actually, it was a precisely a passenger load and revenue issue:

https://www.kaieteurnewsonline.com/2013 ... -pull-out/


A fly by night carrier called EZjet entered the market, dropped fares to unsustainable levels and forced both BW and DL to match. BW then reconfigured its JFK GEO service to be nonstop rather than operating via POS. The combination of both made DLs route less profitable than it was. They asked for a waiver of fuel taxes which are reportedly high and were denied, so they exited.



Well let’s just say I know people who saw that flight go out packed every night. The issue was the local government but hey what do I know.


DL wanted a jet fuel subsidy. The Guyana gov't refused. DL pulled out. The declining yields turned them off the route. DL flies to Nigeria. Case closed!
 
guyanam
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Re: Why don't any US carriers fly to Guyana?

Mon Feb 19, 2018 4:15 pm

CobaltScar wrote:
[it. Even they when they go to visit feel in danger. One I knew went to visit relatives and had a gold chain on, he was shot in the stomach on his relatives front porch and robbed. Died soon after. You listed some other dangerous locations, difference is there is money to be made on those flights. For now.

As far as United to Lagos, the crews there had heavily armed escort to and from and in their layover there. No thanks.


Jamaicans have lots to say about their visits home. So too do Haitians. Note that in some cases relatives have robbed and even killed some of these overseas based Jamaicans and Haitians. DL flies to Haiti.
Last edited by guyanam on Mon Feb 19, 2018 4:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
guyanam
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Re: Why don't any US carriers fly to Guyana?

Mon Feb 19, 2018 4:18 pm

FARmd90 wrote:
Just for a hypothetical question. How well would a GEO-SJU on B6 do with say the 190? ”


B6 isn't using SJU for much aside from flights to the DR and the USVI. They axed their SXM SJU route. The days of an SJU hub have long gone. GEO USA travel is mainly to the JFK and MIA/FLL. There is ample direct service into those markets.
 
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c933103
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Re: Why don't any US carriers fly to Guyana?

Mon Feb 19, 2018 4:25 pm

Maybe the fact that Guyana and Suriname each have less than a million population have something to do with their relatively little amount of service to the US?
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gunnerman
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Re: Why don't any US carriers fly to Guyana?

Mon Feb 19, 2018 8:02 pm

Population is a factor, but what matters a lot is tourist traffic when VFR and business traffic is fairly low. For example, Barbados has a population of 284,000 but has 40 weekly scheduled flights from the US alone, from other countries such as the UK there are 26. It's the package of beaches, resorts, hotels, restaurants, bars, etc, which keep attracting people to Barbados. Guyana and Suriname just don't have these attractions, so cannot get the volume of tourists.
 
Flighty
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Re: Why don't any US carriers fly to Guyana?

Mon Feb 19, 2018 8:30 pm

OA260 wrote:
Its always been a tough market to make money on. All low yield minimal inbound tourism. In recent years they have tried to attract eco tourism but this is a limited market. Guyana Airways then Guyana 2000 then Universal all failures and unreilable operations. I flew both GY and BW. BWIA became the default national carrier of Guyana. Its a shame Guyana Airways did not have a vision free of government corruption and inability to run an airline. It would if run properly have been a good asset to the country with JFK MIA YYZ links.

No demand at all for UK-Guyana. Most who left in the 60s around Independence rarely went back maybe for funerals etc.. their British born children maybe went to visit once or twice to see their roots but nothing like the diaspora in the USA/Canada who do tend to go back and forth more often and who still have lots of family there. A lot of highly educated Asians left and never went back as the country changed and not in a good sense.

As stated DL got sick of the corruption maybe had it been a better business enviroment they might have stayed with a B737 and made it work. It was a major blow to loose DL.


I believe that BWIA was one of the last scheduled L-1011 services to/from the USA. Along with the ATA birds. BWIA really holds the answer to this thread's question. Guyana is a special market that a conventionally structured airline cannot serve. The market requires a special operator.
 
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hummingbird
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Re: Why don't any US carriers fly to Guyana?

Mon Feb 19, 2018 9:22 pm

2. Delta’s decision to exit the JFK-GEO market was not taken lightly “for its own
commercial reasons” as suggested by Fly Jamaica in its Petition. (Page 2) Rather, after
five years of successfully operating nonstop service on the JFK-GEO route, Delta was
forced to terminate service due to the entry of a state sponsored, state-subsided carrier
using an aggressive interpretation of 5th freedom operating rights.

http://airlineinfo.com/ostpdf88/876.pdf
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guyanam
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Re: Why don't any US carriers fly to Guyana?

Tue Feb 20, 2018 5:19 pm

hummingbird wrote:
2. Delta’s decision to exit the JFK-GEO market was not taken lightly “for its own
commercial reasons” as suggested by Fly Jamaica in its Petition. (Page 2) Rather, after
five years of successfully operating nonstop service on the JFK-GEO route, Delta was
forced to terminate service due to the entry of a state sponsored, state-subsided carrier
using an aggressive interpretation of 5th freedom operating rights.

http://airlineinfo.com/ostpdf88/876.pdf



BW was on the JFK GEO route BEFORE DL arrived. DL wanted fuel waivers and used BW as an excuse. If the fact that BW was subsidized by the govt of T&T was such a huge factor they never would have entered the market. What changed the market dynamics was when EZjet, a fly by night carrier entered with cut rate fares. Both BW and DL were forced to respond. Everyone lost $$$.
 
guyanam
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Re: Why don't any US carriers fly to Guyana?

Tue Feb 20, 2018 5:25 pm

Flighty wrote:
[
I believe that BWIA was one of the last scheduled L-1011 services to/from the USA. Along with the ATA birds. BWIA really holds the answer to this thread's question. Guyana is a special market that a conventionally structured airline cannot serve. The market requires a special operator.



Pan Am ran a JFK GEO service via POS in the 60s and 70s when the market was much smaller than it is now. There is significant VFR travel between JFK and GEO and in fact that market is only slightly smaller than is the JFK BGI and it is larger than the JFK ANU.
 
amdiesen
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Re: Why don't any US carriers fly to Guyana?

Wed Feb 28, 2018 4:58 pm

Exxon Mobil announced oil was discovered in the Pacora-1 exploration well offshore Guyana.
https://www.upi.com/https:/www.upi.com/ ... 519825478/

Realization of Guyana production expectations puts the country ahead of Egypt and Libya. Guyana and its oil industry are at an early stage of the exploration and discovery cycle.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_c ... production

Why don't any US carriers fly to Guyana? Retrospectively, they will be viewed as real and annoying nuisances that were addressed and became irrelevant.
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Noise
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Re: Why don't any US carriers fly to Guyana?

Wed Feb 28, 2018 6:01 pm

Geographically speaking, Georgetown and Paramaribo are surprisingly far from places like JFK. They're not in the Caribbean, rather they fully part of the South American mainland border the Atlantic Ocean. As such, it is a little harder to sustain a nonstop JFK-GEO flight than, say, JFK-POS.
 
guyanam
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Re: Why don't any US carriers fly to Guyana?

Wed Feb 28, 2018 11:12 pm

Noise wrote:
Geographically speaking, Georgetown and Paramaribo are surprisingly far from places like JFK. They're not in the Caribbean, rather they fully part of the South American mainland border the Atlantic Ocean. As such, it is a little harder to sustain a nonstop JFK-GEO flight than, say, JFK-POS.



And yet BW manages 10x nonstop on the JFK GEO vs. 17x on the JFK POS. Yields are much higher too, so much that BW regards its JFK GEO as its most profitable route. There is little demand for USA PBM service so all they will get will be PY from MIA via GEO or AUA and connecting service via POS on BW. The US census suggests that there are 300k Guyanese living in the USA.

The issue with Guyana is that it isn't geographically Caribbean and it isn't integrated into South America so it falls below the radar. They also do not do the aggressive routes development targeted to US carriers that most of the Caribbean islands do.
 
Brickell305
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Re: Why don't any US carriers fly to Guyana?

Thu Mar 01, 2018 3:42 pm

I think the main reason that there is no US air carrier service to Guyana is that US demand almost entirely comes from the NYC area and that route is primarily VFR with very little business or leisure traffic. The US carriers that are generally interested in routes like that are low cost carriers a la B6. B6 planes apparently don't have the range to do GEO-JFK non stop with a profitable payload with the current runway length at GEO. It's not very different from what you'll see on other VFR heavy routes from NYC to the Caribbean. POS has BW, B6 with a seasonal sub-daily UA service out of EWR. KIN has BW, B6 and OJ (another Caribbean based VFR carrier). Even BGI, with its significant leisure component now only supports B6 out of JFK. The legacies basically don't serve the English speaking West Indian VFR routes out of JFK. Unlike KIN, POS and BGI, there is no significant demand out of MIA/FLL so there will be no AA or B6 from So. Fla. So until and unless B6 can serve GEO-JFK profitably (I think work is currently being done on runway expansion at GEO), I suspect that there won't be any US carrier serving GEO.
 
guyanam
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Re: Why don't any US carriers fly to Guyana?

Tue Mar 27, 2018 9:02 pm

http://demerarawaves.com/2018/03/27/maj ... ts-routes/


So I guess the questions are answered. AA will begin a MIA GEO service this December. I would think that it will be 3X given that this is a business route.
Last edited by guyanam on Tue Mar 27, 2018 9:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
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OA260
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Re: Why don't any US carriers fly to Guyana?

Tue Mar 27, 2018 9:07 pm

guyanam wrote:
https://www.airliners.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1385637&p=20213759&hilit=guyana#p20213759


So I guess the questions are answered. AA will begin a MIA GEO service this December. I would think that it will be 3X given that this is a business route.


Article here :

Major US airline adds Guyana to its routes

FORT WORTH, Texas, March 27, 2018 (GLOBE NEWSWIRE) The major United States (US) scheduled carrier, American Airlines, will this year-end begin flying to Guyana.

MIA-GEO Airbus A319 On sale April 2 Starts Dec. 20

http://demerarawaves.com/2018/03/27/maj ... ts-routes/
 
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aemoreira1981
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Re: Why don't any US carriers fly to Guyana?

Tue Mar 27, 2018 9:21 pm

OA260 wrote:
guyanam wrote:
https://www.airliners.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1385637&p=20213759&hilit=guyana#p20213759


So I guess the questions are answered. AA will begin a MIA GEO service this December. I would think that it will be 3X given that this is a business route.


Article here :

Major US airline adds Guyana to its routes

FORT WORTH, Texas, March 27, 2018 (GLOBE NEWSWIRE) The major United States (US) scheduled carrier, American Airlines, will this year-end begin flying to Guyana.

MIA-GEO Airbus A319 On sale April 2 Starts Dec. 20

http://demerarawaves.com/2018/03/27/maj ... ts-routes/

How long before B6 applies for FLL-GEO on an E190?
 
LimaFoxTango
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Re: Why don't any US carriers fly to Guyana?

Tue Mar 27, 2018 10:33 pm

aemoreira1981 wrote:
OA260 wrote:
guyanam wrote:
https://www.airliners.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1385637&p=20213759&hilit=guyana#p20213759


So I guess the questions are answered. AA will begin a MIA GEO service this December. I would think that it will be 3X given that this is a business route.


Article here :

Major US airline adds Guyana to its routes

FORT WORTH, Texas, March 27, 2018 (GLOBE NEWSWIRE) The major United States (US) scheduled carrier, American Airlines, will this year-end begin flying to Guyana.

MIA-GEO Airbus A319 On sale April 2 Starts Dec. 20

http://demerarawaves.com/2018/03/27/maj ... ts-routes/

How long before B6 applies for FLL-GEO on an E190?


I'm not sure if the E190 has the legs for that. Even if it does, the baggage capacity would be severely reduced. Guyanese/West Indians travel very heavy!
You are said to be a good pilot when your take-off's equal your landings.
 
guyanam
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Re: Why don't any US carriers fly to Guyana?

Tue Mar 27, 2018 11:18 pm

I suspect that this new AA service is aimed at the oil & gas business travel that has exploded over the past year or so. GEO remains very NY heavy in terms of the VFR. From other US markets VFR travel is highly seasonal.

Reports recently are about planes flying to Guyana "packed with white people". If you know the GEO market you will see why this will be a noteworthy observation. GEO is as far off the beaten track for leisure travel as one can get.
 
PEK777
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Re: Why don't any US carriers fly to Guyana?

Tue Mar 27, 2018 11:31 pm

Never heard of it, therefore air service is not justified.
 
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Aesma
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Re: Why don't any US carriers fly to Guyana?

Tue Mar 27, 2018 11:40 pm

If the country is corrupt now, oil money will not help.

There is also oil offshore French Guiana but there are no plans for mass production.
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Cunard
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Re: Why don't any US carriers fly to Guyana?

Tue Mar 27, 2018 11:45 pm

PEK777 wrote:
Never heard of it, therefore air service is not justified.


What an absolutely ridiculous comment so that's your opinion is it based on total ignorance, I take it that Geography isn't your best subject!
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slickvik
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Re: Why don't any US carriers fly to Guyana?

Wed Mar 28, 2018 12:03 am

guyanam wrote:
VC10er wrote:
What is Guyana’s (and Surinam’s) tourist infrastructure like? Are there resorts etc? I have never been, but I would figure that there is an opportunity given beautiful beaches I’ve seen as well as eco-tourism.
Perhaps too much corruption as stated here, but it seems like a potential great NEW sun chasing destination - no?



What ever the tourism attractions of Guyana and Suriname are beaches aren't it. The sea is muddy and brown in color because of the heavy sediment brought down by the rivers. In fact its not until about 100 miles out to sea that it turns blue again.

Guyana has virtually no tourist infrastructure and doesn't know how to go about building a tourism industry. Suriname has a small eco tourism product. Given that the Amazon basin doesn't lend itself to the type of animal watching safaris that one can get in Africa, and there are no nearby beaches as one can get in Belize and Costa Rica eco tourism will be a very niche product for those countries.

The DR is as corrupt as ever and is also high crime but is the largest Caribbean destination for tourism. Yes there are horror stories in the DR of tourists being attacked by locals who then call the police and then play victim. The police then fine the tourist and distribute the bribe IN FRONT OF THEM! I suggest that those who disbelieve go to http://www.dr1.com.


Suriname has ecotourism but it is in the infancy stages of development. Also the road infrastructure isn't particularly good.
 
EarlyLateORD
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Re: Why don't any US carriers fly to Guyana?

Wed Mar 28, 2018 12:16 am

Note: Guyana shares many of the same natural resources that Venezuela has...with Venezuela's issues...Guyana is an attractive investment

Adam
 
FARmd90
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Re: Why don't any US carriers fly to Guyana?

Wed Mar 28, 2018 1:27 am

LimaFoxTango wrote:
aemoreira1981 wrote:
OA260 wrote:

Article here :

Major US airline adds Guyana to its routes

FORT WORTH, Texas, March 27, 2018 (GLOBE NEWSWIRE) The major United States (US) scheduled carrier, American Airlines, will this year-end begin flying to Guyana.

MIA-GEO Airbus A319 On sale April 2 Starts Dec. 20

http://demerarawaves.com/2018/03/27/maj ... ts-routes/

How long before B6 applies for FLL-GEO on an E190?


I'm not sure if the E190 has the legs for that. Even if it does, the baggage capacity would be severely reduced. Guyanese/West Indians travel very heavy!


Wiki says the range on the 190 is 2,450nm. It doesn’t say what variant of the 190 wiki uses to get that number. And Great Circle Mapper says FLL-GEO is only 1,716nm. So I think FLL-GEO would be comfortably within the 190s performance if B6 really wanted to start it the route off with it.
 
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aemoreira1981
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Re: Why don't any US carriers fly to Guyana?

Wed Mar 28, 2018 1:47 am

FARmd90 wrote:
LimaFoxTango wrote:
aemoreira1981 wrote:
How long before B6 applies for FLL-GEO on an E190?


I'm not sure if the E190 has the legs for that. Even if it does, the baggage capacity would be severely reduced. Guyanese/West Indians travel very heavy!


Wiki says the range on the 190 is 2,450nm. It doesn’t say what variant of the 190 wiki uses to get that number. And Great Circle Mapper says FLL-GEO is only 1,716nm. So I think FLL-GEO would be comfortably within the 190s performance if B6 really wanted to start it the route off with it.

B6 flies the IGW version. That’s doable easily even with multiple diversione. The idea would be to undercut AA’s LatAm network.
 
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OA260
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Re: Why don't any US carriers fly to Guyana?

Wed Mar 28, 2018 9:28 am

LimaFoxTango wrote:
aemoreira1981 wrote:
OA260 wrote:

Article here :

Major US airline adds Guyana to its routes

FORT WORTH, Texas, March 27, 2018 (GLOBE NEWSWIRE) The major United States (US) scheduled carrier, American Airlines, will this year-end begin flying to Guyana.

MIA-GEO Airbus A319 On sale April 2 Starts Dec. 20

http://demerarawaves.com/2018/03/27/maj ... ts-routes/

How long before B6 applies for FLL-GEO on an E190?


I'm not sure if the E190 has the legs for that. Even if it does, the baggage capacity would be severely reduced. Guyanese/West Indians travel very heavy!


Very true you certainly would not sell many HBO fares on that route !
 
WingsOfLove
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Re: Why don't any US carriers fly to Guyana?

Sat Mar 31, 2018 3:14 pm

guyanam wrote:
AA will begin a MIA GEO service this December. I would think that it will be 3X given that this is a business route.

Guyana news outlet reports 4x a week A319.
https://www.kaieteurnewsonline.com/2018 ... -december/
 
wjcandee
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Re: Why don't any US carriers fly to Guyana?

Sat Mar 31, 2018 3:26 pm

North American had a nice little business flying there. Made it look so good, DL decided to come in and put them out of business. Then they left after North American folded. What a great business.
 
guyanam
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Re: Why don't any US carriers fly to Guyana?

Sat Mar 31, 2018 4:09 pm

Actually North American left in 2008 when they decided that the fully charter business was more lucrative. DL came into fill the gap.
 
WingsOfLove
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Re: Why don't any US carriers fly to Guyana?

Sun Apr 01, 2018 3:56 am

guyanam wrote:
A fly by night carrier called EZjet entered the market, dropped fares to unsustainable levels and forced both BW and DL to match. BW then reconfigured its JFK GEO service to be nonstop rather than operating via POS. The combination of both made DLs route less profitable than it was. They asked for a waiver of fuel taxes which are reportedly high and were denied, so they exited.


Love reading your insights. Sure seems a difficult market. Let's see how long AA will survive on the route.
 
Brickell305
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Re: Why don't any US carriers fly to Guyana?

Sun Apr 01, 2018 3:02 pm

WingsOfLove wrote:
guyanam wrote:
AA will begin a MIA GEO service this December. I would think that it will be 3X given that this is a business route.

Guyana news outlet reports 4x a week A319.
https://www.kaieteurnewsonline.com/2018 ... -december/

To move to daily during summer 2019. I for one definitely didn’t see AA starting this route from Miami but I’m glad for Guyana and AA. The flight schedule is similar to other South American red eyes and opens up the full breadth of connections at MIA. With COPA going daily and AA starting this service, things are looking up for GEO. If AA is able to capture enough people willing to connect through MIA to NYC as opposed to taking the non stop on BW, this could go daily earlier than expected.
 
usflyer msp
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Re: Why don't any US carriers fly to Guyana?

Sun Apr 01, 2018 3:24 pm

AA will do fine to GEO (even though those 4 hour redeyes are rough - too short to sleep but too long to stay awake). Their depth of their network and relative reliability should attract most of the business traffic headed to GEO and they can fill the rest of the plane with connections. It should not be difficult to compete with/undercut BW as they charge $750+ for the JFK-GEO nonstop, more than many JFK-Europe flights.
 
guyanam
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Re: Why don't any US carriers fly to Guyana?

Sun Apr 01, 2018 7:06 pm

Brickell305 wrote:
To move to daily during summer 2019. I for one definitely didn’t see AA starting this route from Miami but I’m glad for Guyana and AA. The flight schedule is similar to other South American red eyes and opens up the full breadth of connections at MIA. With COPA going daily and AA starting this service, things are looking up for GEO. If AA is able to capture enough people willing to connect through MIA to NYC as opposed to taking the non stop on BW, this could go daily earlier than expected.



Contrary to popular belief there is travel between GEO and points in the USA aside from NYC. There are Guyanese populations in the DC/ATL areas and even in TX/CA, in addition to a large FL presence. In addition there is more business traffic than before, most I bet originated in FL or TX. AAs MIA service will improve the travel experience for people arriving from non gateway cities as they can fly AA right thru instead of having to switch to PY or BW when they get to MIA. Airfares will definitely improve.

I wonder what impact this service will have on COPA's plans to go daily as I suspect that some of this business is connecting in PTY from assorted points in the USA. BW cannot handle JFK GEO traffic in peak periods, so much of the excess will bleed to AA. I suggest that the chapter of assorted fly by night carriers to GEO is over. As is the era of BW using GEO to generate cash to support the rest of its money losing operation. BW will have to be more imaginative in competing in its POS and Jamaica markets against B6 and WestJet.

I will suggest that PY's North American ambitions just came to a grinding halt.

As to red eye flights. Well these have long been part of GEO USA travel. But AAs service is tied to EXXON. That is what made them bite the bullet and start service to GEO even as they were ambivalent about this market for quite awhile now.
 
9w748capt
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Re: Why don't any US carriers fly to Guyana?

Sun Apr 01, 2018 7:27 pm

Thanks for the insights guyanam. Guyana has always intrigued me - I find it amazing that a country so far from India has so many people of Indian origin. Have met a few of them in the US and they always have interesting stories to tell.
 
gunnerman
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Re: Why don't any US carriers fly to Guyana?

Sun Apr 01, 2018 9:28 pm

I can't help wondering how much incentives AA have got to launch this service.
 
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OA260
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Re: Why don't any US carriers fly to Guyana?

Sun Apr 01, 2018 9:37 pm

9w748capt wrote:
I find it amazing that a country so far from India has so many people of Indian origin. Have met a few of them in the US and they always have interesting stories to tell.


A good insight here

An overview of Indian Indentureship in Guyana, 1838-1917

www.stabroeknews.com/2013/news/stories/ ... 1838-1917/

--

I hope AA stick with it. Too many Mickey Mouse operations have plagued the Guyanese aviation market over the years. What GEO needs is a long term reliable and stable carrier which offers a large one stop network to the rest of the main areas of North America and Europe. AA certainly meet that criteria. Lets hope the government dont do anything to annoy AA.
 
usflyer msp
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Re: Why don't any US carriers fly to Guyana?

Sun Apr 01, 2018 9:56 pm

guyanam wrote:
Brickell305 wrote:
Contrary to popular belief there is travel between GEO and points in the USA aside from NYC.


We have about 15,000 in MSP (I used to date one). They run all of the Caribbean restaurants in MSP except one. It is always an expensive ordeal for them to get back to GEO - they have to budget around $1100 for an MSP - GEO ticket and take a circuitous routing with UA since DL/AA have no interline agreements with BW or PY. Taking AA through MIA will definitely be a more convenient option and hopefully a more economical one as well....
 
guyanam
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Re: Why don't any US carriers fly to Guyana?

Sun Apr 01, 2018 10:55 pm

gunnerman wrote:
I can't help wondering how much incentives AA have got to launch this service.



I am not even sure if the Guyana gov't even knows how to put together incentives. Maybe waiving landing fees and taxes on fuel. AA might even be looking at how many GEO bound people are changing airlines at MIA or POS and decided that this is enough for them. But I doubt that there are revenue guarantees and definitely NOT any marketing support.
 
Alphazone
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Re: Why don't any US carriers fly to Guyana?

Sun Apr 01, 2018 10:57 pm

B737900ER wrote:
In Guyana [...] I’ve been robbed and multiple times at that.


You can get robbed also in the United States
N664US The Spirit of Beijing
N670US World Plane - 50 Years Bridging the Pacific / The Alliance Spirit
N671US City of Detroit
N673US City of Tokyo
N674US City of Shanghai
N675NW Spirit of the Northwest People
 
gunnerman
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Re: Why don't any US carriers fly to Guyana?

Mon Apr 02, 2018 1:26 am

Traffic will be GEO bound, so the late departure from MIA at 1800 helps transfer passengers from NYC and other places to get to GEO on the same day. Arrival will be at the nasty hour of 2340, but that's better than one alternative which is overnighting in MIA to catch a morning flight. And on the return, the nasty arrival time of 0455 into MIA helps transfer passengers to catch a variety of flights to get home.
 
WingsOfLove
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Re: Why don't any US carriers fly to Guyana?

Mon Apr 02, 2018 1:58 am

gunnerman wrote:
the late departure from MIA at 1800 and the nasty arrival time of 0455 into MIA helps transfer passengers


Very true. Scheduled to maximize connections and a very efficient use of an airplane.
 
Brickell305
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Re: Why don't any US carriers fly to Guyana?

Mon Apr 02, 2018 12:50 pm

gunnerman wrote:
Traffic will be GEO bound, so the late departure from MIA at 1800 helps transfer passengers from NYC and other places to get to GEO on the same day. Arrival will be at the nasty hour of 2340, but that's better than one alternative which is overnighting in MIA to catch a morning flight. And on the return, the nasty arrival time of 0455 into MIA helps transfer passengers to catch a variety of flights to get home.


I've actually done a similar schedule to/from BOG on a few occasions with the same aircraft type and I actually quite like it. You maximize your time in MIA in both directions and yes, the sleep is short but it's survivable.
 
skystar767
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Re: Why don't any US carriers fly to Guyana?

Mon Apr 02, 2018 2:48 pm

18:00 departure from MIA to GEO is not a good time. Arriving at 23:40 is a very bad time. Guyanese don’t like arriving to GEO at that time. Guyanese like to arrive in the morning so they can have a running start for business and driving home In the day light. Some people have to drive 2-3 hrs and driving at night in guyana bandits will hold up cars on the road. AA really need to rethink the arrival time for that flight to work.
 
gunnerman
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Re: Why don't any US carriers fly to Guyana?

Mon Apr 02, 2018 4:33 pm

If Guyanese don't like the schedule, they have got alternatives: PY (three times a week, two arriving at 2200, one at 2245) and BW (daily one-stop via POS arriving 2150). And if these alternatives still don't look that good, well that's just the way it is. Guyana is a small market, so no airline is going to fly nice schedules for passengers when they are looking to keep costs low by working their aircraft and crews hard.

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