CMH-DFW shows no availability at all after June 10th even though the schedule is open until August.

CMH-IAH shows no availability after April 5th.

Buffalomatt1027 wrote:

maximairways wrote:

modernArt wrote:

SAT - Raleigh/Durham nonstop.

Ha, ha. Austin-Buffalo. That's got to be an early candidate for the most ridiculous route of the year (if there were such a distinction). Does Houston even have nonstops to Buffalo (or Providence)?

Connecting a fast growing focus city, with a midsized tech city currently without Texas service for some reason. Not to mention the 5th most visited tourist destination in North America 30 minutes away.

I understand Niagara Falls is a big draw for BUF-> Austin (I am sure its seasonal) ..... but you DO NOT see many American tourists visit the falls. It is mostly Asians and Indian people who visit.

I could be wrong .... and I am not taking the Canadian side of the falls into consideration.

The Canadian side of the Falls are what most tourists visit anyways, but either way BUF is the US gateway to the Falls.

dekema2 wrote:

My guess is that the Buffalo expansions are due to the proximity to Toronto. Our metro population is generally stagnant at 1.1M.

I do wonder why we don't have nonstop flights to the PNW, though.

If you add in the Canadian side, that's another 450k in population.

http://www.newsobserver.com/news/busine ... 41889.html

"Denver-based Frontier says it will add flights from RDU to Buffalo, Houston, Milwaukee, New Orleans, San Antonio and San Juan, Puerto. The nonstops to Buffalo, San Antonio and San Juan will be the only ones from RDU, and bring the number of nonstop destinations from the Triangle to 52."

[quote="SyracuseAvGeek"]SYR-DEN. Syracuse offered $400,000 as part of the small communities air service initiative to any airline that will offer non-stop service to Denver. Long shot, but one can hope[/quote

Supposedly the demand is there. The authority needs to go after Southwest.

TucsonDave wrote:

SyracuseAvGeek wrote:

SYR-DEN. Syracuse offered $400,000 as part of the small communities air service initiative to any airline that will offer non-stop service to Denver. Long shot, but one can hope[/quote

Supposedly the demand is there. The authority needs to go after Southwest.

WN would definitely make sense. Maybe they would look at also adding Atlanta or Chicago. BWI too.

Looks like nothing for STL. I was hoping for some kind of add since they dropped ATL. F9 had pretty good growth at STL in 2017, but looks like 2018 it will be back down. Oh well, thats how the F9 scheduling goes. Congrats to the airports that had new routes!

RDU-SJU starts April 11, that's soon. I wonder if this means Allegiant won't be coming next winter season. They launched it as seasonal before canceling it. Allegiant has no competition on any of their other San Juan routes.

Also Frontier's service is only twice weekly. Hopefully they'll increase it during winter season. If they don't I can see Allegiant coming back easily, but if they do I don't know -- there's enough traffic on the route but Allegiant does like to avoid competition.

Midwestindy wrote:

https://news.flyfrontier.com/frontier-airlines-adds-35-new-routes-four-new-cities/

Back at BKG. A kneecap to XNA. As I have posted in previous threads about BKG, it splits the difference between Northwest Arkansas and Springfield. If US 412 is ever upgrading between Huntsville and Harrison Arkansas, it makes even more sense.

modernArt wrote:

Ha, ha. Austin-Buffalo. That's got to be an early candidate for the most ridiculous route of the year (if there were such a distinction).

I don't know how many people fly between SJC and TUL. That was announced last week.

WaywardMemphian wrote:

Midwestindy wrote:

https://news.flyfrontier.com/frontier-airlines-adds-35-new-routes-four-new-cities/

Back at BKG. A kneecap to XNA. As I have posted in previous threads about BKG, it splits the difference between Northwest Arkansas and Springfield. If US 412 is ever upgrading between Huntsville and Harrison Arkansas, it makes even more sense.

The BKG service is for 2 short months only , so there's that

I guess UST-SJU was a mistake but it was showing up. Now it’s not. That was the only head scratcher for me.

Moreover, the carrier moves will now be the second largest carrier in Austin (30),

Well, Austin got its big expansion this week.

So is F9 trying to make AUS a hub or something?

DeltaRules wrote:

Moreover, the carrier moves will now be the second largest carrier in Austin (30),

Well, Austin got its big expansion this week.

BUF- Austin is still a head scratcher for me .... anyone from Austin want to visit Buffalo / Niagara Falls? COME ON UP!

I also only think its once week..... that can NOT help the routes success rate.

PHL-BHM? Pax in PHL want to fly to markets such as ATL, DTW, PIT and ORD, not really so much: BHM, GRR and IND. F9's east-west PHL strategy is cover routes where pax don't want to fly.

KLMatSJC wrote:

modernArt wrote:

Ha, ha. Austin-Buffalo. That's got to be an early candidate for the most ridiculous route of the year (if there were such a distinction).

I don't know how many people fly between SJC and TUL. That was announced last week.

I'm thinking they want to pick off some NWA leisure travelers as well. They attacking the XNA crowd from both sides now with BKG.

RJNUT wrote:

WaywardMemphian wrote:

Midwestindy wrote:

https://news.flyfrontier.com/frontier-airlines-adds-35-new-routes-four-new-cities/

Back at BKG. A kneecap to XNA. As I have posted in previous threads about BKG, it splits the difference between Northwest Arkansas and Springfield. If US 412 is ever upgrading between Huntsville and Harrison Arkansas, it makes even more sense.

The BKG service is for 2 short months only , so there's that

It's start and certainly a trial balloon.

The Christmas season is huge in Branson, Silver Dollar City is consistently rated a Top 10 Christmas attraction. I can see this actually having a shot and being extended.

Ha, ha. Austin-Buffalo. That's got to be an early candidate for the most ridiculous route of the year (if there were such a distinction). Does Houston even have nonstops to Buffalo (or Providence)?

I will admit I thought BUF - AUS and to some extent RDU are choices I wouldn't expect, but the airport does serve a relatively large catchment area. In Canada (Not including frequent bus service from YYZ) you have Hamilton, St Catherines, Niagara Falls and other small cities on the Niagara Peninsula, in NY you have Buffalo, Niagara Falls, Jamestown, and in some extent some passenger bleed from ROC, although at times BUF passengers bleed to ROC as well depending on availability. Erie PA is another city from which passengers commute for flights.

So although the choices are unusual, who knows they may work, besides it's only one day a week, but BUF, like other US airports is experiencing a passenger surge and from what the local papers say, the current Frontier lineup is proving very popular..

It's always good to see airlines try additional unique services, isn't that what deregulation is supposed to do? It's just good someone tries.

Dominion301 wrote:

Buffalomatt1027 wrote:

maximairways wrote:

Connecting a fast growing focus city, with a midsized tech city currently without Texas service for some reason. Not to mention the 5th most visited tourist destination in North America 30 minutes away.

I understand Niagara Falls is a big draw for BUF-> Austin (I am sure its seasonal) ..... but you DO NOT see many American tourists visit the falls. It is mostly Asians and Indian people who visit.

I could be wrong .... and I am not taking the Canadian side of the falls into consideration.

The Canadian side of the Falls are what most tourists visit anyways, but either way BUF is the US gateway to the Falls.

dekema2 wrote:

My guess is that the Buffalo expansions are due to the proximity to Toronto. Our metro population is generally stagnant at 1.1M.

I do wonder why we don't have nonstop flights to the PNW, though.

If you add in the Canadian side, that's another 450k in population.

BUF is a great destination but wouldn't the lower hanging fruit be F9 on DFW-BUF, over AUS-BUF? Far more a population base on the DFW side.

BUFJACK10 wrote:

Ha, ha. Austin-Buffalo. That's got to be an early candidate for the most ridiculous route of the year (if there were such a distinction). Does Houston even have nonstops to Buffalo (or Providence)?

I will admit I thought BUF - AUS and to some extent RDU are choices I wouldn't expect, but the airport does serve a relatively large catchment area. In Canada (Not including frequent bus service from YYZ) you have Hamilton, St Catherines, Niagara Falls and other small cities on the Niagara Peninsula, in NY you have Buffalo, Niagara Falls, Jamestown, and in some extent some passenger bleed from ROC, although at times BUF passengers bleed to ROC as well depending on availability. Erie PA is another city from which passengers commute for flights.

So although the choices are unusual, who knows they may work, besides it's only one day a week, but BUF, like other US airports is experiencing a passenger surge and from what the local papers say, the current Frontier lineup is proving very popular..

It's always good to see airlines try additional unique services, isn't that what deregulation is supposed to do? It's just good someone tries.

BUF - RDU makes sense ..... Frontier is trying to tap into the American Airlines Charlotte, NC passengers. Raleigh is decently close to Charlotte. That is my guess.

BUF- AUS - I dont get it. I am all for the Airport / Airline adding new routes. But I think adding routes that make sense would be more beneficial to having long term success. If they are using Austin as more of a Hub, then i understand the addition.

I remember seeing a list and Houston and San Francisco (bay area) were on of the destinations BNIA was trying to get. Not Austin.

phluser wrote:

Dominion301 wrote:

Buffalomatt1027 wrote:

I understand Niagara Falls is a big draw for BUF-> Austin (I am sure its seasonal) ..... but you DO NOT see many American tourists visit the falls. It is mostly Asians and Indian people who visit.

I could be wrong .... and I am not taking the Canadian side of the falls into consideration.

The Canadian side of the Falls are what most tourists visit anyways, but either way BUF is the US gateway to the Falls.

dekema2 wrote:

My guess is that the Buffalo expansions are due to the proximity to Toronto. Our metro population is generally stagnant at 1.1M.

I do wonder why we don't have nonstop flights to the PNW, though.

If you add in the Canadian side, that's another 450k in population.

BUF is a great destination but wouldn't the lower hanging fruit be F9 on DFW-BUF, over AUS-BUF? Far more a population base on the DFW side.

BNIA / Buffalo has been interested in an Airline that will go to Houston or DFW. Not Austin. So we will see how it does.

Buffalomatt1027 wrote:

DeltaRules wrote:

Moreover, the carrier moves will now be the second largest carrier in Austin (30),

Well, Austin got its big expansion this week.

BUF- Austin is still a head scratcher for me .... anyone from Austin want to visit Buffalo / Niagara Falls? COME ON UP!

I also only think its once week..... that can NOT help the routes success rate.

Looks like twice a week on 'prime' days - Thursdays and Sundays. I flew to BUF and visited the falls when I lived in Austin. Why wouldn't there be anyone? BUF covers Toronto area in some sense, and a very good starting point for a road trip.

I think BHM is probably one of their better adds recently. Decent sized city without an ULCC. I've been surprised for a couple of years that Allegiant had not jumped into the market.

Buffalomatt1027 wrote:

BUF - RDU makes sense ..... Frontier is trying to tap into the American Airlines Charlotte, NC passengers. Raleigh is decently close to Charlotte. That is my guess.

BUF- AUS - I dont get it. I am all for the Airport / Airline adding new routes. But I think adding routes that make sense would be more beneficial to having long term success. If they are using Austin as more of a Hub, then i understand the addition.

I don't think F9 is trying to tap into AA's CLT passengers, but just for arguments sake, the difference in mileage between Raleigh and Charlotte isn't that much more than Austin and Dallas.

HeeseokKoo wrote:

Buffalomatt1027 wrote:

DeltaRules wrote:

Well, Austin got its big expansion this week.

BUF- Austin is still a head scratcher for me .... anyone from Austin want to visit Buffalo / Niagara Falls? COME ON UP!

I also only think its once week..... that can NOT help the routes success rate.

Looks like twice a week on 'prime' days - Thursdays and Sundays. I flew to BUF and visited the falls when I lived in Austin. Why wouldn't there be anyone? BUF covers Toronto area in some sense, and a very good starting point for a road trip.

In that case, that's the prime weekend getaway schedule to visit the Falls or AUS. So linking two touristy places like that makes sense. I wonder if this route has any possible connection opportunities at what now appears to be a new F9 focus city in AUS? It's certainly outside-the-legacy-box thinking that I'm hoping spills over to Canada some day with the emergence of ULCCs here.

At PVD and ISP how is WN reacting to F9s entrance into there market? Both of which are mostly WN stations.

cledaybuck wrote:

Buffalomatt1027 wrote:

BUF - RDU makes sense ..... Frontier is trying to tap into the American Airlines Charlotte, NC passengers. Raleigh is decently close to Charlotte. That is my guess.

BUF- AUS - I dont get it. I am all for the Airport / Airline adding new routes. But I think adding routes that make sense would be more beneficial to having long term success. If they are using Austin as more of a Hub, then i understand the addition.

I don't think F9 is trying to tap into AA's CLT passengers, but just for arguments sake, the difference in mileage between Raleigh and Charlotte isn't that much more than Austin and Dallas.

If they were trying to tap the edge of CLT, these flights would be in GSO (Greensboro) or GSP ( Greenville Spartanburg.

RDU is a different market, but will draw some , not many, of it's travelers from the CLT flights, but the real battle is for the airlines in RDU that offer connecting flights to these locations. I expect a bit of a fare war in RDU this summer.

Like most of their flying, a lot of it will last one summer and then be replaced.

tomaheath wrote:

At PVD and ISP how is WN reacting to F9s entrance into there market? Both of which are mostly WN stations.

I see lots of attacks on WN. They are looking at Southwest's top connecting points and doing end runs.

Let's take TULSA. They add DEN and then add San Diego (SO.Cal) and San Jose (Bay Area/No Cal). Denver if left to connecting the rest.

Let's take Memphis, the had upgraded Denver to an A321 as WN sleeps on adding MEM/DEN. See's lots of connecting to Vegas and adds LAS. They drop DEN ack to 4x. This also attacks bleed to WN's LIT/LAS flight.

Dominion301 wrote:

HeeseokKoo wrote:

Looks like twice a week on 'prime' days - Thursdays and Sundays. I flew to BUF and visited the falls when I lived in Austin. Why wouldn't there be anyone? BUF covers Toronto area in some sense, and a very good starting point for a road trip.

In that case, that's the prime weekend getaway schedule to visit the Falls or AUS. So linking two touristy places like that makes sense. I wonder if this route has any possible connection opportunities at what now appears to be a new F9 focus city in AUS? It's certainly outside-the-legacy-box thinking that I'm hoping spills over to Canada some day with the emergence of ULCCs here.

I can't see any connection schedule offered through AUS from BUF. While AUS can be called a focus city, with mostly 2-4 weekly schedules, it's not easy to offer connections.

Wow, 4 new routes for TTN. The one I am most excited about is TTN-JAX. Certainly beats the convenience vs going EWR/PHL to MCO, etc.

Wonder what routes were killed from TTN.

Perfect for us who live in the Princeton area and commute to North East Florida.... while not UST... certainly beats heading to MCO.

I'm really curious about how they look at PHL/TTN... PHL got SAV while TTN got CHS, curious as to the thought/strategy there.

WaywardMemphian wrote:

The Christmas season is huge in Branson, Silver Dollar City is consistently rated a Top 10 Christmas attraction.

Top 10 attraction, um, on what list? Top 10 things to do at Christmas in
Branson? Or top in the USA? LOL I'd find the latter hard to believe.

LovePrunesAnet wrote:

WaywardMemphian wrote:

The Christmas season is huge in Branson, Silver Dollar City is consistently rated a Top 10 Christmas attraction.

Top 10 attraction, um, on what list? Top 10 things to do at Christmas in
Branson? Or top in the USA? LOL I'd find the latter hard to believe.

Doesn't matter anyway. F9's BKG service will NOT be extended beyond the 2 month summer operation!.

LovePrunesAnet wrote:

WaywardMemphian wrote:

The Christmas season is huge in Branson, Silver Dollar City is consistently rated a Top 10 Christmas attraction.

Top 10 attraction, um, on what list? Top 10 things to do at Christmas in
Branson? Or top in the USA? LOL I'd find the latter hard to believe.

Are we really going to do this? This could go on for all day

The USA and just Silver Dollar City

https://travel.aarp.org/articles-tips/a ... tml#slide7

ttps://www.cnn.com/travel/article/best- ... index.html

www.google.com/amp/www.countryliving.co ... -displays/

https://www.usatoday.com/picture-galler ... /19239865/

RJNUT wrote:

LovePrunesAnet wrote:

WaywardMemphian wrote:

The Christmas season is huge in Branson, Silver Dollar City is consistently rated a Top 10 Christmas attraction.

Top 10 attraction, um, on what list? Top 10 things to do at Christmas in
Branson? Or top in the USA? LOL I'd find the latter hard to believe.

Doesn't matter anyway. F9's BKG service will NOT be extended beyond the 2 month summer operation!.[/quote
Ooh, an !

Frontier has operated here before. It was when they drastically reduced Denver and their connecting strategy in 2014 when it got cut. Now that they are shifting to a hybrid of point to point and connecting bases BKG is back. How do we really know if won't be extended or brought back next urar for a longer time. Since 2014, that Christmas thing has got pretty damn huge I mean, USA Today had it as the #1 Theme Park for Christmas for 2017. I'd bring it back for NOV and DEC.

Some old articles from when Frontier left the building the first time
https://www.news-leader.com/story/news/ ... /20209029/

http://bransontrilakesnews.com/news_fre ... edc0d.html

Ah, when they added MKE in 2010:

https://www.businesswire.com/news/home/ ... o.-Service

I kinda wonder if the everything is old is new again means they take that old Republic CS order over cause BKG screams CS100 like hoe Air Tran thought it screamed 717

Dominion301 wrote:

HeeseokKoo wrote:

Buffalomatt1027 wrote:

BUF- Austin is still a head scratcher for me .... anyone from Austin want to visit Buffalo / Niagara Falls? COME ON UP!

I also only think its once week..... that can NOT help the routes success rate.

Looks like twice a week on 'prime' days - Thursdays and Sundays. I flew to BUF and visited the falls when I lived in Austin. Why wouldn't there be anyone? BUF covers Toronto area in some sense, and a very good starting point for a road trip.

In that case, that's the prime weekend getaway schedule to visit the Falls or AUS. So linking two touristy places like that makes sense. I wonder if this route has any possible connection opportunities at what now appears to be a new F9 focus city in AUS? It's certainly outside-the-legacy-box thinking that I'm hoping spills over to Canada some day with the emergence of ULCCs here.

Okay that seems fair enough, I understand what they are thinking now. Long weekends at both destinations seems like a cool idea. Hopefully it catches on and people visit! I guess living in Buffalo, i really dont think much of the falls and seeing how most American side tourists are foreign. I didnt think much of it.

casinterest wrote:

cledaybuck wrote:

Buffalomatt1027 wrote:

BUF - RDU makes sense ..... Frontier is trying to tap into the American Airlines Charlotte, NC passengers. Raleigh is decently close to Charlotte. That is my guess.

BUF- AUS - I dont get it. I am all for the Airport / Airline adding new routes. But I think adding routes that make sense would be more beneficial to having long term success. If they are using Austin as more of a Hub, then i understand the addition.

I don't think F9 is trying to tap into AA's CLT passengers, but just for arguments sake, the difference in mileage between Raleigh and Charlotte isn't that much more than Austin and Dallas.

If they were trying to tap the edge of CLT, these flights would be in GSO (Greensboro) or GSP ( Greenville Spartanburg.

RDU is a different market, but will draw some , not many, of it's travelers from the CLT flights, but the real battle is for the airlines in RDU that offer connecting flights to these locations. I expect a bit of a fare war in RDU this summer.

Thank you for clarifying .... in the press releases they mentioned some triangle / the cities being close by. So i figured Frontier was trying to enter in on AA's territory.

Frontier already has done that to southwest, going after Florida destinations.

WaywardMemphian wrote:

LovePrunesAnet wrote:

WaywardMemphian wrote:

The Christmas season is huge in Branson, Silver Dollar City is consistently rated a Top 10 Christmas attraction.

Top 10 attraction, um, on what list? Top 10 things to do at Christmas in
Branson? Or top in the USA? LOL I'd find the latter hard to believe.

Are we really going to do this? This could go on for all day

The USA and just Silver Dollar City

https://travel.aarp.org/articles-tips/a ... tml#slide7

ttps://www.cnn.com/travel/article/best- ... index.html

http://www.google.com/amp/www.countryli ... -displays/

https://www.usatoday.com/picture-galler ... /19239865/

Oh Good Lord
Yes we'll do this
Top 10 things to do in the USA at Christmas (YOUR WORDS) is NOT the same as Top 10 "Christmas Light Displays"

you really are trying though. Gotta give your credit for persistence. Seriously bud, might want to edit what you stated if you want to maintain credibility and not just sound like the chamber of commerce..
Vistiting or Going to Branson or "Silver Dollar City" amusement park is NOT one of the Top 10 Things that people in the USA do at Christmas. Not even Top 100. MAYBE Top 1000.

Geez

RL757PVD wrote:

I'm really curious about how they look at PHL/TTN... PHL got SAV while TTN got CHS, curious as to the thought/strategy there.

I too am trying to understand their intentions with TTN. I am not sure what they are going for (no judgement here - just not understanding).
However, note that CHS already has been announced for PHL (starting later this month).

Really happy to see the two SJU flights. Would really like to see PIT-SJU as well! Can't wait to see the tails!

the ISP-SJU flight leaves every night at 11:25 PM. return flight leaves SJU at 2:50 AM.
Don't know how they're going to make that work LOL

WNflyer1523 wrote:

the ISP-SJU flight leaves every night at 11:25 PM. return flight leaves SJU at 2:50 AM.
Don't know how they're going to make that work LOL

Frontier is trying to capture all of the connecting flights into SJU from the surrounding Caribbean islands.

tomaheath wrote:

At PVD and ISP how is WN reacting to F9s entrance into there market? Both of which are mostly WN stations.

As far as PVD goes, WN isn't doing a thing. Even today's schedule extension is S O S. Business is up for them every month year over year lately and that even includes pinching back on PBI and RSW frequency this Winter thereby handing the business to Frontier and Allegiant at half the price or less.

Buffalomatt1027 wrote:

casinterest wrote:

cledaybuck wrote:

I don't think F9 is trying to tap into AA's CLT passengers, but just for arguments sake, the difference in mileage between Raleigh and Charlotte isn't that much more than Austin and Dallas.

If they were trying to tap the edge of CLT, these flights would be in GSO (Greensboro) or GSP ( Greenville Spartanburg.

RDU is a different market, but will draw some , not many, of it's travelers from the CLT flights, but the real battle is for the airlines in RDU that offer connecting flights to these locations. I expect a bit of a fare war in RDU this summer.

Thank you for clarifying .... in the press releases they mentioned some triangle / the cities being close by. So i figured Frontier was trying to enter in on AA's territory.

Frontier already has done that to southwest, going after Florida destinations.

The flights that are being offered seem to me to be going after delta/united/southwest connecting routes rather than AA out of RDU.

Milwaukee was served by Midway prior to Republic purchasing and merging them with Frontier, so this is more of a return to service.

So how many markets have been negatively impacted by today's announcement? FAT-DEN was pushed to 7:10 pm, lost the direct/no connect to ORD, now connects with virtually nothing, and was upgraded to a 321. Wouldn't it be easier to just cancel the route now before it starts? How many other markets have been forced into a "no win" situation with this latest schedule change? Would love to understand their logic, beyond "throw a dart"....

The FAT-DEN schedule change now arrives in Denver at 10:35pm. There are only a handful of potential F9 flights to connect to after that without a passenger having to overnight in the terminal to wait for an early morning connecting flight.

whatusaid wrote:

So how many markets have been negatively impacted by today's announcement? FAT-DEN was pushed to 7:10 pm, lost the direct/no connect to ORD, now connects with virtually nothing, and was upgraded to a 321. Wouldn't it be easier to just cancel the route now before it starts? How many other markets have been forced into a "no win" situation with this latest schedule change? Would love to understand their logic, beyond "throw a dart"....

They will surely cancel it if the advance bookings are weak. It is the way Frontier operates now.

Frontier 14

SyracuseAvGeek wrote:

SYR-DEN. Syracuse offered $400,000 as part of the small communities air service initiative to any airline that will offer non-stop service to Denver. Long shot, but one can hope

Does Syracuse even have any gate space? As far as I can remember they're all being used. There's gate 15 of course but they moved JB to the main south concourse so that it was among the rest of the gates and not hidden behind a wall.