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klemma24
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Re: ORD $8.5B Expansion Deal - Update: AA Now Onboard

Sun Mar 18, 2018 12:07 am

15/33 is due to be decommissioned 3/29 and will be a taxiway to help facilitate taxiways needed to be closed for the rest of 9C/27C to be built.
 
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United787
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Re: ORD $8.5B Expansion Deal - Update: AA Now Onboard

Mon Mar 19, 2018 1:24 am

klemma24 wrote:
15/33 is due to be decommissioned 3/29 and will be a taxiway to help facilitate taxiways needed to be closed for the rest of 9C/27C to be built.


Wow, I didn't expect it to be closed so quickly! When is 9C/27C scheduled for completion? Fall 2019?
 
klemma24
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Re: ORD $8.5B Expansion Deal - Update: AA Now Onboard

Tue Mar 20, 2018 1:02 am

Fall 2020.

Expect more airfield changes associated with T5 expansion and to improve some of the geometry of taxiways and how they intersect other taxiways and runways
 
grbauc
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Re: ORD Expansion Deal - Update: AA Now Onboard

Tue Mar 20, 2018 3:34 am

kngkyle wrote:
Basically AA got nothing for their hissy fit and caved once they realized Emanuel was not backing down. The "accelerated schedule" for their already planned 3 gate addition to L sounds to me like a face-saving "concession" by the city, especially considering no schedule that detailed was ever made public to begin with.

It's good that all parties are now on board. Now let's see if the city can actually pull all of this off by 2026.



you might be right they also might be building some currency with the "hissy fit". Some later on or down the road. These games are not just a simple game of chess there sometimes for moves later down the road.
 
wn676
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Re: ORD Expansion Deal - Update: AA Now Onboard

Tue Mar 20, 2018 12:14 pm

grbauc wrote:
kngkyle wrote:
Basically AA got nothing for their hissy fit and caved once they realized Emanuel was not backing down. The "accelerated schedule" for their already planned 3 gate addition to L sounds to me like a face-saving "concession" by the city, especially considering no schedule that detailed was ever made public to begin with.

It's good that all parties are now on board. Now let's see if the city can actually pull all of this off by 2026.



you might be right they also might be building some currency with the "hissy fit". Some later on or down the road. These games are not just a simple game of chess there sometimes for moves later down the road.


If anything they lost currency and burnt a lot of bridges with the City when they initially opposed this expansion. AA did not play this one well, and this concession is nothing more than them trying to save face. In all likelihood those 3 common use gates will end up being allocated in a more accessible part of the terminal and this whole exercise will have been for naught.
Tiny, unreadable text leaves ample room for interpretation.
 
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kngkyle
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Re: ORD Expansion Deal - Update: AA Now Onboard

Tue Mar 20, 2018 5:44 pm

The ordinance itself has been made public now. Extremely detailed - over 2,000 pages long. You can find it at the below link under attachments.

https://chicago.legistar.com/Legislatio ... s=&Search=

ual763 wrote:
kngkyle wrote:
ual763 wrote:

Wouldn’t that defeat the purpose of the new construction though? I thought the city and Airlines are trying to get away from having to tow aircraft around. If United/SA were in the new Satellte 1, they could handle all intl. arrivals and departures from there, while AA/OW could do the same in T2. The tunnel from Satellite 1 to T2 would still Route all intl. arrivals from the Satellite pier into customs in T2.


I highly doubt Satellite 1 and the underground tunnel will have a separate sterile zone for international arrivals. Towing the planes isn't the primary problem they are trying to fix here. The problem is the long trek connecting passengers have to make between T5 and the domestic terminals. Towing planes isn't much of a problem and has no impact to the customer experience.


I guess we’ll find out later. My thinking was, that with the width of the underground tunnel, domestic travelers, as well as intl. departures going to either Satellite 1 or 2 will have no choice but to take a train between terminals, like many other airports, such as IAD. Whereas intl. arrivals into Satellite 1 would just take an adjacent underground walkway with moving walkways. It’s not that bad of a walk. It’s just across the ramp.


I was wrong. S-1 will indeed be capable of handling international arrivals. So United will be able to operate their international flights out of their own terminal and AA will have to operate theirs out of the shared space at T2.
 
ual763
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Re: ORD Expansion Deal - Update: AA Now Onboard

Tue Mar 20, 2018 6:12 pm

kngkyle wrote:
The ordinance itself has been made public now. Extremely detailed - over 2,000 pages long. You can find it at the below link under attachments.

https://chicago.legistar.com/Legislatio ... s=&Search=

ual763 wrote:
kngkyle wrote:

I highly doubt Satellite 1 and the underground tunnel will have a separate sterile zone for international arrivals. Towing the planes isn't the primary problem they are trying to fix here. The problem is the long trek connecting passengers have to make between T5 and the domestic terminals. Towing planes isn't much of a problem and has no impact to the customer experience.


I guess we’ll find out later. My thinking was, that with the width of the underground tunnel, domestic travelers, as well as intl. departures going to either Satellite 1 or 2 will have no choice but to take a train between terminals, like many other airports, such as IAD. Whereas intl. arrivals into Satellite 1 would just take an adjacent underground walkway with moving walkways. It’s not that bad of a walk. It’s just across the ramp.


I was wrong. S-1 will indeed be capable of handling international arrivals. So United will be able to operate their international flights out of their own terminal and AA will have to operate theirs out of the shared space at T2.


Thanks for the link Kyle!
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ual763
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Re: ORD $8.5B Expansion Deal - Update: AA Now Onboard

Tue Mar 20, 2018 6:52 pm

I found this image particularly interesting. I wonder why T3 isn’t in the diagram. Though, I admit, I haven’t read through it all, as I just quickly paged through it.

Image
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ual763
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Re: ORD $8.5B Expansion Deal - Update: AA Now Onboard

Tue Mar 20, 2018 7:03 pm

Looks like I found my answer. Damn, this is huge. So T3, as we know it, will be gone essentially. From the sound of it, it will be primarily ramp parking like major European airports. Sounds like American will get some additional Satellite piers to the west. Lots more to read. But damn, what a waste building the Stinger gates on L, just to have them demolished...

Image
Image
Last edited by ual763 on Tue Mar 20, 2018 7:10 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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ual763
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Re: ORD $8.5B Expansion Deal - Update: AA Now Onboard

Tue Mar 20, 2018 7:13 pm

United787 wrote:
But they show all of the T3 H/K/L gone and nothing new in it's place?!?!?! Including the yet to be completed L stinger gates? What is up with that... This must be some agreement for the future???


Yeah, I just added the text for T3 redevelopment in my post above. Never saw this coming. Wow!
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United787
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Re: ORD $8.5B Expansion Deal - Update: AA Now Onboard

Tue Mar 20, 2018 7:15 pm

Looks like for T3, the portion of the building from the curb to the check-in desks is renovated and everything behind the desks is new... which makes sense considering the front part of T2 and street canoe is mostly new and a large space that generally works. The TSA space behind it doesn't.

But they show all of the T3 H/K/L gone and nothing new in it's place?!?!?! Including the yet to be completed L stinger gates? What is up with that... This must be some agreement for the future. Looks like T3 could be AA's future international widebodies only and maybe their single-aisle and regional would be concourses (#2 and 3 further west).

I don't have time to read this thing but:

Page 338 describes the tunnel being able to accommodate two future APMs (Automatic People Mover???) - Sterile and Non-Sterile Pax

Page 363 talks more about the tunnel and shows two more concourses (#s 3 & 4) further west and a western terminal.

Page 375 shows an addition to T1 opposite gates B11-B14, where that small staff parking lot is... essentially filling out the T1.

Page 378 shows gates C1-C10 going away and being replaced with the new concourse (#1)
Last edited by United787 on Tue Mar 20, 2018 7:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
ZBA2CGX
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Re: ORD $8.5B Expansion Deal - Update: AA Now Onboard

Tue Mar 20, 2018 7:16 pm

Starting on Pg 317 of the above link https://chicago.legistar.com/View.ashx? ... CB35050FA0 has a little more details on specifics of each of the major projects.
1. Central Basin Elimination and South Basin Expansion
2. Satellite 1 Concourse
3. Satellite 2 Concourse
4. Concourse L 3-Gate Expansion
5. Terminal 5 Landside and Parking Improvements (Phase 1)
6. Consolidated APM, Pedestrian, and Utility Tunnel (Phase 1 Segments)
7. Baggage Handling System (BHS) Equipment
8. Terminal 2 Redevelopment - O'Hare Global Terminal (OGT) and O'Hare Global Concourse (OGC)
9. Terminal 5 Repurposing and Core Expansion
10. TAP Phase I Utilities Allowance
11. Western Parking and Screening Facility Allowance
12. Concourse L 5-Gate Buy-out
 
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LOWS
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Re: ORD $8.5B Expansion Deal - Update: AA Now Onboard

Tue Mar 20, 2018 7:22 pm

Also, this part form p. 380 will answer a lot of questions about international arrivals:

Sterile Corridor and Vertical Cores

a. A sterile arrivals corridor connecting all international arrival gates to the CBP.

b. Arriving international passengers ascend vertical cores associated with gate door at the face of the concourse to a Third-Level corridor network that includes Automated Passport Control kiosks that lead to escalators that descend to a sterile underground tunnel that leads to escalators up to the OGT [O'Hare Global Terminal] CBP arrivals hall.

c. To optimize aircraft arrival and departing flexibility for both international and domestic operations, vertical cores serving international arriving flights are to be located at the concourse perimeter within the concourse envelope. These cores are to facilitate arriving passenger flow to the arrivals corridor. Each core is to be equipped with two (2) loading bridges to serve two (2) aircraft simultaneously and be equipped to allow arrivals and departures from both gates. All gates connected to the international arrivals corridor should be made independent for both arrival and departure.
 
ual763
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Re: ORD $8.5B Expansion Deal - Update: AA Now Onboard

Tue Mar 20, 2018 7:32 pm

Anyone been able to find gate allocations in the document yet?
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ual763
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Re: ORD $8.5B Expansion Deal - Update: AA Now Onboard

Tue Mar 20, 2018 7:40 pm

Also, from what I’ve read so far, Satellite 3 will only be built once the airport reaches 101.5 million passengers. But Satellite 4, oddly enough the farthest west, doesn’t have that trigger attached to it. So I would imagine, with the demolition of most of T3, American Intl. will use the renovated concourse G in T3, and I imagine everything else of theirs will use Satellite 4.

But my question is, why wouldn’t the airport build Satellite 3 first and build Satellite 4 when they reach 101.5 million?
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ldvaviation
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Re: ORD Expansion Deal - Update: AA Now Onboard

Tue Mar 20, 2018 7:45 pm

wn676 wrote:
If anything they lost currency and burnt a lot of bridges with the City when they initially opposed this expansion. AA did not play this one well, and this concession is nothing more than them trying to save face. In all likelihood those 3 common use gates will end up being allocated in a more accessible part of the terminal and this whole exercise will have been for naught.


The only thing that matters now is whether or not AA maximizes the use of all their gates, including the three additional common use gates in L. Going forward, there are no exclusive use gates. All gates are effectively common use, even United's.

The three common use gates will be sized for regional jet ops, thereby limiting their use for other airlines and optimizing their use for AA.

Because of the limitations on the use of the gates, sized as they are for regional jet ops, I doubt the lease will allow the kind of reallocation you indicated.

AA divested gates at ORD because of the merger. It could be that with schedule growth from the merger and more recent schedule expansion, it already has enough aircraft movements to fully maximize the use of the 5 gates it is building, the existing gates used by other airlines in L, and the 3 additional common use gates.

But even if AA cannot maximize the use of the three common use, regional gates now, it is still the case that having access to the gates relatively soon gives AA room to grow long before United has access to 5 more gates in the new T2.

Seems to me like AA played the game quite well.
 
ual763
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Re: ORD $8.5B Expansion Deal - Update: AA Now Onboard

Tue Mar 20, 2018 7:48 pm

This will apparently be the final configuration.
Image
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ADrum23
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Re: ORD $8.5B Expansion Deal - Update: AA Now Onboard

Tue Mar 20, 2018 8:07 pm

I don’t think the T3 work will be done this time around. It looks like that will be done when Satellite 3 + 4 are built.
 
ual763
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Re: ORD $8.5B Expansion Deal - Update: AA Now Onboard

Tue Mar 20, 2018 8:32 pm

ADrum23 wrote:
I don’t think the T3 work will be done this time around. It looks like that will be done when Satellite 3 + 4 are built.


Yes, you are correct, from the looks of it.
Image
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kngkyle
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Re: ORD $8.5B Expansion Deal - Update: AA Now Onboard

Wed Mar 21, 2018 1:45 am

In related news, the city announced the finalists for the competition to build an express train from O'Hare to downtown. Two firms remain including Elon Musk's. Complete RFP's are due in May with construction to begin in 2019 per the city's timeline.

Between the runway reconfiguration, terminal modernization plan, and express train, O'Hare will have received upwards of $20 billion in infrastructure improvements since 2005.

https://chicago.suntimes.com/news/ohare ... e-of-them/
 
ADrum23
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Re: ORD $8.5B Expansion Deal - Update: AA Now Onboard

Wed Mar 21, 2018 2:03 am

kngkyle wrote:
In related news, the city announced the finalists for the competition to build an express train from O'Hare to downtown. Two firms remain including Elon Musk's. Complete RFP's are due in May with construction to begin in 2019 per the city's timeline.

Between the runway reconfiguration, terminal modernization plan, and express train, O'Hare will have received upwards of $20 billion in infrastructure improvements since 2005.

https://chicago.suntimes.com/news/ohare ... e-of-them/


Considering ORD has basically been neglected (sans the ongoing runway reconfiguration and the CONRAC) for the better part of the last 25+ years, it is about time! All of this is extremely overdue. ORD will go from worst to first once all of this is completed.
 
ADrum23
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Re: ORD $8.5B Expansion Deal - Update: AA Now Onboard

Wed Mar 21, 2018 2:10 am

ual763 wrote:
This will apparently be the final configuration.
Image


So I guess in a way, ORD will become more like ATL over time (with concourses going from East to West), which is exactly how I always thought ORD should be reconfigured. Granted, it's not exactly the way I envisioned it, but it looks great.

Construction can't start fast enough IMO.
 
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United787
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Re: ORD $8.5B Expansion Deal - Update: AA Now Onboard

Wed Mar 21, 2018 2:30 am

Interesting that all of this is coming out today. Amazon reps are coming tomorrow.

This is all mind blowing exciting! I need a drink.
 
elbandgeek
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Re: ORD $8.5B Expansion Deal - Update: AA Now Onboard

Wed Mar 21, 2018 2:32 am

I remember the concept renderings that came out last year showed H/K being demolished once more satellites to the west were built out but they had L being kept and it becoming one continuous concourse with the T3 headhouse, basically as a mirror of B. My guess is since that won't be until a later phase anyway they haven't decided one way for another.

As far as gate distribution on the global terminal I'm curious how G fits in. Some renders show it being converted for widebodies on the western side and others don't. I would think between L expanding and H/K being reconfigured they could move Eagle out but I haven't heard anything one way or the other.
 
ual763
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Re: ORD $8.5B Expansion Deal - Update: AA Now Onboard

Wed Mar 21, 2018 2:40 am

I’ve been reading through this some more. On one pages it mentions demolishing L concourse and the new L extension. Even the diagram United787 quoted of mine above, shows the final configuration without the L concourse and expansion. However, this one, also in the pdf packet, shows the stinger gates. To me, this makes more sense than simply demolishing them. Have a look for yourselves:
Image
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ADrum23
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Re: ORD $8.5B Expansion Deal - Update: AA Now Onboard

Wed Mar 21, 2018 2:51 am

ual763 wrote:
I’ve been reading through this some more. On one pages it mentions demolishing L concourse and the new L extension. Even the diagram United787 quoted of mine above, shows the final configuration without the L concourse and expansion. However, this one, also in the pdf packet, shows the stinger gates. To me, this makes more sense than simply demolishing them. Have a look for yourselves:
Image


But what would they be used for when T3 is demolished? It would be a pretty long connection from there to the satellite concourses even with the APM.

Also, are they going to keep the existing neon light underground tunnel between B and C when all this is built?
 
ual763
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Re: ORD $8.5B Expansion Deal - Update: AA Now Onboard

Wed Mar 21, 2018 2:53 am

ADrum23 wrote:
ual763 wrote:
I’ve been reading through this some more. On one pages it mentions demolishing L concourse and the new L extension. Even the diagram United787 quoted of mine above, shows the final configuration without the L concourse and expansion. However, this one, also in the pdf packet, shows the stinger gates. To me, this makes more sense than simply demolishing them. Have a look for yourselves:
Image


Also, are they going to keep the existing neon light underground tunnel between B and C when all this is built?


It looks like it yes! At least I hope so
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United787
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Re: ORD $8.5B Expansion Deal - Update: AA Now Onboard

Wed Mar 21, 2018 3:01 am

With the final T3 configuration, it seems like there is a lot of unused tarmac space. It seems like they could have one additional finger pointing southeast.
 
ADrum23
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Re: ORD $8.5B Expansion Deal - Update: AA Now Onboard

Wed Mar 21, 2018 3:04 am

ual763 wrote:
ADrum23 wrote:
ual763 wrote:
I’ve been reading through this some more. On one pages it mentions demolishing L concourse and the new L extension. Even the diagram United787 quoted of mine above, shows the final configuration without the L concourse and expansion. However, this one, also in the pdf packet, shows the stinger gates. To me, this makes more sense than simply demolishing them. Have a look for yourselves:
Image


Also, are they going to keep the existing neon light underground tunnel between B and C when all this is built?


It looks like it yes! At least I hope so


I would imagine it would not be used as much though once the APM is up and running.
 
ual763
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Re: ORD $8.5B Expansion Deal - Update: AA Now Onboard

Wed Mar 21, 2018 3:11 am

United787 wrote:
With the final T3 configuration, it seems like there is a lot of unused tarmac space. It seems like they could have one additional finger pointing southeast.


I had originally thought that “Multiple Aircraft Ramp System,” meant some hard stand ramp gates like you see some of at Hong Kong or Frankfurt. But, I now realize that that is just the term for multi-use gates. But, it really makes you wonder.
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ual763
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Re: ORD $8.5B Expansion Deal - Update: AA Now Onboard

Wed Mar 21, 2018 3:15 am

ADrum23 wrote:
ual763 wrote:
ADrum23 wrote:

Also, are they going to keep the existing neon light underground tunnel between B and C when all this is built?


It looks like it yes! At least I hope so


I would imagine it would not be used as much though once the APM is up and running.


I think it will all boil down to which check-in kiosks customers will use. If they check in at the current United kiosks in T1 and their flight leaves from C, I imagine they will take it. If they check in at the kiosks in the new Global terminal, they will most likely take the APM to Satellite 1 and just walk from there to C.
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kngkyle
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Re: ORD $8.5B Expansion Deal - Update: AA Now Onboard

Wed Mar 21, 2018 3:22 pm

I'm now seeing these ads all over the place from American.

Image
 
psa188
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Re: ORD $8.5B Expansion Deal - Update: AA Now Onboard

Wed Mar 21, 2018 3:36 pm

What does all this talk about ORD expansion mean for Peotone?
 
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kngkyle
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Re: ORD $8.5B Expansion Deal - Update: AA Now Onboard

Wed Mar 21, 2018 3:37 pm

psa188 wrote:
What does all this talk about ORD expansion mean for Peotone?


Dead; as it should be.
 
wn676
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Re: ORD Expansion Deal - Update: AA Now Onboard

Wed Mar 21, 2018 4:49 pm

ldvaviation wrote:
wn676 wrote:
If anything they lost currency and burnt a lot of bridges with the City when they initially opposed this expansion. AA did not play this one well, and this concession is nothing more than them trying to save face. In all likelihood those 3 common use gates will end up being allocated in a more accessible part of the terminal and this whole exercise will have been for naught.


The only thing that matters now is whether or not AA maximizes the use of all their gates, including the three additional common use gates in L. Going forward, there are no exclusive use gates. All gates are effectively common use, even United's.

The three common use gates will be sized for regional jet ops, thereby limiting their use for other airlines and optimizing their use for AA.

Because of the limitations on the use of the gates, sized as they are for regional jet ops, I doubt the lease will allow the kind of reallocation you indicated.

AA divested gates at ORD because of the merger. It could be that with schedule growth from the merger and more recent schedule expansion, it already has enough aircraft movements to fully maximize the use of the 5 gates it is building, the existing gates used by other airlines in L, and the 3 additional common use gates.

But even if AA cannot maximize the use of the three common use, regional gates now, it is still the case that having access to the gates relatively soon gives AA room to grow long before United has access to 5 more gates in the new T2.

Seems to me like AA played the game quite well.


I don’t believe there is anything that prevents the city from doing what I’ve described. AA could make full use of the additional gates on L, but the city could in turn designate three regional-sized gates elsewhere in T3 for use by airlines other than AA.
Tiny, unreadable text leaves ample room for interpretation.
 
ldvaviation
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Re: ORD Expansion Deal - Update: AA Now Onboard

Wed Mar 21, 2018 8:56 pm

wn676 wrote:
I don’t believe there is anything that prevents the city from doing what I’ve described. AA could make full use of the additional gates on L, but the city could in turn designate three regional-sized gates elsewhere in T3 for use by airlines other than AA.


The new lease contains procedures for reallocating gates based on usage and the need to accommodate new entrants. Specifically, there are provisions in the new lease for allocating turns at gates whose use is not maximized (common or preferential). That is the most practical motivation and solution.

Then there is this. See Article 5, Section 1.5 of the Proposed Lease linked above:

As it turns out, not all of the gates will convert to common use. It seems AA managed to retain the L-Stinger gates on an exclusive basis for the term of the L-Stinger lease (15 years with two 5-year extensions).

It remains to be seen how the L-Stinger lease will be amended to include the 3 additional gates. Whatever the case, with exclusivity on at least 5 of the gates, AA should be able to juggle movements in such a way that it can maximize use of the 3 other gates.
 
ADrum23
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Re: ORD $8.5B Expansion Deal - Update: AA Now Onboard

Thu Mar 22, 2018 1:06 am

kngkyle wrote:
psa188 wrote:
What does all this talk about ORD expansion mean for Peotone?


Dead; as it should be.


Yeah, the Chicago area doesn't need the Peotone Airport. If a third airport was needed in the future (highly unlikely anytime soon as ORD has a lot of room to grow), there are more attractive (and cheaper) options that could be done, such as expanding RFD and GYY (both of which already have basic airport infrastructure in place).
 
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william
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Re: ORD $8.5B Expansion Deal - Update: AA Now Onboard

Thu Mar 22, 2018 1:52 am

ual763 wrote:
This will apparently be the final configuration.
Image


For those who live in the Chicago area, how popular would a west terminal be?
 
ILS28ORD
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Re: ORD $8.5B Expansion Deal - Update: AA Now Onboard

Thu Mar 22, 2018 2:15 am

I would imagine many from the southwest, west and northwest suburbs would use a western terminal if it's built it would save 20 min (without traffic) driving around the airport. During rush hour it would save even more time. While Chicago has the largest portion of the population, the western suburbs have enough people to justify it without a doubt IMO.
 
ILS28ORD
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Re: ORD $8.5B Expansion Deal - Update: AA Now Onboard

Thu Mar 22, 2018 5:36 pm

kngkyle wrote:
psa188 wrote:
What does all this talk about ORD expansion mean for Peotone?


Dead; as it should be.



Correct. If northsiders already complain about driving to MDW (which is hilarious), who's going to drive 50 miles south to the middle of nowhere to catch a regional jet to another hub for the same or more then they would've paid for a nonstop flight from ORD / MDW?
 
nmdrdh787
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Re: ORD $8.5B Expansion Deal - Update: AA Now Onboard

Fri Mar 23, 2018 4:53 pm

william wrote:
ual763 wrote:
This will apparently be the final configuration.
Image


For those who live in the Chicago area, how popular would a west terminal be?


I am 100% curious where you got that image....
 
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United787
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Re: ORD $8.5B Expansion Deal - Update: AA Now Onboard

Fri Mar 23, 2018 5:15 pm

https://chicago.legistar.com/Legislatio ... s=&Search=

All of the images above are from the ordinance....
 
grbauc
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Re: ORD Expansion Deal - Update: AA Now Onboard

Sat Mar 24, 2018 6:27 am

wn676 wrote:
grbauc wrote:
kngkyle wrote:
Basically AA got nothing for their hissy fit and caved once they realized Emanuel was not backing down. The "accelerated schedule" for their already planned 3 gate addition to L sounds to me like a face-saving "concession" by the city, especially considering no schedule that detailed was ever made public to begin with.

It's good that all parties are now on board. Now let's see if the city can actually pull all of this off by 2026.



you might be right they also might be building some currency with the "hissy fit". Some later on or down the road. These games are not just a simple game of chess there sometimes for moves later down the road.


If anything they lost currency and burnt a lot of bridges with the City when they initially opposed this expansion. AA did not play this one well, and this concession is nothing more than them trying to save face. In all likelihood those 3 common use gates will end up being allocated in a more accessible part of the terminal and this whole exercise will have been for naught.



Maybe so but in the world of Business and Government contracts and back room deals there is a lot different picture then that's being given many times.
 
klemma24
Posts: 8
Joined: Wed Feb 10, 2016 11:50 pm

Re: ORD $8.5B Expansion Deal - Update: AA Now Onboard

Sat Mar 24, 2018 8:55 pm

The large deicing pad that is currently being built right now is also temporary based on the long-term terminal layout plan to the West. Lots of things at ORD have been built with the idea of it only being temporary and end up remaining a very long time.



ual763 wrote:
Looks like I found my answer. Damn, this is huge. So T3, as we know it, will be gone essentially. From the sound of it, it will be primarily ramp parking like major European airports. Sounds like American will get some additional Satellite piers to the west. Lots more to read. But damn, what a waste building the Stinger gates on L, just to have them demolished...

Image
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elbandgeek
Posts: 444
Joined: Wed Jun 25, 2008 8:26 pm

Re: ORD $8.5B Expansion Deal - Update: AA Now Onboard

Sat Mar 24, 2018 9:47 pm

I have a feeling that since the master plan shows L being demolished along with H/K there will eventually be a third phase that redevelops that whole area but it's not in the current proposals because it would be purely for net expansion compared to the current plan which is as much about rebuilding dated facilities as it is capacity. Maybe something like this where they mirror the global terminal

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ORDfan
Posts: 654
Joined: Sat Jun 30, 2007 6:02 am

Re: ORD $8.5B Expansion Deal - Update: AA Now Onboard

Sun Mar 25, 2018 3:46 am

kngkyle wrote:
I'm now seeing these ads all over the place from American.

Image


I've been noticing them a lot too. AA definitely trying to get back on the city's good graces. I have been extremely vocal to my office colleagues, family, and friends about AA's poor attitude and corporate citizenship on the matter; the feeling was generally mutual. Sure some will say if AA is cheapest then it doesn't matter in the long run, but for even money AA vs UA, no way AA. They definitely have some work to do if they want to win back my firm's business.
 
AAplat4life
Posts: 324
Joined: Thu Jun 23, 2011 11:14 am

Re: ORD $8.5B Expansion Deal - Update: AA Now Onboard

Sun Mar 25, 2018 12:34 pm

None of us really know what happened in the negotiations, but I found United’s statements to be anything but self serving. It is telling that Rahm demonstrated some movement on the issue after litigation was threatened when discovery of emails and other documents would have exposed what really happened. Given how much money and commitment AA has shown to ORD recently, the fact that the City would try and deny it a handful of gates in an $8.5B project tends to show that the poor attitude is not confined to AA.
 
planespotter20
Posts: 174
Joined: Sun Nov 20, 2016 5:03 pm

Re: ORD $8.5B Expansion Deal - Update: AA Now Onboard

Sun Mar 25, 2018 3:47 pm

elbandgeek wrote:
I have a feeling that since the master plan shows L being demolished along with H/K there will eventually be a third phase that redevelops that whole area but it's not in the current proposals because it would be purely for net expansion compared to the current plan which is as much about rebuilding dated facilities as it is capacity. Maybe something like this where they mirror the global terminal

Image


Maybe in the future the entire central terminal (surrounding the parking lot/Hilton), the one that includes the Global Terminal plus the mirrored concourse, would become all international, for AA, UA, all of OW, and all of SA to fly from. It would be the final realization of their plan, as with the currently planned global terminal only UA, AA, and key airline partners like LH BA IB and CX will fly out of it. T5 would House the rest of the international airlines, the LCCs, and DL. The 4 concourses to the west would be divided, 2 housing UA North American traffic and 2 housing AA North American traffic.

Just my thoughts.
 
User avatar
kngkyle
Posts: 507
Joined: Wed Dec 27, 2006 3:33 am

Re: ORD $8.5B Expansion Deal - Update: AA Now Onboard

Tue Mar 27, 2018 3:14 am

The Aviation and Finance committees today signed off on the plan. It will now go to a full city council vote on Wednesday which will be the final approval needed before work can begin.
 
ADrum23
Posts: 1789
Joined: Fri Jul 14, 2017 11:54 pm

Re: ORD $8.5B Expansion Deal - Update: AA Now Onboard

Tue Mar 27, 2018 3:29 am

kngkyle wrote:
The Aviation and Finance committees today signed off on the plan. It will now go to a full city council vote on Wednesday which will be the final approval needed before work can begin.


When would construction start, and what would be built first?
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