• 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
  • 12
 
PA515
Posts: 1352
Joined: Tue Nov 06, 2007 6:17 am

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Fri Mar 02, 2018 9:19 pm

Gasman wrote:
it's a twist of knife yet again from NZ

Any contrived excuse to bash Air NZ because they don't have Business Class out of WLG. That's an unreasonable grudge Gasman. There must be more to it than that. Perhaps you were an unsuccessful applicant for a job at Air NZ?

PA515
 
Gasman
Posts: 1863
Joined: Mon Mar 01, 2004 10:06 am

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Fri Mar 02, 2018 9:57 pm

Kiwirob wrote:
Disasters haven’t stopped ferries crossing the Cook Strait, or NZ Rail running passenger trains between Auckland and Wellington. The Wahine and Tangiwai disasters resulted in large losses of life, both incidents shocked the nation, both incidents could have been prevented like Erebus, I really don’t understand why Erebus is considered differently.


You're right, and I don't know why Erebus is treated differently either. I can think of many possible reasons why, but they're not the point of this discussion.

But is resolution achieved through insisting that Erebus should be treated no differently to the Tangiwai disaster; or through simply accepting that it has, for whatever reason, left a unique imprint on our collective consciousness? A question for us to ponder, and NZ to keep well away from - or so I would have thought.
 
Gasman
Posts: 1863
Joined: Mon Mar 01, 2004 10:06 am

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Fri Mar 02, 2018 10:00 pm

PA515 wrote:
Gasman wrote:
it's a twist of knife yet again from NZ

Any contrived excuse to bash Air NZ because they don't have Business Class out of WLG. That's an unreasonable grudge Gasman. There must be more to it than that. Perhaps you were an unsuccessful applicant for a job at Air NZ?

PA515

Yeah, you've sussed me. I was turned down for a flight attendant job for being gay.
 
planemanofnz
Posts: 3931
Joined: Fri Sep 30, 2005 4:46 pm

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Fri Mar 02, 2018 11:52 pm

It seems that there were deficiencies on NZ PR's part, in that NZ contacted the Erebus families for their concerns, but such concerns were ignored (NZ didn't even respond to follow-up emails). I wonder why NZ didn't work harder with the Erebus families to incorporate some sort of compromise into the situation - for example, filming the safety video solely at the CHC facility, instead of at Ross Island in Antarctica, or filming / sponsoring a documentary (on NZ's conservation efforts in Antarctica) for a YouTube release instead (without the safety element). After all, NZ were the ones who actually asked the families for their concerns at the start.

See: https://thespinoff.co.nz/society/03-03- ... ers-death/.

At least NZ could then respond to all the bad press (of which there may have been less), by saying that it did compromise? Some other flops from NZ's PR, IMHO:

- NZ said family members would be sent the completed video for a preview - they did so, but less than ~12 hours before the public release (the night before). What was the point of the preview then?

- NZ has refused to sponsor a national memorial for the accident by the 40th anniversary in November 2019, until the New Zealand government commits (I presume financially) to this project.

Kashmon wrote:
We had an incident in a location "that location is now off limits!!!!"

That "incident" is still, AFAIK, the Southern Hemisphere’s worst ever aviation accident.

Cheers,

C.
 
User avatar
mariner
Posts: 19473
Joined: Fri Nov 23, 2001 7:29 am

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Sat Mar 03, 2018 12:22 am

planemanofnz wrote:
It seems that there were deficiencies on NZ PR's part, in that NZ contacted the Erebus families for their concerns, but such concerns were ignored (NZ didn't even respond to follow-up emails). I wonder why NZ didn't work harder with the Erebus families to incorporate some sort of compromise into the situation - for example, filming the safety video solely at the CHC facility, instead of at Ross Island in Antarctica, or filming / sponsoring a documentary (on NZ's conservation efforts in Antarctica) for a YouTube release instead (without the safety element). After all, NZ were the ones who actually asked the families for their concerns at the start.

See: https://thespinoff.co.nz/society/03-03- ... ers-death/.

At least NZ could then respond to all the bad press (of which there may have been less), by saying that it did compromise? Some other flops from NZ's PR, IMHO:

- NZ said family members would be sent the completed video for a preview - they did so, but less than ~12 hours before the public release (the night before). What was the point of the preview then?

- NZ has refused to sponsor a national memorial for the accident by the 40th anniversary in November 2019, until the New Zealand government commits (I presume financially) to this project.


Thankfully, they didn't take any of those suggestions to make it less offensive - those who are going to be offended will be offended, no matter what.

And as in the article, NZ has already paid for it's own memorial to Erebus and Perpignan:

https://thespinoff.co.nz/society/03-03- ... ers-death/.

"A striking sculpture called “Momentum” was installed at the company’s headquarters to honour those who died on Erebus and at Perpignan almost three decades later."

As the article also says NZ isn't the company that it was back then. It has been effectively bankrupt and is now a state owned enterprise. I don't think it's up to NZ to lead the financial way with a national memorial - a contributor, sure, but not the prime mover.

Or perhaps they should have changed the name - New Zealand Airways, say - which would have made the break with the past complete.

mariner
aeternum nauta
 
Gasman
Posts: 1863
Joined: Mon Mar 01, 2004 10:06 am

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Sat Mar 03, 2018 12:24 am

planemanofnz wrote:

- NZ has refused to sponsor a national memorial for the accident by the 40th anniversary in November 2019, until the New Zealand government commits (I presume financially) to this project.

C.

In some ways, they're right to keep a low profile. There's nothing especially significant about 40 years as opposed to 30, 50, or 100 and NZ's PR people must be looking forward to this event like a hole in the head. There'll be the usual contrived moments, speeches made, various fingers pointed, Maria Collins dragged out to say what a wonderful man her husband was and............. a whole cauldron of resentment simmering just below the surface. And no one will be any closer to achieving closure except for that which occurs by natural process through the passage of time.

Which leads me again to ask, with respect to the video.......... WHY???
 
PA515
Posts: 1352
Joined: Tue Nov 06, 2007 6:17 am

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Sat Mar 03, 2018 1:32 am

Air NZ will have two 77Ws in maintenance between Sa 28 Apr / Mo 30 Apr and Mo 11 Jun / We 13 Jun. The 77W Wifi installation is due to be completed in Jun. During this time AKL-SFO NZ8/NZ7 will be a daily 77E and the Mo AKL-LAX NZ6/NZ5 will be a 77E.

Also, AKL-HND is suspended from Mo 02 May to We 18 Jul, giving enough time for another 77E repaint or two between mid Jun and mid Jul. Perhaps all the 77Es will be repainted and Wifi by Dec 2018.

PA515
 
GW54
Posts: 15
Joined: Sat Nov 26, 2016 3:05 am

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Sat Mar 03, 2018 2:13 am

I see 772 ZK-OKB is on it's way to Singapore as NZ6002. Assume it's heading up for maintenance and a repaint. Are the 200's getting WIFI?. Anybody know how many other 200's are being repainted over the next few months?
 
zkncj
Posts: 2979
Joined: Wed Nov 09, 2005 4:57 pm

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Sat Mar 03, 2018 2:25 am

GW54 wrote:
I see 772 ZK-OKB is on it's way to Singapore as NZ6002. Assume it's heading up for maintenance and a repaint. Are the 200's getting WIFI?. Anybody know how many other 200's are being repainted over the next few months?


All of the 77E are meant to be getting wifi installed by the end of 2018, although the current 789 issues might slow some things down.
 
ZK-NBT
Posts: 6255
Joined: Mon Oct 16, 2000 5:42 pm

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Sat Mar 03, 2018 2:35 am

Mr AirNZ wrote:
For all those who last year hypothesised the 77E fleet must be heading for early retirement, OKB departs tomorrow morning for SIN kicking off the next round of heavy maintenance and repaints. She will return in April in the new livery.


GW54 wrote:
I see 772 ZK-OKB is on it's way to Singapore as NZ6002. Assume it's heading up for maintenance and a repaint. Are the 200's getting WIFI?. Anybody know how many other 200's are being repainted over the next few months?


Good to see. Not that I was one who thought they were retiring early
 
DavidByrne
Posts: 1201
Joined: Mon Sep 10, 2007 4:42 pm

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Sat Mar 03, 2018 2:46 am

planemanofnz wrote:
- NZ said family members would be sent the completed video for a preview - they did so, but less than ~12 hours before the public release (the night before). What was the point of the preview then?

Because it was a preview, not an invitation to offer editorial suggestions. I can just imagine the film's editor faced with potentially dozens of conflicting suggestions as to how the film could be improved. No writer or film maker would ever voluntarily put themselves in that position.
This is not my beautiful house . . . This is not my beautiful wife
 
Motorhussy
Posts: 3437
Joined: Thu Mar 30, 2000 7:49 am

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Sat Mar 03, 2018 2:58 am

@Kiwirob - some family members who lost loved ones in the Erebus crash - rightly or wrongly - believe that Air NZ actively had a role in the deaths. To go to Antarctica to make this video without actively engaging with family that the airline is inextricably linked with through tragedy and misadventure feels like a lost opportunity to me.

I’m okay with the vid and believe the airline is quite a different beast now but the airline hasn’t killed any of my family.
come visit the south pacific
 
User avatar
mariner
Posts: 19473
Joined: Fri Nov 23, 2001 7:29 am

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Sat Mar 03, 2018 3:25 am

Motorhussy wrote:
@Kiwirob - some family members who lost loved ones in the Erebus crash - rightly or wrongly - believe that Air NZ actively had a role in the deaths. To go to Antarctica to make this video without actively engaging with family that the airline is inextricably linked with through tragedy and misadventure feels like a lost opportunity to me.


I have nothing but sympathy for them, and I think "the litany of lies" may well have validity.

At the same time I have nothing but sympathy for the families of those lost when the Air France A330 plunged into the Atlantic or for the families of those who were in MH 17 when it was shot from the skies or MH 370 when it simply - disappeared.

But life goes on. Neither Air France nor Malaysia stopped flying and Kiwi bookings on Malaysian flights we're a bight spot for the airline. KLM sells tickets to Tenerife and I suppose Pan Am would if they hadn't gone out of business for other reasons.

Similarly, Erebus was a tragedy that cannot be undone. It will never be forgotten but the families don't "own" Erebus and it is wrong, I think, to give them that authority. So I believe NZ has taken an important step by normalising Antarctica.

mariner
aeternum nauta
 
ZKOAB
Posts: 37
Joined: Tue Jul 12, 2016 9:59 am

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Sat Mar 03, 2018 3:28 am

GW54 wrote:
I see 772 ZK-OKB is on it's way to Singapore as NZ6002. Assume it's heading up for maintenance and a repaint. Are the 200's getting WIFI?. Anybody know how many other 200's are being repainted over the next few months?


I’d like to know timing myself.
Including OKB, there’s 5 left to repaint. I recall it being around the 14 day mark from start to finish.
PA515 will be able to confirm exact turnaround timeframe.

The other 4 772’s that need a repaint are OKD, OKF, OKG and OKH.
 
Gasman
Posts: 1863
Joined: Mon Mar 01, 2004 10:06 am

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Sat Mar 03, 2018 3:44 am

mariner wrote:
Similarly, Erebus was a tragedy that cannot be undone. It will never be forgotten but the families don't "own" Erebus and it is wrong, I think, to give them that authority. So I believe NZ has taken an important step by normalising Antarctica.

mariner

But this is about the story of Air New Zealand and Antarctica - not Antarctica per se. And seeing as the story of NZ and Antarctica has very little to it apart from the Erebus tragedy; it could well be argued that the families do have some sort of moral authority over it.

NZ is an airline. It doesn't need to have anything to do with Antarctica at all. There was no pressing business or commercial reason to base a safety video there. And if their agenda really is some sort of healing or normalisation; first do it by actively engaging with the families in a meaningful way (rather than the 12 hour preview).

Or don't go there at all.
 
PA515
Posts: 1352
Joined: Tue Nov 06, 2007 6:17 am

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Sat Mar 03, 2018 4:51 am

ZKOAB wrote:
GW54 wrote:
I see 772 ZK-OKB is on it's way to Singapore as NZ6002. Assume it's heading up for maintenance and a repaint. Are the 200's getting WIFI?. Anybody know how many other 200's are being repainted over the next few months?


I’d like to know timing myself.
Including OKB, there’s 5 left to repaint. I recall it being around the 14 day mark from start to finish.
PA515 will be able to confirm exact turnaround timeframe.

The other 4 772’s that need a repaint are OKD, OKF, OKG and OKH.


OKC was done at XMN 07 Mar to 05 Apr 2014 (29 days) maintenance and repaint.
OKE was done at FTW 04 May to 19 May 2016 (15 days) repaint only.
OKA was done at FTW 19 May to 02 Jun 2016 (14 days) repaint only.

OKB will be in SIN 03 Mar to 19? Apr 2018. This would be maintenance and a repaint as OKA was in SIN for maintenance 31 Oct to 02 Dec 2017 (32 days), plus 15 days for the repaint. However, I don't know if the satellite installation on the top of the fuselage is done before or after the repaint, so a few more days could be added. For OKC and OKE only 32 days as I expect the Wifi installation can be done during maintenance. OKA will be the shortest only needing the Wifi to be done.

PA515
 
planemanofnz
Posts: 3931
Joined: Fri Sep 30, 2005 4:46 pm

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Sat Mar 03, 2018 5:05 am

PA515 wrote:
Perhaps all the 77Es will be repainted and Wifi by Dec 2018.

Speaking of WiFi, does anyone know if the 320neo and 321neo fleets will have this installed?

I hope that both fleets will also retain PTV IFE, as it can be a hassle to bring your own device.

Cheers,

C.
 
Gasman
Posts: 1863
Joined: Mon Mar 01, 2004 10:06 am

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Sat Mar 03, 2018 5:35 am

If we feel the need to divert the thread from the own-goal that is the latest safety video, can it be towards something *slightly* more gripping than maintenance schedules?
 
PA515
Posts: 1352
Joined: Tue Nov 06, 2007 6:17 am

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Sat Mar 03, 2018 5:58 am

Gasman wrote:
If we feel the need to divert the thread from the own-goal that is the latest safety video, can it be towards something *slightly* more gripping than maintenance schedules?

Some people would like to know what's actually happening at Air NZ, not your *slightly* twisted opinions of Air NZ.

PA515
 
PA515
Posts: 1352
Joined: Tue Nov 06, 2007 6:17 am

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Sat Mar 03, 2018 6:05 am

planemanofnz wrote:
Speaking of WiFi, does anyone know if the 320neo and 321neo fleets will have this installed?

I hope that both fleets will also retain PTV IFE, as it can be a hassle to bring your own device.


The NEOs will have factory fitted Wifi, and the Acro Series 6 seats have PTVs.

PA515
 
coolian2
Posts: 2423
Joined: Sun Oct 22, 2006 3:34 pm

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Sat Mar 03, 2018 6:27 am

Gasman wrote:
If we feel the need to divert the thread from the own-goal that is the latest safety video, can it be towards something *slightly* more gripping than maintenance schedules?

Infinitely better than railing on about a safety video. Nothing stopping you from ignoring those posts (much as I have been about the video) and posting about what you wish to post about. More than one thing can be discussed at a time.
Q300/ATR72-600/737-200/-300/-400/-700/-800/A320/767-200/-300/757-200/777-300ER/
747-200/-300/-400/ER/A340-300/A380-800/MD-83/-88/CRJ-700/-900
 
ZK-NBT
Posts: 6255
Joined: Mon Oct 16, 2000 5:42 pm

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Sat Mar 03, 2018 6:52 am

PA515 wrote:
Air NZ will have two 77Ws in maintenance between Sa 28 Apr / Mo 30 Apr and Mo 11 Jun / We 13 Jun. The 77W Wifi installation is due to be completed in Jun. During this time AKL-SFO NZ8/NZ7 will be a daily 77E and the Mo AKL-LAX NZ6/NZ5 will be a 77E.

Also, AKL-HND is suspended from Mo 02 May to We 18 Jul, giving enough time for another 77E repaint or two between mid Jun and mid Jul. Perhaps all the 77Es will be repainted and Wifi by Dec 2018.

PA515


All the 772’s will be due for 12 year checks this year bar OKA which was done last year, I’d imagine they will rotate through in order between now and December with repaints and wifi installation at the same time.

I’m interested to see weather the 789’s will be back to EZE from April 6th as currently scheduled or will they not regain ETOPS 330 just yet?
 
zkncj
Posts: 2979
Joined: Wed Nov 09, 2005 4:57 pm

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Sat Mar 03, 2018 6:59 am

mariner wrote:
But life goes on. Neither Air France nor Malaysia stopped flying and Kiwi bookings on Malaysian flights we're a bight spot for the airline. KLM sells tickets to Tenerife and I suppose Pan Am would if they hadn't gone out of business for other reasons.


Agreed - Ironically MH must do pretty well ex-AKL it (AKL & LHR) we're there only too long-haul routes that we're kept (Australia is Mid-Haul), and with AKL getting an daily service it shows that it hasn't impacted them too much in the New Zealand market.

I think it is time for New Zealand to move on from TE901, if it really was an deep hurt as the media makes it out to be then why is NZ still flying 40 years later? and if so how many of the effected families (that are complaining) have flown on NZ since?

100% agreed that healing is an process, but it isn't something that should stop you from going forward.
 
planemanofnz
Posts: 3931
Joined: Fri Sep 30, 2005 4:46 pm

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Sat Mar 03, 2018 7:46 am

zkncj wrote:
Agreed - Ironically MH must do pretty well ex-AKL it (AKL & LHR) we're there only too long-haul routes that we're kept (Australia is Mid-Haul), and with AKL getting an daily service it shows that it hasn't impacted them too much in the New Zealand market.

I'm not so sure that MH is doing "pretty well ex-AKL", as last year the airline said that "[AKL] yields have gone to the dogs" and "... the Auckland market can no longer support the A350 as it has become extremely competitive following the launch of nonstop flights from Emirates and Qatar". Further, the airline's CEO said that "most of the airline’s New Zealand traffic is heading to, or is originating in, the UK/Ireland or India". At least on the in-bound front, MH's share of these markets has been mixed - in 2017, visitor arrivals to New Zealand from India via KUL decreased 26.1%, while those from the UK, although increased, are still quite small at ~18 per day.

See:
- https://www.mscnewswire.co.nz/trade-exp ... -a350.html.
- https://centreforaviation.com/insights/ ... 018-350143.
- https://www.stats.govt.nz/information-r ... ember-2017.

Cheers,

C.
 
DobboDobbo
Posts: 621
Joined: Thu Mar 03, 2016 1:02 am

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Sat Mar 03, 2018 10:48 am

MH has a very small presence in the UK and Europe (LHR only) having cut back on a number of other routes. Perhaps the A350 will enable them to open up the likes of CDG, AMS, FRA, FCO and MAN again - which will in turn support services to AKL and others.
 
User avatar
aerorobnz
Posts: 8102
Joined: Sat Feb 10, 2001 3:43 pm

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Sat Mar 03, 2018 10:57 am

So, you think that the Erebus disaster was an issue for just the passenger's families? The crew and the colleagues of those crew are still working for the airline and it is very close to many as a result. I know a number of staff that were around to deal with it, and many lost family and loved ones too including one that lost two of her best friends and flatmates and a fiance, I have talked with them about it and they see nothing wrong with it. I know another that departed it and was supposed to welcome it back again, and they told me of the time they spend waiting, and waiting for information, sitting on the concourse waiting, and knowing that all was not well. Those people don't have an issue with the video, and even said it was the best video they had in ages and both agree it is time to move on,

I can only comment on the closest I have had to deal with which was Perpignan, and I knew them and had talked to one of them about their trip to Europe to collect it and bring it home.
Flown to 147 Airports in 59 Countries on 81 Operators and counting. Wanderlust is like Syphilis, once you have the itch it's too late for treatment.
 
NZ321
Posts: 889
Joined: Fri Jul 31, 2015 8:00 pm

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Sat Mar 03, 2018 11:15 am

It's chicken or egg. If MH actually want to lift performance on the route they need to provide a compelling reason for people to fly them beyond just discount. If I recall, Air Asia X have a far higher proportion of Malaysian originating travelers from stats I've seen. But that doesn't say much. It's also about connections and yield. I know many locals who don't use Air Asia for long haul and fork out for MH. The latest in the papers here this weekend is that MH is on track financially with things continuing to improve. Service is improving too based on my recent flights. They are looking closely at Europe at the moment. If they don't expand with long haul international then it makes a nonsense of the 789 order for sure because their fleet would be not be utilised effectively and at the moment plenty of business is going to other airlines. They need to take this business back. We will see further changes in the coming months as the work out their expansion strategy. As some have said, it's kind of remarkable they're still around given what they have been through in the past few years.
Plane mad!
 
User avatar
aerorobnz
Posts: 8102
Joined: Sat Feb 10, 2001 3:43 pm

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Sat Mar 03, 2018 12:10 pm

MH on overnight is permanently 1h late due late arrival. They need to address this.
Flown to 147 Airports in 59 Countries on 81 Operators and counting. Wanderlust is like Syphilis, once you have the itch it's too late for treatment.
 
Gasman
Posts: 1863
Joined: Mon Mar 01, 2004 10:06 am

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Sat Mar 03, 2018 8:37 pm

NZ321 wrote:
As some have said, it's kind of remarkable they're still around given what they have been through in the past few years.

:checkmark: :checkmark:

Lesser carriers would not have survived. While PAA and TWA were both in poor shape before Lockerbie/TWA800, those events were surely the nails in the coffin for those two carriers. MH, through a truly freakish set of circumstances, suffered two such events in a very short space of time. And they're still here. Pulling back on the international network must have been gut wrenching but it was a ballsy pragmatic move and arguably has saved the carrier from complete annihilation. Hopefully they've consolidated and are now in a position to start reclaiming their patch.

For the New Zealand traveler they offer a niche product through Asia that no-one else quite duplicates. Think SQ with added warmth, and slightly cheaper fares.
 
User avatar
mariner
Posts: 19473
Joined: Fri Nov 23, 2001 7:29 am

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Sat Mar 03, 2018 8:42 pm

mariner wrote:
Neither Air France nor Malaysia stopped flying and Kiwi bookings on Malaysian flights we're a bight spot for the airline.


Whatever the fortunes of Malaysia now, because of Emirates and Qatar, not too long after the twin tragedies this appeared:

https://www.stuff.co.nz/travel/news/689 ... travellers

Malaysia Airlines tragedies fail to deter New Zealand travellers

Malaysia Airlines is filling its flights to and from New Zealand despite the carrier facing financial turmoil and the effects of two high profile disasters last year... flights to Auckland from Kuala Lumpur were more than 90 per cent full on average during the first three months of 2015, the airline said.


There were, of course, naysayers:

But travel agents and an aviation analyst say the airline has been offering deep discounts to attract passengers after the mysterious disappearance of flight MH370, thought to have crashed off the West Australian coast in March last year and the shooting down of MH17 over Ukraine last July."

Really all that says is that there a lot of optimistic cheapskates in New Zealand. Image

mariner
aeternum nauta
 
Planesmart
Posts: 2891
Joined: Sun Dec 05, 2004 3:18 am

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Sat Mar 03, 2018 8:55 pm

ZK-NBT wrote:
All the 772’s will be due for 12 year checks this year bar OKA which was done last year, I’d imagine they will rotate through in order between now and December with repaints and wifi installation at the same time.

NZ 772's all built post-AIMS2, but some customers for consistency specified AIMS-1 after 2 launched. Are all NZ's 772's AIMS2? If not, will those be repainted, etc or go soon?
 
ZK-NBT
Posts: 6255
Joined: Mon Oct 16, 2000 5:42 pm

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Sat Mar 03, 2018 9:20 pm

Planesmart wrote:
ZK-NBT wrote:
All the 772’s will be due for 12 year checks this year bar OKA which was done last year, I’d imagine they will rotate through in order between now and December with repaints and wifi installation at the same time.

NZ 772's all built post-AIMS2, but some customers for consistency specified AIMS-1 after 2 launched. Are all NZ's 772's AIMS2? If not, will those be repainted, etc or go soon?


What is AIMS2? NZ’s were fairly late builds OCT 2005 JAN 2007 deliveries. None are going anytime soon 2022 at the earliest unless there’s a downturn. I’d imagine they are all the same model.
 
Planesmart
Posts: 2891
Joined: Sun Dec 05, 2004 3:18 am

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Sat Mar 03, 2018 9:30 pm

ZK-NBT wrote:
Planesmart wrote:
ZK-NBT wrote:
All the 772’s will be due for 12 year checks this year bar OKA which was done last year, I’d imagine they will rotate through in order between now and December with repaints and wifi installation at the same time.

NZ 772's all built post-AIMS2, but some customers for consistency specified AIMS-1 after 2 launched. Are all NZ's 772's AIMS2? If not, will those be repainted, etc or go soon?


What is AIMS2? NZ’s were fairly late builds OCT 2005 JAN 2007 deliveries. None are going anytime soon 2022 at the earliest unless there’s a downturn. I’d imagine they are all the same model.

Honeywell Aircraft Information Management System (AIMS). AIMS-1 on 777 from launch. AIMS-2 available from 2003, but not all post-2003 deliveries switched to -2. Like Microsoft does with XP, 7 and other iterations of operating software, airlines can purchase costly one to one AIMS-1 support basis from Honeywell.
 
Gasman
Posts: 1863
Joined: Mon Mar 01, 2004 10:06 am

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Sun Mar 04, 2018 3:36 am

aerorobnz wrote:
So, you think that the Erebus disaster was an issue for just the passenger's families?

Not even remotely.

aerorobnz wrote:
The crew and the colleagues of those crew are still working for the airline and it is very close to many as a result. I know a number of staff that were around to deal with it, and many lost family and loved ones too including one that lost two of her best friends and flatmates and a fiance, I have talked with them about it and they see nothing wrong with it.


I know someone who processed the bodies. He's still traumatised. As are probably all the people you mentioned to an extent, and many good people at NZ and CAA who had their reputations unfairly (in my opinion) slaughtered by Mahon. And all their families. Not to mention Chippindale (RIP) who I knew personally.

The whole aftermath was one big CF. Do I think Antarctica should be a no-go zone for NZ for all time? No. But I think there still needs to be a pretty good justification for Antarctica to be part of the NZ package. And I don't think a safety video really cuts it.
 
coolian2
Posts: 2423
Joined: Sun Oct 22, 2006 3:34 pm

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Sun Mar 04, 2018 9:14 am

Image

Has FedEx been a bit confused tonight?
Q300/ATR72-600/737-200/-300/-400/-700/-800/A320/767-200/-300/757-200/777-300ER/
747-200/-300/-400/ER/A340-300/A380-800/MD-83/-88/CRJ-700/-900
 
aotearoa
Posts: 147
Joined: Sun May 08, 2005 1:50 pm

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Sun Mar 04, 2018 9:47 am

All NZ 777s are at AIMS-2 standard.
 
aerokiwi
Posts: 2484
Joined: Sun Jul 30, 2000 1:17 pm

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Sun Mar 04, 2018 10:26 am

Gasman wrote:
mariner wrote:
Similarly, Erebus was a tragedy that cannot be undone. It will never be forgotten but the families don't "own" Erebus and it is wrong, I think, to give them that authority. So I believe NZ has taken an important step by normalising Antarctica.

mariner

But this is about the story of Air New Zealand and Antarctica - not Antarctica per se. And seeing as the story of NZ and Antarctica has very little to it apart from the Erebus tragedy; it could well be argued that the families do have some sort of moral authority over it.

NZ is an airline. It doesn't need to have anything to do with Antarctica at all. There was no pressing business or commercial reason to base a safety video there. And if their agenda really is some sort of healing or normalisation; first do it by actively engaging with the families in a meaningful way (rather than the 12 hour preview).

Or don't go there at all.


Nicely put. A strange choice by the airline indeed.

My diversion from this is likely boeing too. But anyway... Auckland's new intrnational departures appears to be following the irritating style of Melbourne and sydney, with unnecessary diversions through endless shopping areas. The state of it back in early January was pretty dire with carpets from what looked like the early 90s. Have things improved?
 
DavidJ08
Posts: 126
Joined: Thu Dec 27, 2007 9:18 pm

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Sun Mar 04, 2018 12:18 pm

coolian2 wrote:
Has FedEx been a bit confused tonight?

I think it's FR24 that's confused, looking at FX75 it seems to have registered HNL-AKL and AKL-SYD as one single flight.
https://www.flightradar24.com/data/flig ... 5#109a1275
 
User avatar
zkojq
Posts: 3284
Joined: Fri Sep 02, 2011 12:42 am

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Sun Mar 04, 2018 1:15 pm

From the last thread:

Back in the day when I was till something of a dreamy NZ loyalist, I suddenly woke up to Bradley when he completely failed to call NZ to task on going 10 abreast in the 777 - at a time when it was far from the norm amongst 777 operators. Notwithstanding today's article - which is still something of a whitewash - as far as NZ is concerned he is simply a mouthpiece for their spin. The bias of the Herald doesn't stop with Bradley - whenever some entitled loudmouth isn't given a refund by JQ for example, the Herald is all over it - dripping with faux outrage. As they were last week when JQ got Canterbury mixed up with Nelson or whatever (tsk tsk - "our" airline wouldn't do that......).

It's a shame. If Bradley was seen as the objective arbiter for air travel in New Zealand, instead of NZ's rent boy, airlines might sit up and take notice.


I noticed exactly the same. I would love to have it on record the number of free upgrades Bradley has received in the last year from Air New Zealand (as well as their value) and the number of times he has "travelled to XYZ as a guest of Air New Zealand". I'm actually very tempted to email the Herald and ask. :stirthepot:

Personal opinion, QF has made some real bad purchasing decisions over the years. They kept the 763's around far too long then replaced them with A330's meaning they couldn't be used on some 744 routes (North American) and also purchased the A380 which left the 744's having to remain in the fleet 10 years beyond what they should have, based on cost to operate not age, QF should have gone 777/A380

A 777 is far too much plane for transcon Australia flights.

Maybe for you, but not for the people who fly it and for me it remains an defining moment in NZ's change of direction in terms of pax comfort.

I agree. Their reputation before that was fantastic. I've argued many times that, when the (9 abreast) 77E's were delivered in 2005/6/7 they had the most comfortable economy cabin in the world. Comfortable seat, decent pitch + width, aisles that weren't too narrow and a very good IFE system (for the time). Additionally, not having black seat covers does wonders for promoting a light and spacious cabin ambience.



Sure, but if it was actually as bad as you continuously say it is, the passenger feedback / passengers choosing to fly other airlines would lead to NZ changing back to 9-abreast.

Management admitting that they were wrong and making an expensive u-turn? More likely that they would blame people switching to other carriers on external factors.

As a consumer I'm more concerned about the QF and their mid-2000s IFE (read: tiny screen, no USB power) in the A330-200 I spent some 14 hours in last week (of which 2.5 hours was a ground delay at the gate in PEK due to an engineering issue), and will probably avoid their PEK service (which is run with the same two A330-200 with outdated furnishings 5-6 days a week) in future.

QF announced recently that these aircraft (VH-EBG and VH-EBL) will be refitted and brought up to the standard of the other A330-200s. No timeline yet though.


Kormuan's constant ramblings about Hong Kong hubs and compalining that NZ didn't start direct flights to wherever he wanted to go won't be missed though.


I miss his blue sky thinking.
Most recent aircraft flown: A318 F-GUGQ, A319 F-GRHR, A320ceo D-AIZH, A320neo D-AINE, A330-300 VH-QPD, A350-900 B-LRA, A380-800 D-AIMH, 717 VH-YQW, 737-600 LN-RPA, 737-700 OY-JTY, 737-800 LN-NGA, 767-300 ZK-NCI, 777-300 ZK-OKN, 787-9 VH-ZNA, CS100 HB-JBG
 
planemanofnz
Posts: 3931
Joined: Fri Sep 30, 2005 4:46 pm

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Sun Mar 04, 2018 6:53 pm

mariner wrote:
Whatever the fortunes of Malaysia now, because of Emirates and Qatar, not too long after the twin tragedies this appeared:

https://www.stuff.co.nz/travel/news/689 ... travellers

Malaysia Airlines tragedies fail to deter New Zealand travellers

Yes, true - it's definitely sad that, despite its successes at AKL through the two crashes, MH here has done a 180:

- In October 2015, MH's CEO said its AKL route was “very strong and successful” - it was described as "rock solid"
- By June 2017, the CEO said "[AKL] has become extremely competitive" and "[AKL] yields have gone to the dogs"

See:
- http://www.fortheloveoftravel.net.nz/bl ... pw6D-huZPY.
- https://centreforaviation.com/insights/ ... 018-350143.
- https://www.mscnewswire.co.nz/trade-exp ... -a350.html.

It'll be very interesting to see if the ex-AB 332's can turn things around, with them not being payload restricted. :crossfingers:

NZ321 wrote:
If MH actually want to lift performance on the route they need to provide a compelling reason for people to fly them beyond just discount.

What could be that compelling reason - perhaps its more connectivity, like KUL - CHC / WLG or BKI - AKL / SYD?

Cheers,

C.
 
planemanofnz
Posts: 3931
Joined: Fri Sep 30, 2005 4:46 pm

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Sun Mar 04, 2018 7:11 pm

The new NZ safety video has been criticized yet again - this time, by Deborah Hill Cone in the New Zealand Herald, who gives four critiques:

1. Trauma can stretch across generations.
2. We are all interconnected.
3. We have a collective shadow.
4. Empathy is a critical component of good management.


See: http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/artic ... d=12006167.

As much as the Erebus point is important, I'd also like to see more focus by the media on the video's portrayal of Antarctica as a tourism playground. The starting of the video with "woohoo" from a helicopter, calling the snowmobiles "great fun", taking selfies, visiting Ernest Shackleton's hut and asking the children if they want to explore Antarctica at the end of the video (as if it's a place to be explored), may only (wrongly) encourage people to go out of their way to visit Antarctica.

Cheers,

C.
 
User avatar
mariner
Posts: 19473
Joined: Fri Nov 23, 2001 7:29 am

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Sun Mar 04, 2018 8:07 pm

planemanofnz wrote:
The new NZ safety video has been criticized yet again - this time, by Deborah Hill Cone in the New Zealand Herald, who gives four critiques


Whatever Ms. Hill Cone thinks of the video, it's done now and cannot be undone.

Even if some mysterious body (who?) caused the video never to be shown again, its tough to not remember the two million (and counting) hits on Youtube or the countless Facebook posts - or just the general conversation, both positive and negative.

Just as NZ's relationship with Antarctica was changed by Erebus, it has been changed again by this safety video and so I think it's unrealistic to think that it wasn't at least discussed with (and approval given by) the majority shareholder.

mariner
aeternum nauta
 
User avatar
mariner
Posts: 19473
Joined: Fri Nov 23, 2001 7:29 am

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Sun Mar 04, 2018 8:14 pm

planemanofnz wrote:
Yes, true - it's definitely sad that, despite its successes at AKL through the two crashes, MH here has done a 180


The question is, who are the "optimistic cheapskates" flying now, if not Malaysian?

They must be getting something they consider to be of greater value which suggests that now it's the turn of Qatar and perhaps Emirates to be offering the very low fares.

mariner
aeternum nauta
 
Gasman
Posts: 1863
Joined: Mon Mar 01, 2004 10:06 am

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Sun Mar 04, 2018 8:38 pm

mariner wrote:
Whatever Ms. Hill Cone thinks of the video, it's done now and cannot be undone.
mariner

It can be. They did a pretty good job of removing another marketing-foot-in-mouth - ie. Ricco.

I think this from the article is absolutely key:

Air New Zealand maintains it was not offensive. This is arrogant. They don't get to decide that. They have the right to run their business however they choose, but they have no right to tell the rest of us what our truth is.

And whether intentional or not, some family members of the victims of Flight 901 have certainly taken a message from it.

Eric Houghton, who lost his father in the Erebus crash wrote on The Spinoff: "In making this video, I suspect that Air New Zealand is saying it believes it is time to move on. But they don't get to choose when we move on."

Two hundred and fifty seven people died in the worst air crash in New Zealand aviation history. I would have thought Air New Zealand would now be able to see they showed a lack of respect and would be in Deeply Apologetic Mode. But they seem to have done the marketing version of a shrug.
 
User avatar
mariner
Posts: 19473
Joined: Fri Nov 23, 2001 7:29 am

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Sun Mar 04, 2018 8:52 pm

Gasman wrote:
It can be. They did a pretty good job of removing another marketing-foot-in-mouth - ie. Ricco.


I think you didn't read my post properly. I said:

"Even if some mysterious body (who?) caused the video never to be shown again, its tough to not remember the two million (and counting) hits on Youtube or the countless Facebook posts - or just the general conversation, both positive and negative.

How do you eradicate from memory the two million and counting Youtube hits, or the countless Facebook posts? After all, you still remember Ricco.

mariner
aeternum nauta
 
Gasman
Posts: 1863
Joined: Mon Mar 01, 2004 10:06 am

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Sun Mar 04, 2018 9:28 pm

mariner wrote:
Gasman wrote:
It can be. They did a pretty good job of removing another marketing-foot-in-mouth - ie. Ricco.


I think you didn't read my post properly. I said:

"Even if some mysterious body (who?) caused the video never to be shown again, its tough to not remember the two million (and counting) hits on Youtube or the countless Facebook posts - or just the general conversation, both positive and negative.

How do you eradicate from memory the two million and counting Youtube hits, or the countless Facebook posts? After all, you still remember Ricco.

mariner

Your point being?
 
User avatar
mariner
Posts: 19473
Joined: Fri Nov 23, 2001 7:29 am

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Sun Mar 04, 2018 10:52 pm

Gasman wrote:
Your point being?


As I said in an earlier post, it's done and cannot be undone. NZ's relationship with Antarctica has changed.

About time, I say. but each tp their own.

mariner
aeternum nauta
 
Motorhussy
Posts: 3437
Joined: Thu Mar 30, 2000 7:49 am

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Sun Mar 04, 2018 11:35 pm

With Norwegian doing some ‘blue sky’ route planning out of EZE and looking at trans-Antarctic routes to Asia via PER, what do you think of NZ operating a direct South Africa route, CHC-CPT or AKL-JNB?
come visit the south pacific
 
planemanofnz
Posts: 3931
Joined: Fri Sep 30, 2005 4:46 pm

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Mon Mar 05, 2018 1:59 am

Motorhussy wrote:
NZ operating a direct South Africa route, CHC-CPT or AKL-JNB

I should think not, for a couple of reasons:

1. I question if the 789 could make it - JNB is hot and high (5000+ feet) - for twins (the 789), their range would therefore likely be limited either by second-segment climb or tyre speed.

2. Geography is also a factor for AKL - CPT, which would fly much further south than any current commercial flight (like MEL - SCL) - it's questionable whether this would be approved.

3. Aside from VFR traffic, there'd be limited other traffic ex-AKL - IMHO, businesses would be put off by South Africa's stagnant economy, while many tourists here view it as not safe.

4. New Zealand and South Africa recently introduced visas for citizens of the other - until the visas are dropped, this will act as a dis-incentive for any tourism component of the flight.

5. South Africa doesn't fit within NZ's well-publicized 'Pacific Rim' strategy, of which there are many closer (and therefore cheaper to fly to) opportunities, yet to be exploited (e.g. CGK).

6. AKL - CPT / JNB do not develop the 'AKL HUB' strategy's two corridors, being Asia - South America, and Australia - North America - the lack of feed would be a big dis-incentive.

That being said, circumstances are always evolving - who knows what could happen in the 2020's! :cloudnine:

Cheers,

C.
 
User avatar
Zkpilot
Posts: 4132
Joined: Wed Mar 08, 2006 8:21 pm

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - March 2018

Mon Mar 05, 2018 2:44 am

planemanofnz wrote:
Motorhussy wrote:
NZ operating a direct South Africa route, CHC-CPT or AKL-JNB

I should think not, for a couple of reasons:

1. I question if the 789 could make it - JNB is hot and high (5000+ feet) - for twins (the 789), their range would therefore likely be limited either by second-segment climb or tyre speed.

2. Geography is also a factor for AKL - CPT, which would fly much further south than any current commercial flight (like MEL - SCL) - it's questionable whether this would be approved.

3. Aside from VFR traffic, there'd be limited other traffic ex-AKL - IMHO, businesses would be put off by South Africa's stagnant economy, while many tourists here view it as not safe.

4. New Zealand and South Africa recently introduced visas for citizens of the other - until the visas are dropped, this will act as a dis-incentive for any tourism component of the flight.

5. South Africa doesn't fit within NZ's well-publicized 'Pacific Rim' strategy, of which there are many closer (and therefore cheaper to fly to) opportunities, yet to be exploited (e.g. CGK).

6. AKL - CPT / JNB do not develop the 'AKL HUB' strategy's two corridors, being Asia - South America, and Australia - North America - the lack of feed would be a big dis-incentive.

That being said, circumstances are always evolving - who knows what could happen in the 2020's! :cloudnine:

Cheers,

C.

Yes stagnant and soon to be going backwards a la Zimbabwe now that parliament has passed a bill basically authorising confiscation of white farmers land (and if they get raped and murdered in the process so be it). South Africa will be heading down the toilet very soon as a result.
57 types. 38 countries. 24 airlines.
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
  • 12

Popular Searches On Airliners.net

Top Photos of Last:   24 Hours  •  48 Hours  •  7 Days  •  30 Days  •  180 Days  •  365 Days  •  All Time

Military Aircraft Every type from fighters to helicopters from air forces around the globe

Classic Airliners Props and jets from the good old days

Flight Decks Views from inside the cockpit

Aircraft Cabins Passenger cabin shots showing seat arrangements as well as cargo aircraft interior

Cargo Aircraft Pictures of great freighter aircraft

Government Aircraft Aircraft flying government officials

Helicopters Our large helicopter section. Both military and civil versions

Blimps / Airships Everything from the Goodyear blimp to the Zeppelin

Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos