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whywhyzee
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Re: Air Canada will add 4 more A330-300s in 2019

Wed May 23, 2018 12:12 pm

SpaceshipDC10 wrote:
Eirules wrote:
I note further up that the Rouge 767s are coming out of YVR. I haven’t seen this mentioned elsewhere. What about the routes they fly from YVR which only a 767 has the legs for?


Are the routes also served from another Canadian airport, thus flying a W routing or simply transferring the aircraft with a domestic flight.


The problem is going to be Nagoya and Osaka, as they are YVR unique routes. Mainline 787-8s could probably work at a reduced frequency.
 
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lightsaber
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Re: Air Canada will add 4 more A330-300s in 2019

Wed May 23, 2018 1:09 pm

There is currently a widebodies glut with a long wait for new types. Buying used makes sense. These are not being bought for a long period of utilization. Perhaps for 7 years or so. In my opinion, late 2019 and 2020 will be the years to order 787s or A350s for delivery in 2023+.

AC has bought very valuable negotiating time. Due to the glut of widebodies, there is no rush.

Lightsaber
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EChid
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Re: Air Canada will add 4 more A330-300s in 2019

Sat Sep 08, 2018 9:58 pm

Anyone know when AC's A330s will show up with interior refits? They are in dire need of them.
2018: DRW-PER-HKG-ICN-MEL-AVV-BNE-OOL-SYD-YYZ-YYZ-YUL-YVR-PDX-SEA-SFO-PEK-KIX-CDG-IST-NRT-HND-BKK-FAT; AC J-TK J-OZ F-DL F-TG J/F-NH J/F-CX J-VA J
 
Beatyair
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Re: Air Canada will add 4 more A330-300s in 2019

Mon Sep 10, 2018 12:39 am

EChid wrote:
Anyone know when AC's A330s will show up with interior refits? They are in dire need of them.


Starts late 2019, same package as the 787.
 
Beatyair
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Re: Air Canada will add 4 more A330-300s in 2019

Mon Sep 10, 2018 12:41 am

Are the SA planes cabins more up to date then the current AC planes?
 
juliuswong
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Re: Air Canada will add 4 more A330-300s in 2019

Sat Oct 20, 2018 3:12 pm

According to this website, AC is acquiring 4 ex SQ A333. One or two will come flown with TAP recently. Sorry if this information was shared earlier. https://simpleflying.com/air-canada-to- ... a330s/amp/
- Life is a journey, travel it well -
 
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AC_B777
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Re: Air Canada will add 4 more A330-300s in 2019

Sat Oct 20, 2018 3:48 pm

This is an excerpt from our internal employee news site from Oct 18:

"To support our fleet plan and sustain our international growth, we decided to acquire four Airbus A330 aircraft, previously operating at TAP Portugal, to replace aircraft that we’re retiring: mainline Boeing 767s. The combination of great economics and attractive lease rates make the A330 the right aircraft for some of our transatlantic flying.
We’ll receive the first of these aircraft early next year and bring it into service in Q2 2019. They’ll sport our new livery, but the interior of the first two aircraft will not go through a complete retrofit until Q4 2019. These aircraft, along with the remaining two, will be included as part of A330 Dream Cabin project taking place later in the year. That means that the existing “Business class” cabin on board will have an interim interior and angled lie-flat seats instead of our Signature Class product. As a result, we’ll be selling these seats as Premium Economy until their scheduled upgrades.
During this interim configuration, they’ll initially operate on Montréal–Algiers, currently serviced by Rouge."
In life, some days you are the bug..... some days you are the windshield!
 
EChid
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Re: Air Canada will add 4 more A330-300s in 2019

Sat Oct 20, 2018 4:05 pm

AC_B777 wrote:
This is an excerpt from our internal employee news site from Oct 18:

"To support our fleet plan and sustain our international growth, we decided to acquire four Airbus A330 aircraft, previously operating at TAP Portugal, to replace aircraft that we’re retiring: mainline Boeing 767s. The combination of great economics and attractive lease rates make the A330 the right aircraft for some of our transatlantic flying.
We’ll receive the first of these aircraft early next year and bring it into service in Q2 2019. They’ll sport our new livery, but the interior of the first two aircraft will not go through a complete retrofit until Q4 2019. These aircraft, along with the remaining two, will be included as part of A330 Dream Cabin project taking place later in the year. That means that the existing “Business class” cabin on board will have an interim interior and angled lie-flat seats instead of our Signature Class product. As a result, we’ll be selling these seats as Premium Economy until their scheduled upgrades.
During this interim configuration, they’ll initially operate on Montréal–Algiers, currently serviced by Rouge."


Very interesting that they couldn't move quickly enough to make the retrofits happen in time. I guess they saw room for a non-J layout in the line-up and/or had issues nailing down the supplier in time. It'll be a lovely PE product, at any rate. What's encouraging is how seriously AC is taking their branding...they had an opportunity to fail the customer here and market it as J but clearly are working very hard at maintaining the reputation of their all-flat Signature Service. I'm not sure AC of 10 years ago would have done that.
2018: DRW-PER-HKG-ICN-MEL-AVV-BNE-OOL-SYD-YYZ-YYZ-YUL-YVR-PDX-SEA-SFO-PEK-KIX-CDG-IST-NRT-HND-BKK-FAT; AC J-TK J-OZ F-DL F-TG J/F-NH J/F-CX J-VA J
 
boeing767300
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Re: Air Canada will add 4 more A330-300s in 2019

Sat Oct 20, 2018 4:41 pm

Meanwhile the last day of ops for the A-330 on the YYZ DUB AC842 will be October 26th. Effective 27th winter sced AC842 will be operated by a B-767 in 24 187 configuration. Showing 5 X weekly with no ops on Mon and Wed, similar to last winters sced. The A-330 has been operating that route in a 27 21 244 configuration so quite the capacity drop for the season. Meanwhile it is nice to see the venerable B-767 on the route as this no doubt will be the last time unless it ever reverts back to RV. HOPEFULLY NOT!
 
slcdeltarumd11
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Re: Air Canada will add 4 more A330-300s in 2019

Sat Oct 20, 2018 4:46 pm

Seem like good 767 replacements to me. Aren't alot of AC A330 interiors pretty dated and tired especially in business? Will they do newer business seats? My last AC A330 the seats seemed so tired stains and marks all over the business section, was that unusual?
 
Noise
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Re: Air Canada will add 4 more A330-300s in 2019

Sat Oct 20, 2018 4:57 pm

Question about the 737 MAX 9s that Air Canada has on order: will the have the same/similar range to the 737 MAX 8? Can we see these flying across the Atlantic some day, instead of the 7M8?
 
EChid
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Re: Air Canada will add 4 more A330-300s in 2019

Sat Oct 20, 2018 5:06 pm

slcdeltarumd11 wrote:
Seem like good 767 replacements to me. Aren't alot of AC A330 interiors pretty dated and tired especially in business? Will they do newer business seats? My last AC A330 the seats seemed so tired stains and marks all over the business section, was that unusual?


As noted at several points in this thread, the interiors will be refitted on all A330s starting late 2019 to align with the current 77W/787 interiors.
2018: DRW-PER-HKG-ICN-MEL-AVV-BNE-OOL-SYD-YYZ-YYZ-YUL-YVR-PDX-SEA-SFO-PEK-KIX-CDG-IST-NRT-HND-BKK-FAT; AC J-TK J-OZ F-DL F-TG J/F-NH J/F-CX J-VA J
 
YYZLGA
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Re: Air Canada will add 4 more A330-300s in 2019

Mon Oct 22, 2018 5:55 am

On a somewhat related note, Rouge has now got some 767s that are pushing 30 years old. How much longer can they last? Will the A330 be shifted over to Rouge in the longer term? I suppose the planned refits would suggest otherwise. I noticed there are a couple 12-year-old ex-Shanghai Airlines 763s that are apparently currently in storage. They would seem ideal for the AC fleet, though I don't know if they're getting refitted for cargo or something like that. Ethiopian also has a relatively new fleet of 763 that they're planning to retire next year. Will AC keep trying to opportunistically pick up 763s as they come available to replace the ones that age out? Are there enough used 763s available for that? The choice to go with A330s for mainline would suggest not.
 
Galwayman
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Re: Air Canada will add 4 more A330-300s in 2019

Wed Oct 31, 2018 9:30 am

YUL > DUB Ex SQ A330 confirmed for Summer 19

The Ireland - Canada market is so hot right now , great news for DUB and of course great news for people in NI too
 
sixtyseven
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Re: Air Canada will add 4 more A330-300s in 2019

Wed Oct 31, 2018 10:16 am

YYZLGA wrote:
On a somewhat related note, Rouge has now got some 767s that are pushing 30 years old. How much longer can they last? Will the A330 be shifted over to Rouge in the longer term? I suppose the planned refits would suggest otherwise. I noticed there are a couple 12-year-old ex-Shanghai Airlines 763s that are apparently currently in storage. They would seem ideal for the AC fleet, though I don't know if they're getting refitted for cargo or something like that. Ethiopian also has a relatively new fleet of 763 that they're planning to retire next year. Will AC keep trying to opportunistically pick up 763s as they come available to replace the ones that age out? Are there enough used 763s available for that? The choice to go with A330s for mainline would suggest not.


The answer to your question is no. The 767 will be staying at Rouge for another 10 years. I’m not saying all 25 but the vast majority,

There are several projects on the go and proposed for modernizing. The one thing people need to know is these airplanes are essentially free. They make a lot of money for Rougeand don’t tie up a bunch of capital. I think there have been some triggers already made that would allow for the transfer of other types to Rouge however none make enough economic sense to break up what is going so well there.

AC is thrilled with Rouge. It has been nothing short of a home run.
Stand-by for new ATIS message......
 
matt
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Re: Air Canada will add 4 more A330-300s in 2019

Wed Oct 31, 2018 12:13 pm

So far, for Summer 2019, AC 333s will be deployed on the following transatlantic routes:

Regular A333 (8)

YYZ-DUB (daily)
YUL-CDG (daily AC870)
YUL-LHR (daily)
YUL-BRU (daily)
YUL-GVA (daily)
YUL-LYS (days 12456)
YUL-TLV (days 347)
YUL-CMN (days 123567)

Ex-TP A333

YUL-ALG (days 2456)
YUL-DUB (days 246)

What other routes do you think will be flown by the other ex-TP A333s?
Next flights: YQM-YUL-MIA-YUL-YQM / YQM-YUL-YQM / YQM-YUL-LYS-YUL-YQM / YQM-YUL-FRA-MLA-FRA-YUL-YQM
 
dabc
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Re: Air Canada will add 4 more A330-300s in 2019

Wed Oct 31, 2018 12:35 pm

matt wrote:
So far, for Summer 2019, AC 333s will be deployed on the following transatlantic routes:

Regular A333 (8)

YYZ-DUB (daily)
YUL-CDG (daily AC870)
YUL-LHR (daily)
YUL-BRU (daily)
YUL-GVA (daily)
YUL-LYS (days 12456)
YUL-TLV (days 347)
YUL-CMN (days 123567)

Ex-TP A333

YUL-ALG (days 2456)
YUL-DUB (days 246)

What other routes do you think will be flown by the other ex-TP A333s?


YUL-ALG days 246 starting June 6, 2019 and then days 24567 starting June 17
 
matt
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Re: Air Canada will add 4 more A330-300s in 2019

Wed Oct 31, 2018 1:14 pm

dabc wrote:
YUL-ALG days 246 starting June 6, 2019 and then days 24567 starting June 17


Yes, you're right. My mistake. Thanks.
Next flights: YQM-YUL-MIA-YUL-YQM / YQM-YUL-YQM / YQM-YUL-LYS-YUL-YQM / YQM-YUL-FRA-MLA-FRA-YUL-YQM
 
Galwayman
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Re: Air Canada will add 4 more A330-300s in 2019

Wed Oct 31, 2018 1:31 pm

J being sold as Y+ ex Dub .... great bargain
 
whywhyzee
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Re: Air Canada will add 4 more A330-300s in 2019

Wed Oct 31, 2018 2:33 pm

YVR-DUB will likely be an ex SQ A333 as well.
 
ewt340
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Re: Air Canada will add 4 more A330-300s in 2019

Wed Oct 31, 2018 2:36 pm

Honestly, A330-300 especially with the new Trent engines is the perfect plane for Air Canada and their long-haul destinations. It got around 6,000nm+ range (4,500nm - 5,000nm realistically speaking). So it does cover the Whole South America and Continental Europe, they could even do Tel-Aviv Easily fully loaded. And since they are looking at B767 replacement, in terms of range, A330-300 does cover the job nicely. The low fuel consumption doesn't hurt either.

As 2020 approaching, the second hand A330-300 from the 2005-2010 would started to be available for many airlines who love to snatch some bargain. And we would definitely see this kind of trend continuing in the future. It just hit the right spot for many airlines around the world.
 
matt
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Re: Air Canada will add 4 more A330-300s in 2019

Wed Oct 31, 2018 3:00 pm

whywhyzee wrote:
YVR-DUB will likely be an ex SQ A333 as well.


This would make sense. Currently, the YVR-DUB flights (days 1357) are scheduled to be flown by rouge 763s, but it would make sense that an ex-TP 333 be chosen to operate this route. Since YUL-DUB operates on days 246, it would make sense (YUL-DUB-YVR-DUB-YVR cycles).

EDIT: Looks like this is confirmed as per Air Canada website (online schedule).
Last edited by matt on Wed Oct 31, 2018 3:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Next flights: YQM-YUL-MIA-YUL-YQM / YQM-YUL-YQM / YQM-YUL-LYS-YUL-YQM / YQM-YUL-FRA-MLA-FRA-YUL-YQM
 
codyul
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Re: Air Canada will add 4 more A330-300s in 2019

Wed Oct 31, 2018 3:07 pm

matt wrote:
whywhyzee wrote:
YVR-DUB will likely be an ex SQ A333 as well.


This would make sense. Currently, the YVR-DUB flights (days 1357) are scheduled to be flown by rouge 763s, but it would make sense that an ex-TP 333 be chosen to operate this route. Since YUL-DUB operates on days 246, it would make sense (YUL-DUB-YVR-DUB-YVR cycles).


Pretty cool to see the pieces fitting in like a puzzle!
YUL PNC :weightlifter:
 
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Panagiotis
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Re: Air Canada will add 4 more A330-300s in 2019

Wed Oct 31, 2018 4:23 pm

matt wrote:
So far, for Summer 2019, AC 333s will be deployed on the following transatlantic routes:

Regular A333 (8)

YYZ-DUB (daily)
YUL-CDG (daily AC870)
YUL-LHR (daily)
YUL-BRU (daily)
YUL-GVA (daily)
YUL-LYS (days 12456)
YUL-TLV (days 347)
YUL-CMN (days 123567)

Ex-TP A333

YUL-ALG (days 2456)
YUL-DUB (days 246)

What other routes do you think will be flown by the other ex-TP A333s?


Are you sure they will not mix the operations? Like rotating all A333 on every routes, as well as the new ones, or because of the cabin configuration, the ex TP will only fly YUL-DUB and YUL-ALG?

Because what will those frames do on days 1, 3 and 7 ?
 
SpaceshipDC10
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Re: Air Canada will add 4 more A330-300s in 2019

Wed Oct 31, 2018 4:30 pm

Panagiotis wrote:
Are you sure they will not mix the operations? Like rotating all A333 on every routes, as well as the new ones, or because of the cabin configuration, the ex TP will only fly YUL-DUB and YUL-ALG?


On the ALG service, the A333 will be operated instead of Rouge's 767, on a very VFR route.
 
matt
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Re: Air Canada will add 4 more A330-300s in 2019

Wed Oct 31, 2018 4:39 pm

No, they will not rotate all 333s on every route. The 8 original 333s (with C class) will be deployed on specific routes (the ones mentionned earlier).

As for the ex-TP/SQ frames (with no C class), there should be four in operation for the Summer 2019 season. So far, AC will deploy them on the following routes:

YUL-DUB (days 246)
YVR-DUB (days 1357)
YUL-ALG (days 24567)

There are mostly more routes to come for those ex-TP/SQ frames.
Next flights: YQM-YUL-MIA-YUL-YQM / YQM-YUL-YQM / YQM-YUL-LYS-YUL-YQM / YQM-YUL-FRA-MLA-FRA-YUL-YQM
 
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Revelation
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Re: Air Canada will add 4 more A330-300s in 2019

Wed Oct 31, 2018 5:20 pm

lightsaber wrote:
There is currently a widebodies glut with a long wait for new types. Buying used makes sense. These are not being bought for a long period of utilization. Perhaps for 7 years or so. In my opinion, late 2019 and 2020 will be the years to order 787s or A350s for delivery in 2023+.

AC has bought very valuable negotiating time. Due to the glut of widebodies, there is no rush.

Lightsaber

The interesting trend is seeing well-known brands such as AC, VS, LH Group etc cheerfully taking in used widebodies from SQ, Air Berlin, TP, etc.

I imagine Airbus would have put some of these into the A330neo projections.
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Wake now, discover that you are the song that the morning brings
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EChid
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Re: Air Canada will add 4 more A330-300s in 2019

Wed Oct 31, 2018 5:37 pm

Revelation wrote:
lightsaber wrote:
There is currently a widebodies glut with a long wait for new types. Buying used makes sense. These are not being bought for a long period of utilization. Perhaps for 7 years or so. In my opinion, late 2019 and 2020 will be the years to order 787s or A350s for delivery in 2023+.

AC has bought very valuable negotiating time. Due to the glut of widebodies, there is no rush.

Lightsaber

The interesting trend is seeing well-known brands such as AC, VS, LH Group etc cheerfully taking in used widebodies from SQ, Air Berlin, TP, etc.

I imagine Airbus would have put some of these into the A330neo projections.


I'm not sure they would have, actually. VS took the A330s because of the number of issues it's having with the 787s, to my knowledge. I think it would have been hard to foresee either VS or AC as potential neo buyers since AC already only had a small subfleet of ceos that clearly had not been prioritized until now. I expect that it was more of a hit to Boeing's hopes, since I'm guessing they were gunning for a potential top-up 787-10 order from AC for TATL flights.

In fact, I'll go out on a limb and say that Airbus is likely happy AC bought these ceos. They're pretty thin on the ground with AC now that they opted for the MAX instead of the Neo, leaving just the A220, a few A321s, and now, securing the future of these A330s for quite a few more years. That probably gives them better chances come the next time that AC needs to buy some planes.
Last edited by EChid on Wed Oct 31, 2018 5:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.
2018: DRW-PER-HKG-ICN-MEL-AVV-BNE-OOL-SYD-YYZ-YYZ-YUL-YVR-PDX-SEA-SFO-PEK-KIX-CDG-IST-NRT-HND-BKK-FAT; AC J-TK J-OZ F-DL F-TG J/F-NH J/F-CX J-VA J
 
YYZLGA
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Re: Air Canada will add 4 more A330-300s in 2019

Wed Oct 31, 2018 5:39 pm

sixtyseven wrote:
The answer to your question is no. The 767 will be staying at Rouge for another 10 years. I’m not saying all 25 but the vast majority,

There are several projects on the go and proposed for modernizing. The one thing people need to know is these airplanes are essentially free. They make a lot of money for Rougeand don’t tie up a bunch of capital. I think there have been some triggers already made that would allow for the transfer of other types to Rouge however none make enough economic sense to break up what is going so well there.

AC is thrilled with Rouge. It has been nothing short of a home run.


Makes perfect sense. For the aircraft still in their teens, there's no reason why they can't operate at least another decade. As you mentioned though, at least some of the 25 will have to be retired. Are there enough younger 763s with the right engines available to replace them? What's the alternative?
 
SXDFC
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Re: Air Canada will add 4 more A330-300s in 2019

Wed Oct 31, 2018 5:44 pm

Does anyone know the regis of the current TAP A330s that will be going to Air Canada? Is the TAP retrojet one of them?
 
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Polot
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Re: Air Canada will add 4 more A330-300s in 2019

Wed Oct 31, 2018 5:47 pm

SXDFC wrote:
Does anyone know the regis of the current TAP A330s that will be going to Air Canada? Is the TAP retrojet one of them?

It is TAP’s entire fleet of A333s (including the retro jet, yes). They only have the 4 ex SQ birds, the rest of the A330s are -200s.
 
sixtyseven
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Re: Air Canada will add 4 more A330-300s in 2019

Wed Oct 31, 2018 5:59 pm

YYZLGA wrote:
sixtyseven wrote:
The answer to your question is no. The 767 will be staying at Rouge for another 10 years. I’m not saying all 25 but the vast majority,

There are several projects on the go and proposed for modernizing. The one thing people need to know is these airplanes are essentially free. They make a lot of money for Rougeand don’t tie up a bunch of capital. I think there have been some triggers already made that would allow for the transfer of other types to Rouge however none make enough economic sense to break up what is going so well there.

AC is thrilled with Rouge. It has been nothing short of a home run.


Makes perfect sense. For the aircraft still in their teens, there's no reason why they can't operate at least another decade. As you mentioned though, at least some of the 25 will have to be retired. Are there enough younger 763s with the right engines available to replace them? What's the alternative?


Not sure to be honest. As for the engines the fleet is a mix to begin with. Both Pratt’s and GEs are used so I don’t think that would present much of a problem.

I think the company is doing a capital expenditure balancing act. What is the fleet worth in regards to longer term investment/replacement. Are there some frames that are nearing the end? What to do. Of course people on here would have brand new planes everywhere but fiscally that’s not a great move for people who actually pay the bills.

In terms of the pilots contract I believe theyve reached some triggers whereas they could replace some of the 767s. That would open a bit of a can of worms in terms of another type, training etc. But to be honest I think the 319 fleet is more the target. I think they’d rather get their hands on some 320s with the ability to carry more people. The 767 by no means is perfect. But it’s making them a pile of money so it’s incredibly efficient as a revenue generator.

I think it’s going to be pretty quiet until 2020 as to what amount of reinvestment will be made. The closing of the YVR base should ease up the pressure on the fleet in terms of utilization. As the operational tempo in the summer is incredibly high.
Stand-by for new ATIS message......
 
EChid
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Re: Air Canada will add 4 more A330-300s in 2019

Wed Oct 31, 2018 6:16 pm

SXDFC wrote:
Does anyone know the regis of the current TAP A330s that will be going to Air Canada? Is the TAP retrojet one of them?


Keeping in mind that, even though the interior refit isn't being done immediately, they'll already be repainted :)
2018: DRW-PER-HKG-ICN-MEL-AVV-BNE-OOL-SYD-YYZ-YYZ-YUL-YVR-PDX-SEA-SFO-PEK-KIX-CDG-IST-NRT-HND-BKK-FAT; AC J-TK J-OZ F-DL F-TG J/F-NH J/F-CX J-VA J
 
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Revelation
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Re: Air Canada will add 4 more A330-300s in 2019

Wed Oct 31, 2018 6:45 pm

EChid wrote:
In fact, I'll go out on a limb and say that Airbus is likely happy AC bought these ceos. They're pretty thin on the ground with AC now that they opted for the MAX instead of the Neo, leaving just the A220, a few A321s, and now, securing the future of these A330s for quite a few more years. That probably gives them better chances come the next time that AC needs to buy some planes.

That's a good observation. Placing more A330s at AC can only help Airbus in the future. I'm a big A330 fan (believe it or not) and am hoping A330neo finds its way forward.
Wake up to find out that you are the eyes of the world
The heart has its beaches, its homeland and thoughts of its own
Wake now, discover that you are the song that the morning brings
The heart has its seasons, its evenings and songs of its own
 
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ACCS300
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Re: Air Canada will add 4 more A330-300s in 2019

Wed Oct 31, 2018 7:01 pm

The Boeing frenzy at AC seems to be quieting a bit, 27 Airbus birds remain at Rouge and about 80 at AC mainline with 4 more being added. AC recently added a few A321's to Rouge and delayed retirement of some A320's at mainline while it cancelled some 787 options. With the added 330's, I feel AC will next add some 321's perhaps the NEO's for TATL.
 
sixtyseven
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Re: Air Canada will add 4 more A330-300s in 2019

Wed Oct 31, 2018 8:00 pm

ACCS300 wrote:
The Boeing frenzy at AC seems to be quieting a bit, 27 Airbus birds remain at Rouge and about 80 at AC mainline with 4 more being added. AC recently added a few A321's to Rouge and delayed retirement of some A320's at mainline while it cancelled some 787 options. With the added 330's, I feel AC will next add some 321's perhaps the NEO's for TATL.


Are the 787 options cancelled?
Stand-by for new ATIS message......
 
rbavfan
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Re: Air Canada will add 4 more A330-300'S in 2019

Wed Oct 31, 2018 8:01 pm

SuperTwin wrote:
No engine issues (GE), but for shorter flights that are 6-8hrs, the A330 probably has a lower CASM. That’s because the flight’s CASM must also include the cost of ownership and 787s are expensive whereas A330s are much more affordable! Not the only reason, but undoubtedly it’s a big part of the decision.


A330 would be lower cost & fuel burn on short hops vs the 787 that's designed for long haul efficiency.
 
tofur
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Re: Air Canada will add 4 more A330-300s in 2019

Wed Oct 31, 2018 8:17 pm

sixtyseven wrote:
ACCS300 wrote:
The Boeing frenzy at AC seems to be quieting a bit, 27 Airbus birds remain at Rouge and about 80 at AC mainline with 4 more being added. AC recently added a few A321's to Rouge and delayed retirement of some A320's at mainline while it cancelled some 787 options. With the added 330's, I feel AC will next add some 321's perhaps the NEO's for TATL.


Are the 787 options cancelled?


No. According to the audio webcast this morning, the 787 options are still there and at very good prices. Believe it was Calin R. that said this.
 
rbavfan
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Re: Air Canada will add 4 more A330-300s in 2019

Wed Oct 31, 2018 8:17 pm

gilesdavies wrote:
American Airlines are looking to offload the nine former A330-300's, they are due to leave the fleet this year...

I think it is just due to the small number in the fleet, while they worked great for US Airways, but after merger with American Airlines, when you have just nine aircraft in a fleet of 900+ birds its small fry!


It's due toAA having 9 A330's I believe with PW engines & 15 with rollers. They are cutting a out the -200's and an engine type.
 
sixtyseven
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Re: Air Canada will add 4 more A330-300s in 2019

Wed Oct 31, 2018 8:40 pm

tofur wrote:
sixtyseven wrote:
ACCS300 wrote:
The Boeing frenzy at AC seems to be quieting a bit, 27 Airbus birds remain at Rouge and about 80 at AC mainline with 4 more being added. AC recently added a few A321's to Rouge and delayed retirement of some A320's at mainline while it cancelled some 787 options. With the added 330's, I feel AC will next add some 321's perhaps the NEO's for TATL.


Are the 787 options cancelled?


No. According to the audio webcast this morning, the 787 options are still there and at very good prices. Believe it was Calin R. that said this.


Thanks for that. As I understood it they didn’t take them up. But that hadn’t expired. But wasn’t sure if I’d missed something so thanks for clarifying.
Stand-by for new ATIS message......
 
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ACCS300
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Re: Air Canada will add 4 more A330-300s in 2019

Wed Oct 31, 2018 9:26 pm

tofur wrote:
sixtyseven wrote:
ACCS300 wrote:
The Boeing frenzy at AC seems to be quieting a bit, 27 Airbus birds remain at Rouge and about 80 at AC mainline with 4 more being added. AC recently added a few A321's to Rouge and delayed retirement of some A320's at mainline while it cancelled some 787 options. With the added 330's, I feel AC will next add some 321's perhaps the NEO's for TATL.


Are the 787 options cancelled?


No. According to the audio webcast this morning, the 787 options are still there and at very good prices. Believe it was Calin R. that said this.


Whoops thanks for clarifying, I had understood they were not taking the options. Cheers and thanks.
 
EChid
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Re: Air Canada will add 4 more A330-300s in 2019

Wed Oct 31, 2018 9:39 pm

ACCS300 wrote:
tofur wrote:
sixtyseven wrote:

Are the 787 options cancelled?


No. According to the audio webcast this morning, the 787 options are still there and at very good prices. Believe it was Calin R. that said this.


Whoops thanks for clarifying, I had understood they were not taking the options. Cheers and thanks.


I think you're both kind've right. The options are still there, but AC has made it fairly clear that they are done growing for the time being. In other words, that they're not very interested in taking them.
2018: DRW-PER-HKG-ICN-MEL-AVV-BNE-OOL-SYD-YYZ-YYZ-YUL-YVR-PDX-SEA-SFO-PEK-KIX-CDG-IST-NRT-HND-BKK-FAT; AC J-TK J-OZ F-DL F-TG J/F-NH J/F-CX J-VA J
 
YYZLGA
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Re: Air Canada will add 4 more A330-300s in 2019

Wed Oct 31, 2018 10:05 pm

AC has been complaining for the last while that they haven't been able to get slots at airports in China where they'd like to add flights (meanwhile, Chinese airlines have been adding flights left and right to Canada). I imagine that the 787 would be the aircraft used on those flights, and until they're able to get those slots, they won't be buying any additional 787s. It seems as though they feel the 7M8s and used 333s are the best option financially for added European flights.
 
Noise
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Re: Air Canada will add 4 more A330-300s in 2019

Wed Oct 31, 2018 10:22 pm

With a reasonable range of 3,400 miles, the 7M8 offers additional opportunities for YYZ/YOW/YUL-Europe flights.

EDI, GLA, MAN, BHX, OSL, MAD, OPO become possibilities at this point.
 
EChid
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Re: Air Canada will add 4 more A330-300s in 2019

Thu Nov 01, 2018 4:34 am

YYZLGA wrote:
AC has been complaining for the last while that they haven't been able to get slots at airports in China where they'd like to add flights (meanwhile, Chinese airlines have been adding flights left and right to Canada). I imagine that the 787 would be the aircraft used on those flights, and until they're able to get those slots, they won't be buying any additional 787s. It seems as though they feel the 7M8s and used 333s are the best option financially for added European flights.


That's surprising to hear given the fare issues most airlines are having in China. I wonder if they'll try and get slots at Daxing.
2018: DRW-PER-HKG-ICN-MEL-AVV-BNE-OOL-SYD-YYZ-YYZ-YUL-YVR-PDX-SEA-SFO-PEK-KIX-CDG-IST-NRT-HND-BKK-FAT; AC J-TK J-OZ F-DL F-TG J/F-NH J/F-CX J-VA J
 
brindabella
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Re: Air Canada will add 4 more A330-300s in 2019

Thu Nov 01, 2018 12:59 pm

EChid wrote:
Revelation wrote:
lightsaber wrote:
There is currently a widebodies glut with a long wait for new types. Buying used makes sense. These are not being bought for a long period of utilization. Perhaps for 7 years or so. In my opinion, late 2019 and 2020 will be the years to order 787s or A350s for delivery in 2023+.

AC has bought very valuable negotiating time. Due to the glut of widebodies, there is no rush.

Lightsaber

The interesting trend is seeing well-known brands such as AC, VS, LH Group etc cheerfully taking in used widebodies from SQ, Air Berlin, TP, etc.

I imagine Airbus would have put some of these into the A330neo projections.


I'm not sure they would have, actually. VS took the A330s because of the number of issues it's having with the 787s, to my knowledge. I think it would have been hard to foresee either VS or AC as potential neo buyers since AC already only had a small subfleet of ceos that clearly had not been prioritized until now. I expect that it was more of a hit to Boeing's hopes, since I'm guessing they were gunning for a potential top-up 787-10 order from AC for TATL flights.

In fact, I'll go out on a limb and say that Airbus is likely happy AC bought these ceos. They're pretty thin on the ground with AC now that they opted for the MAX instead of the Neo, leaving just the A220, a few A321s, and now, securing the future of these A330s for quite a few more years. That probably gives them better chances come the next time that AC needs to buy some planes.



Fascinating.

Heard plenty of (understandably upset) operators cranky about currently-grounded RR-powered 787s.


But I have a feeling that's ot what you are talking about.

Care to share?

Like ... a link, perchance?

cheers
Billy
 
EChid
Posts: 543
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Re: Air Canada will add 4 more A330-300s in 2019

Thu Nov 01, 2018 2:17 pm

brindabella wrote:
EChid wrote:
Revelation wrote:
The interesting trend is seeing well-known brands such as AC, VS, LH Group etc cheerfully taking in used widebodies from SQ, Air Berlin, TP, etc.

I imagine Airbus would have put some of these into the A330neo projections.


I'm not sure they would have, actually. VS took the A330s because of the number of issues it's having with the 787s, to my knowledge. I think it would have been hard to foresee either VS or AC as potential neo buyers since AC already only had a small subfleet of ceos that clearly had not been prioritized until now. I expect that it was more of a hit to Boeing's hopes, since I'm guessing they were gunning for a potential top-up 787-10 order from AC for TATL flights.

In fact, I'll go out on a limb and say that Airbus is likely happy AC bought these ceos. They're pretty thin on the ground with AC now that they opted for the MAX instead of the Neo, leaving just the A220, a few A321s, and now, securing the future of these A330s for quite a few more years. That probably gives them better chances come the next time that AC needs to buy some planes.



Fascinating.

Heard plenty of (understandably upset) operators cranky about currently-grounded RR-powered 787s.


But I have a feeling that's ot what you are talking about.

Care to share?

Like ... a link, perchance?

cheers


Yes, it's related to the RR-powered 787 issues. They leased the ex-Air Berlin A332s to cover for the new limitations/grounding of some of their 787 fleet. Obviously, AC is not affected by this.

Links:
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles ... -to-virgin
https://skift.com/2018/03/10/virgin-atl ... e-trouble/
2018: DRW-PER-HKG-ICN-MEL-AVV-BNE-OOL-SYD-YYZ-YYZ-YUL-YVR-PDX-SEA-SFO-PEK-KIX-CDG-IST-NRT-HND-BKK-FAT; AC J-TK J-OZ F-DL F-TG J/F-NH J/F-CX J-VA J
 
golfradio
Posts: 892
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Re: Air Canada will add 4 more A330-300s in 2019

Thu Nov 01, 2018 2:29 pm

ACCS300 wrote:
The Boeing frenzy at AC seems to be quieting a bit, 27 Airbus birds remain at Rouge and about 80 at AC mainline with 4 more being added. AC recently added a few A321's to Rouge and delayed retirement of some A320's at mainline while it cancelled some 787 options. With the added 330's, I feel AC will next add some 321's perhaps the NEO's for TATL.


I always thought it was a bad move to go all Boeing. While the 787 makes sense, the Max switch made no sense at all. They should have remained with Airbus/BBD for the short and medium haul.
CSeries forever. Bring back the old site.
 
Noise
Posts: 2447
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Re: Air Canada will add 4 more A330-300s in 2019

Thu Nov 01, 2018 2:48 pm

golfradio wrote:
ACCS300 wrote:
The Boeing frenzy at AC seems to be quieting a bit, 27 Airbus birds remain at Rouge and about 80 at AC mainline with 4 more being added. AC recently added a few A321's to Rouge and delayed retirement of some A320's at mainline while it cancelled some 787 options. With the added 330's, I feel AC will next add some 321's perhaps the NEO's for TATL.


I always thought it was a bad move to go all Boeing. While the 787 makes sense, the Max switch made no sense at all. They should have remained with Airbus/BBD for the short and medium haul.


I happen to agree.
 
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ACCS300
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Re: Air Canada will add 4 more A330-300s in 2019

Thu Nov 01, 2018 2:55 pm

Add me to the 'agree' list. Boeing offered the MAX's to AC at a price they couldn't refuse so it made sense in that dept., in all others it seemed to make little sense, adding the NEOs would have continued the fleet commonality and likely would have leveraged better deals from Airbus in the long term. Just my .02
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