cbphoto
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Great Lakes (ZK) suspends operations

Mon Mar 26, 2018 11:16 pm

Just came through the wire that Great Lakes suspended operations today. Their website seems to confirm the news as well.

Never thought I would see the day the proverbial cockroach finally dies. Some will miss it, most wont for sure!
Last edited by cbphoto on Mon Mar 26, 2018 11:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.
ETOPS: Engines Turning or Passengers Swimming
 
32andBelow
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Re: Great Lakes (ZK) seizes operations

Mon Mar 26, 2018 11:20 pm

RIP. Boutique will be happy.
 
RJNUT
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Re: Great Lakes (ZK) seizes operations

Mon Mar 26, 2018 11:23 pm

EveReady Battery of the airline industry. RIP(or not in Peace). WOW! thanks for the update
 
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atcsundevil
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Re: Great Lakes (ZK) suspends operations

Mon Mar 26, 2018 11:24 pm

cbphoto wrote:
Just came through the wire that Great Lakes suspended operations today. Their website seems to confirm the news as well.

Never thought I would see the day the proverbial cockroach finally dies. Some will miss it, most wont for sure!

I am stunned. I thought they'd never die. The fact that they've hung on for about eight years longer than they should have is truly impressive.

RIP Lakes Air.
 
32andBelow
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Re: Great Lakes (ZK) seizes operations

Mon Mar 26, 2018 11:24 pm

RJNUT wrote:
I wonder how the ADI codeshare flights to Pierre and Watertown will be affected. Will have to find a new partner (Silver?)

It says they will still operated under the ZK code for now.
 
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enilria
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Re: Great Lakes (ZK) seizes operations

Mon Mar 26, 2018 11:26 pm

Image
...no wait, we won't.
 
RJNUT
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Re: Great Lakes (ZK) seizes operations

Mon Mar 26, 2018 11:27 pm

I wonder how the ADI codeshare flights to Pierre and Watertown will be affected. Will have to find a new partner (Silver?)
 
RJNUT
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Re: Great Lakes (ZK) seizes operations

Mon Mar 26, 2018 11:35 pm

32andBelow wrote:
RJNUT wrote:
I wonder how the ADI codeshare flights to Pierre and Watertown will be affected. Will have to find a new partner (Silver?)

It says they will still operated under the ZK code for now.

Thanks I just saw the memo on the ZK website. Hah!, they said "suspend" operations in the memo , so hold on folks they may resurrect in some fashion!
 
WA707atMSP
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Re: Great Lakes (ZK) suspends operations

Mon Mar 26, 2018 11:40 pm

Before Great Lakes ran into problems, I had three good flights on them, which enabled me to log seven new airports. My flights were MSP-IWD-IMT-ORD in 2002, LAS-PGA-CNY-DEN in 2011, and MSP-HON-PIR-CDR-DEN in 2012.

I feel badly for the line employees who tried so hard to hold them together...but I also feel badly for all the passengers who suffered because of their unreliability, and the cities whose access to EAS was affected by their woes.
 
WA707atMSP
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Re: Great Lakes (ZK) suspends operations

Mon Mar 26, 2018 11:43 pm

It will be interesting to see if Boutique picks up the DEN-PIR-ATY route, and adds an extension from ATY to MSP. Right now, Boutique's only route from MSP is to TVF; adding a route through ATY and PIR would enable them to bridge aircraft from MSP to the rest of their system.
 
Wingtips56
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Re: Great Lakes (ZK) suspends operations

Mon Mar 26, 2018 11:43 pm

Well CEC dodged a bullet, as ZK was one of the airlines that had applied for the EAS contract after PenAir pulled the plug. On paper it looked good, with flights to SMF in the EMB-120, with interline ticket and baggage agreements, but I knew they'd fail at some point. And here it is: "Ceasing" service.
Worked for WestAir, Apollo Airways, Desert Pacific, Western, AirCal and American Airlines (Retired). Flight Memory: 181 airports, 92 airlines, 78 a/c types, 403 routes, 58 countries (by air), 6 continents. 1,119,414 passenger miles.

Home airport : CEC
 
TripleA
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Re: Great Lakes (ZK) suspends operations

Mon Mar 26, 2018 11:46 pm

I was up at Page, AZ on Friday and I watched one of their flights arrive and depart back to PHX. The inbound flight had 8 passengers, while the outbound had just 1 passenger. I had kept thinking about flying the PHX-PGA route just to experience the Beech 1900. Guess that won't happen now...

Feel bad for the employees
 
wedgetail737
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Re: Great Lakes (ZK) suspends operations

Mon Mar 26, 2018 11:48 pm

I wonder if Key Lime Air will reinstate service through DEN.
 
32andBelow
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Re: Great Lakes (ZK) suspends operations

Mon Mar 26, 2018 11:55 pm

Wingtips56 wrote:
Well CEC dodged a bullet, as ZK was one of the airlines that had applied for the EAS contract after PenAir pulled the plug. On paper it looked good, with flights to SMF in the EMB-120, with interline ticket and baggage agreements, but I knew they'd fail at some point. And here it is: "Ceasing" service.

While true, that alternate EAS is going to be a disaster. Ya'll should have picked boutique.
 
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enilria
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Re: Great Lakes (ZK) suspends operations

Tue Mar 27, 2018 12:11 am

STATEMENT FROM GREAT LAKES

3/26/18
Great Lakes Suspends Scheduled Flight Operations
As a result, at midnight tonight – Monday, 3/26/18, Great Lakes will suspend scheduled flight
operations as an air carrier.
Although we are ceasing flight operations, it is important to note that the company has not
entered bankruptcy and will continue to operate certain segments of the business. We will
continue to support the ADI flights operating between Denver, Pierre and Watertown.
For those customers who are holding tickets on flights on/after 3/27/18, please contact your
original booking source for a refund.

http://www.greatlakesav.com/alerts/Grea ... ations.pdf
 
RJNUT
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Re: Great Lakes (ZK) suspends operations

Tue Mar 27, 2018 12:14 am

Really only Salina passengers will be affected in any great numbers and that isn't saying much,but they get UA Express service next week I believe.
 
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TWA772LR
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Re: Great Lakes (ZK) suspends operations

Tue Mar 27, 2018 12:22 am

I've never flown on Great Lakes, a 1900, or 120; and now that I live in Denver I finally had an excuse to take a joyride with them and now this happens.

Hope to see you in the air again ZK!
When wasn't America great?


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sunking737
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Re: Great Lakes (ZK) suspends operations

Tue Mar 27, 2018 12:47 am

Great Lakes was the cat that ran out of 9 lives. If they do return I hope they have new owners with deep pockets and a new name. How about Braniff 4.0?
"Don't believe it unless its parked on the ramp, or printed in the schedule...SUBJECT TO CHANGE"

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dc10co
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Re: Great Lakes (ZK) suspends operations

Tue Mar 27, 2018 12:54 am

How tragic! I’m currently working on a trip report for my saga with them last week from DEN-LAX via TEX & PRC. Went for a trip down memory lane riding the Brasilia and had a blast! The service (if you could call it that) consisted of Sam’s Club bottled water or something similar to what most call “coffee”. But the crew & every ZK employee I encountered was beyond fantastic and I built up a rapport with the flight attendant. Got some surprising insight that they were down to only FOUR Brasilia pilots company wide which just blew my mind. And something like 6 FAs and a handful of pilots for the Beech 1900. Hopefully they use this time as a restructuring period but it doesn’t look too good.
Listen Betty, don't start up with your white zone shit again.
 
flyboy7974
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Re: Great Lakes (ZK) suspends operations

Tue Mar 27, 2018 12:59 am

How many aircraft were they still flying?
 
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knope2001
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Re: Great Lakes (ZK) suspends operations

Tue Mar 27, 2018 1:01 am

ZK 3026 is just about to land in Salina.
ZK 3042 landing in Page about the same time -- both about 7pm Mountain
ZK 3039 is en route from LAX to Prescott and should land about 7:55pm Mountain

I think that's it.

Probably some repo flights this evening or tomorrow.
Last edited by knope2001 on Tue Mar 27, 2018 1:06 am, edited 1 time in total.
 
axiom
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Re: Great Lakes (ZK) suspends operations

Tue Mar 27, 2018 1:13 am

I also feel like this day has been years in the making. These ZK threads have been a mainstay of my anet experience since I started visiting the forum almost ten years ago. Thoughts with all of their (ex) employees.
 
N766UA
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Re: Great Lakes (ZK) suspends operations

Tue Mar 27, 2018 1:20 am

I’m surprised they made it this far! Last I heard they had 7 pilots. Total.
 
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SQ789
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Re: Great Lakes (ZK) suspends operations

Tue Mar 27, 2018 1:27 am

Sad to see this news. I know that the last fleet was the EMB 120 and it's the last operator in the US to operate that type.
If it's not Boeing, I'm not going!
 
DDR
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Re: Great Lakes (ZK) suspends operations

Tue Mar 27, 2018 1:32 am

Thoughts go out to all the employees. Although we all may work for different companies, we never want to see this happen to anyone.
 
N415XJ
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Re: Great Lakes (ZK) suspends operations

Tue Mar 27, 2018 1:34 am

SQ789 wrote:
Sad to see this news. I know that the last fleet was the EMB 120 and it's the last operator in the US to operate that type.

Doesn't Via Air still operate a couple?
 
dc10co
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Re: Great Lakes (ZK) suspends operations

Tue Mar 27, 2018 1:39 am

N766UA wrote:
I’m surprised they made it this far! Last I heard they had 7 pilots. Total.

They had to have more than that, when I flew them last Thursday they had two simultaneous Brasilia ops plus a few other Beech flights from DEN and also a Beech departure once we arrived in PRC (unsure where it was going). From what I saw it would require at least 10 pilots just to cover ops for that day alone
Listen Betty, don't start up with your white zone shit again.
 
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knope2001
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Re: Great Lakes (ZK) suspends operations

Tue Mar 27, 2018 1:53 am

Looking at their schedule in Denver, once the Salina flight was to end 4/7 the follwing week it looks like they had 12 total departures scheduled. All they had left beyond that were the PHX-PGA and LAX-PRC routes a couple times per day.

From the Wiki page over the years they have served 163 different airports. Pretty amaaing. About 40-ish of those are cities which lost EAS eligiblity.
 
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knope2001
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Re: Great Lakes (ZK) suspends operations

Tue Mar 27, 2018 1:54 am

dc10co wrote:
N766UA wrote:
I’m surprised they made it this far! Last I heard they had 7 pilots. Total.

They had to have more than that, when I flew them last Thursday they had two simultaneous Brasilia ops plus a few other Beech flights from DEN and also a Beech departure once we arrived in PRC (unsure where it was going). From what I saw it would require at least 10 pilots just to cover ops for that day alone


Tonight they had three places in the air at the same time, which is six pilots right there.
Last edited by knope2001 on Tue Mar 27, 2018 1:55 am, edited 1 time in total.
 
wedgetail737
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Re: Great Lakes (ZK) suspends operations

Tue Mar 27, 2018 1:58 am

Any chance QX will return to FLG and Prescott if these two cities provide the money?
 
MO11
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Re: Great Lakes (ZK) suspends operations

Tue Mar 27, 2018 1:59 am

wedgetail737 wrote:
Any chance QX will return to FLG and Prescott if these two cities provide the money?


Maybe if the planes could fly themselves.
 
mtnwest1979
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Re: Great Lakes (ZK) suspends operations

Tue Mar 27, 2018 2:09 am

Too bad but certainly not a shock. Only flew them DEN-PIR and back a few years ago. Was a nice ride and folks were good.
Just wandered to their new gate area in DEN (A80-ish) and was a small group getting set for SLN.
I personally think that this will be the end of line for scheduled Prescott service. As much as some may want it, just too easy to use PHX IMO.
Cheyenne may have a real difficult time to find any replacement, seeing as it is too close to DEN for EAS rules (IIRC) and have basically been without for awhile anyway as far as most there probably are concerned. I still feel a CYS-SLC could work, but assume that'd wait until SLC changes are closer to completion.
Or an AA CYS-ORD. I doubt they would try CYS-DFW again, unless the $$ was there for the taking.
Riddle: Which lasts longer, a start-up airline or a start-up football league?
 
FlyingElvii
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Re: Great Lakes (ZK) suspends operations

Tue Mar 27, 2018 2:16 am

cbphoto wrote:
Just came through the wire that Great Lakes suspended operations today. Their website seems to confirm the news as well.

Never thought I would see the day the proverbial cockroach finally dies. Some will miss it, most wont for sure!



A merciful death, sadly...
They are a long way from the heady days of all of those UA codeshare runs in ORD and Den.
 
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hOMSaR
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Re: Great Lakes (ZK) suspends operations

Tue Mar 27, 2018 2:25 am

MO11 wrote:
wedgetail737 wrote:
Any chance QX will return to FLG and Prescott if these two cities provide the money?


Maybe if the planes could fly themselves.


Well, you’ve got 7 (or 10 or whatever) pilots available for hire.
The plural of Airbus is Airbuses. Airbii is not a word.
There is no 787-800, nor 787-900 or 747-800. It's 787-8, 787-9, and 747-8.
A321neoLR is also unnecessary. It's simply A321LR.
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Chuska
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Re: Great Lakes (ZK) suspends operations

Tue Mar 27, 2018 2:37 am

Great Lakes was a super power of commuter airlines through the 1990's operating as United Express and, for a short time, as Midway Connection. But they never went beyond the Brasilia, never ordered RJ's like SkyWest, Mesa, and others that are going strong today. Check out the Wikipedia website for Great Lakes Airlines Destinations, over 160 cities have been served. They did a heck of a lot for the industry and I sure dreaded to see this day.
 
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SQ789
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Re: Great Lakes (ZK) suspends operations

Tue Mar 27, 2018 2:48 am

N415XJ wrote:
Doesn't Via Air still operate a couple?

Via still operate 2 of the E120. Sorry that I don't know about this airline. Anyway, Great Lakes now only operates 6 EMB 120 prior to end of operations.
If it's not Boeing, I'm not going!
 
910A
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Re: Great Lakes (ZK) suspends operations

Tue Mar 27, 2018 2:50 am

Wingtips56 wrote:
Well CEC dodged a bullet, as ZK was one of the airlines that had applied for the EAS contract after PenAir pulled the plug. On paper it looked good, with flights to SMF in the EMB-120, with interline ticket and baggage agreements, but I knew they'd fail at some point. And here it is: "Ceasing" service.


Sorry you're mistaken. The proposal was for two B-1900 flights a day.
Great Lakes Aviation, Ltd.
Annual Compensation Requirements for Essential Air Service at
Crescent City, California to Sacramento (SMF) Two Round Trips - B1900

Taken from the flycrescentcity.com web site.

32andBelow wrote:
[
While true, that alternate EAS is going to be a disaster. Ya'll should have picked boutique.


I don't understand how Contour will make money with the plane sitting at OAK for eight hours a day. I understand the first few flights are sold out.
 
drdisque
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Re: Great Lakes (ZK) suspends operations

Tue Mar 27, 2018 2:55 am

My experience with them was that when I was little my dad flew them on DTW-TVC. I had never heard of them before, but I liked their logo. He had to check in at the AA desk in DTW, where there wasn't even a sign for Great Lakes and they departed from the lower level concourse A gate in the Smith Terminal (that was last used by the AA ERJ flights to LGA and JFK before the closure of the terminal), I'm sure it was used for lots of small commuter operations over the 50+ years of the Smith Terminal.

It was so odd of them to take on NW/Mesaba on such a stronghold route like DTW-TVC.
 
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nuke
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Re: Great Lakes (ZK) suspends operations

Tue Mar 27, 2018 2:57 am

Good riddance.
Dependable Engines.
 
MO11
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Re: Great Lakes (ZK) suspends operations

Tue Mar 27, 2018 3:05 am

910A wrote:

I don't understand how Contour will make money with the plane sitting at OAK for eight hours a day. I understand the first few flights are sold out.


Border Coast Regional Airport Authority is the one that needs to worry about filling planes. It is chartering the aircraft from Contour, so Contour should have figured out how much it would take to run that schedule, and passed the appropriate cost on to the Authority. And moving the airplanes between Crescent City and Smyrna for maintenance would have to be a somewhat extraordinary expense.
 
RJNUT
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Re: Great Lakes (ZK) suspends operations

Tue Mar 27, 2018 4:00 am

drdisque wrote:
My experience with them was that when I was little my dad flew them on DTW-TVC. I had never heard of them before, but I liked their logo. He had to check in at the AA desk in DTW, where there wasn't even a sign for Great Lakes and they departed from the lower level concourse A gate in the Smith Terminal (that was last used by the AA ERJ flights to LGA and JFK before the closure of the terminal), I'm sure it was used for lots of small commuter operations over the 50+ years of the Smith Terminal.

It was so odd of them to take on NW/Mesaba on such a stronghold route like DTW-TVC.


I flew them in 1991 TVC-LAN-DTW! then connected onward to Pan Am DTW-LHR.
 
F9Animal
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Re: Great Lakes (ZK) suspends operations

Tue Mar 27, 2018 4:04 am

What a sad ending. I really hoped they would have survived. They missed alot of opportunity through the years. I hope the employees will be able to find work soon.

Maybe they can restructure since they are not in bankruptcy?
I Am A Different Animal!!
 
AntonioMartin
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Re: Great Lakes (ZK) suspends operations

Tue Mar 27, 2018 9:52 am

Wow..didnt see that coming! Wonder who will take Great Lakes' extensive service from Phoenix to outer Arizona cities such as Prescott and Show Low, or if they too will be laid to rest alongside Great Lakes.

Although not a major airline, Great Lakes was a presence for many years-decades actually, becoming a legend of its own, specially in the commuter airline world. RIP GLA!
 
QXAS
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Re: Great Lakes (ZK) suspends operations

Tue Mar 27, 2018 9:59 am

Well this is a shame. I use them to get home from school in Prescott because I hate taking the shuttle to Phoenix. Connecting in LAX was so easy because they used T6 and I fly AS exclusively between LAX and SEA. Sad to see them go. Crossing my fingers QX brings back the LAX-PRC-FLG tag. Coincidentally my first ever QX flight was when they were introducing that flight. It was on the magazine cover. I was on the Portland shuttle that day. Thought nothing of it. Now I’m hoping they bring it back. But it’s more for convinience than anything. It’s certainly not “essential”.
I am NOT an employee of any airline or manufacturer. I speak for myself, not on the behalf of any company.
 
AntonioMartin
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Re: Great Lakes (ZK) suspends operations

Tue Mar 27, 2018 9:59 am

enilria wrote:
STATEMENT FROM GREAT LAKES
ADI flights operating between Denver, Pierre and Watertown.


http://www.greatlakesav.com/alerts/Grea ... ations.pdf

What's an 'ADI' flight?
 
32andBelow
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Re: Great Lakes (ZK) suspends operations

Tue Mar 27, 2018 11:08 am

AntonioMartin wrote:
enilria wrote:
STATEMENT FROM GREAT LAKES
ADI flights operating between Denver, Pierre and Watertown.


http://www.greatlakesav.com/alerts/Grea ... ations.pdf

What's an 'ADI' flight?

Aerodynamics inc. they are another bad airline that basically files their flights under ZK code so they are listed in the GDS.
 
32andBelow
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Re: Great Lakes (ZK) suspends operations

Tue Mar 27, 2018 11:11 am

MO11 wrote:
910A wrote:

I don't understand how Contour will make money with the plane sitting at OAK for eight hours a day. I understand the first few flights are sold out.


Border Coast Regional Airport Authority is the one that needs to worry about filling planes. It is chartering the aircraft from Contour, so Contour should have figured out how much it would take to run that schedule, and passed the appropriate cost on to the Authority. And moving the airplanes between Crescent City and Smyrna for maintenance would have to be a somewhat extraordinary expense.

Then you are in Oakland with no code shares. Please. Everyone will continue to use ACV.
 
AntonioMartin
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Re: Great Lakes (ZK) suspends operations

Tue Mar 27, 2018 11:32 am

32andBelow wrote:
AntonioMartin wrote:
enilria wrote:
STATEMENT FROM GREAT LAKES
ADI flights operating between Denver, Pierre and Watertown.


http://www.greatlakesav.com/alerts/Grea ... ations.pdf

What's an 'ADI' flight?

Aerodynamics inc. they are another bad airline that basically files their flights under ZK code so they are listed in the GDS.

hmmnnn interesting...Thanks for the answer!!
 
jetstream3399
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Re: Great Lakes (ZK) suspends operations

Tue Mar 27, 2018 1:05 pm

32andBelow wrote:
MO11 wrote:
910A wrote:

I don't understand how Contour will make money with the plane sitting at OAK for eight hours a day. I understand the first few flights are sold out.


Border Coast Regional Airport Authority is the one that needs to worry about filling planes. It is chartering the aircraft from Contour, so Contour should have figured out how much it would take to run that schedule, and passed the appropriate cost on to the Authority. And moving the airplanes between Crescent City and Smyrna for maintenance would have to be a somewhat extraordinary expense.

Then you are in Oakland with no code shares. Please. Everyone will continue to use ACV.


The service is actually doing extremely well - booked to over a 50% load factor in April already and with 30+ more days to continue to add traffic. I don't know that this is the best option for connecting travelers but for local O&D to the Bay Area, of which there is plenty from the region, this represents a welcome change from the $300+ one way fares that United has been charging from ACV and MFR. In fact, the newspaper article that came out shortly after tickets went on sale quoted one of the first passengers that booked as from ACV and willing to drive just to to CEC just to save the extra money. Say what you will about Contour but their TUP-BNA service runs about 80% full and MCN-BWI runs about 70% full on a 30-seat ERJ with twice daily service. Filling a 30-seat ERJ with an inexpensive daily flight should not be particularly difficult since the traffic study that was done actually showed the Bay Area as the largest traffic market from the CEC area.
 
wjuddsonk
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Re: Great Lakes (ZK) suspends operations

Tue Mar 27, 2018 1:13 pm

It's a sad day that anyone loses their job in aviation and an airline dies.

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