Noise wrote:

Will this new livery be featured on the rest of the fleet as well?

Yes. Debut on 7M8 in the next few weeks and repaints through regular mx cycle for rest of fleet.

Good re-fresh. Nothing too crazy and moves them into the 21st century in terms of design language.

Westjet sure needs a little more presence being known as a "Canadian" airline. Was just in HNL and when Westjet was called for my stop, almost all confused faces around with some muttering "Westjet? Where is that from?"

Anyone else think the "Spirit of Canada" kind of reminds them of how ANA took to identifying themselves as a Japanese Airline by using "Inspiration of Japan".

WestJet plunges the most in two years as costs of Swoop and overseas expansion mount

Quote:

WestJet Airlines Ltd. dropped the most in more than two years after it said increased spending to create a new low-cost unit and expand overseas will vastly exceed revenue growth.

Costs for each seat flown a mile, excluding fuel and employee profit sharing, will climb as much as 8.5 per cent this quarter, Canada’s second-biggest carrier carrier said Tuesday. WestJet forecast that revenue on the same basis could drop as much as 2 per cent.
...

Acey wrote:

"Qantas North"

First thoughts....

Tail looks pretty good. Big upgrade from the current iteration. I like it.

Font of WESTJET looks god awfully cheap.

The new tag line is totally blah. Nothing hair raising or patriotic about it.

1 for 3. Though I will admit that I didn’t particularly like the new AC livery when it first debuted.

Well I didn’t like AC’s new livery for the first day it was out nor do I like this one today, but I don’t think I’ll like this one tomorrow like I did with AC. It’s still teal, the logo is very poorly placed on the tail as it gets cut up in a strange way, and they decided to do a stupid thing and conveniently unveil it on the same day the pilots are picketing. Are labour disputes really the spirit of Canada?

Looks like a legacy product. With that the pilots should attain a legacy contract. Good luck to them I hope they secure an industry leading contract.

Their current agreement is pure Mickey Mouse. With that beautiful new airplane and it’s new paint, premium forward cabin, the people in the flight deck had best be treated the same.

Welcome to the real word Clive you’ve hoodwinked em long enough.

I do rather wish they’d come up with something other than “The Spirit Of Canada”. I liked what ANA did with “Inspiration of JAPAN” which I assume was intended to make clear where they were from for those who didn’t know. Hopefully someone consults a thesaurus and it can be replaced with something else that mentions Canada.

EDIT: teriyaki beat me to it.

Ratings:

Interior A- (current 763 is D)
Exterior C (current is B)

Inside it looks very very good... but that paint scheme I am very disappointed with... why change the font? The current one is distinctive and effective, this new one is boring and indistinct. Also they should of kept the Mapleleaf/arrow logo on the fuselage not just the tail. "Spirit of Canada" does smack of QANTAS and "The Spirit of Australia" a bit much, especially with the font looking much more like theirs. I will wait to see it in person, but my impression stands for now.

Livery is a huge step up for the current one which is dated and bland looking. Very fresh. Love the new font and larger titles.

Not sure about "The Spirit of Canada" - it's a straight rip off from Qantas "Spirit of Australia". They could have done something else, Proudly Canadian like they do right now or Distinctly Canadian which I'm seeing at some places. They are clearly aware that the "Westjet" name alone is not recognizable outside Canada, I guess that's why they moved the flag upfront also.


The interior product is top notch. Truly amazing. Y class looks much better than AC.

[photoid][/photoid]

767333ER wrote:

Well I didn’t like AC’s new livery for the first day it was out nor do I like this one today, but I don’t think I’ll like this one tomorrow like I did with AC. It’s still teal, the logo is very poorly placed on the tail as it gets cut up in a strange way, and they decided to do a stupid thing and conveniently unveil it on the same day the pilots are picketing. Are labour disputes really the spirit of Canada?

I think you got that the wrong way around. ALPA made the choice to picket the event.

This is a refreshing change from the drab widget. However, to me, it looks like Air Canada's silver sky livery (what some of you called "toothpaste") mated with Air Transat's new livery and produced this new Westjet.

I really like it!

I love the new Livery. It retains elements of the “old” Westjet while encompassing the Maple leaf in a new livery. I wish they would have had an element of red on the leaf but that would have been AC... I love it!

Though I still prefer the new AC livery, I do like the WestJet refresh. I find the ‘Westjet’ a tad high on the fuselage though.

The ‘Spirit of Canada’ is kind of hokey. I’m certain it was chosen to ensure people outside of Canada know where WestJet is from.

49Paralell wrote:

I love the new Livery. It retains elements of the “old” Westjet while encompassing the Maple leaf in a new livery. I wish they would have had an element of red on the leaf but that would have been AC... I love it!

Are you aware that you misspelled your username?

Goes to show how many ex-CP management are hard at work at WS these days.

The updated logo and livery was designed by the same company that designed the initial Canadian Airlines International logo, back in 1987. Saretsky's legacy will live on for decades

https://www.skiesmag.com/press-releases ... ada-world/

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_NAVmt72iYSM/S0f9hjQ_gjI/AAAAAAAACqU/2DjlmwZfj5Q/s1600-h/scan0016.jpg

Looks stunning! I think they have done a great brand refresh, and the interiors do look good.

Saludos,
Alex

I’m getting shades of the recent Alaska rebrand looking at this, which isn’t a bad thing! I wish the new “pixelated” or “textured” maple leaf was more prominent on the exterior of the plane, and perhaps maybe an outline on the Westjet titles... but all together this looks good inside and out!

I'm waiting to see a real plane painted like that, but so far I like it. A positive and nice evolution of their livery. I like the extended use of teal, including on the engines.

I love it- except for Spririt of Canada, too close to QF there sorry. Did they refresh the uniforms at all?

Could we see them in OneWorld one day? That would no doubt support their appeal to business travellers and some decent feed too from the likes of AA,CX,BA,QR

¿dESTINATIONS OF THE wESTJET B787 ?

I’m not a fan of the livery, but the interior product looks great! Very nice layout and colour scheme. I’m looking forward to seeing it in person.

I still have a lot of questions about what exactly WestJet is going to do with these planes. They’ve built their entire brand on being a discount airline, so a transition to a full service carrier will be a long road and in my mind is a very confusing strategy. They’ll need to completely overhaul their domestic fleet to match their international offering in that case, and I doubt they’ll be able to offer any deep discount fares with the kind of product that it looks like they’ll be offering on the 787. Are they trying to be a friendly, low cost airline and also a sophisticated full-service premium carrier at the same time? I don’t get it.

Their competitor, Air Canada, has a long established and wide-reaching international route network, with an extensive domestic and transborder network with high frequencies to back it up. They also have the Maple Leaf Lounges, and are upping their game with the Signature Suite at YYZ among other premium service upgrades for their premium passengers. Their economy and premium economy products are solid, and they enjoy a well known brand recognition worldwide.

I’m hoping that WestJet can offer some true competition to AC. I’ve got no doubt that they have the “know-how” to do it, but whether they have the money, brand recognition, or the commercial ability to get those premium passengers into their planes is questionable. One thing for sure is that they definitely have a huge fight on their hands, not just from AC but from the many international carriers already operating in Canada who also want those premium passengers. I wish WestJet the best of luck and am really interested to see what happens with this. Exciting times for aviation in Canada!

worldranger wrote:

YVR-DXB with EK code share onwards would be ineteresting

I feel that's a non-starter for now. The UAE-Canada bilateral is limited a 6x/week per side. AC already uses 3x a week on YYZ-DXB and that can of worms is not being opened up for renegotiation any time soon. There's probably much bigger fish to fry in the short term.

YOWza

That tail isn’t gorgeous but IMHO the lettering is strange.
Super Diamond J, that same W all the US3 use, and Y that kind of looks like Qatar’s?
I do like the Y seat coverings.

If WS is going to continue with their global expansion, I still think they need to do two things:
1) Get rid of the WestJet name. It's too regional and, to those unfamiliar with the airline, there's nothing in the name itself that would suggest that this airline is from Canada. What the heck is a "WestJet" anyway?
2) The logo: that Rocky Mountain thing needs to go. Again, it makes the airline look too regional and amateurish.

The green/teal can stay. In fact, the green allows it to differentiate itself from Air Canada, which has adopted a White, Red and Black color scheme.

We've seen airlines rebrand themselves in the past and it has worked. Piedmont became USAir which became US Airways. Virgin Blue became Virgin Australia, BWIA became Caribbean Airlines, And Lan/TAM became LATAM.

Yes, the misspell was on purpose!

smi0006 wrote:

I love it- except for Spririt of Canada, too close to QF there sorry. Did they refresh the uniforms at all?

Could we see them in OneWorld one day? That would no doubt support their appeal to business travellers and some decent feed too from the likes of AA,CX,BA,QR

I think they are aligning themselves with skyteam rather than oneworld.

I personally would have liked to see oneworld as well

I wonder why they're going the full-service approach when the future of long-haul seem to point towards LCCs. I doubt they have the scale to pull off the yields needed to justify the J seats.

Congrats Westjet! Very nice onboard product!

KLSMB wrote:

I’m not a fan of the livery, but the interior product looks great! Very nice layout and colour scheme. I’m looking forward to seeing it in person.

I still have a lot of questions about what exactly WestJet is going to do with these planes. They’ve built their entire brand on being a discount airline, so a transition to a full service carrier will be a long road and in my mind is a very confusing strategy. They’ll need to completely overhaul their domestic fleet to match their international offering in that case, and I doubt they’ll be able to offer any deep discount fares with the kind of product that it looks like they’ll be offering on the 787. Are they trying to be a friendly, low cost airline and also a sophisticated full-service premium carrier at the same time? I don’t get it.

Their competitor, Air Canada, has a long established and wide-reaching international route network, with an extensive domestic and transborder network with high frequencies to back it up. They also have the Maple Leaf Lounges, and are upping their game with the Signature Suite at YYZ among other premium service upgrades for their premium passengers. Their economy and premium economy products are solid, and they enjoy a well known brand recognition worldwide.

I’m hoping that WestJet can offer some true competition to AC. I’ve got no doubt that they have the “know-how” to do it, but whether they have the money, brand recognition, or the commercial ability to get those premium passengers into their planes is questionable. One thing for sure is that they definitely have a huge fight on their hands, not just from AC but from the many international carriers already operating in Canada who also want those premium passengers. I wish WestJet the best of luck and am really interested to see what happens with this. Exciting times for aviation in Canada!

Thomaas wrote:

I wonder why they're going the full-service approach when the future of long-haul seem to point towards LCCs. I doubt they have the scale to pull off the yields needed to justify the J seats.

Noise wrote:

If WS is going to continue with their global expansion, I still think they need to do two things:
1) Get rid of the WestJet name. It's too regional and, to those unfamiliar with the airline, there's nothing in the name itself that would suggest that this airline is from Canada. What the heck is a "WestJet" anyway?
2) The logo: that Rocky Mountain thing needs to go. Again, it makes the airline look too regional and amateurish.

WestJet stopped being WestJet years ago, they've been slowly evolving over their life. Airlines need to expand, WestJet has pretty much covered Canada and the Sun Destinations - there's no where else to go but overseas.

Air Canada is broadening its market share from a full fledged legacy carrier by switching around some of its product to their LCC division as demand and markets dictate, WS is doing the same thing albeit the other way around. This puts both carriers into a great position as they'll be able to switch around aircraft on to routes where and when the market calls for it. Swoop will eventually take over some of the sun destinations and honestly, it wouldn't surprise me if the 767s end up over there and they start offering a lower fare alternative to some overseas destinations. WS definitely has a very long road ahead of them, and there's no doubt they're still having growing pains but they'll be able to pull it off.

As a very frequent flyer with WS, mainly Plus fares - I can assure you that many don't fly WS simply because of the lack of their more high end product including its loyalty program and cabin class. WestJet is loosing money to the competition and they want a piece of the pie.

As for the name? No one cares if WestJet isn't instantly recognizable as a Canadian airline. Nobody here cares that they don't know Lufthansa is German, Qantas is Australian, Cathy Pacific is Hong Kong, KLM is dutch, etc. The name hasn't crippled their expansion into Eastern Canada (YYZ now being their largest hub). Most passengers don't care about the name, its the product and value that is the best advertising.

WestJet has a very long and strong following, to change that name would be silly. It took them 20 years to achieve what they have today and to throw that name away because some people think its too "regional" for a global airline is simply ridiculous.

ACDC8 wrote:

KLSMB wrote:

I’m not a fan of the livery, but the interior product looks great! Very nice layout and colour scheme. I’m looking forward to seeing it in person.

I still have a lot of questions about what exactly WestJet is going to do with these planes. They’ve built their entire brand on being a discount airline, so a transition to a full service carrier will be a long road and in my mind is a very confusing strategy. They’ll need to completely overhaul their domestic fleet to match their international offering in that case, and I doubt they’ll be able to offer any deep discount fares with the kind of product that it looks like they’ll be offering on the 787. Are they trying to be a friendly, low cost airline and also a sophisticated full-service premium carrier at the same time? I don’t get it.

Their competitor, Air Canada, has a long established and wide-reaching international route network, with an extensive domestic and transborder network with high frequencies to back it up. They also have the Maple Leaf Lounges, and are upping their game with the Signature Suite at YYZ among other premium service upgrades for their premium passengers. Their economy and premium economy products are solid, and they enjoy a well known brand recognition worldwide.

I’m hoping that WestJet can offer some true competition to AC. I’ve got no doubt that they have the “know-how” to do it, but whether they have the money, brand recognition, or the commercial ability to get those premium passengers into their planes is questionable. One thing for sure is that they definitely have a huge fight on their hands, not just from AC but from the many international carriers already operating in Canada who also want those premium passengers. I wish WestJet the best of luck and am really interested to see what happens with this. Exciting times for aviation in Canada!

Thomaas wrote:

I wonder why they're going the full-service approach when the future of long-haul seem to point towards LCCs. I doubt they have the scale to pull off the yields needed to justify the J seats.

Noise wrote:

If WS is going to continue with their global expansion, I still think they need to do two things:
1) Get rid of the WestJet name. It's too regional and, to those unfamiliar with the airline, there's nothing in the name itself that would suggest that this airline is from Canada. What the heck is a "WestJet" anyway?
2) The logo: that Rocky Mountain thing needs to go. Again, it makes the airline look too regional and amateurish.

WestJet stopped being WestJet years ago, they've been slowly evolving over their life. Airlines need to expand, WestJet has pretty much covered Canada and the Sun Destinations - there's no where else to go but overseas.

Air Canada is broadening its market share from a full fledged legacy carrier by switching around some of its product to their LCC division as demand and markets dictate, WS is doing the same thing albeit the other way around. This puts both carriers into a great position as they'll be able to switch around aircraft on to routes where and when the market calls for it. Swoop will eventually take over some of the sun destinations and honestly, it wouldn't surprise me if the 767s end up over there and they start offering a lower fare alternative to some overseas destinations. WS definitely has a very long road ahead of them, and there's no doubt they're still having growing pains but they'll be able to pull it off.

As a very frequent flyer with WS, mainly Plus fares - I can assure you that many don't fly WS simply because of the lack of their more high end product including its loyalty program and cabin class. WestJet is loosing money to the competition and they want a piece of the pie.

As for the name? No one cares if WestJet isn't instantly recognizable as a Canadian airline. Nobody here cares that they don't know Lufthansa is German, Qantas is Australian, Cathy Pacific is Hong Kong, KLM is dutch, etc. The name hasn't crippled their expansion into Eastern Canada (YYZ now being their largest hub). Most passengers don't care about the name, its the product and value that is the best advertising.

WestJet has a very long and strong following, to change that name would be silly. It took them 20 years to achieve what they have today and to throw that name away because some people think its too "regional" for a global airline is simply ridiculous.

I agree!

Love the interior on this plane. Great inviting and soothing colors and beautiful business and premium economy sections. Great job!

It’s no secret that they have been planning this trajectory for a while, and it’s going to continue. They have lounges coming at YYZ, YYC, and YVR very soon, firm details on timelines are likely to come this month. The renderings look really good, open concept, very “westjet” if you know what I mean. They suit the style well. They are available in some of their publications.

The 737s will be getting a proper J product to replace plus, but details on that are still very few amd far between. It was only decided that it would happen very recently, so I would expect a few months lead time at very least before any announcement, and likely won’t enter service until after the 787 if I were to speculate.

It’s a big step, but the timing is good. Canada is incredibly strong right now in the aviation sector, YYZ, YYC, YVR, and YUL have all been posting strong growth, and likely will continue. That will help yield by shifting th supply and demand curve in their favour. AC has been doing incredibly well with their J cabins lately, posting huge increases in ridership, yield and revenue, so it stands to reason WS should be able to tap into that, especially with their partnership with Delta.

teriyaki wrote:

Anyone else think the "Spirit of Canada" kind of reminds them of how ANA took to identifying themselves as a Japanese Airline by using "Inspiration of Japan".

To me, the Spirit of Canada will always be Canadian Club.

Noise wrote:

If WS is going to continue with their global expansion, I still think they need to do two things:
1) Get rid of the WestJet name. It's too regional and, to those unfamiliar with the airline, there's nothing in the name itself that would suggest that this airline is from Canada. What the heck is a "WestJet" anyway?
2) The logo: that Rocky Mountain thing needs to go. Again, it makes the airline look too regional and amateurish.

The green/teal can stay. In fact, the green allows it to differentiate itself from Air Canada, which has adopted a White, Red and Black color scheme.

We've seen airlines rebrand themselves in the past and it has worked. Piedmont became USAir which became US Airways. Virgin Blue became Virgin Australia, BWIA became Caribbean Airlines, And Lan/TAM became LATAM.

1. Everyone that matters to Westjet in Canada knows who and what Westjet is - that is a massive brand value that should not be dismissed so readily. Presents some brand recognition risks outside Canada but there are better ways of handling that than a name change.

2. Logos, liveries, are for places like airliners.net - as long as they are recognized with the brand they fall well down the significance scale when compared to the #1 factor which is price and several other factors that would overshadow any logo redesign.

It’s funny how wrong some long held theories turn out to be when someone rebels. Virgin Atlantic of course serves a host of non Atlantic destinations. Northwest Orient began to lose some of it’s lustre when they dropped the suffix, but the best example is “Norwegian” who fly many thousands of passengers out of the UK on long haul to the US. Nowadays most of the non avgeek market use price comparison sites and find a good deal, regional naming doesn’t make a bit of difference in reality. In fact hanging onto a brand you build up successfully seems to just add kudos and return business regardless of the naming convention.

Love the new Westjet livery, a nice evolution.

Love everything except the “Spirit of Canada” rubbish. Do they really think by ripping this off another airline it’s going to make people feel warm and fuzzy? Totally pretentious.

tonystan wrote:

Love everything except the “Spirit of Canada” rubbish. Do they really think by ripping this off another airline it’s going to make people feel warm and fuzzy? Totally pretentious.

While people keep mentioning Qantas ... don't forget that in 2008, Qantas stole "You can't beat the experience" from Pan American. Also, Canadian North (when it was a marketing name of Canadian Airlines) named their aircraft "Spirit of ..." after northern cities. Maybe it's just the same 10 people doing marketing for every airline

What I most curious about, is how Westjet will handle the bilingual translation. I understand that "L'Esprit du Canada" will adorn the starboard side of the aircraft. But, will that be the same on every aircraft?

I recall in the mid 1980s, CP Air became Canadian Pacific (again). The translation "Canadien Pacifique" was on the other side of the aircraft. Just in case one side was considered more prominant than the other, the english/french titles alternated by aircraft. With French language laws still in effect in Quebec, I could see this becoming the PR nightmare CP was trying to avoid.

Dominion301 wrote:

It's a cool tail with the same old WestJet Eurowhite fuselage. Medicore rebrand at best.

Bland, but it's a lot more "balanced" compared to Air Canada "the mask"

boeing767300 wrote:

There is no doubt in my mind that they will fall flat on their face with the overseas routes. Air Canada and the other legacies will essentially "eat their lunch" on any routes that they decide to dabble in. I had hoped that Sims would return the airline to some sort of reality and bring it back to its roots. Dropping Swoop and making peace with the pilots would have been a good start. From there he could have reached a Rouge type of agreement with the pilots so as to achieve low cost competiveness. Negotiating with Boeing to replace the 787s with MAX 737s would have been a logical next step. As per Southwest they would have fleet standardization and would only fly where the 737 could take them. Having been around western Canada for forty years and I have seen a lot of carriers come and go. That said it was a great time when Westjet came into being and became a successful 737 airline as per Southwest. Now it is a toxic place to work and under the leadership of a total outsider who has no clue about how to run an airline from western Canada. The toxicity will intensify on May 8th as ALPA has organized a picket at the AGM and all picketers have been told to wear their uniforms. The backdrop to all of this is the ongoing strike vote that is happening and the $2,000.000.00 strike fund that ALPA has transferred to the WS ALPA committee. Very sad indeed and a long ways from the little airline that could.

I totally agree...they are moving away from the formula that initially brought them success. Carriers that try to be all things to all people usually fall flat on their face.

longhauler wrote:

tonystan wrote:

What I most curious about, is how Westjet will handle the bilingual translation. I understand that "L'Esprit du Canada" will adorn the starboard side of the aircraft. But, will that be the same on every aircraft?

In all honesty they could just stick to painting the French line on their 737s and Q400’s if it’s not something that’s mandated by law. The 789 will never fly to YUL since it is a non hub city in their network and one they just can’t seem to grow in for whatever reason.

If WestJet runs into trouble. And I mean long term trouble, not a hiccup as I predict this to be. It won’t be long haul. It’ll be Swoop. That whole thing is a headache and won’t do a thing for them.

It makes no sense and it’s divisive to the employee group.

The whole French thing is nonsense too. They branded themselves western, outgrew what the west could provide. And are now chasing the Francophone dollar. Some French on the airplane and taped French announcements aren’t fooling anyone.

sixtyseven wrote:

The whole French thing is nonsense too. They branded themselves western, outgrew what the west could provide. And are now chasing the Francophone dollar. Some French on the airplane and taped French announcements aren’t fooling anyone.

Well let’s not forget in outgrowing the “Western” focus they are now chasing the UK market and have suggested they’re going after the Chinese market so why should French Canada be any more foreign that they can’t get a grasp on it? It’s telling and sad they can’t succeed in Canada second largest city because the competion (AC) is too engrained or they don’t grasp the subtleties of the Quebec market or language...so it strikes me they are really just de facto English Canada’s Airline no matter how much French they put in their planes, if anything it would probably benefit them more if they added Manadrin and/or Cantonese on the 789 instead so they could strengthen their Vancouver base and future Asian routes.

The livery is sort of growing on me, but I don't think I'll ever be able to ignore the straight up rip off of Qantas with "The Spirit of"... They could've easily stuck with "proudly Canadian" as previously mentioned. The Westjet titles are in an awkward position too. I think it would look better if the titles were enlarged ever so slightly downwards for more width and towards the rear for more length if that makes sense. It's just too much empty white space in contrast with the tail in my opinion. The livery (overall) looks more unique compared to AC. I really love the new AC livery, but I have to admit that it's almost impossible to tell them apart from Delta until the plane is right in front of you.

The new interiors look fantastic and I can't wait to try it out! It will be interesting to see how their in-flight service adapts to the new full service business model. Westjet staff are known for being bubbly and funny; often throwing jokes left and right on the PA, which is nice (in moderation), but not what one expects on a full service carrier. If they can maintain the friendliness, but in a much more professional manner, I think they'll be set. I'm also curious as to what their on-board menu's will look like and if they'll launch their own lounges at their hubs and international focus cities like AC does with LHR, FRA, etc..

Also can't ignore the fact that the pilots don't have a contract yet. I hope that WS management will make some time to sit down with the pilot union and have some meaningful discussions towards an agreement. Nobody wants a strike to happen.

tonystan wrote:

Love everything except the “Spirit of Canada” rubbish. Do they really think by ripping this off another airline it’s going to make people feel warm and fuzzy? Totally pretentious.

Pretentious? Really?

Do you honesty think that most people are coming up with the notion that an airline "ripped" off something that no one notices but a handful of aviation nerds? Come on, lets get real here. Nobody cares because nobody pays attention nor do they care if an airline uses a similar catch phrase or slogans (and FYI, Qantas is hardly the first carrier to use "Spirit of ..." .

I like the "Spirit of Canada", its fitting and hints to our Country's Indigenous Heritage - its a nice touch.

I think the tail colours will look brilliant in actual sunlight and really pop.

The attached article with CBC (Canadian Broadcasting Corporation) outlines how hungry they are for global travelers. But the fact they didn't change their name, to me, reflects that they are most focusing on Canadian travelers who already know them.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/business/westjet ... -1.4629300

sixtyseven wrote:

If WestJet runs into trouble. And I mean long term trouble, not a hiccup as I predict this to be. It won’t be long haul. It’ll be Swoop. That whole thing is a headache and won’t do a thing for them.

Isn't that what everyone said about Rouge? Seems to be working pretty good for AC. I can see Swoop taking over some of the Sun Destinations in off season when loads are down and starting new routes and slowly build them up before mainline takes over - wouldn't shock me to see the 767s eventually go on over to Swoop in the coming years.

Jawaiiansky66 wrote:

I totally agree...they are moving away from the formula that initially brought them success. Carriers that try to be all things to all people usually fall flat on their face.

I disagree. As mentioned before, they've moved away from their initial model years ago, they've evolved and they will continue to evolve. Canada is very different than other countries, especially the US - there is only so much you can do to expand, and WS has reached that years ago - the only way to go international, and Canadians are looking for more options, and not just cheap options, but high end products as well. There is no doubt in my mind that WS will be extremely successful in this endeavour.

ACDC8 wrote:

Jawaiiansky66 wrote:

I totally agree...they are moving away from the formula that initially brought them success. Carriers that try to be all things to all people usually fall flat on their face.

I disagree. As mentioned before, they've moved away from their initial model years ago, they've evolved and they will continue to evolve. Canada is very different than other countries, especially the US - there is only so much you can do to expand, and WS has reached that years ago - the only way to go international, and Canadians are looking for more options, and not just cheap options, but high end products as well. There is no doubt in my mind that WS will be extremely successful in this endeavour.

I'm curious though - is there any other country as small as Canada (~36 million) that has two major airlines with complete networks of international service?

When two full-fledged international airlines existed in Canada, there was barely enough traffic to keep each solvent.

I guess Australia would have Virgin Australia and Qantas/Jetstar. South Korea might be another one that's close (Korean and Asiana). I'm legitimately curious if someone could think of another country that could be comparable.

wave46 wrote:

When two full-fledged international airlines existed in Canada, there was barely enough traffic to keep each solvent.

Times have changed since then - the market has changed since then. 20 years ago, Canadian airports processed some 75 million passengers, today its around 120 million.