According to this source , Westjet’s international product will aim to have a legacy carrier feel. Interesting to note , it is revealed they will have 24 premium economy seats , also worth noting they have rebranded “plus”to “premium
economy”it appears.

http://atwonline.com/blog/westjet-ceo-not-norwegian

Very interesting choice of words.

Trying to be like the legacies is probably a negative thing because Norwegian's product blows the doors off anything the legacies can offer so that sets a very low bar. Ouch.

But that is not actually the case. New CEO Ed Sims, whose background includes running Air New Zealand’s long-haul operations, views WestJet’s coming long-haul offering as more akin to Air New Zealand’s—and Air Canada’s—long-haul offering than Norwegian’s.

With Ed Sims now in the mix at WestJet - there is an chance we could see WestJet try YVR-AKL/SYD?

Ed Sims will know allot of insight on the cross pacific market and will know how well NZ does on YVR-AKL for this NW coming NZ will increase YVR to 10x weekly with an 77E. Its really an route that is in desperate need of someone else to join the party.

YVR-DXB with EK code share onwards would be ineteresting

cirrusdragoon wrote:

According to this source , Westjet’s international product will aim to have a legacy carrier feel. Interesting to note , it is revealed they will have 24 premium economy seats , also worth noting they have rebranded “plus”to “premium
economy”it appears.

http://atwonline.com/blog/westjet-ceo-not-norwegian

I think you're over interpreting the discussion around WestJet's premium product. I don't see anything in there indicating the company is rebranding WestJet Plus. It would be an odd rebranding since Plus is bilingual and Premium isn't. I think he's just using the term "premium economy" in a generic way. This is already how the company describes WestJet Plus -- as a premium economy product:

https://www.westjet.com/en-ca/travel-in ... plus/index

That being said, given that the business class cabin on the 787 will have lie flat seats, I would expect it will have a separate brand announced for that cabin, and possibly another new one for the "international premium economy" cabin that also will be installed on the aircraft if they wish to differentiate it from WestJet Plus.

How is this news...this has been known for literally years. I personally have seen multiple company presentations that were publicially available saying exactly this.

On a side note, we won’t have to wait long for the reveal of the cabins and new livery. Event is next Tuesday. Employees and media.

zkncj wrote:

But that is not actually the case. New CEO Ed Sims, whose background includes running Air New Zealand’s long-haul operations, views WestJet’s coming long-haul offering as more akin to Air New Zealand’s—and Air Canada’s—long-haul offering than Norwegian’s.

With Ed Sims now in the mix at WestJet - there is an chance we could see WestJet try YVR-AKL/SYD?

Ed Sims will know allot of insight on the cross pacific market and will know how well NZ does on YVR-AKL for this NW coming NZ will increase YVR to 10x weekly with an 77E. Its really an route that is in desperate need of someone else to join the party.

From what I have heard, the focus will be Toronto, and initial routes will be to Asia (countries were India, China and Japan). I’m sure Vancouver will see some action, but to what extent I do not have the answer.

Also, where are you seeing ANZ going to 10x weekly, max I see is daily during peak seasons, less than daily other times.

neomax wrote:

Very interesting choice of words.

Trying to be like the legacies is probably a negative thing because Norwegian's product blows the doors off anything the legacies can offer so that sets a very low bar. Ouch.

I feel a legacy carrier such as air canada or lufthansa offer a superior product to what norwegian offers.

cirrusdragoon wrote:

neomax wrote:

Very interesting choice of words.

Trying to be like the legacies is probably a negative thing because Norwegian's product blows the doors off anything the legacies can offer so that sets a very low bar. Ouch.

I feel a legacy carrier such as air canada or lufthansa offer a superior product to what norwegian offers.

While you're not wrong, I suspect he meant that Norwegian's product beats legacies on a "cost-benefit" ratio aspect. Sure, it's not as refined as LH's offerings for example, but it also does cost considerably less. The value per dollar ends up being better.

reffado wrote:

cirrusdragoon wrote:

neomax wrote:

Very interesting choice of words.

Trying to be like the legacies is probably a negative thing because Norwegian's product blows the doors off anything the legacies can offer so that sets a very low bar. Ouch.

I feel a legacy carrier such as air canada or lufthansa offer a superior product to what norwegian offers.

While you're not wrong, I suspect he meant that Norwegian's product beats legacies on a "cost-benefit" ratio aspect. Sure, it's not as refined as LH's offerings for example, but it also does cost considerably less. The value per dollar ends up being better.

Yes absolutely. I agree with this.

A mistake in my opinion but it sure explains the start of "Swoop Airlines" as WJ is it's parent company. It will be interesting to see what services will they offer on board and how they will diversify their service from Air Canada. Will their flight attendants be all serious now and drop the awesome sense of humor that they have? WJ has been successful in its "point-to-point" business model a copy cat of Southwest, I fail to see how a "hub and spoke" saturated model will be successful.

In thinking that, perhaps they see a market in China and some European and middle eastern destinations. time will tell.

whywhyzee wrote:

zkncj wrote:

But that is not actually the case. New CEO Ed Sims, whose background includes running Air New Zealand’s long-haul operations, views WestJet’s coming long-haul offering as more akin to Air New Zealand’s—and Air Canada’s—long-haul offering than Norwegian’s.

With Ed Sims now in the mix at WestJet - there is an chance we could see WestJet try YVR-AKL/SYD?

Ed Sims will know allot of insight on the cross pacific market and will know how well NZ does on YVR-AKL for this NW coming NZ will increase YVR to 10x weekly with an 77E. Its really an route that is in desperate need of someone else to join the party.

From what I have heard, the focus will be Toronto, and initial routes will be to Asia (countries were India, China and Japan). I’m sure Vancouver will see some action, but to what extent I do not have the answer.

Also, where are you seeing ANZ going to 10x weekly, max I see is daily during peak seasons, less than daily other times.

They want to go to Asia? Geez, good luck. Yields to China & HK are very difficult these days. They may have a decent cost base, but going up against Chinese carriers is near suicide, unless they can convince premium passengers to switch from AC (doubtful).

drgmobile wrote:

cirrusdragoon wrote:

According to this source , Westjet’s international product will aim to have a legacy carrier feel. Interesting to note , it is revealed they will have 24 premium economy seats , also worth noting they have rebranded “plus”to “premium
economy”it appears.

http://atwonline.com/blog/westjet-ceo-not-norwegian

I think you're over interpreting the discussion around WestJet's premium product. I don't see anything in there indicating the company is rebranding WestJet Plus. It would be an odd rebranding since Plus is bilingual and Premium isn't. I think he's just using the term "premium economy" in a generic way. This is already how the company describes WestJet Plus -- as a premium economy product:

https://www.westjet.com/en-ca/travel-in ... plus/index

That being said, given that the business class cabin on the 787 will have lie flat seats, I would expect it will have a separate brand announced for that cabin, and possibly another new one for the "international premium economy" cabin that also will be installed on the aircraft if they wish to differentiate it from WestJet Plus.

I will agree that neither of us are correct until this supposed reveal as mentioned by the obvious insider informant. The term plus on its own seems very amatuer in my opinion. It would be nice to see this airline mature a bit more and use a more refined approach to their wording.
I disagree that it would be “an odd rebrand” , for a name does not need to be bilingual for every thing. Air Canada uses Premium Economy and in the French documenation “ Cabine Économique Privilège ". The term
premium economy is already being softly launched on WJ 737 menus as per my recent flight back to europe.

In addition, just because something is status quo today does not mean it will not be something else another day. Products and their names evolve over time. When aligning premium economy with partner airlines , there is some degree of collaboration amongst them. Lufthansa calls their premium economy as Air Canada calls theirs. Delta, soon to be in a joint venture partnership with WJ, has two
names for their Premium Economy depending on aircraft type/ route, Comfort + and Premium Select. Cathay Pacific , another of WJ codesharing partners, refers to theirs as Premium Economy. It Is less confusing for the consumer to use an industry normal term.

I did speak with one of the WJ cabin attendants onboard my flight back to europe , and was hinted at a new 2 by 2 seat coming to their 737 fleet, quite possibly an introduction of business class on the 737 fleet. It remains to be seen. I would analyze this and go further to say one would be trying to create a consistent product offering across the whole fleet. A traveller seated in business class fare on the 787 who makes a connection onto the 737 aircraft, would then continue in a business class seat.

Alas , it would be the opportune time to transform and name their “plus” to premium economy. Had Ed Sim mentioned anywhere in the article the term “Plus” , I would put it completely out of my mind that the term would change , but that is not the case. Time will tell. The writing appears to be on the wall based on all these factors.

whywhyzee wrote:

From what I have heard, the focus will be Toronto, and initial routes will be to Asia (countries were India, China and Japan). I’m sure Vancouver will see some action, but to what extent I do not have the answer.

Interesting, I’ve heard 3/4 YYZ and 1/4 YVR, at least initially. From their investor day route map, Delhi looks like it will be served from YVR while DXB will be from YYZ.
https://www.westjet.com/assets/wj-web/documents/en/investorMedia/171206-presentation-investor-day.pdf

3 Aircraft Scheduled for Q1, 2019.. Not a lot of lift for the lofty aspirations of Anet. I would love to know how folks know where the aircraft are going and who’ve they’ve heard it from. I don’t think the folks who plan their network know yet where they are going just yet.

Jayce wrote:

whywhyzee wrote:

From what I have heard, the focus will be Toronto, and initial routes will be to Asia (countries were India, China and Japan). I’m sure Vancouver will see some action, but to what extent I do not have the answer.

Interesting, I’ve heard 3/4 YYZ and 1/4 YVR, at least initially. From their investor day route map, Delhi looks like it will be served from YVR while DXB will be from YYZ.
https://www.westjet.com/assets/wj-web/documents/en/investorMedia/171206-presentation-investor-day.pdf

DEL/DXB is just a dream. Get investors onboard to pump the stock.

1900Driver wrote:

whywhyzee wrote:

zkncj wrote:

With Ed Sims now in the mix at WestJet - there is an chance we could see WestJet try YVR-AKL/SYD?

Ed Sims will know allot of insight on the cross pacific market and will know how well NZ does on YVR-AKL for this NW coming NZ will increase YVR to 10x weekly with an 77E. Its really an route that is in desperate need of someone else to join the party.

From what I have heard, the focus will be Toronto, and initial routes will be to Asia (countries were India, China and Japan). I’m sure Vancouver will see some action, but to what extent I do not have the answer.

Also, where are you seeing ANZ going to 10x weekly, max I see is daily during peak seasons, less than daily other times.

They want to go to Asia? Geez, good luck. Yields to China & HK are very difficult these days. They may have a decent cost base, but going up against Chinese carriers is near suicide, unless they can convince premium passengers to switch from AC (doubtful).

There are a LOT of Asians living in Western Canada so SIN,DEL,BOM,HKG and maybe PEK are not out of the question for revenue. and YVR could be an excellent place to gain Revenue. (YVR is one of my favorite "Good Eats" places in Canada)

strfyr51 wrote:

There are a LOT of Asians living in Western Canada so SIN,DEL,BOM,HKG and maybe PEK are not out of the question for revenue. and YVR could be an excellent place to gain Revenue. (YVR is one of my favorite "Good Eats" places in Canada)

YVR is a natural place to set up a Pacific gateway\fortress hub. CP did the same in the 1990s.

And what, nobody bets on MNL these days? You could make a mint on YWG-MNL, I swear.

There is no doubt in my mind that they will fall flat on their face with the overseas routes. Air Canada and the other legacies will essentially "eat their lunch" on any routes that they decide to dabble in. I had hoped that Sims would return the airline to some sort of reality and bring it back to its roots. Dropping Swoop and making peace with the pilots would have been a good start. From there he could have reached a Rouge type of agreement with the pilots so as to achieve low cost competiveness. Negotiating with Boeing to replace the 787s with MAX 737s would have been a logical next step. As per Southwest they would have fleet standardization and would only fly where the 737 could take them. Having been around western Canada for forty years and I have seen a lot of carriers come and go. That said it was a great time when Westjet came into being and became a successful 737 airline as per Southwest. Now it is a toxic place to work and under the leadership of a total outsider who has no clue about how to run an airline from western Canada. The toxicity will intensify on May 8th as ALPA has organized a picket at the AGM and all picketers have been told to wear their uniforms. The backdrop to all of this is the ongoing strike vote that is happening and the $2,000.000.00 strike fund that ALPA has transferred to the WS ALPA committee. Very sad indeed and a long ways from the little airline that could.

strfyr51 wrote:

1900Driver wrote:

whywhyzee wrote:

From what I have heard, the focus will be Toronto, and initial routes will be to Asia (countries were India, China and Japan). I’m sure Vancouver will see some action, but to what extent I do not have the answer.

Also, where are you seeing ANZ going to 10x weekly, max I see is daily during peak seasons, less than daily other times.

They want to go to Asia? Geez, good luck. Yields to China & HK are very difficult these days. They may have a decent cost base, but going up against Chinese carriers is near suicide, unless they can convince premium passengers to switch from AC (doubtful).

There are a LOT of Asians living in Western Canada so SIN,DEL,BOM,HKG and maybe PEK are not out of the question for revenue. and YVR could be an excellent place to gain Revenue. (YVR is one of my favorite "Good Eats" places in Canada)

Demand is not the question, but rather supply. Asian markets to Canada are very challenged from a margin perspective. Especially HKG & PEK to a lesser extent (due to the capacity controls from China).

DEL is covered by AC, & will be vigorously defended. As well, margins from Canada to India aren’t great as well. Can ws make it work with limited feed options?

Don’t forget, ws cost advantages are dimishing. If they resolve their dispute with the pilots, the outcome will certainly not favour the company!

WestJet has expanded as much as they can using the old business model - its time to move ahead and frankly, as a very frequent WS passenger, I'm excited in the direction they're heading. Most of my flights are in Plus, its an OK product, but it needs to be better - too many times I've been tempted to switch over to AC for that very reason, and I know I'm not alone. WS could be a very effective competitor in the premium market.

cumulushumilis wrote:

3 Aircraft Scheduled for Q1, 2019.. Not a lot of lift for the lofty aspirations of Anet. I would love to know how folks know where the aircraft are going and who’ve they’ve heard it from. I don’t think the folks who plan their network know yet where they are going just yet.

I suspect they might be used for LGW - at least from Toronto and Calgary. The 767s they have are between 24-28 years old, so I'm not sure how much life they have left in them under daily use.

Those 767s might be rotated into less demanding roles (e.g. YWG-LGW).

Getting past the tweener size in the international market will be hard for Westjet. They had it pretty easy in Canada with only one competitor (and one who was going through troubles of its own to boot) when building a domestic (and to a lesser extent, North American) network.

International business travelers tend to favor airlines in an alliance or with a broad network of destinations. Leisure travelers tend to be low-yield. The competition is fierce on both those markets. There are no huge obvious gaps in service or niches to fill (or if there are, those are protected for various reasons), so they'll have to grind it out and build a competitive product with brand awareness in multiple countries. That's going to cost time and money. Lots of it.

I'd say their best opportunity would be to leverage Delta's experience and resources if they are serious about this.

boeing767300 wrote:

There is no doubt in my mind that they will fall flat on their face with the overseas routes. Air Canada and the other legacies will essentially "eat their lunch" on any routes that they decide to dabble in. I had hoped that Sims would return the airline to some sort of reality and bring it back to its roots. Dropping Swoop and making peace with the pilots would have been a good start. From there he could have reached a Rouge type of agreement with the pilots so as to achieve low cost competiveness. Negotiating with Boeing to replace the 787s with MAX 737s would have been a logical next step. As per Southwest they would have fleet standardization and would only fly where the 737 could take them. Having been around western Canada for forty years and I have seen a lot of carriers come and go. That said it was a great time when Westjet came into being and became a successful 737 airline as per Southwest. Now it is a toxic place to work and under the leadership of a total outsider who has no clue about how to run an airline from western Canada. The toxicity will intensify on May 8th as ALPA has organized a picket at the AGM and all picketers have been told to wear their uniforms. The backdrop to all of this is the ongoing strike vote that is happening and the $2,000.000.00 strike fund that ALPA has transferred to the WS ALPA committee. Very sad indeed and a long ways from the little airline that could.

The problem is that their roots are exhausted. The Southwest model only goes so far in Canada and Westjet has already extended it about as far as it could go. Heading back to the "roots" provides no reasonable possibility for sustained growth. So, take a risk or status quo?

Onboard product revealed.

https://787.westjet.com/

Hello all

A friend who works for Westjet just sent me pics that were revealed today. However I have no idea how to upload them...

Seems like too much product in my opinion as LCC. Will the routes they operate really need such a top end product?

Also dont care for new livery.

Fantastic job WestJet!

The new livery is wonderful, its still identifiable as WS yet new, updated and fresh - fantastic job!

The new product looks awesome, and its truly exiting to watch WS head into a new direction.

Also loving the "Spirit of Canada" on the fuselage.

Paint is underwhelming.

Product looks fantastic, but wonder indeed if its not over the top. They will certainly need top end premium/biz markets to generate the revenue to cover its space cost making utility of airplane less for more leisure markets as currently flown.

Wow, great job WestJet. Looks amazing. Kind of reminds me of the old Air Canada inside, but the cabin looks amazing.

LAXintl wrote:

Onboard product revealed.

https://787.westjet.com/

Holy smokes!!! I have never been so excited about anything before in my life! The product in all classes looks absolutely amazing. It’ll be interesting how the inflight service will be trained out - no offense but WS crew are great but not exactly business-class polished. The training program needs to be a major focus for this to be a success. God I wish I still worked for them - this is so exciting.

Is Qantas buying a stake in Westjet? “Spirit of Canada,” similar sweep of the livery on the rear fuselage.

(And calm down people, I am not actually serious)

Looks awesome. Those PE seats look especially nice.

To me the million dollar questions is will WS be able to earn the revenue premium(matching AC and legacy carriers) to cover the cost in space of such upgraded product offering. Could be a bloody battle.

Also yes the network utility of the 787 frame will be limited with such a configuration. WS will indeed need to chase after more premium heavy/biz markets than potentially more secondary or leisure focused markets. It will be quite a strategy change.

On the paint, yes I am also underwhelmed, but I have always been underwhelmed by WS livery and color palate.

Is this it?

https://www.skiesmag.com/press-releases ... ada-world/

"Qantas North"

https://787.westjet.com

There is the launch site and videos/promo material.

It's stunning...but I wanted to see more "Maple Leaf" in it.

Really like what they’ve done. Clean, contemporary and premium looking.
Interesting they’re using the same seat model that AC uses in business and the same design firm that AC used for their Dreamliner interiors.
Very nice job, Westjet.

Dont care for the new paint. Its dull like current one.

Is WestJet becoming a full fare, full service carrier?

I think I'm in the minority, I don't dig it. The titles look too cheap and is kind of a Qantas rip off. Hopefully it looks better I real life than the rendering.

ACDC8 wrote:

Noise wrote:

It's stunning...but I wanted to see more "Maple Leaf" in it.

I got a fever, and the only cure is more Maple Leaf!

“They gotta a dynamite look...”

Noise wrote:

It's stunning...but I wanted to see more "Maple Leaf" in it.

I got a fever, and the only cure is more Maple Leaf!

mercure1 wrote:

Is WestJet becoming a full fare, full service carrier?

Yes, that is their public plan.

And if ALPA has their way - a full cost airline also....

From today

At this point people would claim everything that has a straight line near the tail a Qantas ripoff lmao

Idk how much it'll work out for them, but the interiors are spectacular! The livery is amazing too. FINALLY SOMEONE KNOWS HOW TO REBRAND!!!

Really liking that new livery!

OA940 wrote:

At this point people would claim everything that has a straight line near the tail a Qantas ripoff lmao

You miss the SPIRIT OF CANADA or you're just gonna pretend that's not what we're talking about? Their "thing" has always been "Proudly Canadian" until "Spirit of Canada" mysteriously appears at the same time as the rest of the Qantas livery.

From Geneva and sending love , for the new Westjet ! Brilliant!

OA940 wrote:

At this point people would claim everything that has a straight line near the tail a Qantas ripoff lmao

Idk how much it'll work out for them, but the interiors are spectacular! The livery is amazing too. FINALLY SOMEONE KNOWS HOW TO REBRAND!!!

It's a cool tail with the same old WestJet Eurowhite fuselage. Medicore rebrand at best.

Also "L'esprit du Canada" will appear on the starboard side of the aircraft.

The interiors do look impressive though.

WS are currently live on FB, but the audio is barely audible: https://www.facebook.com/westjet/videos ... 517403552/

Hard to believe that after all of this hype that WS could be grounded in a few weeks with a pilots' strike at the height of the summer season.

Will this new livery be featured on the rest of the fleet as well?