pabloeing
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LH GROUP to order 2 B77W,2 B77F, 6 A320neo and up to 6 A320ceo

Mon May 07, 2018 4:49 pm

New order to LH Group to Swiss ...LH Cargo and Lufthansa

https://newsroom.lufthansagroup.com/Eng ... 4f2c0ecea6
Last edited by SQ22 on Mon May 07, 2018 7:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Title updated
 
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Revelation
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Re: LH GROUP to order 2 B77W,2 B77F and 12 A320neo

Mon May 07, 2018 4:58 pm

And for those anticipating the 777X order being dumped: nope.

Makes the a.net interpretation of those comments from 2017 seem incorrect, says I.
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pabloeing
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Re: LH GROUP to order 2 B77W,2 B77F and 12 A320neo

Mon May 07, 2018 5:00 pm

LH need the B777X.......no doubt
 
dampfnudel
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Re: LH GROUP to order 2 B77W,2 B77F and 12 A320neo

Mon May 07, 2018 5:03 pm

Revelation wrote:
And for those anticipating the 777X order being dumped: nope.

Makes the a.net interpretation of those comments from 2016 seem incorrect, says I.


Anyone expecting LH to cancel the perfect replacement for their 744 fleet is most likely smoking something good. I wouldn’t be surprised if LH even has an interest in the 797 for routes where the 321 doesn’t have the range and the 333/339 is too much capacity.
A313 332 343 B703 712 722 732 73G 738 739 741 742 744 752 762 76E 764 772 AT5 CR9 D10 DHH DHT F27 GRM L10 M83 TU5

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na
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Re: LH GROUP to order 2 B77W,2 B77F and 12 A320neo

Mon May 07, 2018 5:11 pm

Revelation wrote:
And for those anticipating the 777X order being dumped: nope..


No one ever said that as much as I know, word is about stretching deliveries and a reduction or cancellation of the options taken.
 
devron
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Re: LH GROUP to order 2 B77W,2 B77F and 12 A320neo

Mon May 07, 2018 5:13 pm

Those six A320-ceo will come this year, are these used planes? They have been order to ofset delays in the 320-neo. I guess this will cost airbus something?
 
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Dutchy
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Re: LH GROUP to order 2 B77W,2 B77F and 12 A320neo

Mon May 07, 2018 5:22 pm

dampfnudel wrote:
Revelation wrote:
And for those anticipating the 777X order being dumped: nope.

Makes the a.net interpretation of those comments from 2016 seem incorrect, says I.


Anyone expecting LH to cancel the perfect replacement for their 744 fleet is most likely smoking something good. I wouldn’t be surprised if LH even has an interest in the 797 for routes where the 321 doesn’t have the range and the 333/339 is too much capacity.


Boeing fanboy?

Lufthansa hasn't ordered the 339 as far as I know.
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YangFeng
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Re: LH GROUP to order 2 B77W,2 B77F and 12 A320neo

Mon May 07, 2018 5:26 pm

"The order includes two Boeing 777-300ER long-haul aircraft for SWISS, which are expected to supplement the existing SWISS fleet beginning in early 2020 and will be used to expand the route network."

Does that mean new destinations? I would have thought they will use it for existing destinations that could use a bit more capacity, maybe NRT and PVG?

Edit: I guess they could the 77W for these destinations and open new routes with the refurbished A340s.
Last edited by YangFeng on Mon May 07, 2018 5:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
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Revelation
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Re: LH GROUP to order 2 B77W,2 B77F and 12 A320neo

Mon May 07, 2018 5:26 pm

na wrote:
Revelation wrote:
And for those anticipating the 777X order being dumped: nope..

No one ever said that as much as I know, word is about stretching deliveries and a reduction or cancellation of the options taken.

No one from LH has said that, but much of a.net interpreted a leak from Spohr as saying the order would be dumped.

Anyway, the real news is that LH is ordering some 77W for LX and some 77F for LH Cargo and some A320ceos (if available) to help deal with A320neo delays, along with converting some A320neo options too. Good news for everyone, including those worried about the 777 -> 777X production transition.
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PlanesNTrains
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Re: LH GROUP to order 2 B77W,2 B77F and 12 A320neo

Mon May 07, 2018 5:40 pm

na wrote:
Revelation wrote:
And for those anticipating the 777X order being dumped: nope..


No one ever said that as much as I know, word is about stretching deliveries and a reduction or cancellation of the options taken.


Stroll over to the BA order rumor thread. Jayafe said just that. Start on Page 4.
-Dave


MAX’d out on MAX threads. If you are starting a thread, and it’s about the MAX - stop. There’s already a thread that covers it.
 
Bricktop
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Re: LH GROUP to order 2 B77W,2 B77F and 12 A320neo

Mon May 07, 2018 5:50 pm

Nice little bonus all around, it seems. The short term pickup of 6 ceos is very interesting to me. LH needs the frames now, and it seems they are pessimistic about them being neos and will take ceos instead. An unconversion? Good news for Airbus to fill a small hole.
 
LH779
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Re: LH GROUP to order 2 B77W,2 B77F and 12 A320neo

Mon May 07, 2018 6:00 pm

PlanesNTrains wrote:
na wrote:
Revelation wrote:
And for those anticipating the 777X order being dumped: nope..


No one ever said that as much as I know, word is about stretching deliveries and a reduction or cancellation of the options taken.


Stroll over to the BA order rumor thread. Jayafe said just that. Start on Page 4.


Spohr said a few months ago that they might have ordered too many 779 and not enough A359.
The original order was for 34 779 and 25 A359 + options for both. Since then they only firmed up 20 777s which would be a perfect replacement for the 13 744 and 7 A346 that currently operate out of FRA.
Somehow this led to half of a.net constantly telling us that LH wants to cancel the entire 777 order.
 
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Polot
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Re: LH GROUP to order 2 B77W,2 B77F and 12 A320neo

Mon May 07, 2018 6:35 pm

EddieDude wrote:
I do not believe that the 779 order will be cancelled at all. However, based on comments made by the CEO some months ago, it could be cut to fewer aircraft at the expense of more A359s.

With this top up order, how large will be the LX 77W fleet in the end? How many A343s and A333s are expected to remain in the LX fleet?

There will be 12 LX 77Ws after this order. I don’t think any of their 14 A333s are expected to go anywhere any time soon, they are all rather young (2009+ builds). I don’t know with the A343s.
 
EddieDude
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Re: LH GROUP to order 2 B77W,2 B77F and 12 A320neo

Mon May 07, 2018 6:37 pm

I do not believe that the 779 order will be cancelled at all. However, based on comments made by the CEO some months ago, it could be cut to fewer aircraft at the expense of more A359s.

With this top up order, how large will be the LX 77W fleet in the end? How many A343s and A333s are expected to remain in the LX fleet?
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BHXLOVER
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Re: LH GROUP to order 2 B77W,2 B77F and 12 A320neo

Mon May 07, 2018 6:44 pm

dampfnudel wrote:
Revelation wrote:
And for those anticipating the 777X order being dumped: nope.

Makes the a.net interpretation of those comments from 2016 seem incorrect, says I.


Anyone expecting LH to cancel the perfect replacement for their 744 fleet is most likely smoking something good. I wouldn’t be surprised if LH even has an interest in the 797 for routes where the 321 doesn’t have the range and the 333/339 is too much capacity.


How can they be interested in a plane that does not exist?
 
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Polot
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Re: LH GROUP to order 2 B77W,2 B77F and 12 A320neo

Mon May 07, 2018 6:45 pm

BHXLOVER wrote:
dampfnudel wrote:
Revelation wrote:
And for those anticipating the 777X order being dumped: nope.

Makes the a.net interpretation of those comments from 2016 seem incorrect, says I.


Anyone expecting LH to cancel the perfect replacement for their 744 fleet is most likely smoking something good. I wouldn’t be surprised if LH even has an interest in the 797 for routes where the 321 doesn’t have the range and the 333/339 is too much capacity.


How can they be interested in a plane that does not exist?

Because manufacturers hold advanced talks with airlines so they know about products in the pipeline before the planes are officially launched. With the 7E7 for example, Boeing did not officially launch the plane in April 2004, then went and pitched the plane to ANA, and convinced them to order 50 of them to coincide with the launch announcement all in the same day, or even week.

Boeing is talking to airlines about the 797, this is well known. It may lead nowhere (can’t build a business case), or it may not. That doesn’t mean an airline can’t have interest. If Boeing launches the plane they will certainly already have commitments lined up to go with the launch announcement.
Last edited by Polot on Mon May 07, 2018 6:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
SpaceshipDC10
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Re: LH GROUP to order 2 B77W,2 B77F and 12 A320neo

Mon May 07, 2018 6:49 pm

Polot wrote:
I don’t know with the A343s.


They have 6 active brand new delivered in 2003/2004. I believe a couple more will move to WK.
 
kaitak
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Re: LH GROUP to order 2 B77W,2 B77F and 12 A320neo

Mon May 07, 2018 6:58 pm

Polot wrote:
Title needs to be updated some, it’s 6 A320neos + (up to) 6 A320ceos, not 12 A320neos.


I am surprised that they are being so slow to order more A320 Neos; I had assumed (possibly wrongly) that they would place a large order to replace the current A320s (possibly A319s), which would have required an order of c.60-80 Neos. Their reluctance to order more Neos suggests they don't intend to roll-over all of their A320-ceos to Neos ... possibly interested in the 797 and whatever Airbus might come up with?
 
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Re: LH GROUP to order 2 B77W,2 B77F and 12 A320neo

Mon May 07, 2018 6:59 pm

Revelation wrote:
And for those anticipating the 777X order being dumped: nope.

Makes the a.net interpretation of those comments from 2017 seem incorrect, says I.


It was actually a statement from LH speaking about having ordered too many. Are we going to transform every single topic in a peeing contest?

PlanesNTrains wrote:
Stroll over to the BA order rumor thread. Jayafe said just that. Start on Page 4.


Google "LH too many 777x too few A350", not cancelling but thinking about resizing the order. You're welcome.
 
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Polot
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Re: LH GROUP to order 2 B77W,2 B77F and 12 A320neo

Mon May 07, 2018 7:03 pm

Jayafe wrote:
Revelation wrote:
And for those anticipating the 777X order being dumped: nope.

Makes the a.net interpretation of those comments from 2017 seem incorrect, says I.


It was actually a statement from LH speaking about having ordered too many. Are fanboys going to transform every single topic in a peeing contest?

Some have on A.net have twisted an LH exec saying that the airline may have ordered to many 779s (and not enough A359s) into “LH wants out of their entire 779 order pronto” though. There is still a lot of confusion on what number that LH exec was even talking about. Was it in regards to 34 779s (which LH announced they ordered) or 20 779s? (The number LH actually ordered firm with Boeing)
 
Bricktop
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Re: LH GROUP to order 2 B77W,2 B77F and 12 A320neo

Mon May 07, 2018 7:06 pm

kaitak wrote:
Polot wrote:
Title needs to be updated some, it’s 6 A320neos + (up to) 6 A320ceos, not 12 A320neos.


I am surprised that they are being so slow to order more A320 Neos; I had assumed (possibly wrongly) that they would place a large order to replace the current A320s (possibly A319s), which would have required an order of c.60-80 Neos. Their reluctance to order more Neos suggests they don't intend to roll-over all of their A320-ceos to Neos ... possibly interested in the 797 and whatever Airbus might come up with?

I don't think they are in a mad rush to do anything particularly as getting neos on property is an issue for them right now. Firming up 6 a few years downstream may also be a function of options expiration, similar to QF and their 789s a few days back.
 
aviationaware
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Re: LH GROUP to order 2 B77W,2 B77F and 12 A320neo

Mon May 07, 2018 7:11 pm

Lovely news for Swiss.
 
LH779
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Re: LH GROUP to order 2 B77W,2 B77F and 12 A320neo

Mon May 07, 2018 7:20 pm

kaitak wrote:
Polot wrote:
Title needs to be updated some, it’s 6 A320neos + (up to) 6 A320ceos, not 12 A320neos.


I am surprised that they are being so slow to order more A320 Neos; I had assumed (possibly wrongly) that they would place a large order to replace the current A320s (possibly A319s), which would have required an order of c.60-80 Neos. Their reluctance to order more Neos suggests they don't intend to roll-over all of their A320-ceos to Neos ... possibly interested in the 797 and whatever Airbus might come up with?


Well, 10 A320neos have already been delivered and for now they still have 93 NEOs on order( 53 A320 and 40 A321). So I don't think they are in a rush to order more for now.

LHs current Airbus fleet consinsts of 30 A319, 79 A320 (69 ceo, 10 neo) and 63 A321. But many of those are not that old. Only 23 A320s are older than 10 years, 70 aircraft across the 3 types are older than 10 years.
 
PlanesNTrains
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Re: LH GROUP to order 2 B77W,2 B77F and 12 A320neo

Mon May 07, 2018 7:49 pm

Jayafe wrote:
Revelation wrote:
And for those anticipating the 777X order being dumped: nope.

Makes the a.net interpretation of those comments from 2017 seem incorrect, says I.


It was actually a statement from LH speaking about having ordered too many. Are we going to transform every single topic in a peeing contest?

PlanesNTrains wrote:
Stroll over to the BA order rumor thread. Jayafe said just that. Start on Page 4.


Google "LH too many 777x too few A350", not cancelling but thinking about resizing the order. You're welcome.


Did you even read what I replied to?
-Dave


MAX’d out on MAX threads. If you are starting a thread, and it’s about the MAX - stop. There’s already a thread that covers it.
 
stylo777
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Re: LH GROUP to order 2 B77W,2 B77F, 6 A320neo and up to 6 A320ceo

Mon May 07, 2018 7:54 pm

LX 333's being rather young and the remaining 6-7 343's about to get the new interior, I'm almost certain that the 2 ordered 77W's will be for expansion. Probably NRT and/or JNB go all 77W whereas the freed up 343 can open a new destination.
In my opinion ICN is very strong up there, followed by YYZ and IAD although the latter two are served via A++ Jointventure by AC/UA.
Another creative combination would be EZE or GIG with tag-on to SCL (which they used to have years ago).
 
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Revelation
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Re: LH GROUP to order 2 B77W,2 B77F and 12 A320neo

Mon May 07, 2018 7:59 pm

BHXLOVER wrote:
dampfnudel wrote:
Revelation wrote:
And for those anticipating the 777X order being dumped: nope.

Makes the a.net interpretation of those comments from 2016 seem incorrect, says I.


Anyone expecting LH to cancel the perfect replacement for their 744 fleet is most likely smoking something good. I wouldn’t be surprised if LH even has an interest in the 797 for routes where the 321 doesn’t have the range and the 333/339 is too much capacity.


How can they be interested in a plane that does not exist?

How can you be interested in a baby before it's been conceived?

Maybe because you know the process and trust the partner, etc.

aviationaware wrote:
Lovely news for Swiss.

And LH Cargo, too. It wasn't too long ago when we were speculating here that LH would get out of the main deck freight business.
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Re: LH GROUP to order 2 B77W,2 B77F and 12 A320neo

Mon May 07, 2018 8:04 pm

Jayafe wrote:
Revelation wrote:
And for those anticipating the 777X order being dumped: nope.

Makes the a.net interpretation of those comments from 2017 seem incorrect, says I.


It was actually a statement from LH speaking about having ordered too many.

Yet you characterized it as "LH is trying to get rid of that order".

Ref: viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1393323&start=150#p20385833

Jayafe wrote:
Are we going to transform every single topic in a peeing contest?

Seems appropriate if people keep taking the piss.

Ref: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taking_the_piss
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T54A
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Re: LH GROUP to order 2 B77W,2 B77F, 6 A320neo and up to 6 A320ceo

Mon May 07, 2018 8:16 pm

I imagine a heavily discounted A320CEO over short distances won’t cost much more over time than a normally priced NEO
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Re: LH GROUP to order 2 B77W,2 B77F, 6 A320neo and up to 6 A320ceo

Mon May 07, 2018 8:26 pm

How full are the LX 77Ws?

I've flown on them only to Singapore and both legs of that trip were rather sparse... I had three seats to myself one leg and that load was reflected in most of the economy cabin. (This was, however, nearly two years ago...)

Would also love to see a PE on their 77W. I am a fan of Swiss' soft product and a proper PE (as LH has, for instance) would be terrific on a fleet of new 77Ws.
 
JulietteBravo
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Re: LH GROUP to order 2 B77W,2 B77F, 6 A320neo and up to 6 A320ceo

Mon May 07, 2018 9:06 pm

stylo777 wrote:
LX 333's being rather young and the remaining 6-7 343's about to get the new interior, I'm almost certain that the 2 ordered 77W's will be for expansion. Probably NRT and/or JNB go all 77W whereas the freed up 343 can open a new destination.
In my opinion ICN is very strong up there, followed by YYZ and IAD although the latter two are served via A++ Jointventure by AC/UA.
Another creative combination would be EZE or GIG with tag-on to SCL (which they used to have years ago).



As Edelweiss (EDW) starts ZRH-EZE (not daily) by november Swiss is not going to open EZE. Same with GIG witch is also served by EDW (or via FRA/MUC with LH). EDW is like a lab for SWR - if there is more potential, SWR takes over and fly daily. I guess the New routes are NA - i guess IAD (Washington DC) and one in asia. That one can be one that is not often discussed here, like MAA in India or a city in China. What do you think about?
 
mat66
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Re: LH GROUP to order 2 B77W,2 B77F, 6 A320neo and up to 6 A320ceo

Mon May 07, 2018 9:15 pm

T54A wrote:
I imagine a heavily discounted A320CEO over short distances won’t cost much more over time than a normally priced NEO


That is what I'm wondering about. It is still a lot of fuel if they keep them for 20 years. Would make more sense to sell them in 4-5 years, I guess.
 
Planeflyer
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Re: LH GROUP to order 2 B77W,2 B77F, 6 A320neo and up to 6 A320ceo

Tue May 08, 2018 1:46 am

tigerotor77w wrote:
How full are the LX 77Ws?

I've flown on them only to Singapore and both legs of that trip were rather sparse... I had three seats to myself one leg and that load was reflected in most of the economy cabin. (This was, however, nearly two years ago...)

Would also love to see a PE on their 77W. I am a fan of Swiss' soft product and a proper PE (as LH has, for instance) would be terrific on a fleet of new 77Ws.


Agree, seen the same on LX. Would think the 787 the perfect size for Swiss.
 
1989worstyear
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Re: LH GROUP to order 2 B77W,2 B77F, 6 A320neo and up to 6 A320ceo

Tue May 08, 2018 2:07 am

mat66 wrote:
T54A wrote:
I imagine a heavily discounted A320CEO over short distances won’t cost much more over time than a normally priced NEO


That is what I'm wondering about. It is still a lot of fuel if they keep them for 20 years. Would make more sense to sell them in 4-5 years, I guess.


Yeah - I thought they were supposed to modernizing their fleet, not going back to the last true year of the '80s (1988).
Stuck at age 15 thanks to the certification date of the A320-200 and my parents' decision to postpone having a kid by 3 years. At least there's Dignitas...
 
stylo777
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Re: LH GROUP to order 2 B77W,2 B77F, 6 A320neo and up to 6 A320ceo

Tue May 08, 2018 5:38 am

tigerotor77w wrote:
How full are the LX 77Ws?

it's certainly quite challenging to fill a daily 77W with local and connex passengers (alongside SQ's 380 of course) in a country like Switzerland; nevertheless, they are doing good on those routes. you can't set a very, very tiny snapshot (two flights) equal to the overall SLF and performance.
 
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Re: LH GROUP to order 2 B77W,2 B77F, 6 A320neo and up to 6 A320ceo

Tue May 08, 2018 5:45 am

Planeflyer wrote:
tigerotor77w wrote:
How full are the LX 77Ws?

I've flown on them only to Singapore and both legs of that trip were rather sparse... I had three seats to myself one leg and that load was reflected in most of the economy cabin. (This was, however, nearly two years ago...)

Would also love to see a PE on their 77W. I am a fan of Swiss' soft product and a proper PE (as LH has, for instance) would be terrific on a fleet of new 77Ws.


Agree, seen the same on LX. Would think the 787 the perfect size for Swiss.


They have a fleet of rather young (by LH standards) A330s.
 
columba
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Re: LH GROUP to order 2 B77W,2 B77F, 6 A320neo and up to 6 A320ceo

Tue May 08, 2018 6:43 am

seahawk wrote:
They have a fleet of rather young (by LH standards) A330s.


True, but these could be easily shifted within the LH Group (Eurowings e.g.) - but I also believe that they will stay with Swiss for some time.

I am still hoping that LH Group will order more CSeries to replace their A319s.
It will forever be a McDonnell Douglas MD 80 , Boeing MD 80 sounds so wrong
 
Someone83
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Re: LH GROUP to order 2 B77W,2 B77F, 6 A320neo and up to 6 A320ceo

Tue May 08, 2018 6:55 am

I suspect the 6 A320ceo is some aircraft not taken up by another customer, as with a delivery this year, most of the parts for the aircraft should already been made
 
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seahawk
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Re: LH GROUP to order 2 B77W,2 B77F, 6 A320neo and up to 6 A320ceo

Tue May 08, 2018 7:10 am

And probably for a very good price. Considering the capacity shortage of EW it makes sense.
 
Airboe
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Re: LH GROUP to order 2 B77W,2 B77F and 12 A320neo

Tue May 08, 2018 7:12 am

Revelation wrote:
No one from LH has said that, but much of a.net interpreted a leak from Spohr as saying the order would be dumped.


It is actually well documented he said they probably bought too many 777X's and too few A350's. Not the order would be dumped in any way though.

http://www.aero.de/news-27635/Emirates- ... hansa.html
The well reputed german site "AERO" quote him for saying in an internal Lufthansa video:
"Ich bin nicht sicher, ob wir tatsächlich genügend A350 und möglicherweise zu viele 777X bestellt haben."
Which can be translated to something like: I am not sure if we have bought enough A350 and possible too many 777X's.


Also quoted many other places like:

http://observer.com/2017/11/boeing-777x ... h-in-2020/
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles ... serve-cash
https://centreforaviation.com/news/luft ... 50s-678616


My personal opinion is that probably would take the ordered ones, - but convert a large number of the options for 777F's - all the MD-11's are approaching 20 years now.



KR/
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Last edited by Airboe on Tue May 08, 2018 7:15 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Airboe
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Re: LH GROUP to order 2 B77W,2 B77F and 12 A320neo

Tue May 08, 2018 7:25 am

SpaceshipDC10 wrote:

They have 6 active brand new delivered in 2003/2004. I believe a couple more will move to WK.


They thave 3 340-300 delivered in 2001 - as far I can see they are the newest ones:
According to https://www.lh-taufnamen.de/lufthansa/



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Re: LH GROUP to order 2 B77W,2 B77F, 6 A320neo and up to 6 A320ceo

Tue May 08, 2018 7:58 am

The operation of the MD11s will be terminated by 2025. Till then we will see a gradual relacement and a transition to the 777F. If they replace the remaining 12 MD11s 1 to 1 will be seen. That will be subject to market conditions.
Was Erlauben Erdogan!!!
 
SpaceshipDC10
Posts: 6384
Joined: Tue Jan 01, 2013 11:44 am

Re: LH GROUP to order 2 B77W,2 B77F and 12 A320neo

Tue May 08, 2018 8:09 am

Airboe wrote:
SpaceshipDC10 wrote:

They have 6 active brand new delivered in 2003/2004. I believe a couple more will move to WK.


They thave 3 340-300 delivered in 2001 - as far I can see they are the newest ones:
According to https://www.lh-taufnamen.de/lufthansa/


I was answering to a question regarding Swiss' fleet, not Lufthnasa's.

Airboe wrote:
My personal opinion is that probably would take the ordered ones, - but convert a large number of the options for 777F's - all the MD-11's are approaching 20 years now.
KR/
Airboe


PanHAM wrote:
The operation of the MD11s will be terminated by 2025. Till then we will see a gradual relacement and a transition to the 777F. If they replace the remaining 12 MD11s 1 to 1 will be seen. That will be subject to market conditions.


The replacement aircraft will be B777Fs and if Lufthansa Cargo wants to replace, but not increase, the total capacity of the dozen MD-11Fs then it will need seven new B777 freighters. That figure is based on the equation that each B777F has the capacity ratio of 1.6 MD-11F.

The 7:12 replacement ratio is the current plan and “bottom line”, but Gerber confirmed that additional increases in demand would “see the possibilities change”.


http://www.aircargonews.net/news/airlin ... rowth.html
 
stylo777
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Re: LH GROUP to order 2 B77W,2 B77F, 6 A320neo and up to 6 A320ceo

Tue May 08, 2018 8:12 am

Someone83 wrote:
I suspect the 6 A320ceo is some aircraft not taken up by another customer, as with a delivery this year, most of the parts for the aircraft should already been made

in current quite favorable market conditions which airline would not take up 320 deliveries this year?
 
stylo777
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Joined: Mon Feb 13, 2006 7:32 pm

Re: LH GROUP to order 2 B77W,2 B77F, 6 A320neo and up to 6 A320ceo

Tue May 08, 2018 8:16 am

I don't get it how capacity can be compared with capacity ratios.
you de facto have one aircraft flying a specific route with an available capacity, but you can't split this to 1 aircraft is flying to ABC and 0.6 aircraft to XYZ.
 
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N14AZ
Posts: 3774
Joined: Sat Feb 24, 2007 10:19 pm

Re: LH GROUP to order 2 B77W,2 B77F, 6 A320neo and up to 6 A320ceo

Tue May 08, 2018 8:22 am

Nice little order. I still see Swiss B77W's in HAJ from time to time, which is strange for me. The usual equipment is F100 (operated by Helvetic) or A320. Does anybody know why they still conduct These training flights between ZRH and HAJ, years after introducing the B77W?

PanHAM wrote:
The operation of the MD11s will be terminated by 2025.

Nice to see some variety in FRA until 2025.. Let's hope there will be no more incidents with their MD11s until then... (hard landings, Riad)

1989worstyear wrote:
]Yeah - I thought they were supposed to modernizing their fleet, not going back to the last true year of the '80s (1988).

off-topic, but I am so curious, everytime I see your user-name I feel a little bit annoyed because 1989 was a very good year for me...Why do you consider it "the worst year"?
 
WIederling
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Re: LH GROUP to order 2 B77W,2 B77F and 12 A320neo

Tue May 08, 2018 8:22 am

devron wrote:
Those six A320-ceo will come this year, are these used planes? They have been order to ofset delays in the 320-neo. I guess this will cost airbus something?


LH regularly appears as a nimble opportunistic buyer.
Airbus would like to movemore A320CEO
( filling very near term slots that can not be taken by NEO due to engine shortage )

shake hands :-)
Murphy is an optimist
 
FatCat
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Re: LH GROUP to order 2 B77W,2 B77F, 6 A320neo and up to 6 A320ceo

Tue May 08, 2018 8:40 am

I think the right plane for LH long haul is and will be the A359.
They may add capacity with the A351 but I personally can't see why they have to order the 77X, on higher density routes they may use the 748s and A380s, or?
Thanks for all your kind answers
Aeroplane flies high
Turns left, looks right
 
columba
Posts: 5231
Joined: Fri Dec 10, 2004 10:12 pm

Re: LH GROUP to order 2 B77W,2 B77F, 6 A320neo and up to 6 A320ceo

Tue May 08, 2018 9:06 am

FatCat wrote:
I think the right plane for LH long haul is and will be the A359.
They may add capacity with the A351 but I personally can't see why they have to order the 77X, on higher density routes they may use the 748s and A380s, or?
Thanks for all your kind answers


Back in 2013 when they placed the order, they wanted to split it between Airbus and Boeing. The three candidates were 787-9/10, 777X and A350.
LH came to the conclusion that the 787-9 is too small for them and the 787-10 has not enough range for their needs. So they decision was to with the A350-900 on the lower end to replace the A343 (with options to convert some of the -900s to -1000s) and the 777-9 on the higher end to replace the remaining 747-430s and A346s.

As it looks LH´s strategy has changed a bit as they use the A350-900 to replace the A340-600 in MUC and not as an A340-400 replacement has originally planned.
It will forever be a McDonnell Douglas MD 80 , Boeing MD 80 sounds so wrong
 
FatCat
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Joined: Thu Apr 05, 2018 2:02 pm

Re: LH GROUP to order 2 B77W,2 B77F, 6 A320neo and up to 6 A320ceo

Tue May 08, 2018 9:17 am

Ok, that makes sense.
I'm asking because it looks strange to me for them to have A359s, then a big jump in capacity with B779, they may conflict with B748s, imho they may fill the gap with A351s and some more B748, if it is possible.
Thanks for your kind answers
Aeroplane flies high
Turns left, looks right
 
PanHAM
Posts: 9731
Joined: Fri May 06, 2005 6:44 pm

Re: LH GROUP to order 2 B77W,2 B77F, 6 A320neo and up to 6 A320ceo

Tue May 08, 2018 9:26 am

@N14AZ - you can see 773s of Swiss or other unusual equipemtn at HAJ when an important fair like the CeBit or the Hanover fair takes place
Was Erlauben Erdogan!!!

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