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LAXintl
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Former Jeju Air CEO starting longhaul LCC - Air Premia

Mon May 14, 2018 8:32 pm

Former Jeju Air CEO Kim Jong-chul unveiled his plans to establish the country's first budget carrier specializing in medium- and long-distance flights.

"Air Premia has finished its incorporation in July last year and is currently preparing to apply for an airline license, so as to begin flights next year," Kim said in a press release. Carrier looks to offer two class class product - economy class and 42-inch premium economy class at more affordable prices than full service competitors Korean Air and Asiana Airlines.

Lease of fleet types such as the A330NEO or B787-9 are under consideration, with destinations such as Singapore, Vietnam, California and Western Europe.


Image


http://www.yonhapnews.co.kr/bulletin/20 ... 00003.HTML
https://newsroom.aviator.aero/air-premi ... s-in-2019/

=


Funny they use the 787 in their PR photo. Not sure why they mention A330NEO then.
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bigjku
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Re: Former Jeju Air CEO starting longhaul LCC - Air Premia

Mon May 14, 2018 8:41 pm

I would actually bet on the A330neo for this. There are a good number of leasing company orders with no obvious placements. I believe HiFly has already said some of those leased aircraft are going to be placed with them. The lessors are going to be eager to try and find any home they can I would think. Placing with HiFly isn’t something they likely set out wanting to do and the payments they are getting can’t likely match an established carrier running planes on its own schedule.

I suspect the lessors are looking to make deals here.
 
zakuivcustom
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Re: Former Jeju Air CEO starting longhaul LCC - Air Premia

Mon May 14, 2018 9:32 pm

Umm...both links show a 787 in it. Poor Airbus :cry2:

On the other hand, seems like we're going to have a long-haul TPAC LCC war sooner or later. Between this (Air Premia), the JL's new mid/long-haul LCC, NH's intention for MM to operate longer haul routes, and existing players that could expand (Jin Air? AirAsia X? Scoot?), seems like the pipe dream of cheap TPAC flights that doesn't involved CN3 is not far away :scratchchin: .

On the other hand, I doubt US West Coast would be the top priority. SE Asia (SIN mainly, and of course, DAD with the gajillion flights from ICN) seems to be the initial target to me. After that, HNL is the obvious one, followed by LAS. For Europe it's the typical suspect - BER, PRG, ATH, FCO, BCN, etc.
 
behramjee
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Re: Former Jeju Air CEO starting longhaul LCC - Air Premia

Mon May 14, 2018 9:43 pm

What are the main reasons for the increased demand to DAD being witnessed from Korea EU and USA over the past two years ?
 
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Rajahdhani
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Re: Former Jeju Air CEO starting longhaul LCC - Air Premia

Mon May 14, 2018 10:05 pm

Consider this as part of the greater trend of discussion, especially of the past week's news from Japan;

https://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2018/03/22/business/corporate-business/low-cost-carriers-peach-vanilla-merge-2019-ana/

Vanilla Air and Peach Aviation, two low-cost carriers owned by ANA Holdings, announced on Thursday plans to merge by the end of fiscal 2019.
As of fiscal 2016, the two combined represented over fifty percent of the seats filled by Japanese LCCs, making the merger a significant consolidation for the discount market.

“In order to survive the fierce competition, we chose this option,” said Shinichi Inoue, CEO of Peach Aviation, who joined the news conference along with his new colleague Katsuya Goto, president of Vanilla Air." In February 2018 ANA Holdings released a new five-year growth strategy that uses its LCCs to “capture demand to/from the Asian market place, which is showing remarkable growth.”


That being from late March.

Then, a week ago, from JAL;

https://www.ainonline.com/aviation-news/air-transport/2018-05-14/japan-airlines-launch-long-haul-lcc
Japan Airlines (JAL) plans to establish a new low cost carrier (LCC) specializing in long-haul international routes, the Japanese flag carrier announced Monday.

The LCC will begin with a pair of Boeing 787-8s, concentrating on destinations in North America, Europe, and Asia. Whether or not JAL plans to transfer some of its own 787-8s to the new entity remains uncertain, but currently it flies 25 787-8 in active service and four more on order. Jetstar Japan, also a JAL joint venture, will continue to focus on short-haul destinations.


Both of these plan were well explained in each respective's financial plans for their upcoming years. Melding the two, we see that both reflect on a rather interesting perspective - where the demand is, and how best to capture it.

To add to the trend, and focus on another market:

https://www.flightglobal.com/news/articles/taiwans-starlux-airlines-plans-2020-launch-445151/
Starlux Airlines, a new Taiwanese carrier planned by former EVA Air chairman Chang Kuo-wei, is targeting to launch operations in 2020.


So, from the round up this far;
1). Quite a lot of former CEOs, and new business ventures.
2). 2020 is going to then have a massive launch of many competitors into essentially the same market. Sure. past Tokyo 2020, where will the capacity go?
3). Pragmatically, the penultimate question begs; what will be the response from the other side of the Pacific?
A). Will AA's partnership with JAL extend to this new entity? Will it ultimately hurt yields for AA? Will AA do extend the 'basic economy' model that it has been touting on the trans-Atlantic routes (to combat the LCC entrants) - to the Pacific?
B). DL/KE will be connected, but how will they respond to the LCC expansions?
C). How is UA and ANA going to deal with the LCC growth as it turns longer-haul?


Fascinating times ahead, and I hope prosperous and safe growth to boot!
 
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c933103
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Re: Former Jeju Air CEO starting longhaul LCC - Air Premia

Mon May 14, 2018 10:32 pm

I don't think it will be a low cost carrier? Especially it seems like they are going to offer better seat pitch than KE/OZ (The article say they plan to offer 35" seat pitch in Economy class in addition to 42" in PE) and also put "affordable premium" up as a slogan

The link said the plan is to "Fly mid and long haul routes that are not flown by LCCs while provide a competitive service against Full Service Carrier by offering cheaper fare and wider seats than them."

And they said their economy class fare is going to be 80-90% of what FSC offer for their economy class fare, while the premium economy class would be less than 50% of the fare that FSC would ask for in business class. And the Premium Economy Class will be offering service level comparable to business class in FSC according to them.
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zakuivcustom
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Re: Former Jeju Air CEO starting longhaul LCC - Air Premia

Mon May 14, 2018 10:39 pm

behramjee wrote:
What are the main reasons for the increased demand to DAD being witnessed from Korea EU and USA over the past two years ?


Toruism growth is insane, in part due to increased LCC services, especially from S. Korea.

As for EU - Visa exemption since 2015 being the reason for the increase?

c933103 wrote:
I don't think it will be a low cost carrier? Especially it seems like they are going to offer better seat pitch than KE/OZ (The article say they plan to offer 35" seat pitch in Economy class in addition to 42" in PE) and also put "affordable premium" up as a slogan

The link said the plan is to "Fly mid and long haul routes that are not flown by LCCs while provide a competitive service against Full Service Carrier by offering cheaper fare and wider seats than them."

And they said their economy class fare is going to be 80-90% of what FSC offer for their economy class fare, while the premium economy class would be less than 50% of the fare that FSC would ask for in business class. And the Premium Economy Class will be offering service level comparable to business class in FSC according to them.


Didn't even pay attention to that.

Sounds like we have the South Korean version of Starlux :scratchchin:
 
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LAXintl
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Re: Former Jeju Air CEO starting longhaul LCC - Air Premia

Mon May 14, 2018 10:53 pm

zakuivcustom wrote:
Sounds like we have the South Korean version of Starlux


Starlux will be a full service product - lie flat seats and all.
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juliuswong
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Re: Former Jeju Air CEO starting longhaul LCC - Air Premia

Mon May 14, 2018 11:29 pm

Starlux is established to fight incumbents Eva Air and China Airlines, more so on Eva Air since its CEO was ousted from their BOD few years ago. It is an interesting case for us to see if Taiwan needs another full service carrier.

This new Korean long haul LCC brings about host of questions, how do they survive in long term when the aviation industry in Japan, and South Korea are heavily regulated? Both Korean Air and Asiana have financial muscle and multiple airline under their house to oust any newcomers if price war broke out. Not forgetting the need to butter, cream and cheese their government for route approval. Given that priority is usually given to KE and OZ.

Lastly, in Taiwan where one route, one airline policy is practised, Starlux may have issues establishing foothold in near future. Additionally they need feeds for their network.

I'm not being pessimistic, just being tad bit realistic. All these additional capacity in East Asia and South East Asia over next few years is crazy. In SEA, situation is made worse with airport infrastructure is not catching up as fast as airline industry growth.
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c933103
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Re: Former Jeju Air CEO starting longhaul LCC - Air Premia

Mon May 14, 2018 11:30 pm

LAXintl wrote:
zakuivcustom wrote:
Sounds like we have the South Korean version of Starlux


Starlux will be a full service product - lie flat seats and all.

It was reported that 이 업체의 추진 방향은 기존의 대형 항공사(FSC)나 저비용항공사(LCC)와 다른 신개념 항공사로, 국내 최초의 중장거리 전문 항공사다. which said they're going to push for a new concept that will be different from both LCC and FSC, being a carrier that would be dedicated to mid to long haul flying
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MoKa777
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Re: Former Jeju Air CEO starting longhaul LCC - Air Premia

Tue May 15, 2018 6:19 am

So, in essence, a hybrid product.
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AirAfreak
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Re: Former Jeju Air CEO starting longhaul LCC - Air Premia

Tue May 15, 2018 7:16 am

For the benefit of an additional nonstop option to Seoul, I am hopeful to see Los Angeles (LAX) as a future Air Premia destination. The 35” and 42” seat pitch for the respective “Y” and “W” cabins make this new brand an attractive option to Seoul.
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MoKa777
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Re: Former Jeju Air CEO starting longhaul LCC - Air Premia

Tue May 15, 2018 7:58 am

This just sounds like a really bad idea. Offering better Y and W than home-based competitors but no real J (one of the more profitable cabins for airlines)..?

They will not have J to boost the rest of the cabin and will clearly not have enough seats on board to go with the high volume approach.

How much lower can their costs even be in an established market with a not-so-low cost of living?
Never be proud. Always be grateful.
 
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c933103
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Re: Former Jeju Air CEO starting longhaul LCC - Air Premia

Tue May 15, 2018 8:27 am

MoKa777 wrote:
This just sounds like a really bad idea. Offering better Y and W than home-based competitors but no real J (one of the more profitable cabins for airlines)..?

They will not have J to boost the rest of the cabin and will clearly not have enough seats on board to go with the high volume approach.

How much lower can their costs even be in an established market with a not-so-low cost of living?

They want to offer business class level benefit on their premium economy with 42 inch pinch being what they describe as comparable business class, plus priority check in, boarding, and baggage handling.
Cost saving is said to be from using a single type of latest aircraft, so that fuel efficiency can be achieved and commonality can also be achieved which would cut cost in maintenance/back up part/booking management.


---

And they also they mentioned some routes that they are considering, like Singapore and Vietnam Saigon for Asia, Munich for Europe and San Francisco for North America with specific airport pair Incheon - San Jose being named.
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zakuivcustom
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Re: Former Jeju Air CEO starting longhaul LCC - Air Premia

Tue May 15, 2018 11:17 am

http://english.chosun.com/m/svc/article ... 8051501240

HEL is also listed, along with SJC.

Also, the news mention either 787 or A350, instead of A330neo. In another word, basically undecided on which plane.
 
Nami
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Re: Former Jeju Air CEO starting longhaul LCC - Air Premia

Tue May 15, 2018 7:09 pm

zakuivcustom wrote:
http://english.chosun.com/m/svc/article.html?contid=2018051501240

HEL is also listed, along with SJC.

A bit strange they mentioned HEL. Why wouldn't they instead fly to a completely unserved market such as ARN, CPH or OSL? Finland doesn't really get a whole lot of Korean tourists when compared to the numbers from Japan or China.

That kind of a route won't work unless they co-operate with AY, and that's not something LCCs usually do.
 
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PatrickZ80
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Re: Former Jeju Air CEO starting longhaul LCC - Air Premia

Tue May 15, 2018 8:17 pm

I agree Helsinki is a weird choice. The article says it's a popular stopover to Europe, but that's only true if they have a feeder. Strictly as a destination it isn't popular at all. People flying a long haul LCC will typically use a LCC feeder, but there aren't many LCCs in Helsinki. The only one that holds a base there is Norwegian, but they're unlikely to feed because they got their own long haul network. Other LCCs got only very limited presence and the largest LCC in Europe, Ryanair, doesn't fly to Helsinki at all.

Of course, what's true for Helsinki is true for most of northern Europe. It's dominated by Norwegian, by far the largest LCC in the Nordic countries. Then I'd say Riga would be a better choice as it's a base for Ryanair and Wizzair. The most northeastern base for both airlines in fact. The runway in Riga is certainly long enough to fly from there to Korea, so that shouldn't be a problem. If they make a feeder deal with Ryanair and/or Wizzair all of Europe is open.
 
zakuivcustom
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Re: Former Jeju Air CEO starting longhaul LCC - Air Premia

Tue May 15, 2018 8:23 pm

Nami wrote:
zakuivcustom wrote:
http://english.chosun.com/m/svc/article.html?contid=2018051501240

HEL is also listed, along with SJC.

A bit strange they mentioned HEL. Why wouldn't they instead fly to a completely unserved market such as ARN, CPH or OSL? Finland doesn't really get a whole lot of Korean tourists when compared to the numbers from Japan or China.

That kind of a route won't work unless they co-operate with AY, and that's not something LCCs usually do.


I was a little bit surprised about that also. HEL has some tourism, but nothing that's that big. Finnair also has that advantage of the connecting hub.

juliuswong wrote:
This new Korean long haul LCC brings about host of questions, how do they survive in long term when the aviation industry in Japan, and South Korea are heavily regulated? Both Korean Air and Asiana have financial muscle and multiple airline under their house to oust any newcomers if price war broke out. Not forgetting the need to butter, cream and cheese their government for route approval. Given that priority is usually given to KE and OZ.


I wonder if they'll even get their application approved. The S. Korea MOLIT did just reject two newcomer application (Aero K, planned to be based in Cheongju and Fly Gangwon, planned to be base in Yangyang in Gangwon-do) not too long ago. KE/OZ are most likely going to do everything in their power to at least delay the start of the airline.
 
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HELyes
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Re: Former Jeju Air CEO starting longhaul LCC - Air Premia

Tue May 15, 2018 10:59 pm

zakuivcustom wrote:

I was a little bit surprised about that also. HEL has some tourism, but nothing that's that big. Finnair also has that advantage of the connecting hub.



A large part of the Asian tourists arriving in HEL (in winter) continue to Lapland, there have been a real boom of tourism up there, especially from China. But yes, connections needed, on Finnair or Norwegian.

In 2017 Finland got 28K visitors from South-Korea, while 124K arrived from Japan and and 241K from China & HK. Together 576K visitors from Asia.

http://visitfinland.stat.fi/PXWeb/pxweb ... 6c84fc1e54
 
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c933103
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Re: Former Jeju Air CEO starting longhaul LCC - Air Premia

Tue May 15, 2018 11:18 pm

zakuivcustom wrote:
Nami wrote:
zakuivcustom wrote:
http://english.chosun.com/m/svc/article.html?contid=2018051501240

HEL is also listed, along with SJC.

A bit strange they mentioned HEL. Why wouldn't they instead fly to a completely unserved market such as ARN, CPH or OSL? Finland doesn't really get a whole lot of Korean tourists when compared to the numbers from Japan or China.

That kind of a route won't work unless they co-operate with AY, and that's not something LCCs usually do.


I was a little bit surprised about that also. HEL has some tourism, but nothing that's that big. Finnair also has that advantage of the connecting hub.

juliuswong wrote:
This new Korean long haul LCC brings about host of questions, how do they survive in long term when the aviation industry in Japan, and South Korea are heavily regulated? Both Korean Air and Asiana have financial muscle and multiple airline under their house to oust any newcomers if price war broke out. Not forgetting the need to butter, cream and cheese their government for route approval. Given that priority is usually given to KE and OZ.


I wonder if they'll even get their application approved. The S. Korea MOLIT did just reject two newcomer application (Aero K, planned to be based in Cheongju and Fly Gangwon, planned to be base in Yangyang in Gangwon-do) not too long ago. KE/OZ are most likely going to do everything in their power to at least delay the start of the airline.


Article also mentioned those newcomers applications were rejected for things like lack of document and that Korean authority are as a result tightening regulation required to start a new airlines like it is proposed that at least 5 aircrafts and 30 Million USD startup capital will be needed which they said they will meet these tightened restrictions
Nami wrote:
zakuivcustom wrote:
http://english.chosun.com/m/svc/article.html?contid=2018051501240

HEL is also listed, along with SJC.

A bit strange they mentioned HEL. Why wouldn't they instead fly to a completely unserved market such as ARN, CPH or OSL? Finland doesn't really get a whole lot of Korean tourists when compared to the numbers from Japan or China.

That kind of a route won't work unless they co-operate with AY, and that's not something LCCs usually do.

As mentioned above they are not exactly LCC so cooperation with other carriers could also be possible?
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zakuivcustom
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Re: Former Jeju Air CEO starting longhaul LCC - Air Premia

Tue May 15, 2018 11:31 pm

HELyes wrote:
zakuivcustom wrote:

I was a little bit surprised about that also. HEL has some tourism, but nothing that's that big. Finnair also has that advantage of the connecting hub.



A large part of the Asian tourists arriving in HEL (in winter) continue to Lapland, there have been a real boom of tourism up there, especially from China. But yes, connections needed, on Finnair or Norwegian.

In 2017 Finland got 28K visitors from South-Korea, while 124K arrived from Japan and and 241K from China & HK. Together 576K visitors from Asia.

http://visitfinland.stat.fi/PXWeb/pxweb ... 6c84fc1e54


I don't denied that tourism is booming (Aurora viewing tours are EXTREMELY popular, and it's not just Finland but Norway, Iceland, or places like Yellowknife in Canada). But HEL is definitely not a "first choice" destination when it comes to starting an airline, especially with zero feed at HEL.

c933103 wrote:
Article also mentioned those newcomers applications were rejected for things like lack of document and that Korean authority are as a result tightening regulation required to start a new airlines like it is proposed that at least 5 aircrafts and 30 Million USD startup capital will be needed which they said they will meet these tightened restrictions


I thought Aero K's application was declined b/c MOLIT think there are already way too much capacity on routes that they want to start? And the whole tightening of regulation is nothing more than protectionism anyway (Not just KE/OZ and their LCCs i.e. LJ/BX/RS, but also the other LCCs like Eastar/T'way/Jeju Air) IMO. Although I do agree that Fly Gangwon would went nowhere anyway.
 
c152sy
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Re: Former Jeju Air CEO starting longhaul LCC - Air Premia

Tue May 15, 2018 11:54 pm

I personally thought an ICN-LGW route was on the cards. Very large numbers of Korean students, working holiday-ers and tourists in London and the rest of the UK these days.

That said, there is already an incredible number of cheap connections between the two countries on top of the existing three daily flights between ICN and LHR.
Somewhere between Korea and the UK.
 
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c933103
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Re: Former Jeju Air CEO starting longhaul LCC - Air Premia

Wed May 16, 2018 12:11 am

zakuivcustom wrote:
HELyes wrote:
zakuivcustom wrote:

I was a little bit surprised about that also. HEL has some tourism, but nothing that's that big. Finnair also has that advantage of the connecting hub.



A large part of the Asian tourists arriving in HEL (in winter) continue to Lapland, there have been a real boom of tourism up there, especially from China. But yes, connections needed, on Finnair or Norwegian.

In 2017 Finland got 28K visitors from South-Korea, while 124K arrived from Japan and and 241K from China & HK. Together 576K visitors from Asia.

http://visitfinland.stat.fi/PXWeb/pxweb ... 6c84fc1e54


I don't denied that tourism is booming (Aurora viewing tours are EXTREMELY popular, and it's not just Finland but Norway, Iceland, or places like Yellowknife in Canada). But HEL is definitely not a "first choice" destination when it comes to starting an airline, especially with zero feed at HEL.

c933103 wrote:
Article also mentioned those newcomers applications were rejected for things like lack of document and that Korean authority are as a result tightening regulation required to start a new airlines like it is proposed that at least 5 aircrafts and 30 Million USD startup capital will be needed which they said they will meet these tightened restrictions


I thought Aero K's application was declined b/c MOLIT think there are already way too much capacity on routes that they want to start? And the whole tightening of regulation is nothing more than protectionism anyway (Not just KE/OZ and their LCCs i.e. LJ/BX/RS, but also the other LCCs like Eastar/T'way/Jeju Air) IMO. Although I do agree that Fly Gangwon would went nowhere anyway.

http://m.molit.go.kr/front/boardView.js ... d=95080126 humm
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zakuivcustom
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Re: Former Jeju Air CEO starting longhaul LCC - Air Premia

Wed May 16, 2018 12:22 am

c933103 wrote:
zakuivcustom wrote:
HELyes wrote:

A large part of the Asian tourists arriving in HEL (in winter) continue to Lapland, there have been a real boom of tourism up there, especially from China. But yes, connections needed, on Finnair or Norwegian.

In 2017 Finland got 28K visitors from South-Korea, while 124K arrived from Japan and and 241K from China & HK. Together 576K visitors from Asia.

http://visitfinland.stat.fi/PXWeb/pxweb ... 6c84fc1e54


I don't denied that tourism is booming (Aurora viewing tours are EXTREMELY popular, and it's not just Finland but Norway, Iceland, or places like Yellowknife in Canada). But HEL is definitely not a "first choice" destination when it comes to starting an airline, especially with zero feed at HEL.

c933103 wrote:
Article also mentioned those newcomers applications were rejected for things like lack of document and that Korean authority are as a result tightening regulation required to start a new airlines like it is proposed that at least 5 aircrafts and 30 Million USD startup capital will be needed which they said they will meet these tightened restrictions


I thought Aero K's application was declined b/c MOLIT think there are already way too much capacity on routes that they want to start? And the whole tightening of regulation is nothing more than protectionism anyway (Not just KE/OZ and their LCCs i.e. LJ/BX/RS, but also the other LCCs like Eastar/T'way/Jeju Air) IMO. Although I do agree that Fly Gangwon would went nowhere anyway.

http://m.molit.go.kr/front/boardView.js ... d=95080126 humm


Here is where I get the reason why Aero K and Fly Gangwon application were denied anyway:
http://www.koreatimes.co.kr/www/nation/ ... 41357.html

I believe the MOLIT article say similar things about why the applications were denied (When it comes to Korean I have to use Google Translate...so I've to base what I read upon that :white: ).

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