bob75013
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Dog found dead after cross-country DL flight

Sat Jun 02, 2018 9:05 pm

Last edited by atcsundevil on Sat Jun 02, 2018 11:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Clickbait title
 
jubguy3
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Re: It Appears That DL Kills Dogs, Too,

Sat Jun 02, 2018 9:08 pm

These stories make me so sad :(
 
Sancho99504
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Re: It Appears That DL Kills Dogs, Too,

Sat Jun 02, 2018 9:16 pm

Your thread title is misleading, sensationalist and without merit. Most of us who have worked or still work in this industry have pets. 99.9% of us would never do anything to harm someone else's animal. Some pets just cannot cope with being in the hold. Over 500,000 pets traveled and 24 died? Really sounds like we're hellbent on killing animals. Get a grip.
kill 'em all and let God sort 'em out-USMC
 
Samrnpage
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Re: It Appears That DL Kills Dogs, Too,

Sat Jun 02, 2018 9:18 pm

What a mature, grown up title for a thread. I can certainly see someone is a UA fangirl.
 
bob75013
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Re: It Appears That DL Kills Dogs, Too,

Sat Jun 02, 2018 9:18 pm

Sancho99504 wrote:
Your thread title is misleading, sensationalist and without merit. Most of us who have worked or still work in this industry have pets. 99.9% of us would never do anything to harm someone else's animal. Some pets just cannot cope with being in the hold. Over 500,000 pets traveled and 24 died? Really sounds like we're hellbent on killing animals. Get a grip.


You are absolutely right. I was using the same tone as the ones used by the DL fangirls in the UA incident.

That being said, I have not checked a dog as baggage since November, 1979, and I would NEVER put a dog in a plane's belly during a Phoenix hot summer day. The dog was small enough to fly under seat with Southwest. That would have been a far superior solution.
 
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Jayafe
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Re: It Appears That DL Kills Dogs, Too,

Sat Jun 02, 2018 9:21 pm

One of the few cases US3 can not be blamed for. With the size of that dog:

"The dog is not a pet. He's a member of our family.”


Mate, I bet you wouldn't allow your grandma to travel checked-in in the cargo hold, would you?

Sorry about the dog tho
 
bob75013
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Re: It Appears That DL Kills Dogs, Too,

Sat Jun 02, 2018 9:34 pm

Jayafe wrote:
One of the few cases US3 can not be blamed for. With the size of that dog:

o


My previous comment was an indictment of the dog's owner. What was he/she thinking when the dog was checked in and the local temp was to exceed 100 F.

That being said, DL knew the temp forecast too, and should have exercised extreme care in this situation.

Incidentally, nausea/vomiting is a symptom of heat stroke. The dog had vomited.
 
stratclub
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Re: It Appears That DL Kills Dogs, Too,

Sat Jun 02, 2018 9:40 pm

Something that is highly recommended for transporting animals is to get tranquilizers from your Vet for your pet. Air travel can be extremely frightening for an animal especially some of the more hyperactive breeds. Contrary to what many people believe, cargo holds are pressurized and heated.

No, DL is not killing pets, more likely the animal was mentally ill prepared to deal with the process of air travel.
 
bob75013
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Re: It Appears That DL Kills Dogs, Too,

Sat Jun 02, 2018 9:43 pm

If DL had AA's pet travel policy this wouldn't have happened " To ensure your pet isn’t exposed to extreme heat, American Airlines imposes an embargo any time the current or forecasted temperature is above 85 degrees Fahrenheit at any location on the itinerary. However, if your pet fits in an approved carrier that can be placed under your seat, he can travel with you in the cabin."
 
MartijnNL
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Re: It Appears That DL Kills Dogs, Too,

Sat Jun 02, 2018 9:57 pm

Sancho99504 wrote:
Your thread title is misleading, sensationalist and without merit.

Your tagline could also be better. ;)
 
bob75013
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Re: It Appears That DL Kills Dogs, Too,

Sat Jun 02, 2018 10:00 pm

[quote="Jayafe"]One of the few cases US3 can not be blamed for. With the size of that dog:

quote]

Well, it appears that is not true, as it seems that DL did not adhere to it's own pet travel policy:

"To ensure the safety of your pet, Delta places an embargo on pets as checked baggage from May 15 through September 15. If at any point—origin, transit, destination—the temperature is forecast to be above 85 degrees Fahrenheit—(or 75 degrees Fahrenheit for brachycephalic pets)—YOUR PET CAN"T TRAVEL" (caps are mine).

So by disregarding it's own policy, DL is responsible for the death of the dog.
Last edited by bob75013 on Sat Jun 02, 2018 10:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
codc10
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Re: It Appears That DL Kills Dogs, Too,

Sat Jun 02, 2018 10:02 pm

Delta will not draw nearly the public scorn of United for a similar incident, though.
 
reltney
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Re: It Appears That DL Kills Dogs, Too,

Sat Jun 02, 2018 10:09 pm

bob75013 wrote:
If DL had AA's pet travel policy this wouldn't have happened " To ensure your pet isn’t exposed to extreme heat, American Airlines imposes an embargo any time the current or forecasted temperature is above 85 degrees Fahrenheit at any location on the itinerary. However, if your pet fits in an approved carrier that can be placed under your seat, he can travel with you in the cabin."




It does. In fact Deltas is more restrictive.
Knives don't kill people. People with knives kill people.
OUTLAW KNIVES.

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bob75013
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Re: It Appears That DL Kills Dogs, Too,

Sat Jun 02, 2018 10:16 pm

reltney wrote:
bob75013 wrote:
If DL had AA's pet travel policy this wouldn't have happened " To ensure your pet isn’t exposed to extreme heat, American Airlines imposes an embargo any time the current or forecasted temperature is above 85 degrees Fahrenheit at any location on the itinerary. However, if your pet fits in an approved carrier that can be placed under your seat, he can travel with you in the cabin."




It does. In fact Deltas is more restrictive.


I posted DL's policy earlier in the thread, but after the post you quoted.

DL did not follow it's own policy.
 
hooverman
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Re: It Appears That DL Kills Dogs, Too,

Sat Jun 02, 2018 10:22 pm

It's a thing of nature. People and animals die. Even when they are on an airplane. The animal could just have died from a stroke or something. It's still painful to lose a loved one, one way or the other.
 
ozark1
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Re: It Appears That DL Kills Dogs, Too,

Sat Jun 02, 2018 11:01 pm

Sancho99504 wrote:
Your thread title is misleading, sensationalist and without merit. Most of us who have worked or still work in this industry have pets. 99.9% of us would never do anything to harm someone else's animal. Some pets just cannot cope with being in the hold. Over 500,000 pets traveled and 24 died? Really sounds like we're hellbent on killing animals. Get a grip.

I completely agree. Enough of these one sided social media induced rants to create some sort of hysteria. Anything to get some kind of thread going about an airline. It's really a tragedy what this site has become.
 
bob75013
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Re: It Appears That DL Kills Dogs, Too,

Sat Jun 02, 2018 11:17 pm

ozark1 wrote:
Sancho99504 wrote:
Your thread title is misleading, sensationalist and without merit. Most of us who have worked or still work in this industry have pets. 99.9% of us would never do anything to harm someone else's animal. Some pets just cannot cope with being in the hold. Over 500,000 pets traveled and 24 died? Really sounds like we're hellbent on killing animals. Get a grip.

I completely agree. Enough of these one sided social media induced rants to create some sort of hysteria. Anything to get some kind of thread going about an airline. It's really a tragedy what this site has become.


DL had a policy that said "we don't fly pets in the hold when the temp is over 85 degrees." DL DID NOT follow it's own policy. That likely led to heatstroke induced death for the dog. Read the article. There was vomit in the dog's cage. Vomit/nausea are symptoms of heat stroke. DL's responsible.
 
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PA110
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Re: It Appears That DL Kills Dogs, Too,

Sat Jun 02, 2018 11:42 pm

stratclub wrote:
Something that is highly recommended for transporting animals is to get tranquilizers from your Vet for your pet. Air travel can be extremely frightening for an animal especially some of the more hyperactive breeds. Contrary to what many people believe, cargo holds are pressurized and heated.

No, DL is not killing pets, more likely the animal was mentally ill prepared to deal with the process of air travel.


I hope you don't work in aviationpet transport, because you're wrong on several accounts.
1.Your so-called "highly recommended" advise is actually forbidden by all carriers, who reserve the right to refuse transport if they suspect the animal has been tranquilized.[
2. Not all aircraft are equipped to transport pets in the hold. Many of domestic Airbus aircraft are not certified to carry live animals in the hold. Many of the airbus acquired from US Airways by American can not transport pets in hold. It's on their website explicitly.
It's been swell, but the swelling has gone down.
 
clrd4t8koff
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Re: It Appears That DL Kills Dogs, Too,

Sun Jun 03, 2018 12:05 am

Sancho99504 wrote:
Your thread title is misleading, sensationalist and without merit. Most of us who have worked or still work in this industry have pets. 99.9% of us would never do anything to harm someone else's animal. Some pets just cannot cope with being in the hold. Over 500,000 pets traveled and 24 died? Really sounds like we're hellbent on killing animals. Get a grip.


Did you even read the article? This had nothing to do with the dog not being able to cope with being in the hold, and everything to do with the heat that day.

“There was a stop in Detroit at approximately 6 o’clock in the morning," said Dellegrazie’s attorney, Evan Oshan. "Alejandro was checked on. He was fine. Then approximately at 8 o’clock and 8:30 in the morning, the dog was again checked on, he was dead, and there was vomit in the cage, according to Delta.”

Vomit in the cage is a prominent sign of heat stroke.

Also as stated by another poster DL ignored its own policy of not transporting dogs as cargo after May 15th. All signs are pointing to DL’s negligence killing this dog. Not the dog being unable to cope.
 
sandbender
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Re: Dog found dead after cross-country DL flight

Sun Jun 03, 2018 12:22 am

The fault here lies with the owners and Delta. Delta did not follow their own policies and the owners did not exercise sound judgement checking their dog Phoenix. It doesn't matter that they left on the early morning flight, the overnight temperature in Phoenix 29th-30th was 75F (24C) and the tarmac had been baking in 102F (39C) heat the 29th. The hold would not have been suitable for a dog, especially a small one. We travel with our dog frequently (domestic and international). Checking the weather is always a part of determining if she will go with us or not and how.
Last edited by sandbender on Sun Jun 03, 2018 12:27 am, edited 2 times in total.
 
questions
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Re: It Appears That DL Kills Dogs, Too,

Sun Jun 03, 2018 12:25 am

clrd4t8koff wrote:
Also as stated by another poster DL ignored its own policy of not transporting dogs as cargo after May 15th.


How could this happen? When customer checks something (non-luggage) for cargo, doesn’t the airline note what the contents are, especially when it’s a live animal? Wouldn’t Delta’s system then prevent the checkin of the item, in this case a dog, since it’s past May 15th?
 
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Re: Dog found dead after cross-country DL flight

Sun Jun 03, 2018 12:28 am

sandbender wrote:
The fault here lies with the owners and Delta. Delta did not follow their own policies and the owners did not exercise sound judgement checking their dog Phoenix. It doesn't matter that they left on the early morning flight, the overnight temperature in Phoenix 29th-30th was 75F (24C) and the tarmac had been baking in 102F (39C) heat the 29th. The hold would not have been suitable for a dog, especially a small one. We travel with our dog a frequently (domestic and international). Checking the weather is always a part of determining if she will go with us or not and how.


When an is checked in to fly in the cargo hold, does the passenger have to sign anything noting that they are accepting some level of risk due to the dangers of flying for animals?
 
sandbender
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Re: It Appears That DL Kills Dogs, Too,

Sun Jun 03, 2018 12:35 am

questions wrote:
How could this happen? When customer checks something (non-luggage) for cargo, doesn’t the airline note what the contents are, especially when it’s a live animal? Wouldn’t Delta’s system then prevent the checkin of the item, in this case a dog, since it’s past May 15th?


It's been my experience that airline staff are often not well versed in their own policies for transport of pets. Some airlines are better than others but it's frequently happened that we get three different answers from checking the website before we book the ticket, the airline staff on the phone when we're booking the ticket and the agents at the ticket counter. While a lot of people do travel with pets, it's still a very small percentage of the overall traffic and not the airlines primary focus (which is transporting people).

Edit: I do want to make it clear that every airline we've flown on, the staff has always been friendly and helpful with accommodating us (I'm sure us being prepared and being patient helps). My point was just that it's not something they deal with on every flight and the policies do change, even seasonally (as pointed out in this thread).
Last edited by sandbender on Sun Jun 03, 2018 12:47 am, edited 2 times in total.
 
questions
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Re: Dog found dead after cross-country DL flight

Sun Jun 03, 2018 12:37 am

“I want to know what happened," said Michael Dellegrazie who with his girlfriend owned the Pomeranian named Alejandro. "The dog is not a pet. He's a member of our family.”

This mentality has gotten completely out of hand.

Poor Mr Dellegrazie would be crushed if he heard what my parents told me and my siblings when we got our first pet!
 
sandbender
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Re: Dog found dead after cross-country DL flight

Sun Jun 03, 2018 12:41 am

questions wrote:
When an is checked in to fly in the cargo hold, does the passenger have to sign anything noting that they are accepting some level of risk due to the dangers of flying for animals?


I'm not certain, there may be fine print on the extra paperwork but I've never read it in it's entirety.
 
PWMRamper
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Re: Dog found dead after cross-country DL flight

Sun Jun 03, 2018 2:08 am

Delta only checks pets as baggage now if the passengers are active duty military on relocation orders. They do however, take pets checked as Cargo.

The policy quoted up thread is out of date...Delta doesn't impose date specific restrictions any longer, but does still impose temperature restrictions.
 
LMFNINJA
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Re: It Appears That DL Kills Dogs, Too,

Sun Jun 03, 2018 2:09 am

Sancho99504 wrote:
Your thread title is misleading, sensationalist and without merit. Most of us who have worked or still work in this industry have pets. 99.9% of us would never do anything to harm someone else's animal. Some pets just cannot cope with being in the hold. Over 500,000 pets traveled and 24 died? Really sounds like we're hellbent on killing animals. Get a grip.


Why is the thread title misleading? In fact it is a very objective and accurate title that does not accuse Delta of any wrongdoing.

It seems you are the one that should "get a grip" as your response is rather emotional.
 
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compensateme
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Re: It Appears That DL Kills Dogs, Too,

Sun Jun 03, 2018 2:16 am

bob75013 wrote:
Well, it appears that is not true, as it seems that DL did not adhere to it's own policy.


Wrong. DL no longer accepts pets as checked baggage as of 2016, which that policy references.

Delta Cargo (the service used) has always accepted pets year-round and provided special handling. Based on the known facts, nothing wrong happened, and it’s shameful for you and others to indirectly disparage those employees because you’re butt hurt over the negative attention your favorite airline received for mishandling pets. Seriously, find something more productive to do with your time.

Both AA and DL reported “incidents” for 1 in every 10,000 pets they carried last year. And the few deaths that occurred were primarily triggered by stress, which is a risk anybody who needs to transport an animal must take.
We don’t care what your next flight is.
 
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compensateme
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Re: It Appears That DL Kills Dogs, Too,

Sun Jun 03, 2018 2:18 am

LMFNINJA wrote:
Why is the thread title misleading? In fact it is a very objective and accurate title that does not accuse Delta of any wrongdoing.

It seems you are the one that should "get a grip" as your response is rather emotional.


Please explain to me how a title “It appears that DL kills dogs, too” is objective.
We don’t care what your next flight is.
 
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compensateme
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Re: It Appears That DL Kills Dogs, Too,

Sun Jun 03, 2018 2:21 am

codc10 wrote:
Delta will not draw nearly the public scorn of United for a similar incident, though.


Uh, maybe because employees representing UA asked a passenger to store their dog in an overhead bin, or because UA flew a dog to 6,000 to Japan instead of a few hundred? Those are screw ups, this does not appear to be so far.
We don’t care what your next flight is.
 
Sancho99504
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Re: It Appears That DL Kills Dogs, Too,

Sun Jun 03, 2018 2:24 am

clrd4t8koff wrote:
Sancho99504 wrote:
Your thread title is misleading, sensationalist and without merit. Most of us who have worked or still work in this industry have pets. 99.9% of us would never do anything to harm someone else's animal. Some pets just cannot cope with being in the hold. Over 500,000 pets traveled and 24 died? Really sounds like we're hellbent on killing animals. Get a grip.


Did you even read the article? This had nothing to do with the dog not being able to cope with being in the hold, and everything to do with the heat that day.

“There was a stop in Detroit at approximately 6 o’clock in the morning," said Dellegrazie’s attorney, Evan Oshan. "Alejandro was checked on. He was fine. Then approximately at 8 o’clock and 8:30 in the morning, the dog was again checked on, he was dead, and there was vomit in the cage, according to Delta.”

Vomit in the cage is a prominent sign of heat stroke.

Also as stated by another poster DL ignored its own policy of not transporting dogs as cargo after May 15th. All signs are pointing to DL’s negligence killing this dog. Not the dog being unable to cope.

I did read the article. And there still is nothing there that says that Delta went out and killed this dog. All that is is circumstantial. I forget though, it's guilty until proven innocent regardless of the situation. SNAP will not allow you to check in an animal if the forecasted temperature is above 85 degrees. And apparently you didn't read my comment since I used info directly from the article.
kill 'em all and let God sort 'em out-USMC
 
jumbojet
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Re: Dog found dead after cross-country DL flight

Sun Jun 03, 2018 2:27 am

guess what, pets die on planes all the time even when transported the right way. Its not like this pooch was stuffed someplace he shouldn't have been,
 
klkla
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Re: Dog found dead after cross-country DL flight

Sun Jun 03, 2018 2:28 am

Why on earth would someone check their Pomeranian into the cargo hold? They are definitely small enough to travel in the cabin.
 
Sancho99504
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Re: It Appears That DL Kills Dogs, Too,

Sun Jun 03, 2018 2:31 am

LMFNINJA wrote:
Sancho99504 wrote:
Your thread title is misleading, sensationalist and without merit. Most of us who have worked or still work in this industry have pets. 99.9% of us would never do anything to harm someone else's animal. Some pets just cannot cope with being in the hold. Over 500,000 pets traveled and 24 died? Really sounds like we're hellbent on killing animals. Get a grip.


Why is the thread title misleading? In fact it is a very objective and accurate title that does not accuse Delta of any wrongdoing.

It seems you are the one that should "get a grip" as your response is rather emotional.

"It appears that Delta kills dogs too" isn't misleading? How does it not accuse Delta of any wrongdoing?
The title says itself accuses Delta of killing dogs, just like every other airline. There is not a single airline out there that goes out of its way to kill animals. Kill and die are two very different actions. Had the title read "apparently, dogs die on Delta too" would be accurate and objective.
kill 'em all and let God sort 'em out-USMC
 
AirCalSNA
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Re: Dog found dead after cross-country DL flight

Sun Jun 03, 2018 2:32 am

Caveat emptor.
 
77H
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Re: It Appears That DL Kills Dogs, Too,

Sun Jun 03, 2018 2:35 am

EvanWSFO wrote:
bob75013 wrote:


Very childish thread title. Don't like Delta? Fine but stop posting like a 13 year old girl.


Did you say the same thing when people were verbally flogging UA for their pet related mishaps a few months ago?

The sad thing is, the public cruxifiction of UA’s pet program has had a very profound negative impact for thousands of pets and their owners. The public outcry against UA pushed them to suspend their pet program. When they announced its resumption it came with a long list or breed restrictions and species bringing it more in line with its competitors. UA was by far the least restrictive pet shipper, but no longer. I live on Oahu and there has already been a spike in pet abandonments in Hawaii since UA suspended the program as there are no reasonable way to transport the pets. Service members are the most adversely impacted. For all the people calling for UA to be barred from transporting pets, careful what you wish for. For too many, it has come to pass.

77H
 
77H
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Re: Dog found dead after cross-country DL flight

Sun Jun 03, 2018 2:39 am

jumbojet wrote:
guess what, pets die on planes all the time even when transported the right way. Its not like this pooch was stuffed someplace he shouldn't have been,


You are correct. As for your stuffing comment, the owner should have protested the FAs instructions. The owner of a pet is ultimately responsible for its well being much like a parent of their child. That includes advocating on its behalf. Similar to that girl who flushed her hamster a while back. All comes down to personal responsibility.

77H
 
Bobloblaw
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Re: It Appears That DL Kills Dogs, Too,

Sun Jun 03, 2018 2:40 am

bob75013 wrote:
Jayafe wrote:
One of the few cases US3 can not be blamed for. With the size of that dog:

o


My previous comment was an indictment of the dog's owner. What was he/she thinking when the dog was checked in and the local temp was to exceed 100 F.

That being said, DL knew the temp forecast too, and should have exercised extreme care in this situation.

Incidentally, nausea/vomiting is a symptom of heat stroke. The dog had vomited.


The dog arrived fine in DTW. It wasn't PHX heat that killed him
 
ltbewr
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Re: Dog found dead after cross-country DL flight

Sun Jun 03, 2018 3:13 am

My niece and her children (my grand Niece/Nephews) are moving to Las Vegas over the summer to join her husband who now works there and UA won't transport their dog (a Shepard mix) to Las Vegas from EWR until cooler temps or if more reasonable temps even to Los Angeles. It is too big to be in the pax cabin. I guess UA's policy won''t take the risk from potential high temps with their dog. Guess her mom (my sister-in-law) will have to travel with the dog or on the same flight and she is a dog lover so won't allow it be at any risk of harm.
 
Indy
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Re: It Appears That DL Kills Dogs, Too,

Sun Jun 03, 2018 3:26 am

Sancho99504 wrote:
Your thread title is misleading, sensationalist and without merit. Most of us who have worked or still work in this industry have pets. 99.9% of us would never do anything to harm someone else's animal. Some pets just cannot cope with being in the hold. Over 500,000 pets traveled and 24 died? Really sounds like we're hellbent on killing animals. Get a grip.


People have to realize that flying is very stressful on an animal. Putting them in a crate in a cargo hold is even more stressful. Unfortunately death is a risk when you transport a pet in that manner. That being said, I transported a cat in a pet carrier on a DL flight years ago. When we arrived at our destination, the cat had pissed on itself (to be expected). The issue I had was that somehow DL had cracked the hard case. We also got conflicting information from airline employees along the way as to how the pet would be handled. But that was not long after merger so that was completely understandable. Bottom line is the pet got to its destination a little shaken & stirred but overall in good health. I just probably wouldn't transport a pet like that domestically ever again. Not sure what I'd do about international travel.
Indy = Indianapolis and not Independence Air
 
EvanWSFO
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Re: It Appears That DL Kills Dogs, Too,

Sun Jun 03, 2018 3:41 am

77H wrote:
EvanWSFO wrote:
bob75013 wrote:


Very childish thread title. Don't like Delta? Fine but stop posting like a 13 year old girl.


Did you say the same thing when people were verbally flogging UA for their pet related mishaps a few months ago?

The sad thing is, the public cruxifiction of UA’s pet program has had a very profound negative impact for thousands of pets and their owners. The public outcry against UA pushed them to suspend their pet program. When they announced its resumption it came with a long list or breed restrictions and species bringing it more in line with its competitors. UA was by far the least restrictive pet shipper, but no longer. I live on Oahu and there has already been a spike in pet abandonments in Hawaii since UA suspended the program as there are no reasonable way to transport the pets. Service members are the most adversely impacted. For all the people calling for UA to be barred from transporting pets, careful what you wish for. For too many, it has come to pass.

77H


No, because the OP didn't use such a juvenile title, which I see has been changed since I made my post. I stand by what I said, even if the title was altered.
I have been on this site 15 years. A unrecoverable email account led me to starting over. Those of you who call me a rookie, you may stop ok?
 
questions
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Re: Dog found dead after cross-country DL flight

Sun Jun 03, 2018 5:25 am

[threeid][/threeid]
ltbewr wrote:
My niece and her children (my grand Niece/Nephews) are moving to Las Vegas over the summer to join her husband who now works there and UA won't transport their dog (a Shepard mix) to Las Vegas from EWR until cooler temps or if more reasonable temps even to Los Angeles. It is too big to be in the pax cabin. I guess UA's policy won''t take the risk from potential high temps with their dog. Guess her mom (my sister-in-law) will have to travel with the dog or on the same flight and she is a dog lover so won't allow it be at any risk of harm.


Maybe the dog can travel in the cabin like one of those fake emotional support dogs. :duck:
 
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qf789
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Re: Dog found dead after cross-country DL flight

Sun Jun 03, 2018 5:40 am

Seriously can we actually discuss the topic in a civilised manner rather than complain about the title of the thread which has already been changed. Either discuss the topic or the thread will be locked
Forum Moderator
 
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NYPECO
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Re: Dog found dead after cross-country DL flight

Sun Jun 03, 2018 6:32 am

I image the temperature will determine whether or not it was the airline's fault...
 
toobz
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Re: Dog found dead after cross-country DL flight

Sun Jun 03, 2018 7:02 am

I always put the fault on the owners. I would NEVER check my pet in..especially if it’s a “family member”. It is an extremely stressful event for an animal. I don’t blame them. For them to be around the outside of an aircraft with APUs running and then shoved into the front hold of an aircraft alone is not ever a pleasant experience for them. People need to get a flippin grip and learn to start taking responsibility for their own actions. Do research. Find out what airline accepts animals in the cabin. If you can’t find one that works out-then drive!!! Idiots.

Edited: my mom was going to bring a golden doodle for my grandma in Finland from the US when she is going for a visit around Christmas. She already bought her ticket on DL and she found out that she cannot take the dog in the cabin. So she decided not to get a dog yet and will wait until she goes for another visit and will choose an airline accordingly at that point. This is how it is done responsibly.
 
MrBretz
Posts: 396
Joined: Tue Jun 14, 2016 9:13 pm

Re: Dog found dead after cross-country DL flight

Sun Jun 03, 2018 8:05 am

We don’t know the facts here. A couple of posters have pointed that to be in the cargo hold, the dog must be traveling as Delta cargo. Delta has not allowed dogs to travel as checked baggage since 2016. The dog is small and would have easily fit under the seat IF the owners were aboard. So I bet the owners were not on the plane but were shipping their dog. You have to hand your package(the dog) to a Delta cargo person. So I bet the dog died when it was under Delta care. It too bad this happened. I checked on Delta cargo once for shipping my Labrador. It was very, very expensive. If I were the owner, I would regret not paying for a round trip for myself and paying the fee for taking the dog under the seat. But ultimately, DL is responsible. Based on what I was quoted to ship my dog as cargo, I would guess the owner paid at least what a person flying one way would pay. I wonder why they chose this option. Maybe they didn’t want to spend the time with the dog while driving to Newark?
 
bob75013
Topic Author
Posts: 880
Joined: Tue Jun 23, 2015 5:05 pm

Re: It Appears That DL Kills Dogs, Too,

Sun Jun 03, 2018 12:05 pm

compensateme wrote:
codc10 wrote:
Delta will not draw nearly the public scorn of United for a similar incident, though.


Uh, maybe because employees representing UA asked a passenger to store their dog in an overhead bin, or because UA flew a dog to 6,000 to Japan instead of a few hundred? Those are screw ups, this does not appear to be so far.


The DL employee that accepted the dog for shipment in violation of DL rules that say DL WILL NOT ship animals when temps anywhere in the routing will exceed 85 degrees make it every bit the screw up that happened when the UA FA violated UA rules by putting a dog in the overhead bin.

Both apparently resulted in the deaths of dogs
 
jordanh
Posts: 265
Joined: Fri Sep 08, 2017 11:56 pm

Re: It Appears That DL Kills Dogs, Too,

Sun Jun 03, 2018 12:22 pm

bob75013 wrote:
compensateme wrote:
codc10 wrote:
Delta will not draw nearly the public scorn of United for a similar incident, though.

Uh, maybe because employees representing UA asked a passenger to store their dog in an overhead bin, or because UA flew a dog to 6,000 to Japan instead of a few hundred? Those are screw ups, this does not appear to be so far.

The DL employee that accepted the dog for shipment in violation of DL rules that say DL WILL NOT ship animals when temps anywhere in the routing will exceed 85 degrees make it every bit the screw up that happened when the UA FA violated UA rules by putting a dog in the overhead bin.
Both apparently resulted in the deaths of dogs


You keep saying that... but there is no evidence to support it. Where was the temperature over 85 degrees? It doesn't say that anywhere in the article. Phoenix would be most likely, but even the owners' attorney says “There was a stop in Detroit at approximately 6 o’clock in the morning. Alejandro was checked on. He was fine. Then approximately at 8 o’clock and 8:30 in the morning, the dog was again checked on, he was dead, and there was vomit in the cage, according to Delta.” The dog was fine during the stopover in Detroit... so Phoenix wasn't the problem.

Where is you evidence that anybody did anything wrong?
 
clrd4t8koff
Posts: 1506
Joined: Sun Mar 06, 2005 3:57 am

Re: It Appears That DL Kills Dogs, Too,

Sun Jun 03, 2018 1:16 pm

Sancho99504 wrote:
clrd4t8koff wrote:
Sancho99504 wrote:
Your thread title is misleading, sensationalist and without merit. Most of us who have worked or still work in this industry have pets. 99.9% of us would never do anything to harm someone else's animal. Some pets just cannot cope with being in the hold. Over 500,000 pets traveled and 24 died? Really sounds like we're hellbent on killing animals. Get a grip.


Did you even read the article? This had nothing to do with the dog not being able to cope with being in the hold, and everything to do with the heat that day.

“There was a stop in Detroit at approximately 6 o’clock in the morning," said Dellegrazie’s attorney, Evan Oshan. "Alejandro was checked on. He was fine. Then approximately at 8 o’clock and 8:30 in the morning, the dog was again checked on, he was dead, and there was vomit in the cage, according to Delta.”

Vomit in the cage is a prominent sign of heat stroke.

Also as stated by another poster DL ignored its own policy of not transporting dogs as cargo after May 15th. All signs are pointing to DL’s negligence killing this dog. Not the dog being unable to cope.

I did read the article. And there still is nothing there that says that Delta went out and killed this dog. All that is is circumstantial. I forget though, it's guilty until proven innocent regardless of the situation. SNAP will not allow you to check in an animal if the forecasted temperature is above 85 degrees. And apparently you didn't read my comment since I used info directly from the article.


Just because you used some info from the article doesn’t mean you read the whole thing.

DL killing the dog doesn’t implicate that it purposefully killed them. Drunk drivers don’t purposefully set out to crash their cars into other cars and kill passengers, but they’re still liable and responsible for killing them when it happens. Delta appears to have broke its own policy, which makes this worse.
 
bob75013
Topic Author
Posts: 880
Joined: Tue Jun 23, 2015 5:05 pm

Re: It Appears That DL Kills Dogs, Too,

Sun Jun 03, 2018 2:25 pm

jordanh wrote:
bob75013 wrote:
compensateme wrote:
Uh, maybe because employees representing UA asked a passenger to store their dog in an overhead bin, or because UA flew a dog to 6,000 to Japan instead of a few hundred? Those are screw ups, this does not appear to be so far.

The DL employee that accepted the dog for shipment in violation of DL rules that say DL WILL NOT ship animals when temps anywhere in the routing will exceed 85 degrees make it every bit the screw up that happened when the UA FA violated UA rules by putting a dog in the overhead bin.
Both apparently resulted in the deaths of dogs


You keep saying that... but there is no evidence to support it. Where was the temperature over 85 degrees? It doesn't say that anywhere in the article. Phoenix would be most likely, but even the owners' attorney says “There was a stop in Detroit at approximately 6 o’clock in the morning. Alejandro was checked on. He was fine. Then approximately at 8 o’clock and 8:30 in the morning, the dog was again checked on, he was dead, and there was vomit in the cage, according to Delta.” The dog was fine during the stopover in Detroit... so Phoenix wasn't the problem.

Where is you evidence that anybody did anything wrong?


Yes, I do keep saying that. The flight from PHX to DTW was a red eye departing at 11:10 pm ( I think). The dog would have been checked in at about 9 pm or so. PHX is hot in June. The temp forecast for 9 pm tonight is 98 degrees I suspect the temp that night was not a whole lot different than that. Last time I checked 98 is greater than 85.

Heat stroke is a progressive thing. Unless you actually TREAT it, it doesn't go away on it's own . The damage was likely done in PHX although the death occurred later.

Edit: I just found 8 pm PHX temps in history here they are

May 29 -- 99 degrees
May 30 - 99 degrees
May 31 - 97 degrees
June 1 - 97 degrees

I posted all four since I don't know the date of the flight.

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