Moderators: jsumali2, richierich, ua900, PanAm_DC10, hOMSaR

 
enplaned
Posts: 151
Joined: Mon Aug 29, 2016 9:49 pm

Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread

Mon Jul 20, 2020 9:55 pm

enplaned wrote:
https://beta.regulations.gov/document/DOT-OST-2020-0106-0003

ALPA says they want to see the Breeze confidential information.


https://beta.regulations.gov/document/D ... -0106-0004

Sun Country endorses ALPA's request to see the Breeze confidential information. This is getting interesting...
 
hiflyeras
Posts: 2265
Joined: Thu Jul 14, 2011 6:48 pm

Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread

Mon Jul 20, 2020 11:43 pm

I'm hoping Breeze never makes it into the air. God knows what we don't need right now is another airline in the US.
 
n7371f
Posts: 1836
Joined: Fri Jul 04, 2008 3:54 pm

Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread

Tue Jul 21, 2020 3:09 am

What is this? Why do you care? If Breeze was coming for your beloved eskimo but they have no plans to touch the west coast market except for transcon with the C-Series and Alaska's lopped off much of its VX routes from SFO/LAX.

There's actually an even stronger interest in the Breeze idea with some in the industry given the further erosion of routes and cities touched by the majors because of Covid. Many more city pairs have and will become available once the big boys have cut 20-35%.

hiflyeras wrote:
I'm hoping Breeze never makes it into the air. God knows what we don't need right now is another airline in the US.
Last edited by n7371f on Tue Jul 21, 2020 3:29 am, edited 2 times in total.
 
n7371f
Posts: 1836
Joined: Fri Jul 04, 2008 3:54 pm

Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread

Tue Jul 21, 2020 3:16 am

ALPA doesn't have a chance. Just a desperate attempt to try and show the Compass folks they "care" after taking their money for years and basically doing nothing for them (not that there was anything ALPA could've done with an airline that didn't own a single plane and consistently missed its contractual performance obligations to its major partners).

For reference, when NWA created NewAir and bought Independence Air certificate (which had an ALPA contract) and formed Compass, NWA supplied its own furloughed pilots initially.

11C wrote:
[photoid][/photoid]
enplaned wrote:
https://beta.regulations.gov/document/DOT-OST-2020-0106-0003

ALPA says they want to see the Breeze confidential information.


I don’t know the history of gaining access by ALPA to the confidential documents related to a transfer of an AOC. Does anyone have an idea of the chance ALPA has of succeeding?
 
enplaned
Posts: 151
Joined: Mon Aug 29, 2016 9:49 pm

Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread

Tue Jul 21, 2020 3:52 pm

enplaned wrote:
enplaned wrote:
https://beta.regulations.gov/document/DOT-OST-2020-0106-0003

ALPA says they want to see the Breeze confidential information.


https://beta.regulations.gov/document/D ... -0106-0004

Sun Country endorses ALPA's request to see the Breeze confidential information. This is getting interesting...


Breeze and Compass agree to ALPA's request to see the Confidential information:

https://beta.regulations.gov/document/D ... -0106-0005
 
enplaned
Posts: 151
Joined: Mon Aug 29, 2016 9:49 pm

Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread

Tue Aug 11, 2020 9:47 pm

Sun Country objects to the proposed transaction between Compass and Breeze:

https://beta.regulations.gov/document/D ... -0106-0015

To attempt to summarize Sun Country's three main points (but read it for yourself, it's not too long):

1) Breeze admits it doesn't have the money it needs to back this DOT application. Until it does have the money, it's premature for the DOT to rule on this. And, oh, by the way, Breeze said it would have the money in July and now it's August, it still doesn't have its money.
2) The 12 month operating period after getting its certificate doesn't encompass 12 months of scheduled service. That's an attempt to end-run the DOT's rules.
3) Startup date of October is unrealistic.

Certainly we have heard nothing about the money all these weeks later. Of course, we could hear about it tomorrow for all we know.
 
enplaned
Posts: 151
Joined: Mon Aug 29, 2016 9:49 pm

Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread

Fri Aug 14, 2020 2:24 pm

ALPA is fine with the transfer of the certificate from Compass to Breeze so long as that transfer includes ALPA continuing as the pilot union. Not surprising in the least that ALPA would take this stance, what do they have to lose?

ALPA does not oppose the proposed certificate transfer provided the Joint Applicants
acknowledge and the Department approves the transfer as a successorship transaction
recognizing the Compass Pilots’ Collective Bargaining Agreement (CBA)


https://beta.regulations.gov/document/D ... -0106-0017
 
User avatar
lightsaber
Moderator
Posts: 20282
Joined: Wed Jan 19, 2005 10:55 pm

Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread

Fri Aug 14, 2020 3:05 pm

enplaned wrote:
Sun Country objects to the proposed transaction between Compass and Breeze:

https://beta.regulations.gov/document/D ... -0106-0015

To attempt to summarize Sun Country's three main points (but read it for yourself, it's not too long):

1) Breeze admits it doesn't have the money it needs to back this DOT application. Until it does have the money, it's premature for the DOT to rule on this. And, oh, by the way, Breeze said it would have the money in July and now it's August, it still doesn't have its money.
2) The 12 month operating period after getting its certificate doesn't encompass 12 months of scheduled service. That's an attempt to end-run the DOT's rules.
3) Startup date of October is unrealistic.

Certainly we have heard nothing about the money all these weeks later. Of course, we could hear about it tomorrow for all we know.

I'm excited by the Breeze concept. I see a high demand for dynamic flights a few times a week. Add in good algorithms and I see many redeyes (the more efficient the aircraft, the more profitable Marginal flights become).

However, that funding is an issue. ALPA can be worked with, but money talks.

Lightsaber
Winter is coming.
 
Ishrion
Posts: 2941
Joined: Mon Feb 04, 2019 6:17 am

Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread

Tue Aug 18, 2020 8:17 pm

Breeze no longer plans to acquire Compass’ AOC

Compass Airlines, LLC (“Compass”) and Breeze Aviation Group, Inc. (“Breeze”) jointly provide notice to the Department of Transportation and all interested parties that they are withdrawing their joint application for the transfer of certificate authority.


https://beta.regulations.gov/document/D ... -0106-0018

And apparently they’re receiving their first E190 from Azul next month? https://www.aeroin.net/azul-entrega-jat ... oximo-mes/
 
enplaned
Posts: 151
Joined: Mon Aug 29, 2016 9:49 pm

Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread

Tue Aug 18, 2020 11:46 pm

Ishrion wrote:
Breeze no longer plans to acquire Compass’ AOC

Compass Airlines, LLC (“Compass”) and Breeze Aviation Group, Inc. (“Breeze”) jointly provide notice to the Department of Transportation and all interested parties that they are withdrawing their joint application for the transfer of certificate authority.


https://beta.regulations.gov/document/D ... -0106-0018

And apparently they’re receiving their first E190 from Azul next month? https://www.aeroin.net/azul-entrega-jat ... oximo-mes/


A little more color here:

https://www.flightglobal.com/strategy/b ... 10.article

When asked, the airline only says it will move forward with a “stand-alone Breeze DOT/FAA approvals/certificate”.

“It won’t impact our launch for the new year,” the nascent airline adds, without adding further detail.


The first plan, filed in Feb, was de-novo certification, funding solely from Neeleman and E-jets from Azul (plus A220s from Airbus) - with a supplemental (charter) certificate by August (this month) and scheduled service by end of 2020.

Second plan, filed last month, was an attempt to build a certificate on some of the remains of Compass, funding to be sourced from players to be named later (with an interim round of $4mm from mgmt not including Neeleman), E-jets from Nordic plus A220s from Airbus. Charter flights by October and scheduled flights in 2021.

Something changed that made the second plan necessary - perhaps, at least in part, Neeleman suffering the loss of most of his Azul holdings (which, in Plan 1, were offered as evidence of necessary financial backing).

Perhaps the certification under Plan 1 was going slower than expected. I'm not aware of Breeze offering an explanation for why Plan 1 was no longer adequate, so I can only speculate. Certainly Breeze was chewing up a lot of cash under Plan 1, judging by the financials for Breeze for the Jan-May period as reflected in the DOT filing for Plan 2.

So, during the 2Q20 Azul earnings call on Aug 13, Azul says that it is, once again, going to deliver E-jets to Breeze. This seems pretty material and you might have expected Breeze would have immediately updated DOT on this, but in the event, a couple days go by and instead Breeze withdraws Plan 2 from DOT.

So, now, E-jets again from Azul, but no building on the remains of Compass. Does this mean no more E-jets from Nordic? Unclear. Does this mean Plan 1 is back on (that filing was never withdrawn from DOT)? Will there be a big splashy announcement of a new investor? What is Plan 3? What caused turning away from Compass?

To say there are a lot of unanswered questions is putting it mildly.
 
User avatar
sunking737
Posts: 1641
Joined: Tue Feb 22, 2005 10:33 pm

Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread

Wed Aug 19, 2020 1:13 am

Maybe ALPA had something to do with it??
"Don't believe it unless its parked on the ramp, or printed in the schedule...SUBJECT TO CHANGE"

I'm a SUNDUCK......Worked for RC & SY @ MSP
 
Jerseyguy
Posts: 2183
Joined: Sun Oct 30, 2005 12:05 pm

Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread

Wed Aug 19, 2020 3:12 am

enplaned wrote:
What caused turning away from Compass?

Likely, Neeleman figured that with ALPA objecting and drawing out the process, the amount of time saved (if any) would not be worth the time and the headache that it would require. DN has a plan to secure the funding needed for the inital application.
 
VV
Posts: 1863
Joined: Sat Feb 13, 2016 1:03 pm

Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread

Wed Aug 19, 2020 8:46 am

enplaned wrote:
...
To say there are a lot of unanswered questions is putting it mildly.


Please tell us clearly what the latest credible plan is.
 
enplaned
Posts: 151
Joined: Mon Aug 29, 2016 9:49 pm

Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread

Wed Aug 19, 2020 1:34 pm

VV wrote:
enplaned wrote:
...
To say there are a lot of unanswered questions is putting it mildly.


Please tell us clearly what the latest credible plan is.


The one incremental piece of news in the following article:

https://thepointsguy.com/news/start-up- ... 21-launch/

is that Breeze will give us an update in September.
 
VV
Posts: 1863
Joined: Sat Feb 13, 2016 1:03 pm

Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread

Wed Aug 19, 2020 2:11 pm

enplaned wrote:
VV wrote:
enplaned wrote:
...
To say there are a lot of unanswered questions is putting it mildly.


Please tell us clearly what the latest credible plan is.


The one incremental piece of news in the following article:

https://thepointsguy.com/news/start-up- ... 21-launch/

is that Breeze will give us an update in September.


Thanks.

I'll take that one and wait until another update is presented by the airline in September.
 
enplaned
Posts: 151
Joined: Mon Aug 29, 2016 9:49 pm

Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread

Thu Sep 03, 2020 1:12 pm

Little tidbit - press release Sep 2 by Vistair, a document mgmt system used to prepare and maintain airline manuals:

https://resources.vistair.com/resources ... t-approach

Presumably the info concerning Breeze was vetted by Breeze. Key dates mentioned in the release:

* Operations by year end (of this year)
* E-195 deliveries starting October (next month)
* A220 deliveries starting April 2021

It's now September, so hopefully we'll hear something from Breeze in the near future concerning the timing of money and an operating certificate.
 
enplaned
Posts: 151
Joined: Mon Aug 29, 2016 9:49 pm

Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread

Tue Sep 29, 2020 12:48 am

Breeze has their money - $83mm of it. Their DOT filing says they plan a March 2021 start date, plunging straight into scheduled service (no period of charter service prior to scheduled).

By the end of the 12th month of operation (Feb 2022) they project 22 aircraft in operation. Presumably this includes some A220s, since those start delivering in August 2021.

The three big investors (totaling $75mm) were entities connected with Joel Petersen, former long-time JetBlue chair (which together with prior investments by Peterson now own about 24% of Breeze), Sandlot (controlled by David Jensen of Orem, UT) and owning 14%, and an unnamed Texas family, based in Dallas, which owns 5.6%.

E190s and E195s from *both* Nordic Aviation Capital *and* Azul are on tap, as are the aforementioned A220s.

Be interesting how the DOT and FAA see this. It's not unusual for early-stage airlines to have restrictions on their ability to add aircraft, and those restrictions are typically a lot lower than 22. In this case, Breeze is turning the difficulty level to 11 by starting with not just 22 aircraft within one year of operation, but across two completely different aircraft types.

Breeze expects to have spent $57.5mm before it operates a single flight which is... a bunch. A total of $102.8mm has now been invested in equity.

First year operating losses are projected at $30mm on $116.5mm of revenue (negative 26% operating margin).

Cash at the end of the first 12 months is projected to be $0.6mm. Presumably the plan contemplates some kind of additional financing before then, because an airline with 22 operating aircraft, 24 delivered, etc needs a bit more than $0.6mm cash to operate.

As noted in the text of this Supplement, Breeze has adjusted its plans to confront the
challenges and take advantage of the opportunities caused by the COVID-19 pandemic. In March
2021, Breeze plans to introduce scheduled service on three routes from a southeastern United
States airport to four points northeast, and from another airport farther south to four points in the
northeast, southeast and the southern plains. See Exhibit T-1 at 1. In the subsequent months,
Breeze will increase the number of destinations from the two initial airports and open another
airport in the southeastern United States with service to points in the midwest, southern plains and
northeast. See Exhibit T-1 at 2-4. Beginning in July, Breeze plans to initiate service from another
airport in the southeast to points in the midatlantic, northeast and southern plains while increasing
the number of destinations from its initial airports. See Exhibit T-1 at 5-6. In October, Breeze
plans to begin service from two additional southeastern airports with service primarily to the
northeast, see Exhibit T-1 at 7.


Speculate away!
 
User avatar
LAXintl
Topic Author
Posts: 24712
Joined: Wed May 24, 2000 12:12 pm

Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread

Tue Sep 29, 2020 12:48 am

Some easy to digest highlights

o Is in phase 3 of FAA certification process
o Pilot training began Sep 21st.
o Plan launch service with E190/195 March 2021. First aircraft on property "late October"
o First A220 delivery August 2021
o 6 board members announced including former Air Canada CEO Robert Milton
o As of August had $83mil equity funding

OST-2020-0019
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
User avatar
lightsaber
Moderator
Posts: 20282
Joined: Wed Jan 19, 2005 10:55 pm

Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread

Tue Sep 29, 2020 2:35 am

LAXintl wrote:
Some easy to digest highlights

o Is in phase 3 of FAA certification process
o Pilot training began Sep 21st.
o Plan launch service with E190/195 March 2021. First aircraft on property "late October"
o First A220 delivery August 2021
o 6 board members announced including former Air Canada CEO Robert Milton
o As of August had $83mil equity funding

OST-2020-0019

Do you have a link? I know you have good insight.

Breeze has invested heavily in the app. I'll be blunt, the current apps are 2nd rate and I've tried several. The current ones try to imitate paper instead of envisioning a purely app process. So I hope it is better functionality and not just glosier.

Personally I like the Allegiant approach, but not the Allegiant experience (a few flights per week, only fly during peak season, buy what you want). But I would want more legroom (e.g., I just bought Y+ for a vacation). I want clarity on what I'm buying (bag, onboard service, seat type and selection) not a bunch of pages to get through hoping to sell me more.

I believe I am in the market they are trying to cater to. Alas, I'm on the US West Coast and all indications they will focus East of the Mississippi the first few years. Cest la vie.

When JetBlue was new, it offered a product different enough to be my primary airline for years.
Hopefully Breeze (or whatever name it flies under) feels that way too.

They had better keep costs in check. The market for years will be brutal. E190/E195 seem to be readily available now (wait, everything is available), so hopefully they negotiated a good deal.

Lightsaber
Winter is coming.
 
enplaned
Posts: 151
Joined: Mon Aug 29, 2016 9:49 pm

Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread

Tue Sep 29, 2020 3:11 am

lightsaber wrote:
LAXintl wrote:
Some easy to digest highlights

o Is in phase 3 of FAA certification process
o Pilot training began Sep 21st.
o Plan launch service with E190/195 March 2021. First aircraft on property "late October"
o First A220 delivery August 2021
o 6 board members announced including former Air Canada CEO Robert Milton
o As of August had $83mil equity funding

OST-2020-0019

Do you have a link? I know you have good insight.


It will appear here:

https://beta.regulations.gov/docket/DOT ... 9/document

as early as the morning of Sep 29. You'll want to sort by Posted (Newer-Older).
 
Blerg
Posts: 4174
Joined: Tue Jan 09, 2018 11:42 am

Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread

Tue Sep 29, 2020 4:41 am

So does it mean the first plane has already arrived? There's one day left in October. Will be interesting to see when they launch ticket sales if they plan on flying from March.
 
gdavis003
Posts: 220
Joined: Wed Dec 18, 2019 4:59 am

Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread

Tue Sep 29, 2020 5:14 am

enplaned wrote:
Breeze has their money - $83mm of it. Their DOT filing says they plan a March 2021 start date, plunging straight into scheduled service (no period of charter service prior to scheduled).

By the end of the 12th month of operation (Feb 2022) they project 22 aircraft in operation. Presumably this includes some A220s, since those start delivering in August 2021.

The three big investors (totaling $75mm) were entities connected with Joel Petersen, former long-time JetBlue chair (which together with prior investments by Peterson now own about 24% of Breeze), Sandlot (controlled by David Jensen of Orem, UT) and owning 14%, and an unnamed Texas family, based in Dallas, which owns 5.6%.

E190s and E195s from *both* Nordic Aviation Capital *and* Azul are on tap, as are the aforementioned A220s.

Be interesting how the DOT and FAA see this. It's not unusual for early-stage airlines to have restrictions on their ability to add aircraft, and those restrictions are typically a lot lower than 22. In this case, Breeze is turning the difficulty level to 11 by starting with not just 22 aircraft within one year of operation, but across two completely different aircraft types.

Breeze expects to have spent $57.5mm before it operates a single flight which is... a bunch. A total of $102.8mm has now been invested in equity.

First year operating losses are projected at $30mm on $116.5mm of revenue (negative 26% operating margin).

Cash at the end of the first 12 months is projected to be $0.6mm. Presumably the plan contemplates some kind of additional financing before then, because an airline with 22 operating aircraft, 24 delivered, etc needs a bit more than $0.6mm cash to operate.

As noted in the text of this Supplement, Breeze has adjusted its plans to confront the
challenges and take advantage of the opportunities caused by the COVID-19 pandemic. In March
2021, Breeze plans to introduce scheduled service on three routes from a southeastern United
States airport to four points northeast, and from another airport farther south to four points in the
northeast, southeast and the southern plains. See Exhibit T-1 at 1. In the subsequent months,
Breeze will increase the number of destinations from the two initial airports and open another
airport in the southeastern United States with service to points in the midwest, southern plains and
northeast. See Exhibit T-1 at 2-4. Beginning in July, Breeze plans to initiate service from another
airport in the southeast to points in the midatlantic, northeast and southern plains while increasing
the number of destinations from its initial airports. See Exhibit T-1 at 5-6. In October, Breeze
plans to begin service from two additional southeastern airports with service primarily to the
northeast, see Exhibit T-1 at 7.


Speculate away!


Would love to see Breeze service BHM. Could be quite successful. Demand is strong for BHM-BOS and that seems to be a very doable route within their capacity. Wonder when some routes might be announced
 
User avatar
KLMatSJC
Posts: 769
Joined: Sat Oct 02, 2010 1:16 am

Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread

Tue Sep 29, 2020 8:09 am

Blerg wrote:
There's one day left in October.

Well we are in September. Unless you're a time traveler........
A318/19/20/21/21N A332/3 A343/5 A388 B712 B722 B732/3/4/7/8/9/9ER B744/4M B752/3 B762ER/3/3ER/4ER B772/E/L/W B788 CRJ2/7/9 Q400 EMB-120 ERJ-135/140/145/145XR/175 DC-10-10 MD-82/83/88/90

Long Live the Tulip, Cactus, and Redwood
 
Blerg
Posts: 4174
Joined: Tue Jan 09, 2018 11:42 am

Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread

Tue Sep 29, 2020 8:41 am

KLMatSJC wrote:
Blerg wrote:
There's one day left in October.

Well we are in September. Unless you're a time traveler........


lol... i wrote that before my morning coffee.
 
Scoots71
Posts: 18
Joined: Wed Feb 12, 2020 3:13 pm

Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread

Tue Sep 29, 2020 2:02 pm

gdavis003 wrote:

Would love to see Breeze service BHM. Could be quite successful. Demand is strong for BHM-BOS and that seems to be a very doable route within their capacity. Wonder when some routes might be announced


I second this. It's a mid-major market with strong demand for NE routes, especially BOS area, which is it's highest current non-hub PDEW. It is also a market starved for affordable routes, being among the higher priced WN stations.
 
HNLSLCPDX
Posts: 224
Joined: Sun Nov 01, 2015 5:40 pm

Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread

Wed Sep 30, 2020 4:00 pm

Looks like operations begin March 2021. Service to the southeastern part of the country.
https://skift.com/transport/airlines/

If I were to guess I would think the three cities are SAV, ECP, VPS.
 
CobaltScar
Posts: 752
Joined: Thu Mar 23, 2017 2:30 pm

Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread

Wed Sep 30, 2020 4:12 pm

HNLSLCPDX wrote:
Looks like operations begin March 2021. Service to the southeastern part of the country.
https://skift.com/transport/airlines/

If I were to guess I would think the three cities are SAV, ECP, VPS.


So they get to compete with Silver airways
 
Scoots71
Posts: 18
Joined: Wed Feb 12, 2020 3:13 pm

Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread

Wed Sep 30, 2020 4:19 pm

HNLSLCPDX wrote:
Looks like operations begin March 2021. Service to the southeastern part of the country.
https://skift.com/transport/airlines/

If I were to guess I would think the three cities are SAV, ECP, VPS.


I wouldn't consider VPS to be necessarily underserved, especially being a major Allegiant station (36 routes in peak season). And VPS and ECP are just over an hour apart, so it wouldn't make sense to serve both for a start-up.

Still holding out hope for BHM, which actually has service on a similar scale to ECP
 
FLYKTPA
Posts: 453
Joined: Wed Aug 03, 2016 4:56 pm

Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread

Wed Sep 30, 2020 4:25 pm

I’m thinking it’s gonna be the big Florida markets. The first two maybe being MCO and FLL. There’s plenty of unserved opportunity from both for a 2-4x weekly flight. In total, they want 6 southern focus cities, bases whatever you wanna call them. Should be interesting.
Huge fan of Tampa International Airport
 
RL757PVD
Posts: 3197
Joined: Fri Dec 03, 1999 2:47 am

Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread

Wed Sep 30, 2020 4:26 pm

I really think between Breeze and Xtra that PHF is going to be in the mix in a meaningful way for one of these, as is GSO. Both have decently populated catchment areas with limited competition. Routes like PVD-PHF could capture navy-based traffic and not encounter major competition as its not heavily served from Boston, and routes like PVD-GSO can capture a lot of the transplants to the Carolinas and also business travel that connects or drives from CLT or RDU and is not served from BOS. The i'd make some convenient through likes like WN used to do and tag on places like BHM and JAX. A Navy shuttle like PVD-PHF-JAX would do very well with an E195/A220.
Experience is what you get when what you thought would work out didn't!
 
User avatar
flyPIT
Posts: 1918
Joined: Wed Jun 15, 2016 6:21 am

Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread

Wed Sep 30, 2020 5:07 pm

"It will launch with Embraer E195s flying seven routes, the filing said, three from a “Southeastern United States airport,” and four from “another airport farther south.” Breeze is being vague so other airlines do not fly its routes before it announces them.

In “subsequent months,” the airline told the government, it will add routes from those two airports, and open a third base, also the Southeastern United States. By July, it said, it will add a fourth airport, again in the Southeast. And by October, it will add two more Southeastern airports, it said.
"

If I'm reading this correctly they will operate spokes from 6 southeastern focus cities within a year.
FLYi
 
MAH4546
Posts: 26252
Joined: Wed Jan 24, 2001 1:44 pm

Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread

Wed Sep 30, 2020 6:25 pm

I honestly wouldn't be surprised if they are actually major or midsize airports - like Miami or Orlando or Raleigh
a.
 
User avatar
lightsaber
Moderator
Posts: 20282
Joined: Wed Jan 19, 2005 10:55 pm

Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread

Wed Sep 30, 2020 6:57 pm

flyPIT wrote:
"It will launch with Embraer E195s flying seven routes, the filing said, three from a “Southeastern United States airport,” and four from “another airport farther south.” Breeze is being vague so other airlines do not fly its routes before it announces them.

In “subsequent months,” the airline told the government, it will add routes from those two airports, and open a third base, also the Southeastern United States. By July, it said, it will add a fourth airport, again in the Southeast. And by October, it will add two more Southeastern airports, it said.
"

If I'm reading this correctly they will operate spokes from 6 southeastern focus cities within a year.

It sounds like 5 Southeastern cities and one "further south". I would not rule out a base in the Caribbean, (Puerto Rico or US virgin Islands? I'm guessing, I admit it.)

Lightsaber
Winter is coming.
 
HNLSLCPDX
Posts: 224
Joined: Sun Nov 01, 2015 5:40 pm

Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread

Wed Sep 30, 2020 7:02 pm

The more I think about it Orlando (either MCO or SFB) has to be one of the airports. Still going to say a panhandle airport such as VPS or ECP as well.
 
enplaned
Posts: 151
Joined: Mon Aug 29, 2016 9:49 pm

Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread

Wed Sep 30, 2020 7:21 pm

https://www.regulations.gov/contentStre ... ntType=pdf
https://beta.regulations.gov/document/D ... -0019-0006

regulations.gov and beta.regulations.gov are really slow and/or screwed up the last day or two, but one or both of the above, with patience, ought to allow you to ultimately download the Monday Breeze DOT filing.
 
User avatar
lightsaber
Moderator
Posts: 20282
Joined: Wed Jan 19, 2005 10:55 pm

Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread

Wed Sep 30, 2020 10:26 pm

enplaned wrote:
https://www.regulations.gov/contentStreamer?documentId=DOT-OST-2020-0019-0006&attachmentNumber=1&contentType=pdf
https://beta.regulations.gov/document/D ... -0019-0006

regulations.gov and beta.regulations.gov are really slow and/or screwed up the last day or two, but one or both of the above, with patience, ought to allow you to ultimately download the Monday Breeze DOT filing.

A line maintenance center in Islip NY... We have a dot on the map.

They are starting to become real...

Lightsaber
Winter is coming.
 
slcdeltarumd11
Posts: 4798
Joined: Fri Jan 09, 2004 7:30 am

Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread

Wed Sep 30, 2020 11:11 pm

Islip seems like a natural fit for them. Lots of suburban people on Long island will be happy to have an alternative to JFK in these carona times. Parking is so much money near JFK and no one wants to sit on mass transit or a bus when they can walk to the plane at smaller and less crowded Islip.
 
User avatar
lesfalls
Posts: 3374
Joined: Fri Dec 06, 2013 11:58 pm

Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread

Wed Sep 30, 2020 11:57 pm

HNLSLCPDX wrote:
The more I think about it Orlando (either MCO or SFB) has to be one of the airports. Still going to say a panhandle airport such as VPS or ECP as well.


That would mean competing directly with B6 which I would think they would not want to get into at a time like this?

In addition if they are looking at serving the South East, Frontier already serves RDU and MYR which could lead them to competing with the carrier too considering where Breeze wants to focus on in the region.
Last edited by lesfalls on Thu Oct 01, 2020 12:01 am, edited 1 time in total.
Lufthansa: Einfach ein bisschen besser.
 
enplaned
Posts: 151
Joined: Mon Aug 29, 2016 9:49 pm

Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread

Thu Oct 01, 2020 12:00 am

lightsaber wrote:
enplaned wrote:
https://www.regulations.gov/contentStreamer?documentId=DOT-OST-2020-0019-0006&attachmentNumber=1&contentType=pdf
https://beta.regulations.gov/document/D ... -0019-0006

regulations.gov and beta.regulations.gov are really slow and/or screwed up the last day or two, but one or both of the above, with patience, ought to allow you to ultimately download the Monday Breeze DOT filing.

A line maintenance center in Islip NY... We have a dot on the map.

They are starting to become real...

Lightsaber


Islip was called out as their MX base in their Feb filing as well, so this point on the map has been evident for seven months now.
 
joeljack
Posts: 652
Joined: Fri Feb 25, 2005 12:38 pm

Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread

Thu Oct 01, 2020 12:25 am

So they want alternative airports with little or no service. What about LAL (Lakeland, FL). They have been trying to get service for sometime, currently has none and less than an hour from TPA and Disney World.

Lakeland is also offering incentives for service!
https://www.theledger.com/news/20200303 ... and-linder
 
User avatar
KLMatSJC
Posts: 769
Joined: Sat Oct 02, 2010 1:16 am

Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread

Thu Oct 01, 2020 12:32 am

My money is on MEM and a larger Florida city, like TPA
A318/19/20/21/21N A332/3 A343/5 A388 B712 B722 B732/3/4/7/8/9/9ER B744/4M B752/3 B762ER/3/3ER/4ER B772/E/L/W B788 CRJ2/7/9 Q400 EMB-120 ERJ-135/140/145/145XR/175 DC-10-10 MD-82/83/88/90

Long Live the Tulip, Cactus, and Redwood
 
FLYKTPA
Posts: 453
Joined: Wed Aug 03, 2016 4:56 pm

Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread

Thu Oct 01, 2020 12:55 am

joeljack wrote:
So they want alternative airports with little or no service. What about LAL (Lakeland, FL). They have been trying to get service for sometime, currently has none and less than an hour from TPA and Disney World.

Lakeland is also offering incentives for service!
https://www.theledger.com/news/20200303 ... and-linder


From reading the DOT docket, it sounds like they don’t necessarily care if they airport is smaller or has little air service itself. They care more about the actual route having no competition. There’s loads of potential opportunities from MCO, TPA, RSW etc for a 2-3x weekly flight with no competition. To me, LAL seems like more or a risk than a startup is willing to take. You know a flight to MCO will fill but getting people to fly out of LAL will be hard.
Huge fan of Tampa International Airport
 
slcdeltarumd11
Posts: 4798
Joined: Fri Jan 09, 2004 7:30 am

Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread

Thu Oct 01, 2020 2:34 am

Let's take 2019 if breeze tried to start a route we would see solid retaliation by the legacies and maybe even the ULCCs based on the route. 2020 everyone is so worried about their own survival that if breeze is well funded and starting from scratch they could have much lower operating expenses and actually have a shot.

Look at JetBlue they breezed Into lax and EWR with zero retaliation. The legacies can't do much, they are burning millions a day with no end in sight , even penny is vital for survival even if it means much smaller airlines and retrenching on routes. The legacies have so much bigger fish to fry then spending money to crush a startup, I see breeze breezing into routes unimaginable in 2019. This isn't 2019
 
ATLgaUSA
Posts: 154
Joined: Fri Mar 04, 2005 6:58 am

Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread

Thu Oct 01, 2020 3:02 am

My guesses are RDU, MCO, PIE or maybe LAL. I’d love to see BHM-BOS/PIT/RDU/MSY/JAX/AUS, but I don’t think I’d launch an airline with those.
 
Jshank83
Posts: 3565
Joined: Tue Nov 01, 2016 2:23 pm

Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread

Thu Oct 01, 2020 3:33 am

I’d say Florida airports make the most sense in the current climate. JAX/SRQ/PBI or panhandle airports probably have more non served routes than others. I guess if they would rather go against G4 over others they could set up shop at some of their secondary airports. I’d throw out CHS or SAV as a wild card. RDU/BNA also could be options.

I’m just not sure how easy it will be to stick to unserved routes when you are setting up shop in Florida. So much is served already.
 
Gulfstream500
Posts: 478
Joined: Sat Oct 20, 2018 2:30 am

Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread

Thu Oct 01, 2020 3:37 am

I think EYW might fit the Breeze business model fairly well, provided that either an A220 or E195 can land there - tickets are known to cost quite a bit, even on short hops. The airport has not had LCC service since Southwest/AirTran left several years ago.
So... when will the Northwest DC-9s be retired?
 
Jerseyguy
Posts: 2183
Joined: Sun Oct 30, 2005 12:05 pm

Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread

Sat Oct 03, 2020 8:57 am

joeljack wrote:
So they want alternative airports with little or no service. What about LAL (Lakeland, FL). They have been trying to get service for sometime, currently has none and less than an hour from TPA and Disney World.

Lakeland is also offering incentives for service!
https://www.theledger.com/news/20200303 ... and-linder


It would be great if not for one thing. The traffic between Lakeland and Disney is riddled with slowdowns and accidents. With the pandemic work traffic and Disney Traffic is down but we'll have to see how much it gets affected in the long run. Any flights would have to be based on Local Lakeland catchment and maybe some of the East Tampa catchment what those numbers look like I dont know. Alot of the hopes were based on local corporate business traffic and now thats up in the air with COVID.

According to the article I-4 had 1300 accidents in 2017 for Polk County which is a 30 mile stretch
https://www.theledger.com/news/20170606 ... terstate-4
 
enplaned
Posts: 151
Joined: Mon Aug 29, 2016 9:49 pm

Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread

Sat Oct 03, 2020 7:11 pm

joeljack wrote:
So they want alternative airports with little or no service. What about LAL (Lakeland, FL). They have been trying to get service for sometime, currently has none and less than an hour from TPA and Disney World.

Lakeland is also offering incentives for service!
https://www.theledger.com/news/20200303 ... and-linder


If you look at the most recent Breeze filing they have sample schedules for months 1 thru 12, with the airports "de-identified" (they are referred to as XXX, TTT, BBB, HHH, CCC, III, etc). It shows the lines of flying, including some multistop. There are lines that involve a stop in an intermediate point.

If you assume that one of the first three northeast airports is ISP, and note that the first base is in the Central time zone, and then look at the block hours, a decent candidate for that first base is, say, BNA. The blocks are not large enough for the base to be deep into the Central time zone (like in Texas, or New Orleans) relative to the NE.

The second base is in the Eastern time zone and again, the indicated blocks limit where it can be relative to the first three "northeast" points HHH, CCC and III. So if it's Florida, it's not deep in Florida. It's not PBI, for instance. Each of the BHs that Breeze provides basically defines "BH circles" that a route has to obey - it's not quite as defined as if they provided miles, but it's not nothing either.

Kind of surprised more of you aren't all over this. It's a pretty easy game to play. This is an important startup that's provided a whole lot of clues to where it will fly.

Specific to Lakeland, incentives can't make up for the exceptionally modest demographics around LAL and the lack of any intrinsic inbound reason to travel there. There are very few people elsewhere who see Lakeland itself as a destination.

In my view, LAL plus Amazon is a marriage made in heaven - from LAL Amazon ought to be able to support both the Tampa and Orlando areas, allowing their LAL flights to take advantage of the demand to/from both areas, which from a package planning standpoint is awesome.

But in terms of people, people live and/or want to go to Tampa and Orlando and LAL isn't as good for passengers as the established alternatives.
 
User avatar
lesfalls
Posts: 3374
Joined: Fri Dec 06, 2013 11:58 pm

Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread

Sat Oct 03, 2020 8:36 pm

enplaned wrote:
joeljack wrote:
So they want alternative airports with little or no service. What about LAL (Lakeland, FL). They have been trying to get service for sometime, currently has none and less than an hour from TPA and Disney World.

Lakeland is also offering incentives for service!
https://www.theledger.com/news/20200303 ... and-linder


If you look at the most recent Breeze filing they have sample schedules for months 1 thru 12, with the airports "de-identified" (they are referred to as XXX, TTT, BBB, HHH, CCC, III, etc). It shows the lines of flying, including some multistop. There are lines that involve a stop in an intermediate point.

If you assume that one of the first three northeast airports is ISP, and note that the first base is in the Central time zone, and then look at the block hours, a decent candidate for that first base is, say, BNA. The blocks are not large enough for the base to be deep into the Central time zone (like in Texas, or New Orleans) relative to the NE.

The second base is in the Eastern time zone and again, the indicated blocks limit where it can be relative to the first three "northeast" points HHH, CCC and III. So if it's Florida, it's not deep in Florida. It's not PBI, for instance. Each of the BHs that Breeze provides basically defines "BH circles" that a route has to obey - it's not quite as defined as if they provided miles, but it's not nothing either.

Kind of surprised more of you aren't all over this. It's a pretty easy game to play. This is an important startup that's provided a whole lot of clues to where it will fly.

Specific to Lakeland, incentives can't make up for the exceptionally modest demographics around LAL and the lack of any intrinsic inbound reason to travel there. There are very few people elsewhere who see Lakeland itself as a destination.

In my view, LAL plus Amazon is a marriage made in heaven - from LAL Amazon ought to be able to support both the Tampa and Orlando areas, allowing their LAL flights to take advantage of the demand to/from both areas, which from a package planning standpoint is awesome.

But in terms of people, people live and/or want to go to Tampa and Orlando and LAL isn't as good for passengers as the established alternatives.


If it's not PBI other then TPA and MCO could it be Tallahasee, Jacksonville or something else in the middle of Florida?
Lufthansa: Einfach ein bisschen besser.
 
GSPSPOT
Posts: 2544
Joined: Thu Sep 11, 2003 1:44 am

Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread

Sat Oct 03, 2020 9:03 pm

Scoots71 wrote:
gdavis003 wrote:

Would love to see Breeze service BHM. Could be quite successful. Demand is strong for BHM-BOS and that seems to be a very doable route within their capacity. Wonder when some routes might be announced


I second this. It's a mid-major market with strong demand for NE routes, especially BOS area, which is it's highest current non-hub PDEW. It is also a market starved for affordable routes, being among the higher priced WN stations.

I lived in Birmingham for years in the 80s-90s. What are the economic/demographic connections between that market and the Northeast, specifically BOS?
Great Lakes, great life.

Popular Searches On Airliners.net

Top Photos of Last:   24 Hours  •  48 Hours  •  7 Days  •  30 Days  •  180 Days  •  365 Days  •  All Time

Military Aircraft Every type from fighters to helicopters from air forces around the globe

Classic Airliners Props and jets from the good old days

Flight Decks Views from inside the cockpit

Aircraft Cabins Passenger cabin shots showing seat arrangements as well as cargo aircraft interior

Cargo Aircraft Pictures of great freighter aircraft

Government Aircraft Aircraft flying government officials

Helicopters Our large helicopter section. Both military and civil versions

Blimps / Airships Everything from the Goodyear blimp to the Zeppelin

Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos