Moderators: jsumali2, richierich, ua900, PanAm_DC10, hOMSaR
TC957 wrote:I think BE should pull off LHR - EDI/ABZ and leave that to BA and instead use their LHR slots to feed in from places in the UK not served from LHR, like JER/GCI/NQY/LPL/MME.
3AWM wrote:TC957 wrote:I think BE should pull off LHR - EDI/ABZ and leave that to BA and instead use their LHR slots to feed in from places in the UK not served from LHR, like JER/GCI/NQY/LPL/MME.
I've seen this discussed on here before. The slots are linked to certain cities for a time restricted period (18 months? 24 months?, not sure exactly), after that they can be used anywhere in Europe. I would be inclined to agree that they are worth more to unserved niche locations, maybe we could see that in the future and Flybe effectively open EDI/ABZ again and take the remaining unassigned pairs. In this case they could be building a slot portfolio at LHR that makes them more attractive to a buyer.
I think they can squeeze a bit more profitability out of their existing network but nothing that is going to make it an exiting investment proposition on its own.
3AWM wrote:Once those slots become tradeable couldn't they just be traded with another European airline with no intention of providing anything other than flights between LHR and other European airports? Like with AF/KLM CDG and AMS slots?
[email protected] wrote:They will be fine and are trying very hard to turn things around.
TOGA10 wrote:Wouldn't U2 be interested in those slots?
Jerry123 wrote:Yes Flybe does have a future. The losses are coming down and their revenue is going up and the amount they earn per passenger that they earn is going up. They are on the right path to recovery after some bad decisions.
If they did go bust it would be a disaster for a lot of airports around the UK. Exeter Belfast city and Southampton would be ghost airports over night. Cardiff and Doncaster and Newquay would be severely damaged. Birmingham Manchester Glasgow and Edinburgh would lose a lot of passengers and a lot of connectivity and virtually none of those routes would be replaced because there isn't another airline that can or is willing to do what Flybe does in the UK.
Chaostheory wrote:[email protected] wrote:They will be fine and are trying very hard to turn things around.
The things is, everything Christine and the new CFO said at the results announcement has been heard before from Saad and his team. Flybe is an extremely marginal airline and it seems even a pax sneezing in the cabin would push them into the red. Now that their legacy issues (E-195) are nearly behind them and with the fleet down-sized, it'll be interesting to see how they perform over the next 6-12 months. They need to start performing as they're running out of cash.
Amiga500 wrote:Might they be better off parking their planes off peak? (and reducing frequency)
skipness1E wrote:Given aviation is like an amnesiac goldfish and loves circularity, I suspect a secured future as BA franchisee.
Andy33 wrote:3AWM wrote:Once those slots become tradeable couldn't they just be traded with another European airline with no intention of providing anything other than flights between LHR and other European airports? Like with AF/KLM CDG and AMS slots?
Oh yes, they could. But KLM wouldn't be interested as there's a shortage of slots at AMS at the moment, so no way to use them, and AF has been reducing service between LHR and CDG over the years because EuroStar rail services and Easyjet between them have taken an increasing proportion of LON-PAR O&D traffic, leaving mainly the flights that exist for connections. Lufthansa Group might be a possibility, but LHR slots timed with a 45 minute turn are really optimised for domestic or the shortest of international shorthaul. This does seriously affect the tradeable value of the slots.
[email protected] wrote:They will be fine and are trying very hard to turn things around.
[email protected] wrote:They will be fine and are trying very hard to turn things around.
Jerry123 wrote:Yes Flybe does have a future. The losses are coming down and their revenue is going up and the amount they earn per passenger that they earn is going up. They are on the right path to recovery after some bad decisions.
If they did go bust it would be a disaster for a lot of airports around the UK. Exeter Belfast city and Southampton would be ghost airports over night. Cardiff and Doncaster and Newquay would be severely damaged. Birmingham Manchester Glasgow and Edinburgh would lose a lot of passengers and a lot of connectivity and virtually none of those routes would be replaced because there isn't another airline that can or is willing to do what Flybe does in the UK.
JannEejit wrote:I presume Stobart are watching with interest ? Were they not quoted as a potential Flybe buyer a few months ago ?
davidjohnson6 wrote:Would BA really want Flybe as a franchisee ? Flybe have only 7 slot pairs at Heathrow and no 150+ seat jets. That means relatively little opportunity for feeder traffic - and I don't see BA handing the LHR-EDI route over to Flybe in a significant way. So apart from the franchise fee, BA gain little. Furthermore, do BA really want all the trouble that goes with extending one's brand to a troubled smaller player in return for the franchise fee ?
BrianDromey wrote:I’m sure flyBe does have a future, it has a strong route network serving U.K. business and leisure travellers. It has a cost problem and an image problem. It also has a perception of not being very reliable. flyBe needs to decide what it wants to be, either an LCC, a high-frequency domestic airline or a niche/boutique low frequency, convenient option to Europe from small regional airports like CWL and DSA.
The jet fleet is clearly a cost problem and needs to be dumped. If flyBe feel the need for jets, other threads claim A319s (and probably 73G)are going for little more than scrap value. But if the Q400s can’t fly a route and the yield can’t justify increasing frequency, should flyBe even bother? However Volotea do seem to be carving a niche for themselves.
Finally I’m concerned that by acting as a feeder to all kinds of airlines, flyBe is getting a high volume of passengers but little revenue, which is not unlike bmi and they seem to grab any opportunity that comes their way with franchisees such as Stobart, Blue Islands, Eastern but dropping Loganair, adding new airports like SEN, LHR, DSA and CWL, the debacle with the Scottish routes and short-notice schedule changes.
LHRFlyer wrote:BA turned against having franchises in the UK 10+ years ago when GB Airways was bought by easyJet. It terminated the Loganair franchise at the same time.
BA effectively paid Flybe to take the old BA Connect regional operation off its hands. I certainly don't think IAG would be interested in buying the airline as it would not be the sort of "transformational" deal that IAG seeks.
TurnaroudUK wrote:Could Flybe be bought out and fly under the BA Cityflyer umbrella with them making moves back into regional markets couldn't they in theory operate in the regions again but with lower costs. The backing of IAG could do wonders for BE. The codeshare and feeder service that BE provide for regional Airports especially MAN is vital for UK aviaiton without BE we would not see the expansion we are seeing in the North. That being said some cost cutting on loss making routes should be undertaken.
chunhimlai wrote:buy 25 a320neo and 25 B787
and build a international hub in EXE
Intercontinental route
EXE-YYZ
EXE-YVR
EXE-JFK
EXE-LAX
EXE-SFO
EXE-MIA
EXE-IAD
EXE-JNB-CPT
EXE-DXB
EXE-BKK
EXE-BOM
EXE-DEL
EXE-HKG
EXE-SIN
EXE-PVG
EXE-PEK
EXE-NRT
EXE-GRU-EZE
chunhimlai wrote:buy 25 a320neo and 25 B787
and build a international hub in EXE
Intercontinental route
EXE-YYZ
EXE-YVR
EXE-JFK
EXE-LAX
EXE-SFO
EXE-MIA
EXE-IAD
EXE-JNB-CPT
EXE-DXB
EXE-BKK
EXE-BOM
EXE-DEL
EXE-HKG
EXE-SIN
EXE-PVG
EXE-PEK
EXE-NRT
EXE-GRU-EZE
tomkell92 wrote:chunhimlai wrote:buy 25 a320neo and 25 B787
and build a international hub in EXE
Intercontinental route
EXE-YYZ
EXE-YVR
EXE-JFK
EXE-LAX
EXE-SFO
EXE-MIA
EXE-IAD
EXE-JNB-CPT
EXE-DXB
EXE-BKK
EXE-BOM
EXE-DEL
EXE-HKG
EXE-SIN
EXE-PVG
EXE-PEK
EXE-NRT
EXE-GRU-EZE
I assume you mean EXT (Exeter) ?
I don't think there's enough demand (if any) from Exeter to these places.
TurnaroudUK wrote:Could Flybe be bought out and fly under the BA Cityflyer umbrella with them making moves back into regional markets couldn't they in theory operate in the regions again but with lower costs. The backing of IAG could do wonders for BE. The codeshare and feeder service that BE provide for regional Airports especially MAN is vital for UK aviaiton without BE we would not see the expansion we are seeing in the North. That being said some cost cutting on loss making routes should be undertaken.
TurnaroudUK wrote:Could Flybe be bought out and fly under the BA Cityflyer umbrella with them making moves back into regional markets couldn't they in theory operate in the regions again but with lower costs. The backing of IAG could do wonders for BE. The codeshare and feeder service that BE provide for regional Airports especially MAN is vital for UK aviaiton without BE we would not see the expansion we are seeing in the North. That being said some cost cutting on loss making routes should be undertaken.
Channex757 wrote:It will be interesting to see what Airline Investments does. They have two strong brands in Loganair and BMI Regional, and can apparently put together a decent enough operation from Scotland. LM used to be the biggest regional player at Manchester and I have a feeling they might well be back soon if the ATR happens.
There is the potential for something big to happen in British regional airlines space. None of which would be good for BE. A link-up between Stobart in the south and west, and AIL in the north and Scotland, could shove BE off the map.
Just my musing but a Stobart-AIL deal could field a decent fleet of the latest ATRs as well as SAABs and Embraer jets.
chunhimlai wrote:tomkell92 wrote:chunhimlai wrote:buy 25 a320neo and 25 B787
and build a international hub in EXE
Intercontinental route
EXE-YYZ
EXE-YVR
EXE-JFK
EXE-LAX
EXE-SFO
EXE-MIA
EXE-IAD
EXE-JNB-CPT
EXE-DXB
EXE-BKK
EXE-BOM
EXE-DEL
EXE-HKG
EXE-SIN
EXE-PVG
EXE-PEK
EXE-NRT
EXE-GRU-EZE
I assume you mean EXT (Exeter) ?
I don't think there's enough demand (if any) from Exeter to these places.
Southeest England is the least served UK region
There is seasonal charter brs-mco/puj and 5w cwl-doh only