User avatar
FA9295
Topic Author
Posts: 1094
Joined: Thu Feb 25, 2016 7:44 pm

Re: Sun Country adds 5 routes from PDX

Tue Jul 10, 2018 12:17 am

Dreamflight767 wrote:
Not that it's a hug significance but this must be a pain to AS. Do they have free resources to defend against this small battle with SY?

AS already has a major fleet/pilot shortage as it is, so I don't think they can do much against SY here.
No, "FA" in my username does not stand for "flight attendant"...
 
User avatar
RWA380
Posts: 5057
Joined: Fri Feb 18, 2005 10:51 am

Re: Sun Country adds 5 routes from PDX

Tue Jul 10, 2018 12:44 am

Dreamflight767 wrote:
Not that it's a hug significance but this must be a pain to AS. Do they have free resources to defend against this small battle with SY?


These are all easy routes to fill planes on in the winter from PDX. 4 carriers on PDX-HNL, IIRC this is a first, for the short time DL operates it's seasonal non-stop.
707, 717, 720, 727-1/2, 737-1/2/3/4/5/7/8/9, 747-1/2/3/4, 757, 767-2/3/4, 777, DC-8-5/6/7, DC-9-1/3/5, MD-80/2/3/7/8, DC-10-10/30/40, MD-11, F-27, F-28, SWM, J31, D38, DH7, DH8, DH4 SD-330, B-146, L-1011-2/500, ATR-42/72, VCV, A-300/310/318/319/320, CR2/7
 
Dreamflight767
Posts: 443
Joined: Sun Dec 28, 2008 10:43 pm

Re: Sun Country adds 5 routes from PDX

Tue Jul 10, 2018 5:33 am

RWA380 wrote:
Dreamflight767 wrote:
Not that it's a hug significance but this must be a pain to AS. Do they have free resources to defend against this small battle with SY?


These are all easy routes to fill planes on in the winter from PDX. 4 carriers on PDX-HNL, IIRC this is a first, for the short time DL operates it's seasonal non-stop.


I hear what you're saying but my question, does AS have the planes available? As I've read around here, AS seems to be fighting much bigger battles in CA and up in SEA.

Not that I have anything against AS, but it would be interesting to see if SY can gain any traction and grow in PDX as AS seems to think throwing a bunch of Q400 up to SEA is a way to maintain hub status.

That said, a lot of airlines have come, gone, and shrunk significantly at PDX so maybe SY doesn't stand a chance.

And yes, DL (or maybe it was NW) did have a flight to HNL. It was an early evening flight (around 17:00 Local) and rotated between a 752 and the 753.
 
pdxav8r
Posts: 171
Joined: Mon Jun 10, 2013 3:15 am

Re: Sun Country adds 5 routes from PDX

Tue Jul 10, 2018 5:54 am

Dreamflight767 wrote:
RWA380 wrote:
Dreamflight767 wrote:
Not that it's a hug significance but this must be a pain to AS. Do they have free resources to defend against this small battle with SY?


These are all easy routes to fill planes on in the winter from PDX. 4 carriers on PDX-HNL, IIRC this is a first, for the short time DL operates it's seasonal non-stop.


I hear what you're saying but my question, does AS have the planes available? As I've read around here, AS seems to be fighting much bigger battles in CA and up in SEA.

Not that I have anything against AS, but it would be interesting to see if SY can gain any traction and grow in PDX as AS seems to think throwing a bunch of Q400 up to SEA is a way to maintain hub status.

That said, a lot of airlines have come, gone, and shrunk significantly at PDX so maybe SY doesn't stand a chance.

And yes, DL (or maybe it was NW) did have a flight to HNL. It was an early evening flight (around 17:00 Local) and rotated between a 752 and the 753.


I will answer your question. WTF are you smoking? Defend against an airline offering seasonal service for two, maybe three flights per day against AS in PDX? A small battle? Dude (or dudette), really? SY is picking low hanging fruit, like most low cost airlines. SY’s route planner is from AS, so they know where to pick and choose at PDX. No worry about the resources to deal with a fly in the ointment.
 
PlanesNTrains
Posts: 8303
Joined: Tue Feb 01, 2005 4:19 pm

Re: Sun Country adds 5 routes from PDX

Tue Jul 10, 2018 7:54 am

Dreamflight767 wrote:
Not that I have anything against AS, but it would be interesting to see if SY can gain any traction and grow in PDX as AS seems to think throwing a bunch of Q400 up to SEA is a way to maintain hub status..


Current AS schedule (this is 7/23/2018 - from the AS Hub thread):

PDX:
319: 3
320: 6
73G: 5
738: 28
739: 17
DH4: 56
E75: 32 (12 QX, 20 OO)

Total = 147
40.1% Mainline

A lot of smaller planes, but realistically almost 2/3 are either mainline or Ejets. I think PDX has actually done pretty well with AS of late, though certainly AS is notorious (if that's the right word) for building up places then bringing them back down, for example, San Jose (in past years). However, 147 daily flights - 59 on mainline alone - is a pretty good number, and certainly a bit more than primarily Q's to SEA. :-)
-Dave


”Yet somewhere in Iceland a great anger stirred in the soul of a troubled individual...” - Revelation
 
User avatar
FA9295
Topic Author
Posts: 1094
Joined: Thu Feb 25, 2016 7:44 pm

Re: Sun Country adds 5 routes from PDX

Wed Jul 11, 2018 3:32 am

PlanesNTrains wrote:
pdxav8r wrote:
Dreamflight767 wrote:

I hear what you're saying but my question, does AS have the planes available? As I've read around here, AS seems to be fighting much bigger battles in CA and up in SEA.

Not that I have anything against AS, but it would be interesting to see if SY can gain any traction and grow in PDX as AS seems to think throwing a bunch of Q400 up to SEA is a way to maintain hub status.

That said, a lot of airlines have come, gone, and shrunk significantly at PDX so maybe SY doesn't stand a chance.

And yes, DL (or maybe it was NW) did have a flight to HNL. It was an early evening flight (around 17:00 Local) and rotated between a 752 and the 753.


I will answer your question. WTF are you smoking? Defend against an airline offering seasonal service for two, maybe three flights per day against AS in PDX? A small battle? Dude (or dudette), really? SY is picking low hanging fruit, like most low cost airlines. SY’s route planner is from AS, so they know where to pick and choose at PDX. No worry about the resources to deal with a fly in the ointment.

Current AS schedule (this is 7/23/2018 - from the AS Hub thread):

PDX:
319: 3
320: 6
73G: 5
738: 28
739: 17
DH4: 56
E75: 32 (12 QX, 20 OO)

Total = 147
40.1% Mainline

A lot of smaller planes, but realistically almost 2/3 are either mainline or Ejets. I think PDX has actually done pretty well with AS of late, though certainly AS is notorious (if that's the right word) for building up places then bringing them back down, for example, San Jose (in past years). However, 147 daily flights - 59 on mainline alone - is a pretty good number, and certainly a bit more than primarily Q's to SEA. :-)

I think Dreamflight767's point is that AS is ending some routes from PDX and moving them to SEA. When PDX-STL ended, SEA got an extra flight to STL. However, at the same time, PDX-SEA gets a large increase in frequencies. With that being said, it's probable to infer that AS is using the local PDX traffic in the war against DL at SEA. In ending some PDX routes, moving them to SEA, and then increasing PDX-SEA frequencies, AS can get more passengers on their SEA flights to better compete against DL.
No, "FA" in my username does not stand for "flight attendant"...
 
User avatar
spinkid
Posts: 1637
Joined: Fri Jul 20, 2001 5:59 am

Re: Sun Country adds 5 routes from PDX

Wed Jul 11, 2018 5:31 am

Somewhat off topic, but in looking at the route map. I realized Reno is the only city that doesn't connect with MSP. It's only service will be to PDX.

I imagine RNO-MSP must be coming soon
 
Jshank83
Posts: 1874
Joined: Tue Nov 01, 2016 2:23 pm

Re: Sun Country adds 5 routes from PDX

Wed Jul 11, 2018 1:17 pm

FA9295 wrote:

When PDX-STL ended, SEA got an extra flight to STL. However, at the same time, PDX-SEA gets a large increase in frequencies.


They pretty much just switched STL-PDX to STL-SAN. They cut PDX the end of Nov 2017, SAN started Dec 2017. PDX only came back for a couple months in the spring after that.

STL-SEA has had 2x frequency for awhile. It goes down to 1x over the winter at times. I think it was just normal seasonal timing for SEA to go from 1x to 2x when PDX was cut.
 
User avatar
FA9295
Topic Author
Posts: 1094
Joined: Thu Feb 25, 2016 7:44 pm

Re: Sun Country adds 5 routes from PDX

Wed Jul 11, 2018 7:35 pm

Jshank83 wrote:
FA9295 wrote:

When PDX-STL ended, SEA got an extra flight to STL. However, at the same time, PDX-SEA gets a large increase in frequencies.


They pretty much just switched STL-PDX to STL-SAN. They cut PDX the end of Nov 2017, SAN started Dec 2017. PDX only came back for a couple months in the spring after that.

STL-SEA has had 2x frequency for awhile. It goes down to 1x over the winter at times. I think it was just normal seasonal timing for SEA to go from 1x to 2x when PDX was cut.

That's true. I think that this may have happened because there are more consistent E175 routes out of SAN, and more consistent 737 routes out of PDX. If there was demand for a 737 PDX-STL flight, then Alaska would likely have kept it going.
No, "FA" in my username does not stand for "flight attendant"...
 
User avatar
stl07
Posts: 735
Joined: Mon May 01, 2017 8:57 pm

Re: Sun Country adds 5 routes from PDX

Wed Jul 11, 2018 10:20 pm

FA9295 wrote:
Jshank83 wrote:
FA9295 wrote:

When PDX-STL ended, SEA got an extra flight to STL. However, at the same time, PDX-SEA gets a large increase in frequencies.


They pretty much just switched STL-PDX to STL-SAN. They cut PDX the end of Nov 2017, SAN started Dec 2017. PDX only came back for a couple months in the spring after that.

STL-SEA has had 2x frequency for awhile. It goes down to 1x over the winter at times. I think it was just normal seasonal timing for SEA to go from 1x to 2x when PDX was cut.

That's true. I think that this may have happened because there are more consistent E175 routes out of SAN, and more consistent 737 routes out of PDX. If there was demand for a 737 PDX-STL flight, then Alaska would likely have kept it going.

The day after STL-PDX ended STL-SEA's 2nd flight went from rj to 737
 
Jshank83
Posts: 1874
Joined: Tue Nov 01, 2016 2:23 pm

Re: Sun Country adds 5 routes from PDX

Wed Jul 11, 2018 11:21 pm

stl07 wrote:
FA9295 wrote:
Jshank83 wrote:

They pretty much just switched STL-PDX to STL-SAN. They cut PDX the end of Nov 2017, SAN started Dec 2017. PDX only came back for a couple months in the spring after that.

STL-SEA has had 2x frequency for awhile. It goes down to 1x over the winter at times. I think it was just normal seasonal timing for SEA to go from 1x to 2x when PDX was cut.

That's true. I think that this may have happened because there are more consistent E175 routes out of SAN, and more consistent 737 routes out of PDX. If there was demand for a 737 PDX-STL flight, then Alaska would likely have kept it going.

The day after STL-PDX ended STL-SEA's 2nd flight went from rj to 737


They have been running two 737s in summer. They back off in winter to one 737. This year it looks like they are going to one 737 in winter (like last year) I am guessing the same day they cut PDX is when they did a normal schedule shift and that is when it goes back to two 737s usually. When PDX started back up in March, SEA went from one 737 to one 737 and one RJ the same day. But anyway, this is a Sun Country thread so I'll leave it there.

It would be nice if Sun Country would run STL-PDX in summer. STL-PDX always has good loads spring to fall.
 
Dreamflight767
Posts: 443
Joined: Sun Dec 28, 2008 10:43 pm

Re: Sun Country adds 5 routes from PDX

Thu Jul 12, 2018 6:25 am

[/quote]
I will answer your question. WTF are you smoking? Defend against an airline offering seasonal service for two, maybe three flights per day against AS in PDX? A small battle? Dude (or dudette), really? SY is picking low hanging fruit, like most low cost airlines. SY’s route planner is from AS, so they know where to pick and choose at PDX. No worry about the resources to deal with a fly in the ointment.[/quote]

You just re-affirmed my point. Not to sound insulting but the PDX market overall is low hanging fruit - I mean just look how PDX is treated by most carries. Off and on, seasonal, once daily or just a few times a week, etc. Also PDX is a lot more cost sensitive. Unlike the Bay Area, SEA, SOCAL, etc., (most) people in PDX aren't going to pay an extra few bucks to earn miles or maintain an elite status so there is very little allegiance.

If SY offers service to the same cities as AS (or QX) with a 737 and at a lower cost point, SY may become a big throne in AS side. But just like other carries, I'm not sure how long SY will hang around. So, I too am just contradicting myself.
 
User avatar
FA9295
Topic Author
Posts: 1094
Joined: Thu Feb 25, 2016 7:44 pm

Re: Sun Country adds 5 routes from PDX

Mon Sep 17, 2018 1:16 am

Just posting this as a courtesy notice here: It looks like Sun Country has dropped PDX-RNO before it even began. See this OAG thread: viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1404043
No, "FA" in my username does not stand for "flight attendant"...
 
lavalampluva
Posts: 980
Joined: Tue Jun 24, 2014 7:33 pm

Re: Sun Country adds 5 routes from PDX

Mon Sep 17, 2018 2:40 am

sunking737 wrote:
Pilots are limited to 8 hr duty day. F/A are not. I knew F/A who worked MSP-SJU-MSP flights. They can fly extra crew onboard too. They sit in back most folks don't even know

I was wondering thst too. There always seems to be a lot of pilots who live in the PacNW. Maybe they’ll hire some.
Remind me to send a thank you note to Mr. Boeing.
 
User avatar
LAX772LR
Posts: 10911
Joined: Sun Nov 09, 2014 11:06 pm

Re: Sun Country adds 5 routes from PDX

Mon Sep 17, 2018 4:20 am

lhpdx wrote:
My wishlist for Sun Country is a seasonal MSY, FLL, TPA, and ANC out of PDX............

I always wondered who'd be the one to eventually introduce PDX-MSY. It's the only FAA large-hub with no nonstop to MSY.

SY makes an interesting proposal, and perhaps they would indeed be more game for the risk (and the likely low initial frequency) than would WN or AS.
I myself, suspect a more prosaic motive... ~Thranduil
 
User avatar
FA9295
Topic Author
Posts: 1094
Joined: Thu Feb 25, 2016 7:44 pm

Re: Sun Country adds 5 routes from PDX

Mon Sep 17, 2018 4:58 am

LAX772LR wrote:
lhpdx wrote:
My wishlist for Sun Country is a seasonal MSY, FLL, TPA, and ANC out of PDX............

I always wondered who'd be the one to eventually introduce PDX-MSY. It's the only FAA large-hub with no nonstop to MSY.

SY makes an interesting proposal, and perhaps they would indeed be more game for the risk (and the likely low initial frequency) than would WN or AS.

MSY is the second largest unserved market out of PDX (#1 is IND). It's around 120 PDEW on that route, so it's only a matter of time, IMO... :D
No, "FA" in my username does not stand for "flight attendant"...
 
User avatar
LAX772LR
Posts: 10911
Joined: Sun Nov 09, 2014 11:06 pm

Re: Sun Country adds 5 routes from PDX

Mon Sep 17, 2018 5:35 am

FA9295 wrote:
MSY is the second largest unserved market out of PDX (#1 is IND). It's around 120 PDEW on that route, so it's only a matter of time, IMO...

A poster on the MSY Spotters Fbook page found recent numbers that show it's closer to 150 now--- thus even more so to your point. ;)

Image

MSY's all-new terminal opens in February (foreground above; all scheduled airlines moving to it).
It'd be nice if a route like PDX were to become its first new domestic route to serve it. :spin:
I myself, suspect a more prosaic motive... ~Thranduil
 
rainaviation
Posts: 16
Joined: Mon Sep 17, 2018 10:28 pm

Re: Sun Country adds 5 routes from PDX

Tue Sep 18, 2018 1:18 am

Sun Country added service from PDX to SFO today. Thoughts on this?
 
User avatar
stl07
Posts: 735
Joined: Mon May 01, 2017 8:57 pm

Re: Sun Country adds 5 routes from PDX

Tue Sep 18, 2018 1:39 am

rainaviation wrote:
Sun Country added service from PDX to SFO today. Thoughts on this?

Weird is all I can say
 
flyboy7974
Posts: 1279
Joined: Sat Jan 18, 2003 4:35 pm

Re: Sun Country adds 5 routes from PDX

Tue Sep 18, 2018 1:50 am

stl07 wrote:
rainaviation wrote:
Sun Country added service from PDX to SFO today. Thoughts on this?

Weird is all I can say


That and also SFO PSP service is announced on their website
 
User avatar
RWA380
Posts: 5057
Joined: Fri Feb 18, 2005 10:51 am

Re: Sun Country adds 5 routes from PDX

Tue Sep 18, 2018 2:11 am

rainaviation wrote:
Sun Country added service from PDX to SFO today. Thoughts on this?


Fares are already about $100 r/t PDX-SFO. It must be replacing the PDX-RNO flight SY just cut because that was a Mo & Fr schedule & so is this new SFO service. I do not see this as anything more than an add to a city that gets decent traffic from PDX & was in the SY family already.

That's shooting fish in a barrel during the winter SFO-PSP, so the flight does go PDX-SFO-PSP, but they change the flight number at SFO, on other days they still fly non-stop PDX=PSP.
707, 717, 720, 727-1/2, 737-1/2/3/4/5/7/8/9, 747-1/2/3/4, 757, 767-2/3/4, 777, DC-8-5/6/7, DC-9-1/3/5, MD-80/2/3/7/8, DC-10-10/30/40, MD-11, F-27, F-28, SWM, J31, D38, DH7, DH8, DH4 SD-330, B-146, L-1011-2/500, ATR-42/72, VCV, A-300/310/318/319/320, CR2/7
 
User avatar
sunking737
Posts: 1308
Joined: Tue Feb 22, 2005 10:33 pm

Re: Sun Country adds 5 routes from PDX

Tue Sep 18, 2018 2:21 am

3 words that bring terror to the traveling public..."SUBJECT TO CHANGE"
I'm a SUNDUCK......Worked for RC & SY @ MSP
 
MSPNWA
Posts: 2648
Joined: Thu Apr 23, 2009 2:48 am

Re: Sun Country adds 5 routes from PDX

Tue Sep 18, 2018 3:53 am

PDX-SFO seems to make a lot more sense than PDX-RNO. No ULCC on PDX-SFO at the moment either. Might be some room for SY there.
 
User avatar
RWA380
Posts: 5057
Joined: Fri Feb 18, 2005 10:51 am

Re: Sun Country adds 5 routes from PDX

Tue Sep 18, 2018 4:43 am

MSPNWA wrote:
PDX-SFO seems to make a lot more sense than PDX-RNO. No ULCC on PDX-SFO at the moment either. Might be some room for SY there.


Looks like $96.50 r/t is the best fare on SY, I'm paying $110 r/t on AS in the past month, both fares are all in. I get free carry on's with AS & that's all I need for three days, on SY I would pay more for that. I get a free seat on AS, one pays for that on SY. SY offers 2 x weekly flights in each direction, while AS has 7 x daily service. I get miles on AS & segments towards gold.

In my opinion SY should have connected TUS to PDX as a 2 x weekly flight, or maybe SAN, but they are going to get trounced PDX-SFO. I bet the abysmal pre-bookings for their RNO service, people don't go to Reno any longer from here. it used to be a well traveled route by a myriad of carriers, but QX has it covered. SFO was a very last minute thought & the destination choice shows.
Last edited by RWA380 on Tue Sep 18, 2018 5:01 am, edited 1 time in total.
707, 717, 720, 727-1/2, 737-1/2/3/4/5/7/8/9, 747-1/2/3/4, 757, 767-2/3/4, 777, DC-8-5/6/7, DC-9-1/3/5, MD-80/2/3/7/8, DC-10-10/30/40, MD-11, F-27, F-28, SWM, J31, D38, DH7, DH8, DH4 SD-330, B-146, L-1011-2/500, ATR-42/72, VCV, A-300/310/318/319/320, CR2/7
 
User avatar
FA9295
Topic Author
Posts: 1094
Joined: Thu Feb 25, 2016 7:44 pm

Re: Sun Country adds 5 routes from PDX

Tue Sep 18, 2018 4:52 am

No, "FA" in my username does not stand for "flight attendant"...
 
Utah744
Posts: 186
Joined: Mon Jul 13, 2009 10:41 pm

Re: Sun Country adds 5 routes from PDX

Tue Sep 18, 2018 5:23 am

I see Alaska pulling a Delta and protect their turf with lower fares and see how long SY will last.
You are never too old to learn something stupid

Popular Searches On Airliners.net

Top Photos of Last:   24 Hours  •  48 Hours  •  7 Days  •  30 Days  •  180 Days  •  365 Days  •  All Time

Military Aircraft Every type from fighters to helicopters from air forces around the globe

Classic Airliners Props and jets from the good old days

Flight Decks Views from inside the cockpit

Aircraft Cabins Passenger cabin shots showing seat arrangements as well as cargo aircraft interior

Cargo Aircraft Pictures of great freighter aircraft

Government Aircraft Aircraft flying government officials

Helicopters Our large helicopter section. Both military and civil versions

Blimps / Airships Everything from the Goodyear blimp to the Zeppelin

Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos