TasFlyer
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - July 2018

Fri Jul 20, 2018 7:54 am

QF has refreshed the look of their online timetable with slicker icons depicting an aircraft tail.

However, they have removed the functionality from the previous version that allowed the aircraft type to be seen in the status bar upon hovering. The system still has the same bug from over ten years ago where selected JQ flights (MEL-DRW, MEL-MCY, MEL-OOL, SYD-LST, SYD-HBA, BNE-LST, and BNE-HBA) do not appear in the timetable. This is rather annoying especially since the PDF timetable, which did contain these flights, was removed earlier this year.
 
Qantas16
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - July 2018

Fri Jul 20, 2018 8:04 am

Velocity7 wrote:
Qantas16 wrote:
Velocity7 wrote:
I'm curious. Do these longer flights on 737's (East Coast to DPS or RAR) require any blocking of seats and/or cargo constraints? Are they anywhere near their limits?


I know VA & OD can struggle with their 737s on BNE-DPS... have heard VA asking at the boarding gate for volunteers to offload due to it and OD has previously left luggage behind due to weight.


Thanks, that's interesting. I've flown BNE-DPS with VA quite a few times now and at different times of the year and on each occasion, the flight has never been particularly full - max 75%. I was wondering if it was poor LF's or if there is some type of capacity management in play here considering they fly it daily and on 3 days a week, it operates double daily. You'd think if it were poor LF's there would be an opportunity to improve it by dropping some of the double daily services? Even JQ are only daily (admittedly on 788's) as is OD.


Not sure about VA... they do get quite a fair amount of connecting pax from NZ onto their services as well, which might explain the different departure times to better cater to those connecting flights. JQ only recently went daily with the 788... quite a lot of capacity on the route with JQ at ~330 seats, OD at 162 and VA at least 176 seats per day... that's ~670 seats a day minimum each way between BNE and DPS. Can't imagine JQ gets a lot of connecting pax ex-BNE given the 7am departure and 8-10pm arrival... similarly OD would get basically no domestic connections though can carry pax through to KUL and onwards in the network.
 
waoz1
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - July 2018

Fri Jul 20, 2018 10:46 am

qf789 wrote:
For PER based a.netters the Crystal Air 77L that flew in nonstop from LGW last night is currently sucking on a fuel hose, looks like it’s being prepared for departure this afternoon



Missed it but perth airport page had a good video of it.
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - July 2018

Fri Jul 20, 2018 10:48 am

waoz1 wrote:
qf789 wrote:
For PER based a.netters the Crystal Air 77L that flew in nonstop from LGW last night is currently sucking on a fuel hose, looks like it’s being prepared for departure this afternoon



Missed it but perth airport page had a good video of it.


I had a close up look at it today, outside only, would have loved to see the inside though
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TN486
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - July 2018

Fri Jul 20, 2018 11:06 am

https://www.travelandleisure.com/trip-i ... ir-cruises

Wow, look at that. 84 seats, and the price. Move over QF (LOL)
remember the t shirt "I own an airline"on the front - "qantas" on the back
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - July 2018

Fri Jul 20, 2018 11:07 am

Qantas/Air New Zealand codeshare services now open for booking

https://twitter.com/Airlineroute/status ... 6545386496
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - July 2018

Fri Jul 20, 2018 11:17 am

Philippine Airlines plans to increase SYD to 11 weekly from 1 Dec 18

https://twitter.com/Airlineroute/status ... 7231082498
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log0008
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - July 2018

Fri Jul 20, 2018 12:04 pm

Chinese Southern Expands Cairns

https://www.routesonline.com/news/38/ai ... e-in-nw18/

China Southern Airlines during peak travel period plans to increase Guangzhou – Cairns service for Northern winter 2018/19 season, with the addition of 4th weekly flight. Operated by Airbus A330-300 aircraft, additional frequency will be operating from 15DEC18 to 24FEB19.

CZ333 CAN2200 – 0745+1CNS 333 x247
CZ334 CNS0945 – 1515CAN 333 x135
 
mh124
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - July 2018

Fri Jul 20, 2018 5:56 pm

RyanairGuru wrote:
IndianicWorld wrote:
Interesting that ADL seems to be performing stronger than PER for CZ.

Good news for ADL.


In all honesty this isn’t much of a surprise. South Australia receives 38% more Chinese visitors compared to Western Australia, and Chinese visitor growth is faster for SA.

If you include CX then Perth still has more service to Greater China, but CX carry both a fairly high proportion of transfer traffic and a high poroportion of Australian point of sale traffic compared to the PRC carriers, which are disproportionately oriented to Chinese point of sale inbound traffic. For this traffic Adelaide is a larger market than Perth.

I’ve also heard from someone at CA that ADL will be there next Australian market but at this stage their is no timeframe as it isn’t a priority for them and there won’t be any further expansion in Australia until BNE is bedded down.

http://tourism.sa.gov.au/documents/CORP ... %7D&B=True

https://www.tourism.wa.gov.au/Publicati ... c%2017.pdf


Thanks for that.
Don't those links suggest that WA and SA had the same number of tourists from China? 50 to 57 000 in SA (year ending Mar 18) and 51 to 58 000 in WA (year ending Dec 17).
But the spend differential is huge though. I think there was a massive incentive tourism group that would have boosted the SA figures (though not by enough to account for the jump). Regardless good on them, it's certainly a lot of wine:)
Also WA spend figures all over the place these days, it's very hard to work out medium term comparisons because of the extreme prices that were experienced previously (no supply of hotel rooms so crazy costs, pub steak for 40$, etc etc etc). Perth also has very strong low cost connections to China via Scoot, Malindo and Air Asia X (which ADL doesn't have), though that's a point that has been made before. I suppose it would be interesting to find out how the 58 000 tourists actually get to Perth.
The international price competition out of Perth is still very hectic, it doesn't matter whether its SE Asia, North Asia, the subcontinent or Europe. It's going to be very hard to get new services going forward as I just don't see the capacity being 'soaked up' easily, especially when state owned carriers probably ordered a few too many A380s that they now need to use. But as a consumer...perhaps I should just not overthink it and enjoy the prices.
 
mh124
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - July 2018

Fri Jul 20, 2018 6:05 pm

planemanofnz wrote:
qf789 wrote:
The QF deal has only kicked in and only applies to BME.

I thought it became available from November 2017, and was at many other airports too:

... From November, Qantas will offer the discounts

... will be available for personal travel for people who live in Broome, Kalgoorlie, Karratha, Paraburdoo, Port Hedland and Newman. People in Kalgoorlie are expected to receive the biggest discounts.

See: https://thewest.com.au/travel/air-aviat ... b88586128z.

Cheers,

C.


Wrong promotion.
You need to read a bit more around what you post. The discount you mention only applies 30% to the highest 'flexible economy' fare. The Red eDeal fare only gets a 10% discount. Regional WA fares are very $$$ so in that context they are nice for regional residents but unlikely to drive significant demand.
This is what is being referred to -
https://www.watoday.com.au/national/wes ... 4zg2b.html
 
zkncj
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - July 2018

Fri Jul 20, 2018 8:10 pm

qf789 wrote:
Qantas/Air New Zealand codeshare services now open for booking

https://twitter.com/Airlineroute/status ... 6545386496


Connections look better, although prices seem to be high compared to NZ/VA unless the full inventory has been released yet? e.g. NZ/QF on AKL-SYD-OOL is now $1100 oneway.
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - July 2018

Sat Jul 21, 2018 12:44 am

What caused the cancellations into Sydney last night? Was it weather? A lot of colleagues affected and apparently spilled over into pretty much all flights MEL-SYD today, on Virgin at least.
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - July 2018

Sat Jul 21, 2018 1:03 am

qf789 wrote:
Philippine Airlines plans to increase SYD to 11 weekly from 1 Dec 18

https://twitter.com/Airlineroute/status ... 7231082498


Hmmm, they are going thru the process atm of downgauging most of their dailies from A333 to A321NEO.

Philippine Airlines from July 2018 is introducing Airbus A321neo aircraft on Manila – Sydney route, operating along with the A330-300 aircraft. From 10JUL18, 2 of 7 weekly (Day 24 from MNL, Day 35 from SYD) will be operated by A321neo, increasing to 5 weekly from 25JUL18.


https://www.routesonline.com/news/38/airlineroute/278945/philippine-airlines-adds-a321neo-sydney-service-from-july-2018/

Time will tell what the mix will be with the 11 weekly.

I am intensely curious as to how their narrow body services will go, that is a long way in an A32x. Within range for the aircraft of course, just a long way for the pax. I'd imagine QF gets the bulk of the premium pax on the route though.

Great route to fly from any of the East Coast cities btw - up the middle of the Gulf of Carpentaria, across the tip of West Papua and over the Maluka Islands. Good to do in the daytime on a LCC, where lack of IFE "coincidentally" coincides with non-enforcement of darkened cabin.
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - July 2018

Sat Jul 21, 2018 1:19 am

aerokiwi wrote:
What caused the cancellations into Sydney last night? Was it weather? A lot of colleagues affected and apparently spilled over into pretty much all flights MEL-SYD today, on Virgin at least.


SYD was down to 1 runway ops yesterday due to high winds for most of the day
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MooLor
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - July 2018

Sat Jul 21, 2018 1:22 am

aerokiwi wrote:
What caused the cancellations into Sydney last night? Was it weather? A lot of colleagues affected and apparently spilled over into pretty much all flights MEL-SYD today, on Virgin at least.


I don't know, and I see nothing in the media. Maybe someone with airline / airport ops knowledge will comment.

There was a 'strong wind warning' current for most of the NSW coast yesterday, including the Sydney region. Most of the warnings were lifted this morning. Looking at the BOM observations for SYD, there were some decent wind gusts Friday afternoon but the landings issue may have been that the winds were from the west (across the two main runways): http://www.bom.gov.au/products/IDN60901/IDN60901.94767.shtml

SYD has a single east/west runway, the shortest of the three. It was THE main runway back in the day, before the airport was extended across General Holmes Drive and into Botany Bay.
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - July 2018

Sat Jul 21, 2018 1:48 am

aerokiwi wrote:
What caused the cancellations into Sydney last night? Was it weather? A lot of colleagues affected and apparently spilled over into pretty much all flights MEL-SYD today, on Virgin at least.


SYD was down to 1 runway ops yesterday for most of the day due to high winds
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planemanofnz
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - July 2018

Sat Jul 21, 2018 2:41 am

mh124 wrote:
You need to read a bit more around what you post.

I actually posted the original link, you can see - I was responding to a comment someone made about the link that I posted. The deal noted in the content of the post I originally linked could very validly be attributable to part of WA's growth numbers (even if only by a small amount). Is the deal not described properly in the link I posted from The West?

Cheers,

C.
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - July 2018

Sat Jul 21, 2018 3:19 am

Thanks Moo and qf789. Maybe the same weather front that went through Victoria Tuesday.
 
mh124
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - July 2018

Sat Jul 21, 2018 9:19 am

planemanofnz wrote:
mh124 wrote:
You need to read a bit more around what you post.

I actually posted the original link, you can see - I was responding to a comment someone made about the link that I posted. The deal noted in the content of the post I originally linked could very validly be attributable to part of WA's growth numbers (even if only by a small amount). Is the deal not described properly in the link I posted from The West?

Cheers,

C.


Here's what happened
- The link you originally posted is irrelevant. Qantas have said 1700 bookings have been made since the trial began. That's over a 6 month period.
- The promotion QF789 is referring to is the direct subsidy for Broome only, which a QF A320 (which normally services resources sites during the week) sent to Broome on Friday, Saturday and Sunday. It results in an increase of 830 seats a week from June-October and so wouldn't have been counted in the BITRE figures yet.
- You obviously enjoy reading news..maybe just read a bit more.
 
waoz1
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - July 2018

Sat Jul 21, 2018 10:17 am

Just a question

Is the Perth - Singapore for QF going to daily A330 still?
Looking at something next year up into Singapore and its still showing double daily 737s
 
Whatsaptudo
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - July 2018

Sat Jul 21, 2018 10:21 am

It’s only temporary. Goes back to 737 from the end of October. That’s the current plan.
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - July 2018

Sat Jul 21, 2018 11:00 am

WA will start work on a new terminal at Busselton airport if Qantas chooses the town for its pilot training academy, and separately, JQ is evaluating services to Busselton with insiders suggesting that a thrice-weekly seasonal service from Melbourne is possible. While the new academy coming to WA would be awesome, I'm not sure if a new terminal at Busselton is a good use of resources for WA right now?

See:
- https://www.perthnow.com.au/news/wa/wa- ... b88902188z.
- http://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-07-21/w ... e/10015164.

Cheers,

C.
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - July 2018

Sat Jul 21, 2018 11:48 am

MooLor wrote:
qf789 wrote:
Philippine Airlines plans to increase SYD to 11 weekly from 1 Dec 18

https://twitter.com/Airlineroute/status ... 7231082498


Hmmm, they are going thru the process atm of downgauging most of their dailies from A333 to A321NEO.

Philippine Airlines from July 2018 is introducing Airbus A321neo aircraft on Manila – Sydney route, operating along with the A330-300 aircraft. From 10JUL18, 2 of 7 weekly (Day 24 from MNL, Day 35 from SYD) will be operated by A321neo, increasing to 5 weekly from 25JUL18.


https://www.routesonline.com/news/38/airlineroute/278945/philippine-airlines-adds-a321neo-sydney-service-from-july-2018/

Time will tell what the mix will be with the 11 weekly.

I am intensely curious as to how their narrow body services will go, that is a long way in an A32x. Within range for the aircraft of course, just a long way for the pax. I'd imagine QF gets the bulk of the premium pax on the route though.

Great route to fly from any of the East Coast cities btw - up the middle of the Gulf of Carpentaria, across the tip of West Papua and over the Maluka Islands. Good to do in the daytime on a LCC, where lack of IFE "coincidentally" coincides with non-enforcement of darkened cabin.


The 11 weekly will be a mix of A321/330 for the time being, though from 1 Feb 19 all 11 weekly will be operated by A321neo

https://twitter.com/Airlineroute/status ... 0658025473
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - July 2018

Sat Jul 21, 2018 11:59 am

Qantas16 wrote:
qf789 wrote:
MH134 BNE-KUL has returned to BNE, runway 1/19 will be closed for the next 20 minutes while the aircraft is removed from the runway

Image

https://twitter.com/flightradar24/statu ... 2156763136


This will get a lot of local media attention and is definitely not what MH needed for a ~1 month old route...


The aircraft returned due to faulty airspeed readings as a result of several pitot tubes being covered

https://aviation-safety.net/wikibase/wiki.php?id=213551

On arrival the aircraft had to be towed due to a hydraulic leak

http://avherald.com/h?article=4bb4f5b3&opt=0
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - July 2018

Sat Jul 21, 2018 12:16 pm

aerokiwi wrote:
Thanks Moo and qf789. Maybe the same weather front that went through Victoria Tuesday.


This may be of interest, Air Services Australia normally puts out messages over twitter when there is weather (strong winds, turbulence, fog, storms etc) affecting one or more of the major airports that will likely lead to delays and cancellations

https://twitter.com/AirservicesNews
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tullamarine
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - July 2018

Sun Jul 22, 2018 1:45 am

Bit of movement on MEL's third runway with Commonwealth announcing compulsory land acquisitions in weekend papers. These acquisitions which covers both the new runway as well as the extension of the existing 09-27 runway is land which is all currently farming as it has been part of the airport planning reservation since the original plans for the airport were released in the 1960s so no development has ever been allowed.

For plane spotters, you need to get in soon as once commencement of construction begins the existing viewing area beside Runway 16/34 will be gone forever. MEL has announced on their website that they are keen to develop new viewing areas once construction is complete but no further details have been announced.
717, 721/2, 732/3/4/5/7/8/9, 742/3/4, 752/3, 762/3, 772/E/W, 788/9, 300,310, 319,320/1, 332/3, 359, 388, DC9, DC10, F28, F100, 142,143, E75/90, CR2, D82/3/4, SF3, ATR
 
smi0006
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - July 2018

Sun Jul 22, 2018 2:10 am

tullamarine wrote:
Bit of movement on MEL's third runway with Commonwealth announcing compulsory land acquisitions in weekend papers. These acquisitions which covers both the new runway as well as the extension of the existing 09-27 runway is land which is all currently farming as it has been part of the airport planning reservation since the original plans for the airport were released in the 1960s so no development has ever been allowed.

For plane spotters, you need to get in soon as once commencement of construction begins the existing viewing area beside Runway 16/34 will be gone forever. MEL has announced on their website that they are keen to develop new viewing areas once construction is complete but no further details have been announced.


Is the new runway parallel? The last plans I saw some years ago, the runway wasn’t 100% parallel and there would be a traffic convergence point at a not to far off point
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - July 2018

Sun Jul 22, 2018 2:33 am

Is the new runway parallel? The last plans I saw some years ago, the runway wasn’t 100% parallel and there would be a traffic convergence point at a not to far off point


The new runway will be parallel to existing 09/27. Existing 09/27 will be extended to 3400m whilst new runway will be 3000m.
717, 721/2, 732/3/4/5/7/8/9, 742/3/4, 752/3, 762/3, 772/E/W, 788/9, 300,310, 319,320/1, 332/3, 359, 388, DC9, DC10, F28, F100, 142,143, E75/90, CR2, D82/3/4, SF3, ATR
 
waoz1
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - July 2018

Sun Jul 22, 2018 2:49 am

Whatsaptudo wrote:
It’s only temporary. Goes back to 737 from the end of October. That’s the current plan.



Thanks... back to SQ then
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - July 2018

Sun Jul 22, 2018 3:25 am

There is s fire currently being extinguished next to a QF A380 ay SYD

https://twitter.com/7newssydney/status/ ... 74144?s=21
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smi0006
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - July 2018

Sun Jul 22, 2018 3:49 am

tullamarine wrote:
Is the new runway parallel? The last plans I saw some years ago, the runway wasn’t 100% parallel and there would be a traffic convergence point at a not to far off point


The new runway will be parallel to existing 09/27. Existing 09/27 will be extended to 3400m whilst new runway will be 3000m.


Thank god common sense prevailed. I think the original plans were a slight movement due to noise restrictions... but the additional spend long term was going to be huge
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - July 2018

Sun Jul 22, 2018 4:43 am

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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - July 2018

Sun Jul 22, 2018 4:55 am

Regional route cancellations are just the beginning regarding pilot shortage

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-07-22/a ... s/10012624
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qf2220
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - July 2018

Sun Jul 22, 2018 5:37 am

Re pilot shortage, the last time we had one of these was in 2006-07, and the GFC hit shortly after which fixed the shortage.

My question is, are pilot shortages an indicator (amongst many of course) of an upcoming slowdown in any way?
 
log0008
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - July 2018

Sun Jul 22, 2018 5:45 am

Pilot shortages come up when EBA's are up for negotiation and airlines want Visa workers from overseas.

If REX wants to fix their problem's then how about paying pilots more than bus drivers or more importantly more than instructors. For reference, a first year REX first officer makes $54,800, once checked onto line (around 39k during training) a good instructor at a major school with a year or so under the belt will make closer to 60k, never do overnights, only fly in fairly good weather and work mostly a 9-5 job. Pilots invest almost 100k in there training they aren't going to stay in a 54k job if they don't have to....

Also Qantas got around 950 applications in the last hiring round an knocked back to around 350 after the online testing. This is no pilot shortage in Australia, there is a regional pay shortage and a shortage of training captains and sim instructors. The USA has a shortage and Asia have a shortage however.
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - July 2018

Sun Jul 22, 2018 6:40 am

Today’s VA564 PER-SYD normal departure time 1625 has been delayed to midnight due to in bound aircraft being delayed
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tayser
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - July 2018

Sun Jul 22, 2018 6:57 am

Victorian Government came to the table after Federal Government prodded them with $5bil for Tullamarine Airport Rail Link today.

They've released a route appraisal and surprise surprise, Sunshine/Albion route came out on top (again - has done for multiple studies). Vic Gov will match Federal money, construction to start once the civil/heavy construction completes on the metro tunnel in 2022. Full business case now underway that route has been chosen, supposedly to report back late next year.

Andrews will be using this as part of election promise for November. https://www.urban.com.au/transport/2018 ... -rail-link
 
MooLor
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - July 2018

Sun Jul 22, 2018 7:03 am

tayser wrote:
Victorian Government came to the table after Federal Government prodded them with $5bil for Tullamarine Airport Rail Link today.

They've released a route appraisal and surprise surprise, Sunshine/Albion route came out on top (again - has done for multiple studies). Vic Gov will match Federal money, construction to start once the civil/heavy construction completes on the metro tunnel in 2022. Full business case now underway that route has been chosen, supposedly to report back late next year.

Andrews will be using this as part of election promise for November. https://www.urban.com.au/transport/2018 ... -rail-link


I know little of Melbourne but Sunshine seems a long way from MEL. Are they proposing some sort of dedicated line to the airport rather than integrate it into the suburban network like BNE and SYD links both are? I know nothing of the issues, but does that explain the years of delay? A simple branch line from somewhere closer could have been done cheaply a long time ago you would think.
 
Hornberger
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - July 2018

Sun Jul 22, 2018 9:42 am

MooLor wrote:
I know little of Melbourne but Sunshine seems a long way from MEL. Are they proposing some sort of dedicated line to the airport rather than integrate it into the suburban network like BNE and SYD links both are? I know nothing of the issues, but does that explain the years of delay? A simple branch line from somewhere closer could have been done cheaply a long time ago you would think.


It will be new track running parallel to existing passenger lines from the city to Sunshine, then new track running parallel to existing freight lines from Sunshine to the Airport.

A simple branch line (from the Craigeburne line) was one of the options considered, but that line is already shared by metro and regional services. You would be looking at 40+ minute travels times in peak periods as Airport services would be stuck behind stopping all stations commuter trains.

The other options of building a new line basically straight to the airport are far more expensive to build and would take a lot long to build.

Melbourne Airport is also quite a bit further out compared to Brisbane and Sydney. It also quite some distance away from existing rail infrastructure (other than the freight lines referred to above).
 
Gemuser
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - July 2018

Sun Jul 22, 2018 10:23 am

Hornberger, reply 439:
Can you elaborate a bit please. From Sunshine I assume you mean the line is along side the standard gauge line to about Airport West then a new branch into the airport. I cannot find any lines closer to the airport than that, on Google maps.
Also this: "construction to start once the civil/heavy construction completes on the metro tunnel in 2022" This seems to make a lot of sense,.

Thanks
Gemuser
 
melpax
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - July 2018

Sun Jul 22, 2018 11:00 am

Gemuser wrote:
Hornberger, reply 439:
Can you elaborate a bit please. From Sunshine I assume you mean the line is along side the standard gauge line to about Airport West then a new branch into the airport. I cannot find any lines closer to the airport than that, on Google maps.
Also this: "construction to start once the civil/heavy construction completes on the metro tunnel in 2022" This seems to make a lot of sense,.

Thanks
Gemuser



That seems to be the case from what's been reported. And running the line via Sunshine also ensures that there are links to the regional rail network as well.

https://www.theage.com.au/national/vict ... 4zsvw.html

About time, I use Southern Cross station on a daily basis as I work in Docklands. For the past year I've been working 12.00pm-8.00pm, and a good number of people using the station at those times are transferring from trains to the SkyBus, or vice versa. A cab fare or Uber from the outer east to the Airport would be over $100, taking the train & SkyBus works out much cheaper, around $25 all up.... Now if they manage to keep the new line as part of the 'normal' suburban network, and not add an 'airport surcharge'......


https://www.theage.com.au/national/vict ... 4zsvw.html
Essendon - Whatever it takes......
 
Hornberger
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - July 2018

Sun Jul 22, 2018 11:08 am

Gemuser wrote:
Hornberger, reply 439:
Can you elaborate a bit please. From Sunshine I assume you mean the line is along side the standard gauge line to about Airport West then a new branch into the airport. I cannot find any lines closer to the airport than that, on Google maps.
Also this: "construction to start once the civil/heavy construction completes on the metro tunnel in 2022" This seems to make a lot of sense,.

Thanks
Gemuser

That is correct - the new line would be built on the same rail reservation as the existing standard guage line before branching off at Airport Dr.
Last edited by Hornberger on Sun Jul 22, 2018 11:28 am, edited 1 time in total.
 
Gemuser
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - July 2018

Sun Jul 22, 2018 11:25 am

Thanks!
 
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qf789
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - July 2018

Sun Jul 22, 2018 2:39 pm

Malaysia Airlines will send A380 to MEL on 4 different days in SEP

https://twitter.com/airlineroute/status ... 96449?s=21
Forum Moderator
 
IndianicWorld
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - July 2018

Sun Jul 22, 2018 9:01 pm

qf789 wrote:
Malaysia Airlines will send A380 to MEL on 4 different days in SEP

https://twitter.com/airlineroute/status ... 96449?s=21


I think that might even be 7 days, given that the last part appears to be written as 26 SEP- 30 SEP.
 
tayser
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - July 2018

Sun Jul 22, 2018 10:27 pm

Gemuser wrote:
Hornberger, reply 439:
Can you elaborate a bit please. From Sunshine I assume you mean the line is along side the standard gauge line to about Airport West then a new branch into the airport. I cannot find any lines closer to the airport than that, on Google maps.
Also this: "construction to start once the civil/heavy construction completes on the metro tunnel in 2022" This seems to make a lot of sense,.

Thanks
Gemuser


The standard gauge (actually one of the tracls is dual gauge) corridor is called the Albion (sometimes Albion East) rail corridor - the interstate/standard gauge line joins the main Melbourne-Bendigo rail corridor at Albion Station (that's where it gets its name from).

See this: https://goo.gl/maps/MHEnT1KSFms for the most part, all rail corridors throughout Melbourne will be able to take four tracks - overbridges are regularly built this way and the airport line, although within the corridor, will have its own track. Incidentally, just a bit further along from that streetview is where the airport railway will likely leave the Albion corridor and lift up over the Western Ring road and head up to Tullamarine above Airport Drive.
 
tullamarine
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - July 2018

Sun Jul 22, 2018 10:39 pm

It will be new track running parallel to existing passenger lines from the city to Sunshine, then new track running parallel to existing freight lines from Sunshine to the Airport.

A simple branch line (from the Craigeburne line) was one of the options considered, but that line is already shared by metro and regional services. You would be looking at 40+ minute travels times in peak periods as Airport services would be stuck behind stopping all stations commuter trains.

The other options of building a new line basically straight to the airport are far more expensive to build and would take a lot long to build.

Melbourne Airport is also quite a bit further out compared to Brisbane and Sydney. It also quite some distance away from existing rail infrastructure (other than the freight lines referred to above).

It seems bizarre that it will take 8 years for this rail link to become a reality. In fact, construction doesn't start for 4 years (around the time of the 2022 state election) and then completion in 2026 (in time for the election after that.) Now, there's a coincidence!!! I can only imagine what the Chinese must make of our infrastructure projects where it takes 8 years to build what is effectively a rail line spur. In that time, they'd have built a completely new airport with transport links as well as a nearby city.

I am a bit concerned about the proposed route; the idea of a new line that would've also created a suburban service through Avondale Heights and the new suburb being built on the old Defence site at Maidstone seems a more long-sighted solution. The suggested journey time of 30 minutes doesn't seem particularly compelling especially if the fare is around $22-$25 which means it would be cheaper for 2 people to get an Uber.
717, 721/2, 732/3/4/5/7/8/9, 742/3/4, 752/3, 762/3, 772/E/W, 788/9, 300,310, 319,320/1, 332/3, 359, 388, DC9, DC10, F28, F100, 142,143, E75/90, CR2, D82/3/4, SF3, ATR
 
IndianicWorld
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - July 2018

Sun Jul 22, 2018 11:07 pm

tullamarine wrote:
It will be new track running parallel to existing passenger lines from the city to Sunshine, then new track running parallel to existing freight lines from Sunshine to the Airport.

A simple branch line (from the Craigeburne line) was one of the options considered, but that line is already shared by metro and regional services. You would be looking at 40+ minute travels times in peak periods as Airport services would be stuck behind stopping all stations commuter trains.

The other options of building a new line basically straight to the airport are far more expensive to build and would take a lot long to build.

Melbourne Airport is also quite a bit further out compared to Brisbane and Sydney. It also quite some distance away from existing rail infrastructure (other than the freight lines referred to above).

It seems bizarre that it will take 8 years for this rail link to become a reality. In fact, construction doesn't start for 4 years (around the time of the 2022 state election) and then completion in 2026 (in time for the election after that.) Now, there's a coincidence!!! I can only imagine what the Chinese must make of our infrastructure projects where it takes 8 years to build what is effectively a rail line spur. In that time, they'd have built a completely new airport with transport links as well as a nearby city.

I am a bit concerned about the proposed route; the idea of a new line that would've also created a suburban service through Avondale Heights and the new suburb being built on the old Defence site at Maidstone seems a more long-sighted solution. The suggested journey time of 30 minutes doesn't seem particularly compelling especially if the fare is around $22-$25 which means it would be cheaper for 2 people to get an Uber.


I just don’t get the cost of building it. For much of the route it should be fairly straight forward, which makes such a cost seem hard to work out.

The more direct alignments are far too costly. There’s always scope for being long-sighted in the approach, but the reality is that someone needs to pay for it I the near term. The appetite for that isn’t likely to be high at that scale.

As for extra stops, it needs to be time competitive. Adding additional stations adds time to the journey. It’s got to be a balance there. But hey, the fallback if it doesn’t work as a dedicated airport service they can always just put some stations on the line at that point and create additional demand.

I’m sure using the logic of servicing more people one could add East Keilor, North Sunshine, Airport West or Airport Business Park if they needed to down the line. One would hope that the business case is made correctly in the first instance though :)
 
Gemuser
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - July 2018

Sun Jul 22, 2018 11:33 pm

From Tullamarine reply 147:
It seems bizarre that it will take 8 years for this rail link to become a reality. In fact, construction doesn't start for 4 years (around the time of the 2022 state election) and then completion in 2026 (in time for the election after that.) Now, there's a coincidence!!! I can only imagine what the Chinese must make of our infrastructure projects where it takes 8 years to build what is effectively a rail line spur. In that time, they'd have built a completely new airport with transport links as well as a nearby city.

Did you read the statements from the government? Construction is due to start when construction of the current CBD Tunnels is winding down. This makes a LOT of sense from both a budget and logistical point of view. It will also take, at least 2 years, from acceptance of the full business case, to do the full design and do it properly especially the bit over the road, so you don't have a disaster like we are getting in NW Sydney.
I am actually impressed with the Victorian government [never thought I'd ever say that, about any state government!] for the common sense approach, lets hope it doesn't get stuffed up by politics!

Gemuser
 
A350OZ
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - July 2018

Mon Jul 23, 2018 2:30 am

Hornberger wrote:
Gemuser wrote:
Hornberger, reply 439:
Can you elaborate a bit please. From Sunshine I assume you mean the line is along side the standard gauge line to about Airport West then a new branch into the airport. I cannot find any lines closer to the airport than that, on Google maps.
Also this: "construction to start once the civil/heavy construction completes on the metro tunnel in 2022" This seems to make a lot of sense,.

Thanks
Gemuser

That is correct - the new line would be built on the same rail reservation as the existing standard guage line before branching off at Airport Dr.


And how would it cross the Maribyrnong River? The historic viaduct does not allow for an additional two (or even one) tracks. Do they built a new bridge alongside? Just curious.

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