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UpNAWAy
Posts: 700
Joined: Thu Aug 11, 2016 12:42 pm

Re: New luxury airline to offer affordable prices for first-class only aircraft

Mon Jul 09, 2018 2:23 pm

I always thought a "First Class" airline was a great idea and a niche that could work. I was always wrong!

Here is why. Lets say your configuration is half the seats of a normal config and your operating cost the same. You have to charge double the coach fare and not enough people will pay double for it. There is a reason legacy first class are only 8-16 seats because you can't sell even that many. So even if a legacy 1st ticket is $1000 and coach $400 in a market and you sell your all 1st Class for $800 you might get 10-15 but now way can you fill the plane to profitable levels. Its just math and economics it can never work.
 
KL001
Posts: 8
Joined: Mon May 14, 2018 12:46 am

Re: New luxury airline to offer affordable prices for first-class only aircraft

Mon Jul 09, 2018 3:57 pm

The most interesting is that they say they will not fly to the regular, large airports, but are contracting with small, private airports or at least have their own terminals. I doubt they have the investment money to accomplish that (and what airports in the NYC/Chicago area would be suitable to handle them?), but if they do, it may work: taking away the hassle of having to navigate through large airports is a plus many business class passengers would pay for. See for example British Airways' success on the LCY-NYC route (if only they could fly to a smaller NYC airport...), or La Compagnie's and Boutique Air's business models.

And for all the naysayers, probably they are right as we all know the failure rate of start-up airlines, but this airline also has the characteristics of a disruptive innovator. Their chances will be slim, but I hope they succeed!
 
32andBelow
Posts: 5033
Joined: Mon Sep 03, 2012 2:54 am

Re: New luxury airline to offer affordable prices for first-class only aircraft

Mon Jul 09, 2018 4:37 pm

kimimm19 wrote:
I wish it well! Anything to upset the non-competition legacy monopoly.

Non competition? You can fly from LA To NYC for like under 300 RT. How much more competitive does it need to be?
 
spacecadet
Posts: 3576
Joined: Thu Sep 20, 2001 3:36 am

Re: New luxury airline to offer affordable prices for first-class only aircraft

Mon Jul 09, 2018 5:47 pm

I guess it needs to be said over and over until everyone here gets it: this is not a new idea. There have been several membership-based "airlines" that promise a private jet-like experience for commercial airline prices, if you can be flexible about your schedule (which it seems is no different with Aura). JetSuite, JetSmarter, etc. do this same thing. But there are a lot of customer complaints about bait and switch tactics with those carriers, probably because it's impossible to make money doing this. This is the kind of idea a kid just out of business school comes up with because it looks great on paper. Or, if someone else is doing it and not succeeding, they think it's just because they're not smart enough, and they can do it right. But there are a ton of logistical issues that they never consider.

The only thing Aura seems to be doing different is starting off with one CRJ. One. That's not going to be able to fill out much of a schedule. And if a regular airline with economies of scale and all those advantages has to fill it with 75 people to make money, how is Aura planning to do it with 29?

The answer is those membership fees. They're counting on people spending more on membership fees than they use in tickets. And they're probably using "Guest" tickets as a loss leader to try to sell more memberships. But again, this is not a new thing: https://www.theverge.com/2017/3/28/1505 ... s-lawsuits

Note that while JetSmarter started out flying only empty legs on private jets, they eventually started doing exactly what Aura says they plan to.

So at the very least, Aura has competition already. And at worst, it's not a business model that has any real track record of success - the carriers currently doing it have had to change their model so many times that it's not clear what, if anything, is working. Given that the CEO is just out of business school, I don't give them much of a chance.
I'm tired of being a wanna-be league bowler. I wanna be a league bowler!
 
User avatar
pwm2txlhopper
Posts: 1457
Joined: Tue Jan 27, 2004 10:40 am

Re: New luxury airline to offer affordable prices for first-class only aircraft

Mon Jul 09, 2018 6:00 pm

Didn't MGM Grand Air already try this on premium trans-cons and to LAS about 25 years ago? DIdnt work then, probably won't last this time either. But good luck to them.

Flashback to premium all first class in 1992.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=UddI8Tk9k6M
 
AR385
Posts: 6936
Joined: Fri Nov 07, 2003 8:25 am

Re: New luxury airline to offer affordable prices for first-class only aircraft

Mon Jul 09, 2018 8:07 pm

Not only does the whole thing will never get off the ground, it also looks rather shady.
 
PlanesNTrains
Posts: 9524
Joined: Tue Feb 01, 2005 4:19 pm

Re: New luxury airline to offer affordable prices for first-class only aircraft

Mon Jul 09, 2018 8:51 pm

drgmobile wrote:
The biggest challenge they will have is lack of network. There may be lots of premium traffic between major cities like Chicago and Atlanta but if you live in either market and fly regularly in first or business, you're almost certainly already connected to a major hub airline. Unless the passenger flies on only a handle of routes that coincide with what this company will offers, it's going to be hard to break the loyalty. Where premium only product offerings have been able to work, they've generally been aligned with a network carrier that provides feed onto and beyond the service, such as Open Skies from BA or the PrivatAir service for Lufthansa.


I agree. I think start with MIA and add major destinations from there. My personal opinion, of course.

KL001 wrote:
The most interesting is that they say they will not fly to the regular, large airports, but are contracting with small, private airports or at least have their own terminals. I doubt they have the investment money to accomplish that (and what airports in the NYC/Chicago area would be suitable to handle them?), but if they do, it may work: taking away the hassle of having to navigate through large airports is a plus many business class passengers would pay for. See for example British Airways' success on the LCY-NYC route (if only they could fly to a smaller NYC airport...), or La Compagnie's and Boutique Air's business models.

And for all the naysayers, probably they are right as we all know the failure rate of start-up airlines, but this airline also has the characteristics of a disruptive innovator. Their chances will be slim, but I hope they succeed!


AURA will serve multiple airports in large cities. At launch, AURA will serve airports most requested by Founding KeyHolders. Airports in each city include:
Miami
Opa Locka (OPF)
Miami Executive/Tamiami (TMB)
Miami International Airport, Private Side (MIA)
Ft. Lauderdale/West Palm Beach
Fort Lauderdale Executive (FXE)
Palm Beach International, Private Side (PBI)
Chicago
Chicago Executive (PWK)
O’Hare, Private Side (ORD)
Midway, Private Side (MDW)

Atlanta
DeKalb-Peachtree (PDK)
Fulton County (FTY)
New York City
White Plains (HPN)
LaGuardia, Private Side (LGA)
Newark, Private Side (EWR)

Los Angeles
Van Nuys (VNY)
Long Beach (LGB)
Denver
Centennial (APA)
Rocky Mountain Metropolitan (BJC)
-Dave


MAX’d out on MAX threads. If you are starting a thread, and it’s about the MAX - stop. There’s already a thread that covers it.
 
nmdrdh787
Posts: 185
Joined: Wed Nov 22, 2017 2:39 am

Re: New luxury airline to offer affordable prices for first-class only aircraft

Mon Jul 09, 2018 9:09 pm

wjcandee wrote:
I think if these guys start off overcapitalized, and do it right, they have a shot....But most entrepreneurs haven't learned that lesson, go in insufficiently-capitalized, and don't have anywhere to turn when they hit the speed bump.


This. As a business owner I agree 100%.

I've talked to the CEO through Linkedin and social media, seems like its an interesting idea, I can't critique it when I have an idea about drones transporting cargo that is extremely far fetched too.
 
PlanesNTrains
Posts: 9524
Joined: Tue Feb 01, 2005 4:19 pm

Re: New luxury airline to offer affordable prices for first-class only aircraft

Mon Jul 09, 2018 9:20 pm

nmdrdh787 wrote:
wjcandee wrote:
I think if these guys start off overcapitalized, and do it right, they have a shot....But most entrepreneurs haven't learned that lesson, go in insufficiently-capitalized, and don't have anywhere to turn when they hit the speed bump.


This. As a business owner I agree 100%.

I've talked to the CEO through Linkedin and social media, seems like its an interesting idea, I can't critique it when I have an idea about drones transporting cargo that is extremely far fetched too.


I don't think drones and cargo is farfetched. I don't think premium travel options are farfetched. Where this idea seems to go off the rails is in the over-the-top Wave Class. I think that will become an albatross around their neck. Unfortunately.
-Dave


MAX’d out on MAX threads. If you are starting a thread, and it’s about the MAX - stop. There’s already a thread that covers it.
 
kimimm19
Posts: 434
Joined: Fri Mar 29, 2013 9:34 pm

Re: New luxury airline to offer affordable prices for first-class only aircraft

Tue Jul 10, 2018 7:57 am

32andBelow wrote:
kimimm19 wrote:
I wish it well! Anything to upset the non-competition legacy monopoly.

Non competition? You can fly from LA To NYC for like under 300 RT. How much more competitive does it need to be?


You're quoting the most competitive market in the country to make your point. Take a look elsewhere between two other airports that don't have practically every US airline flying there :roll:
 
Adipocere
Posts: 323
Joined: Sat Jun 27, 2015 9:35 am

Re: New luxury airline to offer affordable prices for first-class only aircraft

Tue Jul 10, 2018 1:21 pm

Why would anyone consider a "lie-flat" on a short domestic flight from DEN to LAX? Other than East Coast - Hawaii, pretty much every other domestic route is too short to bother fidgeting with the buttons to get the seat to recline...

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