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BTVB6Flyer
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Swoop Announces 7 Canada-US Routes

Thu Aug 02, 2018 1:14 pm

7 routes to 5 cities

Upstart Canadian "ultra-low-cost carrier" Swoop is making its first push into the United States, revealing plans Thursday to fly seven routes from five U.S. airports.

The airline’s first U.S. flights start Oct. 11, when Swoop launches non-stop service between Las Vegas and Edmonton. The carrier will add six more U.S.-Canada routes by the end of October. In addition to Las Vegas, Swoop’s new U.S. destinations will include Fort Lauderdale; Orlando; Phoenix/Mesa, Arizona; and Tampa.


Las Vegas-Edmonton

Service begins Oct. 11; Swoop will fly 11 flights a week

Las Vegas-Abbotsford, British Columbia

Service begins Oct. 11; Swoop will fly 3 flights a week (Monday, Thursday, Sunday)

Las Vegas-Hamilton, Ontario

Service begins Oct. 26; Swoop will fly 4 flights a week (Monday, Thursday, Friday, Sunday)

Phoenix/Mesa, Arizona-Edmonton

Service begins Oct. 27; Swoop will fly 2 flights a week (Wednesday, Saturday)

Fort Lauderdale-Hamilton, Ontario

Service begins Oct. 26; Swoop will fly 2 flights a week (Friday, Saturday)

Orlando-Hamilton, Ontario

Service begins Oct. 17; Swoop will fly 3 flights a week (Tuesday, Wednesday, Saturday)

Tampa-Hamilton, Ontario

Service begins Oct. 20; Swoop will fly 3 flights a week (Wednesday, Thursday, Saturday)

https://www.usatoday.com/story/travel/flights/todayinthesky/2018/08/02/swoop-u-s-routes-first-canadian-ultra-low-cost-carrier/883586002/
Last edited by BTVB6Flyer on Thu Aug 02, 2018 1:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
Cactus739
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Re: Swoop Announces 7 Canada-US Routes

Thu Aug 02, 2018 1:21 pm

Interesting choice of Gateway Airport in Mesa for them.
You can't fix stupid.... - Ron White
 
Dominion301
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Re: Swoop Announces 7 Canada-US Routes

Thu Aug 02, 2018 1:31 pm

Cactus739 wrote:
Interesting choice of Gateway Airport in Mesa for them.


No doubt that’s simply shifting their AZO service to Swoop from WS mainline. Likely ditto for YEG-LAS.
 
lavalampluva
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Re: Swoop Announces 7 Canada-US Routes

Thu Aug 02, 2018 1:33 pm

So the usual Canada/Sunbird routes.
Remind me to send a thank you note to Mr. Boeing.
 
Dominion301
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Re: Swoop Announces 7 Canada-US Routes

Thu Aug 02, 2018 1:47 pm

lavalampluva wrote:
So the usual Canada/Sunbird routes.


Pretty much. In fact, I think out of all of these only YHM-TPA is completely new. The others I'd hazard a guess are all transfers from mainline with, in most cases, increased frequencies added.
 
axiom
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Re: Swoop Announces 7 Canada-US Routes

Thu Aug 02, 2018 1:54 pm

While Hamilton-TPA is new, WS has also reduced its footprint in Tampa by cutting Halifax and Ottawa. Part of the Swoop-ing of their sun profile, or just marginal routes that got the axe?
 
Skywatcher
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Re: Swoop Announces 7 Canada-US Routes

Thu Aug 02, 2018 2:38 pm

I guess Rouge worked so well that WestJet is copying the model?
 
MIflyer12
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Re: Swoop Announces 7 Canada-US Routes

Thu Aug 02, 2018 2:44 pm

lavalampluva wrote:
So the usual Canada/Sunbird routes.


Wasn't there just a lengthy thread of speculation how WS would be flying to DL hubs? Nada with this announcement.
 
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gdg9
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Re: Swoop Announces 7 Canada-US Routes

Thu Aug 02, 2018 2:47 pm

Right now they only have two planes... when are more coming online?
@dfwtower
 
lavalampluva
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Re: Swoop Announces 7 Canada-US Routes

Thu Aug 02, 2018 2:52 pm

MIflyer12 wrote:
lavalampluva wrote:
So the usual Canada/Sunbird routes.


Wasn't there just a lengthy thread of speculation how WS would be flying to DL hubs? Nada with this announcement.

Well..yes, but WS/DL was part of a JV. WO is doing this on their own.
Remind me to send a thank you note to Mr. Boeing.
 
jimbo737
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Re: Swoop Announces 7 Canada-US Routes

Thu Aug 02, 2018 2:58 pm

Skywatcher wrote:
I guess Rouge worked so well that WestJet is copying the model?


Rouge operates predominantly into Air Canada's mainline hub cities, causing heightened canibalization and brand confusion.

Fly Rouge from many, if not most destinations and branding remains 100% Air Canada. You won't see any Rouge signs at PHX or PSP even though it's Rouge, not Air Canada, doing the flying.

There's no confusion about whether your on Swoop of WJ mainline. It's a completely different brand / product / look /experience.

WS is keeping Swoop out of it's core markets.

As it stands, if it doesn't touch YXX, YEG, YWG or YHM, (with YXX being the only true "low cost" airport in Canada,with YHM a distant 2nd), they don't operate it.

Compare that to Rouge, where in some cases, they over fly not one, not two, but three AC hubs, (YUL-YYJ).

It's a completely different strategy.
Last edited by jimbo737 on Thu Aug 02, 2018 3:03 pm, edited 2 times in total.
 
SpaceshipDC10
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Re: Swoop Announces 7 Canada-US Routes

Thu Aug 02, 2018 3:00 pm

gdg9 wrote:
Right now they only have two planes... when are more coming online?


Based on what's said on the other Swoop thread, WS plans have six aircraft by the end of this year and 10 by next year's fall.
 
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tjwgrr
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Re: Swoop Announces 7 Canada-US Routes

Thu Aug 02, 2018 3:25 pm

Dominion301 wrote:
Cactus739 wrote:
Interesting choice of Gateway Airport in Mesa for them.


No doubt that’s simply shifting their AZO service to Swoop from WS mainline. Likely ditto for YEG-LAS.


AZA is Gateway Airport in Mesa, AZ. AZO is Kalamazoo, MI... ;)
Direct KNOBS, maintain 2700' until established on the localizer, cleared ILS runway 26 left approach.
 
BWA900
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Re: Swoop Announces 7 Canada-US Routes

Thu Aug 02, 2018 3:33 pm

Skywatcher wrote:
I guess Rouge worked so well that WestJet is copying the model?


Rouge and Swoop are two completely different products. Swoop is an ULC whereas Rouge has the same airfares as mainline carriers, offers a premium service and operates from AC's main hubs.
Flown: A300 A319 A320 A321 A333 A343 A359 A388 AT72 AT76 B712 B735 B736 B737 B738 B739 B38M B744 B752 B753 B763 B772ER B772LR B77W B788 B789 CRJ2 CRJ7 CRJ9 DH8A DH8B DH8D E145 E170 E190
 
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Gonzalo
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Re: Swoop Announces 7 Canada-US Routes

Thu Aug 02, 2018 4:13 pm

Sorry but I HAVE to ask…. what on Earth means Swoop ???? Is it soooo hard to found a more logic name for an airline?
Gear Up!!: DC-3 / EMB-110 / FH-227 / A318-19-20-21 / B732 / B763 / B789 / B788 / A343 / ATR72-600
 
santi319
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Re: Swoop Announces 7 Canada-US Routes

Thu Aug 02, 2018 4:18 pm

Gonzalo wrote:
Sorry but I HAVE to ask…. what on Earth means Swoop ???? Is it soooo hard to found a more logic name for an airline?

Wait till you hear about Joon..
 
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PatrickZ80
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Re: Swoop Announces 7 Canada-US Routes

Thu Aug 02, 2018 4:24 pm

Gonzalo wrote:
Sorry but I HAVE to ask…. what on Earth means Swoop ???? Is it soooo hard to found a more logic name for an airline?


As far as I know, it doesn't mean anything. It just sounds fresh, young and modern and also a bit cheap. It could have been a slang word, most of them don't have any meaning either. They just pop up out of the blue.
 
DJWM
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Re: Swoop Announces 7 Canada-US Routes

Thu Aug 02, 2018 4:34 pm

PatrickZ80 wrote:
Gonzalo wrote:
Sorry but I HAVE to ask…. what on Earth means Swoop ???? Is it soooo hard to found a more logic name for an airline?


As far as I know, it doesn't mean anything. It just sounds fresh, young and modern and also a bit cheap. It could have been a slang word, most of them don't have any meaning either. They just pop up out of the blue.




1. To move in a sudden sweep: The bird swooped down on its prey.
2. To make a rush or an attack with a sudden sweeping movement. Often used with down: The children swooped down on the pile of presents.

https://www.thefreedictionary.com/swoop
 
drgmobile
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Re: Swoop Announces 7 Canada-US Routes

Thu Aug 02, 2018 7:16 pm

Dominion301 wrote:
lavalampluva wrote:
So the usual Canada/Sunbird routes.


Pretty much. In fact, I think out of all of these only YHM-TPA is completely new. The others I'd hazard a guess are all transfers from mainline with, in most cases, increased frequencies added.


This is addressed in the article:

"Swoop will take over four routes that had previously been operated by parent company WestJet. They are Edmonton-Las Vegas; Hamilton-Las Vegas; Hamilton-Orlando and Edmonton-Phoenix/Mesa."
 
Samrnpage
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Re: Swoop Announces 7 Canada-US Routes

Thu Aug 02, 2018 8:20 pm

Gonzalo wrote:
Sorry but I HAVE to ask…. what on Earth means Swoop ???? Is it soooo hard to found a more logic name for an airline?


Swoop is a word , its not made up. It means to swoop down and grab something, or attack or get something, (Maybe the Canadain low cost market?).... I think its alright for a name of a ULCC. It doesnt undermine Westjets brand in any way and could be a success.
 
PlanesNTrains
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Re: Swoop Announces 7 Canada-US Routes

Thu Aug 02, 2018 8:29 pm

Gonzalo wrote:
Sorry but I HAVE to ask…. what on Earth means Swoop ???? Is it soooo hard to found a more logic name for an airline?


Abalanza? Not sure how close that would be.
-Dave


MAX’d out on MAX threads. If you are starting a thread, and it’s about the MAX - stop. There’s already a thread that covers it.
 
Dominion301
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Re: Swoop Announces 7 Canada-US Routes

Thu Aug 02, 2018 8:29 pm

axiom wrote:
While Hamilton-TPA is new, WS has also reduced its footprint in Tampa by cutting Halifax and Ottawa. Part of the Swoop-ing of their sun profile, or just marginal routes that got the axe?


They also cut YOW-FLL (and probably YHZ-FLL too). That's rather surprising as they'd been flying both routes for over a decade. WS have dramatically cut YOW/YHZ-Florida flying in the past 3 years. This winter, out of YOW they're only showing 1x to RSW and 3x to MCO...a far cry from when they were at 11x to Florida from YOW.

tjwgrr wrote:
Dominion301 wrote:
Cactus739 wrote:
Interesting choice of Gateway Airport in Mesa for them.


No doubt that’s simply shifting their AZO service to Swoop from WS mainline. Likely ditto for YEG-LAS.


AZA is Gateway Airport in Mesa, AZ. AZO is Kalamazoo, MI... ;)


Oops that's right.
 
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SierraPacific
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Re: Swoop Announces 7 Canada-US Routes

Thu Aug 02, 2018 8:40 pm

Very excited for new Mesa service. I hope to see an expansion of Canadian airlines here at AZA since the market is definitely concentrated in the east valley which is much closer to Mesa Gateway. My personal dream would be for a Rouge 767 but I may be waiting a while for that.
 
LMFNINJA
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Re: Swoop Announces 7 Canada-US Routes

Thu Aug 02, 2018 8:43 pm

Las Vegas to Hamilton is a good route for those living in or outside Toronto provided the fares are significantly cheaper than Westjet mainline and AC Rouge.
 
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spinotter
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Re: Swoop Announces 7 Canada-US Routes

Thu Aug 02, 2018 8:44 pm

PatrickZ80 wrote:
Gonzalo wrote:
Sorry but I HAVE to ask…. what on Earth means Swoop ???? Is it soooo hard to found a more logic name for an airline?


As far as I know, it doesn't mean anything. It just sounds fresh, young and modern and also a bit cheap. It could have been a slang word, most of them don't have any meaning either. They just pop up out of the blue.


PatrickZ80 - You must not be a native English speaker. Of course the word "swoop" means something. It is a normal English verb meaning to descend rapidly like a hawk.

https://www.vocabulary.com/dictionary/swoop
 
axiom
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Re: Swoop Announces 7 Canada-US Routes

Thu Aug 02, 2018 10:42 pm

Dominion301 wrote:
axiom wrote:
While Hamilton-TPA is new, WS has also reduced its footprint in Tampa by cutting Halifax and Ottawa. Part of the Swoop-ing of their sun profile, or just marginal routes that got the axe?


They also cut YOW-FLL (and probably YHZ-FLL too). That's rather surprising as they'd been flying both routes for over a decade. WS have dramatically cut YOW/YHZ-Florida flying in the past 3 years. This winter, out of YOW they're only showing 1x to RSW and 3x to MCO...a far cry from when they were at 11x to Florida from YOW.

tjwgrr wrote:
Dominion301 wrote:

No doubt that’s simply shifting their AZO service to Swoop from WS mainline. Likely ditto for YEG-LAS.


AZA is Gateway Airport in Mesa, AZ. AZO is Kalamazoo, MI... ;)


Oops that's right.


Do you think YOW/YHZ cuts point to the entry of swoop in these markets? I could imagine sun spikes getting cut to all but the minimum service to the main WS hubs, and leaving Swoop to pick up the seasonal P2P stuff -- if that's within their remit, of course.
 
SurfandSnow
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Re: Swoop Announces 7 Canada-US Routes

Thu Aug 02, 2018 10:43 pm

I'm interested to see what happens with Swoop. Going to Canada has always been very expensive from anywhere in the U.S., especially the less competitive places like YLW and YYJ. I certainly wouldn't be upset to see some dirt cheap fares on LAX-YLW/YYJ, for example... though I realize far less appealing stuff like LAX-YWG/YXE may be much more practical/likely...
Flying in the middle seat of coach is much better than not flying at all!
 
Dominion301
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Re: Swoop Announces 7 Canada-US Routes

Fri Aug 03, 2018 2:12 pm

axiom wrote:
Dominion301 wrote:
axiom wrote:
While Hamilton-TPA is new, WS has also reduced its footprint in Tampa by cutting Halifax and Ottawa. Part of the Swoop-ing of their sun profile, or just marginal routes that got the axe?


They also cut YOW-FLL (and probably YHZ-FLL too). That's rather surprising as they'd been flying both routes for over a decade. WS have dramatically cut YOW/YHZ-Florida flying in the past 3 years. This winter, out of YOW they're only showing 1x to RSW and 3x to MCO...a far cry from when they were at 11x to Florida from YOW.

tjwgrr wrote:

AZA is Gateway Airport in Mesa, AZ. AZO is Kalamazoo, MI... ;)


Oops that's right.


Do you think YOW/YHZ cuts point to the entry of swoop in these markets? I could imagine sun spikes getting cut to all but the minimum service to the main WS hubs, and leaving Swoop to pick up the seasonal P2P stuff -- if that's within their remit, of course.


Swoop will only serve YOW if Flair enter YOW. Now as to why Flair still doesn't serve YOW (or YUL) is beyond me. My only thought is they have virtually no French speaking FAs/personnel and are avoiding them for that reason.

Swoop's primary purpose is to put Flair out of business and to transfer some VFR/leisure routes to the lower cost unit from mainline à la Rouge. Swoop are at YHZ already, so if a YHZ-Florida route transfer were to take place, why didn't it happen with the other seven routes? In other words, I think it points to WS' continued extreme weakness in Eastern Canada (e.g., cutting YSB again: viewtopic.php?t=1398161) and their current obsession of directing as many resources as possible at defeating Flair.
 
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PatrickZ80
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Re: Swoop Announces 7 Canada-US Routes

Fri Aug 03, 2018 4:04 pm

spinotter wrote:
PatrickZ80 - You must not be a native English speaker. Of course the word "swoop" means something. It is a normal English verb meaning to descend rapidly like a hawk.


Indeed I'm not a native English speaker. I'm Dutch, and although I'm rather good at English I can't know everything. Thanks for the clarification.

Dominion301 wrote:
Swoop will only serve YOW if Flair enter YOW. Now as to why Flair still doesn't serve YOW (or YUL) is beyond me. My only thought is they have virtually no French speaking FAs/personnel and are avoiding them for that reason.


I think the reason for that is rather obvious. Swoop, like Ryanair in Europe, is picking the smaller alternative airports instead of the large big ones. This saves on landing and handling fees, which are far lower at the smaller airports.

Also they're a growing airline, their network isn't very big yet. I suppose if they ever serve that area they'll pick Trois-Rivières (YRQ). It's a small airport that's right in the middle between Montreal and Quebec, would be perfect for them.
 
Dominion301
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Re: Swoop Announces 7 Canada-US Routes

Fri Aug 03, 2018 4:08 pm

PatrickZ80 wrote:
spinotter wrote:
PatrickZ80 - You must not be a native English speaker. Of course the word "swoop" means something. It is a normal English verb meaning to descend rapidly like a hawk.


Indeed I'm not a native English speaker. I'm Dutch, and although I'm rather good at English I can't know everything. Thanks for the clarification.

Dominion301 wrote:
Swoop will only serve YOW if Flair enter YOW. Now as to why Flair still doesn't serve YOW (or YUL) is beyond me. My only thought is they have virtually no French speaking FAs/personnel and are avoiding them for that reason.


I think the reason for that is rather obvious. Swoop, like Ryanair in Europe, is picking the smaller alternative airports instead of the large big ones. This saves on landing and handling fees, which are far lower at the smaller airports.

Also they're a growing airline, their network isn't very big yet. I suppose if they ever serve that area they'll pick Trois-Rivières (YRQ). It's a small airport that's right in the middle between Montreal and Quebec, would be perfect for them.


YHU is about the only other airport in Canada that could become a ULCC airport alternative to a city's main airport besides YXX and YHM. Swoop already serve YWG, YHZ and YEG that are all large airports by Canadian standards. Why the aversion to the two other large airports that aren't YYZ - YOW and YUL?
 
sixtyseven
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Re: Swoop Announces 7 Canada-US Routes

Fri Aug 03, 2018 4:45 pm

jimbo737 wrote:
Skywatcher wrote:
I guess Rouge worked so well that WestJet is copying the model?


Rouge operates predominantly into Air Canada's mainline hub cities, causing heightened canibalization and brand confusion.

Fly Rouge from many, if not most destinations and branding remains 100% Air Canada. You won't see any Rouge signs at PHX or PSP even though it's Rouge, not Air Canada, doing the flying.

There's no confusion about whether your on Swoop of WJ mainline. It's a completely different brand / product / look /experience.

WS is keeping Swoop out of it's core markets.

As it stands, if it doesn't touch YXX, YEG, YWG or YHM, (with YXX being the only true "low cost" airport in Canada,with YHM a distant 2nd), they don't operate it.

Compare that to Rouge, where in some cases, they over fly not one, not two, but three AC hubs, (YUL-YYJ).

It's a completely different strategy.


Turn the page. There is no brand confusion anymore that was valid early. As for them staying out of their hub cities? For now buddy. It’ll spread like crazy if they find it a cheaper way to operate.
Stand-by for new ATIS message......
 
ACDC8
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Re: Swoop Announces 7 Canada-US Routes

Fri Aug 03, 2018 6:42 pm

sixtyseven wrote:

Turn the page. There is no brand confusion anymore that was valid early. As for them staying out of their hub cities? For now buddy. It’ll spread like crazy if they find it a cheaper way to operate.

I'm sure that the new Unions at WS will have something to say about that.
A Grumpy German Is A Sauerkraut
 
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spinotter
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Re: Swoop Announces 7 Canada-US Routes

Fri Aug 03, 2018 7:02 pm

PatrickZ80 wrote:
spinotter wrote:
PatrickZ80 - You must not be a native English speaker. Of course the word "swoop" means something. It is a normal English verb meaning to descend rapidly like a hawk.


Indeed I'm not a native English speaker. I'm Dutch, and although I'm rather good at English I can't know everything. Thanks for the clarification.

Dominion301 wrote:
Swoop will only serve YOW if Flair enter YOW. Now as to why Flair still doesn't serve YOW (or YUL) is beyond me. My only thought is they have virtually no French speaking FAs/personnel and are avoiding them for that reason.


I think the reason for that is rather obvious. Swoop, like Ryanair in Europe, is picking the smaller alternative airports instead of the large big ones. This saves on landing and handling fees, which are far lower at the smaller airports.

Also they're a growing airline, their network isn't very big yet. I suppose if they ever serve that area they'll pick Trois-Rivières (YRQ). It's a small airport that's right in the middle between Montreal and Quebec, would be perfect for them.


PatrickZ80, ik weet zeker dat jouw Engels veel beter is dan mijn Nederlands. (Translation: PatrickZ80, I am sure that your English is far better than my Dutch.)
 
sixtyseven
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Re: Swoop Announces 7 Canada-US Routes

Sat Aug 04, 2018 12:18 am

ACDC8 wrote:
sixtyseven wrote:

Turn the page. There is no brand confusion anymore that was valid early. As for them staying out of their hub cities? For now buddy. It’ll spread like crazy if they find it a cheaper way to operate.

I'm sure that the new Unions at WS will have something to say about that.



Well they’d need to negotiate a scope clause which I’m sure they’re going to try and do. The FAs will have no say in it, it will be up to the pilots. I wish them luck. Their airlines management must be happy this thing went straight to mediation.

But my sentiment remains. To think Swoop won’t wind up in the big cities is foolish. Where Rouge goes so will Swoop.
Stand-by for new ATIS message......

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