MIflyer12
Posts: 6188
Joined: Mon Feb 18, 2013 11:58 pm

Re: Jet Airways Updated:. Opperations suspended

Wed Apr 17, 2019 3:32 pm

DALMD80 wrote:
I though Alitalia was in good standing. I was just thinking budget carriers.


You've missed some news. Google 'Alitalia restructuring deadline' constrained to the last month.
 
DIJKKIJK
Posts: 1822
Joined: Sun Jul 27, 2003 11:03 pm

Re: Jet Airways Updated:. Opperations suspended

Wed Apr 17, 2019 3:34 pm

Truly a sad day for Indian civil aviation. After the Kingfisher fiasco, Jet held out the last hope that an Indian carrier would someday become a force to reckon with in world civil aviation. Now all those hopes are dashed.
I'll never forgive NG and his cronies for messing up what was a truly great opportunity. It only goes that whatever else Indian businessmen can or cannot do, they certainly cannot run a successful full service airline. And the Indian members better hold on to their horses. I'm of Indian origin myself.
Never argue with idiots. They will bring you down to their level, and beat you with experience.
 
Antarius
Posts: 1785
Joined: Thu Apr 13, 2017 1:27 pm

Re: Jet Airways Updated:. Opperations suspended

Wed Apr 17, 2019 3:35 pm

winginit wrote:
klm617 wrote:
The question is how did Delta make such a big mistake by partnering with these guys.


Is that the question? It was a simple codeshare nothing more and it's really no skin off Delta's nose. I don't recall 'the questions' of the past being 'How did American make such a big mistake by partnering with AirBerlin' or Mexicana... or Kingfisher...


Someone was holding out hope for DEL-DTW on 9W...

The real question is how did EY manage to recreate the Swissair hunter strategy so perfectly. Right down to the collosal failure.
19:SIN HKG NRT DFW IAH HOU CLT LGA JFK SFO SJC EWR SNA EYW MIA BOG LAX ORD DTW OAK PVG BOS DCA IAD ATL LAS BIS CUN PHX SYD CVG PHL MAD ORY CDG SLC SJU BQN MHT YYZ STS DOH BLR KTM MFM MEX MSY BWI BNA
 
Antarius
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Re: Jet Airways Updated:. Opperations suspended

Wed Apr 17, 2019 3:40 pm

DIJKKIJK wrote:
It only goes that whatever else Indian businessmen can or cannot do, they certainly cannot run a successful full service airline. And the Indian members better hold on to their horses. I'm of Indian origin myself.


I think the issue is not indians not being able to run a successful FSA, but India isn't a market conducive to full service airlines and the price premium required to succeed.

India is not a huge country geographically and the market is price conscious. This means justifying the price premium for a 2 hour flight becomes a much harder proposition. First class on BOM-BLR simply isnt worth it -
19:SIN HKG NRT DFW IAH HOU CLT LGA JFK SFO SJC EWR SNA EYW MIA BOG LAX ORD DTW OAK PVG BOS DCA IAD ATL LAS BIS CUN PHX SYD CVG PHL MAD ORY CDG SLC SJU BQN MHT YYZ STS DOH BLR KTM MFM MEX MSY BWI BNA
 
dtw2hyd
Posts: 7317
Joined: Wed Jan 09, 2013 12:11 pm

Re: Jet Airways Updated:. Opperations suspended

Wed Apr 17, 2019 3:47 pm

DIJKKIJK wrote:
Truly a sad day for Indian civil aviation.


Why feel sad, it was a concerted effort of the entire country to reduce a $3.8 Billion annual revenue company with 16,000 employees to rubble in eight months. From Prime Minister to low-cost shills played their part.

Time to celebrate the achievement.
 
321neo
Posts: 590
Joined: Wed Apr 10, 2013 9:20 pm

Re: Jet Airways Updated:. Opperations suspended

Wed Apr 17, 2019 3:53 pm

So, Boeing has just lost a 200+ 737 MAX order?
 
Antarius
Posts: 1785
Joined: Thu Apr 13, 2017 1:27 pm

Re: Jet Airways Updated:. Opperations suspended

Wed Apr 17, 2019 3:55 pm

dtw2hyd wrote:
DIJKKIJK wrote:
Truly a sad day for Indian civil aviation.


Why feel sad, it was a concerted effort of the entire country to reduce a $3.8 Billion annual revenue company with 16,000 employees to rubble in eight months. From Prime Minister to low-cost shills played their part.

Time to celebrate the achievement.


Source?

This is baseless libel otherwise.
19:SIN HKG NRT DFW IAH HOU CLT LGA JFK SFO SJC EWR SNA EYW MIA BOG LAX ORD DTW OAK PVG BOS DCA IAD ATL LAS BIS CUN PHX SYD CVG PHL MAD ORY CDG SLC SJU BQN MHT YYZ STS DOH BLR KTM MFM MEX MSY BWI BNA
 
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unrave
Posts: 2682
Joined: Tue Jan 06, 2015 6:37 am

Re: Jet Airways Updated:. Opperations suspended

Wed Apr 17, 2019 3:56 pm

dtw2hyd wrote:
Why feel sad, it was a concerted effort of the entire country to reduce a $3.8 Billion annual revenue company with 16,000 employees to rubble in eight months. From Prime Minister to low-cost shills played their part.

Time to celebrate the achievement.

One of the funniest hot takes I have seen on Anet :rotfl:
17April2019: RIP Jet Airways
 
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aemoreira1981
Posts: 3001
Joined: Mon Jan 09, 2017 12:17 am

Re: Jet Airways Updated:. Opperations suspended

Wed Apr 17, 2019 3:59 pm

What happens to YU-ARA? This plane with JU is owned by the now-defunct 9W. Do lease payments now go to the creditors of 9W?
 
dtw2hyd
Posts: 7317
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Re: Jet Airways Updated:. Opperations suspended

Wed Apr 17, 2019 4:00 pm

Antarius wrote:
dtw2hyd wrote:
DIJKKIJK wrote:
Truly a sad day for Indian civil aviation.


Why feel sad, it was a concerted effort of the entire country to reduce a $3.8 Billion annual revenue company with 16,000 employees to rubble in eight months. From Prime Minister to low-cost shills played their part.

Time to celebrate the achievement.


Source?

This is baseless libel otherwise.


First amendment gives the right to question public officials.
Astroturfing is illegal in the US, anyone can blame shills with impunity. Helping shills for money is illegal under US law.
 
avier
Posts: 921
Joined: Tue Aug 07, 2018 12:38 pm

Re: Jet Airways Updated:. Opperations suspended

Wed Apr 17, 2019 4:01 pm

The worst part of this the Govt. of India will remain in full support of the worst airline in the world - Air India- with Rs.55,000Cr debts and receiving + Rs. 30,000cr bailout of public tax payer money and still continues to bring national disgrace around the world. And airlines with a fraction of that debt, who got tremendous respectability and identity globally to the Indian aviation sector , which won the hearts of consumers and it's employees, are left to go. Shame. Sigh.
 
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sturmovik
Posts: 710
Joined: Wed May 16, 2007 12:05 am

Re: Jet Airways Updated:. Opperations suspended

Wed Apr 17, 2019 4:06 pm

I kinda feel bad for the kids in flight school right now. Just like the Kingfisher collapse, there's going to be a glut of qualified pilots hitting the market which means getting a job as a fresher is going to be a bit difficult for a few years. On the other hand, perhaps this is a good time for EK to go fishing and solve their pilot pool woes.
'What's it doing now?'
 
Antarius
Posts: 1785
Joined: Thu Apr 13, 2017 1:27 pm

Re: Jet Airways Updated:. Opperations suspended

Wed Apr 17, 2019 4:09 pm

dtw2hyd wrote:
Antarius wrote:
dtw2hyd wrote:

Why feel sad, it was a concerted effort of the entire country to reduce a $3.8 Billion annual revenue company with 16,000 employees to rubble in eight months. From Prime Minister to low-cost shills played their part.

Time to celebrate the achievement.


Source?

This is baseless libel otherwise.


First amendment gives the right to question public [twoid][/twoid]officials.
Astroturfing is illegal in the US, anyone can blame shills with impunity. Helping shills for money is illegal under US law.


And unless you can prove it, claiming people are shilling for money, is libel. The first amendment has to do with the government and Congress being unable to limit free expression, the first amendment doesnt give people rights to babble with impunity.

Again, back up your claims or stop posting unverifiable fiction.
Last edited by Antarius on Wed Apr 17, 2019 4:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.
19:SIN HKG NRT DFW IAH HOU CLT LGA JFK SFO SJC EWR SNA EYW MIA BOG LAX ORD DTW OAK PVG BOS DCA IAD ATL LAS BIS CUN PHX SYD CVG PHL MAD ORY CDG SLC SJU BQN MHT YYZ STS DOH BLR KTM MFM MEX MSY BWI BNA
 
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unrave
Posts: 2682
Joined: Tue Jan 06, 2015 6:37 am

Re: Jet Airways Updated:. Opperations suspended

Wed Apr 17, 2019 4:10 pm

dtw2hyd wrote:

First amendment gives the right to question public officials.
Astroturfing is illegal in the US, anyone can blame shills with impunity. Helping shills for money is illegal under US law.

TIL the INDIAN Prime Minister is governed by US law.
17April2019: RIP Jet Airways
 
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lightsaber
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Re: Jet Airways Updated:. Opperations suspended

Wed Apr 17, 2019 4:14 pm

DALMD80 wrote:
I though Alitalia was in good standing. I was just thinking budget carriers.

Jet was not a budget carrier by any means. If there are forward failures, it will be airlines with poor profit (unable to survive a downturn) or losing money. You listed Ryanair, one of the most profitable airlines out there. EasyJet is heathy enough to survive.

Possible:
1. Alitalia (somehow they have more lives). Technically already failed.
2. Norwegian
3. Philippine airlines
4. Guardia
5. Malaysian
6. Etihad (still not profitable).


In a few years we could discuss the following, but not before 2021:
1. GoAir (seems to be the next most marginal Indian carrier). They have 15 months to get their act together.
2. Air India. They lose money even in good years.


Don't confuse budget with at risk. The healthiest Indian airline is Indigo. SpiceJet has turned around. The #1 risk is Legacy airlines that haven't started adapting such as Jet.

Airlines must realize private jets have taken the most lucrative premium traffic. The people I know who fly premium just charter/fractional when enough people are going (including my employer). I might fly in lie flat business, but that isn't the true premium. I have fallen into the volume premium. Heck, this summer I'm flying all coach for what I have to pay for as the MAX grounding spiked fares as we know Jet's grounding did in India.

Lightsaber
IM messages to mods on warnings and bans will be ignored and nasty ones will result in a ban.
 
AirbusA322
Posts: 217
Joined: Fri Apr 10, 2009 6:38 am

Re: Jet Airways Updated:. Opperations suspended

Wed Apr 17, 2019 4:14 pm

Realistically what are the chances of it getting up and running again. It appears to be zero?
 
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lightsaber
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Posts: 18424
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Re: Jet Airways Updated:. Opperations suspended

Wed Apr 17, 2019 4:27 pm

Antarius wrote:
The real question is how did EY manage to recreate the Swissair hunter strategy so perfectly. Right down to the collosal failure.

Oh, Alitalia took it a few steps further. Invest in a bunch of failing companies without a plan for effective reform..

Operations companies, such as airlines, either focus on cost control or fail. Obviously they need to focus on revenue too.

Jet had:
1. Poor employee efficiency (lack of modern sales, maintenance planning, and crew resource management).
2. Poor return on assets (seat configuration out of line with what market is willing to pay for). Seriously, I like elbow room, buy if people won't pay, adapt.
3. Incredibly high sales costs with no yield improvement to show for it.
4. Poor advertising strategy. (Poor return for spending).
5. A horrible hubbing strategy on fixed after it was too late.
6. A me too route strategy that gave first mover's advantage away.
7. What was their ancillary revenue strategy? E.g., credit cards, luggage, selling up (y+ vs. Y)?

Jet was managed by hope too long. That will always result in failure.

Lightsaber
IM messages to mods on warnings and bans will be ignored and nasty ones will result in a ban.
 
EmoticonsAllDay
Posts: 148
Joined: Fri Nov 16, 2018 2:19 am

Re: Jet Airways Updated: Operations suspended

Wed Apr 17, 2019 4:32 pm

I guess it is finally time to close this magnificent thread.
 
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lightsaber
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Re: Jet Airways Updated:. Opperations suspended

Wed Apr 17, 2019 4:33 pm

AirbusA322 wrote:
Realistically what are the chances of it getting up and running again. It appears to be zero?

Under the current structure? Zero.

Jet part 2 where new rules, crew management, and all the other issues fixed? I don't know. Unfortunately for employees, salaries will have to be reduced to market and productivity increased. Look at the LCC aspects DL adopted. 9W must relaunch with those in place day 1. Entirely new sales software, maintenance, yield management, and employee contracts.

Untangling this mess is tricky. Just because I do not know how doesn't mean it cannot be done.

I do know there is no business case for maintaining 16,000+ employees. :cry2:

Lightsaber
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lightsaber
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Re: Jet Airways Updated: Operations suspended

Wed Apr 17, 2019 4:39 pm

Please continue discussion here:

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1420603
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