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alggag
Posts: 436
Joined: Tue Apr 20, 2010 6:34 am

Re: Updated: AS employee steals and crashes Q400 at SeaTac

Sat Aug 11, 2018 7:10 am

Crazy story but at least this guy was sensible enough to do it using an empty plane and then not crash into a crowd of people.
 
Heinkel
Posts: 247
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Re: AS Employee steals Q400 at SeaTac

Sat Aug 11, 2018 7:11 am

NearMiss wrote:
How would a costumer service agent know how to even start a modern twin engine turboprop? It's not like just pushing buttons or moving levers.


Everybody should be able to start the engines after reading the manual or some other kind of training. It is no rocket science, especially for people, who are interested in aviation.
 
gensys
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Re: Updated: AS employee steals and crashes Q400 at SeaTac

Sat Aug 11, 2018 7:18 am

One Seattle TV station reported he just jumped the line awaiting take off, much like an express pass at an amusement park.

They also quoted a passenger as saying their pilot hit the brakes hard.

Maybe ATC figured out they had a rogue on their hands in time to prevent an in-air disaster.
Last edited by gensys on Sat Aug 11, 2018 7:24 am, edited 1 time in total.
 
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Kaphias
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Re: Updated: AS employee steals and crashes Q400 at SeaTac

Sat Aug 11, 2018 7:21 am

Since airliners.net doesn't want this in the database I'll just leave it here... I took this 20 image stack of 30 second exposures approximately two hours after the crash, it shows rescue aircraft and helicopters circling the crash site.

Image
 
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neomax
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Re: Updated: AS employee steals and crashes Q400 at SeaTac

Sat Aug 11, 2018 7:22 am

gensys wrote:
They also quoted a passenger as saying their pilot hit the brakes hard.

Maybe ATC figured out they had a rouge on their hands in time to prevent an in-air disaster.


Airbrakes or wheel brakes?
 
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RetroRoo
Posts: 79
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Re: Updated: AS employee steals and crashes Q400 at SeaTac

Sat Aug 11, 2018 7:25 am

How terribly, terribly sad.

A note of caution to other posters that we should continue to discuss this with sensitivity.
 
gensys
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Re: Updated: AS employee steals and crashes Q400 at SeaTac

Sat Aug 11, 2018 7:29 am

neomax wrote:
gensys wrote:
They also quoted a passenger as saying their pilot hit the brakes hard.

Maybe ATC figured out they had a rouge on their hands in time to prevent an in-air disaster.


Airbrakes or wheel brakes?


If I understood that they were reporting it was during taxi (or may be take off roll).

Clarification: I am wondering/speculating if ATC recognized the unauthorized movement and quickly alerted numerous aircraft, and thus avoided a potential in-air collision.
Last edited by gensys on Sat Aug 11, 2018 7:37 am, edited 1 time in total.
 
gensys
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Re: Updated: AS employee steals and crashes Q400 at SeaTac

Sat Aug 11, 2018 7:31 am

Kaphias wrote:
Since airliners.net doesn't want this in the database I'll just leave it here... I took this 20 image stack of 30 second exposures approximately two hours after the crash, it shows rescue aircraft and helicopters circling the crash site.

Image


It's odd that such a sad event could bring about such a beautiful image.

Thanks for sharing.
 
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neomax
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Re: Updated: AS employee steals and crashes Q400 at SeaTac

Sat Aug 11, 2018 7:44 am

Seattle Times has a good map graphic

Image
 
PlanesNTrains
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Re: Updated: AS employee steals and crashes Q400 at SeaTac

Sat Aug 11, 2018 7:46 am

For anyone who is familiar with where Eatonville, WA is, this link is to a short video of it passing low over town. Excuse the foul language, but respect the guy's knowledge of aviation. :-)

https://www.facebook.com/iFIBERONENEWS/ ... 242902592/
-Dave


MAX’d out on MAX threads. If you are starting a thread, and it’s about the MAX - stop. There’s already a thread that covers it.
 
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flybynight
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Re: Updated: AS employee steals and crashes Q400 at SeaTac

Sat Aug 11, 2018 7:51 am

Sad and it could have been worse from a public perspective.
Also a weird feeling to know I have flown on N449QX many times. I always take note of which plane I am so I can look up age, etc.
My next AS Q400 flight will be this Tuesday in fact.

Isn’t that the only Q400 in the new livery?
Heia Norge!
 
Draken21fx
Posts: 241
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Re: AS Employee steals Q400 at SeaTac

Sat Aug 11, 2018 7:53 am

Etheereal wrote:

Dont worry, i couldnt stand her either with all that nonsense.


Too much drama especially if you compare it with the S. African crash a few weeks ago.

B764er wrote:
Looks like a bad case of "Tex Johnstone-itis."
Only problem was he didnt count on NORAD going code red on him.


nXnw wrote:
Pierce Co Sheriff
Pierce Co Sheriff
@PierceSheriff
·
1h
“Told F 15s made it within a few minutes of theft of plane. Pilots kept plane out of harms way and people on ground safe. Yay air force . They may not admit for a few days. But is true.“


That's a bit of an exaggeration isn't? The F15s seem to be monitoring only. From the transcripts we have "Rich" was never bothered about them and he said he is going to crash the plane anyway, don't think the F15s had much to do with the incident nor they kept the plane out of "harms way".

Also let's not forget that fighter pilots are humans as well and they were keeping an eye on the frequency so they perfectly knew what was going on, don't think they would have intervened unless absolutely necessary and "Rich" did not sound like he wanted to harm anyone. Kudos to the air traffic controller for doing a stellar job.

Memories of the Helios 522 crash came into memory. A depressurised 737 full of passengers flying close to Athens followed by two HAF F16s. They talk in Greek, but listen to the tone of voice of the F16 pilot when he sees a jetliner full of passengers crashing into a hill, the pilot although highly professional is almost crying on the frequency.

https://youtu.be/mBKokazW9Ms?t=7m23s

I am sure the F15s pilots or any other sane individual would have similar feelings when asked to intercept a commercial airliner.

RIP "Rich".
 
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flybynight
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Re: Updated: AS employee steals and crashes Q400 at SeaTac

Sat Aug 11, 2018 7:55 am

RIP Rich. Troubled and you didn’t get the help you needed
Heia Norge!
 
aldrigsomandre
Posts: 346
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Re: Updated: AS employee steals and crashes Q400 at SeaTac

Sat Aug 11, 2018 7:59 am

This is absolutely shocking. It also shows how important it is that airlines pay attention to employee health and well-being. Those long TSA lines are not the only frontier of aviation security.
 
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Finn350
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Re: Updated: AS employee steals and crashes Q400 at SeaTac

Sat Aug 11, 2018 8:01 am

Sad story, luckily there was no other loss of life. The guy probably got too excited of the idea of actually flying a plane. If he had stolen and crashed a car I don't know if that would qualify as a mental illness.
 
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flybynight
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Re: Updated: AS employee steals and crashes Q400 at SeaTac

Sat Aug 11, 2018 8:05 am

In fairness to KING5, they have a very good aviation expert on staff.
Heia Norge!
 
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SEAxSANxBOS
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Re: Updated: AS employee steals and crashes Q400 at SeaTac

Sat Aug 11, 2018 8:21 am

flybynight wrote:
In fairness to KING5, they have a very good aviation expert on staff.


Agreed. Also considering the amount of aviation and aviation industry up here. There are plenty of people with first hand knowledge and background on many facets of the industry.
Does not reflect the views of Delta Air Lines

Favorite Airports: SEA, SAN, BOS, MSP, IND, CVG
 
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lebda
Posts: 128
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Re: Updated: AS employee steals and crashes Q400 at SeaTac

Sat Aug 11, 2018 8:46 am

Oh God, so that's why we were getting diversions from SEA-bound planes down here.

This is crazy on so many levels. I just went on a trip from PDX to SEA and the first plane I saw at the Horizon gate was N449QX. I also live right under a major approach pattern for PDX and probably have seen this specific aircraft on more than one occasion.

But it's not about the plane, it's about the guy. I could have easily passed by or seen him the other week on my stopover in SEA while flying Horizon. It's sad to think about. He was clearly hurting a lot to have pulled this off. While I wouldn't do what he did given the potential to hurt others in the process, I understand what it's like to be so deeply depressed that you're willing to expose yourself to extreme harm. It's not pleasant. My condolences go out to the deceased's family. As cliche as it sounds, it's never too late to get help. You're not in this alone, and you're not weak for having an illness and wanting to treat it.
Denver Tower: Gulfstream 592, you’re cleared to 9,000 feet. For a vector to Hector, contact the sector director.
 
Max Q
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Re: AS Employee steals Q400 at SeaTac

Sat Aug 11, 2018 8:50 am

cpd wrote:
joeblow10 wrote:
Holy moly he had to be less than 100 feet over the water after that inverted loop...


Completely mad. I wonder exactly what kind of extra precautions will happen in response to this?

Max Q wrote:
Tragic,



Why on earth the idiot aviation ignoramus
Mary Schiavo is called on for commentary is beyond me



What she knows about flying could fit
on the head of a pin



Plenty of experienced pilots out there who
could be called on


She just makes stuff up, adding to the confusion


By the way, is there a reason your posts are always done with strange line breaks splitting up sentences? It makes a tiny post take up a lot of room and also displays strangely - what I've quoted even has a scroll bar.





I take special care to arrange my sentences in that manner
It’s all quite deliberate and primarily for your benefit



And you are most welcome. By the way.
The best contribution to safety is a competent Pilot.


GGg
 
BlueberryWheats
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Re: AS Employee steals Q400 at SeaTac

Sat Aug 11, 2018 9:03 am

Max Q wrote:


I take special care to arrange my sentences in that manner
It’s all quite deliberate and primarily for your benefit



And you are most welcome. By the way.


What benefit is that?

It just makes it read like a William Shatner cover version.
The tallest blade of grass is the first to be cut.
 
outbackair
Posts: 155
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Re: Updated: AS employee steals and crashes Q400 at SeaTac

Sat Aug 11, 2018 9:14 am

Not so different from the Air Botswana ATR-42 which was stolen and crashed, though that was a pilot and he destroyed most of the fleet on the ground at Gaborone airport.

https://aviation-safety.net/database/re ... 19991011-0

Photo of damage here:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/471568.stm
 
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Jouhou
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Re: AS Employee steals Q400 at SeaTac

Sat Aug 11, 2018 9:30 am

spacecadet wrote:
Pellegrine wrote:
I don't believe in people snapping


Whether you believe it or not, it's a scientific fact. It's called a "psychotic break", and you can look that term up. (I had a family member who went through that.) This is why it's usually pointless to ask "why" in cases like this (as well as in other sudden violent events); the real question, and the only thing that actually matters in terms of safety going forward, is "how". Solve the "how" and you solve the problem. Focusing on the "why" is just a distraction.

Even if there was a buildup of problems, two people can go through the same issues and one will handle them fine while the other experiences a psychotic break. There's no real way to predict which of those two people will be ok while the other does something like this. So all you can do is make it so that nobody has the means to do it. Life for anyone is just a series of problems that need to be solved, and humans all handle those problems differently.

I'm not a mechanic so I don't know what security protocols are already in place. But I would think there has to be a way to keep a mechanic from stealing a plane. I mean, I dunno, make it so that two people are always watching the planes in the hangar, or make it so you need a security code to start a plane's engines, or whatever... there are any number of ideas. It's not impossible for a company to keep better control than this on its employees and assets.


The audio does tell me this is definitely a psychotic episode. I also get the feeling he may have been severely bipolar. That manic tone of voice and way of thinking is familiar to me, it happened to my ex (he attempted to kill me and himself).

I'm glad he hurt no one else, that's a dangerous state of mind. And hey, if you're going to lose your mind, I suppose he pulled it off in spectacular fashion. That was a crazy manoeuvre he pulled off.

Also, RE: video games, "Do a barrel roll" was from starfox. GTA has you do it as a part of the flight tutorial, but starfox made it a meme beforehand. The guys obsession with it tells me he had starfox in mind.
情報
 
murchmo
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Re: Updated: AS employee steals and crashes Q400 at SeaTac

Sat Aug 11, 2018 9:37 am

PlanesNTrains wrote:
For anyone who is familiar with where Eatonville, WA is, this link is to a short video of it passing low over town. Excuse the foul language, but respect the guy's knowledge of aviation. :-)

https://www.facebook.com/iFIBERONENEWS/ ... 242902592/


This is all tripping me out as i spent the afternoon driving around all these areas where i live and have lived. The biggest thing of note to me is the time in the air. For some reason it seemed to me he took off did a few rolls then crashed. I rememeber the last time F-15s were scrambled to Seattle when Obama was in town a small plane stumbled into restricted airspace. It was my first time hearing a sonic boom. Took them something like 10 minutes to get here. Anyway, in the current incident, according to the approximate times in the article this guy was in the air for an hour and a half. Thats crazy! Eatonville is closer to Mt Rainier than Puget Sound. Im curious if his whole flight path will be known. Sad story.
 
mxaxai
Posts: 1986
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Re: Updated: AS employee steals and crashes Q400 at SeaTac

Sat Aug 11, 2018 10:01 am

murchmo wrote:
According to the approximate times in the article this guy was in the air for an hour and a half. Thats crazy! Eatonville is closer to Mt Rainier than Puget Sound. Im curious if his whole flight path will be known.

It's crazy that a Q400 that wasn't refueled after the last flight took off and flew for 1.5 hours without running out of fuel. I am equally amazed that the Q400's structure withstood those maneuvers, and that the F-15s actually got there and found him so quickly. I wonder if he knew that there was an F-15 on his tail.
 
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Jouhou
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Re: Updated: AS employee steals and crashes Q400 at SeaTac

Sat Aug 11, 2018 10:04 am

mxaxai wrote:
murchmo wrote:
According to the approximate times in the article this guy was in the air for an hour and a half. Thats crazy! Eatonville is closer to Mt Rainier than Puget Sound. Im curious if his whole flight path will be known.

It's crazy that a Q400 that wasn't refueled after the last flight took off and flew for 1.5 hours without running out of fuel. I am equally amazed that the Q400's structure withstood those maneuvers, and that the F-15s actually got there and found him so quickly. I wonder if he knew that there was an F-15 on his tail.


I'm going to guess that the Q400 could only pull that off because it had no passengers or cargo on board.
情報
 
77H
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Re: AS Employee steals Q400 at SeaTac

Sat Aug 11, 2018 10:16 am

426Shadow wrote:
DarthLobster wrote:
426Shadow wrote:
Man mental illness is a serious problem in this country. And there is nothing we can do about it.


Not with that attitude we won't, which I guess brings the problem full-circle, doesn't it...


I'm a realist. Just like I believe gun violence cannot be stopped, racism cannot be stopped, corporate greed cannot be stopped. Don't shoot the messenger.


While I am inclined to agree with you I also think things can change for the better in terms of mental illness, gun violence, racism, etc. But it is going to take some big mentality changes.
Getting slightly off topic here but look at what is occurring in nearly every major American city. The idea of the American Dream is changing with the "millennial" generation from house with the yard and white picket fence of the baby boomer generation back to urban living.

77H
 
KentB27
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Re: Updated: AS employee steals and crashes Q400 at SeaTac

Sat Aug 11, 2018 11:26 am

This is an extremely crazy and sad situation. It's almost hard to believe it's even real. That barrel roll he did was unbelievable and the ATC recordings are chilling. I do feel sorry for him. I wish he could have gotten the help he needed. My cousin took his own life in 2012. Sometimes we don't realize the demons that other people are dealing with until it is too late. At the very least I do commend him for not taking anyone else's life. He could have made it a lot worse if he had wanted to. RIP Rich. My condolences to his family and friends.
 
smokeybandit
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Re: Updated: AS employee steals and crashes Q400 at SeaTac

Sat Aug 11, 2018 11:29 am

Would ATC get training on how to deal with a pilot (rogue or otherwise) that is flying in an imbalanced state? The controller seemed to do a really good job.
 
ltbewr
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Re: Updated: AS employee steals and crashes Q400 at SeaTac

Sat Aug 11, 2018 11:43 am

There is no doubt this was a very disturbing incident, but I don't see any real way to limit them from ever happening. Sadly a person with apparently some serious personal and mental health issues, who had access to a plane, few it with some competency, led to this sad event.

I am quite sure a search A-net would bring up a number of "suicide by aircraft' crashes by amateur and professional pilots, persons with some knowledge of flying who stole or hijacked aircraft and ending up flying into buildings or attempting to do so - think of 9/11/01. Some ATC audio of this incident suggests the person flying this plane did intend to crash it in an act of suicide, admitted to having psychological problems.

Of course, the costs to Alaska Air, their insurers, the ANG plane operations and local government costs, the costs of investigation, damage at the crash site, costs for operations screwed up at SEA and other airports, in all will be in the millions of dollars. He also could have killed people on the ground if hit an occupied building, a fuel depot or chemical plant

As to possible ways to reduce the risk of unauthorized flying, as I noted above, it may be very difficult. Attempts to try to use mental health conditions to limit employment such persons has conflicts with privacy rights and the Americans With Disabilities Act. Perhaps some technical or mechanical way to limit access to aircraft or their ability to take off except by a pilot but that may cause their own problems and won't stop a registered pilot from crashing a plane (Germanwings). Perhaps taking a cue from anti-terrorism messages we hear (like where I work in NYC in the WTC area) could reduce the risk - if you see (or hear) something, do something, report it to police or supervisors. The next time of such an incident it could be far more deadly to innocent persons.
 
murchmo
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Re: Updated: AS employee steals and crashes Q400 at SeaTac

Sat Aug 11, 2018 11:53 am

From the Seattle Times article: ...
An exchange between Rich and the controller not long before the plane crashed, perhaps the final exchange, was recorded by Aviation journalist Jon Ostrower at 8:47 p.m. and posted to his Air Current website.

“I feel like one of my engines is going out or something,” Rich says...

Maybe not quite the deliberate suicide everyones thinking.

https://theaircurrent.com/aviation-safe ... -air-q400/
to strive to seek to find and not to yield
 
rlwynn
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Re: Updated: AS employee steals and crashes Q400 at SeaTac

Sat Aug 11, 2018 12:05 pm

Yeah but if you fly the plane knowingly until the fuel runs out then it is still suicide. He was talking about how little fuel he had from the start.
I can drive faster than you
 
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Acey559
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Re: Updated: AS employee steals and crashes Q400 at SeaTac

Sat Aug 11, 2018 12:13 pm

I checked my logbook and I flew N449QX on New Year’s Day 2016 from RNO-SJC-RNO-PDX. Really, really sad and certainly not something you expect to wake up to.
In Dixie Land I'll take my stand to live and die in Dixie.
 
highflier92660
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Re: AS Employee steals Q400 at SeaTac

Sat Aug 11, 2018 12:28 pm

Runway28L wrote:
Link to the video of the Q400 barrel roll. Look how close to the water it gets:
http://twitter.com/CameronThomsen/statu ... 8158568448

Absolutely nuts :eyepopping: :crazy:



That barrel roll actually looks more like a modified split-S. In the coming days it'll be interesting to see what Rich's aeronautical background was. At one point the ATC conversation turns to his getting hired by Alaska, an idea Rich dismisses with "Nah, I'm a white guy." Could he have once been a failed aspiring airline pilot? We'll find out.
 
usflyer msp
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Re: Updated: AS employee steals and crashes Q400 at SeaTac

Sat Aug 11, 2018 12:33 pm

murchmo wrote:
From the Seattle Times article: ...
An exchange between Rich and the controller not long before the plane crashed, perhaps the final exchange, was recorded by Aviation journalist Jon Ostrower at 8:47 p.m. and posted to his Air Current website.

“I feel like one of my engines is going out or something,” Rich says...

Maybe not quite the deliberate suicide everyones thinking.

https://theaircurrent.com/aviation-safe ... -air-q400/


As close as he was to Ft. Lewis, I would not be surprised if he was actually shot down and the officials are just keeping it quiet.
 
KentB27
Posts: 476
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Re: Updated: AS employee steals and crashes Q400 at SeaTac

Sat Aug 11, 2018 12:41 pm

murchmo wrote:
From the Seattle Times article: ...
An exchange between Rich and the controller not long before the plane crashed, perhaps the final exchange, was recorded by Aviation journalist Jon Ostrower at 8:47 p.m. and posted to his Air Current website.

“I feel like one of my engines is going out or something,” Rich says...

Maybe not quite the deliberate suicide everyones thinking.

https://theaircurrent.com/aviation-safe ... -air-q400/


There's a part of the ATC audio where he says "I wouldn't know how to land it....I wasn't really planning on landing it." Sounds to me like it was a deliberate suicide on his part, sadly.
 
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AirlineCritic
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Re: Updated: AS employee steals and crashes Q400 at SeaTac

Sat Aug 11, 2018 12:42 pm

Kaphias wrote:
Since airliners.net doesn't want this in the database I'll just leave it here... I took this 20 image stack of 30 second exposures approximately two hours after the crash, it shows rescue aircraft and helicopters circling the crash site.

Image


Sad situation, but a beautiful pic. Thanks for sharing.
 
Jshank83
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Joined: Tue Nov 01, 2016 2:23 pm

Re: Updated: AS employee steals and crashes Q400 at SeaTac

Sat Aug 11, 2018 1:01 pm

usflyer msp wrote:
murchmo wrote:
From the Seattle Times article: ...
An exchange between Rich and the controller not long before the plane crashed, perhaps the final exchange, was recorded by Aviation journalist Jon Ostrower at 8:47 p.m. and posted to his Air Current website.

“I feel like one of my engines is going out or something,” Rich says...

Maybe not quite the deliberate suicide everyones thinking.

https://theaircurrent.com/aviation-safe ... -air-q400/


As close as he was to Ft. Lewis, I would not be surprised if he was actually shot down and the officials are just keeping it quiet.


They were telling him to land there, so I doubt they shot him down because he was near it. Also through all the transmissions he never said anything that made it sounds like he was going to do anything that would hurt anyone else.
 
mxaxai
Posts: 1986
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Re: Updated: AS employee steals and crashes Q400 at SeaTac

Sat Aug 11, 2018 1:06 pm

usflyer msp wrote:
murchmo wrote:
From the Seattle Times article: ...
An exchange between Rich and the controller not long before the plane crashed, perhaps the final exchange, was recorded by Aviation journalist Jon Ostrower at 8:47 p.m. and posted to his Air Current website.

“I feel like one of my engines is going out or something,” Rich says...

Maybe not quite the deliberate suicide everyones thinking.

https://theaircurrent.com/aviation-safe ... -air-q400/


As close as he was to Ft. Lewis, I would not be surprised if he was actually shot down and the officials are just keeping it quiet.

The controller suggested him to land at McChord although he rejected the offer. I doubt that they would shoot him down just for being close. He was also communicating pretty openly (e. g. his intention to do a barrel roll) so I'm pretty sure he would've said something if he wanted to crash into something significant (and he would've had plenty of opportunity).


pprune has the Q400's fuel burn at ~1800 lbs/h for holding. If he departed with 3000, as he said himself, there wouldn't be much left after 1.5 hours of flight.
 
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Finn350
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Re: Updated: AS employee steals and crashes Q400 at SeaTac

Sat Aug 11, 2018 1:15 pm

murchmo wrote:
From the Seattle Times article: ...
An exchange between Rich and the controller not long before the plane crashed, perhaps the final exchange, was recorded by Aviation journalist Jon Ostrower at 8:47 p.m. and posted to his Air Current website.

“I feel like one of my engines is going out or something,” Rich says...

Maybe not quite the deliberate suicide everyones thinking.

https://theaircurrent.com/aviation-safe ... -air-q400/


Yes, and he asked the ATC whether 5000 ft was high enoug for a barrel roll. I don't think he wanted to commit suicide when he took the plane, but the circumstances steered him into losing his life anyway.
 
Indy
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Re: Updated: AS employee steals and crashes Q400 at SeaTac

Sat Aug 11, 2018 1:33 pm

Very sad story. It was hard listening to the guy talk on the ATC feed knowing how it was going to end. He wasn't a bad person. He just needed serious help. I hope some day mental health issues get taken more seriously and real help is offered. It can be overly difficult to get help if you need it and the cost is very high. If you are suicidal you can get in patient treatment (at a very high cost) right away. Otherwise the wait to get help can be lengthy and very discouraging. Seeking help for people with mental health issues should not be difficult, time consuming, delayed or very expensive. These are all barriers that could prevent someone from seeking treatment.
Indy = Indianapolis and not Independence Air
 
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GE90man
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Re: Updated: AS employee steals and crashes Q400 at SeaTac

Sat Aug 11, 2018 1:34 pm

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4LLmF9tZoEE
Full ATC recording of flight, includes takeoff.
 
ual763
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Re: Updated: AS employee steals and crashes Q400 at SeaTac

Sat Aug 11, 2018 1:38 pm

Finn350 wrote:
murchmo wrote:
From the Seattle Times article: ...
An exchange between Rich and the controller not long before the plane crashed, perhaps the final exchange, was recorded by Aviation journalist Jon Ostrower at 8:47 p.m. and posted to his Air Current website.

“I feel like one of my engines is going out or something,” Rich says...

Maybe not quite the deliberate suicide everyones thinking.

https://theaircurrent.com/aviation-safe ... -air-q400/


Yes, and he asked the ATC whether 5000 ft was high enoug for a barrel roll. I don't think he wanted to commit suicide when he took the plane, but the circumstances steered him into losing his life anyway.


Exactly! From the sound of it, he was obviously a broken man. But, from having listened to all of the recordings, it sounds as if he intended to just take it up for a joy-ride. It genuinely sounded like he planned on landing (or trying to land) somewhere. However, it seems as if when he got into the air, he quickly realized that it was no video game and that he knew he was done for. That’s when he apologized for what he did.

It’s actually quite noble that he steered away from population out over the sound while doing his maneuvers. Truly didn’t want to hurt anyone I don’t think. From the fuel-flow figures of the Q400, sounds like he ran out of fuel leading to an engine failure shortly before crashing. To an inexperienced pilot, once the engines fail, the plane is pretty much unflyable. Go try doing it in P3D with the Majestic Q400. It’s just sad all-around.
From flying to the NOTAM office
 
Mortyman
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Re: AS Employee steals Q400 at SeaTac

Sat Aug 11, 2018 1:43 pm

N415XJ wrote:
Geez, what's with everyone stealing regional jets these days? I mean, if you're going to do something as idiotic as steal a commercial plane at least go all in and grab something cool like an A380 or 787.
.



Would one person be able to take off and fly an A380 ?
 
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GE90man
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Re: AS Employee steals Q400 at SeaTac

Sat Aug 11, 2018 1:49 pm

Mortyman wrote:
N415XJ wrote:
Geez, what's with everyone stealing regional jets these days? I mean, if you're going to do something as idiotic as steal a commercial plane at least go all in and grab something cool like an A380 or 787.
.



Would one person be able to take off and fly an A380 ?

It would be incredibly hard to do so, since to even get on the plane would require stairs or a jetway, which would be nearly impossible to get rid of while you were in the plane if there were no one else to remove them. That would be the first obstacle
 
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atcsundevil
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Re: Updated: AS employee steals and crashes Q400 at SeaTac

Sat Aug 11, 2018 1:49 pm

smokeybandit wrote:
Would ATC get training on how to deal with a pilot (rogue or otherwise) that is flying in an imbalanced state? The controller seemed to do a really good job.

Controllers are trained to quickly recognize abnormal behavior and situations, and to act accordingly. A huge part of training is recognizing the data block doing something it's not supposed to be doing. Controllers don't really train for specific scenarios, because the circumstances would be different in every case. That's part of the reason that training takes so long, because eventually that training becomes ingrained that any controller can effectively handle any abnormal situation. In scenarios like this, training simply takes over, and it's only once you're off position that you fully realize what's happened.
 
wezgulf3
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Re: Updated: AS employee steals and crashes Q400 at SeaTac

Sat Aug 11, 2018 1:50 pm

I really hope the ATC guy gets a lot of help with this, he would be pretty cut up at a guess having spoke to Rich for so long...

Wes...
 
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Polot
Posts: 10715
Joined: Thu Jul 28, 2011 3:01 pm

Re: AS Employee steals Q400 at SeaTac

Sat Aug 11, 2018 1:52 pm

Mortyman wrote:
N415XJ wrote:
Geez, what's with everyone stealing regional jets these days? I mean, if you're going to do something as idiotic as steal a commercial plane at least go all in and grab something cool like an A380 or 787.
.



Would one person be able to take off and fly an A380 ?

Probably just as easy as flying a Q400 with one man, if not easier.

The reason this happens mostly with RJs and not the heavy metal is because RJs are easier to get into and leave with no help. Walk up to an unattended widebody with no bridge or air stairs attached and try to get in. You will find their height makes things a little more challenging.
 
smokeybandit
Posts: 1387
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Re: Updated: AS employee steals and crashes Q400 at SeaTac

Sat Aug 11, 2018 1:56 pm

usflyer msp wrote:
murchmo wrote:
From the Seattle Times article: ...
An exchange between Rich and the controller not long before the plane crashed, perhaps the final exchange, was recorded by Aviation journalist Jon Ostrower at 8:47 p.m. and posted to his Air Current website.

“I feel like one of my engines is going out or something,” Rich says...

Maybe not quite the deliberate suicide everyones thinking.

https://theaircurrent.com/aviation-safe ... -air-q400/


As close as he was to Ft. Lewis, I would not be surprised if he was actually shot down and the officials are just keeping it quiet.


If he was shot down, there would be eyewitness reports of such by now.
 
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Finn350
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Re: Updated: AS employee steals and crashes Q400 at SeaTac

Sat Aug 11, 2018 2:00 pm

Here is the VASAviation recording
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4LLmF9tZoEE

The guy is pretty suicidal in the end.
 
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JetBuddy
Posts: 2570
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Re: Updated: AS employee steals and crashes Q400 at SeaTac

Sat Aug 11, 2018 2:05 pm

Such a tragedy. I feel sorry for the guy, even though he endangered a lot of people by doing this. He wanted to go see Mount Olympus, see the orcas and do a barrel roll before killing himself.

In his own words:

"I got a lot of people that care about me. It's going to disappoint them to hear that I did this. I would like to apologize to each and every one of them. Just a broken guy... got a few screws loose, I guess. Never really knew it until now. Just, you know..."

I also hope that the ATC and F-15 crews will get a good debrief after this, this is something that will stick with them for the rest of their lives.
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