MavyWavyATR
Topic Author
Posts: 187
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2014 10:52 pm

Is it time to close LGA?

Fri Aug 17, 2018 2:21 am

This was something I've been pondering about for a good bit now. I already know that the PANYNJ and the city itself are pouring truck fulls of money into building new terminals and improving the airport; But in all honesty, I felt they should've just spent the budget into JFK & EWR instead considering that both of them serve the NY market more effectively, both operationally and for the traveler.

One person over at the NY Times wrote a piece 3 years ago on the same subject and it's a decent read.

I'd like to know your position on this topic. Do you think they should've just closed LGA instead of investing in the ongoing improvements?
 
User avatar
EA CO AS
Posts: 15419
Joined: Wed Nov 14, 2001 8:54 am

Re: Is it time to close LGA?

Fri Aug 17, 2018 2:25 am

No.
"In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem - government IS the problem." - Ronald Reagan

Comments made here are my own and are not intended to represent the official position of Alaska Air Group
 
ScottB
Posts: 6646
Joined: Fri Jul 28, 2000 1:25 am

Re: Is it time to close LGA?

Fri Aug 17, 2018 2:36 am

MavyWavyATR wrote:
Do you think they should've just closed LGA instead of investing in the ongoing improvements?


Spend an hour in traffic on the Van Wyck or trying to get through the Lincoln/Holland Tunnels (or GW Bridge) and ask again.
 
User avatar
neomax
Posts: 945
Joined: Fri Dec 01, 2017 3:26 am

Re: Is it time to close LGA?

Fri Aug 17, 2018 2:42 am

Yes.

The only reason people use LGA is because its closer to the city. Once they build high speed rail from Manhattan to JFK/EWR, LGA will be useless. But realistically, they should bulldoze all three airports and build one massive new airport to replace all of them.
 
tootallsd
Posts: 493
Joined: Fri Apr 28, 2006 11:02 pm

Re: Is it time to close LGA?

Fri Aug 17, 2018 2:43 am

Close it now while what, $2B in renovations are underway?
 
User avatar
aemoreira1981
Posts: 2891
Joined: Mon Jan 09, 2017 12:17 am

Re: Is it time to close LGA?

Fri Aug 17, 2018 2:44 am

Where else will you put the flights? LGA basically exists as an O&D airport for NYC within the perimeter, although I'm of the feeling that the perimeter rule should be lifted...which could enable JFK for more connections and allow more long-haul flights at times people want to fly.
 
User avatar
spinkid
Posts: 1874
Joined: Fri Jul 20, 2001 5:59 am

Re: Is it time to close LGA?

Fri Aug 17, 2018 2:48 am

I think the original poster fails to realize the number of passengers who use LGA each day. JFK and EWR can't pick up all that extra traffic.
 
planecane
Posts: 1165
Joined: Thu Feb 09, 2017 4:58 pm

Re: Is it time to close LGA?

Fri Aug 17, 2018 2:49 am

neomax wrote:
Yes.

The only reason people use LGA is because its closer to the city. Once they build high speed rail from Manhattan to JFK/EWR, LGA will be useless. But realistically, they should bulldoze all three airports and build one massive new airport to replace all of them.


Where would this new airport go? Eminent domain harlem and replace it with an airport?
 
HPAEAA
Posts: 1114
Joined: Mon May 08, 2006 7:24 am

Re: Is it time to close LGA?

Fri Aug 17, 2018 2:50 am

MavyWavyATR wrote:
This was something I've been pondering about for a good bit now. I already know that the PANYNJ and the city itself are pouring truck fulls of money into building new terminals and improving the airport; But in all honesty, I felt they should've just spent the budget into JFK & EWR instead considering that both of them serve the NY market more effectively, both operationally and for the traveler.

One person over at the NY Times wrote a piece 3 years ago on the same subject and it's a decent read.

I'd like to know your position on this topic. Do you think they should've just closed LGA instead of investing in the ongoing improvements?


well, I'll throw my .02 in for this as a frequent NYC flyer - I'm not sure how you're measuring "effectively" or "operationally" but in my opinion No, and I can't wait for the project to get completed. Yes, LGA is not a pretty gem yet and it's facilities are old and out of date but it takes me 1/2 the time to get from most points in manhattan on the east side to get to LGA vs JFK or EWR.

Typically here's how I think about it:
Getting to the Airport - To get to LGA, the trip in an uber or town car the trip to LGA can take from 20 mins to an hour in my experience, to get to JFK or EWR it can take 45 mins to 2 hours due to congestion on the roadways. I've done public transit to all 3 and in my opinion it's not really an option - having to take a subway (some times multiple) to connect to a bus or airtran takes too long, can be a miserable experience & more of a headache than the money I'd save by taking a private car.

At the Airport - LGA is a pretty simple lay out, multiple concourses usually means that the security lines are pretty short for Precheck and even walking to the furthest gates is 5 mins after clearing security. Because of the size of JFK & EWR, I've had a lot more problems with security getting backed up & taking 20 mins to clear and post security the concourses are much more spread out, where I can have a 5 minute walk at LGA that can take 20 minutes if you loose the gate lotto.

The issue as I understand it really is that too many planes between fly into the airspace around NYC which causes a lot of the headaches for travelers, my simply removing LGA from the equation, I don't think that would materially improve the situation here at all since I would presume that JFK & EWR would add runway capacity to absorb the traffic at the two locations. I've never really seen any in-depth analysis on how that would look from an ATC perspective, if anyone has please share, I'd love to read it.
1.4mm and counting...
 
BobbyPSP
Posts: 345
Joined: Fri Oct 08, 2004 12:29 pm

Re: Is it time to close LGA?

Fri Aug 17, 2018 2:51 am

Lol .... No
 
HPAEAA
Posts: 1114
Joined: Mon May 08, 2006 7:24 am

Re: Is it time to close LGA?

Fri Aug 17, 2018 2:56 am

neomax wrote:
Yes.

The only reason people use LGA is because its closer to the city. Once they build high speed rail from Manhattan to JFK/EWR, LGA will be useless. But realistically, they should bulldoze all three airports and build one massive new airport to replace all of them.


I'm sorry but no - you'd need multiple single train lines direct to the airport to make a dent (probably UES, UWS, Grand Central, Penn, FIDI) the reality is getting around in the city is problematic and a hassle when pulling luggage around, if you spend 20 - 40 mins getting to the pick up point in the city it doesn't save much time unless you're comparing it to the subway - air train setup.

Regarding the consolidation of all 3, that's laughable, the amount of roadway & transportation costs to connect North Jersey, Connecticut, Hudson Valley & the city itself would make this unfeasible.
1.4mm and counting...
 
masseybrown
Posts: 5384
Joined: Wed Dec 11, 2002 2:40 pm

Re: Is it time to close LGA?

Fri Aug 17, 2018 2:59 am

If the climate change people are correct, sea rise will cause serious runway flooding problems at LGA in the 2030s. Perhaps this can be addressed by building dikes; but nobody seems to talk about it.
 
PEK777
Posts: 418
Joined: Thu Jun 28, 2012 12:56 pm

Re: Is it time to close LGA?

Fri Aug 17, 2018 3:10 am

Shut er down, boys!
 
ltbewr
Posts: 14330
Joined: Thu Jan 29, 2004 1:24 pm

Re: Is it time to close LGA?

Fri Aug 17, 2018 3:15 am

I do see a longer term problem for LGA, that is average global warming raising the waters just off if (Long Island Sound) that may limit it use a few decades from now. Still, there is no real choice to keep it and try to improve the terminals and put in a rail/light rail mass transit connection.
 
User avatar
william
Posts: 3156
Joined: Thu Jun 10, 1999 1:31 pm

Re: Is it time to close LGA?

Fri Aug 17, 2018 3:15 am

HPAEAA wrote:

The issue as I understand it really is that too many planes between fly into the airspace around NYC which causes a lot of the headaches for travelers, my simply removing LGA from the equation, I don't think that would materially improve the situation here at all since I would presume that JFK & EWR would add runway capacity to absorb the traffic at the two locations. I've never really seen any in-depth analysis on how that would look from an ATC perspective, if anyone has please share, I'd love to read it.


I think this is the point the OP was trying to make for closing LGA, there is no other option to improving airspace over NYC.
 
cheapgreek
Posts: 566
Joined: Mon Feb 13, 2017 3:57 pm

Re: Is it time to close LGA?

Fri Aug 17, 2018 3:19 am

No way, the closest airport to the city, what it needs is a direct subway line to the terminal and to make better use of the slots, no airliners below 90 seats. Years back I was watching a steady stream of Dash-8-100's clog up landings and takeoffs while US used these planes to hold on to the slots during their lean years. Use the slots to move the most people as LGA will never have more than two runways.
 
HPAEAA
Posts: 1114
Joined: Mon May 08, 2006 7:24 am

Re: Is it time to close LGA?

Fri Aug 17, 2018 3:27 am

cheapgreek wrote:
No way, the closest airport to the city, what it needs is a direct subway line to the terminal and to make better use of the slots, no airliners below 90 seats. Years back I was watching a steady stream of Dash-8-100's clog up landings and takeoffs while US used these planes to hold on to the slots during their lean years. Use the slots to move the most people as LGA will never have more than two runways.


I do like the idea of requiring upgrades however not sure how many communities would loose service as a result... fortunately the dash-8s are gone but there is still a healthy flow of the 40 & 50 seaters operating at the airport.

There is actually a proposal to add a 3rd once Riker's is shut down, looking for the details but there would also be room to potentially add a another terminal as well.
https://www.constructiondive.com/news/n ... ia/440202/
1.4mm and counting...
 
4engines4lnghll
Posts: 212
Joined: Fri Aug 06, 2010 9:25 am

Re: Is it time to close LGA?

Fri Aug 17, 2018 3:31 am

Hahaha. Good one!
4engines4lnghll
 
santi319
Posts: 836
Joined: Thu Dec 29, 2005 3:24 pm

Re: Is it time to close LGA?

Fri Aug 17, 2018 3:46 am

Yes of course! I mean theres PLENTY of space in JFK and EWR. Lets obliterate aviation yall.
 
GalaxyFlyer
Posts: 3729
Joined: Fri Jan 01, 2016 4:44 am

Re: Is it time to close LGA?

Fri Aug 17, 2018 3:56 am

Simple, DFW is 3½ times the size of JFK; I’d suggest bulldozing insufferable Brooklyn and turning it into the New JFK.

GF
 
LAXLHR
Posts: 448
Joined: Sat Dec 03, 2016 10:07 am

Re: Is it time to close LGA?

Fri Aug 17, 2018 4:06 am

MavyWavyATR wrote:
This was something I've been pondering about for a good bit now. I already know that the PANYNJ and the city itself are pouring truck fulls of money into building new terminals and improving the airport; But in all honesty, I felt they should've just spent the budget into JFK & EWR instead considering that both of them serve the NY market more effectively, both operationally and for the traveler.

One person over at the NY Times wrote a piece 3 years ago on the same subject and it's a decent read.

I'd like to know your position on this topic. Do you think they should've just closed LGA instead of investing in the ongoing improvements?


You obviously have never lived in NYC before, nor do you use LGA/JFK and EWR frequently ...if ever I suspect. Fly in and out of all 3 over 300 times and then ask again!... no utilize them a few times each and the answer will be a little clearer.

JFK has not been sidelined in favor of LGA. EVERY terminal at JFK except for T7 is new (and perhaps the former EA terminal that some DL flights use (sorry, I barely "never") look at DL but I think I saw an old little Square terminal over there. Basically a lot of investment has been poured into JFK since the late 90s. It was a dump prior, I remember.

Is it time to close LGA - SMH, and put those passengers where exactly? Stewart? Just wow.
BA IB ET JM EA GK PA VS AA SN HP CO W7 WN NW DL UA AC US LH LX OS JL QF QR WY MH CX U2 EK 9W UK TP VY VN LO OK OZ UL SQ LA

707 727 L10 732-NG 741 742 743 744 752 753 762 763 772 773 787 DC8 DC9 DC10 M80 M11 100 AB3 310 318 319 320 321 332 333 342 343 380
 
flyfresno
Posts: 837
Joined: Tue May 02, 2006 6:18 am

Re: Is it time to close LGA?

Fri Aug 17, 2018 4:40 am

spinkid wrote:
I think the original poster fails to realize the number of passengers who use LGA each day. JFK and EWR can't pick up all that extra traffic.


I’ve sat in line at JFK during the PM rush for over an hour, with aircraft starting on A or B, joining U, crossing 13L, then going back down C to 22R. While certainly not normal, I could see lines like that for most of the day if even half of LGA’s traffic was moved over, supposing there would even be enough gates for all of those extra flights...
 
MavyWavyATR
Topic Author
Posts: 187
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2014 10:52 pm

Re: Is it time to close LGA?

Fri Aug 17, 2018 4:42 am

LAXLHR wrote:
You obviously have never lived in NYC before, nor do you use LGA/JFK and EWR frequently ...if ever I suspect.


First off, I grew up in Nassau County for 12 years so I had my share of trips through JFK & LGA during the time.

LAXLHR wrote:
Is it time to close LGA - SMH, and put those passengers where exactly? Stewart? Just wow.


If LGA were closed, I'd just simply run the passengers through JFK & EWR (the two primary NYC airports) with ISP and HPN handling some of the load when needed (ISP & HPN would be linked to Manhattan by existing rail service).
 
User avatar
flyingclrs727
Posts: 2431
Joined: Thu Apr 19, 2007 7:44 am

Re: Is it time to close LGA?

Fri Aug 17, 2018 4:56 am

After spending over $4-5 Billion to build a new terminal? Fat chance that would happen. That money would have been better spent on building a right of way allowing nonstop high speed trains from JFK to Penn Station and upgrading JFK.
 
willenglish
Posts: 41
Joined: Thu Jul 06, 2017 1:13 pm

Re: Is it time to close LGA?

Fri Aug 17, 2018 5:19 am

* BREAKING NEWS *

LGA CLOSING TOMORROW!

Not. Gonna. Happen.
 
stlgph
Posts: 10976
Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 4:19 pm

Re: Is it time to close LGA?

Fri Aug 17, 2018 5:22 am

Seriously, people, *WHAT* high speed trains to a New York airport? Who will put them in?

Public transit in New York City is an absolute abortion and it's kind of amazing people haven't just started shooting up anything MTA related.
if assumptions could fly, airliners.net would be the world's busiest airport
 
User avatar
NYPECO
Posts: 557
Joined: Sun Feb 15, 2015 12:55 am

Re: Is it time to close LGA?

Fri Aug 17, 2018 5:44 am

If you close LGA, where is all the traffic supposed to go? EWR pretty much can't be expanded and JFK doesn't have room for another few hundred departures and arrivals daily.
 
hz747300
Posts: 2373
Joined: Thu Mar 11, 2004 11:38 pm

Re: Is it time to close LGA?

Fri Aug 17, 2018 5:48 am

planecane wrote:
neomax wrote:
Yes.

The only reason people use LGA is because its closer to the city. Once they build high speed rail from Manhattan to JFK/EWR, LGA will be useless. But realistically, they should bulldoze all three airports and build one massive new airport to replace all of them.


Where would this new airport go? Eminent domain harlem and replace it with an airport?


I'd put it in Prospect Park in Brooklyn, then make LGA, and JFK parks.
Keep on truckin'...
 
User avatar
NYPECO
Posts: 557
Joined: Sun Feb 15, 2015 12:55 am

Re: Is it time to close LGA?

Fri Aug 17, 2018 6:03 am

hz747300 wrote:
planecane wrote:
neomax wrote:
Yes.

The only reason people use LGA is because its closer to the city. Once they build high speed rail from Manhattan to JFK/EWR, LGA will be useless. But realistically, they should bulldoze all three airports and build one massive new airport to replace all of them.


Where would this new airport go? Eminent domain harlem and replace it with an airport?


I'd put it in Prospect Park in Brooklyn, then make LGA, and JFK parks.


How would a mega airport replacing EWR, JFK, and LGA fit into a park that's smaller than LGA?
 
Bald1983
Posts: 622
Joined: Wed Jun 15, 2016 8:04 pm

Re: Is it time to close LGA?

Fri Aug 17, 2018 6:08 am

neomax wrote:
Yes.

The only reason people use LGA is because its closer to the city. Once they build high speed rail from Manhattan to JFK/EWR, LGA will be useless. But realistically, they should bulldoze all three airports and build one massive new airport to replace all of them.


Where?
 
EAARbrat
Posts: 29
Joined: Fri Aug 17, 2018 5:39 am

Re: Is it time to close LGA?

Fri Aug 17, 2018 6:22 am

Was born and raised in SE Nassau county and spent 44 years of my life there. Both my parts worked in the airline industry in operations and as a cabin crew member. I've flown in and out of all three hundreds of times from the early 1970's. Heck my wife still flies back to NY through LGA every month since we left 4 years ago.

Is LGA going to be closed, not after all the investment.

That being said LGA should have been closed post 9/11, no particular exact meaning behind that date other than it was a good time for major changes to have been adopted. With LGA gone JFK could have utilized both pairs for takeoffs and landing all the time except of course during strong crosswind weather situations. EWR would not have to deal with LGA outbound and inbound squeezing. My father talks about the development map for JFK when its was Idlewild and a full train system was planned early on to connect directly to NYC and the local rail systems. We are talking mid-to late 1950's re-enforcing the sickness that is the NY metro area. Anyone who thinks JFK and EWR couldn't handle the uptick is nuts especially with ISP for eastern Nassau/Suffolk and SWF for northern Westchester to just below the Albany area.

LGA has always been the problem in NYC but now that the money has been alotted all those that regular this area and the locals are doomed to enjoy the disaster this will continue to be.
 
User avatar
neomax
Posts: 945
Joined: Fri Dec 01, 2017 3:26 am

Re: Is it time to close LGA?

Fri Aug 17, 2018 6:40 am

EAARbrat wrote:
LGA has always been the problem in NYC but now that the money has been alotted all those that regular this area and the locals are doomed to enjoy the disaster this will continue to be.


This sums it up.
 
User avatar
flyingclrs727
Posts: 2431
Joined: Thu Apr 19, 2007 7:44 am

Re: Is it time to close LGA?

Fri Aug 17, 2018 7:14 am

hz747300 wrote:
planecane wrote:
neomax wrote:
Yes.

The only reason people use LGA is because its closer to the city. Once they build high speed rail from Manhattan to JFK/EWR, LGA will be useless. But realistically, they should bulldoze all three airports and build one massive new airport to replace all of them.


Where would this new airport go? Eminent domain harlem and replace it with an airport?


I'd put it in Prospect Park in Brooklyn, then make LGA, and JFK parks.


It's not big enough. You'd have to tear down a mile or more all around the park. It would be better to redevelop JFK than your proposal.
Last edited by flyingclrs727 on Fri Aug 17, 2018 7:43 am, edited 1 time in total.
 
UAL777UK
Posts: 2340
Joined: Sun Nov 20, 2005 1:16 am

Re: Is it time to close LGA?

Fri Aug 17, 2018 7:20 am

If LGA were closed, I'd just simply run the passengers through JFK & EWR (the two primary NYC airports) with ISP and HPN handling some of the load when needed (ISP & HPN would be linked to Manhattan by existing rail service).[/quote]

You think JFK and EWR could pick up that slack just like that? Lets be realistic, that scenario is just not going to happen.
 
User avatar
flyingclrs727
Posts: 2431
Joined: Thu Apr 19, 2007 7:44 am

Re: Is it time to close LGA?

Fri Aug 17, 2018 7:55 am

MavyWavyATR wrote:
If LGA were closed, I'd just simply run the passengers through JFK & EWR (the two primary NYC airports) with ISP and HPN handling some of the load when needed (ISP & HPN would be linked to Manhattan by existing rail service).


Plus all the flights going to JFK would be able to work for both O&D and international connecting traffic. The inside the LGA perimeter flights are more natural feed for JFK international flights than the outside the perimeter domestic flights that go to JFK. Instead of two regional jet flights split between two airports, there could be one consolidated flight on a 737-800 or A320.
 
User avatar
chunhimlai
Posts: 467
Joined: Wed Jun 03, 2015 11:03 am

Re: Is it time to close LGA?

Fri Aug 17, 2018 7:57 am

Some suggestion:
Close LGA and EWR
PHL and JFK limited to regional services only
Massive expanion on PCT with 200m capacity, and rename as “Albert Einstein-Donald J. Trump NewYork-Philadelphia-Newark Princeton Intercontinental Airport”
 
EAARbrat
Posts: 29
Joined: Fri Aug 17, 2018 5:39 am

Re: Is it time to close LGA?

Fri Aug 17, 2018 8:09 am

With no LGA movements JFK could run wide open in all directions, its literally got two hands behind it back because of the sharing of airspace with LGA.
 
LupineChemist
Posts: 801
Joined: Wed Oct 07, 2015 9:03 am

Re: Is it time to close LGA?

Fri Aug 17, 2018 8:10 am

Would TEB be usable as a commercial airport without LGA air traffic?

Could be a New York version of LCY. One could even imagine a scheduled LCY-TEB flight (I imagine there are quite a few of those flights now, just on private/chartered aircraft)
 
77H
Posts: 1461
Joined: Mon Sep 19, 2016 11:27 pm

Re: Is it time to close LGA?

Fri Aug 17, 2018 8:30 am

I’d argue there’s two schools of thought regarding whether or not to close LGA and it’s impact on the market. Closing the airport raises the question of whether or not the already congested EWR/JFK could pick up the slack. The other being that with LGA shuttered, you free up air space, have more funds to devote to EWR and JFK.

I’d posit that $2B could go a long way towards boring new tunnels for faster transport to EWR and JFK. From Manhattan and other points. Additionally, taking LGA traffic out of the equation opens the airspace to allow for more efficient flows into and out of EWR and JFK. The capacity LGA has now could easily be absorbed by upgauging larger markets served by all 3 markets. It is easier to upgauge larger aircraft than grow airspace while maintaining status quo. Land use restrictions around EWR and JFK all but ensure neither will ever be able to expand.

As for building a mega airport to replace all 3 airports, there is nowhere to build an airport large enough to handle the needs of a metro region of over 21M people. Looking at Google Earth, the closest undeveloped land to NYC is between Middletown, Monticello and Port Jervis. Provided it’s not protected land, PANYNJ would spend millions just earth moving to flatten the land there. Building an offshore island like HKG, KIX is a nonstarter. While the ocean floor around Long Island is shallow enough I doubt the proposal would pass environmental muster let alone it would constrict access to the second busiest port in the Western Hemisphere.

77H
 
Flighty
Posts: 9963
Joined: Thu Apr 05, 2007 3:07 am

Re: Is it time to close LGA?

Fri Aug 17, 2018 9:29 am

LGA is a heavily used airport that is getting extremely big value from its real estate. There are plenty of useless facilities in the world, but LGA is a very useful facility that helps people every day.
 
WPvsMW
Posts: 2103
Joined: Thu Mar 23, 2017 7:30 pm

Re: Is it time to close LGA?

Fri Aug 17, 2018 9:41 am

The only solution: think KIX and NGO. New island in LI Sound. Then again, think NGO, because KIX is still sinking.
 
smokeybandit
Posts: 1077
Joined: Mon Mar 17, 2014 3:24 pm

Re: Is it time to close LGA?

Fri Aug 17, 2018 10:22 am

It'll close once they build the Maglev Hyperloop
 
aviationaware
Posts: 2823
Joined: Mon May 19, 2014 12:02 pm

Re: Is it time to close LGA?

Fri Aug 17, 2018 10:26 am

We should build Bill Island beyond the Verrazano Narrows Bridge! Seeing how great Boris Island worked out, it might be a rare moment of success for De Blasio.
 
Thenoflyzone
Posts: 2846
Joined: Sun Jan 07, 2001 4:42 am

Re: Is it time to close LGA?

Fri Aug 17, 2018 10:35 am

MavyWavyATR wrote:
Do you think they should've just closed LGA instead of investing in the ongoing improvements?


Closing LGA is a bad idea. The airport handles 30 million passengers and close to 400,000 movements a year. JFK and EWR cannot absorb that in their current state.

spinkid wrote:
I think the original poster fails to realize the number of passengers who use LGA each day. JFK and EWR can't pick up all that extra traffic.


:checkmark:
us Air Traffic Controllers have a good record, we haven't left one up there yet !!
 
User avatar
ro1960
Posts: 1161
Joined: Wed Jan 04, 2006 8:19 am

Re: Is it time to close LGA?

Fri Aug 17, 2018 10:54 am

Just to simply answer the OP's question : no.

Major upgrade work is underway, so now is definitely not the time to close LGA. As many have stated in their post, it plays a major role in the NYC area and its traffic could not simply be transferred to EWR and JFK or maybe with a shoehorn.

A global look at public transportation in the area would certainly improve accessing the 3 airports when capacity grows. Rethink NYC has some interesting ideas like relocating Rikers Island Prison and having a direct link to an expanded LGA. Not sure it solves the ATC problem, though. A recommended read: http://www.rethinknyc.org/

Image
You may like my airport photos:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/aeroports
 
Cointrin330
Posts: 1253
Joined: Sat Jul 16, 2016 12:23 pm

Re: Is it time to close LGA?

Fri Aug 17, 2018 11:00 am

You can't close LGA without a suitable alternative ready to open tomorrow and that does not exist. LGA is undergoing not $2BN but $8BN to $10BN in renovations (when all is said and done). That will not resolve the short runway issue or the capacity constraints but the airport is favored because of its proximity to Manhattan. If this country would spend the billions it does invading other countries, throwing military parades, propping up failed governments around the world for decades, and looking to space as the next frontier and would re-allocate or have spent that money on infrastructure, our bridges would not be crumbling, our airports would not suck, and our train system would look more like Europe's. But back to the question of LGA, neither JFK nor EWR can absorb the flow that goes through LGA. What has helped LGA somewhat is the reduction in turboprops flying to places people aren't going to because the airlines were squatting on slots. LGA is for better or worse, here to stay.
 
User avatar
cougar15
Posts: 1416
Joined: Thu Sep 05, 2013 6:10 pm

Re: Is it time to close LGA?

Fri Aug 17, 2018 11:01 am

ro1960 wrote:
Just to simply answer the OP's question : no.

Major upgrade work is underway, so now is definitely not the time to close LGA. As many have stated in their post, it plays a major role in the NYC area and its traffic could not simply be transferred to EWR and JFK or maybe with a shoehorn.

A global look at public transportation in the area would certainly improve accessing the 3 airports when capacity grows. Rethink NYC has some interesting ideas like relocating Rikers Island Prison and having a direct link to an expanded LGA. Not sure it solves the ATC problem, though. A recommended read: http://www.rethinknyc.org/

Image


Interesting read, thanks for sharing!
some you lose, others you can´t win!
 
User avatar
Midwestindy
Posts: 4158
Joined: Sun Mar 12, 2017 3:56 am

Re: Is it time to close LGA?

Fri Aug 17, 2018 11:08 am

Imagine if I said lets close down DCA and BWI and consolidate the DMV into IAD, that's essentially what you are saying but much worse.

MavyWavyATR wrote:
LAXLHR wrote:
Is it time to close LGA - SMH, and put those passengers where exactly? Stewart? Just wow.


If LGA were closed, I'd just simply run the passengers through JFK & EWR (the two primary NYC airports) with ISP and HPN handling some of the load when needed (ISP & HPN would be linked to Manhattan by existing rail service).


1. You can't just "run passengers through JFK & EWR," those airports are congested as is you can't just throw on 30 million more passengers like it is nothing.
2. LGA is a very convenient airport if you are going to Manhattan, no one wants to give that up
3. Closing LGA would be terrible in the air service world, certain routes could lose 1/2 their capacity to NYC
4. Sorry, I refuse to fly into ISP and HPN to get to NYC, I already had to do that once this year and I promised myself never again
5. Delta would throw a fit if they were forced to give up LGA
6. The Manhattan business community would throw a fit
7. Rail service is not an automatic fix to flying people into ISP and HPN
Status for 2019/2020: AAdvantage Platinum, Delta Gold, Southwest A-List
 
tphuang
Posts: 3246
Joined: Tue Mar 14, 2017 2:04 pm

Re: Is it time to close LGA?

Fri Aug 17, 2018 1:16 pm

ro1960 wrote:
Just to simply answer the OP's question : no.

Major upgrade work is underway, so now is definitely not the time to close LGA. As many have stated in their post, it plays a major role in the NYC area and its traffic could not simply be transferred to EWR and JFK or maybe with a shoehorn.

A global look at public transportation in the area would certainly improve accessing the 3 airports when capacity grows. Rethink NYC has some interesting ideas like relocating Rikers Island Prison and having a direct link to an expanded LGA. Not sure it solves the ATC problem, though. A recommended read: http://www.rethinknyc.org/

Image


whoever came up with that needs to get a reality check. Do these people have any concept of how much it cost to build stuff in New York? For the cost of that, they should first bother to finish the second avenue subway line. If we can't even afford to build out the 2nd avenue subway line, how are we getting money for this kind of project. Complete lunacy.
 
User avatar
william
Posts: 3156
Joined: Thu Jun 10, 1999 1:31 pm

Re: Is it time to close LGA?

Fri Aug 17, 2018 1:39 pm

Midwestindy wrote:
Imagine if I said lets close down DCA and BWI and consolidate the DMV into IAD, that's essentially what you are saying but much worse.

MavyWavyATR wrote:
LAXLHR wrote:
Is it time to close LGA - SMH, and put those passengers where exactly? Stewart? Just wow.


If LGA were closed, I'd just simply run the passengers through JFK & EWR (the two primary NYC airports) with ISP and HPN handling some of the load when needed (ISP & HPN would be linked to Manhattan by existing rail service).


1. You can't just "run passengers through JFK & EWR," those airports are congested as is you can't just throw on 30 million more passengers like it is nothing.
2. LGA is a very convenient airport if you are going to Manhattan, no one wants to give that up
3. Closing LGA would be terrible in the air service world, certain routes could lose 1/2 their capacity to NYC
4. Sorry, I refuse to fly into ISP and HPN to get to NYC, I already had to do that once this year and I promised myself never again
5. Delta would throw a fit if they were forced to give up LGA
6. The Manhattan business community would throw a fit
7. Rail service is not an automatic fix to flying people into ISP and HPN


You mention nothing about the crowded inefficienct airspace on VOR days and a cluster......on IFR days due to LGA where it is.

Popular Searches On Airliners.net

Top Photos of Last:   24 Hours  •  48 Hours  •  7 Days  •  30 Days  •  180 Days  •  365 Days  •  All Time

Military Aircraft Every type from fighters to helicopters from air forces around the globe

Classic Airliners Props and jets from the good old days

Flight Decks Views from inside the cockpit

Aircraft Cabins Passenger cabin shots showing seat arrangements as well as cargo aircraft interior

Cargo Aircraft Pictures of great freighter aircraft

Government Aircraft Aircraft flying government officials

Helicopters Our large helicopter section. Both military and civil versions

Blimps / Airships Everything from the Goodyear blimp to the Zeppelin

Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos