Prost
Posts: 2491
Joined: Wed Oct 03, 2012 6:23 pm

Re: Management shake up at Alaska Air Group

Sat Oct 13, 2018 8:19 pm

jumbojet wrote:
Prost wrote:
We need to remember that AS has had a higher profit margin than DL has during these intervening years. I would hardly characterize AS as floundering.


different environment today than 10 years ago and two totally different mergers with 4 totally different airlines. Totally different landscape. Plus, we also need to take a look back to the OP, I dont think anyone suggested that AS is floundering. Maybe they will be if they don't make these cuts,

Now, if B6 and AS were to merge, which is not out of the realm of possibility, what would the new airline be called?


Response 42 used the word floundering. I just don’t see it.
 
HPRamper
Posts: 4965
Joined: Sat May 14, 2005 4:22 am

Re: Management shake up at Alaska Air Group

Sat Oct 13, 2018 8:21 pm

jumbojet wrote:
Now, if B6 and AS were to merge, which is not out of the realm of possibility, what would the new airline be called?

Although popular and cute to speculate on, it wouldn't be some kind of mishmash of the two names. It would be one or the other, and historically it's simply been the larger carrier that retains the name, regardless of who bought who. In this case, the two are just too close to call. They can both claim advantage in various metrics.
 
hiflyeras
Posts: 2061
Joined: Thu Jul 14, 2011 6:48 pm

Re: Management shake up at Alaska Air Group

Sat Oct 13, 2018 8:59 pm

global1 wrote:
I'm not saying AS is floundering as an enterprise. I'm saying that they're floundering to find a long term strategy if they aspire to be a national player.


They're not aspiring to be a national player...they're aspiring to be an airline customers primarily on the west coast consider when they are traveling domestically (including Hawaii, Mexico and likely more Central America destinations are coming. They have no illusions of becoming a 'national' airline and I don't think they even have the desire. They don't want to merge with B6 unless absolutely necessary and are happy being a 'niche' major. They're a thorn in the side of DL, UA and WN...that's the biggest danger to their success to have so many enemies. Their immediate challenge today (besides the long-awaited entry by WN to Hawaii) is buy-in by the ex-VX employees and getting them to stop trashing their new employer where customers are within earshot. That's been a challenge for every airline merger and it'll settle down...but ex-VX need to move on.

EA CO AS was right...taking into account not filling open positions it's supposedly about 50 people out of thousands of employees. Nothing much to see here and I wouldn't read much into it. Just trimming a bit of fat off what's historically been a nice cut of Filet Mignon.
 
Flaps
Posts: 1582
Joined: Sat Feb 05, 2000 1:11 pm

Re: Management shake up at Alaska Air Group

Sat Oct 13, 2018 10:07 pm

Super80Fan wrote:
Getting ready for a nice B6 takeover.

That's funny. B6 cant even get their own house in order let alone handle the acquisition and integration of a larger carrier.

:lol:
 
User avatar
Super80Fan
Posts: 1622
Joined: Thu Jul 06, 2017 4:14 am

Re: Management shake up at Alaska Air Group

Sat Oct 13, 2018 11:35 pm

Flaps wrote:
Super80Fan wrote:
Getting ready for a nice B6 takeover.

That's funny. B6 cant even get their own house in order let alone handle the acquisition and integration of a larger carrier.

:lol:


I meant AS takes over B6. You are correct, B6 can't even takeover SY at this point.
RIP McDonnell Douglas
RIP US Airways
 
flyby519
Posts: 1463
Joined: Tue Jul 24, 2007 3:31 am

Re: Management shake up at Alaska Air Group

Sun Oct 14, 2018 1:58 am

MIflyer12 wrote:
In RPMs, still less than half the size of AA, DL or UA. (See the 2017 Annual Reports.) Still no meaningful South American network, and nothing TATL nor TPAC. No Mid-Con hub. Ask US Air how well the 'barbell' network worked after it bought PSA.


Just to play Devil's Advocate, is a mid-con hub really necessary now with planes like the A220? Yes, you wont be able to effectively serve those tertiary airports that only see small RJs now, but the main midwest cities would be doable (MCI/OMA/STL/etc)?
 
n7371f
Posts: 1605
Joined: Fri Jul 04, 2008 3:54 pm

Re: Management shake up at Alaska Air Group

Sun Oct 14, 2018 2:12 am

Helps set the narrative for upcoming quarterly earnings with investors. AA is rumored to be readying cost cutting measures to prop up its similar under performance for quarterly conference call.
 
PlanesNTrains
Posts: 9526
Joined: Tue Feb 01, 2005 4:19 pm

Re: Management shake up at Alaska Air Group

Sun Oct 14, 2018 2:15 am

n7371f wrote:
Helps set the narrative for upcoming quarterly earnings with investors. AA is rumored to be readying cost cutting measures to prop up its similar under performance for quarterly conference call.


Absolutely.
-Dave


MAX’d out on MAX threads. If you are starting a thread, and it’s about the MAX - stop. There’s already a thread that covers it.
 
CobaltScar
Posts: 506
Joined: Thu Mar 23, 2017 2:30 pm

Re: Management shake up at Alaska Air Group

Sun Oct 14, 2018 2:31 am

hiflyeras wrote:
Their immediate challenge today (besides the long-awaited entry by WN to Hawaii) is buy-in by the ex-VX employees and getting them to stop trashing their new employer where customers are within earshot. That's been a challenge for every airline merger and it'll settle down...but ex-VX need to move on.


Oh this is kind of juicy. The rose colored glasses must be VERY strong if the ex-VX want to be back at the airline that paid them so little to do so much.

And the world won't let AS remain a little west coast regional airline happy to go about its business. Sooner or latter a bigger fish will want the territory or will want better yields on their routes that AS is depressing, and then that is the end of the small fish who is afraid to jump into a bigger pond and grow.

The AS/B6 merge name will be "Blue Horizon Airways".
 
catiii
Posts: 3201
Joined: Mon Mar 31, 2008 1:18 am

Re: Management shake up at Alaska Air Group

Sun Oct 14, 2018 3:00 am

jumbojet wrote:
if AS and B6 merged, where would that place them amongst DL, UA, AA and SW? If they did merge, I would hope they would stick with Alaska Airlines as the new name of the combined carriers.


Im surprised it took you this long to jump in with an anti JetBlue comment. You're getting soft.
 
c933103
Posts: 3896
Joined: Wed May 18, 2016 7:23 pm

Re: Management shake up at Alaska Air Group

Sun Oct 14, 2018 7:03 am

MIflyer12 wrote:
In RPMs, still less than half the size of AA, DL or UA. (See the 2017 Annual Reports.) Still no meaningful South American network, and nothing TATL nor TPAC. No Mid-Con hub. Ask US Air how well the 'barbell' network worked after it bought PSA.

Except AS have much better name and operation than US?
Peace cannot counter violence when violence are being used by the powerful without mercy. #HongKong
But there is one possible exception. That is if the world could come together and make those who use violence lose their power. #China
 
jumbojet
Posts: 2956
Joined: Mon Dec 29, 2003 3:01 am

Re: Management shake up at Alaska Air Group

Sun Oct 14, 2018 12:51 pm

JayWings wrote:
As much as it pains me to say this, these cuts are a by-product of an acquisition. However, I am upset that the chosen employees were not already quietly notified and offered a severance package or optional retirement. Leaving the knife hovering above an entire work group for 3 weeks with nobody knowing who it’s coming for isn’t good for anyone. It feels unnecessary. My thoughts and best wishes to everyone in AS management who are going through this right now.


Alaska Air is a phenomenal airline and it sucks that they have to let go of some of its managers who I am sure do a fantastic job. Makes you wonder if Delta would be interested in picking up some ex-AS management to assist and help in their quest to bolster and solidify its SEA operations. :wink2:
 
sxf24
Posts: 882
Joined: Wed Aug 15, 2007 12:22 pm

Re: Management shake up at Alaska Air Group

Sun Oct 14, 2018 1:01 pm

jumbojet wrote:
JayWings wrote:
As much as it pains me to say this, these cuts are a by-product of an acquisition. However, I am upset that the chosen employees were not already quietly notified and offered a severance package or optional retirement. Leaving the knife hovering above an entire work group for 3 weeks with nobody knowing who it’s coming for isn’t good for anyone. It feels unnecessary. My thoughts and best wishes to everyone in AS management who are going through this right now.


Alaska Air is a phenomenal airline and it sucks that they have to let go of some of its managers who I am sure do a fantastic job. Makes you wonder if Delta would be interested in picking up some ex-AS management to assist and help in their quest to bolster and solidify its SEA operations. :wink2:


Outside of supervisors, Delta has very little management in Seattle.
 
winginit
Posts: 2614
Joined: Sat Feb 23, 2013 9:23 pm

Re: Management shake up at Alaska Air Group

Sun Oct 14, 2018 5:34 pm

jumbojet wrote:
if AS and B6 merged, where would that place them amongst DL, UA, AA and SW? If they did merge, I would hope they would stick with Alaska Airlines as the new name of the combined carriers.


jumbojet wrote:
Now, if B6 and AS were to merge, which is not out of the realm of possibility, what would the new airline be called?


Stop. This is a thread about the management shake up at Alaska, not a discussion of the very hypothetical outcome of a B6/AS merger. If you want to speculate around that merger make a dedicated thread for it. You'll find there are many already.
 
durangomac
Posts: 414
Joined: Fri Dec 08, 2006 5:18 am

Re: Management shake up at Alaska Air Group

Sun Oct 14, 2018 7:50 pm

jumbojet wrote:
JayWings wrote:
As much as it pains me to say this, these cuts are a by-product of an acquisition. However, I am upset that the chosen employees were not already quietly notified and offered a severance package or optional retirement. Leaving the knife hovering above an entire work group for 3 weeks with nobody knowing who it’s coming for isn’t good for anyone. It feels unnecessary. My thoughts and best wishes to everyone in AS management who are going through this right now.


Alaska Air is a phenomenal airline and it sucks that they have to let go of some of its managers who I am sure do a fantastic job. Makes you wonder if Delta would be interested in picking up some ex-AS management to assist and help in their quest to bolster and solidify its SEA operations. :wink2:


Management staff for AS is anyone that isn't covered by a union, so that is really anyone not front line, there is a group in accounting that are union.

I'm going to throw this out there to, remember AS is now on the downhill side of integration, they staffed up a lot to get departments and applications like PSS integrated, now that large number of those projects are finished those people are no longer needed. AS needs to thin the back office staff, some groups are way larger than they were before the merger.
 
9252fly
Posts: 956
Joined: Thu Sep 22, 2005 7:19 am

Re: Management shake up at Alaska Air Group

Sun Oct 14, 2018 10:44 pm

Why when B6 and AS are in the same thread it always has to be speculated that they could,should merge. My opinion is that they are well suited to cooperating together in some kind of codeshare agreement with a reciprocal frequent flyer program. They could remain independent working together with each being strong on either the east or west coast.
 
jetblueguy22
Posts: 3285
Joined: Thu Nov 29, 2007 12:26 am

Re: Management shake up at Alaska Air Group

Mon Oct 15, 2018 3:51 am

flyby519 wrote:
MIflyer12 wrote:
In RPMs, still less than half the size of AA, DL or UA. (See the 2017 Annual Reports.) Still no meaningful South American network, and nothing TATL nor TPAC. No Mid-Con hub. Ask US Air how well the 'barbell' network worked after it bought PSA.


Just to play Devil's Advocate, is a mid-con hub really necessary now with planes like the A220? Yes, you wont be able to effectively serve those tertiary airports that only see small RJs now, but the main midwest cities would be doable (MCI/OMA/STL/etc)?

Your feed is going to be out of whack. With a hub in say MSP you can extend to most of the Midwest with RJs, fed by flights from multiple points on the coast. But if you limit yourself to JFK and SAN, you’re depending on basic those two points. Unlikely someone will fly say MIA-JFK-FAR. When they can do MIA-MSP-FAR.

That’s an extreme example, but it makes it harder to top off off those flights without a mid-con hub, you’re purely depending on O&D. Not bad for yields, but not great if you’re looking for corporate contracts.
Look at sweatpants guy. This is a 90 million dollar aircraft, not a Tallahassee strip club
 
slcdeltarumd11
Posts: 4404
Joined: Fri Jan 09, 2004 7:30 am

Re: Management shake up at Alaska Air Group

Mon Oct 15, 2018 4:10 am

I rarely think layoffs are a good thing, but some changes at Alaska are necessary. They just seem lost right now.

They need new management with an actual plan for the future.
 
PlanesNTrains
Posts: 9526
Joined: Tue Feb 01, 2005 4:19 pm

Re: Management shake up at Alaska Air Group

Mon Oct 15, 2018 4:14 am

slcdeltarumd11 wrote:
I rarely think layoffs are a good thing, but some changes at Alaska are necessary. They just seem lost right now.

They need new management with an actual plan for the future.


So because you don’t know their plan right now, they need new mgmt?
-Dave


MAX’d out on MAX threads. If you are starting a thread, and it’s about the MAX - stop. There’s already a thread that covers it.
 
MIflyer12
Posts: 6199
Joined: Mon Feb 18, 2013 11:58 pm

Re: Management shake up at Alaska Air Group

Mon Oct 15, 2018 4:40 am

flyby519 wrote:
MIflyer12 wrote:
In RPMs, still less than half the size of AA, DL or UA. (See the 2017 Annual Reports.) Still no meaningful South American network, and nothing TATL nor TPAC. No Mid-Con hub. Ask US Air how well the 'barbell' network worked after it bought PSA.


Just to play Devil's Advocate, is a mid-con hub really necessary now with planes like the A220? Yes, you wont be able to effectively serve those tertiary airports that only see small RJs now, but the main midwest cities would be doable (MCI/OMA/STL/etc)?


There's a lot of people (and businesses) west of PIT/ATL yet east of PHX/SLC. A couple 737s (or E75s) a day to an East Coast hub and a West Coast hub isn't going to cut it for DTW/CMH/MSY/AUS/STL/MCI, etc.

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