Jshank83
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WOW adds Vancouver

Mon Oct 22, 2018 1:32 pm

WOW adding Vancouver. Starts June 6th. 6x a week.

It wasn't the "Major" city I was thinking of but I could see it making sense. 6x a week might be a lot out of the gate but they also said they were wanting more frequency to cities.

https://icelandmag.is/article/wow-air-w ... ummer-2019
 
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holcakker
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Re: WOW adds Vancouver

Mon Oct 22, 2018 1:40 pm

They won't be around by that time.
 
SpaceshipDC10
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Re: WOW adds Vancouver

Mon Oct 22, 2018 1:42 pm

Interesting to see YVR get some (more) LCC to Europe. So along FI, there will be 12 weekly flights to KEF. Do AC has any plans to launch it's own service, be it with Rouge? I guess WOW will send its A321neo.
 
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hvusslax
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Re: WOW adds Vancouver

Mon Oct 22, 2018 1:50 pm

Are there a lot of Indians around Vancouver? They wanted a destination that could drive connections to Dehli.
 
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ACCS300
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Re: WOW adds Vancouver

Mon Oct 22, 2018 1:53 pm

Great news for my hometown airport!

I wonder how KEF is handling all this added traffic, was there ( KEF ) two weeks ago and the airport in nearing complete chaos, never have I experienced such an overcrowded terminal.
 
Jshank83
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Re: WOW adds Vancouver

Mon Oct 22, 2018 2:00 pm

hvusslax wrote:
Are there a lot of Indians around Vancouver? They wanted a destination that could drive connections to Dehli.


I was curious about this also. I also thought KEF would be way out of the way but it isn't really any worse than any other connection spot.
 
SpaceshipDC10
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Re: WOW adds Vancouver

Mon Oct 22, 2018 2:11 pm

ACCS300 wrote:
Great news for my hometown airport!

I wonder how KEF is handling all this added traffic, was there ( KEF ) two weeks ago and the airport in nearing complete chaos, never have I experienced such an overcrowded terminal.


September stats aren't available yet, but here are the first 8 months:

2018 7,273,316 +11,7% +763,832

2017 6,509,484 +29,2% +1,470,037

2016 5,039,447

More details are available here: https://www.isavia.is/en/corporate/abou ... statistics
 
MartijnNL
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Re: WOW adds Vancouver

Mon Oct 22, 2018 2:24 pm

ACCS300 wrote:
(...) I wonder how KEF is handling all this added traffic, was there (KEF ) two weeks ago and the airport in nearing complete chaos, never have I experienced such an overcrowded terminal.

Was there at least some construction going on? Are there any plans at all to expand the terminal? Why is it taking the authorities so long?
 
steveinbc
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Re: WOW adds Vancouver

Mon Oct 22, 2018 2:31 pm

hvusslax wrote:
Are there a lot of Indians around Vancouver? They wanted a destination that could drive connections to Dehli.


Yes. Surrey to he southeast of Vancouver has a huge Indian population. Supports a daily Delhi from Vancouver.
A319 320 321 330 340 380 B707 727 737 747 757 767 777 787 BAe1-11 Trident 1, 2, 3B Viscount Lancaster VC10 HS748, ATP DHC-1, 3 Dash-8 Dash-400 Shorts 330 360 Embraer Banderiante Brasileria 175 190 BAe146 Saab 200 DC-3 -8 -9 -10 MD-11 ATR42-72
 
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SRQKEF
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Re: WOW adds Vancouver

Mon Oct 22, 2018 2:39 pm

That's a long flight for an A321, even if it's a neo...hopefully they won't have to make too many fuel stops. Anyway, always nice to see new dots added from KEF, even though FI already serves YVR. I hope they can co-exist on this route like the other Canadian routes they both thrive on! (YYZ & YUL)
Nothing compares to taking off in an empty 757 with full thrust!
 
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hvusslax
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Re: WOW adds Vancouver

Mon Oct 22, 2018 2:40 pm

MartijnNL wrote:
ACCS300 wrote:
(...) I wonder how KEF is handling all this added traffic, was there (KEF ) two weeks ago and the airport in nearing complete chaos, never have I experienced such an overcrowded terminal.

Was there at least some construction going on? Are there any plans at all to expand the terminal? Why is it taking the authorities so long?


It's rather hard for a government owned airport operator to properly plan for passenger numbers to triple in a span of a few years. There is a massive expansion in the works but it is going to take some years until we see serious relief from that.
 
MartijnNL
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Re: WOW adds Vancouver

Mon Oct 22, 2018 2:40 pm

Wikepedia reports the following full year passenger numbers for Keflavik Airport:

2004 1,883,725
2005 2,101,679 +11.6%
2006 2,272,917 +8.1%
2007 2,429,144 +6.9%
2008 2,193,434 -9.7%
2009 1,832,944 -16.4%
2010 2,065,188 +12.7%
2011 2,474,806 +19.8%
2012 2,764,026 +11.7%
2013 3,209,848 +16.1%
2014 3,867,425 +20.5%
2015 4,855,505 +25.5%
2016 6,821,358 +40.4%
2017 8,755,352 +28.3%

Though many European airports are (much) busier than Keflavik, the growth rate of the latter is hard to believe.
 
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ACCS300
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Re: WOW adds Vancouver

Mon Oct 22, 2018 2:51 pm

Wow, almost doubled in 3 years! When I departed KEF two weeks ago there wasn't a single seat available in the terminal, people were sitting on the floor, queues extended through the entire length of the A gate section, the D gate area was one massive crowd, it was a challenge to figure out which queue went to which flight, many travellers were totally confused.
 
klm617
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Re: WOW adds Vancouver

Mon Oct 22, 2018 3:41 pm

hvusslax wrote:
Are there a lot of Indians around Vancouver? They wanted a destination that could drive connections to Dehli.


That's exactly it they want the traffic to feed the India connections. Good choice on WOW's part YVR has a huge Indian community.
the truth does matter, guys. too bad it's often quite subjective. the truth is beyond the mere facts and figures. it's beyond good and bad, right and wrong...
 
marktci
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Re: WOW adds Vancouver

Mon Oct 22, 2018 3:49 pm

Metro Vancouver has a South Asian population of about 300K.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metro_Van ... l_District
 
slcdeltarumd11
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Re: WOW adds Vancouver

Mon Oct 22, 2018 3:58 pm

holcakker wrote:
They won't be around by that time.


Can't wait till you are wrong :white: The Norweigan haters said that for YEARS on here the same thing. They have since all given up and most have moved onto saying WOW will die now. Get some new material people. Any airline can go under, its a tough industry.
 
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Ytraveller
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Re: WOW adds Vancouver

Mon Oct 22, 2018 4:25 pm

hvusslax wrote:
Are there a lot of Indians around Vancouver? They wanted a destination that could drive connections to Dehli.

Bear in mind though that AC has been operating YVR-DEL for a while now (on the 789) and will convert the flight into a daily, year-round service.

https://www.routesonline.com/news/38/ai ... d-in-2019/
 
MartijnNL
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Re: WOW adds Vancouver

Mon Oct 22, 2018 5:20 pm

According to Great Circle Mapper YVR - DEL is 6,934 mi (11,159 km) and YVR - KEF - DEL 8,293 mi (13,347 km).

Travelling via Iceland adds 19.6% to the total distance and probably three hours extra travel time, not including the time needed to change planes at Keflavik.
 
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aemoreira1981
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Re: WOW adds Vancouver

Mon Oct 22, 2018 5:26 pm

hvusslax wrote:
Are there a lot of Indians around Vancouver? They wanted a destination that could drive connections to Dehli.


But for Vancouver, going via the Orient would be way shorter.
 
SpaceshipDC10
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Re: WOW adds Vancouver

Mon Oct 22, 2018 5:26 pm

MartijnNL wrote:
According to Great Circle Mapper YVR - DEL is 6,934 mi (11,159 km) and YVR - KEF - DEL 8,293 mi (13,347 km).

Travelling via Iceland adds 19.6% to the total distance and probably three hours extra travel time, not including the time needed to change planes at Keflavik.


Yes, but if for that you get a lower fare... multiplied by several persons, means some good savings.
 
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longhauler
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Re: WOW adds Vancouver

Mon Oct 22, 2018 5:32 pm

aemoreira1981 wrote:
But for Vancouver, going via the Orient would be way shorter.


Actually, routing through NRT or HKG (for example) is longer than through KEF.


MartijnNL wrote:
According to Great Circle Mapper YVR - DEL is 6,934 mi (11,159 km) and YVR - KEF - DEL 8,293 mi (13,347 km).

Travelling via Iceland adds 19.6% to the total distance and probably three hours extra travel time, not including the time needed to change planes at Keflavik.


I have to wonder what sort of price edge WOW could give, seeing that they have to fly the passenger 20% longer with double the ground handling costs.
Just because I stopped arguing, doesn't mean I think you are right. It just means I gave up!
 
master14225
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Re: WOW adds Vancouver

Mon Oct 22, 2018 5:53 pm

This could bring load from SEA and PDX
 
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spinkid
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Re: WOW adds Vancouver

Mon Oct 22, 2018 6:05 pm

MartijnNL wrote:
ACCS300 wrote:
(...) I wonder how KEF is handling all this added traffic, was there (KEF ) two weeks ago and the airport in nearing complete chaos, never have I experienced such an overcrowded terminal.

Was there at least some construction going on? Are there any plans at all to expand the terminal? Why is it taking the authorities so long?


I was there 2 summers ago and there was so much chaos I thought for sure there must have been some sort of irrops going on, but nope, its just a normal day at KEF.

I should say normal time of day. Someone more familiar could probably explain what banks and times are the busiest.

My FI flight to JFK seemed to depart later than most so by the time I boarded, it had cleared out quite a bit and it looked like the remnants of a rock concert after the show. piles of trash everywhere. I walked through to see if I could find anything valuable. lol

I actually do that a lot, after a flight departs, I walk around the gate area to see what's left. I used to do it to find a newspaper, but I've found a couple books, bookmarks, pens, pack of cigarrettes, Never anything truly valuable.
 
klm617
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Re: WOW adds Vancouver

Mon Oct 22, 2018 6:14 pm

slcdeltarumd11 wrote:
holcakker wrote:
They won't be around by that time.


Can't wait till you are wrong :white: The Norweigan haters said that for YEARS on here the same thing. They have since all given up and most have moved onto saying WOW will die now. Get some new material people. Any airline can go under, its a tough industry.


Exactly great move by WOW here to feed their new India flights.
the truth does matter, guys. too bad it's often quite subjective. the truth is beyond the mere facts and figures. it's beyond good and bad, right and wrong...
 
winginit
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Re: WOW adds Vancouver

Mon Oct 22, 2018 6:26 pm

slcdeltarumd11 wrote:
holcakker wrote:
They won't be around by that time.


Can't wait till you are wrong :white: The Norweigan haters said that for YEARS on here the same thing. They have since all given up and most have moved onto saying WOW will die now. Get some new material people. Any airline can go under, its a tough industry.


For the record, it's not just armchair CEO nay-sayers who are raising red flags about WOW's viability...

There's a difference between yelling about the potential downfall of an airline because they pose some sort of threat and pointing out very legitimate financial concerns. WOW very much falls into the latter category.

Forbes
 
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LAX772LR
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Re: WOW adds Vancouver

Tue Oct 23, 2018 3:44 am

ACCS300 wrote:
I wonder how KEF is handling all this added traffic, was there ( KEF ) two weeks ago and the airport in nearing complete chaos, never have I experienced such an overcrowded terminal.

Indeed, a lot of people don't seem to realize that this is the scope of KEF airport.

Image

It's not a large gateway by ANY stretch of the imagination, especially for the amount of traffic that it already handles.

Even its in-construction expansion doesn't really change that:

Image
I myself, suspect a more prosaic motive... ~Thranduil
 
EvanWSFO
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Re: WOW adds Vancouver

Tue Oct 23, 2018 3:48 am

hvusslax wrote:
Are there a lot of Indians around Vancouver? They wanted a destination that could drive connections to Dehli.


Air Canada already flies YVR-DEL nonstop. Why would anyone with a brain fly a POS airline that makes Norwegian look like SQ? Regardless of price, WW is a disaster. One RT was 1 RT too many for me. I like to try new airlines. I've yet to find a ULCC worth wasting my money on. WW is a bottom feeder.
I have been on this site 15 years. A unrecoverable email account led me to starting over. Those of you who call me a rookie, you may stop ok?
 
EvanWSFO
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Re: WOW adds Vancouver

Tue Oct 23, 2018 3:51 am

LAX772LR wrote:
ACCS300 wrote:
I wonder how KEF is handling all this added traffic, was there ( KEF ) two weeks ago and the airport in nearing complete chaos, never have I experienced such an overcrowded terminal.

Indeed, a lot of people don't seem to realize that this is the scope of KEF airport.

Image

It's not a large gateway by ANY stretch of the imagination, especially for the amount of traffic that it already handles.

Even its in-construction expansion doesn't really change that:

Image


Those WW gates are going to be empty. They are not in the same universe as FI. Bottom feeder airline. It's not going to last. FI will take those extra gates and provide real airline service.
I have been on this site 15 years. A unrecoverable email account led me to starting over. Those of you who call me a rookie, you may stop ok?
 
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LAX772LR
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Re: WOW adds Vancouver

Tue Oct 23, 2018 4:24 am

EvanWSFO wrote:
Those WW gates are going to be empty. They are not in the same universe as FI. Bottom feeder airline. It's not going to last. FI will take those extra gates and provide real airline service.

...can I borrow your crystal ball for the weekend?
I myself, suspect a more prosaic motive... ~Thranduil
 
EvanWSFO
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Re: WOW adds Vancouver

Tue Oct 23, 2018 4:26 am

LAX772LR wrote:
EvanWSFO wrote:
Those WW gates are going to be empty. They are not in the same universe as FI. Bottom feeder airline. It's not going to last. FI will take those extra gates and provide real airline service.

...can I borrow your crystal ball for the weekend?


Sorry, I'm all booked up. I don't do business with elves anyway.
I have been on this site 15 years. A unrecoverable email account led me to starting over. Those of you who call me a rookie, you may stop ok?
 
hz747300
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Re: WOW adds Vancouver

Tue Oct 23, 2018 5:55 am

I think every airline that folded recently announced new route adds shortly before closing. Being the PR person must be similar to being Baghdad Bob.
Keep on truckin'...
 
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hvusslax
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Re: WOW adds Vancouver

Tue Oct 23, 2018 7:00 am

LAX772LR wrote:
ACCS300 wrote:
I wonder how KEF is handling all this added traffic, was there ( KEF ) two weeks ago and the airport in nearing complete chaos, never have I experienced such an overcrowded terminal.

Indeed, a lot of people don't seem to realize that this is the scope of KEF airport.

Image

It's not a large gateway by ANY stretch of the imagination, especially for the amount of traffic that it already handles.

Even its in-construction expansion doesn't really change that:

Image


The expansion plans have changed somewhat from that latter picture. Here is a video showing every phase of expansion from 1987 to 2017 and then what the next steps are going to be.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_cont ... E-9jOm4eZQ
 
a350lover
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Re: WOW adds Vancouver

Tue Oct 23, 2018 7:26 am

MartijnNL wrote:
According to Great Circle Mapper YVR - DEL is 6,934 mi (11,159 km) and YVR - KEF - DEL 8,293 mi (13,347 km).

Travelling via Iceland adds 19.6% to the total distance and probably three hours extra travel time, not including the time needed to change planes at Keflavik.


DEL - YVR traveling time is going to be 20h45min, with a layover time in KEF of 4h 20min. Leaves Delhi at 7am and arrives Vancouver at 6.15pm. Eastwards, travel time increases despite a tighter layover in KEF of just 2h25min.

Air Canada non-stop service YVR-DEL is just 14 hours 10 min, 13h 50min on the way back.
 
Airlinepilot129
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Re: WOW adds Vancouver

Tue Oct 23, 2018 8:03 am

I’m optimistic about this and the viability of the entire operation after they cut 5 US markets in a week that were supposedly doing “very well.”
Still Working Hard, Still Flying Right.

Houston, TX
Ruston, LA
 
slcdeltarumd11
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Re: WOW adds Vancouver

Tue Oct 23, 2018 8:28 am

NA -India is extremely price driven. Many families etc a 4 hour layover will not be a huge problem if the fares are lowest. Almost guaranteed connection. Grab dinner and relax between flights, walk! The wow crowd would be crammed in economy it's not like a ultra long flight in business.

Alot of Indians go on less frequent but long trips 2 weeks or a month + is very normal. A connection is not a problem. They should be able to pull off India their problem so far has been ticket sales were too close in from launch. Alot of their prime audience plans very far ahead if you know when your semi annual month long trip is home you already have tickets at this point. Their close in will suffer since their prime audience is ticketed. Long term I hope it works and they build the route and don't knee jerk panic.
 
MartijnNL
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Re: WOW adds Vancouver

Tue Oct 23, 2018 8:38 am

EvanWSFO wrote:
Air Canada already flies YVR-DEL nonstop. Why would anyone with a brain fly a POS airline that makes Norwegian look like SQ? Regardless of price, WW is a disaster. One RT was 1 RT too many for me. I like to try new airlines. I've yet to find a ULCC worth wasting my money on. WW is a bottom feeder.

Maybe to save money? Btw, what does POS mean? And why is WW a disaster? I'm just curious.

Personally I haven't flown them (yet), but their hard product doesn't look that bad.
 
SpaceshipDC10
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Re: WOW adds Vancouver

Tue Oct 23, 2018 8:44 am

Here are the flights schedules:

WW245 KEF1720 – 1815YVR 321 x6 / WW246 YVR1930 – 1005+1KEF 321 x6

https://www.routesonline.com/news/38/ai ... june-2019/

Basically, they are matching those FI will have next year.

FI697 KEF1715 – 1800YVR 75W x6 / FI698 YVR1900 – 0905+1KEF 75W x6

https://www.routesonline.com/news/38/ai ... Icelandair
 
MartijnNL
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Re: WOW adds Vancouver

Tue Oct 23, 2018 8:52 am

When looking at the Keflavik expansion plans, one question pops up in my mind: why does that pier between the two buildings stay that narrow? Why not make it wider to provide more room for passengers?

For example the E-pier at Schiphol Airport is currently three times wider than the old one used to be. It looks to me Keflavik could use the same kind of expansion.
 
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hvusslax
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Re: WOW adds Vancouver

Tue Oct 23, 2018 9:21 am

MartijnNL wrote:
When looking at the Keflavik expansion plans, one question pops up in my mind: why does that pier between the two buildings stay that narrow? Why not make it wider to provide more room for passengers?

For example the E-pier at Schiphol Airport is currently three times wider than the old one used to be. It looks to me Keflavik could use the same kind of expansion.


Check out the video in my response to LAX772LR earlier in the thread. That picture is already outdated as the most recent version of the expansion plan is actually to begin by widening this pier between the current north and south buildings. That won't increase the number of gates currently on that pier but it will allow for proper waiting areas and since the expanded pier will be on three levels it will allow use of these gates as both Schengen and international (currently they are only available for Schengen flights).
 
Blerg
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Re: WOW adds Vancouver

Tue Oct 23, 2018 10:06 am

Interesting that FI has only an hour on the ground in YVR. Isn't that a bit tight especially if both flights are full?
 
arcticcruiser
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Joined: Tue Aug 22, 2017 2:16 pm

Re: WOW adds Vancouver

Tue Oct 23, 2018 10:55 am

Blerg wrote:
Interesting that FI has only an hour on the ground in YVR. Isn't that a bit tight especially if both flights are full?


Not a problem with a good handler.
 
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TWA302
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Re: WOW adds Vancouver

Tue Oct 23, 2018 1:18 pm

Airlinepilot129 wrote:
I’m optimistic about this and the viability of the entire operation after they cut 5 US markets in a week that were supposedly doing “very well.”


Did you even look at the loads WW had at JFK, DFW, CLE, CVG and STL? They were performing, they flat out even told (at least the STL airport) A WOW official said in an email, "I just wanted to let you know that we are planning a big thank you to the people of St. Louis next Monday. WOW Air is really happy with the St. Louis route this summer." Then they do a 180 a month later and throw out "it's not us it's you". The loads were very good. It is the WW model that is what is not doing "very well". A healthy airline doesn't go and pull out of five markets in 72 hours and then start/restart 3 more within a week. Their deplorable customer service, double selling XL seats, etc. is just not acceptable, even for a ULCC.
 
DUSZRH
Posts: 154
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Re: WOW adds Vancouver

Tue Oct 23, 2018 2:40 pm

a350lover wrote:
DEL - YVR traveling time is going to be 20h45min, with a layover time in KEF of 4h 20min. Leaves Delhi at 7am and arrives Vancouver at 6.15pm. Eastwards, travel time increases despite a tighter layover in KEF of just 2h25min.

Air Canada non-stop service YVR-DEL is just 14 hours 10 min, 13h 50min on the way back.


They're not competing with AC, but the Chinese Airlines, all having similar durations (even though YVR-PEK-DEL is shorter than via KEF).
 
SpaceshipDC10
Posts: 6418
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Re: WOW adds Vancouver

Wed Oct 24, 2018 11:40 am

SpaceshipDC10 wrote:
September stats aren't available yet, but here are the first 8 months:

2018 7,273,316 +11,7% +763,832

2017 6,509,484 +29,2% +1,470,037

2016 5,039,447

More details are available here: https://www.isavia.is/en/corporate/abou ... statistics


Sorry, I have to make a correction here. I provided the numbers for all Isavia airports and not just for KEF, so here they are.

August 2018... 1.189.250..... 2017... 1.081.409 +10,0%

YTD 2018... 6.737.067.....2017... 5.954.761 +13,1%

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