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Cedric13
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MEA orders 4 a330 neo

Fri Oct 26, 2018 3:45 pm

Mea just officially ordered 4 a330 neos to expand their long haul fleet and add to their 11 a321 neo order.

https://www.flightglobal.com/news/artic ... eo-452983/
 
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gatibosgru
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Re: MEA orders 4 a330 neo

Fri Oct 26, 2018 3:58 pm

-900 for a little more capacity or -800 for a direct A332 replacement?
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OGLOBAL
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Re: MEA orders 4 a330 neo

Fri Oct 26, 2018 4:00 pm

i don't think its expansion probably just replacement . they are very conservative in expanding
 
Cedric13
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Re: MEA orders 4 a330 neo

Fri Oct 26, 2018 4:06 pm

gatibosgru wrote:
-900 for a little more capacity or -800 for a direct A332 replacement?

-900
 
Cedric13
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Re: MEA orders 4 a330 neo

Fri Oct 26, 2018 4:07 pm

OGLOBAL wrote:
i don't think its expansion probably just replacement . they are very conservative in expanding

“Modernization”. They are getting 15 new aircraft in the next 3 to 4 years tho but it is worth noting that they might return their 6 leased a320s which will leave them with 7 a320s.
 
behramjee
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Re: MEA orders 4 a330 neo

Fri Oct 26, 2018 6:56 pm

Lebanon’s MEA officially announces a new order for its full fleet replacement:

a) 5 A332s to be replaced by 4 new A330-900neos

b) 13 A320s to be replaced by 11 new A321Neos

Comments:

This is a smart move by MEA as it is sticking to its core focus of operating short and medium haul routes up to a maximum of 6 hours from its Beirut hub. Due to this, the airline does not need to waste money by ordering the more expensive A350-900 which would have been the logical thing to do if it was any other airline.

Another interesting to note is that it’s current fleet of 18 aircraft (5 A332s + 13 A320s) is being reduced to 16 (4 A339s + 11 A321neos) which in turn means it will be better optimizing it’s network to focus on routes where there is higher yielding p2p demand bound to Lebanon versus targeting lower yielding transit traffic from EU to GCC.

In addition one is to expect few A332 routes to be downgraded to A321neos as the wide body fleet size reduces from 5 to 4. Lebanon isn’t a big cargo market so the loss of one wide body aircraft isn’t a big deal but what is commendable to note is the fact that they are not going to be operating the A320s in the future since they realize the economics of the A321neos is far superior + with many of their prime destinations ie DXB JED RUH LHR CDG CAI IST facing slot issues it is is best to maximize seats available per slot ratio to gain maximum uplift.
 
Armodeen
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Re: MEA orders 4 a330 neo

Fri Oct 26, 2018 9:01 pm

Congratulations to Airbus and MEA! This is exactly the sort of small operator fleet replacement order that the neo is both expected and really must win to ensure the program is viable.

Any idea if these will be direct from Airbus or be leased?
 
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seabosdca
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Re: MEA orders 4 a330 neo

Fri Oct 26, 2018 9:20 pm

Just wanted to ask about the buy/lease question. Lessors have plenty of A330-900neo ordered but unplaced. I don't think that's the case for A321neo.
 
Cedric13
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Re: MEA orders 4 a330 neo

Fri Oct 26, 2018 9:24 pm

behramjee wrote:
Lebanon’s MEA officially announces a new order for its full fleet replacement:

a) 5 A332s to be replaced by 4 new A330-900neos

b) 13 A320s to be replaced by 11 new A321Neos

Comments:

This is a smart move by MEA as it is sticking to its core focus of operating short and medium haul routes up to a maximum of 6 hours from its Beirut hub. Due to this, the airline does not need to waste money by ordering the more expensive A350-900 which would have been the logical thing to do if it was any other airline.

Another interesting to note is that it’s current fleet of 18 aircraft (5 A332s + 13 A320s) is being reduced to 16 (4 A339s + 11 A321neos) which in turn means it will be better optimizing it’s network to focus on routes where there is higher yielding p2p demand bound to Lebanon versus targeting lower yielding transit traffic from EU to GCC.

In addition one is to expect few A332 routes to be downgraded to A321neos as the wide body fleet size reduces from 5 to 4. Lebanon isn’t a big cargo market so the loss of one wide body aircraft isn’t a big deal but what is commendable to note is the fact that they are not going to be operating the A320s in the future since they realize the economics of the A321neos is far superior + with many of their prime destinations ie DXB JED RUH LHR CDG CAI IST facing slot issues it is is best to maximize seats available per slot ratio to gain maximum uplift.

Only the 6 leased a320s will be returned which will leave them with 7 and they have a 2 year old a332 that’s going nowhere so most of their a332 fleet won’t be replaced anytime soon. They actually said that they are retiring aircrafts that pass 13 years in age and they are planning to launch new destinations actively.
 
Chaostheory
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Re: MEA orders 4 a330 neo

Fri Oct 26, 2018 9:48 pm

According to some, there isn't a market for 330neos.

Yet we have this order. And there will no doubt be others.

What on earth is going on?

Could it be that those of us who actually work in the industry know what we're talking about when we say the 330neo will do well?
 
BA
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Re: MEA orders 4 a330 neo

Fri Oct 26, 2018 9:56 pm

behramjee wrote:
Lebanon’s MEA officially announces a new order for its full fleet replacement:

a) 5 A332s to be replaced by 4 new A330-900neos

b) 13 A320s to be replaced by 11 new A321Neos

Comments:

Another interesting to note is that it’s current fleet of 18 aircraft (5 A332s + 13 A320s) is being reduced to 16 (4 A339s + 11 A321neos) which in turn means it will be better optimizing it’s network to focus on routes where there is higher yielding p2p demand bound to Lebanon versus targeting lower yielding transit traffic from EU to GCC.


This is not correct. They are not not downsizing their fleet.

The 4 A330neos are replacing the 4 A330-200s that were delivered in 2008 and 2009.

The 5th A330-200, which was delivered in 2016, and features a nicer cabin interior, will be in service for many more years before it is replaced. When it comes time to be replaced, MEA will probably place a top off order for an additional A330neo.

The 11 A321s are replacing only a portion of the A320 fleet, I'm not sure of the exact quantity, but it is not all 13 A320s.
"Generosity is giving more than you can, and pride is taking less than you need." - Khalil Gibran
 
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Polot
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Re: MEA orders 4 a330 neo

Fri Oct 26, 2018 10:05 pm

Chaostheory wrote:
According to some, there isn't a market for 330neos.

Yet we have this order. And there will no doubt be others.

What on earth is going on?

Could it be that those of us who actually work in the industry know what we're talking about when we say the 330neo will do well?

Only the most delusional Boeing supporter would think that the A330neo will never get an order again. You are playing “I told you so” over an order for 4 frames, when Boeing has 104 net orders for the A330neo’s closest competitor ytd versus ~20 for the Neo (assuming these are not a lease placement).

There is a disconnect between how Airbus thought the A330neo would do in 2014 at program launch (and by extension how well many people here thought/touted the plane would do) versus it’s actual sales performance.
 
LewisNEO
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Re: MEA orders 4 a330 neo

Fri Oct 26, 2018 10:15 pm

Chaostheory wrote:
According to some, there isn't a market for 330neos.

Yet we have this order. And there will no doubt be others.

What on earth is going on?

Could it be that those of us who actually work in the industry know what we're talking about when we say the 330neo will do well?


I hear you, and it's something that wasn't here in te past, and I've been following this forum for many, many years before getting active myself. Well it's quite easy to post with emotions online here, especially when one is sitting behind a desktop or laptop and filling in comments. I think there are also people here who seem to confuse politics and nationalism very easy with factual discussions. Of course everyone has his or her own preferences, but sometimes it is indeed like some want to dow play certain things, and that is a pity. It is also sort of a time related matter of all current things that are going on.

Well back to the discussion: Indeed I think on the longer term the A330neo will do quite well and it is great to see another order. It is also how the market acts: the 787 and A350 are the most robust selling wide bodies now, with the proven 777 and A330 who where (once) fulfilling the role as a new marketleader, which are complementing the 787 and A350 now. :-) And I think MEA just chose the perfect airplane that fits their current fleet and meets up with their demands.
You are the wind beneath my wings.

Fokker 27, Bombardier Dash 8, Embraer 175 & 195, 727-200, 737-200 & -300 & -400 & -800, 747-400, 767-300, 767-400, DC 10-30, A320-200, A330-200, A330-300, A380.
 
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aemoreira1981
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Re: MEA orders 4 a330 neo

Fri Oct 26, 2018 10:21 pm

The A21N are replacing all the leased (T7-) frames. The A339s could be for expansion as additional regional wide body capacity is needed.
 
LewisNEO
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Re: MEA orders 4 a330 neo

Fri Oct 26, 2018 10:35 pm

aemoreira1981 wrote:
The A21N are replacing all the leased (T7-) frames. The A339s could be for expansion as additional regional wide body capacity is needed.


Cool I didn't know that, but how does this compare to the woes of the ME3 who seem to coope with a market that slows a bit down? Or seems to slow down?
You are the wind beneath my wings.

Fokker 27, Bombardier Dash 8, Embraer 175 & 195, 727-200, 737-200 & -300 & -400 & -800, 747-400, 767-300, 767-400, DC 10-30, A320-200, A330-200, A330-300, A380.
 
ramzi
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Re: MEA orders 4 a330 neo

Fri Oct 26, 2018 11:11 pm

As BA mentioned, the 4 A339 are replacing 4 A332. Actually the owned A320s (OD-) will be leaving first, along with T7-MRA, T7-MRB, and T7-MRC. The 321 order replaces those plus one extra frame. Eventually, as has been done in the past, they will order another one (or two?) A339s and another two or more A321neos.

They are definitely not downsizing, as the new aircraft have more capacity and are going to be replaced on at least a 1 to 1 basis.

A big advantage ME has had in the past few years is the relocation of all Damascus passenger traffic to BEY. The airport has been operating over capacity for 2-3 years, and there is an expansion plan including improvements to the current terminal and the construction of two new ones.
There will come a time when you believe everything is finished - that will be the beginning.
 
BA
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Re: MEA orders 4 a330 neo

Fri Oct 26, 2018 11:39 pm

seabosdca wrote:
Just wanted to ask about the buy/lease question. Lessors have plenty of A330-900neo ordered but unplaced. I don't think that's the case for A321neo.


These will be owned by MEA, along with the A321neos.
"Generosity is giving more than you can, and pride is taking less than you need." - Khalil Gibran
 
behramjee
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Re: MEA orders 4 a330 neo

Sat Oct 27, 2018 2:38 am

BA wrote:
behramjee wrote:
Lebanon’s MEA officially announces a new order for its full fleet replacement:

a) 5 A332s to be replaced by 4 new A330-900neos

b) 13 A320s to be replaced by 11 new A321Neos

Comments:

Another interesting to note is that it’s current fleet of 18 aircraft (5 A332s + 13 A320s) is being reduced to 16 (4 A339s + 11 A321neos) which in turn means it will be better optimizing it’s network to focus on routes where there is higher yielding p2p demand bound to Lebanon versus targeting lower yielding transit traffic from EU to GCC.


This is not correct. They are not not downsizing their fleet.

The 4 A330neos are replacing the 4 A330-200s that were delivered in 2008 and 2009.

The 5th A330-200, which was delivered in 2016, and features a nicer cabin interior, will be in service for many more years before it is replaced. When it comes time to be replaced, MEA will probably place a top off order for an additional A330neo.

The 11 A321s are replacing only a portion of the A320 fleet, I'm not sure of the exact quantity, but it is not all 13 A320s.


Thank you for clarifying this, I appreciate it.

So the future fleet will consist of 5 A330s, 6 A320s and 11 A321Neos...correct?

Would u think that the A339s too will have 42J like the current A332s? Or reduced to ensure full flat beds across the board? I doubt that the A321s will get flat beds though!

What is the configuration of the single A332 with the new cabin layout?
 
SXDFC
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Re: MEA orders 4 a330 neo

Sat Oct 27, 2018 2:42 am

Has Airbus released a rendering of the A320 and A330NEO in the MEA livery yet? I believe MEA is expected to introduce a new livery soon, but I could be wrong..
 
olba
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Re: MEA orders 4 a330 neo

Sat Oct 27, 2018 5:30 am

behramjee wrote:
BA wrote:
behramjee wrote:
Lebanon’s MEA officially announces a new order for its full fleet replacement:

a) 5 A332s to be replaced by 4 new A330-900neos

b) 13 A320s to be replaced by 11 new A321Neos

Comments:

Another interesting to note is that it’s current fleet of 18 aircraft (5 A332s + 13 A320s) is being reduced to 16 (4 A339s + 11 A321neos) which in turn means it will be better optimizing it’s network to focus on routes where there is higher yielding p2p demand bound to Lebanon versus targeting lower yielding transit traffic from EU to GCC.


This is not correct. They are not not downsizing their fleet.

The 4 A330neos are replacing the 4 A330-200s that were delivered in 2008 and 2009.

The 5th A330-200, which was delivered in 2016, and features a nicer cabin interior, will be in service for many more years before it is replaced. When it comes time to be replaced, MEA will probably place a top off order for an additional A330neo.

The 11 A321s are replacing only a portion of the A320 fleet, I'm not sure of the exact quantity, but it is not all 13 A320s.


Thank you for clarifying this, I appreciate it.

So the future fleet will consist of 5 A330s, 6 A320s and 11 A321Neos...correct?

Would u think that the A339s too will have 42J like the current A332s? Or reduced to ensure full flat beds across the board? I doubt that the A321s will get flat beds though!

What is the configuration of the single A332 with the new cabin layout?




The Lebanese Plane Spotters facebook page once mentioned a few months ago that the new wide body aircrafts will have business class layout of 1-2-1 and wifi on board
 
BA
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Re: MEA orders 4 a330 neo

Sat Oct 27, 2018 6:21 am

behramjee wrote:
Thank you for clarifying this, I appreciate it.

So the future fleet will consist of 5 A330s, 6 A320s and 11 A321Neos...correct?


5 A330s and 11 A321neos for sure. Of the 13 A320s they currently have, I'm not sure how many will be replaced by the A321neos and how many will be retained.

Of the 13 A320s, 7 are owned while 6 are leased. The 7 owned are the oldest, having been delivered between 2009 and 2012, while the 6 leased A320s were delivered between 2014 and 2016. What's interesting is 4 of the 6 leased A320s have CFM56 engines, while the rest have IAE engines like the 7 owned A320s.

Ramzi and other members indicated that the 11 A321neos will replace 10 of the 13 A320s, the oldest ones, so that means the future fleet will consist of 5 A330s, 3 A320s, and 11 A321neos.

behramjee wrote:
Would u think that the A339s too will have 42J like the current A332s? Or reduced to ensure full flat beds across the board? I doubt that the A321s will get flat beds though!

No idea, sorry.

behramjee wrote:
What is the configuration of the single A332 with the new cabin layout?


It's the same layout (44J/200Y), but the seats themselves are more modern, with an updated IFE system, and power outlets in the seats (in J at least, not sure about Y). It also features updated cabin lighting.
"Generosity is giving more than you can, and pride is taking less than you need." - Khalil Gibran
 
BA
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Re: MEA orders 4 a330 neo

Sat Oct 27, 2018 6:25 am

SXDFC wrote:
Has Airbus released a rendering of the A320 and A330NEO in the MEA livery yet? I believe MEA is expected to introduce a new livery soon, but I could be wrong..


They haven't. And yes you're right, MEA is expected to introduce a new livery with the new fleet.
"Generosity is giving more than you can, and pride is taking less than you need." - Khalil Gibran
 
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zkojq
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Re: MEA orders 4 a330 neo

Sun Oct 28, 2018 9:54 am

Polot wrote:
Chaostheory wrote:
According to some, there isn't a market for 330neos.

Yet we have this order. And there will no doubt be others.

What on earth is going on?

Could it be that those of us who actually work in the industry know what we're talking about when we say the 330neo will do well?

Only the most delusional Boeing supporter would think that the A330neo will never get an order again. You are playing “I told you so” over an order for 4 frames, when Boeing has 104 net orders for the A330neo’s closest competitor ytd versus ~20 for the Neo (assuming these are not a lease placement).


I think that post was a response to the belligerence of some of the Dreamliner fanboys here, especially on matters regarding the A330's prospects. Every time there is a discussion on a RFP, regardless of the airline, its route structure, existing fleet, average aircraft age etc we always have someone saying that the Dreamliner is "by far the best" or "an easy win" and that the A330neo has no chance. A few months back there was a discussion of SAS's longhaul fleet somewhere here and of course we had someone saying that it made sense for them to cancel all A350+A330s and replace them with 787-9s. Likewise someone said something similar in regards to Iberia in a thread at the start of the year. :roll: It gets a bit tiresome after a while.

ramzi wrote:
As BA mentioned, the 4 A339 are replacing 4 A332. Actually the owned A320s (OD-) will be leaving first, along with T7-MRA, T7-MRB, and T7-MRC. The 321 order replaces those plus one extra frame. Eventually, as has been done in the past, they will order another one (or two?) A339s and another two or more A321neos.

Two thoughts:

1) What's up with the T7 registrations? I know MEA all used French registrations at some point in the past, but T7 is new to me. San Marino seems a peculiar place to have their aircraft registered.

2) What about T7-MRD? Is it going to be an orphan as the only CFM powered A320ceo in the fleet?
First to fly the 787-9
 
LewisNEO
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Re: MEA orders 4 a330 neo

Sun Oct 28, 2018 2:37 pm

BA wrote:
SXDFC wrote:
Has Airbus released a rendering of the A320 and A330NEO in the MEA livery yet? I believe MEA is expected to introduce a new livery soon, but I could be wrong..


They haven't. And yes you're right, MEA is expected to introduce a new livery with the new fleet.


Is there also some other source? Would be awesome to see a rendering
You are the wind beneath my wings.

Fokker 27, Bombardier Dash 8, Embraer 175 & 195, 727-200, 737-200 & -300 & -400 & -800, 747-400, 767-300, 767-400, DC 10-30, A320-200, A330-200, A330-300, A380.
 
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DL747400
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Re: MEA orders 4 a330 neo

Sun Oct 28, 2018 3:10 pm

Would love to see MEA on BEY-JFK.
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AsoRock
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Re: MEA orders 4 a330 neo

Sun Oct 28, 2018 3:30 pm

SXDFC wrote:
Has Airbus released a rendering of the A320 and A330NEO in the MEA livery yet? I believe MEA is expected to introduce a new livery soon, but I could be wrong..


I certainly hope so! I have never been a fan of the 'eurowhite' MEA liveries in the 2000s. The classic liveries were much bolder and had character. I hope they do introduce a new rich and colorful identity that captures the soul of Lebanon.
 
musman9853
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Re: MEA orders 4 a330 neo

Sun Oct 28, 2018 5:22 pm

Chaostheory wrote:
According to some, there isn't a market for 330neos.

Yet we have this order. And there will no doubt be others.

What on earth is going on?

Could it be that those of us who actually work in the industry know what we're talking about when we say the 330neo will do well?



no one expects the a330neo to never get another order, it's not the a380 and has some uses. in general though airlines have looked at the options, and in most cases the 787 is the superior airframe.
Welcome to the City Beautiful.
 
BA
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Re: MEA orders 4 a330 neo

Sun Oct 28, 2018 7:10 pm

zkojq wrote:
1) What's up with the T7 registrations? I know MEA all used French registrations at some point in the past, but T7 is new to me. San Marino seems a peculiar place to have their aircraft registered.


The T7 registrations are the leased A320s while the OD (Lebanese registrations) are the owned A320s. In the past, French registrations were used for both owned and leased aircraft.

zkojq wrote:
2) What about T7-MRD? Is it going to be an orphan as the only CFM powered A320ceo in the fleet?


It's not the only CFM-powered A320 in the fleet. They have 4 CFM-powered A320s.

LewisNEO wrote:
Is there also some other source? Would be awesome to see a rendering


As I said above, they have not released the new livery yet.
"Generosity is giving more than you can, and pride is taking less than you need." - Khalil Gibran
 
ramzi
Posts: 253
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Re: MEA orders 4 a330 neo

Tue Oct 30, 2018 1:59 am

zkojq wrote:
ramzi wrote:
As BA mentioned, the 4 A339 are replacing 4 A332. Actually the owned A320s (OD-) will be leaving first, along with T7-MRA, T7-MRB, and T7-MRC. The 321 order replaces those plus one extra frame. Eventually, as has been done in the past, they will order another one (or two?) A339s and another two or more A321neos.

Two thoughts:

1) What's up with the T7 registrations? I know MEA all used French registrations at some point in the past, but T7 is new to me. San Marino seems a peculiar place to have their aircraft registered.

2) What about T7-MRD? Is it going to be an orphan as the only CFM powered A320ceo in the fleet?


I'm not sure why San Marino particularly, but I'm going to guess it is because of the leasing company being registered there. In the past MEA always used the F- code, but shifted around 10 years ago to using OD-, only the newer, leased A320s came with the T7-.

ME will definitely have exercised options to replace T7-MRD by the time the other CFMs leave the fleet. It is an odd bird, CFM, with Sharklets, leased not owned, and SkyTeam livery on top of that. The intersections of all the oddities in the little baby bus fleet.

In the past ME have been pretty quite about options and top-up orders, probably since they are so small, but the current fleet started from a smaller order that got was marginally grown, and I expect the same with the current order.
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