Moderators: jsumali2, richierich, ua900, PanAm_DC10, hOMSaR

 
aviator2000
Topic Author
Posts: 77
Joined: Sun May 20, 2018 11:19 am

BA & IB widebodies between MAD-LHR

Tue Oct 30, 2018 6:19 pm

I've always wondred why do BA and IB operate the flights between their hubs with widebody aircrafts. Is it due to the LHR slot constraint?
Last edited by atcsundevil on Tue Oct 30, 2018 9:10 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Title edited for clarity
 
Arion640
Posts: 3059
Joined: Fri Mar 31, 2017 5:15 pm

Re: BA& IB MAD-LHR

Tue Oct 30, 2018 6:22 pm

Cargo.
 
User avatar
FlyRow
Posts: 850
Joined: Mon Mar 21, 2016 10:05 pm

Re: BA& IB MAD-LHR

Tue Oct 30, 2018 7:47 pm

Plus probably a lot of demand.

BA is really strong in North America, IB in South America, that funnels traffic between the cities.
Plus, they are Europe's 3rd and 1st largest city, with 16 million plus inhabitants between them in there urban areas.

It's not that weird that there is a large demand, plus cargo. And since LHR is very very slot constricted, widebodies are needed.

Scheduling wise it won't mather that much, lot's of planes who can get a extra 6hr roundtrip MAD-LHR between a long flight in a day.
F70-F100-RJ85-RJ70-E190-319-320-321-733-734-735-737-738-752-753-763-764-772-744-380
 
lhrsfosyd
Posts: 209
Joined: Wed Oct 26, 2016 4:57 pm

Re: BA& IB MAD-LHR

Tue Oct 30, 2018 7:50 pm

Cargo isn't the only reason. Travel volumes are rather large between the two cities and given no competition, long haul aircraft availability and the retirement of B767, IAG tries to make as much profit as possible. There are however only two wide body services a day and they are largely connected to departure and arrival banks at both LHR and MAD.
 
rutankrd
Posts: 3025
Joined: Mon Sep 08, 2003 6:08 am

Re: BA& IB MAD-LHR

Tue Oct 30, 2018 8:03 pm

IBERIA has operated one of the evening flights with a wide body aircraft for decades long before the alliances and IAG ownership.

As far back as the seventies they were deploying a DC10 on that rotation.

It’s demand upstairs and downstairs as it connects into the Latin American departure banks.
 
TC957
Posts: 3816
Joined: Wed May 23, 2012 1:12 pm

Re: BA & IB widebodies between MAD-LHR

Tue Oct 30, 2018 9:24 pm

And even the DC-8-63 before that !
 
User avatar
FlyRow
Posts: 850
Joined: Mon Mar 21, 2016 10:05 pm

Re: BA & IB widebodies between MAD-LHR

Tue Oct 30, 2018 9:36 pm

^^
You can't compare seventies/eightees use of shorthaul widebodies to modern aviation. totally uncomparable flying.
F70-F100-RJ85-RJ70-E190-319-320-321-733-734-735-737-738-752-753-763-764-772-744-380
 
skipness1E
Posts: 4818
Joined: Sun Aug 19, 2007 9:18 am

Re: BA & IB widebodies between MAD-LHR

Tue Oct 30, 2018 9:55 pm

Pretty sure there was a gap of many years between the A300s going and the A340 operating. It was all narrow bodies in the interim :)
 
mdavies06
Posts: 545
Joined: Fri Aug 07, 2009 10:28 pm

Re: BA & IB widebodies between MAD-LHR

Tue Oct 30, 2018 11:54 pm

a few similar thread for Ops reference if interested.

viewtopic.php?t=1350119
viewtopic.php?t=1361693
 
Geoff1947
Posts: 633
Joined: Thu Jun 16, 2016 11:28 pm

Re: BA & IB widebodies between MAD-LHR

Wed Oct 31, 2018 12:28 am

Yippee... flying MAD-LHR in a few weeks and it looks as though it will be a A340-600.

Geoff
 
CRJ900
Posts: 2388
Joined: Wed Jun 02, 2004 2:48 am

Re: BA & IB widebodies between MAD-LHR

Wed Oct 31, 2018 12:48 am

Probably so many A.nutters trying to get a widebody on European routes that they have to fly widebodies LHR-MAD to cope with the demand ;)
Come, fly the prevailing winds with me
 
gunnerman
Posts: 1143
Joined: Fri May 19, 2017 7:55 pm

Re: BA & IB widebodies between MAD-LHR

Wed Oct 31, 2018 1:16 am

BA uses the 216-seat 772 or the 299-seat 773 to operate the daily BA060 flight. I can't help noticing that loads don't look so good in the near future especially when the 773 operates.
 
Cunard
Posts: 2510
Joined: Fri Nov 11, 2016 6:45 pm

Re: BA & IB widebodies between MAD-LHR

Wed Oct 31, 2018 1:24 am

gunnerman wrote:
BA uses the 216-seat 772 or the 299-seat 773 to operate the daily BA060 flight. I can't help noticing that loads don't look so good in the near future especially when the 773 operates.


But it's probably full of belly cargo which is one of the main reasons that both BA and IB use wide-bodies on LHR to MAD.

A lot of airfreight is transported between the two Oneworld hubs that's why we see the wide-bodies from each airline serving the route.
94 Countries, 327 Destinations Worldwide, 32 Airlines, 29 Aircraft Types, 182 Airports, 335 Flights.
 
B752OS
Posts: 1247
Joined: Thu Dec 22, 2005 4:05 am

Re: BA & IB widebodies between MAD-LHR

Wed Oct 31, 2018 2:25 am

What connecting point does BA use to connect South American and Central American traffic? MAD? MIA? They don't serve places like BOG, LIM (year round), PTY, BSB, MDE, UIO, GYE, MVD, GUA and CCS.
 
BA777FO
Posts: 577
Joined: Sun Apr 22, 2018 2:58 pm

Re: BA & IB widebodies between MAD-LHR

Wed Oct 31, 2018 2:53 am

gunnerman wrote:
BA uses the 216-seat 772 or the 299-seat 773 to operate the daily BA060 flight. I can't help noticing that loads don't look so good in the near future especially when the 773 operates.


The 461 yesterday (30th October) was virtually full and had over 13 tonnes of cargo/mail etc. The cargo alone on that flight will make it profitable, that's without the nearly 300 passengers, virtually 60 of which were booked Club Europe. It's a money spinner.

It's good aircraft utilisation too. Most of the 777-300 routes arrive early morning (SIN, HKG, GRU) and depart late evening (same destinations: SIN, GRU, PVG etc) so it slots nicely into the day before heading out to SIN again rather than sitting on the ground all day.
 
User avatar
aemoreira1981
Posts: 3586
Joined: Mon Jan 09, 2017 12:17 am

Re: BA & IB widebodies between MAD-LHR

Wed Oct 31, 2018 5:21 am

A part of me would say that the B78J would be a perfect aircraft on this rotation for BA, given that it's lighter than any of the 4-class planes BA flies on LHR-MAD. It would free up the B77W on TATL services where the mid-J or low-J 744s are flown, allowing for their retirement.
 
LupineChemist
Posts: 824
Joined: Wed Oct 07, 2015 9:03 am

Re: BA & IB widebodies between MAD-LHR

Wed Oct 31, 2018 7:28 am

The BA widebody is to get people from from MAD to LHR in time for the afternoon bank to the US.

The IB widebody is to get people from LHR in time for the night bank to S. America.
 
a350lover
Posts: 874
Joined: Sun Dec 24, 2017 11:21 am

Re: BA & IB widebodies between MAD-LHR

Wed Oct 31, 2018 8:10 am

As the A346 frames of IB get liberated from routes which will transfer to A359, we might see them more in short-haul routes which IB has operated with this big bird. LHR has the tightest slot situation of Europe; no big surprise airlines try to deploy there with every single operation the maximum capacity in seats and cargo.
 
User avatar
readytotaxi
Posts: 7432
Joined: Mon Dec 11, 2006 2:09 am

Re: BA & IB widebodies between MAD-LHR

Wed Oct 31, 2018 9:19 am

At least with the IB A346 you get a proper business class seat for the money.

you don't get a second chance to make a first impression!
Growing older, but not up.
 
royroy
Posts: 52
Joined: Mon Nov 13, 2017 11:48 am

Re: BA & IB widebodies between MAD-LHR

Wed Oct 31, 2018 9:42 am

BA sells the cargo space for both airlines in the UK. As such all of Iberia's network is marketed from here. I presume using the widebodies means less money spent on trunking down to Spain and vice versa. The flights are always full with cargo
 
lhrsfosyd
Posts: 209
Joined: Wed Oct 26, 2016 4:57 pm

Re: BA & IB widebodies between MAD-LHR

Wed Oct 31, 2018 10:22 am

LupineChemist wrote:
The BA widebody is to get people from from MAD to LHR in time for the afternoon bank to the US.

The IB widebody is to get people from LHR in time for the night bank to S. America.


BA wide body arrives at 1910, it's the other way around, the wide body captures arriving North Atlantic traffic.
 
pabloeing
Posts: 594
Joined: Wed Dec 10, 2014 3:00 pm

Re: BA & IB widebodies between MAD-LHR

Wed Oct 31, 2018 10:40 am

¿We will see the BA B787-10 in this route?
 
LupineChemist
Posts: 824
Joined: Wed Oct 07, 2015 9:03 am

Re: BA & IB widebodies between MAD-LHR

Wed Oct 31, 2018 10:54 am

lhrsfosyd wrote:
LupineChemist wrote:
The BA widebody is to get people from from MAD to LHR in time for the afternoon bank to the US.

The IB widebody is to get people from LHR in time for the night bank to S. America.


BA wide body arrives at 1910, it's the other way around, the wide body captures arriving North Atlantic traffic.


Did they switch it up? It used to be the 767 or 777 leaving at 1130 to get to LHR around 1300 and the IB 340 leaving at 1630 ish to make it back to MAD by 2200. I know that BA and IB do try to coordinate so that they won't have to RONs at the other hub to lower costs so the last flights out of LHR are IB operated and last flights out of MAD are BA operated.
 
a350lover
Posts: 874
Joined: Sun Dec 24, 2017 11:21 am

Re: BA & IB widebodies between MAD-LHR

Wed Oct 31, 2018 11:10 am

The IAG market between Madrid and London was compensated in favor of BA. BA has a larger amount of frequencies operated with widebodies, plus aicraft overnights in MAD. On the other hand, Iberia stopped placing night-stops in LHR years ago, not even Iberia Express to MAD or VY to Barcelona.
 
Crispi
Posts: 10
Joined: Tue Feb 16, 2016 12:24 pm

Re: BA & IB widebodies between MAD-LHR

Wed Oct 31, 2018 11:19 am

Good morning, I think you are wrong. Iberia has more total frequencies on the route, and the same number of large aircraft as BA. In addition neither Iberia leaves sleeping aircraft in LHR nor BA leaves aircraft in MAD.
They did this to save costs, because they save the rest of the crews in Hotels. If you notice all the nightly departures from LHR to MAD are operated by IB and the nightly departures from MAD are operated by BA
Crispi
 
a350lover
Posts: 874
Joined: Sun Dec 24, 2017 11:21 am

Re: BA & IB widebodies between MAD-LHR

Wed Oct 31, 2018 11:33 am

Crispi wrote:
Good morning, I think you are wrong. Iberia has more total frequencies on the route, and the same number of large aircraft as BA. In addition neither Iberia leaves sleeping aircraft in LHR nor BA leaves aircraft in MAD.
They did this to save costs, because they save the rest of the crews in Hotels. If you notice all the nightly departures from LHR to MAD are operated by IB and the nightly departures from MAD are operated by BA


You are very right. Sorry for the missed information.
In Barcelona BA, despite the same level of collaboration with Vueling (which mainly flies to LGW, just a single flight a day to LHR), BA does leave a stopnight aircraft. Probably because of the need to secure connections to LHR first early in the morning.
 
lhrsfosyd
Posts: 209
Joined: Wed Oct 26, 2016 4:57 pm

Re: BA & IB widebodies between MAD-LHR

Wed Oct 31, 2018 12:04 pm

a350lover wrote:
Crispi wrote:
Good morning, I think you are wrong. Iberia has more total frequencies on the route, and the same number of large aircraft as BA. In addition neither Iberia leaves sleeping aircraft in LHR nor BA leaves aircraft in MAD.
They did this to save costs, because they save the rest of the crews in Hotels. If you notice all the nightly departures from LHR to MAD are operated by IB and the nightly departures from MAD are operated by BA


You are very right. Sorry for the missed information.
In Barcelona BA, despite the same level of collaboration with Vueling (which mainly flies to LGW, just a single flight a day to LHR), BA does leave a stopnight aircraft. Probably because of the need to secure connections to LHR first early in the morning.


Vueling and Aer Lingus do not offer a business class product so you see BA overnight aircraft at BCN and DUB to catch high yield traffic first thing in the morning bound for London.

Popular Searches On Airliners.net

Top Photos of Last:   24 Hours  •  48 Hours  •  7 Days  •  30 Days  •  180 Days  •  365 Days  •  All Time

Military Aircraft Every type from fighters to helicopters from air forces around the globe

Classic Airliners Props and jets from the good old days

Flight Decks Views from inside the cockpit

Aircraft Cabins Passenger cabin shots showing seat arrangements as well as cargo aircraft interior

Cargo Aircraft Pictures of great freighter aircraft

Government Aircraft Aircraft flying government officials

Helicopters Our large helicopter section. Both military and civil versions

Blimps / Airships Everything from the Goodyear blimp to the Zeppelin

Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos