xxcr
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Re: British Airways A350-1000 with No First Class

Wed Nov 07, 2018 5:12 pm

Arion640 wrote:
xxcr wrote:
ClassicLover wrote:

Have you flown in Club World? I have, both versions and it's great.

Sitting in a window seat is completely private with the dividing screen up, which it is throughout the flight (unless you're travelling with someone). There is also a lot of room, especially for your legs. The Qatar J cabin on the A350 (the one before QSuite) has a little cubby for your feet which makes sleeping really annoying. And that is the whole point of the bed! The same with the J fitted on Aer Lingus, Swiss, Qantas A330 and so on - your feet are enclosed into a small space when laying down. It makes turning over a chore and you can't "spread out".

Club World doesn't have that problem at all. The seat is an inch less wide than other J class seats, and it's not like you notice that either. I'll be sad to see BA not have a bespoke product, so hopefully it continues to be so. If they get larger seats with less density, fares will go up and Club World is a fairly priced product now.



I have, and to me it feels extremely claustrophobic. Seats are comfy, but the design IMO is very poor. Feels more like a high end premium economy seat.


It is not premium economy. What premium economy anywhere in the world gives you a flat bed? These days flat beds define long haul business class.

A poor business class seat, Yes. A premium economy seat, certainly not.



Read my post! i said a high end premium economy........ i know its not premium Economy
 
Arion640
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Re: British Airways A350-1000 with No First Class

Wed Nov 07, 2018 5:59 pm

xxcr wrote:
Arion640 wrote:
xxcr wrote:


I have, and to me it feels extremely claustrophobic. Seats are comfy, but the design IMO is very poor. Feels more like a high end premium economy seat.


It is not premium economy. What premium economy anywhere in the world gives you a flat bed? These days flat beds define long haul business class.

A poor business class seat, Yes. A premium economy seat, certainly not.



Read my post! i said a high end premium economy........ i know its not premium Economy


It’s not a premium economy of any sort.
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xxcr
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Re: British Airways A350-1000 with No First Class

Wed Nov 07, 2018 11:33 pm

Arion640 wrote:
xxcr wrote:
Arion640 wrote:

It is not premium economy. What premium economy anywhere in the world gives you a flat bed? These days flat beds define long haul business class.

A poor business class seat, Yes. A premium economy seat, certainly not.



Read my post! i said a high end premium economy........ i know its not premium Economy


It’s not a premium economy of any sort.


you guys are killing me! i know its not premium economy!

the reason im comparing BA business J seats to Premium economy is the layout. 2-4-2 layout with no storage space, minimal privacy (even with the divider), AVOD systems needs a major overhaul, and the service could use some sort of improvement.
 
SheddingVortex
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Re: British Airways A350-1000 with No First Class

Wed Nov 07, 2018 11:55 pm

While 1-2-1 J class is desirable, I suspect that BA has some considerations— not dissimilar to LH— that might not make it possible. These are:
  • relatively shorter flight durations compared with the ME3 thereby reducing the need for “extravagant” J seats.
  • a revenue model that derived from London as a business destination, thereby requiring denser J seating that is perhaps not readily available.
  • a cost constrained culture, coupled with monopoly/duopoly on many routes
  • until recently, North American carriers had even worse J class (hard and soft) allowing BA to get away with it.

Just a guess on my part.
 
Arion640
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Re: British Airways A350-1000 with No First Class

Thu Nov 08, 2018 7:28 am

xxcr wrote:
Arion640 wrote:
xxcr wrote:


Read my post! i said a high end premium economy........ i know its not premium Economy


It’s not a premium economy of any sort.


you guys are killing me! i know its not premium economy!

the reason im comparing BA business J seats to Premium economy is the layout. 2-4-2 layout with no storage space, minimal privacy (even with the divider), AVOD systems needs a major overhaul, and the service could use some sort of improvement.


Exactly. Just a really bad business class.

Some people love it (well the window seats) some people can’t wait to see the back of it.
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ClassicLover
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Re: British Airways A350-1000 with No First Class

Thu Nov 08, 2018 10:32 am

xxcr wrote:
the reason im comparing BA business J seats to Premium economy is the layout. 2-4-2 layout with no storage space, minimal privacy (even with the divider), AVOD systems needs a major overhaul, and the service could use some sort of improvement.


No storage space? Completely wrong. You get the standard overhead locker, a drawer at your feet for things like a wallet, headphones, phone and Passport, and upstairs on the A380 and Boeing 747-400 you also get the lockers beside you. How much space do you actually need?

AVOD and service have nothing to do with the new product. The new service is already on the way. What's wrong with the AVOD? On all my flights it's worked just fine.

They operate 2-4-2 as you have stated, but the seats are just one inch less wide than competitors business class - half an inch each side. So 2-4-2 is not at all an issue here, as the seats are virtually as wide as the competitors products due to the yin yang layout.

Don't get me wrong, I think the product can be improved. People on here tend to get bogged down in the "X abreast is better than Y abreast" when the seat designs are completely different.

I hazard a guess that if BA hadn't patented Club World's design, all the airlines would use some variation of it, because it works well when it comes to space.

SheddingVortex wrote:
While 1-2-1 J class is desirable, I suspect that BA has some considerations— not dissimilar to LH— that might not make it possible. These are:
  • relatively shorter flight durations compared with the ME3 thereby reducing the need for “extravagant” J seats.
  • a revenue model that derived from London as a business destination, thereby requiring denser J seating that is perhaps not readily available.
  • a cost constrained culture, coupled with monopoly/duopoly on many routes
  • until recently, North American carriers had even worse J class (hard and soft) allowing BA to get away with it.

Just a guess on my part.


All that is desirable is all aisle access for all passengers in J. It does not necessarily mean 1-2-1 is the solution. The concepts of a further enhanced Club World with all aisle access looked good. If it turns out to be this, I'd be happy enough.

Interesting points you made though. For me, I think they need to keep the cabin density. BA are making a boatload of cash at the moment, so they need to have all those business class seats. Also, it has been pointed out that it will be an evolution rather than revolution with the new seat, so I am guessing it will be similar enough as they need to keep the same number of people flying it.
I do enjoy a spot of flying, especially when it's not in economy!
 
parapente
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Re: British Airways A350-1000 with No First Class

Thu Nov 08, 2018 11:22 am

I do wonder here sometimes - when it comes to business class.How many writers have actually been on it....
Those who have crossed the pond Biz may have become aware that for very many Biz travellers the soft product is meaningless-for night flights.Many travellers prefer to eat in the Biz lounge then go straight to bed when on board, as sleep is the key peramiter when doing business the next day.
 
LAXLHR
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Re: British Airways A350-1000 with No First Class

Thu Nov 08, 2018 11:59 am

LHR remains the most important international airport and this is not about to change anytime soon. BA obviously knew this, but things are changing. People can moan all they like about the J seat, but if you need to fly nonstop from London, BA is the hometown airline and many just go with it, even other superior competition. BA flights are FULL!!

BA can crawl back to the top if it wants to, so lets see :-)
BA JM EA GK PA VS AA SN HP CO W7 WN NW DL QQ UA AC US LH LX OS JL QF QR PG MH CX U2 EK 9W UK TP VY VN PC LO OK OZ UL SQ LA

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Pcoder
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Re: British Airways A350-1000 with No First Class

Thu Nov 08, 2018 12:18 pm

Don't forget quite a lot of Business travel can be points upgrades/redemptions, so business might seem full, but it might be stacked with upgrades. It is more than likely that they are ditching there current setup as most airlines that they compete with have a much better business seat and they need to maintain their Customer base.

As their current first class is very similar to a very good business class, upgrading their business would make it too similar, which could be the reason they are dropping first as they probably couldn't make a large first suite work economically.
 
ilyagran
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Re: British Airways A350-1000 with No First Class

Thu Nov 08, 2018 12:53 pm

Having flown many times in CW, I do agree while it is not the best product out there but it is still adequate.
Window seats offer a great deal of privacy and sleeping comfort is superior to most of the seats, even the best-in-class.

What drives me crazy is that people keep saying that BA Club is 2-4-2 as opposed to 1-2-1 with the competition.
Folks, BA seats are STAGGERED. Their 2-4-2 is no fundamentally different from others' 1-2-1. They do sacrifice seat width a bit by you gain leg space.
Do not confuse with UA's old 2-4-2 arrangement that was truly shoulder-to-shoulder and quite bad.
Most CW window seats indeed don't have aisle access and direct eye contact with your seat mate during takeoff is awkward.
On the other hand, this seat is 12 years old (while the revolutionary concept dates back to 2000 and was industry's first fully-flat business seat).
Given its age, it holds quite well and is still superior or on par with the competition (e.g. LH).

I find BA to be a very well run airline. They know exactly what they are doing and as long as they fill up those seats, they're happy.
BA is most of the time the cheapest connecting option to the US in C and I would take them anytime over LH, AF or their respective American friends.
 
ilyagran
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Re: British Airways A350-1000 with No First Class

Thu Nov 08, 2018 12:57 pm

Pcoder wrote:
As their current first class is very similar to a very good business class, upgrading their business would make it too similar, which could be the reason they are dropping first as they probably couldn't make a large first suite work economically.


This is not true. While BA's F is inferior to other offerings, it is way roomier than other's C seats, even if the concept is similar. Having connected from BA F to AA business on 77W, BA seat is way larger even if the seats look alike to bystanders.
 
upperdeckfan
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Re: British Airways A350-1000 with No First Class

Thu Nov 08, 2018 1:14 pm

Why wouldn't BA follow the trend of his european counterparts such as AF, LH and LX which are reducing F seats every time they introduce a type in their fleet?

My 2 cents are that in a few years time, F will be gone from european carriers.

As said before, major global corporations don't pay F for their staff anymore, they pay J and some even Y+. These days many F seats on TATL market are J upgrades and award tickets, one only have to see how do you get "Bid for an F upgrade" offers in your mailbox every time you buy a TATL J ticket.
748,744,742,741,772,773,762,763,
764, 789, 732,733,735,737,738,739,
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DSH8, CS1,CS3
 
lhrsfosyd
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Re: British Airways A350-1000 with No First Class

Sat Nov 10, 2018 5:45 pm

ACC and NBO would be perfect candidates for the 3 class A350. Very strong demand for all classes except F and the turnaround can easily be done in 18 hours.
 
Arion640
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Re: British Airways A350-1000 with No First Class

Thu Mar 07, 2019 8:36 pm

george77300 wrote:
jfk777 wrote:
BA has announced their A350-1000 fleet will have no First Class but the 744 they are replacing do have it, what is going on here ? Will there be a Lufthansa style 777-9 Business Class ? BA is upgrading Club World, is it going to revolutionary or evolutionary ? Whatever is going on here clarity would be great, J class mysteries are not wanted. What shape will BA First Class take and on what planes, 777 & 787 only.


BA A350s WILL HAVE FIRST CLASS

The FIRST A350s won’t. They are 3 class. The second batch will be 4 class.


Is there a source that some will arrive with F?
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george77300
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Re: British Airways A350-1000 with No First Class

Thu Mar 07, 2019 8:50 pm

Arion640 wrote:
george77300 wrote:
jfk777 wrote:
BA has announced their A350-1000 fleet will have no First Class but the 744 they are replacing do have it, what is going on here ? Will there be a Lufthansa style 777-9 Business Class ? BA is upgrading Club World, is it going to revolutionary or evolutionary ? Whatever is going on here clarity would be great, J class mysteries are not wanted. What shape will BA First Class take and on what planes, 777 & 787 only.


BA A350s WILL HAVE FIRST CLASS

The FIRST A350s won’t. They are 3 class. The second batch will be 4 class.


Is there a source that some will arrive with F?


I don't know if I'm going mad but I recognize your username from FlyerTalk?

It was mentioned on the BA forum there from some insiders so very believable.

Either search this thread or post a question. Here is the specific BA Fleet thread (info in the wiki there too) Source: https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/british ... acker.html
 
LongHaul101
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Re: British Airways A350-1000 with No First Class

Thu Mar 07, 2019 9:13 pm

The a350 is probably replacing the 777-200 when the 777x comes along and replaces the 747 so the first class is deemed as a waste of space on the a350 but not on the larger 777x which will become BA's secondary flagship.

The lack of first class on these planes makes leads me to believe that some of them will be positioned on BA's leisure network out of Gatwick
 
Arion640
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Re: British Airways A350-1000 with No First Class

Thu Mar 07, 2019 9:21 pm

george77300 wrote:
Arion640 wrote:
george77300 wrote:

BA A350s WILL HAVE FIRST CLASS

The FIRST A350s won’t. They are 3 class. The second batch will be 4 class.


Is there a source that some will arrive with F?


I don't know if I'm going mad but I recognize your username from FlyerTalk?

It was mentioned on the BA forum there from some insiders so very believable.

Either search this thread or post a question. Here is the specific BA Fleet thread (info in the wiki there too) Source: https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/british ... acker.html


I am indeed on flyertalk and active on the BA forum but not under this username. Thanks for that.
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ramzi
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Re: British Airways A350-1000 with No First Class

Thu Mar 07, 2019 9:42 pm

LongHaul101 wrote:
The a350 is probably replacing the 777-200 when the 777x comes along and replaces the 747 so the first class is deemed as a waste of space on the a350 but not on the larger 777x which will become BA's secondary flagship.

The lack of first class on these planes makes leads me to believe that some of them will be positioned on BA's leisure network out of Gatwick


The entire A35K fleet will be based out of Heathrow. If anything, they are replacing, with some variation, the low-J 747s. Although all of the recent orders and seat arrangements indicate that this entire fleet renewal is anything but a one for one replacement. I am very curious to see where each type flies, and whether the 772s will really stay as long as BA currently claims.
There will come a time when you believe everything is finished - that will be the beginning.
 
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Revelation
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Re: British Airways A350-1000 with No First Class

Fri Jun 07, 2019 2:56 pm

Now, out of the paint hangar:

Image
Wake up to find out that you are the eyes of the world
The heart has its beaches, its homeland and thoughts of its own
Wake now, discover that you are the song that the morning brings
The heart has its seasons, its evenings and songs of its own
 
musman9853
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Re: British Airways A350-1000 with No First Class

Fri Jun 07, 2019 3:17 pm

Revelation wrote:
Now, out of the paint hangar:

Image


man the a350 cockpit just looks weird to me. everything else is great.
Welcome to the City Beautiful.
 
Armodeen
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Re: British Airways A350-1000 with No First Class

Fri Jun 07, 2019 3:38 pm

What a beauty
 
ikramerica
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Re: British Airways A350-1000 with No First Class

Fri Jun 07, 2019 3:42 pm

flipdewaf wrote:
Business today is essentially what first was 10-15 years ago and the business of 10-15 years ago is the same as what a lot of y+ is today. The corporate contracts of people in business has seen a slide into the world of first class tickets and first class prices with only a name staying similar, the airlines are laughing all the way to the bank (as are the passengers who aren’t paying). The 3 classes are the same as they ever were, they just have different names.

Whilst I haven’t flown on BAs business product I would say it’s fundamentals aren’t bad but it does look tired and in need of some glamming up.

Not entirely surprised there is no F going in, if I was running an airline like BA I wouldn’t be putting on F by default.

Fred


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

No. Not true. 20-25 years. Even then BA had club world cradle seats while Y+ has a footrest.
Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
 
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Revelation
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Re: British Airways A350-1000 with No First Class

Fri Jun 07, 2019 3:44 pm

Armodeen wrote:
What a beauty

I have a hard time deciding if I like the longer variants (351, 781) over the baseline variants (359, 789).

I guess I'll go with "size matters!".
Wake up to find out that you are the eyes of the world
The heart has its beaches, its homeland and thoughts of its own
Wake now, discover that you are the song that the morning brings
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sabby
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Re: British Airways A350-1000 with No First Class

Fri Jun 07, 2019 3:46 pm

Revelation wrote:
Armodeen wrote:
What a beauty

I have a hard time deciding if I like the longer variants (351, 781) over the baseline variants (359, 789).

I guess I'll go with "size matters!".

I'm one of the rare people who like A35K and 788 over their sisters.
 
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rida79
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Re: British Airways A350-1000 with No First Class

Fri Jun 07, 2019 3:59 pm

musman9853 wrote:
Revelation wrote:
Now, out of the paint hangar:

Image


man the a350 cockpit just looks weird to me. everything else is great.



I agree with you 100%: that is one weird (and ugly) looking cockpit.
 
Skyguy
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Re: British Airways A350-1000 with No First Class

Fri Jun 07, 2019 5:00 pm

Lots of complaints above about how BA Business Class is of poor standard and those with opposing views who think it's the best ever. Only way to really make an informed opinion is from having traveled recently on a variety of different carriers in both long and medium haul and being able to discern the difference in both hard product (seats/cabin) and soft product (crew/food/drink) etc., and focusing on service onboard rather than on the ground. Having spent a significant amount of time in J on all sorts of carriers, my (humble) opinion is that BA has lost the "edge" it once had as lead purveyor of a premium J product. There are other airlines that do it better, and while no one is perfect, the entire "package" that is experienced by customers is surpassed by quite a few airlines compared to what BA now offers.
Having become used to the 1-2-1 layout on widebody aircraft of several airlines, it seems quite jarring to see the 2-4-2 lay out that BA has in it's class, the general feel and experience is that of being more cramped and less space available to get comfortable in. Apart from the nuances of the existing seats that for all sense of purposes will retain the same footprint in the future when the new J class seats are installed, the layout will remain 2-4-2 and I don't know how this is logically supposed to be superior to the 1-2-1 that is currently offered on several airlines. Second, I have had mixed experiences with cabin crew on BA in J. Some individual members are more approachable and pay more attention to customers than others, while others are matter-of-fact about their jobs, get it done and have little incentive to exceed their set job tasks. These things are noticeable in small things like how often crew members come down aisles checking on passengers, removing used service items, offering anything that maybe needed etc. I understand that the concept of hospitality is different one Middle Eastern and Asian airlines and for European/US airlines, the approach and manner of service delivery is markedly different, but even within that, I have found that generally speaking the BA crew have a lot of catching up to do. There are many reasons why it's like this and I would not want to get into it here, but I find the comments above that BA's J class, both hard and soft product, are above others and beyond reproach somewhat far fetched and ill-informed.
"Those who talk, do not know, and those who know, do not talk."
 
subramak1
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Re: British Airways A350-1000 with No First Class

Fri Jun 07, 2019 5:18 pm

george77300 wrote:
waly777 wrote:
cedarjet wrote:
Nothing wrong with Club World, fully flat beds and more privacy in the window seats than SQ Suites. “Sad sad shadow” is ridiculous.


Nothing wrong with club world? You do realise it's been the same product for over a decade? So old that the competitors J has leaped frog theirs and is on par with/sometimes better than their F. The seat width is not that great, 8AB in J is appalling.


The BA Club World Window seats are great for night flights. A wide and long bed with very good privacy. Something you dont get on most.

The BA soft product is very good now too. The food, bedding and crew are all usually excellent. However the big problem of the current seat is lack of storage (basically none) and direct aisle access. Hopefully if both get sorted it should be good. Possibly a bit like the Apex Suites on JAL/OmanAir/Gulf Air.


I disagree having flown Club world in 747 400, 787 and then flown American's business class in 77W. There is a world of difference. In club world upper deck window seats are comfortable as you get additional space. 787 is club world is cramped but I guess better than 777 or 747 lower deck especially the dreaded middle pair. Given AA or CX or even now defunct 9W style J seats over club world anyday

Subu
 
YouGeeElWhy
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Re: British Airways A350-1000 with No First Class

Fri Jun 07, 2019 5:29 pm

Skyguy wrote:
Lots of complaints above about how BA Business Class is of poor standard and those with opposing views who think it's the best ever. Only way to really make an informed opinion is from having traveled recently on a variety of different carriers in both long and medium haul and being able to discern the difference in both hard product (seats/cabin) and soft product (crew/food/drink) etc., and focusing on service onboard rather than on the ground. Having spent a significant amount of time in J on all sorts of carriers, my (humble) opinion is that BA has lost the "edge" it once had as lead purveyor of a premium J product. There are other airlines that do it better, and while no one is perfect, the entire "package" that is experienced by customers is surpassed by quite a few airlines compared to what BA now offers.
Having become used to the 1-2-1 layout on widebody aircraft of several airlines, it seems quite jarring to see the 2-4-2 lay out that BA has in it's class, the general feel and experience is that of being more cramped and less space available to get comfortable in. Apart from the nuances of the existing seats that for all sense of purposes will retain the same footprint in the future when the new J class seats are installed, the layout will remain 2-4-2 and I don't know how this is logically supposed to be superior to the 1-2-1 that is currently offered on several airlines. Second, I have had mixed experiences with cabin crew on BA in J. Some individual members are more approachable and pay more attention to customers than others, while others are matter-of-fact about their jobs, get it done and have little incentive to exceed their set job tasks. These things are noticeable in small things like how often crew members come down aisles checking on passengers, removing used service items, offering anything that maybe needed etc. I understand that the concept of hospitality is different one Middle Eastern and Asian airlines and for European/US airlines, the approach and manner of service delivery is markedly different, but even within that, I have found that generally speaking the BA crew have a lot of catching up to do. There are many reasons why it's like this and I would not want to get into it here, but I find the comments above that BA's J class, both hard and soft product, are above others and beyond reproach somewhat far fetched and ill-informed.
In the immortal words of Hank Hill, "hwhat"? I guess you missed the memo about the new Club Suites (Reverse Herringbone Super Diamond with a bloody door) that is premiering on this exact plane in this thread. BA soft product is pretty darn good (their new bedding is arguably the best in J) and with the seat upgrade will lead the US3/EU3 and only be behind a few Asian carriers. Personally, I enjoy the BA's cabin crew, but I know others feel differently.
 
APYu
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Re: British Airways A350-1000 with No First Class

Fri Jun 07, 2019 6:15 pm

Revelation wrote:
Armodeen wrote:
What a beauty

I have a hard time deciding if I like the longer variants (351, 781) over the baseline variants (359, 789).

I guess I'll go with "size matters!".

You’ll prefer the shorter aircraft if you’re on BA flight at the back of the new ultra long Club cabin (A351) waiting for a hand run glass of wine to go with your hand delivered meal from the front galley which is now so far away. The new slow Club World Service is about to get even slower.
We'd like to welcome in particular our Executive Club members and those joining us from our Oneworld alliance partners.
 
strfyr51
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Re: British Airways A350-1000 with No First Class

Fri Jun 07, 2019 6:21 pm

Web500sjc wrote:
One has to question how much longer international first class will be around if BA are not putting it on thier new flagship.



What the greater question IS? Is anyone actually PAYING to FLY First Class?? British may not be installing it if they're already giving it AWAY ....
Does that make Sense to any of you? After all? This is a profit center, isn't it still?
 
strfyr51
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Re: British Airways A350-1000 with No First Class

Fri Jun 07, 2019 6:26 pm

Arion640 wrote:
xxcr wrote:
Arion640 wrote:

It is not premium economy. What premium economy anywhere in the world gives you a flat bed? These days flat beds define long haul business class.

A poor business class seat, Yes. A premium economy seat, certainly not.



Read my post! i said a high end premium economy........ i know its not premium Economy


It’s not a premium economy of any sort.



Soo?? What is Premium Economy? A Little Extra Leg Room Like Economy Plus on United? If the seat isn't wider? Then it's ECONOMY!! Period!!
 
UAEflyer
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Re: British Airways A350-1000 with No First Class

Fri Jun 07, 2019 6:37 pm

So BA will fly A350 to DXB ,, where else?
 
YouGeeElWhy
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Re: British Airways A350-1000 with No First Class

Fri Jun 07, 2019 6:49 pm

UAEflyer wrote:
So BA will fly A350 to DXB ,, where else?
YYZ, TLV, BLR
 
UAEflyer
Posts: 1205
Joined: Thu Nov 02, 2006 8:29 pm

Re: British Airways A350-1000 with No First Class

Fri Jun 07, 2019 6:57 pm

YouGeeElWhy wrote:
UAEflyer wrote:
So BA will fly A350 to DXB ,, where else?
YYZ, TLV, BLR

Weird that no US city getting A350
 
sabby
Posts: 306
Joined: Fri Jun 01, 2018 5:11 pm

Re: British Airways A350-1000 with No First Class

Fri Jun 07, 2019 7:04 pm

UAEflyer wrote:
YouGeeElWhy wrote:
UAEflyer wrote:
So BA will fly A350 to DXB ,, where else?
YYZ, TLV, BLR

Weird that no US city getting A350

Probably because they are currently served by 789 or 77W which have first class or 744 which will be replaced by 779/A35K with first class. The first batch of A35Ks don't have first class.
 
speedbird52
Posts: 750
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Re: British Airways A350-1000 with No First Class

Fri Jun 07, 2019 7:55 pm

xxcr wrote:
Arion640 wrote:
xxcr wrote:


Read my post! i said a high end premium economy........ i know its not premium Economy


It’s not a premium economy of any sort.


you guys are killing me! i know its not premium economy!

the reason im comparing BA business J seats to Premium economy is the layout. 2-4-2 layout with no storage space, minimal privacy (even with the divider), AVOD systems needs a major overhaul, and the service could use some sort of improvement.

It certainly had more storage than Emirates 2-3-2 Business or Turkish 2-2-2 Business. The seats are in no way comparable to premium economy. What premium economy gives you a fully flat bad, or 73 inch seat pitch? People complain about BA Club World seats far too much. It isn't the best or most cutting edge product out there, and there are many problems with it, but people act like it is the worst product in the sky.
 
Arion640
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Re: British Airways A350-1000 with No First Class

Fri Jun 07, 2019 10:06 pm

strfyr51 wrote:
Arion640 wrote:
xxcr wrote:


Read my post! i said a high end premium economy........ i know its not premium Economy


It’s not a premium economy of any sort.



Soo?? What is Premium Economy? A Little Extra Leg Room Like Economy Plus on United? If the seat isn't wider? Then it's ECONOMY!! Period!!


What on earth are you talking about?

The poster was trying to say BA’s lie flat business class was a Premium Economy product.
223 319 320 321 333 346 359 388 733 73G 738 744 752 753 763 764 772 77E 773 77W 788 789 MD83 E145 E175 E195 RJ85 F70 DH8C DH8D AT75

Brexit - It’s time for global Britain.
 
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Stitch
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Re: British Airways A350-1000 with No First Class

Fri Jun 07, 2019 10:20 pm

george77300 wrote:
BA A350s WILL HAVE FIRST CLASS. The FIRST A350s won’t. They are 3 class. The second batch will be 4 class.


Well the 18 they have on order will all be delivered with Club World, World Traveller Plus and World Traveller.

So unless they place a follow-on order (which they may do), the fleet as currently envisioned will only have three classes.
 
Arion640
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Re: British Airways A350-1000 with No First Class

Fri Jun 07, 2019 10:23 pm

Stitch wrote:
george77300 wrote:
BA A350s WILL HAVE FIRST CLASS. The FIRST A350s won’t. They are 3 class. The second batch will be 4 class.


Well the 18 they have on order will all be delivered with Club World, World Traveller Plus and World Traveller.

So unless they place a follow-on order (which they may do), the fleet as currently envisioned will only have three classes.


Off the top of my head they do have options for more. There’s potential to convert them to A359 for 777-200 replacement in the future though I’d of thought.
223 319 320 321 333 346 359 388 733 73G 738 744 752 753 763 764 772 77E 773 77W 788 789 MD83 E145 E175 E195 RJ85 F70 DH8C DH8D AT75

Brexit - It’s time for global Britain.
 
EChid
Posts: 528
Joined: Fri Nov 03, 2017 4:00 am

Re: British Airways A350-1000 with No First Class

Sat Jun 08, 2019 1:58 am

Stitch wrote:
george77300 wrote:
BA A350s WILL HAVE FIRST CLASS. The FIRST A350s won’t. They are 3 class. The second batch will be 4 class.


Well the 18 they have on order will all be delivered with Club World, World Traveller Plus and World Traveller.

So unless they place a follow-on order (which they may do), the fleet as currently envisioned will only have three classes.

Considering their new Business seat arguably surpasses their current F class seat, I don't think that is a problem.
2018: DRW-PER-HKG-ICN-MEL-AVV-BNE-OOL-SYD-YYZ-YYZ-YUL-YVR-PDX-SEA-SFO-PEK-KIX-CDG-IST-NRT-HND-BKK-FAT; AC J-TK J-OZ F-DL F-TG J/F-NH J/F-CX J-VA J
 
mutu
Posts: 472
Joined: Tue Mar 21, 2006 7:04 am

Re: British Airways A350-1000 with No First Class

Sat Jun 08, 2019 9:53 am

As a point of interest there are numerous mathematical and geometric ways to compare BA 2 42 with others 1 2 1 to demonstrate that for the same amount of cabin floor they are broadly the same.

Count heads in a row and its x4 on Baand 4 on others
Count feet in a row and its x4.
The difference is where you place your feet. In a box or not in a box.
Yes BA configurationmay look and feel a bit cramped but as a bed (surely its primary purpose) it is one of the most comfortable out there
 
mutu
Posts: 472
Joined: Tue Mar 21, 2006 7:04 am

Re: British Airways A350-1000 with No First Class

Sat Jun 08, 2019 9:53 am

As a point of interest there are numerous mathematical and geometric ways to compare BA 2 42 with others 1 2 1 to demonstrate that for the same amount of cabin floor they are broadly the same.

Count heads in a row and its x4 on Baand 4 on others
Count feet in a row and its x4.
The difference is where you place your feet. In a box or not in a box.
Yes BA configurationmay look and feel a bit cramped but as a bed (surely its primary purpose) it is one of the most comfortable out there
 
AIRT0M
Posts: 65
Joined: Thu Mar 01, 2018 8:54 am

Re: British Airways A350-1000 with No First Class

Sat Jun 08, 2019 10:19 am

Noshow wrote:
Lufthansa has not had first class seating installed on their A350 as well.
But they have first on their 747-8 and they will likely have it on their 777-9, however just four seats. Seems to be related to cabin diameter and how much space you are ready to "waste" as you must top business class that includes suite like compartments today on many carriers.


LH doesn't have F on their A350 because they're being used out of MUC only. Before LH moved some A380 to MUC there wasn't supposed to be any F out if MUC anymore.
 
kennyomg
Posts: 17
Joined: Fri Dec 31, 2010 9:28 pm

Re: British Airways A350-1000 with No First Class

Sat Jun 08, 2019 11:23 am

AIRT0M wrote:
Noshow wrote:
LH doesn't have F on their A350 because they're being used out of MUC only. Before LH moved some A380 to MUC there wasn't supposed to be any F out if MUC anymore.

This is quite inaccurate. They do have loads of 346s based in MUC with F and they do and will want to capture the Bavarian high rollers. Also evidenced by the enormous (compared to the previous) F lounge in the T2 satellite.
 
EChid
Posts: 528
Joined: Fri Nov 03, 2017 4:00 am

Re: British Airways A350-1000 with No First Class

Sun Jun 09, 2019 3:48 pm

kennyomg wrote:
AIRT0M wrote:
Noshow wrote:
LH doesn't have F on their A350 because they're being used out of MUC only. Before LH moved some A380 to MUC there wasn't supposed to be any F out if MUC anymore.

This is quite inaccurate. They do have loads of 346s based in MUC with F and they do and will want to capture the Bavarian high rollers. Also evidenced by the enormous (compared to the previous) F lounge in the T2 satellite.

In fact, Munich is the more wealthy area of the country compared to Frankfurt. From and O/D perspective (and increasingly via transfers, given the new focus they have placed on MUC in the last few years), F class has very nice odds at MUC.
2018: DRW-PER-HKG-ICN-MEL-AVV-BNE-OOL-SYD-YYZ-YYZ-YUL-YVR-PDX-SEA-SFO-PEK-KIX-CDG-IST-NRT-HND-BKK-FAT; AC J-TK J-OZ F-DL F-TG J/F-NH J/F-CX J-VA J

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