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Re: WOW Financial Discussion Thread

Posted: Sat Dec 15, 2018 9:15 pm
by aemoreira1981
workhorse wrote:
Does anyone have an idea on which frames are going and which are staying?


They're down to 16 planes right now. TF-GAY is definitely going back to ICBC. I'd expect the A20N to go back as well, and as for A321s...possibly some of the four UTair-owned frames (lease managed by Vnesheconombank), which would then be re-marketed on UTair's behalf. (UTair also owns 4 of Airblue's 5 A321s, and I believe 1 of Air Travel's 2 A321s; another one to Air Travel plus two A321s now with S7 were sold to other lessors).

Re: WOW Financial Discussion Thread

Posted: Sat Dec 15, 2018 9:41 pm
by workhorse
aemoreira1981 wrote:
They're down to 16 planes right now. TF-GAY is definitely going back to ICBC. I'd expect the A20N to go back as well, and as for A321s...possibly some of the four UTair-owned frames (lease managed by Vnesheconombank), which would then be re-marketed on UTair's behalf. (UTair also owns 4 of Airblue's 5 A321s, and I believe 1 of Air Travel's 2 A321s; another one to Air Travel plus two A321s now with S7 were sold to other lessors).


Totally agree about the 320. It's an oddball in the fleet now and because it is probably easy to re-market because it's a neo.

As for the 321s, I guess the two neos are the easiest to re-market but maybe Wow would like to keep them for KEF-YVR if it restarts indeed.

Do you think that VEB are easier to negotiate with than with other lessors?

Re: WOW Financial Discussion Thread

Posted: Sat Dec 15, 2018 10:23 pm
by Natflyer
aemoreira1981 wrote:
workhorse wrote:
Does anyone have an idea on which frames are going and which are staying?


They're down to 16 planes right now. TF-GAY is definitely going back to ICBC. I'd expect the A20N to go back as well, and as for A321s...possibly some of the four UTair-owned frames (lease managed by Vnesheconombank), which would then be re-marketed on UTair's behalf. (UTair also owns 4 of Airblue's 5 A321s, and I believe 1 of Air Travel's 2 A321s; another one to Air Travel plus two A321s now with S7 were sold to other lessors).


TF-GPA positioned to MIA on Dec 3rd and has not flown since. Someone mentioned a wet-lease, but it is taking its time. Repaint? Or being returned?

Re: WOW Financial Discussion Thread

Posted: Sat Dec 15, 2018 10:29 pm
by aemoreira1981
Natflyer wrote:
aemoreira1981 wrote:
workhorse wrote:
Does anyone have an idea on which frames are going and which are staying?


They're down to 16 planes right now. TF-GAY is definitely going back to ICBC. I'd expect the A20N to go back as well, and as for A321s...possibly some of the four UTair-owned frames (lease managed by Vnesheconombank), which would then be re-marketed on UTair's behalf. (UTair also owns 4 of Airblue's 5 A321s, and I believe 1 of Air Travel's 2 A321s; another one to Air Travel plus two A321s now with S7 were sold to other lessors).


TF-GPA positioned to MIA on Dec 3rd and has not flown since. Someone mentioned a wet-lease, but it is taking its time. Repaint? Or being returned?


That was a LATAM NTU originally. The lessor was ALC, but were they managing the frame for LATAM, with LATAM now ready to take back the frame?

Re: WOW Financial Discussion Thread

Posted: Thu Dec 20, 2018 4:37 pm
by arcticcruiser
Wow air claims to have sold Gatwick slots but declines to name buyer and price.
https://www.mbl.is/vidskipti/frettir/20 ... a_gatwick/

How much can this be worth (AFAIK 8 slots) and who could the buyer be?

They claim relocating to STN gives them the opportunity to grow in the UK market. Rrrright.

Re: WOW Financial Discussion Thread

Posted: Thu Dec 20, 2018 7:19 pm
by SurfandSnow
arcticcruiser wrote:
Wow air claims to have sold Gatwick slots but declines to name buyer and price.
https://www.mbl.is/vidskipti/frettir/20 ... a_gatwick/

How much can this be worth (AFAIK 8 slots) and who could the buyer be?

They claim relocating to STN gives them the opportunity to grow in the UK market. Rrrright.


I see the process of shifting ops to a cheaper alternative has begun. I've never understood how or why such an ULCC airline would operate from such congested, costly primary airports. It will be interesting to see if this also happens in the U.S... why go head to head with 2 competitors on the KEF-EWR route when they serve the Tri-State Area market via (a) hassle-free niche airport(s) like SWF and/or ISP instead?!?

Re: WOW Financial Discussion Thread

Posted: Fri Dec 21, 2018 11:26 am
by SRQKEF
4 A321s have been sold to Air Canada, apparently they're all aircraft that joined the fleet in 2014:

http://www.visir.is/g/2018181229776/fjo ... air-canada

Re: WOW Financial Discussion Thread

Posted: Fri Dec 21, 2018 12:09 pm
by pmanni1
SurfandSnow wrote:
arcticcruiser wrote:
Wow air claims to have sold Gatwick slots but declines to name buyer and price.
https://www.mbl.is/vidskipti/frettir/20 ... a_gatwick/

How much can this be worth (AFAIK 8 slots) and who could the buyer be?

They claim relocating to STN gives them the opportunity to grow in the UK market. Rrrright.


I see the process of shifting ops to a cheaper alternative has begun. I've never understood how or why such an ULCC airline would operate from such congested, costly primary airports. It will be interesting to see if this also happens in the U.S... why go head to head with 2 competitors on the KEF-EWR route when they serve the Tri-State Area market via (a) hassle-free niche airport(s) like SWF and/or ISP instead?!?

Congested is the key word. Foreign carriers need to be wear the population is. Foreign travelers don't want to land at airports that are nearly 2 hours from Manhattan. Not even sure if these airports have customs.

Re: WOW Financial Discussion Thread

Posted: Fri Dec 21, 2018 12:57 pm
by fcogafa
arcticcruiser wrote:
Wow air claims to have sold Gatwick slots but declines to name buyer and price.


Rumoured to be Wizz Air who are starting a LGW-BUD service with the slots

Re: WOW Financial Discussion Thread

Posted: Fri Dec 21, 2018 1:24 pm
by hvusslax
arcticcruiser wrote:
They claim relocating to STN gives them the opportunity to grow in the UK market. Rrrright.


I sometimes wonder if the people writing these corporate releases actually realize how incredibly ridiculous they can sound. How is it possible say with a straight face that relocating to a less convenient London airport is somehow an "opportunity to grow"?

Re: WOW Financial Discussion Thread

Posted: Fri Dec 21, 2018 2:03 pm
by Newbiepilot
fcogafa wrote:
arcticcruiser wrote:
Wow air claims to have sold Gatwick slots but declines to name buyer and price.


Rumoured to be Wizz Air who are starting a LGW-BUD service with the slots


Could Indigo Partners be coming in to raid/purchase some of WOW’s assets?

Re: WOW Financial Discussion Thread

Posted: Sun Dec 23, 2018 11:10 pm
by debonair
nomorerjs wrote:
WW won’t be flying by summer 2019. Every week or every two weeks they cut a route or two. It’s only a matter of time before BWI and DTW are cut and than it will end.


DTW is now gone as well, after Los Angeles, San Francisco, New York JFK already axed.
https://eu.usatoday.com/story/travel/fl ... 397088002/

Re: WOW Financial Discussion Thread

Posted: Mon Dec 24, 2018 1:50 am
by Lapplander800
debonair wrote:
DTW is now gone as well, after Los Angeles, San Francisco, New York JFK already axed.
https://eu.usatoday.com/story/travel/fl ... 397088002/


I read in that article; DFW cancelled, DTW remaining.

Re: WOW Financial Discussion Thread

Posted: Mon Dec 24, 2018 4:19 am
by F27500
and how do we say "Liquidation" in Icelandic?

Re: WOW Financial Discussion Thread

Posted: Mon Dec 24, 2018 9:26 am
by bennett123
How many aircraft do they own?.

However, I can see that STN could be cheaper/more profitable than LTW. It is also a slightly shorter flight.

SRQKEF

Which A321 joined in 2014?.

Re: WOW Financial Discussion Thread

Posted: Mon Dec 24, 2018 10:24 am
by arcticcruiser
bennett123 wrote:
How many aircraft do they own?.


Not a single one really, all on various types of leases.

Re: WOW Financial Discussion Thread

Posted: Mon Dec 24, 2018 1:11 pm
by SRQKEF
F27500 wrote:
and how do we say "Liquidation" in Icelandic?


Gjaldþrot. ;)

bennett123 wrote:
SRQKEF
Which A321 joined in 2014?.


The first A321s joined in 2015, but TF-KID, -SON, -DAD and -MOM are all 2013- or 2014-builds. The rest of the fleet consists of newer aircraft, so those are probably the four aircraft.

Re: WOW Financial Discussion Thread

Posted: Mon Dec 24, 2018 1:31 pm
by bennett123
Google translation

WOW air has sold four Airbus aircraft to the airline Air Canada. The announcement from the company states that WOW's cash position will improve by USD 12 million, about ISK 1.4 billion, through the sale.

"The board of WOW air has approved this transaction, but this sale is part of the restructuring of the company, but the fleet has been reduced in order to increase efficiency, reduce the seasonal fluctuation and maximize profitability.

These are Airbus A321 engines that WOW air has been on lease since 2014. The machines will be delivered in January 2019, ”the announcement says.

According to Skúli Mogensen, CEO and founder of WOW air, this is a very positive and important step in the company's restructuring, as the fleet is being reduced and the company's liquidity is improved.

Part of the streamlining measures announced by WOW in recent weeks, in conjunction with the company's adaptation to Indigo Partners LLC's operating model, was airline cutbacks. The airline's fleet is expected to decrease by half, leaving 11 aircraft remaining.

At the end of last month, it was also reported that WOW would dispose of four Airbus engines, two Airbus A320s and two Airbus A330s - "engines that would not have been useful in the WOW air winter program," as it was termed . There were two of the smallest aircraft in the fleet and two of them were the largest.

Re: WOW Financial Discussion Thread

Posted: Mon Dec 24, 2018 2:02 pm
by debonair
bennett123 wrote:
WOW air has sold four Airbus aircraft to the airline Air Canada.


One of the affected aircraft, TF-MOM, is subleased to ARUBA AIRLINES... Will be interesting to see, what will happen!

https://www.flightradar24.com/data/aircraft/tf-mom

Re: WOW Financial Discussion Thread

Posted: Mon Dec 24, 2018 3:34 pm
by bennett123
There is a second thread on this subject with a link to ch aviation.

They indicate the same four aircraft.

Re: WOW Financial Discussion Thread

Posted: Mon Dec 24, 2018 7:37 pm
by workhorse
Sorry, I must be missing something, but how Wow can sell anything to Air Canada? They don't own any of these planes, VEB does, right?

So should we rather read this article as "Wow managed to get out of the leasing contract with VEB and VEB leased these planes to Air Canada." or as "Wow managed to get out of the leasing contract with VEB and VEB sold these planes to Air Canada."?

Re: WOW Financial Discussion Thread

Posted: Mon Dec 24, 2018 7:44 pm
by Pe@rson
Four A321s - TF-MOM, -DAD, -KID, -SON - are on finance leases, the others - including 320s and 330s - are all on dry leases. Source: slide 15 of https://kjarninn.overcastcdn.com/docume ... esound.pdf

Re: WOW Financial Discussion Thread

Posted: Mon Dec 24, 2018 9:08 pm
by william
So if one was a passenger on the new cancelled flights, do they get a refund, rebooked by WOW? In all my years of flying I have never ran into this situation before.

Re: WOW Financial Discussion Thread

Posted: Mon Dec 24, 2018 10:52 pm
by debonair
william wrote:
So if one was a passenger on the new cancelled flights, do they get a refund, rebooked by WOW? In all my years of flying I have never ran into this situation before.


Refund only, rebooking under EU law AFAIK within 14days b4 departure date. But none route is cancelled less than 14days to go.

Re: WOW Financial Discussion Thread

Posted: Mon Dec 24, 2018 11:19 pm
by Speedalive
Pe@rson wrote:
Four A321s - TF-MOM, -DAD, -KID, -SON - are on finance leases, the others - including 320s and 330s - are all on dry leases. Source: slide 15 of https://kjarninn.overcastcdn.com/docume ... esound.pdf

Sending away the whole family lol

Re: WOW Financial Discussion Thread

Posted: Tue Dec 25, 2018 1:57 pm
by SRQKEF
Speedalive wrote:
Pe@rson wrote:
Four A321s - TF-MOM, -DAD, -KID, -SON - are on finance leases, the others - including 320s and 330s - are all on dry leases. Source: slide 15 of https://kjarninn.overcastcdn.com/docume ... esound.pdf

Sending away the whole family lol


Poor grandma, grandpa and the pets (-GMA, -GPA, -DOG, -CAT) are the only ones left! ;)

A320s -BRO and -SIS have already left the fleet as well.

Re: WOW Financial Discussion Thread

Posted: Tue Dec 25, 2018 4:13 pm
by Ryanair01
workhorse wrote:
Sorry, I must be missing something, but how Wow can sell anything to Air Canada? They don't own any of these planes, VEB does, right?

So should we rather read this article as "Wow managed to get out of the leasing contract with VEB and VEB leased these planes to Air Canada." or as "Wow managed to get out of the leasing contract with VEB and VEB sold these planes to Air Canada."?


No not quite. These aircraft are funded by a Finance Lease, which is (kind of) like a mortgage. A Finance Lease is treated like a type of loan, but (typically) the lessee (i.e. Wow) doesn't get ownership until all the money is paid fully off, when they (again typically) can choose to either (a) for a nominal fee take full ownership or (b) return the aircraft. VEB owns the Finance Lease, but typically the aircraft is considered the lessee's asset sat on their balance sheet, with future payments classed as a liability.

So essentially Air Canada is buying from Wow, the right to own these aircraft outright when the lease period runs out (which has a value), the aircraft will be classed as Air Canada's assets when they take delivery, although in the meantime they'll need to pay VEB's charges.

I've simplified it, but that's broadly what you'd expect.

Re: WOW Financial Discussion Thread

Posted: Tue Dec 25, 2018 4:50 pm
by minilinde
Very interesting to read through the financial presentation. I know that it is prior to the sell off of "assets" and down-scaling in general... They "expected" a +12 % RASK improvement which is really ridicules. Will be interesting to see how they will spin it next time around, if there will be a next time that is...

Re: WOW Financial Discussion Thread

Posted: Tue Dec 25, 2018 5:04 pm
by Jshank83
Can someone sum up all what has happened. I can go thru the thread and try to piece it all together but if I could get a summary that would be great.

Parts I am trying to figure out:

What North American airports are they still going to have service to next summer?
How many planes will they have left now? Still the 11? or is it less?

Re: WOW Financial Discussion Thread

Posted: Tue Dec 25, 2018 5:51 pm
by minilinde
Jshank83 wrote:
What North American airports are they still going to have service to next summer?
How many planes will they have left now? Still the 11? or is it less?


Q1: I don't have the complete list, but they have axed JFK, SFO and LAX.
Q2: No, the 4 aircraft that are leaving for AC is part of the 9 aircraft leaving. The fleet is going from 20 to 11.

Re: WOW Financial Discussion Thread

Posted: Tue Dec 25, 2018 6:20 pm
by SRQKEF
Jshank83 wrote:
Can someone sum up all what has happened. I can go thru the thread and try to piece it all together but if I could get a summary that would be great.

Parts I am trying to figure out:

What North American airports are they still going to have service to next summer?
How many planes will they have left now? Still the 11? or is it less?


AFAIK, it's EWR, BWI, YYZ, YUL, DTW and BOS.

They've axed JFK, ORD, STL, CLE, CVG, PIT, DFW, YVR, MCO, DFW, SFO and LAX. They also once served MIA for a year or so.

Re: WOW Financial Discussion Thread

Posted: Tue Dec 25, 2018 7:16 pm
by Natflyer
debonair wrote:
william wrote:
So if one was a passenger on the new cancelled flights, do they get a refund, rebooked by WOW? In all my years of flying I have never ran into this situation before.


Refund only, rebooking under EU law AFAIK within 14days b4 departure date. But none route is cancelled less than 14days to go.


No. ICETRA, the Icelandic Transport Authority has decided WOW air must EITHER offer ALTERNATE flights OR refund as the customer wishes. Gonna’ cost them dearly.

Re: WOW Financial Discussion Thread

Posted: Tue Dec 25, 2018 9:28 pm
by Jshank83
SRQKEF wrote:

AFAIK, it's EWR, BWI, YYZ, YUL, DTW and BOS.

They've axed JFK, ORD, STL, CLE, CVG, PIT, DFW, YVR, MCO, DFW, SFO and LAX. They also once served MIA for a year or so.


minilinde wrote:

Q1: I don't have the complete list, but they have axed JFK, SFO and LAX.
Q2: No, the 4 aircraft that are leaving for AC is part of the 9 aircraft leaving. The fleet is going from 20 to 11.


Thanks for clearing all that up.

Re: WOW Financial Discussion Thread

Posted: Wed Dec 26, 2018 12:54 pm
by workhorse
Ryanair01 wrote:
These aircraft are funded by a Finance Lease, which is (kind of) like a mortgage. A Finance Lease is treated like a type of loan, but (typically) the lessee (i.e. Wow) doesn't get ownership until all the money is paid fully off, when they (again typically) can choose to either (a) for a nominal fee take full ownership or (b) return the aircraft. VEB owns the Finance Lease, but typically the aircraft is considered the lessee's asset sat on their balance sheet, with future payments classed as a liability.

So essentially Air Canada is buying from Wow, the right to own these aircraft outright when the lease period runs out (which has a value), the aircraft will be classed as Air Canada's assets when they take delivery, although in the meantime they'll need to pay VEB's charges.

I've simplified it, but that's broadly what you'd expect.


That's very clear, thank you. Can we assume that the 12 million USD mentioned in the press release is what Air Canada has paid to Wow to buy this right to own these aircraft outright when the lease period runs out?

In other words, does that means that Wow:

1) gets 3 million USD in cash for each aircraft
2) gets rid of further payments to do to VEB

and Air Canada pays:

1) 3 million USD for each aircraft
2) whatever is left to pay to VEB (= total price that Wow agreed with VEB upon - what Wow has already paid)

?

Re: WOW Financial Discussion Thread

Posted: Wed Dec 26, 2018 7:16 pm
by SRQKEF
workhorse wrote:
Ryanair01 wrote:
These aircraft are funded by a Finance Lease, which is (kind of) like a mortgage. A Finance Lease is treated like a type of loan, but (typically) the lessee (i.e. Wow) doesn't get ownership until all the money is paid fully off, when they (again typically) can choose to either (a) for a nominal fee take full ownership or (b) return the aircraft. VEB owns the Finance Lease, but typically the aircraft is considered the lessee's asset sat on their balance sheet, with future payments classed as a liability.

So essentially Air Canada is buying from Wow, the right to own these aircraft outright when the lease period runs out (which has a value), the aircraft will be classed as Air Canada's assets when they take delivery, although in the meantime they'll need to pay VEB's charges.

I've simplified it, but that's broadly what you'd expect.


That's very clear, thank you. Can we assume that the 12 million USD mentioned in the press release is what Air Canada has paid to Wow to buy this right to own these aircraft outright when the lease period runs out?

In other words, does that means that Wow:

1) gets 3 million USD in cash for each aircraft
2) gets rid of further payments to do to VEB

and Air Canada pays:

1) 3 million USD for each aircraft
2) whatever is left to pay to VEB (= total price that Wow agreed with VEB upon - what Wow has already paid)

?


I'd assume that's correct.

Re: WOW Financial Discussion Thread

Posted: Sat Dec 29, 2018 3:31 pm
by caaardiff
This is what is currently on sale on wowair.com. All flights are from a week in June and shown as weekly frequencies.
BOS x7 **
ORD x7
DTW x4
EWR x14 (x7 A330)
BWI x7
YYZ x7 **
YUL x7 **

A321 - AMS x14, TXL x12(**x7 Non Prem), CPH x12 (**x7 Non Prem), DUB x12 (**x7 Non prem), FRA x12 (**x7 Non Prem), CDG x14 (7 on A330), BRU x7, STN x7**
TFS x2, TLV x3,
A320 - EDI x3, ALC x4, BCN x4, DUS x3, LYS x4, MXP x3, ARN x4, WAW x2

According to what's currently on sale the fleet would look like;
2x A320
13x A321 (x5 Non Prem / 7x Prem with 36 rows / 1x Prem with 37 rows)
1x A330
Total:16 aircraft
On a Friday there is a requirement for 2 more aircraft to operate to Europe. With 1 departure to AMS showing A330, when there's already a CDG & EWR, and a rogue European flight on the 1130 bank.
Each day there is currently a requirement of 4 aircraft where they only operate x1 European flight each day. 3 of these are the 1130 departure bank with 1 being the 0600 departure bank.

North America departures vary between 1520-1550, 1720 (YUL) & 2030-2050 (EWR&ORD)

If there is to be a reduction to 11 aircraft, there's likely going to be a lot more schedule changes, mainly to the European departures, to make it fit.

Re: WOW Financial Discussion Thread

Posted: Sat Dec 29, 2018 7:26 pm
by Natflyer
caaardiff wrote:
This is what is currently on sale on wowair.com. All flights are from a week in June and shown as weekly frequencies.
BOS x7 **
ORD x7
DTW x4
EWR x14 (x7 A330)
BWI x7
YYZ x7 **
YUL x7 **

A321 - AMS x14, TXL x12(**x7 Non Prem), CPH x12 (**x7 Non Prem), DUB x12 (**x7 Non prem), FRA x12 (**x7 Non Prem), CDG x14 (7 on A330), BRU x7, STN x7**
TFS x2, TLV x3,
A320 - EDI x3, ALC x4, BCN x4, DUS x3, LYS x4, MXP x3, ARN x4, WAW x2

According to what's currently on sale the fleet would look like;
2x A320
13x A321 (x5 Non Prem / 7x Prem with 36 rows / 1x Prem with 37 rows)
1x A330
Total:16 aircraft
On a Friday there is a requirement for 2 more aircraft to operate to Europe. With 1 departure to AMS showing A330, when there's already a CDG & EWR, and a rogue European flight on the 1130 bank.
Each day there is currently a requirement of 4 aircraft where they only operate x1 European flight each day. 3 of these are the 1130 departure bank with 1 being the 0600 departure bank.

North America departures vary between 1520-1550, 1720 (YUL) & 2030-2050 (EWR&ORD)

If there is to be a reduction to 11 aircraft, there's likely going to be a lot more schedule changes, mainly to the European departures, to make it fit.


This looks like quite a bit more flying than 11 aircraft can make. Looks like more than 170 rotations out of KEF whereas each airplane can make 2 each day excluding some maintenance downtime. And there is not going to be an A330, so this is by no means a final schedule. I actually thought they had dropped ORD.

Re: WOW Financial Discussion Thread

Posted: Sat Dec 29, 2018 7:28 pm
by Natflyer
Natflyer wrote:
caaardiff wrote:
This is what is currently on sale on wowair.com. All flights are from a week in June and shown as weekly frequencies.
BOS x7 **
ORD x7
DTW x4
EWR x14 (x7 A330)
BWI x7
YYZ x7 **
YUL x7 **

A321 - AMS x14, TXL x12(**x7 Non Prem), CPH x12 (**x7 Non Prem), DUB x12 (**x7 Non prem), FRA x12 (**x7 Non Prem), CDG x14 (7 on A330), BRU x7, STN x7**
TFS x2, TLV x3,
A320 - EDI x3, ALC x4, BCN x4, DUS x3, LYS x4, MXP x3, ARN x4, WAW x2

According to what's currently on sale the fleet would look like;
2x A320
13x A321 (x5 Non Prem / 7x Prem with 36 rows / 1x Prem with 37 rows)
1x A330
Total:16 aircraft
On a Friday there is a requirement for 2 more aircraft to operate to Europe. With 1 departure to AMS showing A330, when there's already a CDG & EWR, and a rogue European flight on the 1130 bank.
Each day there is currently a requirement of 4 aircraft where they only operate x1 European flight each day. 3 of these are the 1130 departure bank with 1 being the 0600 departure bank.

North America departures vary between 1520-1550, 1720 (YUL) & 2030-2050 (EWR&ORD)

If there is to be a reduction to 11 aircraft, there's likely going to be a lot more schedule changes, mainly to the European departures, to make it fit.


This looks like quite a bit more flying than 11 aircraft can make. Looks like more than 170 rotations out of KEF whereas each airplane can make 2 each day excluding some maintenance downtime. And there is not going to be an A330, so this is by no means a final schedule. I actually thought they had dropped ORD per post above. I also doubt they will operate two banks with the smaller fleet.

Re: WOW Financial Discussion Thread

Posted: Thu Jan 03, 2019 7:10 pm
by klm617
Was wondering how WOW Air is doing operationally. It seems that they are running pretty good at staying on time much better than a year ago.

Re: WOW Financial Discussion Thread

Posted: Thu Jan 03, 2019 10:11 pm
by Natflyer
klm617 wrote:
Was wondering how WOW Air is doing operationally. It seems that they are running pretty good at staying on time much better than a year ago.


Pretty much both of their banks 1-2 hours behind today, creating issues for other operators. http://www.airport.is

Re: WOW Financial Discussion Thread

Posted: Fri Jan 04, 2019 3:03 pm
by 346fetish
SRQKEF wrote:
Jshank83 wrote:
Can someone sum up all what has happened. I can go thru the thread and try to piece it all together but if I could get a summary that would be great.

Parts I am trying to figure out:

What North American airports are they still going to have service to next summer?
How many planes will they have left now? Still the 11? or is it less?


AFAIK, it's EWR, BWI, YYZ, YUL, DTW and BOS.

They've axed JFK, ORD, STL, CLE, CVG, PIT, DFW, YVR, MCO, DFW, SFO and LAX. They also once served MIA for a year or so.


YVR still shows in the reservation system but without any inventory. Odd.

Re: WOW Financial Discussion Thread

Posted: Fri Jan 04, 2019 5:13 pm
by karan14695
Which airline(s) are the two ex-WOW Air A333s heading to?

Re: WOW Financial Discussion Thread

Posted: Fri Jan 04, 2019 6:48 pm
by a350lover
[quote="caaardiff"]
According to what's currently on sale the fleet would look like;
2x A320
13x A321 (x5 Non Prem / 7x Prem with 36 rows / 1x Prem with 37 rows)
1x A330
Total:16 aircraft
[quote="caaardiff"]


Silly thing to keep 1 single A330 which generates somehow like an extra sub-fleet. Keep it all narrowbody and fingers crossed WOW!

Re: WOW Financial Discussion Thread

Posted: Fri Jan 04, 2019 7:22 pm
by devron
Just read some reviews for WOW and these are down the drain for this airline, can't imagine a lot of people currently booking with them. doesn't look good for there future income.

Re: WOW Financial Discussion Thread

Posted: Fri Jan 04, 2019 8:22 pm
by Natflyer
WOW air COO Ragnhildur Geirsdottir has left for greener and (safer) pastures...

Re: WOW Financial Discussion Thread

Posted: Fri Jan 04, 2019 9:07 pm
by SRQKEF
a350lover wrote:
caaardiff wrote:
According to what's currently on sale the fleet would look like;
2x A320
13x A321 (x5 Non Prem / 7x Prem with 36 rows / 1x Prem with 37 rows)
1x A330
Total:16 aircraft
caaardiff wrote:


Silly thing to keep 1 single A330 which generates somehow like an extra sub-fleet. Keep it all narrowbody and fingers crossed WOW!


It leaves the fleet at the end of January, the booking system just hasn't been updated to reflect that.

Re: WOW Financial Discussion Thread

Posted: Sat Jan 05, 2019 1:06 pm
by hvusslax
caaardiff wrote:
This is what is currently on sale on wowair.com. All flights are from a week in June and shown as weekly frequencies.
BOS x7 **
ORD x7
DTW x4
EWR x14 (x7 A330)
BWI x7
YYZ x7 **
YUL x7 **

A321 - AMS x14, TXL x12(**x7 Non Prem), CPH x12 (**x7 Non Prem), DUB x12 (**x7 Non prem), FRA x12 (**x7 Non Prem), CDG x14 (7 on A330), BRU x7, STN x7**
TFS x2, TLV x3,
A320 - EDI x3, ALC x4, BCN x4, DUS x3, LYS x4, MXP x3, ARN x4, WAW x2

According to what's currently on sale the fleet would look like;
2x A320
13x A321 (x5 Non Prem / 7x Prem with 36 rows / 1x Prem with 37 rows)
1x A330
Total:16 aircraft
On a Friday there is a requirement for 2 more aircraft to operate to Europe. With 1 departure to AMS showing A330, when there's already a CDG & EWR, and a rogue European flight on the 1130 bank.
Each day there is currently a requirement of 4 aircraft where they only operate x1 European flight each day. 3 of these are the 1130 departure bank with 1 being the 0600 departure bank.

North America departures vary between 1520-1550, 1720 (YUL) & 2030-2050 (EWR&ORD)

If there is to be a reduction to 11 aircraft, there's likely going to be a lot more schedule changes, mainly to the European departures, to make it fit.


I don't expect ORD and the second daily EWR flight to remain. Only two America-bound flights seem like an unsustainable second bank.

Re: WOW Financial Discussion Thread

Posted: Sat Jan 05, 2019 4:24 pm
by mcg
Ryanair01 wrote:
workhorse wrote:
Sorry, I must be missing something, but how Wow can sell anything to Air Canada? They don't own any of these planes, VEB does, right?

So should we rather read this article as "Wow managed to get out of the leasing contract with VEB and VEB leased these planes to Air Canada." or as "Wow managed to get out of the leasing contract with VEB and VEB sold these planes to Air Canada."?


No not quite. These aircraft are funded by a Finance Lease, which is (kind of) like a mortgage. A Finance Lease is treated like a type of loan, but (typically) the lessee (i.e. Wow) doesn't get ownership until all the money is paid fully off, when they (again typically) can choose to either (a) for a nominal fee take full ownership or (b) return the aircraft. VEB owns the Finance Lease, but typically the aircraft is considered the lessee's asset sat on their balance sheet, with future payments classed as a liability.

So essentially Air Canada is buying from Wow, the right to own these aircraft outright when the lease period runs out (which has a value), the aircraft will be classed as Air Canada's assets when they take delivery, although in the meantime they'll need to pay VEB's charges.

I've simplified it, but that's broadly what you'd expect.


Very well put.

Re: WOW Financial Discussion Thread

Posted: Sun Jan 06, 2019 9:11 am
by factsonly
Sunday, January 6th, 2019:

In the A333 days, WOW's largest European destinations were AMS and CDG, both with 2x daily A333/A321 services in Summer.
Now the A333 aircraft have been returned to lessors, it seems WOW is combining the two destinations with extra capacity to handle A333 volume bookings.

- WOW 444 REK-AMS A321 TF-JOY
- WOW 404 REK-CDG A321 TF-GMA
- WOW 442 REK-AMS-CDG-KEF A321 TF-KID

The final A333 TF-GAY is operating REK-DEL and REK-LAX at present.

Re: WOW Financial Discussion Thread

Posted: Sun Jan 06, 2019 9:32 am
by scandinavian590
factsonly wrote:
Sunday, January 6th, 2019:

In the A333 days, WOW's largest European destinations were AMS and CDG, both with 2x daily A333/A321 services in Summer.
Now the A333 aircraft have been returned to lessors, it seems WOW is combining the two destinations with extra capacity to handle A333 volume bookings.

- WOW 444 REK-AMS A321 TF-JOY
- WOW 404 REK-CDG A321 TF-GMA
- WOW 442 REK-AMS-CDG-KEF A321 TF-KID

The final A333 TF-GAY is operating REK-DEL and REK-LAX at present.


Combining two destinations in one flight sounds rather like a capacity decrease to cope with lower bookings. As I understand, there's one A321-rotation to each destination, while the second A321-rotation has become a triangular flight. Since you don't quote any timeframe, it could also be a one-off operational measure.