Max Q
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When will Perth get a non stop flight to the US ?

Fri Nov 30, 2018 12:17 pm

With all the ULR operations flown these days and QF with its direct LHR service I’m surprised no airline has looked at a Perth-
LAX / SFO


Seems like a promising market
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OzarkD9S
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Re: When will Perth get a non stop flight to the US ?

Fri Nov 30, 2018 12:23 pm

I would imagine JetStar might test the PER-HNL market (if there is one) before anyone tried PER-LAX/SFO.
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smi0006
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Re: When will Perth get a non stop flight to the US ?

Fri Nov 30, 2018 12:36 pm

OzarkD9S wrote:
I would imagine JetStar might test the PER-HNL market (if there is one) before anyone tried PER-LAX/SFO.


Is there a huge market for HNL, when beach destination are so much closer in Asia? Low cost or full service? Seems like a long very thin route, and JQ don’t have crew rests fitted to their 789. Not sure an LCC could justify a dedicated Long haul fleet,

Even for the mainland states I question how big the market is considering Perth’s size- not sure for LAX or SFO - And depends on the destination and which coast of US, AKL,SYD,BNE,MEL are more appealing transit points than US airports. I confess I can’t see the economics stacking up against the competing one stop alternatives.
Last edited by smi0006 on Fri Nov 30, 2018 12:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
StudiodeKadent
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Re: When will Perth get a non stop flight to the US ?

Fri Nov 30, 2018 12:37 pm

It'll probably be a while, frankly.

Its a ULH route that will have to deal with unfavorable winds, to a city that's smaller than Brisbane. I can't see it happening for a long time.
 
redroo
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Re: When will Perth get a non stop flight to the US ?

Fri Nov 30, 2018 12:40 pm

As much as I’d love one as I am from WA. I just can’t see it happening. The USA is popular for business and tourism, but Europe is more popular and Bali is overwhelmingly the number one destination.

Maybe when we get a a321xxxxxxxxlr or a 737 max extra extra extra LR we will get a non stop to LAX :-)
 
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eta unknown
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Re: When will Perth get a non stop flight to the US ?

Fri Nov 30, 2018 2:16 pm

Never. Too far from North America with very limited regional feed on the PER end. As aircraft are expensive pieces of real estate, it's very difficult to launch a PER-North America route when the return on investment is not promising. Also remember from an inbound perspective, PER is regarded as a second Australian visit destination- the first visit being SYD/QLD/VIC area.
 
rph99
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Re: When will Perth get a non stop flight to the US ?

Fri Nov 30, 2018 4:06 pm

Don’t see this happening anytime soon.

What plane could even make this distance right now that would be economical?
 
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fraspotter
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Re: When will Perth get a non stop flight to the US ?

Fri Nov 30, 2018 4:20 pm

There are not a lot of connection opportunities on the Perth end as most of them would involve a sizable back track since that's where the population centers are. The marginal numbers of Western Australians who want to go to the US west coast will just have to continue to connect in SE Asia or SYD, MEL, BNE etc
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Re: When will Perth get a non stop flight to the US ?

Fri Nov 30, 2018 4:25 pm

It's also an extremely long haul flight from PER to LAX/SFO, probably the longest in the world even exceeding LAX/EWR-Singapore. 18 hours+ in the air on a 789, 772LR or A350ULH is what this route would require.
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Re: When will Perth get a non stop flight to the US ?

Fri Nov 30, 2018 4:44 pm

I could see Hawaiian give HNL-PER a shot. It would offer the most direct connections to LAX and SFO distance wise, and would also offer the only one stop connections to cities such as SEA, PDX, SAN, LAS, PHX, etc. unless transiting via Asia which adds about 1,000 nm to the trip. Then of course Hawaii as a destination itself. SYD/MEL/BNE already having nonstop service so PER would most likely be next.
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Re: When will Perth get a non stop flight to the US ?

Fri Nov 30, 2018 4:51 pm

To put it into more US-centric terms, Perth is about the population size of Nashville, TN. A city that size doesn't a need a long, thin ULH link to the US, especially when connecting in BNE, MEL or SYD doesn't require much extra distance. The only reason QF is flying PER-LHR is so they can say they fly non-stop from Australia to London and Perth is the westernmost major city in OZ.
 
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Re: When will Perth get a non stop flight to the US ?

Fri Nov 30, 2018 6:13 pm

The fact that SYD-Europe is still impractical creates excitement about PER-Europe. SYD-mainland USA has been possible for 30 years or so. So there is not the same motivation to get to PER.

That said, BBN is perhaps a little small to get USA service and they do have it.
 
rutankrd
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Re: When will Perth get a non stop flight to the US ?

Fri Nov 30, 2018 7:44 pm

Short answer never !
 
Bhoy
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Re: When will Perth get a non stop flight to the US ?

Fri Nov 30, 2018 8:19 pm

Flighty wrote:
The fact that SYD-Europe is still impractical creates excitement about PER-Europe. SYD-mainland USA has been possible for 30 years or so. So there is not the same motivation to get to PER.

That said, BBN is perhaps a little small to get USA service and they do have it.

There's a total of 3 flights a day from BBN [Bario Airport, Malaysia], all of them domestic.

Assuming you mean BNE [Brisbane] - it's a bigger Metropolitan area than Perth, and I'd assume the market from there grew organically while the TPAC flights to/from SYD/MEL were doing fuel stops there.
 
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Re: When will Perth get a non stop flight to the US ?

Fri Nov 30, 2018 9:04 pm

Bhoy wrote:
Flighty wrote:
The fact that SYD-Europe is still impractical creates excitement about PER-Europe. SYD-mainland USA has been possible for 30 years or so. So there is not the same motivation to get to PER.

That said, BBN is perhaps a little small to get USA service and they do have it.

There's a total of 3 flights a day from BBN [Bario Airport, Malaysia], all of them domestic.

Assuming you mean BNE [Brisbane] - it's a bigger Metropolitan area than Perth, and I'd assume the market from there grew organically while the TPAC flights to/from SYD/MEL were doing fuel stops there.


BNE also has a much larger catchment area - Queensland is almost twice the size in population than WA is. I'd also argue there's more tourism demand with the Gold Coast and tropical Queenland destinations than there is with Perth. Not to mention the logistical differences of PER-LAX being 1800 nm longer in distance than BNE-LAX.
 
as739x
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Re: When will Perth get a non stop flight to the US ?

Fri Nov 30, 2018 9:08 pm

Perth won't get non-stops to HNL. To far away and to expensive. You have Bali only 3 hours away along with multiple SE Asia sun destinations. Many of my friends in Perth even rent apartments or Villas in Bali for the weekends.
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EvanWSFO
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Re: When will Perth get a non stop flight to the US ?

Fri Nov 30, 2018 10:10 pm

Flighty wrote:
The fact that SYD-Europe is still impractical creates excitement about PER-Europe. SYD-mainland USA has been possible for 30 years or so. So there is not the same motivation to get to PER.

That said, BBN is perhaps a little small to get USA service and they do have it.


PER-LHR is viable because it offers a genuine nonstop to Europe, and gets traffic from other cities in Australia. PER-LAX is a long thin flight with no feed on the PER end. It's not gonna happen.
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RJMAZ
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Re: When will Perth get a non stop flight to the US ?

Fri Nov 30, 2018 10:32 pm

I disagree with most members direct flights from Perth to the USA will happen. Why? Because it makes every city in the US a 1 stop instead of a 2 stop. Perth might be small but you only need a big feeder market on one end.

Perth to San Francisco would work easily right now with a standard A350-900ULR and a full cabin of passengers.

Singapore to Los Angeles is 7621nm
Singapore to New York is 8288nm

Perth to San Francisco is 7960nm

Based on the A350 performance numbers of Singapore to San Francisco route they wont even need the ULR capabilities to do Singapore to Los Angeles. Singapore to New York the performance numbers show they could probably use their standard higher density A350 cabin and still make it.

I assume the 777-8 will win project sunrise. Qantas will definitely use that aircraft to fly Perth to Los Angeles which it could do comfortably.
 
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Re: When will Perth get a non stop flight to the US ?

Fri Nov 30, 2018 10:42 pm

Max Q wrote:
With all the ULR operations flown these days and QF with its direct LHR service I’m surprised no airline has looked at a Perth-LAX / SFO
Seems like a promising market

I'm not surprised. 15,000km is very similar to SIN-EWR, and I'm not sure Singapore makes much money on that route. Plus it'll require some very serious work on ETOPS certification and that's another "drama". When we're talking about the connection between the largest commercial center in Asia and the largest commercial center in North America, it makes sense to start flying. Perth is neither. The only reason Qantas flies PER-LHR is because they don't have a plane to go SYD-LHR. So the answer to your question is, probably never in our life time.
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Re: When will Perth get a non stop flight to the US ?

Fri Nov 30, 2018 11:23 pm

I don't believe this will happen unless there is an extraordinary surge in demand for a non-stop from Perth to the U.S.

Image

Flying from Perth to LAX via Sydney adds 2.3% flying distance (an extra 182 miles) and via Brisbane adds 1% (a whopping 77 additional miles), and I would have to believe that unless there's some magic formula no one has thought about in flying from the U.S. to Perth non-stop, QF is going to be quite happy shuttling those passengers through the east coast of Australia. Yes, I know, "your mileage may vary", but the point is that this is an ultra-long haul flight that has a plethora of one-stop options the non-stop would have to compete with.
 
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Re: When will Perth get a non stop flight to the US ?

Fri Nov 30, 2018 11:53 pm

Unfortunately I can't see a nonstop PER-US flight happening for at least 10 years. It's just that much too far for the 787 it would require the outcome of Project Sunrise which as far as I know is already earmarked for East Coast Australia to LON/East Coast US. And I can't see a US airline being interested in a flight that far to a relatively small market. With HA and HNL there would have to be enough demand that are happy to pay a premium over closer beach destinations and it would have to be enough to fill a 332/789.

While it's true that PER-LHR has connecting pax to elsewhere in Australia. It is worth mentioning that Perth has a huge British expat community which certainly helps the route. From the figures from what I understand around 25% of passengers continue on QF9/10 through to MEL. With the other 75% either originate in PER or connect on domestic flights elsewhere. I'd be interested to know how many passengers start/finish their journeys in WA.
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Re: When will Perth get a non stop flight to the US ?

Sat Dec 01, 2018 12:06 am

Flighty wrote:
SYD-mainland USA has been possible for 30 years or so.


Got news for you...its been over 40 years since the 747SP entered service and it was eventually regularly used on USA west coast-OZ west coast. Not sure when it started but the capability was there if I'm not mistaken. I will gladly stand corrected if I'm mistaken.

We're aging and time is flying by...

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Re: When will Perth get a non stop flight to the US ?

Sat Dec 01, 2018 12:20 am

aeromoe wrote:
Flighty wrote:
SYD-mainland USA has been possible for 30 years or so.


Got news for you...its been over 40 years since the 747SP entered service and it was eventually regularly used on USA west coast-OZ west coast. Not sure when it started but the capability was there if I'm not mistaken. I will gladly stand corrected if I'm mistaken.

We're aging and time is flying by...

Cheers.


First delivery to Pan Am of a 747-121SP was N531PA, on March 5 or 6, 1976. but I can't find the date of Pan Am's first revenue flight. Probably April or May. 42 years ago. First routes were probably JFK-Tokyo and LAX-Australia. I know for a period of time that LAX-SYD was the record holding longest flight in the Guiness Book of World Records. I remember reading those statistics in the book in elementary school in the mid-1970's.
 
slcdeltarumd11
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Re: When will Perth get a non stop flight to the US ?

Sat Dec 01, 2018 1:28 am

0% chance , quote me on that when it doesn't happen.
 
F100Flyer
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Re: When will Perth get a non stop flight to the US ?

Sat Dec 01, 2018 1:45 am

As much as airline talk can be all hype, but i wouldn't rule PER-HNL as 'impossible', particularly when Hawaiian has flagged Perth as a potential route when the 789s arrive:

https://www.ausbt.com.au/hawaiian-airli ... oeing-787s
 
Max Q
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Re: When will Perth get a non stop flight to the US ?

Sat Dec 01, 2018 2:29 am

aeromoe wrote:
Flighty wrote:
SYD-mainland USA has been possible for 30 years or so.


Got news for you...its been over 40 years since the 747SP entered service and it was eventually regularly used on USA west coast-OZ west coast. Not sure when it started but the capability was there if I'm not mistaken. I will gladly stand corrected if I'm mistaken.

We're aging and time is flying by...

Cheers.



Don’t think so, that was not flown, too far even for the mighty SP, unless it was empty
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Re: When will Perth get a non stop flight to the US ?

Sat Dec 01, 2018 2:47 am

Max Q wrote:
aeromoe wrote:
Flighty wrote:
SYD-mainland USA has been possible for 30 years or so.


Got news for you...its been over 40 years since the 747SP entered service and it was eventually regularly used on USA west coast-OZ west coast. Not sure when it started but the capability was there if I'm not mistaken. I will gladly stand corrected if I'm mistaken.

We're aging and time is flying by...

Cheers.



Don’t think so, that was not flown, too far even for the mighty SP, unless it was empty



PA and later QF then UA replacing PA definitely flew SYD-LAX Viv non stop with the 747SP!

As for PER-US never say never beyond 5-10 years but it certainly doesn’t seem like something that will happen anytime soon.
 
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Re: When will Perth get a non stop flight to the US ?

Sat Dec 01, 2018 5:05 am

I think the biggest indication that there is no market for this route is that Qantas have not so much as once hinted that it could be considered as part of "Project Sunrise". Every statement focusses on SYD/MEL-LHR and SYD-JFK, and not once was there a throwaway line like "these new aircraft could eventually open up other exciting new routes such as PER-LAX"
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Max Q
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Re: When will Perth get a non stop flight to the US ?

Sat Dec 01, 2018 5:11 am

ZK-NBT wrote:
Max Q wrote:
aeromoe wrote:

Got news for you...its been over 40 years since the 747SP entered service and it was eventually regularly used on USA west coast-OZ west coast. Not sure when it started but the capability was there if I'm not mistaken. I will gladly stand corrected if I'm mistaken.

We're aging and time is flying by...

Cheers.



Don’t think so, that was not flown, too far even for the mighty SP, unless it was empty



PA and later QF then UA replacing PA definitely flew SYD-LAX Viv non stop with the 747SP!

As for PER-US never say never beyond 5-10 years but it certainly doesn’t seem like something that will happen anytime soon.



That’s all true however the poster I replied to suggested the SP was operated non stop from the US west coast to the west coast of Australia

This is not correct
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chidino
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Re: When will Perth get a non stop flight to the US ?

Sat Dec 01, 2018 5:58 am

Please don't kill the messenger, but I think there is a much larger problem with PER-US service. I'm being completely honest, as a college-educated American (history major, tech career, surprise!); I'm fairly average and have some of those tourism dollars. This what I knew of Perth before reading the OP and replies:

1. The city put on a beautiful welcoming light display for John Glenn's flight (The Right Stuff)
2. QF's LHR service departs from there (logically, since it's the big city in the west of Australia, as I learned in The Right Stuff)

I'm not trying to be cruel or faking ignorance -- I'm the guy who looks forward to geography Jeopardy questions. Virtually all Americans are completely ignorant of WA. Our knowledge of the entire country is run through Sydney/Reef/Koala east coast marketing and exposure so completely that you would have to begin with a basic education campaign on Perth and WA. I really think that any talk of a demand for Perth as an ultra-long market from the US would not be reflected in reality, simply due to American lack of knowledge. And then people are going to genuinely ask: is the experience worth a full day plus in Y (or worse)?
Last edited by chidino on Sat Dec 01, 2018 6:01 am, edited 1 time in total.
 
chidino
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Re: When will Perth get a non stop flight to the US ?

Sat Dec 01, 2018 5:59 am

dupe, sorry
 
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aeromoe
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Re: When will Perth get a non stop flight to the US ?

Sat Dec 01, 2018 6:01 am

Max Q wrote:
ZK-NBT wrote:
Max Q wrote:


Don’t think so, that was not flown, too far even for the mighty SP, unless it was empty



PA and later QF then UA replacing PA definitely flew SYD-LAX Viv non stop with the 747SP!

As for PER-US never say never beyond 5-10 years but it certainly doesn’t seem like something that will happen anytime soon.



That’s all true however the poster I replied to suggested the SP was operated non stop from the US west coast to the west coast of Australia

This is not correct


You are absolutely correct...I mis-typed when I typed AUS West Coast. I honestly meant AUS EAST COAST (SYD, etc) So my typo is my egg on my face.
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waoz1
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Re: When will Perth get a non stop flight to the US ?

Sat Dec 01, 2018 8:13 am

F100Flyer wrote:
As much as airline talk can be all hype, but i wouldn't rule PER-HNL as 'impossible', particularly when Hawaiian has flagged Perth as a potential route when the 789s arrive:

https://www.ausbt.com.au/hawaiian-airli ... oeing-787s


Its the only potential route to the US for Perth in the next decade or so. Hawaiian has mentioned it a few times.

Perth will overtake Brisbane as third largest city in Australia and locals will look for other destinations.
 
a350lover
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Re: When will Perth get a non stop flight to the US ?

Sat Dec 01, 2018 8:23 am

Geography matters.

Perth has a logical role on Asian/European connections due to its position on the map. Now, taking it to the next level to connect anywhere in USA is definitely highly unlikely now. Technology could become available and the right airplane could fly the route, but the market simply won't justify such a long flight. Hawaii may sustain some by reason of local aussie demand for a different holiday experience, but apart of having to compete against the loads of Asian flights leaving from Perth, it wouldn't mean a very different thing than just connecting through the existing non-stop flights from SYD, MEL or BNE. Perth doesn't even have flights to other typical Pacific Islands such as Fiji, which links daily again to all three East Coast destinations in Australia mainland.

Although the per capita of WA's inhabitants is truly high (for such an isolated state!), the air-routes won't change much after this Perth-London non-stop. Adelaide for instance, which is comparable if we compare the size of the cities, has even a less appealing route map.

If you wanna look at rather more interesting Americas' connections for Perth, maybe there is some potential to the Southern cone (Argentina mainly).
 
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SCFlyer
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Re: When will Perth get a non stop flight to the US ?

Sat Dec 01, 2018 8:54 am

waoz1 wrote:
F100Flyer wrote:
As much as airline talk can be all hype, but i wouldn't rule PER-HNL as 'impossible', particularly when Hawaiian has flagged Perth as a potential route when the 789s arrive:

https://www.ausbt.com.au/hawaiian-airli ... oeing-787s


Its the only potential route to the US for Perth in the next decade or so. Hawaiian has mentioned it a few times.

Perth will overtake Brisbane as third largest city in Australia and locals will look for other destinations.


HA has a interline/codeshare agreement with VA so Perth may or may not work for connections from regional WA and ADL/NT.

Any sources to back up the claim that Perth would take over Brisbane population-wise?
 
NTLDaz
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Re: When will Perth get a non stop flight to the US ?

Sat Dec 01, 2018 9:07 am

waoz1 wrote:
F100Flyer wrote:
As much as airline talk can be all hype, but i wouldn't rule PER-HNL as 'impossible', particularly when Hawaiian has flagged Perth as a potential route when the 789s arrive:

https://www.ausbt.com.au/hawaiian-airli ... oeing-787s


Its the only potential route to the US for Perth in the next decade or so. Hawaiian has mentioned it a few times.

Perth will overtake Brisbane as third largest city in Australia and locals will look for other destinations.


Even if Perth overtakes Brisbane ( which I'm dubious about ) it'll never have the large catchment area of Brisbane. Sunshine Coast to the Gold Coast is basically a conurbation.
 
waoz1
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Re: When will Perth get a non stop flight to the US ?

Sat Dec 01, 2018 9:36 am

SCFlyer wrote:
waoz1 wrote:
F100Flyer wrote:
As much as airline talk can be all hype, but i wouldn't rule PER-HNL as 'impossible', particularly when Hawaiian has flagged Perth as a potential route when the 789s arrive:

https://www.ausbt.com.au/hawaiian-airli ... oeing-787s




Its the only potential route to the US for Perth in the next decade or so. Hawaiian has mentioned it a few times.

Perth will overtake Brisbane as third largest city in Australia and locals will look for other destinations.


HA has a interline/codeshare agreement with VA so Perth may or may not work for connections from regional WA and ADL/NT.

Any sources to back up the claim that Perth would take over Brisbane population-wise?


Wont happen overnight but will happen in future decades as Perth overtook Adelaide some time ago.

Report from infrastructure australia as reported in the west.

https://www.google.com.au/amp/s/thewest ... 53472z.amp

Even longer brisbane times reported it too

https://www.google.com.au/amp/s/amp.bri ... mhjcg.html
 
Max Q
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Re: When will Perth get a non stop flight to the US ?

Sat Dec 01, 2018 10:00 am

aeromoe wrote:
Max Q wrote:
ZK-NBT wrote:


PA and later QF then UA replacing PA definitely flew SYD-LAX Viv non stop with the 747SP!

As for PER-US never say never beyond 5-10 years but it certainly doesn’t seem like something that will happen anytime soon.



That’s all true however the poster I replied to suggested the SP was operated non stop from the US west coast to the west coast of Australia

This is not correct


You are absolutely correct...I mis-typed when I typed AUS West Coast. I honestly meant AUS EAST COAST (SYD, etc) So my typo is my egg on my face.



Now it makes sense !

Best wishes
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melpax
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Re: When will Perth get a non stop flight to the US ?

Sat Dec 01, 2018 11:03 am

I couldn't see a huge amount of business demand for direct PER-US flights as Perth is a mining-focused city, whereas both MEL & SYD are major business centres with the resultant premium seating demand. In the Australian scheme of things, PER is mainly a branch office, with some exceptions (Wesfarmers & the miners - although the retail business of Wesfarmers is run from MEL).
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SCFlyer
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Re: When will Perth get a non stop flight to the US ?

Sat Dec 01, 2018 11:28 am

NTLDaz wrote:
waoz1 wrote:
F100Flyer wrote:
As much as airline talk can be all hype, but i wouldn't rule PER-HNL as 'impossible', particularly when Hawaiian has flagged Perth as a potential route when the 789s arrive:

https://www.ausbt.com.au/hawaiian-airli ... oeing-787s


Its the only potential route to the US for Perth in the next decade or so. Hawaiian has mentioned it a few times.

Perth will overtake Brisbane as third largest city in Australia and locals will look for other destinations.


Even if Perth overtakes Brisbane ( which I'm dubious about ) it'll never have the large catchment area of Brisbane. Sunshine Coast to the Gold Coast is basically a conurbation.


Good point. If you add the populations of the Gold Coast and Sunshine Coast to the population of Brisbane (also known as South East Queensland), that's still a larger catchment area in Perth, even in the slim chance of Perth overtaking Brisbane (excluding the Coasts) in the next 15+ years.

Also helps for South East Queensland that there's 2 major airports (BNE (primary gateway) & OOL (LCC focused gateway)), and 2 minor ones (WTB & MCY) which all take international flights.
 
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Re: When will Perth get a non stop flight to the US ?

Sat Dec 01, 2018 12:42 pm

Perth doesn't even have a direct flight to Korea yet. I would see that happening long before any attempts to the US are realised.
 
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Re: When will Perth get a non stop flight to the US ?

Sat Dec 01, 2018 1:13 pm

Almost 1 million intl tourists visited Western Australia in the 12 months to June 2018. Of these, the UK was the largest single market with around 160,000. The US had 8%, so almost 80,000 visitors. But it is exceptionally easier and more economic to fly via somewhere (especially SYD, MEL, or BNE). Source: WA tourism statistics.
"Everyone writing for the Telegraph knows that the way to grab eyeballs is with Ryanair and/or sex."
 
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flyPIT
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Re: When will Perth get a non stop flight to the US ?

Sat Dec 01, 2018 3:19 pm

chidino wrote:
Please don't kill the messenger, but I think there is a much larger problem with PER-US service. I'm being completely honest, as a college-educated American (history major, tech career, surprise!); I'm fairly average and have some of those tourism dollars. This what I knew of Perth before reading the OP and replies:

1. The city put on a beautiful welcoming light display for John Glenn's flight (The Right Stuff)
2. QF's LHR service departs from there (logically, since it's the big city in the west of Australia, as I learned in The Right Stuff)

I'm not trying to be cruel or faking ignorance -- I'm the guy who looks forward to geography Jeopardy questions. Virtually all Americans are completely ignorant of WA. Our knowledge of the entire country is run through Sydney/Reef/Koala east coast marketing and exposure so completely that you would have to begin with a basic education campaign on Perth and WA. I really think that any talk of a demand for Perth as an ultra-long market from the US would not be reflected in reality, simply due to American lack of knowledge. And then people are going to genuinely ask: is the experience worth a full day plus in Y (or worse)?

The point of sales would be mostly from PER, especially a flight to HNL so I guess it's a good thing Aussies know more about the US than Americans do about Australia.


a350lover wrote:
Although the per capita of WA's inhabitants is truly high (for such an isolated state!), the air-routes won't change much after this Perth-London non-stop. Adelaide for instance, which is comparable if we compare the size of the cities, has even a less appealing route map.

Perth is significantly larger than Adelaide. Perth is now larger than Brisbane was when BNE started nonstop flights to the US mainland. I agree with others that PER-US Mainland will not happen anytime soon, but PER-HNL could come as a pleasant surprise within a few years.
FLYi
 
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Re: When will Perth get a non stop flight to the US ?

Sat Dec 01, 2018 4:31 pm

flyPIT wrote:
Perth is significantly larger than Adelaide. Perth is now larger than Brisbane was when BNE started nonstop flights to the US mainland. I agree with others that PER-US Mainland will not happen anytime soon, but PER-HNL could come as a pleasant surprise within a few years.


True. Still geography matters and Perth is 5h ish away flying from BNE. Even if we just completely omit the potential of each market, the economics of a long-haul flight (i.e. BNE-US mainland), are a bit different to the economics of an ultra-long-haul route such as an unlikely by now PER-US mainland.
 
gunnerman
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Re: When will Perth get a non stop flight to the US ?

Sat Dec 01, 2018 4:42 pm

Brits make up 12.4 percent of Perth's population and are by far Perth’s biggest migrant group, which helps to explain how QF can make PER-LHR a success. In contrast there are few Americans living in Perth and a route such as PER-LAX would likely be mostly consisting of people from Perth, with light load factors as a result.
 
910A
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Re: When will Perth get a non stop flight to the US ?

Sat Dec 01, 2018 5:05 pm

PSAatSAN4Ever wrote:

First delivery to Pan Am of a 747-121SP was N531PA, on March 5 or 6, 1976. but I can't find the date of Pan Am's first revenue flight. Probably April or May. 42 years ago. First routes were probably JFK-Tokyo and LAX-Australia. I know for a period of time that LAX-SYD was the record holding longest flight in the Guiness Book of World Records. I remember reading those statistics in the book in elementary school in the mid-1970's.
. Clipper Freedom commenced service between JFK-HND in April 1976. When PA started 747SP service to SYD, the flight was operated with an AKL stop. Somewhere around 1984-85 when PA started to operated it N/S to Australia in order to compete with QF.
 
F27500
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Re: When will Perth get a non stop flight to the US ?

Sat Dec 01, 2018 7:53 pm

Is there really a need for one? How many Americans need to go to Perth? And viceversa.
 
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Re: When will Perth get a non stop flight to the US ?

Sat Dec 01, 2018 10:00 pm

910A wrote:
PSAatSAN4Ever wrote:

First delivery to Pan Am of a 747-121SP was N531PA, on March 5 or 6, 1976. but I can't find the date of Pan Am's first revenue flight. Probably April or May. 42 years ago. First routes were probably JFK-Tokyo and LAX-Australia. I know for a period of time that LAX-SYD was the record holding longest flight in the Guiness Book of World Records. I remember reading those statistics in the book in elementary school in the mid-1970's.
. Clipper Freedom commenced service between JFK-HND in April 1976. When PA started 747SP service to SYD, the flight was operated with an AKL stop. Somewhere around 1984-85 when PA started to operated it N/S to Australia in order to compete with QF.


Thanks for the information! Didn't the 747-200's for Qantas make it non-stop to LAX?
 
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LAX772LR
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Re: When will Perth get a non stop flight to the US ?

Sat Dec 01, 2018 11:16 pm

RJMAZ wrote:
with a standard A350-900ULR and a full cabin of passengers.

What's a "standard" A359ULR?

Also, the A359ULR gets its increased range from swapping pax/bags/cargo weight in exchange for fuel capacity... so if a "full cabin" is your objective, it's not the best plane to have-- which is a big reason why only one airline has ever ordered it.
I myself, suspect a more prosaic motive... ~Thranduil
 
910A
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Re: When will Perth get a non stop flight to the US ?

Sat Dec 01, 2018 11:21 pm

PSAatSAN4Ever wrote:
910A wrote:
PSAatSAN4Ever wrote:

First delivery to Pan Am of a 747-121SP was N531PA, on March 5 or 6, 1976. but I can't find the date of Pan Am's first revenue flight. Probably April or May. 42 years ago. First routes were probably JFK-Tokyo and LAX-Australia. I know for a period of time that LAX-SYD was the record holding longest flight in the Guiness Book of World Records. I remember reading those statistics in the book in elementary school in the mid-1970's.
. Clipper Freedom commenced service between JFK-HND in April 1976. When PA started 747SP service to SYD, the flight was operated with an AKL stop. Somewhere around 1984-85 when PA started to operated it N/S to Australia in order to compete with QF.


Thanks for the information! Didn't the 747-200's for Qantas make it non-stop to LAX?


The 743 could, I seen it happen, but it also had to stop in AKL going westbound. -the 200 series no way, stop at either AKL or HNL both ways.
Last edited by 910A on Sat Dec 01, 2018 11:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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