kaitak
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Re: Irish 12/18: December Dreaming ...

Tue Dec 25, 2018 8:01 am

Wishing all of the participants in the Irish threads a very happy Christmas and all the very best for the new year! Hope you're having a very nice day and that the man in red has been good to you!
 
dstc47
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Re: Irish 12/18: December Dreaming ...

Tue Dec 25, 2018 9:32 am

And the same to you.
Sadly the man in red seems to have adopted the low-cost model here and the presents have slipped outside the hand baggage rules.
Wishing all a happy and safe 2019.
 
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Miami
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Re: Irish 12/18: December Dreaming ...

Wed Dec 26, 2018 6:42 pm

Hey, everyone.

Simple question... Does anyone know if Aer Lingus will rejoin OneWorld? I keep hearing things about them applying for a JV with several OneWorld airlines. Anyone have more info on that?

Thanks.
Aviation is proof that given, the will, we have the capacity to achieve the impossible. - Eddie Rickenbacker
 
EINA320
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Re: Irish 12/18: December Dreaming ...

Wed Dec 26, 2018 11:33 pm

Hi all,

Does anybody know if EI will open a pilot base in SNN? They’ll be using their own metal once the A321LR comes in for the flights to JFK and BOS and the LHR flights will be an A320 which will result in an all Airbus single aisle base so surely that would be reason enough to open one?
 
S0Y
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Re: Irish 12/18: December Dreaming ...

Thu Dec 27, 2018 4:24 am

Miami wrote:
Hey, everyone.

Simple question... Does anyone know if Aer Lingus will rejoin OneWorld? I keep hearing things about them applying for a JV with several OneWorld airlines. Anyone have more info on that?

Thanks.


The expectation is they will join under the OW Connect model, per recent rumors.

Investor communications talked about joining the TATL JV , was discussed up thread IIRC
 
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ClassicLover
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Re: Irish 12/18: December Dreaming ...

Thu Dec 27, 2018 9:36 am

Miami wrote:
Simple question... Does anyone know if Aer Lingus will rejoin OneWorld? I keep hearing things about them applying for a JV with several OneWorld airlines. Anyone have more info on that?


Yes, they are joining the transatlantic joint venture with AA/BA/IB and AY. This does not mean they will join the oneworld alliance. It does mean that the Aer Lingus AerClub will allow earning points, recognition of frequent flyer status etc with the airlines in the joint venture and vice versa. This is because JV airlines cross sell each others flights and it's supposed to all be seamless for the passengers.

A decision on alliance membership is not part of the JV. There is no official word from anyone at Aer Lingus about rejoining oneworld. All references to oneworld Connect membership are just airliners.net speculation as what people believe will most likely occur. Hope this helps!
I do enjoy a spot of flying, especially when it's not in economy!
 
BrianDromey
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Re: Irish 12/18: December Dreaming ...

Thu Dec 27, 2018 9:54 am

No airline is part of a JV without being an alliance member. VS has a JV with Delta, but not got her skyTeam partners yet.

The obvious way to align FFPs with AA/BA/AY/IB is by becoming a one world member. Either connect, or a full member. Fiji are the only connect airline at present and the project seems unecessarily complex for passengers. It’s a sort of á la carte situation which requires customers to know which one world airlines sponsored the airline. I think full membership might work for EI, as aside from the JV four they have worked with Cathay and Qantas too.
 
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ClassicLover
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Re: Irish 12/18: December Dreaming ...

Thu Dec 27, 2018 10:31 am

BrianDromey wrote:
No airline is part of a JV without being an alliance member. VS has a JV with Delta, but not got her skyTeam partners yet.

The obvious way to align FFPs with AA/BA/AY/IB is by becoming a one world member. Either connect, or a full member. Fiji are the only connect airline at present and the project seems unecessarily complex for passengers. It’s a sort of á la carte situation which requires customers to know which one world airlines sponsored the airline. I think full membership might work for EI, as aside from the JV four they have worked with Cathay and Qantas too.


Yes, I was about to say - Virgin Atlantic is the obvious one. Aer Lingus will be exactly the same, the unaligned airline that happens to have some oneworld partners.

I completely agree with you on wanting Aer Lingus back in oneworld. However, I can't see them joining as a full member. The main reason is that their bespoke Astral system will have to have money spent on it so it can work with all the other airlines systems. They originally left because of the "change in business model" but wasn't it really because they didn't want to spend the money on getting their IT systems to work with the three airlines that joined the same time they left?

oneworld Connect is the most likely, as they'll just join up with QF, BA, CX, AA, AY and IB. However, it could still be a while off before even that happens.

You never know, maybe they'll decide to dump Astral and buy something from Amadeus, then integration as a full oneworld member will be much easier as many of those airlines already use the Amadeus systems. Time will tell anyway!
I do enjoy a spot of flying, especially when it's not in economy!
 
EI121
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Re: Irish 12/18: December Dreaming ...

Thu Dec 27, 2018 10:32 am

Aer Lingus reduces MIA to 2 per week in S19 between 09Jun-16Oct. The Friday service has been cancelled.

Source: https://www.routesonline.com/news/38/ai ... y-changes/

I wonder if any other route will see an extra rotation added.

I have heard rumours that the MIA route hasn't performed well - never a good sign when a route is cut frequencies during the busy summer season.

EI121
 
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OA260
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Re: Irish 12/18: December Dreaming ...

Thu Dec 27, 2018 10:58 am

EI121 wrote:
I have heard rumours that the MIA route hasn't performed well - never a good sign when a route is cut frequencies during the busy summer season.

EI121


It struggled from the start. Various promotions to boost the numbers were done and for a while things looked like they were improving but it has been under constant review and I guess dropping from 3 to 2 has been the outcome. Shame to see but not unexpected.
 
neutral
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Re: Irish 12/18: December Dreaming ...

Thu Dec 27, 2018 11:40 am

Any news on the proposed link between Aer Lingus and Ryanair for bookings? it's seems to have all gone very quiet of late!!!!
 
BrianDromey
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Re: Irish 12/18: December Dreaming ...

Thu Dec 27, 2018 12:16 pm

ClassicLover wrote:
Yes, I was about to say - Virgin Atlantic is the obvious one. Aer Lingus will be exactly the same, the unaligned airline that happens to have some oneworld partners.

I completely agree with you on wanting Aer Lingus back in oneworld. However, I can't see them joining as a full member. The main reason is that their bespoke Astral system will have to have money spent on it so it can work with all the other airlines systems. They originally left because of the "change in business model" but wasn't it really because they didn't want to spend the money on getting their IT systems to work with the three airlines that joined the same time they left?

oneworld Connect is the most likely, as they'll just join up with QF, BA, CX, AA, AY and IB. However, it could still be a while off before even that happens.

You never know, maybe they'll decide to dump Astral and buy something from Amadeus, then integration as a full oneworld member will be much easier as many of those airlines already use the Amadeus systems. Time will tell anyway!


I mentioned the VS/DL JV as an outlier because it is. VS is not, part of the larger DL/AF/KL/AZ transatlantic venture. It is purely a VS/DL venture between UK and US markets. This will change next year and AZ are not going to be part of the JV going forward. So EI would remain an anomaly as a member of an Alliance JV while not being a member. (Level is another odd outlier, but is arguably a brand, rather than an airline)

IIRC one of the reasons for leaving in the first place was that EI's systems needed a lot of investment to work with incoming members AY and JL. This investment is going to have to be made now. From a customer point of view full membership would be better because reciprocal benefits are only offered on sponsor airlines (presumably to avoid the EI situation where members leave rather than work with peripheral members). Unless EI can convince CX and QF to sponsor them, there will be no recognition of AerClub status on CX or QF. How is the average traveller is supposed to know that AA sponsored entry, but LatAm didn't?

The migraine-inducing Fiji Airlines benefits charts are here..
https://onemileatatime.com/oneworld-connect-confusing/
 
VFRonTop
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Re: Irish 12/18: December Dreaming ...

Thu Dec 27, 2018 12:22 pm

There seems to be an issue at NOC at the moment. BE663 from MAN and FR8142 from LTN seem to be circling the field.
 
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ClassicLover
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Re: Irish 12/18: December Dreaming ...

Thu Dec 27, 2018 12:27 pm

BrianDromey wrote:
IIRC one of the reasons for leaving in the first place was that EI's systems needed a lot of investment to work with incoming members AY and JL. This investment is going to have to be made now. From a customer point of view full membership would be better because reciprocal benefits are only offered on sponsor airlines (presumably to avoid the EI situation where members leave rather than work with peripheral members). Unless EI can convince CX and QF to sponsor them, there will be no recognition of AerClub status on CX or QF. How is the average traveller is supposed to know that AA sponsored entry, but LatAm didn't?

The migraine-inducing Fiji Airlines benefits charts are here..
https://onemileatatime.com/oneworld-connect-confusing/


RJ and JL, you mean. AY was a member from 1999.

I agree with you completely that full membership would be better from a frequent flyer perspective. However, does it make sense from a business perspective? Is the investment in IT going to be paid back by enough increased revenue from all the members? That's what it comes down to, moreso than frequent flyers.

Regarding FJ, I agree. It's not particularly clear, but then, how many members are really going to fly on FJ apart from those they have been sponsored by? Obviously this was taken into account when FJ went for Connect membership. Cost benefit.
I do enjoy a spot of flying, especially when it's not in economy!
 
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OA260
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Re: Irish 12/18: December Dreaming ...

Thu Dec 27, 2018 1:18 pm

VFRonTop wrote:
There seems to be an issue at NOC at the moment. BE663 from MAN and FR8142 from LTN seem to be circling the field.


Seems to be weather issues at NOC.
 
JAmie2k9
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Re: Irish 12/18: December Dreaming ...

Thu Dec 27, 2018 2:41 pm

EI121 wrote:
Aer Lingus reduces MIA to 2 per week in S19 between 09Jun-16Oct. The Friday service has been cancelled.

Source: https://www.routesonline.com/news/38/ai ... y-changes/

I wonder if any other route will see an extra rotation added.

I have heard rumours that the MIA route hasn't performed well - never a good sign when a route is cut frequencies during the busy summer season.

EI121


They need the extra schedule slack, MIA may have its problems but suspect its more operational and MIA happens to be the weakest flight so its cut.

An extra two aircraft flying (19) and only 4 free slots with A330s and 1 B752. Remains to be seen if the third A321LR will arrive to provide additional releif.

This year has cost them a lot...
 
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Miami
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Re: Irish 12/18: December Dreaming ...

Thu Dec 27, 2018 5:12 pm

ClassicLover wrote:
Hope this helps!

Thanks!

EI121 wrote:
Aer Lingus reduces MIA to 2 per week in S19 between 09Jun-16Oct. The Friday service has been cancelled.

Source: https://www.routesonline.com/news/38/ai ... y-changes/

I wonder if any other route will see an extra rotation added.

I have heard rumours that the MIA route hasn't performed well - never a good sign when a route is cut frequencies during the busy summer season.

EI121


It is just temporarily (4 months). MIA traffic is at it's best during the winter months and although this may not surprise some, this surprised me.

The flights are never 100%. But they aren't empty either. If the A332 holds 266-271, I've seen the flight on average in both directions around 240 pax. Though, the inbound flight to MIA does better than the outbound.

Maybe the JV will help.
Aviation is proof that given, the will, we have the capacity to achieve the impossible. - Eddie Rickenbacker
 
BrianDromey
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Re: Irish 12/18: December Dreaming ...

Sat Dec 29, 2018 12:07 pm

JAmie2k9 wrote:

They need the extra schedule slack, MIA may have its problems but suspect its more operational and MIA happens to be the weakest flight so its cut.


BA/AA/AY/IB and DL/VS are selling direct/one-stop MIA from London for €308/£279 all the way through to next November with a Saturday night stay. Of that 174.82 is Government Tax, 90 is Fuel/Carrier Surcharge, leaving an underlying fare of £13. It's hardly any wonder that MIA is struggling.
 
eirflot
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Re: Irish 12/18: December Dreaming ...

Sat Dec 29, 2018 12:33 pm

Dont you just live the fuel surcharge! I wonder why unless they hace buggered up their headging!
The UK government tax is staggering- what's the bets it disappears once BREXIT settles in???
We do live in a truly remarkable little country!
 
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OA260
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Re: Irish 12/18: December Dreaming ...

Sat Dec 29, 2018 12:46 pm

Some interesting fares with the new TAP route. MIA is EUR70 base fare plus taxes each way.

VS/UA/LH/KL/BA/AA/IB/LX all have base fares of EUR96 return plus taxes.
 
JAmie2k9
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Re: Irish 12/18: December Dreaming ...

Sat Dec 29, 2018 12:59 pm

BrianDromey wrote:
JAmie2k9 wrote:

They need the extra schedule slack, MIA may have its problems but suspect its more operational and MIA happens to be the weakest flight so its cut.


BA/AA/AY/IB and DL/VS are selling direct/one-stop MIA from London for €308/£279 all the way through to next November with a Saturday night stay. Of that 174.82 is Government Tax, 90 is Fuel/Carrier Surcharge, leaving an underlying fare of £13. It's hardly any wonder that MIA is struggling.


Capacity is gone to SEA, another service that will be daily as soon as fleet allows.
 
BrianDromey
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Re: Irish 12/18: December Dreaming ...

Sat Dec 29, 2018 1:05 pm

eirflot wrote:
Dont you just live the fuel surcharge! I wonder why unless they hace buggered up their headging!
The UK government tax is staggering- what's the bets it disappears once BREXIT settles in???
We do live in a truly remarkable little country!


I think the carrier surcharge is advantageous for airlines in JV's. I think they get to keep all the surcharge, rather than put in in the pot. BA certainly impose a huge carrier surcharge on reward flights, both their own and partners, which they keep.
I think the UK government may be putting taxes up, rather than reducing them, so APD is likely here to stay. If a more left leaning government wins a general election reduction in travel-taxes seems unlikely.
 
shamrock321
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Re: Irish 12/18: December Dreaming ...

Sat Dec 29, 2018 1:32 pm

MIA is one of those routes that busier in winter than summer, loom at BA for example, 3 daily this winter up from 2 and once daily A380.The 3rd daily frequencies stay next summer but no A380.
 
eirflot
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Re: Irish 12/18: December Dreaming ...

Sat Dec 29, 2018 1:49 pm

I was thinking more along the lines of reducing taxes to keep travel UK centered!
 
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OA260
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Re: Irish 12/18: December Dreaming ...

Sat Dec 29, 2018 2:08 pm

eirflot wrote:
I was thinking more along the lines of reducing taxes to keep travel UK centered!


I do not see taxes being reduced to be honest. Whoever remains in power in the UK this time next year will either keep taxes as they are or if Mr C gets in or similar air tax would increase to pay for bringing the rail network back into state control ( because it worked so well last time ) :banghead:

It will also be interesting to see how Ireland balances its books as an emergency budget would be called no doubt increasing travel taxes even if only by EUR10 per passenger.
 
eirflot
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Re: Irish 12/18: December Dreaming ...

Sat Dec 29, 2018 2:31 pm

Just out of curiosity why would there be a need to raise a transport rax? As a country on the edge of the EU, and in the event if BREXIT, i belueve the EU would offer additional support
I know I am being quite simplistic but then does anyone actually know what BREXIT will bring????
 
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OA260
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Re: Irish 12/18: December Dreaming ...

Sat Dec 29, 2018 2:43 pm

eirflot wrote:
Just out of curiosity why would there be a need to raise a transport rax?


In bad times travel and tourism taxes usually get eased to boost inbound tourism as we saw with the low VAT rate for example. When things get back to normal and like Ireland is now booming in terms of tourism growth and air traffic growth the option to raise taxes are more attractive as we have seen in many parts of Europe where city taxes/resort taxes have been introduced for hotels etc...

I guess its easier then hitting those on state pensions or welfare and has less of an impact Domestically ( politically ) . If Ireland does indeed need to raise hard cash which is still as you say unknown travel would be an easy target. The EU do not give something for nothing and Ireland if it needed a bailout would most likely have to ditch its low tax for business. Something that was really a sticking point in the last bailout/economic issues of the PIGS.
 
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IrishTexan
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Re: Irish 12/18: December Dreaming ...

Sat Dec 29, 2018 2:46 pm

shamrock321 wrote:
MIA is one of those routes that busier in winter than summer, loom at BA for example, 3 daily this winter up from 2 and once daily A380.The 3rd daily frequencies stay next summer but no A380.

The third BA MIA flight replaced an AA 777 rotation (which was redeployed as an additional DFW/LHR flight).
 
eirflot
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Re: Irish 12/18: December Dreaming ...

Sat Dec 29, 2018 5:00 pm

OA260
I take your point and I guess anything is possible. We don't have exactly the same view on the EU and what they might so. As I see it, and the crash excepted, the EU has to think favourably on Ireland. The ness could gave been much worse especially if we started proceedings agsinst the two main German banks and the German central bank - a card i believe we still hold!
FR will weather any BREXIT storm, EI less so especially with all that transatlantic connectivity. I have questioned in the past the logic of building additional transatlantic routes without additional short haul feed. It will be interesting to see how BREXIT handles any transatlantic JV especially when the Trump unpredictability is included
Very interesting first half of 2019
 
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shamrock350
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Re: Irish 12/18: December Dreaming ...

Sat Dec 29, 2018 5:55 pm

Seattle going 5 weekly next summer explains the Miami reduction, it's encouraging to see somewhere like SEA doing so well and the amount of capacity being sustained to the west coast when you consider it was abandoned less than a decade ago.

eirflot wrote:
I have questioned in the past the logic of building additional transatlantic routes without additional short haul feed.

The short haul feed manifests itself in more ways than just new routes or frequencies. Aer Lingus already has a pretty extensive short haul network to key European markets but it was primarily focused on the point to point business. A number of adjustments have been made in recent years and they've still got a lot of room to manoeuvre to provide additional connections from the existing network before throwing new routes it at.

I am of the belief, and have been for a while now, that short haul has stagnated, at least network wise and that this side of the business needs reviewing in order to secure future growth and market share. The business case for new aircraft is a long way off but the product is under review, particularly a potential euro business offering but the difference with Aer Lingus is that while some on here scoff at their prices and product, while also singing the praises of their legacy carrier rivals, Aer Lingus still has a much lower cost base than most of these and makes a tasty profit against them without the bells, whistles and inevitable high costs that come with them.

With that in mind, any product enhancement or adjustment and new route needs to guarantee a return from the start and not compromise the hard fought cost base.
 
eirflot
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Re: Irish 12/18: December Dreaming ...

Sat Dec 29, 2018 6:35 pm

I am one that scoffs, as you say, at EIs prices and product. In many cases there is nothing cheap about the fares but the service and products can be cheap. I'm all for cost efficiency but there is a difference between 29.99 and 199.98 or even 299.99! I look forward to the new Aer Space offering, the refreshed brand and the new uniforms but I can help feeling a little concerned at what EI will ultimately end up doing!
Time will tell!
 
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ClassicLover
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Re: Irish 12/18: December Dreaming ...

Sat Dec 29, 2018 9:42 pm

eirflot wrote:
I have questioned in the past the logic of building additional transatlantic routes without additional short haul feed.


Considering the Aer Lingus financial performance and the return on capital percentage, I think we can all conclude that Aer Lingus is doing a lot of things correctly. After all, the purpose of a business is to make money and they're certainly doing that.
I do enjoy a spot of flying, especially when it's not in economy!
 
eirflot
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Re: Irish 12/18: December Dreaming ...

Sun Dec 30, 2018 12:15 am

Never said they shouldn't make money! SWISS and Lufthansa are also making money but their standard of service is better, and there are many ocassions when their fares are better than EI
It is always interesting that money seems to be the only measurable level of success
 
BrianDromey
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Re: Irish 12/18: December Dreaming ...

Sun Dec 30, 2018 1:15 pm

Interesting that SEA is getting an increase in frequency, it's a city I really want to visit soon.

eirflot wrote:
Never said they shouldn't make money! SWISS and Lufthansa are also making money but their standard of service is better, and there are many ocassions when their fares are better than EI
It is always interesting that money seems to be the only measurable level of success


It's a fair comparison if you want to fly to the destinations LH serves non-stop, otherwise less so. Of course LH also offers many destinations that EI can only dream of. EI and LH are very different airlines, serving different markets with very different competition. IAG clearly feel that being a cost leader is extremely important and that this allows them to be also be price leaders, when necessary. IAG has stiff competition at all of their major base cities - Ryanair in Barcelona, Dublin, London, Madrid, Rome and Vienna, easyJet at Amsterdam and Paris. Lufthansa has very little based competition at any of its hub cities, aside from Vienna and easyJet at Geneva.

I totally appreciate your point of view though. I find it difficult to justify £87 difference between FR (including hand luggage) and EI on ORK-LON. As slow as the STN express is and as unpleasant as the terminal at STN is, coming from Central London there isn't that much in it for a one-hour flight.
 
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ClassicLover
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Re: Irish 12/18: December Dreaming ...

Sun Dec 30, 2018 4:51 pm

BrianDromey wrote:
Interesting that SEA is getting an increase in frequency, it's a city I really want to visit soon.


You should, I went in May and it's a fantastic city to visit! Plus you have Boeing there too, and that is certainly well worth it on its own. It's also just a four hour - and pretty scenic - train journey to Vancouver, plus Portland is not far away either and it's also pretty sweet. Love that area of the world - great people, amazing food, and plenty to see.
I do enjoy a spot of flying, especially when it's not in economy!
 
kaitak
Topic Author
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Re: Irish 12/18: December Dreaming ...

Sun Dec 30, 2018 7:34 pm

Looks like the Etihad A330 fleet is being retired quite quickly. 'EYE (the Man City logojet) has already gone to Lourdes and as Skyliner shows (see attached) another four, including a -300, have now gone.

https://www.skyliner-aviation.de/regdb. ... av4&page=2

Catch 'em while you can!
 
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OA260
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Re: Irish 12/18: December Dreaming ...

Sun Dec 30, 2018 7:41 pm

kaitak wrote:
Looks like the Etihad A330 fleet is being retired quite quickly. 'EYE (the Man City logojet) has already gone to Lourdes and as Skyliner shows (see attached) another four, including a -300, have now gone.

https://www.skyliner-aviation.de/regdb. ... av4&page=2

Catch 'em while you can!


Saw the Man City one a few times in DUB. Shame to see it go.
 
BrianDromey
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Re: Irish 12/18: December Dreaming ...

Mon Dec 31, 2018 12:35 am

kaitak wrote:
Looks like the Etihad A330 fleet is being retired quite quickly. 'EYE (the Man City logojet) has already gone to Lourdes and as Skyliner shows (see attached) another four, including a -300, have now gone.


Such is the march of progress, being replaced with 787s, I assume? Airfleets lists 6 as being in storage, I wonder where they will end up. Unfortunately they are RR powered, they might have been good for EI otherwise. Im sure QR can keep a supply of GE engined birds coming, if required!
 
kaitak
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Re: Irish 12/18: December Dreaming ...

Tue Jan 01, 2019 12:18 am

Hello folks! The first thread of 2019 is up and running, here:

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1411823

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