Saudi LCC pick 30 orders + 20 options 737MAX-8 seating 189.

https://boeing.mediaroom.com/2018-12-21 ... 7-MAX-Jets



https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Du9fdT7UYAAZLsu.jpg:large


Currently an A320 operator.

Nice year end boost for Boeing.

Airbus likely believed they could keep them in the family.

This takes the cake for most budget-airline-sounding name of all the budget airlines.

Maybe they can take some of the Max slots if Lion Air follows through on cancelling their large order.

bond787 wrote:

Maybe they can take some of the Max slots if Lion Air follows through on cancelling their large order.

All bluster IMHO. Lion Air may defer, but not major cancellations

Interesting to see another airline flip from A320ceo to 737MAX. I believe that they are part of Saudia

How are they going to fill all the planes... Flynas has 120 planes on orde (30 owned now) r, Flyadeal 50 (10 owned now) , then you have Saudi itself and saudi gulf with 16 planes flying domestic.
The Hajj market, while huge is very very competitive with lots of players.

it's a lot of planes for a not to large market. Is this a bubble?

FlyRow wrote:

How are they going to fill all the planes... Flynas has 120 planes on orde (30 owned now) r, Flyadeal 50 (10 owned now) , then you have Saudi itself and saudi gulf with 16 planes flying domestic.
The Hajj market, while huge is very very competitive with lots of players.

it's a lot of planes for a not to large market. Is this a bubble?

One thing Flyadeal has going for it is that it is government owned (being owned by Saudia).

Polot wrote:

One thing Flyadeal has going for it is that it is government owned (being owned by Saudia).

Could it be related to Individual-1's support for MBS?

I would be surprised if the Airbus Flyadeal fleet did not move over to parent company Saudia. (Flyadeal has 9 planes with 2 more due), ending the last leased passenger capacity operations at Saudia (currently 9 A332/A333 planes leased from Onur Air at 230t or 233t MTOW).

Flyadeal would transition to a B38M operation exclusively with a Y189 seat configuration on its planes. The additional planes would allow Flyadeal to expand into international markets. I'd be surprised if Flyadeal exercised the options, but stranger things have happened. The bigger question would be if Flynas took all the planes it has on order. (A similar airline in the region, Air Arabia, operates across several AOCs.) Great deal for Boeing to get back into the region with narrow-body aircraft after Airbus secured a large lease from Saudia prior (30 A320ceo and 20 A330-300 Regional directly as lessor via IAFC).

Congratulations to Flyadeal and Boeing. I'm not one for purple but that livery is fantastic!!! Can't wait to see it roll off the line at Renton.

Boeing has picked up 80 orders and 70 options in the last couple of days.

Newbiepilot wrote:

Interesting to see another airline flip from A320ceo to 737MAX. I believe that they are part of Saudia

LOL. I thought you worked in the industry?

Meaningless when you consider this procurement decision was taken without Board approval. The MDs, jungle jets and initial tranche of 777s were similarly procured without consultation.

Rank and authority mean everything in that part of the world. When the telephone rings and someone higher than you tells you to do something, you do it.

Antarius wrote:

Boeing has picked up 80 orders and 70 options in the last couple of days.

What orders are you refering to?

chiad wrote:

Antarius wrote:

Boeing has picked up 80 orders and 70 options in the last couple of days.

What orders are you refering to?

This one is 30+20 and the Green Africa one is 50 + 50.

Chaostheory wrote:

Meaningless when you consider this procurement decision was taken without Board approval.

You know this for a fact?

Antarius wrote:

Chaostheory wrote:

Meaningless when you consider this procurement decision was taken without Board approval.

You know this for a fact?

Yes.

No heads up whatsoever.

The airline has its hands full with 777x planning, not enough pilots and cadets and with 2020 round the corner, it's going to get worse. I'm gone next year so not my problem.

One step forward and two steps back with this place.

Antarius wrote:

chiad wrote:

Antarius wrote:

Boeing has picked up 80 orders and 70 options in the last couple of days.

What orders are you refering to?

This one is 30+20 and the Green Africa one is 50 + 50.

They are both commitments to order. Not an unconditional order. Not a conditional order.

An intention to order. The prospective buyer still has to negotiate price, delivery, finance and other terms and conditions, as well as obtain their Board approval.

Commitments are usually broken down into tranches (say purchases of 5 or 10 but can be as low as a single unit), for which each of the above are negotiated / arranged.

So for example, this transaction within 12 months, may consist of an unconditional order for 10, conditional order for 11-20, and the final 10 might still be a commitment.

Always a flurry of commitments late in the calendar year. Feels good for OEM's and airlines (including staff and customers), and gets financiers and leasing companies excited about next year's prospects.

Of course this deal was always going to Boeing. Germany stopped selling arms to Saudi's after Khashoggi murder so no way would they give Airbus any deal.

Strato2 wrote:

Of course this deal was always going to Boeing. Germany stopped selling arms to Saudi's after Khashoggi murder so no way would they give Airbus any deal.

Until the US pressured them to drop the effort last week, the UK and others were also requesting an investigation into Saudi actions in the Yemeni conflict.

Chaostheory wrote:

Antarius wrote:

Chaostheory wrote:

Meaningless when you consider this procurement decision was taken without Board approval.

You know this for a fact?

Yes.

No heads up whatsoever.

The airline has its hands full with 777x planning, not enough pilots and cadets and with 2020 round the corner, it's going to get worse. I'm gone next year so not my problem.

One step forward and two steps back with this place.

Well, you just threw out interesting news (777X planning)....since we were not aware of any 777Xs on order.

smartplane wrote:

Antarius wrote:

chiad wrote:

What orders are you refering to?

This one is 30+20 and the Green Africa one is 50 + 50.

They are both commitments to order. Not an unconditional order. Not a conditional order.

An intention to order. The prospective buyer still has to negotiate price, delivery, finance and other terms and conditions, as well as obtain their Board approval.

Commitments are usually broken down into tranches (say purchases of 5 or 10 but can be as low as a single unit), for which each of the above are negotiated / arranged.

So for example, this transaction within 12 months, may consist of an unconditional order for 10, conditional order for 11-20, and the final 10 might still be a commitment.

Always a flurry of commitments late in the calendar year. Feels good for OEM's and airlines (including staff and customers), and gets financiers and leasing companies excited about next year's prospects.

Exactly.
It's a great chance that some of these commitments will become orders, but probably not all, and certainly not in 2018.

jbs2886 wrote:

Chaostheory wrote:

The airline has its hands full with 777x planning, not enough pilots and cadets and with 2020 round the corner, it's going to get worse.

Well, you just threw out interesting news (777X planning)....since we were not aware of any 777Xs on order.

If hands full with 777X planning, must be taking early deliveries of 779 from an existing customer, suggesting agreement with an airline with existing conditional order, OEM (restraints unless leased from original customer) and Saudia.

Could it be Etihad? Negotiated parallel with the recent code share? Same alliance. Is Skyteam poised to make the first foray into aircraft ownership / lease (most progressive - CORSIA, future opportunities)? Could DL operate a Skyteam 777X in the not too distant future? Or is this an early April 1?

Antarius wrote:

Boeing has picked up 80 orders and 70 options in the last couple of days.

Good for Boeing. Since often options are not excercise, I prefer firm + options to denote.

Lightsaber

smartplane wrote:

jbs2886 wrote:

Chaostheory wrote:

The airline has its hands full with 777x planning, not enough pilots and cadets and with 2020 round the corner, it's going to get worse.

Well, you just threw out interesting news (777X planning)....since we were not aware of any 777Xs on order.

If hands full with 777X planning, must be taking early deliveries of 779 from an existing customer, suggesting agreement with an airline with existing conditional order, OEM (restraints unless leased from original customer) and Saudia.

Could it be Etihad? Negotiated parallel with the recent code share? Same alliance. Is Skyteam poised to make the first foray into aircraft ownership / lease (most progressive - CORSIA, future opportunities)? Could DL operate a Skyteam 777X in the not too distant future? Or is this an early April 1?

Since when is Etihad in SkyTeam? Also, no to all of the foregoing.

I disagree,
The fleet must be from one maker
But maybe in Airbus The production line is full
Saudi flyadeal prefers to receive the aircraft quickly .

Aviationman777 wrote:

I disagree,
The fleet must be from one maker
But maybe in Airbus The production line is full
Saudi flyadeal prefers to receive the aircraft quickly .

The question remains if this will be completely a direct order or some from lessors. This likely does 2 things:

1. Makes F3 an all-B38M operator (the existing A320s move to parent SV)
2. Ends all leased capacity at SV, rationalizing its passenger fleet around 5 models: A320, A321, A333 (Regional), B77W (2-class with 413 seats and 3-class with 292 seats), and B789.

The only future orders for SV for the foreseeable future would be for freighters (to replace leased freighter capacity, a top-up B777F order is possible at the end of the line or new-build B763 frames could be ordered for shorter regional freight) OR VIP frames to replace some of their old VIP planes (their VIP fleet still has B74S, B743, and A342 - the first and last A342 - aircraft in it, although the VIP fleet recently added a B77W).