reltney
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Southwest loses part of stabilizer LAX-Reno 21 Dec

Sun Dec 23, 2018 1:59 pm

Seems SW 5623 lost part of the stab. Or at least it was discovered in Reno. No one knows when it happened. Seems southwest pilots do a walk around once a day instead of every flight so the plane could have had the damage for a few flights? It this a true procedure at SW? I am not sure but if so, that will change.
Reguardless, anyone know the facts and have photos?
Last edited by atcsundevil on Sun Dec 23, 2018 9:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Edited spelling in title
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PlanesNTrains
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Re: Southwest looses part of stab. LAX-Reno 21 dec

Sun Dec 23, 2018 3:12 pm

1. Link?
2. Source for “daily walk around”?

It helps to have a full picture of what we’re discussing.
-Dave


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dcajet
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Re: Southwest looses part of stab. LAX-Reno 21 dec

Sun Dec 23, 2018 3:53 pm

It was flight WN5623 on 12/20, LAX-RNO, 737-800 N245WN. Birdstrike.

Image
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joeblow10
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Re: Southwest looses part of stab. LAX-Reno 21 dec

Sun Dec 23, 2018 4:16 pm

Minor corrections:
A) 737-700
B) N254WN

http://avherald.com/h?article=4c1da4c4&opt=0

Avherald doesnt say it’s a bird strike yet... but based on the photos that seems likely. We’ll see if this changes WN walk around policy (which I believe is for a ground engineer to conduct, could be mistaken though)

Edited to add: Also... FAA incidents report says they found the damage during the next preflight... so assuming it hadnt occurred earlier than this flight, seems the preflight is doing the job
Last edited by joeblow10 on Sun Dec 23, 2018 4:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
msycajun
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Re: Southwest looses part of stab. LAX-Reno 21 dec

Sun Dec 23, 2018 4:18 pm

Looks like the front fell off
 
smokeybandit
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Re: Southwest looses part of stab. LAX-Reno 21 dec

Sun Dec 23, 2018 4:35 pm

dcajet wrote:
It was flight WN5623 on 12/20, LAX-RNO, 737-800 N245WN. Birdstrike.

Image



THat picture is from a flight in November

https://twitter.com/CFlorijan/status/10 ... 5936667649
 
737MAX7
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Re: Southwest looses part of stab. LAX-Reno 21 dec

Sun Dec 23, 2018 4:45 pm

reltney wrote:
Seems SW 5623 lost part of the stab. Or at least it was discovered in Reno. No one knows when it happened. Seems southwest pilots do a walk around once a day instead of every flight so the plane could have had the damage for a few flights? It this a true procedure at SW? I am not sure but if so, that will change.
Reguardless, anyone know the facts and have photos?

Anytime there is a crew change the FO does a walk around and the ramp does one on every turn.
 
coolian2
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Re: Southwest looses part of stab. LAX-Reno 21 dec

Sun Dec 23, 2018 10:25 pm

msycajun wrote:
Looks like the front fell off

Well yes, the front fell of this one.
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kabq737
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Re: Southwest loses part of stabilizer LAX-Reno 21 Dec

Mon Dec 24, 2018 6:21 am

If anyone ever wonders what’s wrong with A.net these days all they have to do is read a thread like this. Things get really petty really fast around here.

Any updates on the actual incident at hand?
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PlanesNTrains
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Re: Southwest loses part of stabilizer LAX-Reno 21 Dec

Mon Dec 24, 2018 4:14 pm

kabq737 wrote:
If anyone ever wonders what’s wrong with A.net these days all they have to do is read a thread like this. Things get really petty really fast around here.

Any updates on the actual incident at hand?


Fair enough. But:

1. Where is the O.P.?
2. What is the source?
3. Why say WN (not SW) doesn’t do preflight walk-around?

If you’re going to post a thread and make accusations, at least be involved in the discussion so we can discuss what’s going on.
-Dave


MAX’d out on MAX threads. If you are starting a thread, and it’s about the MAX - stop. There’s already a thread that covers it.
 
F9Animal
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Re: Southwest loses part of stabilizer LAX-Reno 21 Dec

Mon Dec 24, 2018 4:22 pm

WN always does a pretrip inspection on every single flight. Ramp also does this as well. When I worked at US, I recall seeing the FO do his walk around. Just before pushback, I did my quick walk around to ensure there was no equipment or FOD. I just happened to look up at the Horizontal Stab and noticed what looked like a dent. This was on an Airbus 321, and the lighting was pretty bad as the sun was setting. I asked the crew to come take a look with me just to be safe. Of course they went out and could see what I saw. They got the deice truck and went up for a better look. Sure as can be, it was a previous bird strike.

My point is, there are practices in place that have more than one set of eyes on the machine. WN has a pretty darned incredible safety record, and I am 110% certain they do a walk around for every flight. I have seen it first hand.
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kabq737
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Re: Southwest loses part of stabilizer LAX-Reno 21 Dec

Mon Dec 24, 2018 4:31 pm

PlanesNTrains wrote:
kabq737 wrote:
If anyone ever wonders what’s wrong with A.net these days all they have to do is read a thread like this. Things get really petty really fast around here.

Any updates on the actual incident at hand?


Fair enough. But:

1. Where is the O.P.?
2. What is the source?
3. Why say WN (not SW) doesn’t do preflight walk-around?

If you’re going to post a thread and make accusations, at least be involved in the discussion so we can discuss what’s going on.


I agree completely and I’m criticizing the OP just as much as anybody else here. I consider the false accusations from everybody here to be petty and misleading. I think we’re in agreement here we’re just stating it differently.
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PlanesNTrains
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Re: Southwest loses part of stabilizer LAX-Reno 21 Dec

Mon Dec 24, 2018 4:33 pm

kabq737 wrote:
PlanesNTrains wrote:
kabq737 wrote:
If anyone ever wonders what’s wrong with A.net these days all they have to do is read a thread like this. Things get really petty really fast around here.

Any updates on the actual incident at hand?


Fair enough. But:

1. Where is the O.P.?
2. What is the source?
3. Why say WN (not SW) doesn’t do preflight walk-around?

If you’re going to post a thread and make accusations, at least be involved in the discussion so we can discuss what’s going on.


I agree completely and I’m criticizing the OP just as much as anybody else here. I consider the false accusations from everybody here to be petty and misleading. I think we’re in agreement here we’re just stating it differently.


Well hopefully he’ll return.
-Dave


MAX’d out on MAX threads. If you are starting a thread, and it’s about the MAX - stop. There’s already a thread that covers it.
 
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seabosdca
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Re: Southwest loses part of stabilizer LAX-Reno 21 Dec

Mon Dec 24, 2018 8:53 pm

The photo says it all.

OP started the thread in a very bad way but it ended up conveying interesting information. Birds + leading edges = a loss for everyone involved.
 
barney captain
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Re: Southwest loses part of stabilizer LAX-Reno 21 Dec

Mon Dec 24, 2018 10:57 pm

seabosdca wrote:
The photo says it all.

OP started the thread in a very bad way but it ended up conveying interesting information. Birds + leading edges = a loss for everyone involved.


As was pointed out - that isn't the photo for this incident. That was from a bird strike back in November.

I've seen the actual photo of this incident (and am not at liberty to post it). It looks very much like the one already posted - minus any hint of blood or feathers. To say it "lost part of the stab" is wildly inaccurate. There's a gash in the leading edge, that looks to have been caused by something other than an animal. It would have been nearly impossible to miss that on the pre-flight (which gets done every leg btw), so it likely happened while airborne.
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kalvado
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Re: Southwest loses part of stabilizer LAX-Reno 21 Dec

Mon Dec 24, 2018 11:54 pm

barney captain wrote:

I've seen the actual photo of this incident (and am not at liberty to post it). It looks very much like the one already posted - minus any hint of blood or feathers. To say it "lost part of the stab" is wildly inaccurate. There's a gash in the leading edge, that looks to have been caused by something other than an animal. It would have been nearly impossible to miss that on the pre-flight (which gets done every leg btw), so it likely happened while airborne.

Sound as if we have widespread drone epidemic?
 
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Re: Southwest loses part of stabilizer LAX-Reno 21 Dec

Tue Dec 25, 2018 2:33 am

To the comment about pre-flight walk arounds, as mentioned above the First Officer performs a walk around on originating and terminating aircraft and before any flight involving a crew change. Ramp Agents do a walk around before every departure including flights where the FO did a walk around so many flights have two sets of eyes looking them over.

Ramp Agents take it very seriously. We report anything we see that requires the Captain’s attention, even if it’s common or trivial and we know the likely response. If we see something, we say something.
ALL views, opinions expressed are mine ONLY and are NOT representative of those shared by Southwest Airlines Co.
 
kiowa
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Re: Southwest loses part of stabilizer LAX-Reno 21 Dec

Tue Dec 25, 2018 3:02 pm

Silver1SWA wrote:
To the comment about pre-flight walk arounds, as mentioned above the First Officer performs a walk around on originating and terminating aircraft and before any flight involving a crew change. Ramp Agents do a walk around before every departure including flights where the FO did a walk around so many flights have two sets of eyes looking them over.

Ramp Agents take it very seriously. We report anything we see that requires the Captain’s attention, even if it’s common or trivial and we know the likely response. If we see something, we say something.


So if it a through- flight with no change in crew, neither pilot does a walk around?

I don’t think this is true with most airlines.
 
Cubsrule
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Re: Southwest loses part of stabilizer LAX-Reno 21 Dec

Tue Dec 25, 2018 3:29 pm

kiowa wrote:
Silver1SWA wrote:
To the comment about pre-flight walk arounds, as mentioned above the First Officer performs a walk around on originating and terminating aircraft and before any flight involving a crew change. Ramp Agents do a walk around before every departure including flights where the FO did a walk around so many flights have two sets of eyes looking them over.

Ramp Agents take it very seriously. We report anything we see that requires the Captain’s attention, even if it’s common or trivial and we know the likely response. If we see something, we say something.


So if it a through- flight with no change in crew, neither pilot does a walk around?

I don’t think this is true with most airlines.


I’d be surprised if an airline like DL or UA that almost exclusively operates turns has a procedure specific to thru flights. Look at the percentage of WN pilots who change aircraft at MDW versus AA or UA (and regional) pilots at ORD and you’ll see a huge difference.

While an interesting labor relations question, I’m not sure that the identity of the person who walks around (pilot versus A&P versus ramper) affects safety all that much. Walkarounds are very easily trainable. It’s just a checklist. And I’ve certainly had flights over the years where the pilot has walked around and a ramper notices something concerning that the pilot missed.
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BravoOne
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Re: Southwest loses part of stabilizer LAX-Reno 21 Dec

Tue Dec 25, 2018 3:29 pm

I know that DL does a walk around after every landing. No exceptions, and I would imagine that is SOP for all US Part 121 carriers. Check the tires, struts, leading edge, radome, pitot tubes, AOA, position lights, fluid leaks, for starters. Only takes a few minutes. Mechanics do a similar inspection.
 
kiowa
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Re: Southwest loses part of stabilizer LAX-Reno 21 Dec

Tue Dec 25, 2018 4:13 pm

Cubsrule wrote:
kiowa wrote:
Silver1SWA wrote:
To the comment about pre-flight walk arounds, as mentioned above the First Officer performs a walk around on originating and terminating aircraft and before any flight involving a crew change. Ramp Agents do a walk around before every departure including flights where the FO did a walk around so many flights have two sets of eyes looking them over.

Ramp Agents take it very seriously. We report anything we see that requires the Captain’s attention, even if it’s common or trivial and we know the likely response. If we see something, we say something.


So if it a through- flight with no change in crew, neither pilot does a walk around?

I don’t think this is true with most airlines.


I’d be surprised if an airline like DL or UA that almost exclusively operates turns has a procedure specific to thru flights. Look at the percentage of WN pilots who change aircraft at MDW versus AA or UA (and regional) pilots at ORD and you’ll see a huge difference.

While an interesting labor relations question, I’m not sure that the identity of the person who walks around (pilot versus A&P versus ramper) affects safety all that much. Walkarounds are very easily trainable. It’s just a checklist. And I’ve certainly had flights over the years where the pilot has walked around and a ramper notices something concerning that the pilot missed.


It’s just a checklist??

Are you okay with the receptionist doing a “checklist “ and reading your chest X-ray or would you rather have a physician do it?
 
Cubsrule
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Re: Southwest loses part of stabilizer LAX-Reno 21 Dec

Tue Dec 25, 2018 4:24 pm

kiowa wrote:
Cubsrule wrote:
kiowa wrote:

So if it a through- flight with no change in crew, neither pilot does a walk around?

I don’t think this is true with most airlines.


I’d be surprised if an airline like DL or UA that almost exclusively operates turns has a procedure specific to thru flights. Look at the percentage of WN pilots who change aircraft at MDW versus AA or UA (and regional) pilots at ORD and you’ll see a huge difference.

While an interesting labor relations question, I’m not sure that the identity of the person who walks around (pilot versus A&P versus ramper) affects safety all that much. Walkarounds are very easily trainable. It’s just a checklist. And I’ve certainly had flights over the years where the pilot has walked around and a ramper notices something concerning that the pilot missed.


It’s just a checklist??

Are you okay with the receptionist doing a “checklist “ and reading your chest X-ray or would you rather have a physician do it?


In the first instance yes. Whether the first officer or a ramper does the walkaround, the person who performs it does not have final authority to accept the airplane in the condition that it's in. They are flagging issues for the captain, not making a decision about whether to fly. That decision ought to rest with the captain, dispatch, and maintenance if necessary.
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longhauler
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Re: Southwest loses part of stabilizer LAX-Reno 21 Dec

Tue Dec 25, 2018 4:25 pm

BravoOne wrote:
I would imagine that is SOP for all US Part 121 carriers. Check the tires, struts, leading edge, radome, pitot tubes, AOA, position lights, fluid leaks, for starters. Only takes a few minutes. Mechanics do a similar inspection.

The walk around must be done, it does not necessarily need to be done by a pilot. Remember, Southwest "invented" the fast turnaround 50+ years ago. A part of that "invention" is not taking the pilots out of the cockpit during the turn, when someone equally as qualified can do it.

kiowa wrote:
It’s just a checklist??

Are you okay with the receptionist doing a “checklist “ and reading your chest X-ray or would you rather have a physician do it?


A "checklist" would be how it is learned, just like how a Radiologist learns to read an x-ray/radiograph. But after thousands of reads, one learns what is normal and what is not. Much like if a non-pilot ramp agent did dozens of walk arounds a day, it wouldn't take long before his inspection was first rate ... and it started with a checklist.
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Babyshark
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Re: Southwest loses part of stabilizer LAX-Reno 21 Dec

Tue Dec 25, 2018 4:26 pm

reltney wrote:
Seems SW 5623 lost part of the stab. Or at least it was discovered in Reno. No one knows when it happened. Seems southwest pilots do a walk around once a day instead of every flight so the plane could have had the damage for a few flights? It this a true procedure at SW? I am not sure but if so, that will change.
Reguardless, anyone know the facts and have photos?


No. Just no.
 
n757kw
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Re: Southwest loses part of stabilizer LAX-Reno 21 Dec

Tue Dec 25, 2018 4:32 pm

My company loves checklists. There is a checklist for almost everything.

The flight crew has a checklist for the walk around. Some of them carry it with them on the walk around. The flight crew performs the walk around prior to every departure.

The maintenance staff has a checklist. They perform a walk around after arrival and prior to departure.

Ground staff also have a checklist. We do our own walk around after arrival and prior to departure.

N757KW
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kiowa
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Re: Southwest loses part of stabilizer LAX-Reno 21 Dec

Tue Dec 25, 2018 4:37 pm

longhauler wrote:
BravoOne wrote:
I would imagine that is SOP for all US Part 121 carriers. Check the tires, struts, leading edge, radome, pitot tubes, AOA, position lights, fluid leaks, for starters. Only takes a few minutes. Mechanics do a similar inspection.

The walk around must be done, it does not necessarily need to be done by a pilot. Remember, Southwest "invented" the fast turnaround 50+ years ago. A part of that "invention" is not taking the pilots out of the cockpit during the turn, when someone equally as qualified can do it.

kiowa wrote:
It’s just a checklist??

Are you okay with the receptionist doing a “checklist “ and reading your chest X-ray or would you rather have a physician do it?


A "checklist" would be how it is learned, just like how a Radiologist learns to read an x-ray/radiograph. But after thousands of reads, one learns what is normal and what is not. Much like if a non-pilot ramp agent did dozens of walk arounds a day, it wouldn't take long before his inspection was first rate ... and it started with a checklist.


Huge disagree. I doubt most rampers have the longevity or interest to identity what an hf antenna looks like. They also do not have the “skin” in the game that the pilot does.
 
Silver1SWA
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Re: Southwest loses part of stabilizer LAX-Reno 21 Dec

Tue Dec 25, 2018 5:10 pm

kiowa wrote:
longhauler wrote:
BravoOne wrote:
I would imagine that is SOP for all US Part 121 carriers. Check the tires, struts, leading edge, radome, pitot tubes, AOA, position lights, fluid leaks, for starters. Only takes a few minutes. Mechanics do a similar inspection.

The walk around must be done, it does not necessarily need to be done by a pilot. Remember, Southwest "invented" the fast turnaround 50+ years ago. A part of that "invention" is not taking the pilots out of the cockpit during the turn, when someone equally as qualified can do it.

kiowa wrote:
It’s just a checklist??

Are you okay with the receptionist doing a “checklist “ and reading your chest X-ray or would you rather have a physician do it?


A "checklist" would be how it is learned, just like how a Radiologist learns to read an x-ray/radiograph. But after thousands of reads, one learns what is normal and what is not. Much like if a non-pilot ramp agent did dozens of walk arounds a day, it wouldn't take long before his inspection was first rate ... and it started with a checklist.


Huge disagree. I doubt most rampers have the longevity or interest to identity what an hf antenna looks like. They also do not have the “skin” in the game that the pilot does.


Pilots will often tell you they can fly the plane but they know nothing about the mechanical workings of an aircraft.

The purpose of the walk around is to give it a final glance, using a “checklist” of items to focus on. Ramp Agents spend a lot more time looking at the exterior and it doesn’t take long working around aircraft to have something unusual catch your attention. I’ve spotted issues (open panels, missing parts etc) from three gates away by just glancing at the action on ramp.

It’s not an in-depth maintenance check. It’s a final look for dents, open doors or panels, leaks etc. If we see something, we tell the Captain and they will call MX control to determine if a mechanic needs to be called over.

And FWIW, I’ve spotted things after the FO already completed the walk around.
ALL views, opinions expressed are mine ONLY and are NOT representative of those shared by Southwest Airlines Co.
 
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longhauler
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Re: Southwest loses part of stabilizer LAX-Reno 21 Dec

Tue Dec 25, 2018 5:19 pm

kiowa wrote:
Huge disagree. I doubt most rampers have the longevity or interest to identity what an hf antenna looks like. They also do not have the “skin” in the game that the pilot does.

A ramp agent doesn't need to know what an HF antenna is, nor its purpose. He does however, know what it should look like, if it doesn't look "right" and where it should be.

A ramp agent has as much "skin" in the game as the person who maintained the aircraft, who fueled the aircraft, who calculated the weight & balance, who loaded the cargo correctly, etc etc etc. None of who are riding on the aircraft, but ... are concerned about the welfare of the passengers and the reputation of the company.

Where I fly, one of the pilots does the walk around. But ... on many occasions a ramp agent has come up to the cockpit with a query about how something looks. I always go and check it out. Sometimes he is right, sometimes he is not ... however the interaction always starts with me thanking him for his concern, and encouraging him to raise a concern again.

They may not be flying the aircraft, but they spend more time looking at the outiside of an airplane than I ever will!
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Cubsrule
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Re: Southwest loses part of stabilizer LAX-Reno 21 Dec

Tue Dec 25, 2018 5:54 pm

longhauler wrote:
Where I fly, one of the pilots does the walk around. But ... on many occasions a ramp agent has come up to the cockpit with a query about how something looks. I always go and check it out. Sometimes he is right, sometimes he is not ... however the interaction always starts with me thanking him for his concern, and encouraging him to raise a concern again.

They may not be flying the aircraft, but they spend more time looking at the outiside of an airplane than I ever will!


Correct. And I would imagine that quite frequently, your reaction to a ramp agent who is “right” is calling maintenance to come take a look.
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Antarius
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Re: Southwest loses part of stabilizer LAX-Reno 21 Dec

Tue Dec 25, 2018 6:05 pm

longhauler wrote:
kiowa wrote:
A ramp agent has as much "skin" in the game as the person who maintained the aircraft, who fueled the aircraft, who calculated the weight & balance, who loaded the cargo correctly, etc etc etc. None of who are riding on the aircraft, but ... are concerned about the welfare of the passengers and the reputation of the company.


This x 1000000000000...

And all the listed people above may not be riding that flight, but they may be taking the next one or the one after that. And I'm sure they wouldn't want the rampers and co. to say "meh, i'm not on board".

Aviation is so safe because safety is everyone's job.
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Whiteguy
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Re: Southwest loses part of stabilizer LAX-Reno 21 Dec

Tue Dec 25, 2018 8:53 pm

longhauler wrote:
kiowa wrote:
Huge disagree. I doubt most rampers have the longevity or interest to identity what an hf antenna looks like. They also do not have the “skin” in the game that the pilot does.

A ramp agent doesn't need to know what an HF antenna is, nor its purpose. He does however, know what it should look like, if it doesn't look "right" and where it should be.

A ramp agent has as much "skin" in the game as the person who maintained the aircraft, who fueled the aircraft, who calculated the weight & balance, who loaded the cargo correctly, etc etc etc. None of who are riding on the aircraft, but ... are concerned about the welfare of the passengers and the reputation of the company.

Where I fly, one of the pilots does the walk around. But ... on many occasions a ramp agent has come up to the cockpit with a query about how something looks. I always go and check it out. Sometimes he is right, sometimes he is not ... however the interaction always starts with me thanking him for his concern, and encouraging him to raise a concern again.

They may not be flying the aircraft, but they spend more time looking at the outiside of an airplane than I ever will!


When I was lead on the ramp we always did an arrival walk around and another for departure. More then a couple times things were found by the ramp guys and gals. Always good to have more then a few sets of eyes looking. One example was an AC B763 having a panel missing on the verified stab, lead saw it on the walk around prior to departure for LHR.
Last edited by Whiteguy on Tue Dec 25, 2018 8:54 pm, edited 2 times in total.
 
Whiteguy
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Re: Southwest loses part of stabilizer LAX-Reno 21 Dec

Tue Dec 25, 2018 8:53 pm

longhauler wrote:
kiowa wrote:
Huge disagree. I doubt most rampers have the longevity or interest to identity what an hf antenna looks like. They also do not have the “skin” in the game that the pilot does.

A ramp agent doesn't need to know what an HF antenna is, nor its purpose. He does however, know what it should look like, if it doesn't look "right" and where it should be.

A ramp agent has as much "skin" in the game as the person who maintained the aircraft, who fueled the aircraft, who calculated the weight & balance, who loaded the cargo correctly, etc etc etc. None of who are riding on the aircraft, but ... are concerned about the welfare of the passengers and the reputation of the company.

Where I fly, one of the pilots does the walk around. But ... on many occasions a ramp agent has come up to the cockpit with a query about how something looks. I always go and check it out. Sometimes he is right, sometimes he is not ... however the interaction always starts with me thanking him for his concern, and encouraging him to raise a concern again.

They may not be flying the aircraft, but they spend more time looking at the outiside of an airplane than I ever will!


When I was a lead on the ramp we always did an arrival walk around and another for departure. More then a couple times things were found by the ramp guys and gals. Always good to have more then a few sets of eyes looking. One example was an AC B763 having a panel missing on the verified stab, lead saw it on the walk around prior to departure for LHR.
 
INFINITI329
Posts: 2434
Joined: Mon Jul 02, 2012 12:53 am

Re: Southwest loses part of stabilizer LAX-Reno 21 Dec

Wed Dec 26, 2018 2:08 am

kiowa wrote:
Huge disagree. I doubt most rampers have the longevity or interest to identity what an hf antenna looks like. They also do not have the “skin” in the game that the pilot does.


Get off your high horse. Rampers arent dumb. Most airlines train their rampers to understand the critical parts of the exterior of aircraft, to include antennas. If something looks abnormal or sketchy the captain is alerted. He/she determines how important or minor something is. Wheater that airplane departs lies soley with them. Properly trained ramp agents are more than capable of completing a walk around its not rocket science. You are not asking them to shoot an ILS down to minimums, even though some ramp agents can because they are instrument pilots.......
 
kiowa
Posts: 520
Joined: Wed Jun 08, 2011 12:37 am

Re: Southwest loses part of stabilizer LAX-Reno 21 Dec

Wed Dec 26, 2018 11:28 pm

INFINITI329 wrote:
kiowa wrote:
Huge disagree. I doubt most rampers have the longevity or interest to identity what an hf antenna looks like. They also do not have the “skin” in the game that the pilot does.


Get off your high horse. Rampers arent dumb. Most airlines train their rampers to understand the critical parts of the exterior of aircraft, to include antennas. If something looks abnormal or sketchy the captain is alerted. He/she determines how important or minor something is. Wheater that airplane departs lies soley with them. Properly trained ramp agents are more than capable of completing a walk around its not rocket science. You are not asking them to shoot an ILS down to minimums, even though some ramp agents can because they are instrument pilots.......


Ouch! I did not mean to step on anyone’s toes. Of course rampers are not dumb and most of them can spell fairly well. Obviously not all of them though.
 
reltney
Topic Author
Posts: 439
Joined: Fri Jun 25, 2004 1:34 am

Re: Southwest loses part of stabilizer LAX-Reno 21 Dec

Fri Dec 28, 2018 9:40 pm

kabq737 wrote:
If anyone ever wonders what’s wronvg with A.net these days all they have to do is read a thread like this. Things get really petty really fast around here.

Any updates on the actual incident at hand?



Exactly! Anyone know facts? That’s it but of course, the thread takes a knife and implication of its own...

Cheers
Knives don't kill people. People with knives kill people.
OUTLAW KNIVES.

I am a pilot, therefore I envy no one...
 
PlanesNTrains
Posts: 9527
Joined: Tue Feb 01, 2005 4:19 pm

Re: Southwest loses part of stabilizer LAX-Reno 21 Dec

Fri Dec 28, 2018 10:43 pm

reltney wrote:
kabq737 wrote:
If anyone ever wonders what’s wronvg with A.net these days all they have to do is read a thread like this. Things get really petty really fast around here.

Any updates on the actual incident at hand?



Exactly! Anyone know facts? That’s it but of course, the thread takes a knife and implication of its own...

Cheers


1. You provided zero sources or info.
2. You implied WN crews aren’t doing regular walk-arounds.
3. You waited five days to return to the thread.

What did you expect?
-Dave


MAX’d out on MAX threads. If you are starting a thread, and it’s about the MAX - stop. There’s already a thread that covers it.

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