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User avatar
AAR
Posts: 51
Joined: Mon Mar 05, 2018 7:58 pm

Re: Nordic Aviation - 2019

Tue Feb 05, 2019 2:10 pm

SAS should sell all LHR slots and move to other airports.
 
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SASViking
Posts: 144
Joined: Mon Dec 05, 2011 12:06 pm

Re: Nordic Aviation - 2019

Tue Feb 05, 2019 2:14 pm

AAR wrote:
SAS should sell all LHR slots and move to other airports.

That would be suicide for SAS
Types flown: A319, A320, A32N, A321, A332, A333, A343, AT43, AT75, AT76, B717, B732, B735, B736, B737, B738, B752, B753, CRJ9, DC10, DH4D, DHC3, E135, E145, E175, E190, E195, F100, MD11, MD81, MD82, MD87, RJ1H
 
Asiaflyer
Posts: 847
Joined: Fri May 11, 2007 11:50 am

Re: Nordic Aviation - 2019

Tue Feb 05, 2019 2:19 pm

SASViking wrote:
TUGMASTER wrote:
WOW.... more slots sold...?

Yes, sadly. But also because SAS have a CEO that would rather see SAS as a LCC competing with airlines like Norwegian, EasyJet and Ryanair. I'm surpriced they even bother with it, when their attempt on GOT-STN was a massive failure

I might have missed it, but has there been anything official about LHR slots sold?
I humble disagree with your critisism about SAS CEO. To me, he is keeping business up very well despite the fierce competition from Norwegian, Ryanair, Wizz etc.Richard Gustfsson is by far the best CEO SAS have had for a long time.
SQ,MI,MH,CX,KA,CA,CZ,MU,KE,OZ,QF,NZ,FD,JQ,3K,5J,IT,AI,IC,QR,SK,LF,KL,AF,LH,LX,OS,SR,BA,SN,FR,WF,1I,5T,VZ,VX,AC,NW,UA,US,
 
minilinde
Posts: 83
Joined: Sat Dec 31, 2005 1:16 am

Re: Nordic Aviation - 2019

Tue Feb 05, 2019 2:22 pm

That timetable does not cater business travel, so these flights are for leisure travelers to London. A LOT of traffic for London are leisure purpose, and these flights might defend a higher price on LHR, and then use SAS Ireland to compete against EasyJet etc. Ryanair are not really a direct competitor in my book.. A lot of travelers in the Scandinavian market refuse to use them due to lack of unions, and Ryanair seems to have a really bad safety image in the mind of Scandinavians.
 
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SASViking
Posts: 144
Joined: Mon Dec 05, 2011 12:06 pm

Re: Nordic Aviation - 2019

Tue Feb 05, 2019 2:28 pm

Asiaflyer wrote:
SASViking wrote:
TUGMASTER wrote:
WOW.... more slots sold...?

Yes, sadly. But also because SAS have a CEO that would rather see SAS as a LCC competing with airlines like Norwegian, EasyJet and Ryanair. I'm surpriced they even bother with it, when their attempt on GOT-STN was a massive failure

I might have missed it, but has there been anything official about LHR slots sold?
I humble disagree with your critisism about SAS CEO. To me, he is keeping business up very well despite the fierce competition from Norwegian, Ryanair, Wizz etc.Richard Gustfsson is by far the best CEO SAS have had for a long time.

It's behind a paywall in a Danish news site called check-in.dk.
It's the slots they sold in spring 2017 that they'll lose in October.

Sure SAS is earning money currently. But they're slowly losing loyalty from their main costumer base because of all the cuts, in the long term that could be fatal.
Types flown: A319, A320, A32N, A321, A332, A333, A343, AT43, AT75, AT76, B717, B732, B735, B736, B737, B738, B752, B753, CRJ9, DC10, DH4D, DHC3, E135, E145, E175, E190, E195, F100, MD11, MD81, MD82, MD87, RJ1H
 
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SASViking
Posts: 144
Joined: Mon Dec 05, 2011 12:06 pm

Re: Nordic Aviation - 2019

Tue Feb 05, 2019 2:45 pm

minilinde wrote:
That timetable does not cater business travel, so these flights are for leisure travelers to London. A LOT of traffic for London are leisure purpose, and these flights might defend a higher price on LHR, and then use SAS Ireland to compete against EasyJet etc. Ryanair are not really a direct competitor in my book.. A lot of travelers in the Scandinavian market refuse to use them due to lack of unions, and Ryanair seems to have a really bad safety image in the mind of Scandinavians.

SK503/504 is also used by many for connections. I've flown that flight often and most of the time it's been a full A321 often overbooked with pax moved onto SK505, which in my experience is rather empty.
I don't agree with the statement regarding Ryanair, they're growing especially in Denmark (mainly CPH). A lot of Danes don't care about anything but price because they're miserly. That's apart of Danish mentality. Those who dislike Ryanair, Together with Norwegian and EasyJet, are the usually the "SAS-segment"
Types flown: A319, A320, A32N, A321, A332, A333, A343, AT43, AT75, AT76, B717, B732, B735, B736, B737, B738, B752, B753, CRJ9, DC10, DH4D, DHC3, E135, E145, E175, E190, E195, F100, MD11, MD81, MD82, MD87, RJ1H
 
seansasLCY
Posts: 963
Joined: Mon Mar 19, 2007 5:25 am

Re: Nordic Aviation - 2019

Tue Feb 05, 2019 2:53 pm

minilinde wrote:
That timetable does not cater business travel, so these flights are for leisure travelers to London. A LOT of traffic for London are leisure purpose, and these flights might defend a higher price on LHR, and then use SAS Ireland to compete against EasyJet etc. Ryanair are not really a direct competitor in my book.. A lot of travelers in the Scandinavian market refuse to use them due to lack of unions, and Ryanair seems to have a really bad safety image in the mind of Scandinavians.


If Scandinavian's cared about labour practices and unions then Norwegian wouldn't have done so well.

This is a bad move by SAS. They can't compete on price with Ryanair or Easyjet so why try? They would be better off moving flights to LCY - at least they could still charge a premium.
 
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QuawerAir
Posts: 814
Joined: Sun Jun 25, 2017 9:44 am

Re: Nordic Aviation - 2019

Tue Feb 05, 2019 2:58 pm

Stansted might be a good option for those who don't want to go through the busy LHR. However, I'm not sure how busy and crowded STN is. Google Maps shows that the distance between Heathrow and Central London is 30 min by train and Stansted to London is 50 min. I don't think an additional 20 minutes is bad.

And about Juneyao Airlines:
HO seems to offer cheaper flights from HEL to PVG than AY but since HO is much less known airline than AY, it's a good way to attract passengers. Skyscanner shows the ticket price (Economy) of €862 onboard AY and for HO, €780.
Last edited by QuawerAir on Tue Feb 05, 2019 3:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.
ATL, AYT, FRA, FUE, HEL, JFK, LCA, LHR, MUC | AY, BA, DL, FH, LH, LO | A320, A321, A333, 752, 764, 772, 788
The word "Quawer" means nothing but it looks great.
 
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SASViking
Posts: 144
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Re: Nordic Aviation - 2019

Tue Feb 05, 2019 3:02 pm

seansasLCY wrote:
minilinde wrote:
That timetable does not cater business travel, so these flights are for leisure travelers to London. A LOT of traffic for London are leisure purpose, and these flights might defend a higher price on LHR, and then use SAS Ireland to compete against EasyJet etc. Ryanair are not really a direct competitor in my book.. A lot of travelers in the Scandinavian market refuse to use them due to lack of unions, and Ryanair seems to have a really bad safety image in the mind of Scandinavians.


If Scandinavian's cared about labour practices and unions then Norwegian wouldn't have done so well.

This is a bad move by SAS. They can't compete on price with Ryanair or Easyjet so why try? They would be better off moving flights to LCY - at least they could still charge a premium.

I agree with you on everything you say here. LCY would be s great addition to SAS' network but sadly they don't have the aircraft type for it.
Types flown: A319, A320, A32N, A321, A332, A333, A343, AT43, AT75, AT76, B717, B732, B735, B736, B737, B738, B752, B753, CRJ9, DC10, DH4D, DHC3, E135, E145, E175, E190, E195, F100, MD11, MD81, MD82, MD87, RJ1H
 
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SASViking
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Re: Nordic Aviation - 2019

Tue Feb 05, 2019 3:03 pm

QuawerAir wrote:
Stansted might be a good option for those who don't want to go through the busy LHR. However, I'm not sure how busy and crowded STN is. Google Maps shows that the distance between Heathrow and Central London is 30 min by train and Stansted to London is 50 min. I don't think an additional 20 minutes is bad.

Heathrow Express only takes 15 minutes to Central London (Paddington Station)
Types flown: A319, A320, A32N, A321, A332, A333, A343, AT43, AT75, AT76, B717, B732, B735, B736, B737, B738, B752, B753, CRJ9, DC10, DH4D, DHC3, E135, E145, E175, E190, E195, F100, MD11, MD81, MD82, MD87, RJ1H
 
IADCA
Posts: 1846
Joined: Mon Feb 26, 2007 12:24 am

Re: Nordic Aviation - 2019

Tue Feb 05, 2019 3:06 pm

minilinde wrote:
Anybody have any insigths into LN-RKS's trip to SBD. I believe LN-RKS got struck by a ground vehicle in ORD, and then got ferried to SBD for service. Flew ORD-SBD on 30th JAN.


That was a long time in ORD before they ferried it, so the damage must not be too minor. The damage happened on January 16th or so. I had a flight take a cancellation on the 21st because of this incident, and the agent on the phone mentioned that the plane was damaged on the ground in Chicago but nothing more. It looks like the flight down to SBD did go up to 40,000 feet so it at least isn't having pressure problems.
 
Oykie
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Re: Nordic Aviation - 2019

Tue Feb 05, 2019 3:20 pm

I’m sad to see SAS leave LHR, and it makes Star alliance weaker, I have been flying with SAS to LHR and connected with United to the states. That will be more difficult going forward.
Dream no small dream; it lacks magic. Dream large, then go make that dream real - Donald Douglas
 
Blerg
Posts: 2004
Joined: Tue Jan 09, 2018 11:42 am

Re: Nordic Aviation - 2019

Tue Feb 05, 2019 3:38 pm

AAR wrote:
SAS should sell all LHR slots and move to other airports.


Why should they do that if they are making money on the route? Maybe they are selling slots that they have no need for.
 
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SASViking
Posts: 144
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Re: Nordic Aviation - 2019

Tue Feb 05, 2019 4:13 pm

The media that reported 04OCT19 as a start date for SAS' CPH-STN made a massive mistake. (That was the first day available for booking this morning apparently) First flight is actually 08APR19.
Flights will be 5x weekly (Mon, Wed, Fri, Sat & Sun) changing to Daily later in the year
Types flown: A319, A320, A32N, A321, A332, A333, A343, AT43, AT75, AT76, B717, B732, B735, B736, B737, B738, B752, B753, CRJ9, DC10, DH4D, DHC3, E135, E145, E175, E190, E195, F100, MD11, MD81, MD82, MD87, RJ1H
 
NAX737MAX
Posts: 14
Joined: Thu Jun 08, 2017 10:42 pm

Re: Nordic Aviation - 2019

Tue Feb 05, 2019 4:25 pm

SASViking wrote:
I agree with you on everything you say here. LCY would be s great addition to SAS' network but sadly they don't have the aircraft type for it.


Wouldn't adding flights to LCY using the CRJ9 be possible?
 
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SASViking
Posts: 144
Joined: Mon Dec 05, 2011 12:06 pm

Re: Nordic Aviation - 2019

Tue Feb 05, 2019 4:29 pm

NAX737MAX wrote:
SASViking wrote:
I agree with you on everything you say here. LCY would be s great addition to SAS' network but sadly they don't have the aircraft type for it.


Wouldn't adding flights to LCY using the CRJ9 be possible?

The CRJ's are not certified for LCY. The only aircraft they could use would be the ATRs from Nordica/Regional Jet, but that would not be attractive
Types flown: A319, A320, A32N, A321, A332, A333, A343, AT43, AT75, AT76, B717, B732, B735, B736, B737, B738, B752, B753, CRJ9, DC10, DH4D, DHC3, E135, E145, E175, E190, E195, F100, MD11, MD81, MD82, MD87, RJ1H
 
TR
Posts: 980
Joined: Thu May 03, 2001 1:28 am

Re: Nordic Aviation - 2019

Tue Feb 05, 2019 4:42 pm

SASViking wrote:
NAX737MAX wrote:
SASViking wrote:
I agree with you on everything you say here. LCY would be s great addition to SAS' network but sadly they don't have the aircraft type for it.


Wouldn't adding flights to LCY using the CRJ9 be possible?

The CRJ's are not certified for LCY. The only aircraft they could use would be the ATRs from Nordica/Regional Jet, but that would not be attractive


BA - and I actually believe SAS before them - tried LCY from Copenhagen and Stockholm. Both routes failed heavily and was fairly quickly shut down.
 
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SASViking
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Re: Nordic Aviation - 2019

Tue Feb 05, 2019 4:49 pm

TR wrote:
SASViking wrote:
NAX737MAX wrote:

Wouldn't adding flights to LCY using the CRJ9 be possible?

The CRJ's are not certified for LCY. The only aircraft they could use would be the ATRs from Nordica/Regional Jet, but that would not be attractive


BA - and I actually believe SAS before them - tried LCY from Copenhagen and Stockholm. Both routes failed heavily and was fairly quickly shut down.

SAS tried with leased RJ-85s and Cimber also tried with ATR 42s. The last time BA Cityflyer tried CPH-LCY, the route itself was making money, but they had to have the aircraft on the ground for 5 hours in the middle of the day, due to lack of space at LCY. That was expensive and made them close it. BA even went as far as searching for a route from CPH that the aircraft could do within the nearly 5 hour layover because they made money on the flights
Types flown: A319, A320, A32N, A321, A332, A333, A343, AT43, AT75, AT76, B717, B732, B735, B736, B737, B738, B752, B753, CRJ9, DC10, DH4D, DHC3, E135, E145, E175, E190, E195, F100, MD11, MD81, MD82, MD87, RJ1H
 
seansasLCY
Posts: 963
Joined: Mon Mar 19, 2007 5:25 am

Re: Nordic Aviation - 2019

Tue Feb 05, 2019 4:51 pm

TR wrote:
SASViking wrote:
NAX737MAX wrote:

Wouldn't adding flights to LCY using the CRJ9 be possible?

The CRJ's are not certified for LCY. The only aircraft they could use would be the ATRs from Nordica/Regional Jet, but that would not be attractive


BA - and I actually believe SAS before them - tried LCY from Copenhagen and Stockholm. Both routes failed heavily and was fairly quickly shut down.


Actually that's not true. ARN was served for several years first by SAS (around 2 years with a leased RJ70) and then BA. BA served it from 2010 until 2014 or 15 and from 2013 it was three times daily. They dropped it and added an extra daily LHR flight at the time and used the plane to launch DUB from LCY.

SAS dropped CPH when they removed the Q400 from the fleet and had nothing to replace it with. BA flew CPH for a few years also.
 
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SASViking
Posts: 144
Joined: Mon Dec 05, 2011 12:06 pm

Re: Nordic Aviation - 2019

Tue Feb 05, 2019 6:05 pm

seansasLCY wrote:
TR wrote:
SASViking wrote:
The CRJ's are not certified for LCY. The only aircraft they could use would be the ATRs from Nordica/Regional Jet, but that would not be attractive


BA - and I actually believe SAS before them - tried LCY from Copenhagen and Stockholm. Both routes failed heavily and was fairly quickly shut down.


Actually that's not true. ARN was served for several years first by SAS (around 2 years with a leased RJ70) and then BA. BA served it from 2010 until 2014 or 15 and from 2013 it was three times daily. They dropped it and added an extra daily LHR flight at the time and used the plane to launch DUB from LCY.

SAS dropped CPH when they removed the Q400 from the fleet and had nothing to replace it with. BA flew CPH for a few years also.

Nearly correct ;) SAS leased an Avro RJ85 from Atlantic Airways to operate CPH-LCY after they removed the Q400's from service. Later on they leased a Cimber ATR-42 instead. Then Cimber Sterling took over the route completely, however still in cooperation with SAS, replacing their CPH-LGW route
Types flown: A319, A320, A32N, A321, A332, A333, A343, AT43, AT75, AT76, B717, B732, B735, B736, B737, B738, B752, B753, CRJ9, DC10, DH4D, DHC3, E135, E145, E175, E190, E195, F100, MD11, MD81, MD82, MD87, RJ1H
 
JCCLAG
Posts: 24
Joined: Tue Jan 01, 2019 2:28 pm

Re: Nordic Aviation - 2019

Tue Feb 05, 2019 6:39 pm

SASViking wrote:
AAR wrote:
SAS should sell all LHR slots and move to other airports.

That would be suicide for SAS

Selling the LHR slots would be very very short sighted.
 
YIMBY
Posts: 596
Joined: Tue Sep 20, 2016 4:32 pm

Re: Nordic Aviation - 2019

Tue Feb 05, 2019 6:57 pm

davidjohnson6 wrote:
I'll happily fly SAS from STN instead of LHR
For all those who slag it off, there are also a lot of people who think that STN is actually quite good. The Ryanair pier (especially the far end at ground level) is horrible but the rest of it, especially gates 1-39 is fine. Plenty of shops as well if that's what you want.
Security on departure is fine for any flight after the early morning wave (ie any flight departing after 8:30 am)
Immigration on arrival is usually pretty quick with the automatic gates, unless you land after about 10pm with the Ryanair rush.


STN has also a catchment area of its own, like North London, Cambridge area and Middle England. Cambridge is not just an old university but a home for many technology companies.
 
TUGMASTER
Posts: 1018
Joined: Wed Jul 07, 2004 8:56 pm

Re: Nordic Aviation - 2019

Tue Feb 05, 2019 9:19 pm

Actually, IIRC, weren’t these slots sold to AA, then leased back to SK for 24 months or so...?
 
Someone83
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Joined: Sun Sep 17, 2006 5:47 pm

Re: Nordic Aviation - 2019

Tue Feb 05, 2019 10:06 pm

SASViking wrote:
SVG-LHR-SVG will also move to STN but I don't have a schedule for that yet


Are you sure about that or are you mixing facts here?

SAS will from the coming Spring reduce SVG-LHR from 2x to 1x daily. This accounts for one of the two LHR slots they sold a while back. The other one is the CPH rotation that is shifted to STN

SAS hasn’t sold any other LHR slots
 
Someone83
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Joined: Sun Sep 17, 2006 5:47 pm

Re: Nordic Aviation - 2019

Tue Feb 05, 2019 10:09 pm

BTW, SAS also tried OSL-LCY with leasing Avro-70, so not only CPH and ARN had a go at LCY

Oykie wrote:
I’m sad to see SAS leave LHR, and it makes Star alliance weaker, I have been flying with SAS to LHR and connected with United to the states. That will be more difficult going forward.


They are not leaving LHR but is reducing from 21 to 19x daily, or something like that
 
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SASViking
Posts: 144
Joined: Mon Dec 05, 2011 12:06 pm

Re: Nordic Aviation - 2019

Tue Feb 05, 2019 10:55 pm

Someone83 wrote:
SASViking wrote:
SVG-LHR-SVG will also move to STN but I don't have a schedule for that yet


Are you sure about that or are you mixing facts here?

SAS will from the coming Spring reduce SVG-LHR from 2x to 1x daily. This accounts for one of the two LHR slots they sold a while back. The other one is the CPH rotation that is shifted to STN

SAS hasn’t sold any other LHR slots

I got a message from someone with insider info saying "It's the mid-day CPH-LHR-CPH (SK503/504) that'll move to STN together with one SVG-LHR-SVG rotation"
Types flown: A319, A320, A32N, A321, A332, A333, A343, AT43, AT75, AT76, B717, B732, B735, B736, B737, B738, B752, B753, CRJ9, DC10, DH4D, DHC3, E135, E145, E175, E190, E195, F100, MD11, MD81, MD82, MD87, RJ1H
 
Oykie
Posts: 1836
Joined: Sat Jan 07, 2006 9:21 am

Re: Nordic Aviation - 2019

Wed Feb 06, 2019 5:46 am

Someone83 wrote:
BTW, SAS also tried OSL-LCY with leasing Avro-70, so not only CPH and ARN had a go at LCY

Oykie wrote:
I’m sad to see SAS leave LHR, and it makes Star alliance weaker, I have been flying with SAS to LHR and connected with United to the states. That will be more difficult going forward.


They are not leaving LHR but is reducing from 21 to 19x daily, or something like that


Thanks, I was a bit surprised that they would reduce more than what is already announced.
Dream no small dream; it lacks magic. Dream large, then go make that dream real - Donald Douglas
 
Kikko19
Posts: 523
Joined: Sat Apr 22, 2017 4:45 pm

Re: Nordic Aviation - 2019

Wed Feb 06, 2019 8:23 am

Oykie wrote:
Someone83 wrote:
BTW, SAS also tried OSL-LCY with leasing Avro-70, so not only CPH and ARN had a go at LCY

Oykie wrote:
I’m sad to see SAS leave LHR, and it makes Star alliance weaker, I have been flying with SAS to LHR and connected with United to the states. That will be more difficult going forward.


They are not leaving LHR but is reducing from 21 to 19x daily, or something like that


Thanks, I was a bit surprised that they would reduce more than what is already announced.

SAS is reducing every year, just some years ago only to cph they had 8 daily flights or was 10? osl and arn was a bit less but they had also bgo, svg, and even Hel with blue1.
 
TUGMASTER
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Joined: Wed Jul 07, 2004 8:56 pm

Re: Nordic Aviation - 2019

Wed Feb 06, 2019 10:17 am

Why on earth they ever stopped the GOT-LHR route is beyond me....
I use this regularly on BA , and the load factors are always high...
Yield , i don't know, but if it wasn't making money, they wouldn't of added the 3rd service when SK did a bunk.
 
Someone83
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Joined: Sun Sep 17, 2006 5:47 pm

Re: Nordic Aviation - 2019

Wed Feb 06, 2019 4:41 pm

Kikko19 wrote:

Thanks, I was a bit surprised that they would reduce more than what is already announced.

SAS is reducing every year, just some years ago only to cph they had 8 daily flights or was 10? osl and arn was a bit less but they had also bgo, svg, and even Hel with blue1.[/quote]

SAS had never had more than 7 (or was it 6) CPH-LHR. ARN has been 6 for ages and OSL 5.

SAS hasn’t flown BGO-LHR, at least not in modern ages
 
Someone83
Posts: 4263
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Re: Nordic Aviation - 2019

Wed Feb 06, 2019 4:43 pm

TUGMASTER wrote:
Why on earth they ever stopped the GOT-LHR route is beyond me....
I use this regularly on BA , and the load factors are always high...
Yield , i don't know, but if it wasn't making money, they wouldn't of added the 3rd service when SK did a bunk.


Simple, they results was poor and it was better financially better to sell the slots for a good price
 
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QuawerAir
Posts: 814
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Re: Nordic Aviation - 2019

Thu Feb 07, 2019 9:23 am

HEL January 2019 statistics

Domestic: 275,221 (-0.0%)
International:1,287,983 (+5.3%)
Total: 1,563,204 (+4.3%)
ATL, AYT, FRA, FUE, HEL, JFK, LCA, LHR, MUC | AY, BA, DL, FH, LH, LO | A320, A321, A333, 752, 764, 772, 788
The word "Quawer" means nothing but it looks great.
 
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QuawerAir
Posts: 814
Joined: Sun Jun 25, 2017 9:44 am

Re: Nordic Aviation - 2019

Thu Feb 07, 2019 10:18 am

PAX number still keeps growing but it's now slower than last year. Passenger load factor has lowered, but it may primarily result from increased capacity since PAX growth has not been as high as the growth in capacity.


Finnair Traffic Performance in January 2019

Capacity growth fastest in Europe – On North America routes demand grew faster than its capacity

In January, Finnair carried 1,007,800 passengers, 4.4% more than in the corresponding period of 2018. The overall capacity measured in Available Seat Kilometres (ASK) increased in January by 10.0%. Finnair's traffic measured in Revenue Passenger Kilometres (RPKs) increased by 5.7%. The Passenger Load Factor (PLF) decreased year-on-year by 3.1% points to 77.0%.


news.cision.com
ATL, AYT, FRA, FUE, HEL, JFK, LCA, LHR, MUC | AY, BA, DL, FH, LH, LO | A320, A321, A333, 752, 764, 772, 788
The word "Quawer" means nothing but it looks great.
 
kanye
Posts: 91
Joined: Thu Jun 28, 2007 3:32 am

Re: Nordic Aviation - 2019

Thu Feb 07, 2019 1:34 pm

Another good month for SAS, carrying 1,8 million passengers in January.

"Compared to January 2018, capacity was unchanged while the number of passengers increased, leading to a 0.9 percentage point increase in the load factor to 64.9%. Currency adjusted unit revenue (PASK) increased with 3.6%. During the month, European/Intrascandinavian traffic fell slightly while Domestic and Intercontinental increased."

https://www.sasgroup.net/en/1-8-million ... g-january/
 
DLBOIFIN
Posts: 143
Joined: Sun Jun 18, 2006 6:51 am

Re: Nordic Aviation - 2019

Thu Feb 07, 2019 6:08 pm

It's interesting to compare Finnair and SAS and their growth. In the good old days SAS was roughly three times the size of Finnair, depending what was measured (pax, fleet, staff). Nowadays, the size difference has shrunken considerably, SAS now being approximately double in size compared with Finnair in almost every measurable aspect. It will be interesting to see, how these two rivals will evolve from here in the coming years.
 
Lewton
Posts: 91
Joined: Sat Jan 19, 2019 12:46 pm

Re: Nordic Aviation - 2019

Fri Feb 08, 2019 8:16 am

DLBOIFIN wrote:
It's interesting to compare Finnair and SAS and their growth. In the good old days SAS was roughly three times the size of Finnair, depending what was measured (pax, fleet, staff). Nowadays, the size difference has shrunken considerably, SAS now being approximately double in size compared with Finnair in almost every measurable aspect. It will be interesting to see, how these two rivals will evolve from here in the coming years.

It depends very much on Norwegian's survival.
Finnair did not have a fierce competitor in its home market, SAS did.
 
JCCLAG
Posts: 24
Joined: Tue Jan 01, 2019 2:28 pm

Re: Nordic Aviation - 2019

Fri Feb 08, 2019 9:07 am

Lewton wrote:
DLBOIFIN wrote:
It's interesting to compare Finnair and SAS and their growth. In the good old days SAS was roughly three times the size of Finnair, depending what was measured (pax, fleet, staff). Nowadays, the size difference has shrunken considerably, SAS now being approximately double in size compared with Finnair in almost every measurable aspect. It will be interesting to see, how these two rivals will evolve from here in the coming years.

It depends very much on Norwegian's survival.
Finnair did not have a fierce competitor in its home market, SAS did.

Isn’t that prtly true? Finnair have had a very focused and dedicated strategy. I am not sure if the same could be said about SAS. I am not sure how much Norwegians long routes have stoped SAS from developing their network. Isn’t it that network that has given finnair such a success? SAS have had an almost unhealthy focus on LCC (with this Irish circus as an example) while other airlines have focused on their core.
 
seansasLCY
Posts: 963
Joined: Mon Mar 19, 2007 5:25 am

Re: Nordic Aviation - 2019

Fri Feb 08, 2019 11:10 am

It's been posted on another site but Sun Air has increased its profits in 2018.

https://www.jv.dk/billund/Billund-flyse ... el/2685550
 
mjoelnir
Posts: 8361
Joined: Sun Feb 03, 2013 11:06 pm

Re: Nordic Aviation - 2019

Fri Feb 08, 2019 12:49 pm

Traffic Numbers for Kéflavík January 2019

departing 182,344, arriving 171,539, connecting 181,327, combined 535,210, -6% decrease compared to January 2018, 10.3 % decrease in connecting pax.

Icelandair posted a 55.6 million USD loss for 2018, the presentation:
https://globenewswire.com/news-release/ ... ml?print=1

Passenger numbers at FI +12% in December and +8 % in January. Passenger growth 2 % for the whole year 2018. The two month since WOW reduced their flights showed a good increase at Icelandair.

https://globenewswire.com/news-release/ ... ml?print=1
https://globenewswire.com/news-release/ ... ml?print=1
 
IADCA
Posts: 1846
Joined: Mon Feb 26, 2007 12:24 am

Re: Nordic Aviation - 2019

Fri Feb 08, 2019 5:31 pm

Lewton wrote:
DLBOIFIN wrote:
It's interesting to compare Finnair and SAS and their growth. In the good old days SAS was roughly three times the size of Finnair, depending what was measured (pax, fleet, staff). Nowadays, the size difference has shrunken considerably, SAS now being approximately double in size compared with Finnair in almost every measurable aspect. It will be interesting to see, how these two rivals will evolve from here in the coming years.

It depends very much on Norwegian's survival.
Finnair did not have a fierce competitor in its home market, SAS did.


Depends how you conceive of their home markets, in part, and Norwegian does fly domestic in Finland. Not to the same degree they do on OSL-ARN/CPH and other SAS bread-and-butter routes, but they're there and has an effect. I couldn't believe how cheap RVN-HEL was, for example.
 
kanye
Posts: 91
Joined: Thu Jun 28, 2007 3:32 am

Re: Nordic Aviation - 2019

Fri Feb 08, 2019 7:08 pm

JCCLAG wrote:
Lewton wrote:
DLBOIFIN wrote:
It's interesting to compare Finnair and SAS and their growth. In the good old days SAS was roughly three times the size of Finnair, depending what was measured (pax, fleet, staff). Nowadays, the size difference has shrunken considerably, SAS now being approximately double in size compared with Finnair in almost every measurable aspect. It will be interesting to see, how these two rivals will evolve from here in the coming years.

It depends very much on Norwegian's survival.
Finnair did not have a fierce competitor in its home market, SAS did.

Isn’t that prtly true? Finnair have had a very focused and dedicated strategy. I am not sure if the same could be said about SAS. I am not sure how much Norwegians long routes have stoped SAS from developing their network. Isn’t it that network that has given finnair such a success? SAS have had an almost unhealthy focus on LCC (with this Irish circus as an example) while other airlines have focused on their core.



Finnair has been very successful building up their Asian operations. SAS was going more towards becoming a really big airline by buying other airlines like Spanair, Air Baltic, Estonian, Blue1 and so on. In the end pretty much all of this failed and burned extremely much money for SAS. In recent years they’ve been going back towards being a Scandinavian airline focusing on frequent travellers and obviously its paying off, they are making a good profit for years now.
Anyway it’s impressive what Finnair have done, especially when considering all three Scandinavian countries themself’s are bigger economies than Finland.
 
JCCLAG
Posts: 24
Joined: Tue Jan 01, 2019 2:28 pm

Re: Nordic Aviation - 2019

Fri Feb 08, 2019 9:13 pm

You are right SAS have been messing around and Finnairs journey is impressive. They looked at their business and what are their advantages. Based on that made a simple and understandably strategy and went all in. Really, hats off.
 
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hilram
Posts: 732
Joined: Wed Aug 20, 2014 11:12 am

Re: Nordic Aviation - 2019

Sat Feb 09, 2019 9:45 am

kanye wrote:
Another good month for SAS, carrying 1,8 million passengers in January.

"Compared to January 2018, capacity was unchanged while the number of passengers increased, leading to a 0.9 percentage point increase in the load factor to 64.9%. Currency adjusted unit revenue (PASK) increased with 3.6%. During the month, European/Intrascandinavian traffic fell slightly while Domestic and Intercontinental increased."

https://www.sasgroup.net/en/1-8-million ... g-january/

Isn't a load factor of 64,9% really low? I thought airlines average 80-85% How can this be a "good month" ?
Flown on: A319, 320, 321, 332, 333, 343 | B732, 734, 735, 736, 73G, 738, 743, 744, 772, 77W | BAe-146 | DHC-6, 7, 8 | F50 | E195 | MD DC-9 41, MD-82, MD-87
 
kanye
Posts: 91
Joined: Thu Jun 28, 2007 3:32 am

Re: Nordic Aviation - 2019

Sat Feb 09, 2019 10:15 am

hilram wrote:
kanye wrote:
Another good month for SAS, carrying 1,8 million passengers in January.

"Compared to January 2018, capacity was unchanged while the number of passengers increased, leading to a 0.9 percentage point increase in the load factor to 64.9%. Currency adjusted unit revenue (PASK) increased with 3.6%. During the month, European/Intrascandinavian traffic fell slightly while Domestic and Intercontinental increased."

https://www.sasgroup.net/en/1-8-million ... g-january/

Isn't a load factor of 64,9% really low? I thought airlines average 80-85% How can this be a "good month" ?



Well, i meant both load factor and yield is up from previous January, the year when SAS made best profit for two decades or so.
Anyway load factors alone is not very interesting, filling up planes giving away tickets isn’t hard.
 
User avatar
SASViking
Posts: 144
Joined: Mon Dec 05, 2011 12:06 pm

Re: Nordic Aviation - 2019

Sat Feb 09, 2019 10:59 am

hilram wrote:
kanye wrote:
Another good month for SAS, carrying 1,8 million passengers in January.

"Compared to January 2018, capacity was unchanged while the number of passengers increased, leading to a 0.9 percentage point increase in the load factor to 64.9%. Currency adjusted unit revenue (PASK) increased with 3.6%. During the month, European/Intrascandinavian traffic fell slightly while Domestic and Intercontinental increased."

https://www.sasgroup.net/en/1-8-million ... g-january/

Isn't a load factor of 64,9% really low? I thought airlines average 80-85% How can this be a "good month" ?

SAS' main costumer base is business travellers, those generally travel very little in January, it's not just an issue for SAS.
Types flown: A319, A320, A32N, A321, A332, A333, A343, AT43, AT75, AT76, B717, B732, B735, B736, B737, B738, B752, B753, CRJ9, DC10, DH4D, DHC3, E135, E145, E175, E190, E195, F100, MD11, MD81, MD82, MD87, RJ1H
 
minilinde
Posts: 83
Joined: Sat Dec 31, 2005 1:16 am

Re: Nordic Aviation - 2019

Mon Feb 11, 2019 7:56 am

SAS is not in the business of filling the planes with passengers, but more with filling them with revenue. As Kanye said above, filling them, by dumping the prices isn't hard.
 
B747forever
Posts: 13758
Joined: Mon May 21, 2007 9:50 pm

Re: Nordic Aviation - 2019

Mon Feb 11, 2019 8:15 am

Would be interesting to know what the load factor was for intercontinental flights in January. I am sure that drags down the average load factor as TATL traffic dives after the busy Christmas period before it picks up again in spring. A couple of weeks ago I flew LAX-ARN-LAX, and on the way back home, Y was at most 1/3 full with Plus being equally empty while C was full. The outbound LAX-ARN flight had better loads with around 60% full in Y.
Work Hard, Fly Right
 
minilinde
Posts: 83
Joined: Sat Dec 31, 2005 1:16 am

Re: Nordic Aviation - 2019

Mon Feb 11, 2019 8:53 am

B747forever wrote:
Would be interesting to know what the load factor was for intercontinental flights in January. I am sure that drags down the average load factor as TATL traffic dives after the busy Christmas period before it picks up again in spring. A couple of weeks ago I flew LAX-ARN-LAX, and on the way back home, Y was at most 1/3 full with Plus being equally empty while C was full. The outbound LAX-ARN flight had better loads with around 60% full in Y.


Depends on route. More business focused routes (IAD/ORD/EWR) are probably on average (around 60-65 %), while MIA and LAX should be higher. The Asian routes are probably somewhere in between.
 
Blerg
Posts: 2004
Joined: Tue Jan 09, 2018 11:42 am

Re: Nordic Aviation - 2019

Mon Feb 11, 2019 4:53 pm

Starting from April 16, Norwegian will operate a one weekly flight from HEL to TIV.
 
User avatar
QuawerAir
Posts: 814
Joined: Sun Jun 25, 2017 9:44 am

Re: Nordic Aviation - 2019

Tue Feb 12, 2019 6:33 am

Finnair and Jetstar Airways plan to commence codesharing on the latter's routes from Australia to Japan on 31 March 2019. AY already codeshares with Jetstar Asia Airways. Additionally, Finnair and Qantas plan to expand their codeshare agreement to cover Australia – New Zealand sector.

blueswandaily.com
ATL, AYT, FRA, FUE, HEL, JFK, LCA, LHR, MUC | AY, BA, DL, FH, LH, LO | A320, A321, A333, 752, 764, 772, 788
The word "Quawer" means nothing but it looks great.
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