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qf2220
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - January 2019

Wed Jan 30, 2019 10:43 am

Gemuser wrote:

BTW,unless its changed in the last 10 years or so, nobody works for Qantaslink, it is not a company, it is a trading name of Qantas Airways Ltd. a search today showed NO aircraft registered to Qantaslink, which is what you would expect if it is just a trading name.

Gemuser


Not quite. QantasLink is the brand under which Airlink, Eastern Australian Airlines and Sunstate Airlines trades under (as well as the Cobham 717s in a slightly different way and maybe some of the National Jet Systems services?? tho not sure on that last one).

One of those (maybe Eastern) is the main entity and the other ones are slowly winding up as their EBAs and other favourable contracts are winding down as employees retire etc and as aircraft are sold out of them.
 
brucetiki
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - January 2019

Wed Jan 30, 2019 10:47 am

SQ217's diverted to ADL
CZ343's diverted to ADL

Busy night ahead in ADL!

JQ and TT have started cancelling their late night domestic flights into MEL
 
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EK413
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - January 2019

Wed Jan 30, 2019 10:52 am

QF10 PER-MEL diverted AVV
JQ831 PPP-MEL on final MEL

EK413
Last edited by EK413 on Wed Jan 30, 2019 11:00 am, edited 1 time in total.
Good evening, ladies and gentlemen. We are tonight’s entertainment!
 
VapourTrails
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - January 2019

Wed Jan 30, 2019 10:53 am

EK413 wrote:
VapourTrails wrote:
EK413 wrote:

MEL getting hit with some pretty bad thunderstorms.

EK413



Hi, thanks. I assumed that was the reason, when I checked in with my weather app. Storms are almost a daily occurrence around my way at the moment. Be glad when summer is over. With regard to thunderstorms and diversions, this is due to ground staff not being allowed onto the tarmac, rather than the flights themselves being able to land and take off, is this correct? I was at MEL a few years back waiting to board a flight when a storm rolled through, and this was the reason we were given on that occasion.


With the storm at 10nm ground staff receive a warning beacon, 5nm all ground staff must stop work and highlift vehicles must lower their cabins.
Strange AVV wasn’t considered as alternate with tonight’s Air Asia flight landing with nil issues.

More diversions & flights holding

NZ729 AKL-MEL diverted SYD
QF10 PER-MEL holding
QF489 SYD-MEL holding
QF823 CBR-MEL holding
JQ523 SYD-MEL holding
QF467 SYD-MEL holding
QF158 AKL-MEL holding
TT504 HBA-MEL holding
NZ126 AKL-MEL diverted SYD. Aircraft now repositioning NZ6015 SYD-AKL

EK413


OK - thank you, and welcome back! :thumbsup:

QF10 has landed at AVV.
 
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EK413
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - January 2019

Wed Jan 30, 2019 10:57 am

VapourTrails wrote:
EK413 wrote:
VapourTrails wrote:


Hi, thanks. I assumed that was the reason, when I checked in with my weather app. Storms are almost a daily occurrence around my way at the moment. Be glad when summer is over. With regard to thunderstorms and diversions, this is due to ground staff not being allowed onto the tarmac, rather than the flights themselves being able to land and take off, is this correct? I was at MEL a few years back waiting to board a flight when a storm rolled through, and this was the reason we were given on that occasion.


With the storm at 10nm ground staff receive a warning beacon, 5nm all ground staff must stop work and highlift vehicles must lower their cabins.
Strange AVV wasn’t considered as alternate with tonight’s Air Asia flight landing with nil issues.

More diversions & flights holding

NZ729 AKL-MEL diverted SYD
QF10 PER-MEL holding
QF489 SYD-MEL holding
QF823 CBR-MEL holding
JQ523 SYD-MEL holding
QF467 SYD-MEL holding
QF158 AKL-MEL holding
TT504 HBA-MEL holding
NZ126 AKL-MEL diverted SYD. Aircraft now repositioning NZ6015 SYD-AKL

EK413


OK - thank you, and welcome back! :thumbsup:

QF10 has landed at AVV.


Welcome & Thankyou.

Interesting to see what happens with QF49 MEL-SFO as VHZNA was scheduled to operate it -ZNG is still out of action according to sources.

EK413
Good evening, ladies and gentlemen. We are tonight’s entertainment!
 
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qf789
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - January 2019

Wed Jan 30, 2019 10:59 am

VapourTrails wrote:
EK413 wrote:
VapourTrails wrote:


Hi, thanks. I assumed that was the reason, when I checked in with my weather app. Storms are almost a daily occurrence around my way at the moment. Be glad when summer is over. With regard to thunderstorms and diversions, this is due to ground staff not being allowed onto the tarmac, rather than the flights themselves being able to land and take off, is this correct? I was at MEL a few years back waiting to board a flight when a storm rolled through, and this was the reason we were given on that occasion.


With the storm at 10nm ground staff receive a warning beacon, 5nm all ground staff must stop work and highlift vehicles must lower their cabins.
Strange AVV wasn’t considered as alternate with tonight’s Air Asia flight landing with nil issues.

More diversions & flights holding

NZ729 AKL-MEL diverted SYD
QF10 PER-MEL holding
QF489 SYD-MEL holding
QF823 CBR-MEL holding
JQ523 SYD-MEL holding
QF467 SYD-MEL holding
QF158 AKL-MEL holding
TT504 HBA-MEL holding
NZ126 AKL-MEL diverted SYD. Aircraft now repositioning NZ6015 SYD-AKL

EK413


OK - thank you, and welcome back! :thumbsup:

QF10 has landed at AVV.


BNE Airport has an information piece on the effect on thunderstorms

Image

https://bne.com.au/passenger/brisbane-a ... and-storms
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qf789
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - January 2019

Wed Jan 30, 2019 11:12 am

EK413 wrote:
VapourTrails wrote:
EK413 wrote:

With the storm at 10nm ground staff receive a warning beacon, 5nm all ground staff must stop work and highlift vehicles must lower their cabins.
Strange AVV wasn’t considered as alternate with tonight’s Air Asia flight landing with nil issues.

More diversions & flights holding

NZ729 AKL-MEL diverted SYD
QF10 PER-MEL holding
QF489 SYD-MEL holding
QF823 CBR-MEL holding
JQ523 SYD-MEL holding
QF467 SYD-MEL holding
QF158 AKL-MEL holding
TT504 HBA-MEL holding
NZ126 AKL-MEL diverted SYD. Aircraft now repositioning NZ6015 SYD-AKL

EK413


OK - thank you, and welcome back! :thumbsup:

QF10 has landed at AVV.


Welcome & Thankyou.

Interesting to see what happens with QF49 MEL-SFO as VHZNA was scheduled to operate it -ZNG is still out of action according to sources.

EK413


QF49 has a ETA of departing 2 hours late from MEL, 0030 to be precise, there is likely going to be a delay on the return sector as well
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VapourTrails
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - January 2019

Wed Jan 30, 2019 11:16 am

qf789 wrote:

BNE Airport has an information piece on the effect on thunderstorms

Image

https://bne.com.au/passenger/brisbane-a ... and-storms


Thanks - that is an informative guide to the procedures. :thumbsup:

At least MEL doesn’t have a curfew to deal with, re clearing the holds. An interesting late evening to be living under MEL approach and departures tonight. :listen:
 
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RyanairGuru
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - January 2019

Wed Jan 30, 2019 11:30 am

qf2220 wrote:
Gemuser wrote:

BTW,unless its changed in the last 10 years or so, nobody works for Qantaslink, it is not a company, it is a trading name of Qantas Airways Ltd. a search today showed NO aircraft registered to Qantaslink, which is what you would expect if it is just a trading name.

Gemuser


Not quite. QantasLink is the brand under which Airlink, Eastern Australian Airlines and Sunstate Airlines trades under (as well as the Cobham 717s in a slightly different way and maybe some of the National Jet Systems services?? tho not sure on that last one).

One of those (maybe Eastern) is the main entity and the other ones are slowly winding up as their EBAs and other favourable contracts are winding down as employees retire etc and as aircraft are sold out of them.


Sunstate is the favoured brand. All Q400 flying is under Sunstate and 200/300 flying under Eastern. Eastern will be retired along with the 200/300s. a

This division of Q400 and 200/300 leads to the slightly odd situation where Q400 flights in NSW/VIC are "Operated by Sunstate on behalf of Eastern" while 200/300 flights in QLD are "Operated by Eastern on behalf of Sunstate". Given that the distribution is now entirely along fleet, rather than geographical, lines I'm not really sure why they maintain the traditional distinction of Eastern operating flights in NSW/VIC and Sunstate in QLD.

Not sure who you are referring to by Airlink, as they are a subsidiary of Rex.

Cobham and National Jet are the same thing, to all intents and purposes, but you are correct the situation with them is different to Sunstate/Eastern which are wholly owned subsidiaries.
Worked Hard, Flew Right
 
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EK413
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - January 2019

Wed Jan 30, 2019 11:51 am

qf789 wrote:
VapourTrails wrote:
EK413 wrote:

With the storm at 10nm ground staff receive a warning beacon, 5nm all ground staff must stop work and highlift vehicles must lower their cabins.
Strange AVV wasn’t considered as alternate with tonight’s Air Asia flight landing with nil issues.

More diversions & flights holding

NZ729 AKL-MEL diverted SYD
QF10 PER-MEL holding
QF489 SYD-MEL holding
QF823 CBR-MEL holding
JQ523 SYD-MEL holding
QF467 SYD-MEL holding
QF158 AKL-MEL holding
TT504 HBA-MEL holding
NZ126 AKL-MEL diverted SYD. Aircraft now repositioning NZ6015 SYD-AKL

EK413


OK - thank you, and welcome back! :thumbsup:

QF10 has landed at AVV.


BNE Airport has an information piece on the effect on thunderstorms

Image

https://bne.com.au/passenger/brisbane-a ... and-storms


Excellent informative link!

qf789 wrote:
EK413 wrote:
VapourTrails wrote:

OK - thank you, and welcome back! :thumbsup:

QF10 has landed at AVV.


Welcome & Thankyou.

Interesting to see what happens with QF49 MEL-SFO as VHZNA was scheduled to operate it -ZNG is still out of action according to sources.

EK413


QF49 has a ETA of departing 2 hours late from MEL, 0030 to be precise, there is likely going to be a delay on the return sector as well


Unless they make up time in flight definitely a delay on the return service.

EK413
Good evening, ladies and gentlemen. We are tonight’s entertainment!
 
Qantas16
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - January 2019

Wed Jan 30, 2019 12:00 pm

EK413 wrote:
NZ126 AKL-MEL diverted SYD. Aircraft now repositioning NZ6015 SYD-AKL


One of the issues with NZ's transtasman operations is that as soon as a flight has to divert to another Australian port, it will offload the pax there and then ferry empty back to NZ, presumably so the crew don't run out of hours and the aircraft can operate their next service (particularly important for 777/787 services).

I have seen this multiple times where AKL-SYD diverts to BNE (for whatever reason), the pax are then offloaded in BNE, organised onto domestic flights (not always that day) and the aircraft quickly returns back to AKL empty. This also happened the other day with a WLG-SYD A320 service that diverted to BNE....
 
travelhound
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - January 2019

Wed Jan 30, 2019 12:09 pm

My understanding is that QF are the registered owners of the 717's and Cobham the registered operator. From memory QF are responsible for aircraft leasing/financing, insurance and fuel costs and Cobham are responsible/contracted for crewing, maintenance, navigational fees, etc.

If we consider QF collect all the revenues for 717 flying and the ticket prices are set using QF's revenue management systems, Cobham would contractually protect itself against operational variables such as fuel costs, storms, airport closures, etc.

If I remember correctly Cobham recently renewed it's contract with QF. I thought maintenance was part of the contract
 
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EK413
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - January 2019

Wed Jan 30, 2019 12:27 pm

Qantas16 wrote:
EK413 wrote:
NZ126 AKL-MEL diverted SYD. Aircraft now repositioning NZ6015 SYD-AKL


One of the issues with NZ's transtasman operations is that as soon as a flight has to divert to another Australian port, it will offload the pax there and then ferry empty back to NZ, presumably so the crew don't run out of hours and the aircraft can operate their next service (particularly important for 777/787 services).

I have seen this multiple times where AKL-SYD diverts to BNE (for whatever reason), the pax are then offloaded in BNE, organised onto domestic flights (not always that day) and the aircraft quickly returns back to AKL empty. This also happened the other day with a WLG-SYD A320 service that diverted to BNE....


I thought this would be the case with the B789/777 fleet stretched and had the aircraft night stopped then this would’ve delayed NZ46 AKL-RAR the next leg the aircraft will operate.

QF10 VHZNA on its way to MEL.

EK413
Last edited by EK413 on Wed Jan 30, 2019 12:49 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Good evening, ladies and gentlemen. We are tonight’s entertainment!
 
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vhqpa
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - January 2019

Wed Jan 30, 2019 12:34 pm

RyanairGuru wrote:
Not sure who you are referring to by Airlink, as they are a subsidiary of Rex.


Airlink was the trading name for NJS's BAe 146 operation for QF (Australian Airlink back in the TN days) before Qantaslink became a thing in 2001.



While we're on Qantaslink history at one point in the 90s Sunstate had a Victorian operation initially based in I believe MQL but migrated to MEL, which was operationally isolated from the QLD operation. The Victorian Sunstate became Southern Australia Airlines and was eventually merged into Eastern Australia Airlines in the early 2000s.
"There you go ladies and gentleman we're through Mach 1 the speed of sound no bumps no bangs... CONCORDE"
 
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angusjt
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - January 2019

Wed Jan 30, 2019 12:47 pm

Just got off VA96, originally routed CHC-MEL

Ended up holding for about 30 mins near Traralgon before we diverted to LST.

Stayed on board whilst the plane refueled and took off bound for MEL again, we attempted to land at MEL but the captain chose to pull out and took us to SYD instead, where I am now.

VA have been very helpful throughout this entire situation.
 
QF754
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - January 2019

Wed Jan 30, 2019 12:51 pm

brucetiki wrote:
SQ217's diverted to ADL
CZ343's diverted to ADL

Busy night ahead in ADL!


Just got back into ADL. There’s an SQ A380 and a VA A330 parked up that obviously aren’t supposed to be there.
 
timtam
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - January 2019

Wed Jan 30, 2019 12:55 pm

smi0006 wrote:
tullamarine wrote:
mh124 wrote:
I was just talking about the new perth airport train station and the proposed link from the station to the terminal - looks like a overpass rather than a seamless underground pedestrian link (which is what i'm generally used to elsewhere, eg SYD).
Friends suggested that the airport may eventually go to a two level system, with the upper level to drop off / departures and the lower level to pick up / arrivals. Perth doesn't have any suggestion of this happening in masterplans. We were wondering - what is the largest airport by passenger numbers that is single level drop off/pick up? SYD, MEL and BNE are all multilevel (I haven't been to BNE in a decade so my memory is hazy), as is CBR (very nice but maybe they over-capitalised?)
Anyone got any international experience? All the ones I have been to that are say 20 m and above are multilevel.


BNE domestic is single level. Its railway station is also accessed from an overpass and it works fine.

Modern airport design isn't so much about single or dual level. It seems to be about opening up the front of the terminal as a pedestrian type plaza with vehicle traffic moved back so pedestrians don't have to intersect with traffic. ADL has now done this as has SYD T1. AMS has done it completely on its arrival level which moves into a shared pax/guest/shopper plaza. Unfortunately its departure level remains as chaotic as anywhere.


I’d like to say design and pax and vechile flow was the idea, however I believe it’s primarily security. I’m not certain if laws are coming, or it’s accepted good practice. But the trend is vechiles are to be kept away from places of mass gathering, and key infrastructure. This prevents the use of a vechile as a bomb next to the terminal, and minanises damage.

A quick google search whilst not aviation specific has the below document of interest.

http://designingoutcrime.com/wp-content ... gement.pdf


Yes I heard it was a security matter. A rule was put in place mandating the minimum distance away for vehicles. I can only guess that airports might have a timeframe in which they must comply with the rule. Adelaide Airport moved vehicles about 75m away from the original pickup and dropoff points in front of the terminal not very long after the new terminal was built. The original dropoff ramp was quite an impressive effort and would have been quite expensive to build.
 
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EK413
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - January 2019

Wed Jan 30, 2019 12:58 pm

angusjt wrote:
Just got off VA96, originally routed CHC-MEL

Ended up holding for about 30 mins near Traralgon before we diverted to LST.

Stayed on board whilst the plane refueled and took off bound for MEL again, we attempted to land at MEL but the captain chose to pull out and took us to SYD instead, where I am now.

VA have been very helpful throughout this entire situation.


I’m puzzled AVV isn’t an alternate. The QF10 must’ve been low on gas to divert into AVV.

EK413
Good evening, ladies and gentlemen. We are tonight’s entertainment!
 
smi0006
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - January 2019

Wed Jan 30, 2019 1:09 pm

RyanairGuru wrote:
qf2220 wrote:
Gemuser wrote:

BTW,unless its changed in the last 10 years or so, nobody works for Qantaslink, it is not a company, it is a trading name of Qantas Airways Ltd. a search today showed NO aircraft registered to Qantaslink, which is what you would expect if it is just a trading name.

Gemuser


Not quite. QantasLink is the brand under which Airlink, Eastern Australian Airlines and Sunstate Airlines trades under (as well as the Cobham 717s in a slightly different way and maybe some of the National Jet Systems services?? tho not sure on that last one).

One of those (maybe Eastern) is the main entity and the other ones are slowly winding up as their EBAs and other favourable contracts are winding down as employees retire etc and as aircraft are sold out of them.


Sunstate is the favoured brand. All Q400 flying is under Sunstate and 200/300 flying under Eastern. Eastern will be retired along with the 200/300s. a

This division of Q400 and 200/300 leads to the slightly odd situation where Q400 flights in NSW/VIC are "Operated by Sunstate on behalf of Eastern" while 200/300 flights in QLD are "Operated by Eastern on behalf of Sunstate". Given that the distribution is now entirely along fleet, rather than geographical, lines I'm not really sure why they maintain the traditional distinction of Eastern operating flights in NSW/VIC and Sunstate in QLD.

Not sure who you are referring to by Airlink, as they are a subsidiary of Rex.

Cobham and National Jet are the same thing, to all intents and purposes, but you are correct the situation with them is different to Sunstate/Eastern which are wholly owned subsidiaries.


I’m not sure if it’s the case, but crew were employed by Sunstate or Eastern, and couldn’t cross crew. Q400s were Sunstate only so CBR was a Sunsate bass along with BNE and CBS. MQL, MEL, and SYD were all Eastern bases.
 
smi0006
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - January 2019

Wed Jan 30, 2019 1:11 pm

angusjt wrote:
Just got off VA96, originally routed CHC-MEL

Ended up holding for about 30 mins near Traralgon before we diverted to LST.

Stayed on board whilst the plane refueled and took off bound for MEL again, we attempted to land at MEL but the captain chose to pull out and took us to SYD instead, where I am now.

VA have been very helpful throughout this entire situation.


Ouch that’s ugly! I wonder why he couldn’t get in for a second shot when everyone else was getting in by that time.

I always feel for groundstaff on nights like tonight, they’d be torn apart
 
tayser
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - January 2019

Wed Jan 30, 2019 1:18 pm

angusjt wrote:
Just got off VA96, originally routed CHC-MEL

Ended up holding for about 30 mins near Traralgon before we diverted to LST.

Stayed on board whilst the plane refueled and took off bound for MEL again, we attempted to land at MEL but the captain chose to pull out and took us to SYD instead, where I am now.

VA have been very helpful throughout this entire situation.


A grand tour of the Tasman Sea/Bass Strait! How long will you have to wait for a hotel though? :)

Like EK413 said, really puzzling that AVV isn't/wasn't used as an alternate (Air Asia landed as normal when everyone else was doing doughies over Port Phillip/Bendigo/Wangaratta).

Lack of Virgin group operations at AVV, perhaps?
 
tayser
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - January 2019

Wed Jan 30, 2019 1:22 pm

brucetiki wrote:
SQ217's diverted to ADL
CZ343's diverted to ADL

Busy night ahead in ADL!

JQ and TT have started cancelling their late night domestic flights into MEL


They're back!!

CZ343 just landed at Tullamarine. SQ217 just crossed the SA border.
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - January 2019

Wed Jan 30, 2019 2:10 pm

Due to ZNG being out of action on Thursday 31/1 QF9 MEL-PER will be subbed by 738, QF10 PER-MEL has been cancelled, ZNB will terminate in PER (LHR-PER) to operate PER-LHR
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Qantas16
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - January 2019

Wed Jan 30, 2019 10:17 pm

angusjt wrote:
Just got off VA96, originally routed CHC-MEL

Ended up holding for about 30 mins near Traralgon before we diverted to LST.

Stayed on board whilst the plane refueled and took off bound for MEL again, we attempted to land at MEL but the captain chose to pull out and took us to SYD instead, where I am now.

VA have been very helpful throughout this entire situation.


Question... in this instance, why would the captain (or operations) not put a lot more fuel on in LST expecting there to be a long hold getting into MEL? This seems to happen somewhat regularly where planes will double divert and I would have thought that an extra hour of fuel would be a cost effective way to prevent this...
 
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EK413
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - January 2019

Wed Jan 30, 2019 10:56 pm

Qantas16 wrote:
angusjt wrote:
Just got off VA96, originally routed CHC-MEL

Ended up holding for about 30 mins near Traralgon before we diverted to LST.

Stayed on board whilst the plane refueled and took off bound for MEL again, we attempted to land at MEL but the captain chose to pull out and took us to SYD instead, where I am now.

VA have been very helpful throughout this entire situation.


Question... in this instance, why would the captain (or operations) not put a lot more fuel on in LST expecting there to be a long hold getting into MEL? This seems to happen somewhat regularly where planes will double divert and I would have thought that an extra hour of fuel would be a cost effective way to prevent this...


With Thunderstorms on the TAF dispatch would plan flights with additional 60mins of fuel. This would’ve been the case last night if you observe the flights which ended up diverting they had been in holding patterns for well over 30-60mins before they opted to divert.

As I mentioned previously I don’t understand why AVV isn’t alternate. Yes, ground handling would be a challenge but they could plan in advance? Would be far cheaper to bus the passengers AVV-MEL than organise hotels in ADL,MEL,LST,SYD,CBR etc.

EK413
Good evening, ladies and gentlemen. We are tonight’s entertainment!
 
aerokiwi
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - January 2019

Wed Jan 30, 2019 11:01 pm

Is it because of no ground equipment for 737s at AVV? I don't know anything about what would be needed, but just a hunch. And likely the total absence of Virgin staff. Then again if Qantas diverts to AVV, do Jetstar staff just chip in? It must be a pretty complex operational change.
 
jman
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - January 2019

Wed Jan 30, 2019 11:04 pm

.
Last edited by jman on Wed Jan 30, 2019 11:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
jman
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - January 2019

Wed Jan 30, 2019 11:05 pm

EK413 wrote:
VapourTrails wrote:
EK413 wrote:

More diversions & flights holding

JQ523 SYD-MEL holding

EK413


Returned to SYD
 
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EK413
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - January 2019

Wed Jan 30, 2019 11:16 pm

aerokiwi wrote:
Is it because of no ground equipment for 737s at AVV? I don't know anything about what would be needed, but just a hunch. And likely the total absence of Virgin staff. Then again if Qantas diverts to AVV, do Jetstar staff just chip in? It must be a pretty complex operational change.


Definitely lack of ground handling but planned in advance could’ve been used. Easier said than done I know.

jman wrote:
EK413 wrote:
VapourTrails wrote:


Returned to SYD


Have JQ completely pulled out of AVV?

EK413
Good evening, ladies and gentlemen. We are tonight’s entertainment!
 
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angusjt
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - January 2019

Wed Jan 30, 2019 11:25 pm

EK413 wrote:
angusjt wrote:
Just got off VA96, originally routed CHC-MEL

Ended up holding for about 30 mins near Traralgon before we diverted to LST.

Stayed on board whilst the plane refueled and took off bound for MEL again, we attempted to land at MEL but the captain chose to pull out and took us to SYD instead, where I am now.

VA have been very helpful throughout this entire situation.


I’m puzzled AVV isn’t an alternate. The QF10 must’ve been low on gas to divert into AVV.

EK413


I imagine the lack of VA operations there, combined with more customs & connections at SYD made it a preferable alternative.

smi0006 wrote:

Ouch that’s ugly! I wonder why he couldn’t get in for a second shot when everyone else was getting in by that time.

I always feel for groundstaff on nights like tonight, they’d be torn apart


We went down to a little under 10,000ft (according to the FR24 playback) before pulling back out, it seemed like a very vicious storm, you could see flashes of lightning from the right side of the aircraft. The staff where helpful and evidently did as much as they could.

tayser wrote:

A grand tour of the Tasman Sea/Bass Strait! How long will you have to wait for a hotel though? :)

Like EK413 said, really puzzling that AVV isn't/wasn't used as an alternate (Air Asia landed as normal when everyone else was doing doughies over Port Phillip/Bendigo/Wangaratta).

Lack of Virgin group operations at AVV, perhaps?


The whole ordeal meant we spent a little over 9 hours on the aircraft, not getting into SYD until 11:30, the staff spent the next hour or so sorting out hotels & flights. I spent last night at a Novotel near the CBD, which I didnt get to sleep until 2.

Like I mentioned before I imagine the better customs/connections/VA operations offered at SYD made it preferable.

Thanks everyone for their concerns, i'm flying back to Perth on board VA599 later today, which is scheduled as being an a330 rather then the 737 I was originally supposed to take from MEL-PER.
 
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qf2220
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - January 2019

Wed Jan 30, 2019 11:28 pm

RyanairGuru wrote:
[
Not sure who you are referring to by Airlink, as they are a subsidiary of Rex.


No, Airlink Pty Ltd is a QF sub - not sure what the Rex one is. See Note 28 of the 2018 report. I forget how it works but it was somehow involved with the 717s.
https://investor.qantas.com/FormBuilder ... rt-ASX.pdf
 
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qf2220
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - January 2019

Wed Jan 30, 2019 11:30 pm

vhqpa wrote:
While we're on Qantaslink history at one point in the 90s Sunstate had a Victorian operation initially based in I believe MQL but migrated to MEL, which was operationally isolated from the QLD operation. The Victorian Sunstate became Southern Australia Airlines and was eventually merged into Eastern Australia Airlines in the early 2000s.


Yes what happened with Southern will eventually happen to Eastern and Sunstate (thanks for the correction RyanairGuru) will be the Qantaslink company. Though with the LDH flying needing them the 200s might be around for a while so it might be around for a bit.
 
jman
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - January 2019

Wed Jan 30, 2019 11:40 pm

EK413 wrote:
aerokiwi wrote:
Is it because of no ground equipment for 737s at AVV? I don't know anything about what would be needed, but just a hunch. And likely the total absence of Virgin staff. Then again if Qantas diverts to AVV, do Jetstar staff just chip in? It must be a pretty complex operational change.


Definitely lack of ground handling but planned in advance could’ve been used. Easier said than done I know.

jman wrote:
EK413 wrote:


Returned to SYD


Have JQ completely pulled out of AVV?

EK413


No, they are still the main operator there. they have aircraft based there and its a maintain airport
 
Qantas16
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - January 2019

Wed Jan 30, 2019 11:48 pm

EK413 wrote:
As I mentioned previously I don’t understand why AVV isn’t alternate. Yes, ground handling would be a challenge but they could plan in advance? Would be far cheaper to bus the passengers AVV-MEL than organise hotels in ADL,MEL,LST,SYD,CBR etc.


I'm sure there is a reason but I agree with you, it seems odd. Does Jetstar self-handle at AVV or use a third party? I know Swissport handles Air Asia X at AVV and they look after TT/VA/JQ at other ports around Australia so would think it would be possible.
 
moa999
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - January 2019

Thu Jan 31, 2019 12:11 am

Has Qantas announced where the final four A380s (OQE, OQH, OQI, OQJ) will be repainted? The first eight having been completed in 2018 in Dubai as part of the contract announced in 2017. (Also any reason why the two newest OQK and OQL got an earlier paint)

And any more information on where the reconfiguration by Airbus will take place, noting OQA is presently in Abu Dhabi.
 
waoz1
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - January 2019

Thu Jan 31, 2019 12:24 am

qf789 wrote:
Due to ZNG being out of action on Thursday 31/1 QF9 MEL-PER will be subbed by 738, QF10 PER-MEL has been cancelled, ZNB will terminate in PER (LHR-PER) to operate PER-LHR


Ive seen the post a few times what they sub a 738 on the per-mel leg
Does that mean they just arent getting the numbers out of melbourne for this route?
 
eamondzhang
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - January 2019

Thu Jan 31, 2019 12:25 am

VapourTrails wrote:


Hi, thanks. I assumed that was the reason, when I checked in with my weather app. Storms are almost a daily occurrence around my way at the moment. Be glad when summer is over. With regard to thunderstorms and diversions, this is due to ground staff not being allowed onto the tarmac, rather than the flights themselves being able to land and take off, is this correct? I was at MEL a few years back waiting to board a flight when a storm rolled through, and this was the reason we were given on that occasion.

Not only that, it could also be storm cells are in the path of landing/departing preventing a safe landing or go around (in case if they have to). They won't have much choice but hold/divert if the storm cells are close enough to airport.

MEL has had some pretty bad storms yesterday which took out a lot of electricity supply again - second time in a week after the heatwave late last week.

Michael
 
tullamarine
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - January 2019

Thu Jan 31, 2019 1:33 am

eamondzhang wrote:
VapourTrails wrote:


Hi, thanks. I assumed that was the reason, when I checked in with my weather app. Storms are almost a daily occurrence around my way at the moment. Be glad when summer is over. With regard to thunderstorms and diversions, this is due to ground staff not being allowed onto the tarmac, rather than the flights themselves being able to land and take off, is this correct? I was at MEL a few years back waiting to board a flight when a storm rolled through, and this was the reason we were given on that occasion.

Not only that, it could also be storm cells are in the path of landing/departing preventing a safe landing or go around (in case if they have to). They won't have much choice but hold/divert if the storm cells are close enough to airport.

MEL has had some pretty bad storms yesterday which took out a lot of electricity supply again - second time in a week after the heatwave late last week.

Michael

Correct, wind shear is at a much increased risk during thunderstorms. These severe downdrafts can have a significant effect on an aircraft particularly during flaring as a plane lands.
717, 721/2, 732/3/4/5/7/8/9, 742/3/4, 752/3, 762/3, 772/E/W, 788/9, 300,310, 319,320/1, 332/3, 359, 388, DC9, DC10, F28, F100, 142,143, E75/90, CR2, D82/3/4, SF3, ATR
 
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qf789
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - January 2019

Thu Jan 31, 2019 4:52 am

waoz1 wrote:
qf789 wrote:
Due to ZNG being out of action on Thursday 31/1 QF9 MEL-PER will be subbed by 738, QF10 PER-MEL has been cancelled, ZNB will terminate in PER (LHR-PER) to operate PER-LHR


Ive seen the post a few times what they sub a 738 on the per-mel leg
Does that mean they just arent getting the numbers out of melbourne for this route?


It really has nothing to do with passenger numbers, more to do with utilisation of the aircraft. In the times that the MEL-PER sector has been subbed by a 737 or 330 there has typically been another aircraft out of service. As the aircraft flying in from LHR is operating back to LHR tonight if it continued to MEL there would be a delay of around 5 hours on the return sector. Obviously if it went delayed it could cause other problems such as needing to hold flying into LHR where as on the scheduled time it normally flies straight in. Currently the average flight time is 17 and a half hours though there has been 2 flights that have clocked in at just under 18 hours in the past couple of weeks, being 17.56 and 17.57, the majority of flights in Jan have gone over the scheduled 17 hours and 25 minutes so I think it important to QF to operate the schedule on time, as holding may require extra fuel on board which means passengers could be bumped to other flights
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EK413
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - January 2019

Thu Jan 31, 2019 6:52 am

A change of weather conditions at SYD has just caused a few flights to abort their final approaches into SYD & execute go-arounds.

TR12 SIN-SYD 2 missed approaches & go-around runway 34L & 16R
QF146 AKL-SYD 2 missed approaches & go-around 34R & 16R
QF446 MEL-SYD 2 missed approaches & go-around 34L & 16R
VA556 PER-SYD holding
JQ516 MEL-SYD holding

EK413
Good evening, ladies and gentlemen. We are tonight’s entertainment!
 
qf2048
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - January 2019

Thu Jan 31, 2019 6:58 am

qf2220 wrote:
RyanairGuru wrote:
[
Not sure who you are referring to by Airlink, as they are a subsidiary of Rex.


No, Airlink Pty Ltd is a QF sub - not sure what the Rex one is. See Note 28 of the 2018 report. I forget how it works but it was somehow involved with the 717s.
https://investor.qantas.com/FormBuilder ... rt-ASX.pdf

Rexs' Air Link airlines (note the gap in the name)was based in Dubbo and flew charter operations plus some regular services, ie SYD-DBO-CAZ with a B1900, but this service was discontinued. I flew on it once between SYD and DBO between Christmas and new year when demand for flights were low. There were no rex flights or QF flight that day. It had a ZL code.
Just doing a bit of research and I've just discovered Rex have sold Air Link off in Sept last year.
https://www.dailyliberal.com.au/story/5 ... -business/
ZL,QF,KE,BA,AS,CX,FR,U2,W6,EI,IB,JL,AY,LH,AA,AC,FQ,DJ,JQ,LA,FJ,QS,NZ,NF,SB,PG,EK,AB,VA,MH
 
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Dan23
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - January 2019

Thu Jan 31, 2019 7:42 am

VH-OEH is positioning from SYD-MEL as QF6004 to cover tonights QF49/50 to SFO. There are also 744's scheduled for QF29/30 to HKG on Sunday and Monday.
 
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EK413
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - January 2019

Thu Jan 31, 2019 8:34 am

Dan23 wrote:
VH-OEH is positioning from SYD-MEL as QF6004 to cover tonights QF49/50 to SFO. There are also 744's scheduled for QF29/30 to HKG on Sunday and Monday.


Brings a big smile to my :D

As always the B747 steps up and saves the day! They stepped up when the A380 fleet was grounded & now the Dream)liner...

EK413
Good evening, ladies and gentlemen. We are tonight’s entertainment!
 
jupiter2
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - January 2019

Thu Jan 31, 2019 8:49 am

Dan23 wrote:
VH-OEH is positioning from SYD-MEL as QF6004 to cover tonights QF49/50 to SFO. There are also 744's scheduled for QF29/30 to HKG on Sunday and Monday.



The 744's to HKG would be to do with Chinese New Year demand.
 
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SeaEagle8
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - January 2019

Thu Jan 31, 2019 8:50 am

EK413 wrote:
Dan23 wrote:
VH-OEH is positioning from SYD-MEL as QF6004 to cover tonights QF49/50 to SFO. There are also 744's scheduled for QF29/30 to HKG on Sunday and Monday.


Brings a big smile to my :D

As always the B747 steps up and saves the day! They stepped up when the A380 fleet was grounded & now the Dream)liner...

EK413


But.

What happens when there are no 744s left to step and save the day?
NSW based avgeek
 
VapourTrails
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - January 2019

Thu Jan 31, 2019 8:52 am

EK413 wrote:
A change of weather conditions at SYD has just caused a few flights to abort their final approaches into SYD & execute go-arounds.

TR12 SIN-SYD 2 missed approaches & go-around runway 34L & 16R
QF146 AKL-SYD 2 missed approaches & go-around 34R & 16R
QF446 MEL-SYD 2 missed approaches & go-around 34L & 16R
VA556 PER-SYD holding
JQ516 MEL-SYD holding

EK413


..and a 747 diversion to CBR. The sound made me jump up so quick I forgot I was still eating food.. Another evening of diversions and holds, this time SYD.. I’ve nothing booked till April, I am actually OK about this... :swirl:

Image
Source: http://www.flightradar24.com
 
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EK413
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - January 2019

Thu Jan 31, 2019 8:57 am

VapourTrails wrote:
EK413 wrote:
A change of weather conditions at SYD has just caused a few flights to abort their final approaches into SYD & execute go-arounds.

TR12 SIN-SYD 2 missed approaches & go-around runway 34L & 16R
QF146 AKL-SYD 2 missed approaches & go-around 34R & 16R
QF446 MEL-SYD 2 missed approaches & go-around 34L & 16R
VA556 PER-SYD holding
JQ516 MEL-SYD holding

EK413


..and a 747 diversion to CBR. The sound made me jump up so quick I forgot I was still eating food.. Another evening of diversions and holds, this time SYD.. I’ve nothing booked till April, I am actually OK about this... :swirl:

Image
Source: http://www.flightradar24.com

Problem with SYD would be the curfew...

Going to be a fun night!

Btw, enjoy your dinner ;)

SeaEagle8 wrote:
EK413 wrote:
Dan23 wrote:
VH-OEH is positioning from SYD-MEL as QF6004 to cover tonights QF49/50 to SFO. There are also 744's scheduled for QF29/30 to HKG on Sunday and Monday.


Brings a big smile to my :D

As always the B747 steps up and saves the day! They stepped up when the A380 fleet was grounded & now the Dream)liner...

EK413


But.

What happens when there are no 744s left to step and save the day?


Exactly. I know QF want to simplify their fleet but I don’t see why they need to retire all B747’s by 2020. Personally, -ER’s should stay on until 2022-24 as they’ll always step up when QF are desperate for a reliable bird!

EK413
Good evening, ladies and gentlemen. We are tonight’s entertainment!
 
tullamarine
Posts: 2098
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - January 2019

Thu Jan 31, 2019 9:21 am

Exactly. I know QF want to simplify their fleet but I don’t see why they need to retire all B747’s by 2020. Personally, -ER’s should stay on until 2022-24 as they’ll always step up when QF are desperate for a reliable bird!


The cost savings an airline achieves by eliminating a type are just too attractive. Apart from the fuel savings, QF can dispose of warehouses of rotables, avoid potential C & D checks and eliminate the need to keep crew and maintenance staff current in the type. In addition, they get tot standardise their product meaning the entire medium to long-range int'l product will be common by the end of 2020.
717, 721/2, 732/3/4/5/7/8/9, 742/3/4, 752/3, 762/3, 772/E/W, 788/9, 300,310, 319,320/1, 332/3, 359, 388, DC9, DC10, F28, F100, 142,143, E75/90, CR2, D82/3/4, SF3, ATR
 
VapourTrails
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - January 2019

Thu Jan 31, 2019 9:26 am

Using this week as an example, SYD and MEL had a weather scenario impacting the airports on consecutive evenings. What if they both had the weather disruptions on the same night, how would this then play out? CBR, AVV and ADL and BNE would be busy for sure. Are weather disruption events becoming more frequent and a real and increasing cost issue for airlines, or are we just noticing air traffic movements more in general because we have the mobile technology to sit and watch it?
 
SYDSpotter
Posts: 770
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - January 2019

Thu Jan 31, 2019 10:08 am

VapourTrails wrote:
Are weather disruption events becoming more frequent and a real and increasing cost issue for airlines, or are we just noticing air traffic movements more in general because we have the mobile technology to sit and watch it?


Probably a bit of both. Assuming the number of weather events has remained constant, just with the growth in air traffic, you will have an increase in the number of pax/aircraft each time.

Go back 20 years ago, if a flight was delayed by 5 hours, you probably wouldn't hear anything about it. In todays world, if a flight is delayed by 5 mins, you will have social media warriors tweeting that their life has been irreparably impacted :duck:
319_320_321_332_333_388 / 734_737_738_743_744_762_763_772_773_77W_788_789
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