Moderators: jsumali2, richierich, ua900, PanAm_DC10, hOMSaR

 
User avatar
cosyr
Posts: 1475
Joined: Thu Jul 26, 2012 3:23 pm

Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Fri Sep 06, 2019 12:08 am

VC10er wrote:
There is a well known expression that would apply well here “there is no such thing as a stupid question”
Would having any UA flights into London Gatwick be beneficial in anyway to anyone?
Basic thought is: for some people in a part of London and its surrounding suburbs etc benefit with a faster ride vs LHR?

I've thought for a little while with as many flights as United has to LHR, that 1 or 2 daily flights to LGW would be reasonable, but they would have to be lower premium density, because LGW wouldn't have the same ground experience that LHR offers. It might allow cities like DEN to fly in the off season, when they don't have the slots at LHR. That being said, UA has a great set up at LHR, at the generally preferred airport to London, and a really strong presence for a non-partner airline to any hub carriers.
 
jayunited
Posts: 2968
Joined: Sat Jan 05, 2013 12:03 am

Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Fri Sep 06, 2019 12:58 am

cosyr wrote:
I've thought for a little while with as many flights as United has to LHR, that 1 or 2 daily flights to LGW would be reasonable, but they would have to be lower premium density, because LGW wouldn't have the same ground experience that LHR offers. It might allow cities like DEN to fly in the off season, when they don't have the slots at LHR. That being said, UA has a great set up at LHR, at the generally preferred airport to London, and a really strong presence for a non-partner airline to any hub carriers.


DEN-LHR is now year around UA was able to secure a year around slot it was announced earlier this summer.
 
codc10
Posts: 2897
Joined: Sat Jul 08, 2000 7:18 am

Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Fri Sep 06, 2019 1:45 am

Delta flying BOS/JFK-LGW (with VS) has everything to do with preempting JetBlue. United doesn’t have the same forthcoming threat at its TATL hubs.
 
CriticalPoint
Posts: 1062
Joined: Thu Jan 19, 2017 5:01 pm

Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Fri Sep 06, 2019 1:51 am

sdh9 wrote:
calpsafltskeds wrote:
UA probably want some minor changes that make sense and doesn't harm pilots.

Allowing the 76 seat 175 E2, which would bring a quieter, more efficient aircraft into the fleet w/o changing numbers of total E175s.

And how about some minor relief to allow more than 70 additional 76 seaters if the 220 or E195 come on the scene. With current scope, UA would be forced to cap the E195 or 220 fleet when the 70 RJs cap is met.

That's why its called negotiations and common sense stuff should be a no brainer that grows UA and its pilot jobs.


UA scope is the same as Delta’s; Delta just chose to operate a 100-seat product (and two of them, at that.) It takes 88 jets to “unlock” the scope, but neither company is restricted if they wish to operate more (and Delta currently does).


That is completely incorect
 
sdh9
Posts: 66
Joined: Wed Jun 15, 2016 3:13 pm

Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Fri Sep 06, 2019 3:14 am

CriticalPoint wrote:
sdh9 wrote:
calpsafltskeds wrote:
UA probably want some minor changes that make sense and doesn't harm pilots.

Allowing the 76 seat 175 E2, which would bring a quieter, more efficient aircraft into the fleet w/o changing numbers of total E175s.

And how about some minor relief to allow more than 70 additional 76 seaters if the 220 or E195 come on the scene. With current scope, UA would be forced to cap the E195 or 220 fleet when the 70 RJs cap is met.

That's why its called negotiations and common sense stuff should be a no brainer that grows UA and its pilot jobs.


UA scope is the same as Delta’s; Delta just chose to operate a 100-seat product (and two of them, at that.) It takes 88 jets to “unlock” the scope, but neither company is restricted if they wish to operate more (and Delta currently does).


That is completely incorect


Read section 1-C-1-g of the United Pilot Agreement. The company may add a total of 70 76-seat aircraft if 88 New Small Narrowbody aircraft are added, but there is no restriction on the company operating more than 88 New Small Narrowbody aircraft. Of course they don’t get more 76-seat RJs, but neither did Delta.

There are other factors in play, such as the reduction of 50-seat aircraft, but that’s not relevant to this discussion.
 
User avatar
cosyr
Posts: 1475
Joined: Thu Jul 26, 2012 3:23 pm

Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Fri Sep 06, 2019 6:36 pm

sdh9 wrote:
CriticalPoint wrote:
sdh9 wrote:

UA scope is the same as Delta’s; Delta just chose to operate a 100-seat product (and two of them, at that.) It takes 88 jets to “unlock” the scope, but neither company is restricted if they wish to operate more (and Delta currently does).


That is completely incorect


Read section 1-C-1-g of the United Pilot Agreement. The company may add a total of 70 76-seat aircraft if 88 New Small Narrowbody aircraft are added, but there is no restriction on the company operating more than 88 New Small Narrowbody aircraft. Of course they don’t get more 76-seat RJs, but neither did Delta.

There are other factors in play, such as the reduction of 50-seat aircraft, but that’s not relevant to this discussion.


As is being discussed in the thread about the Mesa MRJ MoU (viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1430759) this article from earlier this week https://www.flightglobal.com/news/artic ... -f-460666/ reaffirms what I have said before, that the stance "not an inch on scope" is not as black and white as it seems. Former contracts have only focused on what mainline pilots get with regard to small narrowbodies, but there are still gains that pilots can make with the rest of the fleet, in exchange for updating the scope clause. This doesn't mean giving away the farm, it could just mean allowing the E2-175 under weight, and changing some of the allowed 50 seaters to 70 seaters, while potentially reducing the total allowed express. A guarantee that UA would actually buy 100 seaters this time, rather than just said a ratio of express:100 seaters, would also be an improvement over the last contracts. Promise of mainline jobs seems better than potential sometime vaguely in the future. I support pilots, and I know they have gotten burned by management in the past, so anytime spoken promises can be converted into guarantees, the better. As a passenger, I want to see the E2-195 or A220 at UA, flown by mainline.
 
UAinAUS
Posts: 231
Joined: Fri Jun 17, 2016 8:11 am

Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Sun Sep 08, 2019 1:44 am

UAX Update:

CR5:
N161GJ exited TUS with new CR5 interior, ferried STL
N164GJ exited AMA in new livery, ferried TUS for interior mod
N167GJ ferried AMA for new livery paint

CR7:
N169GJ has exited revenue service, awaiting CR5 mods
 
User avatar
Schweigend
Posts: 532
Joined: Sun Jun 06, 2010 8:47 am

Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Sun Sep 08, 2019 6:53 am

jayunited wrote:
DEN-LHR is now year around UA was able to secure a year around slot it was announced earlier this summer.


There have been questions about where that slot came from ... and I may have come across the answer --

While reading the Australian Aviation Thread - September 2019 I came across a link to a Forbes article about Qantas and LHR (post 103), with the following quote:


Smaller European airlines have reduced or totally exited London. Lufthansa’s Eurowings will give up a Heathrow-Berlin flight so the Heathrow slot can be better used by partner United Airlines.


https://www.forbes.com/sites/willhorton ... -to-london

So, apparently we now know that the slot allowing year-round DEN-LHR service will come from a discontinued EW TXL-LHR flight.

Thank you, Star Partner Lufthansa !
 
User avatar
intotheair
Posts: 1895
Joined: Sun Aug 31, 2014 12:49 pm

Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Sun Sep 08, 2019 10:11 am

Schweigend wrote:
jayunited wrote:
DEN-LHR is now year around UA was able to secure a year around slot it was announced earlier this summer.


There have been questions about where that slot came from ... and I may have come across the answer --

While reading the Australian Aviation Thread - September 2019 I came across a link to a Forbes article about Qantas and LHR (post 103), with the following quote:


Smaller European airlines have reduced or totally exited London. Lufthansa’s Eurowings will give up a Heathrow-Berlin flight so the Heathrow slot can be better used by partner United Airlines.


https://www.forbes.com/sites/willhorton ... -to-london

So, apparently we now know that the slot allowing year-round DEN-LHR service will come from a discontinued EW TXL-LHR flight.

Thank you, Star Partner Lufthansa !


Nice find!
300 319 320 321 332 333 345 346 380 717 733 734 735 73G 738 739 744 752 753 762 763 772 77W 788 789 CR2 CR7 CR9 CRK Q400 E175 DC10 MD82 MD90
AA AF AS AY AZ B6 BA BR DL F9 FI GA HA KF LH MI QX SK SN SQ UA US VY WN
 
Themotionman
Posts: 210
Joined: Tue Sep 19, 2017 1:18 pm

Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Sun Sep 08, 2019 10:36 am

VC10er wrote:
There is a well known expression that would apply well here “there is no such thing as a stupid question”
Would having any UA flights into London Gatwick be beneficial in anyway to anyone?
Basic thought is: for some people in a part of London and its surrounding suburbs etc benefit with a faster ride vs LHR?


I don't think all the costs and complexity of opening a new station would outweigh the extra revenue of setting up operations in Gatwick. Gatwick serves South London, the southern home counties and some Thameslink traffic from Herts and Beds.

Whilst I think its unlikely, the only thing I can fathom UA doing is sending a B752/B763 from EWR. UA are probably best sticking to Heathrow.
 
Themotionman
Posts: 210
Joined: Tue Sep 19, 2017 1:18 pm

Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Sun Sep 08, 2019 10:49 am

cosyr wrote:
codc10 wrote:
- They look at the seasonal TATL markets as experimental flying and, in some cases, target places where Star doesn't have much share. This stimulates growth and doesn't negatively impact the integrity of European JV hubs. NAP, PMO, NCE (probably SkyTeam-primary and where OW has larger share than *A) were identified as such. So this might give some guidance as to where UA might like to go in the future.


It would be nice if this would mean a return to some markets in the UK, or a better partnership with someone non-star. When CO was in Skyteam, it was nice being able to fly KLM, because they seem bigger in the UK than BA, at times. LH doesn't fly to half the small markets in the UK, which is surprising and disappointing to me. Plus, I don't enjoy changing planes in FRA, AMS was alright. LHR would be great if they had a partner in Terminal 2, so I could use the UA club.


FSDan wrote:
I'd think secondary UK + Ireland and the Iberian Peninsula would be other examples where nonstops from the U.S. wouldn't steal too much connecting traffic from the interior European hubs.


UA seems to have given up on secondary UK. Bristol was launched by Continental in 2005 before being dropped some time before/during the merger (2010 I think). Belfast was dropped in 2017. Newcastle had a short run during 2015/16. Glasgow has been made seasonal. Birmingham was axed in 2017. The UK is in no better state now than it was 5 years ago so there is no reason to believe that these markets would work today when UA couldn't make them work before the Brexit chaos. The only adds I could imagine are ORD/IAD-MAN, or the addition of another London Airport. It is actually quicker to get from The City to STN on the Stansted Express from Liverpool St than it is to get the Heathrow Express.
 
jayunited
Posts: 2968
Joined: Sat Jan 05, 2013 12:03 am

Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Sun Sep 08, 2019 12:12 pm

Schweigend wrote:
jayunited wrote:
DEN-LHR is now year around UA was able to secure a year around slot it was announced earlier this summer.


There have been questions about where that slot came from ... and I may have come across the answer --

While reading the Australian Aviation Thread - September 2019 I came across a link to a Forbes article about Qantas and LHR (post 103), with the following quote:


Smaller European airlines have reduced or totally exited London. Lufthansa’s Eurowings will give up a Heathrow-Berlin flight so the Heathrow slot can be better used by partner United Airlines.


https://www.forbes.com/sites/willhorton ... -to-london

So, apparently we now know that the slot allowing year-round DEN-LHR service will come from a discontinued EW TXL-LHR flight.

Thank you, Star Partner Lufthansa !


Yes it pays to have partners.

But now you have me wondering does UA still have the seasonal slot we were using for DEN-LHR or did we give that slot to LH or perhaps some other JV or Star Alliance member?
 
codc10
Posts: 2897
Joined: Sat Jul 08, 2000 7:18 am

Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Sun Sep 08, 2019 1:04 pm

jayunited wrote:
Schweigend wrote:
jayunited wrote:
DEN-LHR is now year around UA was able to secure a year around slot it was announced earlier this summer.


There have been questions about where that slot came from ... and I may have come across the answer --

While reading the Australian Aviation Thread - September 2019 I came across a link to a Forbes article about Qantas and LHR (post 103), with the following quote:


Smaller European airlines have reduced or totally exited London. Lufthansa’s Eurowings will give up a Heathrow-Berlin flight so the Heathrow slot can be better used by partner United Airlines.


https://www.forbes.com/sites/willhorton ... -to-london

So, apparently we now know that the slot allowing year-round DEN-LHR service will come from a discontinued EW TXL-LHR flight.

Thank you, Star Partner Lufthansa !


Yes it pays to have partners.

But now you have me wondering does UA still have the seasonal slot we were using for DEN-LHR or did we give that slot to LH or perhaps some other JV or Star Alliance member?


We’ll know if LAXLHR #2 (or EWRLHR #6) is in the schedule for next summer...
 
VC10er
Posts: 4268
Joined: Tue Feb 20, 2007 6:25 am

Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Sun Sep 08, 2019 1:30 pm

Couple curiosities:
Of the US3, who has the most of their own metal from points throughout the USA to LHR?

Second: once the brand new deliveries for United arrive, by summer 2020, will UA keep all EWR/LHR nonstops 763’s or can we expect to see refurbished 772’s or 78Js on EWR/LHR? (77W?)
To Most the Sky is The Limit, For me, the Sky is Home.
 
Scarebus34
Posts: 529
Joined: Tue Feb 12, 2019 10:54 pm

Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Sun Sep 08, 2019 2:57 pm

VC10er wrote:
Couple curiosities:
Of the US3, who has the most of their own metal from points throughout the USA to LHR?

Second: once the brand new deliveries for United arrive, by summer 2020, will UA keep all EWR/LHR nonstops 763’s or can we expect to see refurbished 772’s or 78Js on EWR/LHR? (77W?)

They will keep the high-J 767 on EWR-LHR....
 
VC10er
Posts: 4268
Joined: Tue Feb 20, 2007 6:25 am

Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Sun Sep 08, 2019 3:25 pm

Scarebus34 wrote:
VC10er wrote:
Couple curiosities:
Of the US3, who has the most of their own metal from points throughout the USA to LHR?

Second: once the brand new deliveries for United arrive, by summer 2020, will UA keep all EWR/LHR nonstops 763’s or can we expect to see refurbished 772’s or 78Js on EWR/LHR? (77W?)

They will keep the high-J 767 on EWR-LHR....


Thanks! I was really hoping that Boeing was going to agree to building some additional passenger 763ER’s for United a couple years ago. I feel so comfortable inside a 767.

I know that NYC/LHR has the need for many J seats. With United’s high Polaris, I also wonder who of the US3 will have the most lie flat J seats in total between the USA and LHR?
To Most the Sky is The Limit, For me, the Sky is Home.
 
xxcr
Posts: 468
Joined: Fri Oct 24, 2008 6:37 pm

Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Sun Sep 08, 2019 5:38 pm

VC10er wrote:
Scarebus34 wrote:
VC10er wrote:
Couple curiosities:
Of the US3, who has the most of their own metal from points throughout the USA to LHR?

Second: once the brand new deliveries for United arrive, by summer 2020, will UA keep all EWR/LHR nonstops 763’s or can we expect to see refurbished 772’s or 78Js on EWR/LHR? (77W?)

They will keep the high-J 767 on EWR-LHR....


Thanks! I was really hoping that Boeing was going to agree to building some additional passenger 763ER’s for United a couple years ago. I feel so comfortable inside a 767.

I know that NYC/LHR has the need for many J seats. With United’s high Polaris, I also wonder who of the US3 will have the most lie flat J seats in total between the USA and LHR?


Pretty sure UA takes the cake on the amount of lie flat J seats from the US-LHR. AA and DL trailing just behind.......but correct me if im wrong.
 
notconcerned
Posts: 189
Joined: Sat Jun 18, 2016 3:39 pm

Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Sun Sep 08, 2019 5:51 pm

VC10er wrote:
Couple curiosities:
Of the US3, who has the most of their own metal from points throughout the USA to LHR?

Second: once the brand new deliveries for United arrive, by summer 2020, will UA keep all EWR/LHR nonstops 763’s or can we expect to see refurbished 772’s or 78Js on EWR/LHR? (77W?)


AA has the most from 9 US airports.

xxcr wrote:
VC10er wrote:

Thanks! I was really hoping that Boeing was going to agree to building some additional passenger 763ER’s for United a couple years ago. I feel so comfortable inside a 767.

I know that NYC/LHR has the need for many J seats. With United’s high Polaris, I also wonder who of the US3 will have the most lie flat J seats in total between the USA and LHR?


Pretty sure UA takes the cake on the amount of lie flat J seats from the US-LHR. AA and DL trailing just behind.......but correct me if im wrong.


Based on my crude calculations, AA has around 665 F/J seats and UA has around 686 J seats today. AA flies a lot of 772/77W to LHR but they also have a few A330 with lower J count. UA could widen its margin with more high-J flying from ORD. But UA doesn't have the luxury that AA/DL has with a JV partner to help lift additional J capacity. So the comparison is not really fair to begin with (especially with high premium BA configurations).
 
xxcr
Posts: 468
Joined: Fri Oct 24, 2008 6:37 pm

Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Sun Sep 08, 2019 5:57 pm

notconcerned wrote:
VC10er wrote:
Couple curiosities:
Of the US3, who has the most of their own metal from points throughout the USA to LHR?

Second: once the brand new deliveries for United arrive, by summer 2020, will UA keep all EWR/LHR nonstops 763’s or can we expect to see refurbished 772’s or 78Js on EWR/LHR? (77W?)


AA has the most from 9 US airports.

xxcr wrote:
VC10er wrote:

Thanks! I was really hoping that Boeing was going to agree to building some additional passenger 763ER’s for United a couple years ago. I feel so comfortable inside a 767.

I know that NYC/LHR has the need for many J seats. With United’s high Polaris, I also wonder who of the US3 will have the most lie flat J seats in total between the USA and LHR?


Pretty sure UA takes the cake on the amount of lie flat J seats from the US-LHR. AA and DL trailing just behind.......but correct me if im wrong.


Based on my crude calculations, AA has around 665 F/J seats and UA has around 686 J seats today. AA flies a lot of 772/77W to LHR but they also have a few A330 with lower J count. UA could widen its margin with more high-J flying from ORD. But UA doesn't have the luxury that AA/DL has with a JV partner to help lift additional J capacity. So the comparison is not really fair to begin with (especially with high premium BA configurations).



what about DL? im sure DL is behind in numbers of J seats offered to LHR.
 
notconcerned
Posts: 189
Joined: Sat Jun 18, 2016 3:39 pm

Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Sun Sep 08, 2019 6:46 pm

xxcr wrote:

what about DL? im sure DL is behind in numbers of J seats offered to LHR.


I didn't initially include DL as their most premium aircraft only has 40J seats. Based on today's flights, there are around 348 J seats for DL to LHR (also surprised DL doesn't fly SEA-LHR). UA also has more frequency and higher J configurations than DL. Pretty much for most international market comparison. Now if only UA can quickly increase domestic F with the reconfigured A319/320 and CRJ550.
 
xxcr
Posts: 468
Joined: Fri Oct 24, 2008 6:37 pm

Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Sun Sep 08, 2019 7:11 pm

notconcerned wrote:
xxcr wrote:

what about DL? im sure DL is behind in numbers of J seats offered to LHR.


I didn't initially include DL as their most premium aircraft only has 40J seats. Based on today's flights, there are around 348 J seats for DL to LHR (also surprised DL doesn't fly SEA-LHR). UA also has more frequency and higher J configurations than DL. Pretty much for most international market comparison. Now if only UA can quickly increase domestic F with the reconfigured A319/320 and CRJ550.


poor DL lol!


4 additional F seats per plane, it'll take some time so dont hold your breath lol
 
RainerBoeing777
Posts: 531
Joined: Wed Jun 21, 2017 3:43 pm

Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Sun Sep 08, 2019 8:29 pm

United launches its new premium products in Washington Dulles (IAD) the first destinations will be FRA and MUC both will be with Boeing 777-200ER

https://www.touristik-aktuell.de/nachrichten/verkehr/news/datum/2019/09/06/united-airlines-mehr-premiumsitze-ab-deutschland/
CX - JL - LH - KE - KL - SQ - QR - QF - TG
 
jayunited
Posts: 2968
Joined: Sat Jan 05, 2013 12:03 am

Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Sun Sep 08, 2019 9:27 pm

RainerBoeing777 wrote:
United launches its new premium products in Washington Dulles (IAD) the first destinations will be FRA and MUC both will be with Boeing 777-200ER

https://www.touristik-aktuell.de/nachrichten/verkehr/news/datum/2019/09/06/united-airlines-mehr-premiumsitze-ab-deutschland/


UA's premium product is already on dedicated routes at IAD, routes like BRU, CDG, and TLV are the dedicated routes that are flown with Polaris/PE every flight.

I'm not sure why this article is making spotlighting these upcoming routes because the last PW 77E goes in for Polaris/PE in December and by May 2020 the last GE 77E goes in so its safe to say come February there will be a lot 77E routes going Polaris/PE and by May all international 77E routes will be flown on true Polaris/PE aircraft.
 
Runway28L
Posts: 2100
Joined: Wed Sep 20, 2017 7:35 pm

Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Sun Sep 08, 2019 9:32 pm

B738 N13248 just exited paint and is currently ferrying AMA-CLE.

https://www.flightradar24.com/data/flight/UA2725
 
DeltaRules
Posts: 5198
Joined: Sat Sep 01, 2001 11:57 am

Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Mon Sep 09, 2019 2:59 am

Is a return to DAB in the near future?

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1430931
A310/319/320/321/333, ARJ, BN2, B717/722/73S/733/734/735/73G/738/739/744/757/753/767/763/764/777, CR1/2/7/9, DH6, 328, EM2/ERJ/E70/E75/E90, F28/100, J31, L10/12/15, DC9/D93/D94/D95/M80/M88/M90/D10, SF3, SST
 
User avatar
atcsundevil
Moderator
Topic Author
Posts: 4296
Joined: Sat Mar 20, 2010 12:22 pm

Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Mon Sep 09, 2019 4:11 am

The fleet updates, fleet status, and repaint status posts at the start of this thread have been updated.

✈️ atcsundevil
 
fun2fly
Posts: 1615
Joined: Tue Dec 26, 2006 8:44 am

Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Wed Sep 11, 2019 3:15 pm

N664UA 763 Conv to High J looks to be leaving HKG on 9/13.
 
Cmac787
Posts: 86
Joined: Fri Oct 27, 2017 5:15 pm

Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Fri Sep 13, 2019 12:56 pm

Does anyone know when the first widebody is due to go into paint? Some of the 767-300’s are looking pretty rough
 
User avatar
calpsafltskeds
Posts: 3227
Joined: Tue Dec 19, 2006 1:29 am

Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Fri Sep 13, 2019 3:16 pm

763:
N662UA entered SFO 2792/5Sep, probably maint issue, possibly HKG mod when N664UA exits HKG.

39M:
Entire 14 aircraft fleet now in GYR. Last 2 en route this morning from HOU

763 Paint:
Would expect when seasonal services end. Approximate dates:
ATH 10/4
PRG 10/5
VCE 10/22
NAP 10/26
ORD-HKG ended 9/6, not sure if 772s will head to XMN or paint.
 
FSDan
Posts: 3340
Joined: Mon Jan 03, 2011 5:27 pm

Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Fri Sep 13, 2019 3:56 pm

Any further word on when the CR5s will enter service? Is UA still waiting on certification of the type?

I assume the CR5s that have already been converted are just sitting around waiting to enter revenue service...
This is my signature until I think of a better one.
 
aviator96
Posts: 21
Joined: Tue Feb 12, 2019 8:04 pm

Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Sat Sep 14, 2019 2:30 am

Looks like N668UA will replace N664UA in HKG. Scheduled to arrive 9/17.
 
User avatar
calpsafltskeds
Posts: 3227
Joined: Tue Dec 19, 2006 1:29 am

Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Sun Sep 15, 2019 1:07 pm

763:
N656UA entered PVG 2690/14Sep, assume maint, already has Polaris, (maybe HKG is full with Polaris mods)
N662UA still in SFO since 9/5 after ferrying IAH-SFO
N664UA sked first revenue Polaris flight 938/16Sep EWR-LHR
N668UA sked to enter HKG 2740/15Sep for High J Polaris/PP

Paint not moving forward at the moment. 738 N73291 been in AMA since 9/2 and new to UA 319 N876UA since 9/4.
At moment I count 13 738s in maintenance around the system. Maybe catching up from running full boar all summer due to MAX groundings.

Paint should get into the swing of things as beside those EWR market mentioned above, there will be more wide body releases when IAD-BCN/MAD/FCO and ORD -FCO go away for the off season on various dates in October. Also IAD-LIS.EDI//DUB and ORD-EDI/DUB go away for the off season (I believe they are all 752 operations).
 
User avatar
KVH68
Posts: 265
Joined: Sat Aug 20, 2016 4:09 am

Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Sun Sep 15, 2019 1:19 pm

763:
N662UA is having landing gear change. It should be done in a couple of days.
 
GmoneyCO
Posts: 163
Joined: Sun Oct 29, 2017 4:42 pm

Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Sun Sep 15, 2019 2:18 pm

319:
N875UA - Delivery from China Southern (B-6039). Looks to currently be in NRT as it was flown there on 9-Sept, UA took delivery on 11-Sept and no exit flights scheduled from NRT.
N879UA - Delivery from China Southern (B-2295). Also looks to be in NRT as it was flown there on 10-Sept, UA took delivery on 12-Sept and no exit flights scheduled from NRT.
 
User avatar
CALTECH
Posts: 3427
Joined: Thu May 17, 2007 4:21 am

Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Sun Sep 15, 2019 5:49 pm

737-700

#0755 removed from list.

737-700s

Nose #....Type.........Mfg SN....N Number....Line #.........Yr Acq.........Fmr Oper
0755....... 737-76N .32679..... N13755....... 1514 ..........Sep-19 ........SWA/N7714B (610)
0756 .......737-76N .32653 .....N16756 .......1566 ..........Dec-19 ........SWA/N7703A (612)
0757 .......737-76N .32661 .....N18757 .......1593 ...........Mar-20 .......SWA/N7706A (614)
0758 .......737-76N .32667 .....N15758 .......1623 ...........Mar-20 .......SWA/N7707C (615)
0759 .......737-76N .32652 .....N17759 .......1627 ...........Apr-20 .......SWA/N7708E (616)
0760 .......737-76N .32654 .....N24760 .......1641 ...........Apr-20 .......SWA/N7709A (617)
0761 .......737-76N .32656 .....N12761 .......1671 ...........Jun-20 .......SWA/N7710A (618)
0762 .......737-76N .32657 .....N12762 .......1687 ............Jul-20 .......SWA/N7711N (619)
0763 .......737-76N .32660 .....N12763 .......1710 ...........Aug-20 ......SWA/N7712G (620)
0764....... 737-76N .32662 .....N12764 .......1788 ...........Jan-21 .......SWA/N7716A (621)
0765 .......737-76N .32664 .....N13765 .......1804 ...........Feb-21 .......SWA/N7717D (622)
0766 .......737-76N .32665 .....N16766 .......1827 ...........Mar-21 .......SWA/N7718B (623)
0767 .......737-76N .32666..... N28767 .......1833 ...........Mar-21 .......SWA/N7719A (624)
0768 .......737-76N .32668 .....N17768 .......1876 ...........May-21 ......SWA/N7722B (625)
0769 .......737-76N .32670 .....N13769 .......1898 ...........Jun-21 .......SWA/N7723E (626)
0770 .......737-76N .32671 .....N47770 .......1925 ...........Jul-21 ........SWA/N7725A (627)
0771 .......737-76N .32673 .....N13771 .......1943 ...........Aug-21 ......SWA/N7727A (628)
0772 .......737-76N .32675 .....N13772 .......1970 ...........Sep-21 ......SWA/N7729A (629)
0773 .......737-76N .32677 .....N13773 .......2002 ...........Oct-21 .......SWA/N7731A (630)
0774 .......737-76N .32678 .....N13774 .......2055 ..........Jan-22 ........SWA/N7733B (631)
0775 .......737-76N .32679 ....TBD .............1514 ...........Aug-15 .......SWA/N7714B (610)

737MAX-8s

7251 ....737MAX-8 .43931 ....N27251 .......8035 ..........TBD .............UA
7252 ....737MAX-8 .43932 ....N27252 .......8075 ..........TBD .............UA
7253 ....737MAX-8 .43930 ....N27253 .......8092 ..........TBD .............UA
7254 ....737MAX-8 .43436 ....N17254 .......8104 ..........TBD .............UA
7255 ....737MAX-8 .43440 ....TBD ............8119 ..........TBD .............UA
7256 ....737MAX-8 .64447 ....TBD ............8126 ..........TBD .............UA
7257 ....737MAX-8 .43442 ....TBD ............8133 ..........TBD .............UA
7258 ....737MAX-8 .66593 ....TBD ............8139 ..........TBD .............UA
7259 ....737MAX-8 .43462 ....TBD ............8143 ..........TBD .............UA
7260 ....737MAX-8 .43458 ....TBD ............8151 ..........TBD .............UA
7261 ....737MAX-8 .43464 ....TBD ............8153 ..........TBD .............UA

737MAX-10s

7751 ....737MAX-10 .66122 ...N27751 .....7644 ..........TBD .............UA
7752 ....737MAX-10 .66123 ...N27752 .....7705 ..........TBD .............UA
7753 ....737MAX-10 .66118 ...TBD ...........7935 ..........TBD .............UA
7754 ....737MAX-10 .66115 ...TBD ...........8173 ..........TBD .............UA
7755 ....737MAX-10 .66116 ...TBD ...........8210 ..........TBD .............UA

787-9s

0975 .....787-9 ........66134 ..N29975 ........0960 ...........20 ...............CO
0976 .....787-9 ........66135 ..TBD .............0970 ...........TBD ............CO
0977 .....787-9 ........66136 ..TBD .............0974 ...........TBD ............CO
0978 .....787-9 ........66137 ..TBD .............0986 ...........TBD ............CO
0979 .....787-9 ........66141 ..TBD .............1004 ...........TBD ............CO
0980 .....787-9 ........66138 ..TBD .............1018 ...........TBD ............CO
0981 .....787-9 ........66142 ..TBD .............1022 ...........TBD ............CO
0982 .....787-9 ........66139 ..TBD .............1030 ...........TBD ............CO
0983 .....787-9 ........66140 ..TBD .............1038 ...........TBD ............CO
0984 .....787-9 ........66143 ..TBD .............1044 ...........TBD ............CO
0985 .....787-9 ........66144 ..TBD .............1048 ...........TBD ............CO

787-10s Corrected Info

1010 .....787-10 ......40926 ....N12010 ......0948 ...........19 ..............CO
1011 .....787-10 .......40934 ...N14011 .......0950 ...........19 ..............CO
1012 .....787-10 .......60145 ...N12012 .......0964 ...........22 .............CO

A319-132s Updated Info

4875 A319-132 875 2200 N875UA N/A TBD 875 WV002 17 B-6039/CSN
4876 A319-132 876 2203 N876UA N/A TBD 876 WV002 17 B-6040/CSN
4877 A319-132 877 2232 N877UA N/A TBD 877 WV002 17 B-6041/CSN
4878 A319-132 878 2371 N878UA N/A TBD 878 WV002 17 B-2294/CSN
4879 A319-132 879 2408 N879UA N/A TBD 879 WV002 17 B-2295/CSN
4880 A319-132 880 2426 N880UA N/A TBD 880 WV002 17 B-2296/CSN
4881 A319-132 881 2435 N881UA N/A TBD 881 WV002 17 B-2297/CSN
4882 A319-132 882 2505 N882UA N/A TBD 882 WV002 17 B-6205/CSN
4883 A319-132 883 2574 N883UA N/A TBD 883 WV002 17 B-6206/CSN
4884 A319-132 884 2579 N884UA N/A TBD 884 WV002 17 B-6207/CSN
You are here.
 
User avatar
STT757
Posts: 14146
Joined: Tue Mar 28, 2000 1:14 am

Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Sun Sep 15, 2019 6:34 pm

CALTECH wrote:
737-700

#0755 removed from list.

737-700s

Nose #....Type.........Mfg SN....N Number....Line #.........Yr Acq.........Fmr Oper
0755....... 737-76N .32679..... N13755....... 1514 ..........Sep-19 ........SWA/N7714B (610)
0756 .......737-76N .32653 .....N16756 .......1566 ..........Dec-19 ........SWA/N7703A (612)
0757 .......737-76N .32661 .....N18757 .......1593 ...........Mar-20 .......SWA/N7706A (614)
0758 .......737-76N .32667 .....N15758 .......1623 ...........Mar-20 .......SWA/N7707C (615)
0759 .......737-76N .32652 .....N17759 .......1627 ...........Apr-20 .......SWA/N7708E (616)
0760 .......737-76N .32654 .....N24760 .......1641 ...........Apr-20 .......SWA/N7709A (617)
0761 .......737-76N .32656 .....N12761 .......1671 ...........Jun-20 .......SWA/N7710A (618)
0762 .......737-76N .32657 .....N12762 .......1687 ............Jul-20 .......SWA/N7711N (619)
0763 .......737-76N .32660 .....N12763 .......1710 ...........Aug-20 ......SWA/N7712G (620)
0764....... 737-76N .32662 .....N12764 .......1788 ...........Jan-21 .......SWA/N7716A (621)
0765 .......737-76N .32664 .....N13765 .......1804 ...........Feb-21 .......SWA/N7717D (622)
0766 .......737-76N .32665 .....N16766 .......1827 ...........Mar-21 .......SWA/N7718B (623)
0767 .......737-76N .32666..... N28767 .......1833 ...........Mar-21 .......SWA/N7719A (624)
0768 .......737-76N .32668 .....N17768 .......1876 ...........May-21 ......SWA/N7722B (625)
0769 .......737-76N .32670 .....N13769 .......1898 ...........Jun-21 .......SWA/N7723E (626)
0770 .......737-76N .32671 .....N47770 .......1925 ...........Jul-21 ........SWA/N7725A (627)
0771 .......737-76N .32673 .....N13771 .......1943 ...........Aug-21 ......SWA/N7727A (628)
0772 .......737-76N .32675 .....N13772 .......1970 ...........Sep-21 ......SWA/N7729A (629)
0773 .......737-76N .32677 .....N13773 .......2002 ...........Oct-21 .......SWA/N7731A (630)
0774 .......737-76N .32678 .....N13774 .......2055 ..........Jan-22 ........SWA/N7733B (631)
0775 .......737-76N .32679 ....TBD .............1514 ...........Aug-15 .......SWA/N7714B (610)

737MAX-8s

7251 ....737MAX-8 .43931 ....N27251 .......8035 ..........TBD .............UA
7252 ....737MAX-8 .43932 ....N27252 .......8075 ..........TBD .............UA
7253 ....737MAX-8 .43930 ....N27253 .......8092 ..........TBD .............UA
7254 ....737MAX-8 .43436 ....N17254 .......8104 ..........TBD .............UA
7255 ....737MAX-8 .43440 ....TBD ............8119 ..........TBD .............UA
7256 ....737MAX-8 .64447 ....TBD ............8126 ..........TBD .............UA
7257 ....737MAX-8 .43442 ....TBD ............8133 ..........TBD .............UA
7258 ....737MAX-8 .66593 ....TBD ............8139 ..........TBD .............UA
7259 ....737MAX-8 .43462 ....TBD ............8143 ..........TBD .............UA
7260 ....737MAX-8 .43458 ....TBD ............8151 ..........TBD .............UA
7261 ....737MAX-8 .43464 ....TBD ............8153 ..........TBD .............UA

737MAX-10s

7751 ....737MAX-10 .66122 ...N27751 .....7644 ..........TBD .............UA
7752 ....737MAX-10 .66123 ...N27752 .....7705 ..........TBD .............UA
7753 ....737MAX-10 .66118 ...TBD ...........7935 ..........TBD .............UA
7754 ....737MAX-10 .66115 ...TBD ...........8173 ..........TBD .............UA
7755 ....737MAX-10 .66116 ...TBD ...........8210 ..........TBD .............UA

787-9s

0975 .....787-9 ........66134 ..N29975 ........0960 ...........20 ...............CO
0976 .....787-9 ........66135 ..TBD .............0970 ...........TBD ............CO
0977 .....787-9 ........66136 ..TBD .............0974 ...........TBD ............CO
0978 .....787-9 ........66137 ..TBD .............0986 ...........TBD ............CO
0979 .....787-9 ........66141 ..TBD .............1004 ...........TBD ............CO
0980 .....787-9 ........66138 ..TBD .............1018 ...........TBD ............CO
0981 .....787-9 ........66142 ..TBD .............1022 ...........TBD ............CO
0982 .....787-9 ........66139 ..TBD .............1030 ...........TBD ............CO
0983 .....787-9 ........66140 ..TBD .............1038 ...........TBD ............CO
0984 .....787-9 ........66143 ..TBD .............1044 ...........TBD ............CO
0985 .....787-9 ........66144 ..TBD .............1048 ...........TBD ............CO

787-10s Corrected Info

1010 .....787-10 ......40926 ....N12010 ......0948 ...........19 ..............CO
1011 .....787-10 .......40934 ...N14011 .......0950 ...........19 ..............CO
1012 .....787-10 .......60145 ...N12012 .......0964 ...........22 .............CO

A319-132s Updated Info

4875 A319-132 875 2200 N875UA N/A TBD 875 WV002 17 B-6039/CSN
4876 A319-132 876 2203 N876UA N/A TBD 876 WV002 17 B-6040/CSN
4877 A319-132 877 2232 N877UA N/A TBD 877 WV002 17 B-6041/CSN
4878 A319-132 878 2371 N878UA N/A TBD 878 WV002 17 B-2294/CSN
4879 A319-132 879 2408 N879UA N/A TBD 879 WV002 17 B-2295/CSN
4880 A319-132 880 2426 N880UA N/A TBD 880 WV002 17 B-2296/CSN
4881 A319-132 881 2435 N881UA N/A TBD 881 WV002 17 B-2297/CSN
4882 A319-132 882 2505 N882UA N/A TBD 882 WV002 17 B-6205/CSN
4883 A319-132 883 2574 N883UA N/A TBD 883 WV002 17 B-6206/CSN
4884 A319-132 884 2579 N884UA N/A TBD 884 WV002 17 B-6207/CSN


So they're getting more than the 19 rumored.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro
Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
 
unitedewr737
Posts: 54
Joined: Sun Mar 31, 2019 8:58 am

Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Sun Sep 15, 2019 8:59 pm

Does anyone know if/when the pilots union and United corporate need to have the next contract done? Just wondering as it pertains to scope and if they would have to buy a 100 seat mainline given the rumor of the A220XLR.
 
jetmatt777
Posts: 4325
Joined: Sun Jun 26, 2005 2:16 am

Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Sun Sep 15, 2019 9:04 pm

unitedewr737 wrote:
Does anyone know if/when the pilots union and United corporate need to have the next contract done? Just wondering as it pertains to scope and if they would have to buy a 100 seat mainline given the rumor of the A220XLR.


I think the contract reached its amendable date this year; so they are probably still in negotiations right now.
 
User avatar
aemoreira1981
Posts: 3611
Joined: Mon Jan 09, 2017 12:17 am

Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Mon Sep 16, 2019 12:12 am

More international changes for NW19, starting October 26 (all effective dates are for departures from the United States). If no effective date is given, it's October 26.

https://www.routesonline.com/news/38/ai ... f-13sep19/

From DEN:
FRA: Reduce to 5-6 weekly, B788 service
LHR: 6 weekly in winter, B788 service (service extends to year-round)

From EWR:
AMS: B764 instead of B763
BCN: B763 instead of B764 until December 18, and again from January 6 until February 9.
BRU: B77E instead of B78X from February 13
CPT: B789 effective December 15 (3x weekly, new route)
CUR: B737 effective December 7 (1 weekly, last served in 2013)
FCO: B764 instead of B763 from February 14 until March 7
GRU: B77W instead of B77E from December 3
HKG: B77E instead of B77W from December 3
MAN: B763 instead of B752
TLV (UA84/5): B77W instead of B78X from December 3 (EWR-TLV all B77W)
TXL: B764 instead of B763
ZRH: B763 instead of B764 from December 19

From GUM:
HKG: Canceled (last flight October 15)
NGO: Increase to 14 weekly, B738 service
SPN: Increase to 9 weekly, B738 service

From IAD:
ZRH: B763 instead of B764 from December 3

From IAH:
GRU: B77E instead of B763 from December 9 until February 12
LHR (UA4/5): B764 instead of B77E from December 10 until February 12

From LAX:
PVG: B78X service not happening, B789 service maintained
MEL: 4x weekly until December 6, and again from February 1 until end of NW19, no flights on Tuesdays, Thursdays, or Saturdays

From ORD:
MUC: B763 instead of B77E from January 6

From SFO:
AMS: Suspended for NW19
AKL: B78X instead of B77W from December 3 (except selected dates)
DEL: B789 from December 5 (daily, new route)
FRA (UA926/7): B77W instead of B77E from February 12 (SFO-FRA all B77W)
HKG: B77E 2-class instead of B77E 3-class
HND: B78X instead B789 from January 6
KIX: B789 instead of B788 effective January 6 (1 of 5 weekly)
MEL: B789 3 weekly (new route)
NRT: B77E instead of B77W on 3 of 7 weekly flights until December 8
PEK: B77E instead of B77W for entire NW19
PVG (UA857/8): B789 instead of B78X or B77E mix for entire NW19 (UA857/8, except November 3 to November 26 on 3 of 7 weekly flights with a B78X)
PVG (UA890/1): B789 instead of B788 from October 29 until December 4, B77E instead of B789 December 5 until February 12, B78X instead of B77E from February 13
TLV: B77E instead of B789
TPE: B77W instead of B77E

As for the 737-700s coming into the fleet soon, United Airlines is buying them from GECAS. Southwest will be returning the planes to GECAS for the sale.
 
UAinAUS
Posts: 231
Joined: Fri Jun 17, 2016 8:11 am

Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Mon Sep 16, 2019 2:24 am

UAX Update:

E175SC:
N610UX entered revenue service 10Sept
N614UX has been delivered to ExpressJet
 
User avatar
calpsafltskeds
Posts: 3227
Joined: Tue Dec 19, 2006 1:29 am

Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Mon Sep 16, 2019 5:05 am

Hi CALTECH and thanks for the update.
However, it looks like these are listed twice.. So, it looks like 20 73Gs total.

0755....... 737-76N .32679..... N13755....... 1514 ..........Sep-19 ........SWA/N7714B (610) (first one on list)
0775 .......737-76N .32679 ....TBD .............1514 ...........Aug-15 .......SWA/N7714B (610) (last one on list)
 
UAL777UK
Posts: 2368
Joined: Sun Nov 20, 2005 1:16 am

Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Mon Sep 16, 2019 6:43 am

So do we have any idea as of yet when we will see a wide body on the "new" livery?
 
len90
Posts: 1150
Joined: Thu Jul 06, 2006 1:03 pm

Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Mon Sep 16, 2019 8:38 am

Where is the 789 for EWR-CPT going to come from? Will it rotate in and out via SFO or LAX?
Len90
 
User avatar
cosyr
Posts: 1475
Joined: Thu Jul 26, 2012 3:23 pm

Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Mon Sep 16, 2019 12:07 pm

UAL777UK wrote:
So do we have any idea as of yet when we will see a wide body on the "new" livery?

Isn't there supposed to be some new deliveries starting in November? How long before a delivery do we typically see planes come out of paint in Everett? I would think sometime in early October.
 
wn676
Posts: 1747
Joined: Mon Jun 20, 2005 5:33 am

Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Mon Sep 16, 2019 12:28 pm

len90 wrote:
Where is the 789 for EWR-CPT going to come from? Will it rotate in and out via SFO or LAX?


Appears to be coming from SFO...UA0295/2006.
Tiny, unreadable text leaves ample room for interpretation.
 
User avatar
calpsafltskeds
Posts: 3227
Joined: Tue Dec 19, 2006 1:29 am

Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Mon Sep 16, 2019 3:19 pm

738:
N73291 sked to exit AMA paint 2716/16Sep with Globe Evolution livery, 4th complete
 
Cointrin330
Posts: 2074
Joined: Sat Jul 16, 2016 12:23 pm

UA Long Haul Capacity Changes - Some Questions

Mon Sep 16, 2019 4:26 pm

As noted in previous threads, UA is suspending some long haul routes (ORG-HKG, EWR-EZE) and shifting capacity in other markets (all SFO/EWR to HKG to 772ER). Curious about some other changes and what others think:

San Francisco to Auckland, which was being operated with a 777-300ER at peak season is going to be a 787-10. It would seem UA has to figure out where to put 773s not pull them from, this winter. Thoughts?

Also, UA will base some 767-400ERs at IAH for the winter, to operate some deep South America routes and one London Heathrow frequency. Think this is the first time long haul international will see the 767-400ER at IAH since the merger.
 
xxcr
Posts: 468
Joined: Fri Oct 24, 2008 6:37 pm

Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Mon Sep 16, 2019 4:30 pm

Are there pictures of the 752 and a319 in the new livery?
 
IAHWorldflyer
Posts: 877
Joined: Mon Feb 06, 2012 7:22 pm

Re: UA Long Haul Capacity Changes - Some Questions

Mon Sep 16, 2019 4:32 pm

In the HKG thread, someone noted that EWR-GRU will be going to 77W for northern winter. That route requires 2 frames since the plane sits all day down at GRU. SFO-FRA will also go to a 77W.
I'd suspect they may upgauge the second daily EWR-TLV flight to a 77W. Seems like they have good loads on that route. Possibly put a 77W on one of the EWR-India routes as well?
Is LAX-SYD a 77W? I could see that as a possibility for the January-February peak season on that route.
 
MIflyer12
Posts: 8282
Joined: Mon Feb 18, 2013 11:58 pm

Re: UA Long Haul Capacity Changes - Some Questions

Mon Sep 16, 2019 4:53 pm

Cointrin330 wrote:
San Francisco to Auckland, which was being operated with a 777-300ER at peak season is going to be a 787-10. It would seem UA has to figure out where to put 773s not pull them from, this winter. Thoughts?


You're seeking to get particularly granular for a fleet of 192 widebody aircraft. A few seasonal parkings, an uptick in Polaris conversions... and your careful math (speculation) gets thrown off.

Popular Searches On Airliners.net

Top Photos of Last:   24 Hours  •  48 Hours  •  7 Days  •  30 Days  •  180 Days  •  365 Days  •  All Time

Military Aircraft Every type from fighters to helicopters from air forces around the globe

Classic Airliners Props and jets from the good old days

Flight Decks Views from inside the cockpit

Aircraft Cabins Passenger cabin shots showing seat arrangements as well as cargo aircraft interior

Cargo Aircraft Pictures of great freighter aircraft

Government Aircraft Aircraft flying government officials

Helicopters Our large helicopter section. Both military and civil versions

Blimps / Airships Everything from the Goodyear blimp to the Zeppelin

Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos