calpsafltskeds wrote:

My hopeful guess is 76L. 4 of 7 that were to be retired are sked to become 76L.
N657UA has been in one day short or N667UA and they both appear to be taking test hops.
Also, N652UA and N656UA are in XMN for maint - if N657UA is just maint, then why in HKG.

MX only, no interior change other than being restored...

codc10 wrote:

Maybe a FA can chime in, but my understanding is that “load” flight attendant positions were eliminated long ago, such that staffing is 3 for A319/320/73G and 4 for 738/739, except for special circumstances. Do Hawaii turns get an extra position?

Had a flight on a UA 739 just a few weeks ago with 5 flight attendants - the flight was full and not that long. So I'm assuming the assignment was based on the workload, but I don't have any info on the matrix UA uses to assign the extra FA. The fifth FA was a surprise to me.

CALTECH wrote:

calpsafltskeds wrote:

My hopeful guess is 76L. 4 of 7 that were to be retired are sked to become 76L.
N657UA has been in one day short or N667UA and they both appear to be taking test hops.
Also, N652UA and N656UA are in XMN for maint - if N657UA is just maint, then why in HKG.

MX only, no interior change other than being restored...

It is all based on th amount of seats. 1 per 50 passengers. So a 73G with 118 seats requires atleast 3 no matter if there are 118 passengers of 5 passengers. They can staff more but there cant be less. On Intl flights there usually is more than minimum however things happen like a fa becoming sick.

calpsafltskeds wrote:

My hopeful guess is 76L. 4 of 7 that were to be retired are sked to become 76L.
N657UA has been in one day short or N667UA and they both appear to be taking test hops.
Also, N652UA and N656UA are in XMN for maint - if N657UA is just maint, then why in HKG.

I guess we will find out soon enough n657ua is leaving on the 5th as 2783 and n667ua is also leaving the 5th as 2786. Racing to hnl lol...it will be interesting to see which are the next two in. I hope they decide to keep all of them and don’t retire any.

763:
N657UA shows standard seat map and seat count. Don't expect Polaris even though its ironic that HKG visit is the exact number of days that Polaris takes to complete.

772:
N78005 sked to exit HKG 2741/5Oct with Polaris/PP confirmed by seat count in amenities. 8th GE powered Polaris out of 22 total.

United just announced today they are launching Aviate. Aviate is a pathway for for future pilots to go from school to United pilot. Aviate will also include a pathway for current employees who want to go from their current job to a United pilot. More details about the employee pathway will be announced early next year on Flying Together. This is exciting news because employees like myself have been asking UA for years for an employee pathway to the flight deck and so far we've all been told sorry no pathway. The commitment required to become an airline pilot would require current employees to quit United Airlines because there is no leave of absence that can cover the time a current employee would need to become a pilot. Even if that person did become a pilot there were no guarantees United would hire you back and if they did you have lost everything and had to start over from the bottom with 2 weeks vacation and no company seniority. I personally know quite a few employees myself included who are excited about the future employee pathway from student to United pilot. If the employee pathway pans out this changes my entire career goals at United. The employee option is on Flying Together however here is a link the public can use to access the Aviate website.

https://unitedaviate.com

763:
N667UA sked to exit HKG 2786/5Oct, doesn't show Polaris yet on seat map.

Where are the refitted (Polaris, maybe PE) 772’s flying to? Are they sticking to more dedicated routes and airports or moving around a lot?

I have been looking at a number of international destinations lately on UA.com but every single seat map shows the old configuration? I have looked at many (MANY) flights from EWR, and have not found one in new configuration.

It’s also rather astonishing how many MAJOR European destinations are 764’S. I know they are going in last, and frankly it’s a bird I love, however I could easily choose 3 or 4 destinations where every competitor to that European city has a far superior J product. Yes, status maintenance keeps me on UA, but Zurich for one it’s awfully tempting to take SWISS!

VC10er wrote:

Where are the refitted (Polaris, maybe PE) 772’s flying to? Are they sticking to more dedicated routes and airports or moving around a lot?

I have been looking at a number of international destinations lately on UA.com but every single seat map shows the old configuration? I have looked at many (MANY) flights from EWR, and have not found one in new configuration.

Not doing full research, 772 dedicated routes are:
SFO-PEK/PVG(2nd)/LHR/FRA(2nd)
IAD-NRT/FRA/BRU/MUC

The only non-Polaris EWR 772 flights are EWR-PEK/HKG/DEL. Everything else is either high J 763, 77W or 78J with Polaris or TATL 763 with old seats but possibility for swap. And 789 when CPT starts.

VC10er wrote:

Where are the refitted (Polaris, maybe PE) 772’s flying to? Are they sticking to more dedicated routes and airports or moving around a lot?

I have been looking at a number of international destinations lately on UA.com but every single seat map shows the old configuration? I have looked at many (MANY) flights from EWR, and have not found one in new configuration.

It’s also rather astonishing how many MAJOR European destinations are 764’S. I know they are going in last, and frankly it’s a bird I love, however I could easily choose 3 or 4 destinations where every competitor to that European city has a far superior J product. Yes, status maintenance keeps me on UA, but Zurich for one it’s awfully tempting to take SWISS!

For the spring/summer 2019 there were dedicated Polaris/PE routes from SFO/EWR/IAD, however with the IATA schedule change that will take place at the end of October there will be a lot of equiptment changes which is why you are probably seeing the old seating configuration on certain routes that use to show Polaris/PE. For instance starting later this year EWR-HKG and some EWR-TATL flight will be loosing Polaris/PE. Every since the suspension ((cancellation) however you want to look at it )of ORD-HKG UA has been ferrying PW 77Es to XMN and GE 77E to HKG. With the schedule change and both SFO and EWR downguaging to 77Es this will end the need to ferry empty aircraft and UA can go back to just ferrying the empty PW 77Es between HKG and XMN. The 78Js some of those frames are being moved to the West Coast for IATA winter, I know EWR-BCN will be downguaged from a 78J to a 763/764 during the fall and winter season and for now the only high J 763 routes are EWR-LHR, ORD-LHR is being rolled out now. As more high J 763 roll out at some point EWR-ZRH/GVA will transistion but I'm not sure when that will happen. As far as the other 763 TATL routes you will continue to see the generic diamond seating layout because both the diamond and Polaris non-PE have the same exact number of seats in business class. Since a plane change can happen you will not see a Polaris non-PE seat map until you get closer to departure. It will remain like this until more 763s are converted from diamond seats to high J.
Looking at the PW 77Es the last frame is schedule to go to XMN in late December 2019. I've said it before and i'll just reiterate I don't know when UA will pull the four remaining PW 77Es (transitioning to domestic configuration) from international routes but by January if your international flight is on a PW 77E the chances are good that you will be on an aircraft equipped with Polaris and PE. If your flight is on a GE 77E you will have to wait until May 2020 this is when the last GE 77E is schedule to enter HKG for Polaris/PE.

On October 3rd.. A320 N431UA ferried from IAH-GYR. According to the crew, this aircraft was being retired. I have not heard of any Airbus retirements at my company. Is there any truth to this? Does UA have maintenance or paint done at GYR?

https://www.bizjournals.com/philadelphi ... hl-to.html
"United Airlines said it will offer new flights to Philadelphia International Airport from its hub at Washington Dulles International Airport, allowing customers to connect to the airline’s nearly 270 domestic and more than 30 international flights.

Chicago-based United (NASDAQ: UAL) will operate four times a day between Washington and Philadelphia onboard a two-cabin regional aircraft. The new routes will be available for purchase starting October 5 with service set to begin on May 8, 2020."

"In addition to Philadelphia, United said it would launch new service to West Palm Beach, Florida, and Akron-Canton, Ohio."

The funny part is that United just cut IAD-PHL last fall, so they are quickly bringing it back.

Nice to see IAD-PBI added....UA is slowly rebuilding the IAD-Florida routes. At one point, all UA had was IAD-MCO/TPA/JAX. By this winter, they'll have IAD-MCO/TPA/JAX/FLL/MIA/RSW/SRQ/PBI.

IAD-CAK will be tough. Not sure the route will succeed, but I'll give UA credit for trying.

Midwestindy wrote:

https://www.bizjournals.com/philadelphia/news/2019/10/04/united-to-start-daily-flights-from-phl-to.html
"United Airlines said it will offer new flights to Philadelphia International Airport from its hub at Washington Dulles International Airport, allowing customers to connect to the airline’s nearly 270 domestic and more than 30 international flights.

Chicago-based United (NASDAQ: UAL) will operate four times a day between Washington and Philadelphia onboard a two-cabin regional aircraft. The new routes will be available for purchase starting October 5 with service set to begin on May 8, 2020."

"In addition to Philadelphia, United said it would launch new service to West Palm Beach, Florida, and Akron-Canton, Ohio."

Two class regional jet, CRJ-550?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

Tristar328 wrote:

On October 3rd.. A320 N431UA ferried from IAH-GYR. According to the crew, this aircraft was being retired. I have not heard of any Airbus retirements at my company. Is there any truth to this? Does UA have maintenance or paint done at GYR?

I can't confirm if this aircraft is being retired or not but UA did announce at the beginning of the year they would be retiring a few older A320/A319s and replacing them with ten newer (used) A319s. The older aircraft are supposed to be parted out.

4 A320s
2 A319s

https://liveandletsfly.boardingarea.com ... leet-plan/

Tristar328 wrote:

On October 3rd.. A320 N431UA ferried from IAH-GYR. According to the crew, this aircraft was being retired. I have not heard of any Airbus retirements at my company. Is there any truth to this? Does UA have maintenance or paint done at GYR?

According to the maintenance log, this aircraft, 4631, has been retired.

United1 wrote:

Tristar328 wrote:

On October 3rd.. A320 N431UA ferried from IAH-GYR. According to the crew, this aircraft was being retired. I have not heard of any Airbus retirements at my company. Is there any truth to this? Does UA have maintenance or paint done at GYR?

I can't confirm if this aircraft is being retired or not but UA did announce at the beginning of the year they would be retiring a few older A320/A319s and replacing them with ten newer (used) A319s. The older aircraft are supposed to be parted out.

4 A320s
2 A319s

https://liveandletsfly.boardingarea.com ... leet-plan/

Tail number N431UA is showing retired in the our system. Flight UA2740-03 was the retirement ferry for this frame.
This frame was delivered to UA on March 1, 1996, its last flight for UA October 03, 2019.

jayunited wrote:

United1 wrote:

Tristar328 wrote:

On October 3rd.. A320 N431UA ferried from IAH-GYR. According to the crew, this aircraft was being retired. I have not heard of any Airbus retirements at my company. Is there any truth to this? Does UA have maintenance or paint done at GYR?

I can't confirm if this aircraft is being retired or not but UA did announce at the beginning of the year they would be retiring a few older A320/A319s and replacing them with ten newer (used) A319s. The older aircraft are supposed to be parted out.

4 A320s
2 A319s

https://liveandletsfly.boardingarea.com ... leet-plan/

Tail number N431UA is showing retired in the our system. Flight UA2740-03 was the retirement ferry for this frame.
This frame was delivered to UA on March 1, 1996, its last flight for UA October 03, 2019.

Presumably it was very near due a heavy Mx check... which comes with quite the hefty price tag.

763:
N672UA skled to enter HKG 2789/6Oct for High J Polaris/PP

772:
N78005 now sked to exit HKG 2737/6Oct with Polaris/PP

788:
N27908 entered XMN 2734/3Oct, maint.

77E:
N78017 enters HKG for Polaris/PE 2742/5Oct
N37018 enters HKG for Polaris/PE 2792/5Oct

CR5:
N157GJ has been re-registered as N539GJ
N159GJ has been re-registered as N541GJ
N163GJ has been re-registered as N545GJ

Having just flown on a 25 y/o United 757 yesterday from Porto to Newark it got me thinking. Their are so many longer thin routes that the 757 is perfect for but so far United hasn’t ordered any any aircraft to replace it with. A lot of the 757’s they fly are very old. Seems the best replacement would be the A321NEOLR or A321NEOXLR. Any thoughts?

This will turn in too a massive A321 vs. B797 debate. As we had before, will have again in the future. This is how every "what will replace the 757/767 at ~insert airline~ " ends up.

We cant's really say what is best for them, what is the cheapest and what they need or how much discount they get on buying the plane. UA knows that, we don't. Especially as we barely know anything about the B797.

vulindlela744 wrote:

Having just flown on a 25 y/o United 757 yesterday from Porto to Newark it got me thinking. Their are so many longer thin routes that the 757 is perfect for but so far United hasn’t ordered any any aircraft to replace it with. A lot of the 757’s they fly are very old. Seems the best replacement would be the A321NEOLR or A321NEOXLR. Any thoughts?

If United agreed they’d already have ordered it. I’m sure they’ll evaluate it again soon in a competitive bid.

I am not trying to turn this into a A vs. B debate. I’m just wondering what people think United will order eventually to replace the 757’s

vulindlela744 wrote:

Having just flown on a 25 y/o United 757 yesterday from Porto to Newark it got me thinking. Their are so many longer thin routes that the 757 is perfect for but so far United hasn’t ordered any any aircraft to replace it with. A lot of the 757’s they fly are very old. Seems the best replacement would be the A321NEOLR or A321NEOXLR. Any thoughts?

Yesterday Simple Flying put out an article that in my opinion best explains why UA still hasn't order any A321 variant as a replacement for our aging 757s. The article also points out even though UA has resisted ordering any A321neo/LH/XLR it is still a posibility given the fact that time itself is a factor. For now time is on UA and Boeings side but but its is quickly running out at stake according to Simple Flying is an order that could be up to 200 frames, 100 firm and options for 100 more.

If Boeing drops the ball on the 797 you could see UA order several variants of the A321 as we wouldn't need all A321to be XLRs along with some A330s, or A321s and more 788s.
In my opinion I think up until now Boeing has convinced UA to wait and UA may give Beoing another 10 months to a year to decided whether to launch the 797. If Boeing hasn't made a move by October 2020 I think UA has no choice but to a least go with the A321 and probably more 788s.

https://simpleflying.com/united-airlines-boeing-797/

vulindlela744 wrote:

Having just flown on a 25 y/o United 757 yesterday from Porto to Newark it got me thinking. Their are so many longer thin routes that the 757 is perfect for but so far United hasn’t ordered any any aircraft to replace it with. A lot of the 757’s they fly are very old. Seems the best replacement would be the A321NEOLR or A321NEOXLR. Any thoughts?

In last quarter's conference call, Scott Kirby said that UA has "some time" to decide what to do with the 757/767 fleets. He seemed to indicate that they will have to make a decision at some point, but that such a decision is not imminent.

My sense is that UA is/was waiting for the Boeing NMA to launch in 2025, though now with the Max fiasco tying up Boeing, I can't help but wonder whether the NMA EIS might be delayed too much for UA to wait. I can see how they might conclude that the A321 (in whatever variant) is not the ideal 757 replacement, though there certainly could be some value to growing the A320 family fleet with NEOs.

jayunited wrote:

United just announced today they are launching Aviate. Aviate is a pathway for for future pilots to go from school to United pilot. Aviate will also include a pathway for current employees who want to go from their current job to a United pilot. More details about the employee pathway will be announced early next year on Flying Together. This is exciting news because employees like myself have been asking UA for years for an employee pathway to the flight deck and so far we've all been told sorry no pathway. The commitment required to become an airline pilot would require current employees to quit United Airlines because there is no leave of absence that can cover the time a current employee would need to become a pilot. Even if that person did become a pilot there were no guarantees United would hire you back and if they did you have lost everything and had to start over from the bottom with 2 weeks vacation and no company seniority. I personally know quite a few employees myself included who are excited about the future employee pathway from student to United pilot. If the employee pathway pans out this changes my entire career goals at United. The employee option is on Flying Together however here is a link the public can use to access the Aviate website.

https://unitedaviate.com

That Idea hasn't always been closed as I know 4 Mechanics who Became Pilots and all were Capts. Before I retired. There were and are LOT of guys with commercial time In Operations, Dispatch and Maintenance. It is not Unheard of and the. y'd have some DAMN dedicated troops as well

intotheair wrote:

vulindlela744 wrote:

Having just flown on a 25 y/o United 757 yesterday from Porto to Newark it got me thinking. Their are so many longer thin routes that the 757 is perfect for but so far United hasn’t ordered any any aircraft to replace it with. A lot of the 757’s they fly are very old. Seems the best replacement would be the A321NEOLR or A321NEOXLR. Any thoughts?

In last quarter's conference call, Scott Kirby said that UA has "some time" to decide what to do with the 757/767 fleets. He seemed to indicate that they will have to make a decision at some point, but that such a decision is not imminent.

My sense is that UA is/was waiting for the Boeing NMA to launch in 2025, though now with the Max fiasco tying up Boeing, I can't help but wonder whether the NMA EIS might be delayed too much for UA to wait. I can see how they might conclude that the A321 (in whatever variant) is not the ideal 757 replacement, though there certainly could be some value to growing the A320 family fleet with NEOs.

Still not convinced the mythical 797 is the answer.. it's not going to replace both the 757 and 767 fleets. It's one or the other.

Scarebus34 wrote:

intotheair wrote:

vulindlela744 wrote:

Having just flown on a 25 y/o United 757 yesterday from Porto to Newark it got me thinking. Their are so many longer thin routes that the 757 is perfect for but so far United hasn’t ordered any any aircraft to replace it with. A lot of the 757’s they fly are very old. Seems the best replacement would be the A321NEOLR or A321NEOXLR. Any thoughts?

In last quarter's conference call, Scott Kirby said that UA has "some time" to decide what to do with the 757/767 fleets. He seemed to indicate that they will have to make a decision at some point, but that such a decision is not imminent.

My sense is that UA is/was waiting for the Boeing NMA to launch in 2025, though now with the Max fiasco tying up Boeing, I can't help but wonder whether the NMA EIS might be delayed too much for UA to wait. I can see how they might conclude that the A321 (in whatever variant) is not the ideal 757 replacement, though there certainly could be some value to growing the A320 family fleet with NEOs.

Still not convinced the mythical 797 is the answer.. it's not going to replace both the 757 and 767 fleets. It's one or the other.

I agree that many of us on here are wont to think that one plane can directly 'replace' another. No matter what we think, the 77Ws didn't directly replace all the 744s on all of the 744 missions, and the 77Es didn't directly replace all DC10s on all of the DC10 missions, etc. etc. etc. With that said, the rumored profile of the NMA (200-250 seats, 5000 nmi) is very close to both that of UA's 752s (169 seats, 4100 nmi) and UA's 763s (214 seats, 5900 nmi). If this plane gets built under that size and capacity, then it wouldn't be a shoe-in for all of UA's existing 752 and 763 mission profiles, but it certainly would come close.

Still, that presupposes that 1) the plane will get built, 2) the plane will be delivered on time, and 3) that UA will buy it.

Scarebus34 wrote:

intotheair wrote:

vulindlela744 wrote:

Having just flown on a 25 y/o United 757 yesterday from Porto to Newark it got me thinking. Their are so many longer thin routes that the 757 is perfect for but so far United hasn’t ordered any any aircraft to replace it with. A lot of the 757’s they fly are very old. Seems the best replacement would be the A321NEOLR or A321NEOXLR. Any thoughts?

In last quarter's conference call, Scott Kirby said that UA has "some time" to decide what to do with the 757/767 fleets. He seemed to indicate that they will have to make a decision at some point, but that such a decision is not imminent.

My sense is that UA is/was waiting for the Boeing NMA to launch in 2025, though now with the Max fiasco tying up Boeing, I can't help but wonder whether the NMA EIS might be delayed too much for UA to wait. I can see how they might conclude that the A321 (in whatever variant) is not the ideal 757 replacement, though there certainly could be some value to growing the A320 family fleet with NEOs.

Still not convinced the mythical 797 is the answer.. it's not going to replace both the 757 and 767 fleets. It's one or the other.

It could, if it replaces primarily the 753, 762 and 763, and not the out ends of the seat range like the 752 and 764. I think it is going to end up being a lighter version of a 762 or 763, that can carry less cargo. If it is at least an inch wider than a 757/737 cabin, and no wider than an A330 cabin, I will be happy, because that means they won't be able to squeeze the wrong number of seats in each row. I would prefer it to be 1" narrower than a 767. Then it could stay 2 aisles with 7 seats, and not even hack European charter airlines could try to squeeze 8 seats in.

I could be totally off base here but I have always seen the TATL 752s (and not just for UA) as being less of a "we need this aircraft type for this mission" and more of a "hey look, this aircraft can do this mission" scenario. The 752 was never really designed to do intercontinental service but the airlines realized the frame was capable of opening up new, thin routes over the Atlantic. The 752s have been serving those routes for so long now we have just gotten used to them but that doesn't necessarily mean they are the correct or at least the optimal aircraft for the job. It might turn out that the A321XLR or 797 (one is smaller than the 757, the other larger) might end up being a better fit, or maybe the airlines will utilize a mix of both types depending on the route. I guess my point is the 752, as I understand it, was basically shoehorned into its current role, so just because they won't be replaced by an aircraft of the exact same size and capability doesn't mean the routes won't continue to be viable.

*** 787 Pilot Project STC POLARIS ***
#0908

Polaris MODs in work...
#0020
#6668
#2795
#2894

MX Only
#6452
#6456

A-319s awaiting induction into HMV-2 at XMN
#4871
#4875
#4877
#4878
#4879
#4881

# 0017 and # 0018 are in SFO Base MX waiting to launch to HKG later this afternoon....

Question... is UA going to give the Star Alliance aircraft blue engines or will they keep them grey? Following the merger, the L-UA aircraft in Star paint had the engines repainted from the Rising Blue scheme to grey. However, when US was in Star, they neglected to paint the engines to the new blue from the HP merger, and left them grey until they were repainted into AA colors in 2014.

Runway28L wrote:

Question... is UA going to give the Star Alliance aircraft blue engines or will they keep them grey? Following the merger, the L-UA aircraft in Star paint had the engines repainted from the Rising Blue scheme to grey. However, when US was in Star, they neglected to paint the engines to the new blue from the HP merger, and left them grey until they were repainted into AA colors in 2014.

Speaking of *A, no new aircraft have been painted in that livery. Is that no longer a part of membership, or does UA have enough that no more are required?

788:
Thanks CALTECH,
N27908 is the STC bird for 788 Polaris/PP.  Based on other STCs expect about 100 or more days, especially since the first 787 and there's a big configuration change in Y as well. 

The fleet updates, fleet status, and repaint status posts at the start of this thread have been updated.

✈️ atcsundevil

AviationAddict wrote:

The 752 was never really designed to do intercontinental service but the airlines realized the frame was capable of opening up new, thin routes over the Atlantic. The 752s have been serving those routes for so long now we have just gotten used to them but that doesn't necessarily mean they are the correct or at least the optimal aircraft for the job.

B757-200 : range 3,915 nmi
B767-200 : range 3,900 nmi
The first TATL flight using a B767 was in February 1985 after ETOPS was granted for that airframe. ETOPS was granted for the B752 in 1986. I don't really understand why people say the B767 was built for TATL flight while the B752 was not.

The best theory I can think of is that the extended-range version 767-300ER ( range of 5,980 nmi | exit limit 351 seats) entered service with American Airlines in 1988, and that was more popular so it led to the theory that the B752 designers were never thinking of TATL service.

vulindlela744 wrote:

Having just flown on a 25 y/o United 757 yesterday from Porto to Newark it got me thinking. Their are so many longer thin routes that the 757 is perfect for but so far United hasn’t ordered any any aircraft to replace it with. A lot of the 757’s they fly are very old. Seems the best replacement would be the A321NEOLR or A321NEOXLR. Any thoughts?

I have flown a UA 752 TATL many, many times to a handful of destinations in Europe over the past 10 (perhaps more years ago on CO, pre merger) At first I didn’t like it because the cabin size (which I presume was called BusinessFirst as merger/Polaris had yet to happen). But I continued to fly it because it was much more convenient way as a nonstop to places like Edinburgh or Lisbon etc, vs connecting. I grew to actually appreciate the small front cabin. Far less people and fast service- it almost felt like a commercial/private hybrid after ALWAYS being on a twin aisle.
However my pet peeve today is that it was NOT a very stylish Premium cabin back then either, and 10 years later the only changes are obvious wear and tear. They look old, and is totally devoid of anything remotely like a true Polars seat, and today an even more jarring disconnect after leaving the EWR Polaris Lounge. YET, it costs as much as a 787-10!
I think it’s just plain BAD for the United brand. Especially if you’ve now had some true Polaris flights or even spent roughly the same on SWISS, KLM, AF etc or EVEN TAP! Where the general atmosphere of business class is happy and nice vs the warn drab blue grey EVERYTHING on UA’s 752 (including ps) - and it would not take much either. Install the new bulkhead design, new carpets, great (vs cheesy amenity kits- until a new bird arrives!

767 production moved to mostly ER versions just a couple years after introduction. Only DL/HA were big US carriers to buy the Non-ER versions of the 763 - several Asian carriers bought lots of non-ER versions for short haul, high density service. So, when the ER was produced most airlines saw the extra range as TATL capable and the 767 became a TATL aircraft. Now, most are used internationally as well as many continuing to serve as freighters.

752 production was to replace the 727, be more fuel efficient and serve hot and high airports. An ER version was proposed about 2000 by CO and another airline, but it was probably too late to produce such a variant when 767s were available. The 757X, with 5,000NM range and 753 gear upgrades never garnered any sales. CO was the airline that made most use of TATL services with the 752 from EWR to Ireland, England/Scotland and western Europe (fuel stops have been an issue). It would appear the A321XLR is a replacement for the 752 as the 797 design isn't set.

My calculations show a Polaris type seat should fit into a 752 and other Boeing airframes - the available width for the actual seats for a single aisle would have more width than on widebodies. however, the design would probably take up too much space between the mandated distance between doors 1 and 2. If it yielded only 12 or 12 seats vs. 16 diamond seats, airlines would balk as the seat reduction.

These are approximate, things can change at any time.

POLARIS MODs.........ETR
0017............................12/06...HKG
0018............................12/06...HKG
0020............................11/16...HKG
6668............................11/04...HKG
0908............................11/18....XMN.......MX MOD complete>>>>> then STC
2795............................11/17....XMN
2894............................11/10....XMN

AMA Paint.....................ETR
0106.............................10/08
0208.............................10/09
4249.............................10/14

Finally have room, coming from other airlines, bring them up to United Standards ....
Inducted CS.................ETR.......XMN
4871............................10/29
4875.............................02/21...... (12/26 Induct Est) Moved up from 2020 ETR
4877.............................10/17....... Moved up from 2020 ETR
4878.............................12/04
4879.............................xx/xx.......Induction Scheduled 10/30
4881.............................xx/xx.......Induction Scheduled 11/28

MX Check Stand Alone....ETR
0053.................................10/25....HKG
6452.................................10/29....PVG
6456..................................10/11...PVG
0717.................................10/26....PVG





.

calpsafltskeds wrote:

My calculations show a Polaris type seat should fit into a 752 and other Boeing airframes - the available width for the actual seats for a single aisle would have more width than on widebodies. however, the design would probably take up too much space between the mandated distance between doors 1 and 2. If it yielded only 12 or 12 seats vs. 16 diamond seats, airlines would balk as the seat reduction.

If that's the case, then maybe it wouldn't be so bad if they also put a small Premium Plus cabin in with 2-2 domestic F seating. Hell, the 788 is going from 36J to 28J. Maybe losing 4 J seats on the 752/A321 wouldn't be such a big deal with the PP cabin.

That would further erode total seats. Let's say 2 rows of 4 across PP is a narrowbody would probably lose 3 rows of Y unless all the extra pitch is taken from reducing E+ to maybe a row or 2.
So that would lose maybe 4 BF seats, add 8 PP seats and lose 18E+/Y seats. Total loss 14 seats.

calpsafltskeds wrote:

That would further erode total seats. Let's say 2 rows of 4 across PP is a narrowbody would probably lose 3 rows of Y unless all the extra pitch is taken from reducing E+ to maybe a row or 2.
So that would lose maybe 4 BF seats, add 8 PP seats and lose 18E+/Y seats. Total loss 14 seats.

Wouldn't 5 across PP seats be more similar to other existing PP seats on 777's and 787's? When UA had domestic 77A's back in the 90's, they had 6 F seats to 9 Y seats. Now with Int'l 77E's they have 8 PP seats in the same width cabin, so I don't think the product is meant to be equitable with domestic F. This might be a fairly extreme idea, but would it possibly fit to put in two aisles, with 6 rows of staggered Polaris seats in two of those sections, and 3 rows of only forward facing seats in the third section? That would potentially seat 15 in J, but with some serious reconfiguration of Lavs and Galleys. These would certainly be the minimum allowable width of aisles.

"United is modifying 40 757-224 aircraft to a 16F/42E+/118Y “Slimline” configuration. This modification installs new economy class seats, new United décor and several other changes detailed below. All 40 aircraft are scheduled to be completed by 3rd qtr. 2020. Upon completion, aircraft will re-enter revenue service as the 75S fleet code. Aircraft 105 is the first aircraft to complete this modification and is scheduled for revenue service in early October 2019."

"Cabin:
➢ Existing Diamond seats in Polaris cabin refreshed with new dress covers, new “unibrow” video bezels and new monitors.
➢ New Collins Meridian seats in Economy and Economy Plus with leather dress covers.
➢ New carpet and curtains throughout.
➢ In-seat power (ISP) throughout the cabin with aft facing outlets in Economy."

"Lavatories:
➢ Interior and exterior of lavatories refreshed with new United décor featuring:
➢ New one-piece floor pan.
➢ New sink deck and backsplash.
➢ Interior LED lighting."

"Galleys:
➢ All galleys are refreshed with new United décor.
➢ New galley area flooring.
➢ United branding panel and Polaris brand plaque installed on G1B Galley."

"IFE
➢ New Panasonic Crew Terminal for IFE and GCS (Wi-Fi) near Door 1L is equipped with load ports and IFE/GCS switches.
➢ IFE ▪ IFE system upgraded from Panasonic eFx to eX1 system ▪ Updated passenger seatback interactive (Interactive 3.0) ▪

******* Flight Deck Audio feature added (Channel 9) ********
>>>>>>>>>> ➢ GCS ▪ Gate-to-Gate Phase 3 added ▪ Backlit GCS Broadband Comm switch and Observer Audio Entertainment (Channel 9) switch added to P5 panel" <<<<<<<<<<<<<

"Door 2R:
➢ Closet removed and replaced with new windscreen equipped with Economy Plus brand plaque and safety video monitor."

"Flight Attendant Seats
➢ New cushions and covers.
➢ New bumpers and rubstrips.
➢ New, longer restraints to match new décor."

CALTECH wrote:

"United is modifying 40 757-224 aircraft to a 16F/42E+/118Y “Slimline” configuration. This modification installs new economy class seats, new United décor and several other changes detailed below. All 40 aircraft are scheduled to be completed by 3rd qtr. 2020. Upon completion, aircraft will re-enter revenue service as the 75S fleet code. Aircraft 105 is the first aircraft to complete this modification and is scheduled for revenue service in early October 2019."

Interesting! Would you mind posting the link to that article? I just flew a roundtrip from EWR to SFO going on the 787-10 and back on one of the legacy CO 757-200s, and I actually found the economy to be more comfortable on the 757. They had much more padding, the tech was fine but not great, but overall seemed much more comfortable.

intotheair wrote:

If that's the case, then maybe it wouldn't be so bad if they also put a small Premium Plus cabin in with 2-2 domestic F seating. Hell, the 788 is going from 36J to 28J. Maybe losing 4 J seats on the 752/A321 wouldn't be such a big deal with the PP cabin.

On international flights they would loose at least 1 J seat and depending on how the pilot contract is interpreted it could be 2 J seats. Right now with diamond seats the only way 15 passengers are allowed in business class on the 752 on an international flight is if the captain gives up the second crew rest seat. On a 787 there is a crew rest area a business class seat is held for crew rest only if the flight isn't booked completely full in business class. However in most cases if business isn't booked full the crew will release the seat on the 787s to non revs you rarely see the captain give up 1 or their crew rest seats on a 752. Installing Polaris on a 752 isn't a good idea however I do like the idea of a small Premium Plus cabin. I think UA could get a nice ROI not only in the international market but also on our EWR-SFO/LAX and BOS-SFO/LAX routes.

UA just started selling premium plus seats on select EWR-SFO/LAX flight that operate with this product. I think having a small Premium Plus section on the 752s is a great idea.

I'll even take it a step further and say UA should offer premium plus seating on our high density 77A models. Perhaps when those four 77Es are converted to high density UA could install premium plus seating. They could then offer premium plus seating for sale on more transcon routes as well as Mainland - Hawaii routes. Routes like ORD/IAH/DEN-HNL DEN/ORD-OGG could probably benefit from premium plus. The only problem I see with the 77As is there is no PTV's. Would UA install PTV's in the premium plus section or hand out iPads that connect to the back of the seat?

CALTECH wrote:

"United is modifying 40 757-224 aircraft to a 16F/42E+/118Y “Slimline” configuration. This modification installs new economy class seats, new United décor and several other changes detailed below. All 40 aircraft are scheduled to be completed by 3rd qtr. 2020. Upon completion, aircraft will re-enter revenue service as the 75S fleet code. Aircraft 105 is the first aircraft to complete this modification and is scheduled for revenue service in early October 2019."

I'm surprised you say all 40. Some of those were delivered as early as 1994, and while I know they could have more life in them, UA isn't using as many for transatlantic flights as CO did. I would have thought once the Max10's start arriving and taking over transcon flights, UA would want to phase out some of the oldest 752's and only keep a fleet dedicated to transatlantic, that represents the reduced routes they are flying today (and maybe some South America). How long does UA need to keep flying these planes to justify the modifications? Or maybe these upgrades aren't as expensive as I'm thinking.

If optimistically, a 797 entered service in 2025, the oldest 752's would be 31 years old, and the youngest would be 26-27 (correct me if I'm wrong, I can't remember when CO got their last 752). But more realistically, the 797 will get delayed, just like every other major new plane since the 90's. 2027 might be safer to assume.

jayunited wrote:

intotheair wrote:

If that's the case, then maybe it wouldn't be so bad if they also put a small Premium Plus cabin in with 2-2 domestic F seating. Hell, the 788 is going from 36J to 28J. Maybe losing 4 J seats on the 752/A321 wouldn't be such a big deal with the PP cabin.

I'll even take it a step further and say UA should offer premium plus seating on our high density 77A models. Perhaps when those four 77Es are converted to high density UA could install premium plus seating. They could then offer premium plus seating for sale on more transcon routes as well as Mainland - Hawaii routes. Routes like ORD/IAH/DEN-HNL DEN/ORD-OGG could probably benefit from premium plus. The only problem I see with the 77As is there is no PTV's. Would UA install PTV's in the premium plus section or hand out iPads that connect to the back of the seat?

The 77A's have PTV's in J, so I assume that PP would too, as an added benefit for upsell. In fact, given how leisure heavy, and reward heavy the Hawaii routes can be, I can see plenty of people redeeming miles for Y and paying to upgrade to PP, if UA would allow it. You might not be willing to pay for F/J for vacation, but PP might seem like an affordable treat to one's self. And it would be a great perk for Premier's when the planes fly domestic hub-hub routes.