jayunited
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Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Sun Apr 21, 2019 2:01 pm

N649DL wrote:
I'm still curious as to how DEN is UA's most profitable hub after almost shunning it after the merger with CO. The competition is tough out there with WN and Frontier as well.

I lived in DEN for about 2 years and returned back to LAX as I was there for work. UA needs to be careful with DEN expansion because the cost of living is out of whack (especially real estate) and a lot of people are fleeing it almost as much as people are coming in. Local O&D could tank as a result and then they'll be right back to where they were at DEN back in 2010. And DEN will never be on the same level as a hub as ATL or DFW. It's really just hype by UA expanding DEN and far too late. Great hub nonetheless for them though.



A lot has changed in 2 years UA has gone from a summertime high of 350 departures just 2 years ago to 515 this coming summer according to Kirby. Denver, the surrounding suburbs and Colorado are growing. In addition to having a strong O&D market UA at DEN is in a unique position because we are able to connect DEN to a lot of smaller cities through UAX neither WN or F9 serve many of these surrounding communities. Kirby never stated he envisioned DEN being DL's ATL hub with over 1,000 departures or AA's DFW. But he did make it clear UA will continue to grow DEN and UA is in talks to acquire more gates/terminal and I believe in 2-4 years UA will have 700 daily departures from DEN in the summer and at least 550 during the remainder of the year.

Just because you don't understand how DEN is profitable doesn't mean its hype or far to late. In fact UA's overall success at all our hubs since Kirby's arrival speak volumes that his vision and plan are working. UA under Tilton and then Smisek ran from a fight. UA adopted the policy shrink your way into profitability opening the doors for airlines like WN, F9, even DL and AA to take advantage. As good as Oscar Munoz is I think the greatest thing he ever did at UA was hire Scott Kirby. Now image if Doug Parker had kept Kirby where would American Airlines be today and where would United Airlines be. I think before Kirby we had people like Andrew Levy and others who either had no vision for UA's future or agreed with Smisek's plan, shrink to profitability. Even Wall Street thought Munoz and Kirby were nuts when Kirby announced a few years ago a complete reversal of Smisek's plan and instead said UA would be growing and fighting and defending all of our hubs. Kirby has upguaged quite a few routes out of ORD, DEN and IAH he has also added more flights out of these hubs, IAD and LAX are no longer on the verge of being de-hubbed in fact before Kirby, Wall Street was actively pushing for UA to de-hub both these hubs (shrink your way into profitability) CLE fell victim to this policy, now those hubs instead of shrinking are growing. In the New York City market UA was loosing to both DL, AA and B6. We were loosing corporate accounts, high value premium passengers, and just everyday regular passengers. Kirby comes in changes all of it and now UA at EWR is winning back corporate accounts and high value premium passengers so much so that UA now is rolling out a high J version on 17 of our 763s. And its not just New York, UA is winning back corporate accounts a high value customers in Washington D.C. and surrounding areas. While UA has always enjoyed dominance at SFO we are also winning back corporate and high value customers in the San Francisco area. Before Kirby I don't think anyone at sUA considered EWR a crown jewel perhaps sCO did, but the then merged UA didn't. However so much has changed at both SFO and EWR and these high value accounts and customers are returning making both these hubs the crown jewels of our network.
UA still has some work to do in Los Angeles to win more corporate and high value accounts, however UA has made some steps in the right direction at LAX by first stabilizing the hub, next will be growth.

Look at all Kirby has accomplished in his short tenure here at UA including stabilizing and growing all our hubs including DEN expanding UA's international network while managing to keep United Airlines profitable and keeping Wall Street happy and you have the audacity to say it just hype, its to late. The results speak for themselves and the results are saying it never to late to turn it around and this is what UA is doing we are turning it around and making a profit while doing it.

It was interesting to watch from the sidelines as DL went through this process some years ago and I'll admit I was jealous. DL seemed to be doing everything right ash was growing by leaps and bounds,while UA was the exact opposite. I've said this many times on a.netters that I believe UA is 4-6 years behind DL is terms of growth and profitability. UA lost a lot during bankruptcy and the merger. But having worked for UA through through both of those events and having seen UA hit rock bottom it is exciting to see UA turn a corner and start to live up to it potential. Again I ask where would UA be if Doug Parker had kept Kirby at AA and Munoz had kept the likes of Andrew Levy at UA? My answer to that question is I believe neither LAX, or IAD would exist as a hub today and DEN instead of preparing for 515 daily departures summer 2019, would probably have been on the chopping block down to 150 daily summer 2019 departures because WN would have chocked the life out of us at that hub. To put if bluntly UA would have probably been on life support, still trying to shrink to profitability and it would have opened the doors for AA and DL to pounce. If UA had continued to shrink at some point the US3 would have become the US2 in my opinion because once DL turned the corner and became profitable they also became a take no prisoners airline. There was blood in the water and DL could smell it and they were coming hard for UA, if AA would have gotten it house together as well and kept Kirby I don't see how UA could have survive. We would have had DL attacking from one side, AA another, WN from another then airlines like AS, B6, F9, and NK would have joined in and drove the final nail in the coffin. By 2025-2030 UA would have been out of business if not sooner.
 
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Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Sun Apr 21, 2019 3:02 pm

The fleet changes and fleet status posts at the start of this thread have been updated.

✈️ atcsundevil
 
FlyHossD
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Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Sun Apr 21, 2019 3:03 pm

jayunited wrote:
N649DL wrote:
It was interesting to watch from the sidelines as DL went through this process some years ago and I'll admit I was jealous. DL seemed to be doing everything right ash was growing by leaps and bounds,while UA was the exact opposite.


Ah yes, the "Smisek effect." I have yet to chat with a single UA employee that wasn't uber-happy the day he was canned.
My statements do not represent my former employer or my current employer and are my opinions only.
 
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SQ789
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Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Sun Apr 21, 2019 3:30 pm

Planespotters report that UA is also getting 4 ex Vueling A320's.

https://www.planespotters.net/productio ... tus=future
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SQ789
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Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Sun Apr 21, 2019 3:31 pm

Also, are the upcoming 20 A319's are coming from Easyjet?
If it's not Boeing, I'm not going!
 
GmoneyCO
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Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Sun Apr 21, 2019 4:00 pm

A few random updates this week:

--All 4 Vueling A320s are still flying. All 4 were delivered in March & April 2012, assuming a lease agreement that is based on straight years, its anyone's guess on when they will get delivered as their conceptual '2019' return dates are upon us or just passed depending on the frame.
--B-6018, B-6019 and B-6039 - B-6041 all have lease & delivery dates that tie to a 15 year lease. Conceptually this accounts for 5 out of the 6 Airbii aircraft that are expected to be delivered in Q2 and Q3.
    ---B-6040 and B-6041 have not flowing in ~2 weeks. Assuming the date fact pattern above is correct, high likelihood both are in for exit prep work.
--All of the other China Southern A319s tagged on the fleet site have ~2020 dates for transition to UA assuming 15 year leases on them.

3M9:
N27515 - Parked at BFI, conceptually ready for delivery once MCAS software update is applied
N37516 - Completed B3 flight & was painted at VCV
N47517 - Pre Flight Prep
N37518 - Final Assembly Line

787-10:
The last few 787-10s do not have working Flight Aware links, can these be added.
 
GmoneyCO
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Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Sun Apr 21, 2019 4:01 pm

SQ789 wrote:
Also, are the upcoming 20 A319's are coming from Easyjet?


Some are from easyJet, others are from China Southern. We should see ~6 used A319s delivered by the end of Q3. Entry into service won't be for ~6 months after the delivery of each frame due to inspection and modification work.
 
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intotheair
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Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Sun Apr 21, 2019 4:21 pm

GmoneyCO wrote:

Frontier isn't the threat to UA in Denver that it used to be, primarily due to very bad flight times, the 'nickle and dime' feeling people leave with, and the experience (e.g. no-recline seats). Also, most everyone that I know that has flown Frontier recently, has made the comment they will not fly them again and actually carried through except on the shortest of flights (e.g. DEN to ABQ or MCI). Their analysis was that the base fare was cheap but by the time you factor in the 'nickle and dime' items, the cost difference is not worth it especially for experience that Frontier provides.

The numbers prove it is a 2 man race at this point between UA and WN @ DEN

Airline.....2018 Mkt Share.....2019 Mkt Share
UA..........42.4%....................44.9%
WN.........28.9%....................30.4%
F9..........10.8%....................10.9%
AA..........5.2%......................5.7%
DL..........5.1%......................5.1%


I agree though you have all but the UA numbers flipped. It should read:

Airline.....2018 Mkt Share.....2019 Mkt Share
UA..........42.4%....................44.9%
WN.........30.4%....................28.9%
F9..........10.9%....................10.8%
AA..........5.7%......................5.2%
DL..........5.1%......................5.1%

Interesting to see UA is the only one growing market share. All of them but AA added passengers year over year too.

https://www.flydenver.com/sites/default ... bruary.pdf
300 319 320 321 332 333 345 346 717 733 734 735 73G 738 739 744 752 753 762 763 772 77W 788 789 CR2 CR7 CR9 Q400 E175 DC10 MD82 MD90
AA AF AS AY AZ B6 BA BR DL F9 FI GA HA KF LH MI QX SK SN SQ UA US VY WN
 
GmoneyCO
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Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Sun Apr 21, 2019 4:51 pm

intotheair wrote:
GmoneyCO wrote:

Frontier isn't the threat to UA in Denver that it used to be, primarily due to very bad flight times, the 'nickle and dime' feeling people leave with, and the experience (e.g. no-recline seats). Also, most everyone that I know that has flown Frontier recently, has made the comment they will not fly them again and actually carried through except on the shortest of flights (e.g. DEN to ABQ or MCI). Their analysis was that the base fare was cheap but by the time you factor in the 'nickle and dime' items, the cost difference is not worth it especially for experience that Frontier provides.

The numbers prove it is a 2 man race at this point between UA and WN @ DEN

Airline.....2018 Mkt Share.....2019 Mkt Share
UA..........42.4%....................44.9%
WN.........28.9%....................30.4%
F9..........10.8%....................10.9%
AA..........5.2%......................5.7%
DL..........5.1%......................5.1%


I agree though you have all but the UA numbers flipped. It should read:

Airline.....2018 Mkt Share.....2019 Mkt Share
UA..........42.4%....................44.9%
WN.........30.4%....................28.9%
F9..........10.9%....................10.8%
AA..........5.7%......................5.2%
DL..........5.1%......................5.1%

Interesting to see UA is the only one growing market share. All of them but AA added passengers year over year too.

https://www.flydenver.com/sites/default ... bruary.pdf


Thanks, now that I go back and look at it I was reading the columns in the wrong order.
 
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Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Sun Apr 21, 2019 6:36 pm

GmoneyCO wrote:
SQ789 wrote:
Also, are the upcoming 20 A319's are coming from Easyjet?


Some are from easyJet, others are from China Southern. We should see ~6 used A319s delivered by the end of Q3. Entry into service won't be for ~6 months after the delivery of each frame due to inspection and modification work.


From what I know the CFM powered easyjet A319s start being delivered in 2020.

The 10 A319s this year are a mix of former China Southern and Shaheen Air birds all have IAE engines.
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x1234
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Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Sun Apr 21, 2019 6:54 pm

I have to go to SIN & PVG and will definitely NOT be flying UA because of the OLD config. I can't believe in this day and age UA's 787's don't have a 1-2-1 Polaris config yet! I mean even China Eastern has a 1-2-1 on their B77W! What's the ETA on the 787 Polaris roll-out? They should have done few of the 787's on their longest route in the network (SIN & SYD-IAH)!
 
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Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Sun Apr 21, 2019 6:58 pm

Also which routes do the retrofitted 772ER fly? I have a EU trip coming up too.
 
SFOtoORD
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Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Sun Apr 21, 2019 7:11 pm

x1234 wrote:
I have to go to SIN & PVG and will definitely NOT be flying UA because of the OLD config. I can't believe in this day and age UA's 787's don't have a 1-2-1 Polaris config yet! I mean even China Eastern has a 1-2-1 on their B77W! What's the ETA on the 787 Polaris roll-out? They should have done few of the 787's on their longest route in the network (SIN & SYD-IAH)!


My guess is that given the 789s are their newest planes that were delivered with the old product that they want to get a few years out of those seats. On the other hand the 767s and 77Es are much older and better to get outfitted sooner so they get a full life out of the Polaris seats before retirement. However, I do agree for long 789 flights like SIN, SYD, MEL, CPT it would be better to have the superior business product on board.
 
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Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Sun Apr 21, 2019 7:42 pm

SFOtoORD wrote:
x1234 wrote:
I have to go to SIN & PVG and will definitely NOT be flying UA because of the OLD config. I can't believe in this day and age UA's 787's don't have a 1-2-1 Polaris config yet! I mean even China Eastern has a 1-2-1 on their B77W! What's the ETA on the 787 Polaris roll-out? They should have done few of the 787's on their longest route in the network (SIN & SYD-IAH)!


My guess is that given the 789s are their newest planes that were delivered with the old product that they want to get a few years out of those seats. On the other hand the 767s and 77Es are much older and better to get outfitted sooner so they get a full life out of the Polaris seats before retirement. However, I do agree for long 789 flights like SIN, SYD, MEL, CPT it would be better to have the superior business product on board.


It is ironic that the UA 789’s have the old style diamond seats, but I’m also sure that being a big decision maker at an enormous airline is always difficult. The higher up the corporate ladder you go the higher amount of multiple impossible choices you must debate, then make. I thought when Australia and Singapore flights went to 789’s UA would take an X amount of them and put in true POLARIS seats and find a new home for those newer diamond seats, like 757 Transcontinental or TATL and replace the most battered ones in the fleet.
The “stranger” next to can really wreck the experience!

Also, I’m surprised the manufacturer never found a way to integrate a handle bar on those diamond seats. To climb over your fully reclined, large and deep sleeping neighbor without your foot hitting them is close to impossible- there no way to steady yourself- perhaps if you’re a Cirque du Sol
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deltadudejg
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Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Sun Apr 21, 2019 7:48 pm

Here is a link for which EasyJet A319s United will be receiving. Still very very odd that they're going to pick up CFM powered A319s

http://jethros.org.uk/fleets/fleet_list ... _a319.html
Aviation Enthusiast working in Airport Operations
 
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antoniemey
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Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Sun Apr 21, 2019 8:01 pm

deltadudejg wrote:
Here is a link for which EasyJet A319s United will be receiving. Still very very odd that they're going to pick up CFM powered A319s

http://jethros.org.uk/fleets/fleet_list ... _a319.html


Why? They have a massive fleet of CFM powered aircraft. They just happen to be Boeings.
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sohanb82
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Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Sun Apr 21, 2019 8:04 pm

VC10er wrote:
SFOtoORD wrote:
x1234 wrote:
I have to go to SIN & PVG and will definitely NOT be flying UA because of the OLD config. I can't believe in this day and age UA's 787's don't have a 1-2-1 Polaris config yet! I mean even China Eastern has a 1-2-1 on their B77W! What's the ETA on the 787 Polaris roll-out? They should have done few of the 787's on their longest route in the network (SIN & SYD-IAH)!


My guess is that given the 789s are their newest planes that were delivered with the old product that they want to get a few years out of those seats. On the other hand the 767s and 77Es are much older and better to get outfitted sooner so they get a full life out of the Polaris seats before retirement. However, I do agree for long 789 flights like SIN, SYD, MEL, CPT it would be better to have the superior business product on board.


It is ironic that the UA 789’s have the old style diamond seats, but I’m also sure that being a big decision maker at an enormous airline is always difficult. The higher up the corporate ladder you go the higher amount of multiple impossible choices you must debate, then make. I thought when Australia and Singapore flights went to 789’s UA would take an X amount of them and put in true POLARIS seats and find a new home for those newer diamond seats, like 757 Transcontinental or TATL and replace the most battered ones in the fleet.
The “stranger” next to can really wreck the experience!

Also, I’m surprised the manufacturer never found a way to integrate a handle bar on those diamond seats. To climb over your fully reclined, large and deep sleeping neighbor without your foot hitting them is close to impossible- there no way to steady yourself- perhaps if you’re a Cirque du Sol


787 Diamond seats most likely won't fit the 757––the only remaining fleet with the diamond seats after Polaris refit is completed. First 787 should go in for Polaris seats this summer and management still expects the whole wide body fleet (minus some 763s) to be completed by end of 2020. Additionally, there will be 13 789s coming next year with the new seats.
 
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Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Sun Apr 21, 2019 8:08 pm

antoniemey wrote:
deltadudejg wrote:
Here is a link for which EasyJet A319s United will be receiving. Still very very odd that they're going to pick up CFM powered A319s

http://jethros.org.uk/fleets/fleet_list ... _a319.html


Why? They have a massive fleet of CFM powered aircraft. They just happen to be Boeings.


There is very little commonality between the two engines, a quick search can show you a thread about this. However, a 20 aircraft subfleet should be fine especially if more might be coming in the future.
 
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intotheair
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Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Sun Apr 21, 2019 8:08 pm

antoniemey wrote:
deltadudejg wrote:
Here is a link for which EasyJet A319s United will be receiving. Still very very odd that they're going to pick up CFM powered A319s

http://jethros.org.uk/fleets/fleet_list ... _a319.html


Why? They have a massive fleet of CFM powered aircraft. They just happen to be Boeings.


From what I’ve gathered on here, there’s not that much in common between the CFM 737s and Airbus. With that said, I think United probably decided to look into CFM Airbuses simply because the IAE birds are far less common, especially on the current secondhand market.
300 319 320 321 332 333 345 346 717 733 734 735 73G 738 739 744 752 753 762 763 772 77W 788 789 CR2 CR7 CR9 Q400 E175 DC10 MD82 MD90
AA AF AS AY AZ B6 BA BR DL F9 FI GA HA KF LH MI QX SK SN SQ UA US VY WN
 
deltadudejg
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Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Sun Apr 21, 2019 8:42 pm

They are dual overwing exit A319s as well, meaning they could put more seats in. I wonder if they will configure them different and use them on specific routes
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george77300
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Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Sun Apr 21, 2019 9:41 pm

deltadudejg wrote:
They are dual overwing exit A319s as well, meaning they could put more seats in. I wonder if they will configure them different and use them on specific routes


I think I heard they are just blocking one of them and standard config. It’s very easy to block those over-wing exits and you would even know it’s there from the inside.
 
N649DL
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Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Sun Apr 21, 2019 9:57 pm

GmoneyCO wrote:
CALTECH wrote:
intotheair wrote:

Denver’s population is growing - how could that translate to *less* O&D? By that line of thinking, United should dehub SFO because the cost of living and population are increasing there too.

By every metric, UA’s expansion at DEN has been a success. The conpany’s very pleased with it and is continuing to expand rapidly there while posting strong financial results. Southwest and Frontier are both there but they both are down in market share year over year in DEN while United is up more than two percent.

I don’t know how much of the doubts of United’s future in DEN post merger were ever much more than speculation, but even so, the Smisek-era philosophy of cutting capacity and retreating to EWR, ORD, and SFO only while letting other hubs whither clearly turned out to be the wrong direction for the airline.Increasing connectivity throughout the network (but particularly in the mid con hubs) appears to be working very well.


Sounds like some who spout myths as facts....

"Denver's metro population grew by 1.53% from 2017 to 2018, with 44,188 new residents, according to new population estimates released Thursday by the U.S. Census Bureau.

The metro's total population for 2018 was 2,932,415. Denver remains the 19th-largest metro in the U.S., just behind Tampa."

https://www.bizjournals.com/denver/news ... -data.html



It is true that Denver's population is still growing at a fairly strong rate, however the there is a lot of noise in 44k growth number. Denver is a top 5 market for people 'looking to leave' https://www.redfin.com/blog/q3-2018-migration-report/. Destinations have varied over the past year, however Phoenix, Seattle, and Colorado Springs top the lists. CO Springs, is a feeder market to DIA so the numbers will likely be moot for air travel. I don't expect to see a net drop in population in the Denver metro area, however the more foundational changes going on are hidden in the headline numbers.


That's the article I've read before and almost posted it so thanks. "Noise" is definitely the right word as last year was one of the slowest years for growth in DEN metro compared to the years before it. There's also this which I find to be interesting: https://www.denverpost.com/2018/11/03/c ... h-slowing/
 
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Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Sun Apr 21, 2019 11:24 pm

deltadudejg wrote:
Here is a link for which EasyJet A319s United will be receiving. Still very very odd that they're going to pick up CFM powered A319s

http://jethros.org.uk/fleets/fleet_list ... _a319.html


UA has been operating 757s with different engine manufacturers since the merger. There's the pmUA 752s with Pratts and the pmCO 752s and 753s with RB211s.
My statements do not represent my former employer or my current employer and are my opinions only.
 
CriticalPoint
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Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Sun Apr 21, 2019 11:28 pm

FlyHossD wrote:
deltadudejg wrote:
Here is a link for which EasyJet A319s United will be receiving. Still very very odd that they're going to pick up CFM powered A319s

http://jethros.org.uk/fleets/fleet_list ... _a319.html


UA has been operating 757s with different engine manufacturers since the merger. There's the pmUA 752s with Pratts and the pmCO 752s and 753s with RB211s.


It’s called OCD some people just can’t stand it.
 
FlyHossD
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Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Sun Apr 21, 2019 11:41 pm

CriticalPoint wrote:
FlyHossD wrote:
deltadudejg wrote:
Here is a link for which EasyJet A319s United will be receiving. Still very very odd that they're going to pick up CFM powered A319s

http://jethros.org.uk/fleets/fleet_list ... _a319.html


UA has been operating 757s with different engine manufacturers since the merger. There's the pmUA 752s with Pratts and the pmCO 752s and 753s with RB211s.


It’s called OCD some people just can’t stand it.


I prefer CDO. ;)
My statements do not represent my former employer or my current employer and are my opinions only.
 
COEWR787
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Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Sun Apr 21, 2019 11:44 pm

FlyHossD wrote:
deltadudejg wrote:
Here is a link for which EasyJet A319s United will be receiving. Still very very odd that they're going to pick up CFM powered A319s

http://jethros.org.uk/fleets/fleet_list ... _a319.html


UA has been operating 757s with different engine manufacturers since the merger. There's the pmUA 752s with Pratts and the pmCO 752s and 753s with RB211s.

Not to mention 777-200s powered by Pratt (pmUA) and GE (pmCO)
 
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SQ789
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Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Mon Apr 22, 2019 1:28 am

United1 wrote:
GmoneyCO wrote:
SQ789 wrote:
Also, are the upcoming 20 A319's are coming from Easyjet?


Some are from easyJet, others are from China Southern. We should see ~6 used A319s delivered by the end of Q3. Entry into service won't be for ~6 months after the delivery of each frame due to inspection and modification work.


From what I know the CFM powered easyjet A319s start being delivered in 2020.

The 10 A319s this year are a mix of former China Southern and Shaheen Air birds all have IAE engines.

The IAE's A319s that I identified are 5 each are from CZ and a further 5 are from Shaheen.
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VC10er
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Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Mon Apr 22, 2019 1:33 am

deltadudejg wrote:
Here is a link for which EasyJet A319s United will be receiving. Still very very odd that they're going to pick up CFM powered A319s

http://jethros.org.uk/fleets/fleet_list ... _a319.html


I’m sorry I don’t understand: how many A319’s from easyjet is UA taking? Everything on that list?
Thanks
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codc10
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Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Mon Apr 22, 2019 1:41 am

intotheair wrote:
antoniemey wrote:
deltadudejg wrote:
Here is a link for which EasyJet A319s United will be receiving. Still very very odd that they're going to pick up CFM powered A319s

http://jethros.org.uk/fleets/fleet_list ... _a319.html


Why? They have a massive fleet of CFM powered aircraft. They just happen to be Boeings.


From what I’ve gathered on here, there’s not that much in common between the CFM 737s and Airbus. With that said, I think United probably decided to look into CFM Airbuses simply because the IAE birds are far less common, especially on the current secondhand market.


UA reportedly has options on 50-60 CFM-powered frames, which negate the cost disadvantage of a small fleet with an oddball engine. Clearly they are looking to hit a critical mass with CFM A319/320s given, as you note, the relative paucity of IAE-powered ships on the secondhand market.

deltadudejg wrote:
They are dual overwing exit A319s as well, meaning they could put more seats in. I wonder if they will configure them different and use them on specific routes


The #2 OW exit pair will be deactivated and configuration will match other 319s in the fleet, depending on the aft galley/lav layout.
 
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Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Mon Apr 22, 2019 3:17 am

SQ789 wrote:
United1 wrote:
GmoneyCO wrote:

Some are from easyJet, others are from China Southern. We should see ~6 used A319s delivered by the end of Q3. Entry into service won't be for ~6 months after the delivery of each frame due to inspection and modification work.


From what I know the CFM powered easyjet A319s start being delivered in 2020.

The 10 A319s this year are a mix of former China Southern and Shaheen Air birds all have IAE engines.

The IAE's A319s that I identified are 5 each are from CZ and a further 5 are from Shaheen.


There are already 4 ex-birds that UA took delivery of in 2018. They are current undergoing induction work. Are these 5 in addition to those 4 or is there only 1 more ex-Shaheen frame coming?
 
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Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Mon Apr 22, 2019 9:24 am

FlyHossD wrote:

UA has been operating 757s with different engine manufacturers since the merger. There's the pmUA 752s with Pratts and the pmCO 752s and 753s with RB211s.


COEWR787 wrote:
Not to mention 777-200s powered by Pratt (pmUA) and GE (pmCO)


I know they run both 757s and 777s. I've flown on both types of each model. The Pratt powered 757s I hold near and dear to my heart. All this came from the merger, which is understandable. Most airlines try to unify and reduce the difference in variation in their aircraft, (ie engine types) which is why I question, why would United take up such a small number of CFM powered A319s. In my opinion it seems like they're going backwards with what airlines try to do with their fleet.

VC10er wrote:

I’m sorry I don’t understand: how many A319’s from easyjet is UA taking? Everything on that list?
Thanks


There are 20 total aircraft. In the farthest section to the right is the remarks column where the new information is listed.[/quote][/quote]
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Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Mon Apr 22, 2019 1:45 pm

763:
N646UA exited MCO maint 2745/21Apr
N655UA entered MCO maint 2753/21Apr

772:
N771UA exited RFD 2760/20Apr, ADSS-B install
N775UA entered RFD 2761/21Apr, ADS-B install
 
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Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Mon Apr 22, 2019 10:34 pm

The company is really keeping this paint job under wraps. From a update, it was said that the fuselage belly was being painted grey and that a step was ' paint Gold stripe and Gold on Globe '. Could be some good misdirection.

The name 'UNITED' looks bigger on the fuselage, the engines looked as though they might be getting some blue, the tail, could be just a interim step in the paint process. Some of those white longitude lines might get purple.
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Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Mon Apr 22, 2019 10:59 pm

CALTECH wrote:
The company is really keeping this paint job under wraps. From a update, it was said that the fuselage belly was being painted grey and that a step was ' paint Gold stripe and Gold on Globe '. Could be some good misdirection.

The name 'UNITED' looks bigger on the fuselage, the engines looked as though they might be getting some blue, the tail, could be just a interim step in the paint process. Some of those white longitude lines might get purple.


Exactly what I'm thinking as well. Looking back at the color palette, I can't help but think that the five "core" colors will all be in the final design.

Image

I'm not as good at livery mockups as others on here, but subbing out the gold for the "Dusk" looks pretty nice in my opinion:

Image
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Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Tue Apr 23, 2019 12:12 am

intotheair wrote:
CALTECH wrote:
The company is really keeping this paint job under wraps. From a update, it was said that the fuselage belly was being painted grey and that a step was ' paint Gold stripe and Gold on Globe '. Could be some good misdirection.

The name 'UNITED' looks bigger on the fuselage, the engines looked as though they might be getting some blue, the tail, could be just a interim step in the paint process. Some of those white longitude lines might get purple.


Exactly what I'm thinking as well. Looking back at the color palette, I can't help but think that the five "core" colors will all be in the final design.

Image

I'm not as good at livery mockups as others on here, but subbing out the gold for the "Dusk" looks pretty nice in my opinion:

Image



“Dusk” looks exactly like the original BF linens and little flowers pattern on the dishes.

Basically it just seems Gold is getting dumped. Which jives with the line “Out with the Gold in with the Blue”
 
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Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Tue Apr 23, 2019 3:33 am

772:
N219UA sked to exit XMN 2747/23Apr, w/o Polaris seat map - only in XMN 17Days, bummer, 772PW fleet going from 3 to 2 mod lines?

78X:
N16009 B2 flight today at CHS
 
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Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Tue Apr 23, 2019 11:52 am

calpsafltskeds wrote:
772:
N219UA sked to exit XMN 2747/23Apr, w/o Polaris seat map - only in XMN 17Days, bummer, 772PW fleet going from 3 to 2 mod lines?


I noticed it on the schedule yesterday as well, its disappointing to see it leave XMN without Polaris. As we get deeper into our spring schedule more 78Xs will begin to take over their scheduled TATL routes. Up until now UA has been using 77Es and 78Xs to back fill for MAX groundings as those 2 fleet types had the most slack. The 78X in recent weeks has made numerous unscheduled appearances on SFO-IAH-SFO and LAX-IAH-LAX. While the 77Es have made unscheduled appearances on IAD-SFO-IAD, SFO-IAH-SFO, SFO-ORD-SFO, EWR-SFO-EWR, SFO-HNL/OGG-SFO, LAX-OGG-LAX. The use of these aircraft on these routes has freed up 738s, 739s 739ERs, and 757s to take over routes normally flown by 739MAXs. Even the 763s have gotten in on some of the action. UA has a few of them that sit on the ground in IAH after their early morning arrival from South America, on early morning IAH-Florida-IAH routes especially if the plane isn't needed till the afternoon out of IAH. But it becomes increasingly difficult to find spare aircraft, spare pilots and FA's as we head as we ramp up the schedule. And lets not forget at lot of vacation time was already awarded last year or early this year before the MAX groundings which effects crew availability for these unschedule equipment changes.

So far UA has been lucky but with 14 aircraft grounded and no deliveries which UA was expecting it's starting to look like it might be a painful summer. Its a bummer for sure, UA was on a good role for a while with the 77Es, 5 mod lines open 3 at XMN and 2 at HKG while still covering MAX flying. Hopefully by this November the MAX will be back in the air and UA can make up some lost time during the fall/winter months.
 
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Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Tue Apr 23, 2019 4:20 pm

Hello United fleet experts,

Are there any aircraft that still sport CO's old checkerboard fabric economy seat covers (like the GE-powered ex-CO 772ERs with the 2-2-2 lieflat biz class)?

Also on the UA fleet site, what are the "old seat covers" vs. "new seat covers" on the 752s? I'm assuming this means checkerboard vs new leather, but it would be nice if some pictures could be provided.

One last question--do some 752s still feature the old seatback screens (like this: Image

or do they have new IFE like this: Image

Thanks!
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Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Tue Apr 23, 2019 4:23 pm

maps4ltd wrote:
One last question--do some 752s still feature the old seatback screens (like this:
or do they have new IFE like this:

Thanks!


The older resistive-touch screens are found on the 16J former CO 757-200s (75B) and the newer capacitive-touch screens on the 28J former UA 757-200s (75K).
 
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Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Tue Apr 23, 2019 11:11 pm

738: New livery update:
N37267 exited AMA paint 2691/23Apr, arrived ORD 2:55am.
I don't see any photos or updates on websites. Arrival at ORD at 3am was probably straight to the hanger.
 
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Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Tue Apr 23, 2019 11:26 pm

calpsafltskeds wrote:
738: New livery update:
N37267 exited AMA paint 2691/23Apr, arrived ORD 2:55am.
I don't see any photos or updates on websites. Arrival at ORD at 3am was probably straight to the hanger.


Have we been able to figure out whether that bird is the only one in the new colors? Some posts in the other thread implied that the 787-10 that was just in paint was also in new colors, but that contradicts what I've read in this thread.
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Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Wed Apr 24, 2019 1:50 am

Leaked photo.....

Lighting, or the blue gets lighter towards the top of the vertical......

Image
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Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Wed Apr 24, 2019 1:55 am

An improvement.

I wonder if that "connecting people, Uniting the world" forward of the door will be on every aircraft.
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Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Wed Apr 24, 2019 1:56 am

CALTECH wrote:
Leaked photo.....

Lighting, or the blue gets lighter towards the top of the vertical......

Image

I figured something would leak sooner or later. Interesting they incorporated the 787 cheatline wave. I like it, but I'm not sure how I feel about the gray belly with the purple cheatline though...it looks slightly strange to me.
 
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Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Wed Apr 24, 2019 3:21 am

No really impressed. So much for a possibility that all the newly painted aircraft could get by with a touchup.

Purple just looks like a darker blue - doesn't stand out, but a bit out of place with everything else being a shade of blue.  It would have been better to take the wave above the wing like the 787 and run it the entire length of the aircraft.
Could have just taken the 787 livery, changed the gold line to purple, increase the United name size, but not through the windows and changed the tail.  Could have been an easy job to repaint part of the aircraft. 
Name is too big and not forward enough.  Never liked a title going though the windows. Total amount of Blue make the aircraft look tailheavy.  Engines looked better grey instead of royal blue.  Globe looks like a negative or what you see on a blueprint.
Maybe it will grow on us all.  How about no units go into paint until after the MAX groundings and left the public and employees put in their 2 cents worth?  How about making this aircraft a one off design like the Peter Max, etc. 
 
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Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Wed Apr 24, 2019 1:10 pm

CALTECH wrote:
Leaked photo.....

Lighting, or the blue gets lighter towards the top of the vertical......

Image

I like it. I think it modernizes the theme just enough. The fading blue seems to be a little throw back to Rising Blue, and best of all, I don't think United will look junky in the awkward stage of repainting over the next few years, where half the planes look completely different than others (Like DL for years, or UA in the 90's...or UA in the early 2000's) I think this transition will be much more like when QF has updated, or AF.

I just can't help thinking, this would have been the livery to introduce in 2010.
 
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Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Wed Apr 24, 2019 4:15 pm

maps4ltd wrote:
Hello United fleet experts,

Are there any aircraft that still sport CO's old checkerboard fabric economy seat covers (like the GE-powered ex-CO 772ERs with the 2-2-2 lieflat biz class)?

Also on the UA fleet site, what are the "old seat covers" vs. "new seat covers" on the 752s? I'm assuming this means checkerboard vs new leather, but it would be nice if some pictures could be provided.

One last question--do some 752s still feature the old seatback screens (like this: Image

or do they have new IFE like this: Image

Thanks!


these are both 752. Top one is PMCO international layout with 16J/153Y with new seat blue seat covers to match the rest of the fleet.
bottom one is the PMUA 3-class that were converted to the new PS layout with 28J/114Y with the new Y seats.

I've flown on the PMCO 752 and i hate the AVOD in J/Y. Very old and unresponsive......the PW birds are much better since they have the new seats and AVOD.
 
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Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Wed Apr 24, 2019 4:41 pm

calpsafltskeds wrote:
No really impressed. So much for a possibility that all the newly painted aircraft could get by with a touchup.

Purple just looks like a darker blue - doesn't stand out, but a bit out of place with everything else being a shade of blue.  It would have been better to take the wave above the wing like the 787 and run it the entire length of the aircraft.
Could have just taken the 787 livery, changed the gold line to purple, increase the United name size, but not through the windows and changed the tail.  Could have been an easy job to repaint part of the aircraft. 
Name is too big and not forward enough.  Never liked a title going though the windows. Total amount of Blue make the aircraft look tailheavy.  Engines looked better grey instead of royal blue.  Globe looks like a negative or what you see on a blueprint.
Maybe it will grow on us all.  How about no units go into paint until after the MAX groundings and left the public and employees put in their 2 cents worth?  How about making this aircraft a one off design like the Peter Max, etc. 


It does seem like the under belly of the aircraft is painted in a light grey I think you are correct the engines should have matched that color. Besides that I like the new livery I think it works. I like the the title through the windows the globe on the tail has been slightly updated. As far as tail heavy look in my opinion all 737s have a tail heavy look to them but I think the livery will photograph better on a widebody like a 787 or a 77E/W.

The one thing UA should not do under any circumstances is open this up to the public and employees, there are just so many opinions out there there will never be a consensus on what the livery should be.
 
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Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Wed Apr 24, 2019 10:46 pm

SQ789 wrote:
Planespotters report that UA is also getting 4 ex Vueling A320's.

https://www.planespotters.net/productio ... tus=future


Old news. Much of the aircraft being acquired by United was listed months ago earlier in this thread.
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intotheair
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Re: United Fleet/Network Thread - 2019

Thu Apr 25, 2019 12:51 am

So now begins the long stretch toward getting the entire fleet into the new colors. FlightGlobal reports that a slew of planes will be repainted soon, though it’ll take up to seven years to roll it out to each and every bird.

I would imagine the MAX grounding must put a slowdown on the repainting. According to the fleet site, only a 788 and possibly a 787-10 are currently in paint.

If they’re only going to do it when repainting is already scheduled, then I hope they don’t go at a glacial pace like when PMUA tried to do that. Say what you will about the merger era livery, but they at least had a lot of paint lines open to get that on all the birds fast.
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